Can Parasites Cause Thyroid Problems? | Podcast #316

Parasitic infections are a big problem in tropical and subtropical regions of the world. In this video, Dr. J and Evan will share how to handle these cases. One of these is giardiasis that may cause diarrhea, gas, upset stomach, greasy stools, and dehydration; cryptosporidiosis, which may cause stomach cramps, stomach pain, nausea, vomiting, dehydration, weight loss, and fever; toxoplasmosis may cause flu-like symptoms, including swollen lymph nodes and muscle aches or pains that can last for over a month. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

0:05    Parasites and Thyroid Issues

8:05    Conventional Medicines on Parasites

12:50   Thyroid Symptoms

16:54   Adrenals as Natural Inflammatory

19:55   Gut Healing Protocols

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there, it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani. I’m with Evan Brand, Evan, how are we doing today? My friend?

Evan Brand: I’m doing well. I’m excited to dive into this, you thought of the idea of parasites and thyroid issues? And I said, Well, that’s easy, because we’ve seen hundreds and hundreds of cases at this point where thyroid issues magically get better or even resolve themselves just by fixing infections. Now, I will I will say that, you know, even though the title of this is parasites and thyroid, I would argue other infections are probably going to be happening at the same time. It’s rare that you and I, when we’re doing functional stool testing, it’s rare that you and I find just a parasite, right? Like, we’re probably going to find some Candida, we’re probably going to find some cebo type stuff, maybe some CFO issues, maybe some worms, maybe some gut inflammation, but parasites can be a really big catalyst for thyroid issues. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. So we talk about these topics, you know, in a lot of different ways, so we try to nuance it a little bit. So if you’ve heard topics on parasite infections before from our podcast, we’ll try to make it a little bit different for you. So you get a little bit of a different perspective on this. So parasites are really a big deal. Gut infections is general and you can kind of lump in SIBO and Candida with this as well. Parasites can be a little bit more severe. Right, we have blasto, e, histo, Giardia, Cryptosporidium, any of the immediate miba infections, d fragilis. penta trichomonas, hominess. Trying to think of some other ones here, we have different worm infections, right. And these can all create inflammation in the body. But more importantly, besides inflammation, they can create gut permeability. And when the guts more permeable, we can have more immune stress, right, the more the immune system is stressed, because 80% of the immune systems in the malt, and the golf, right malt is the mucosal associated lymphoid tissue that’s in the stomach. I’m sorry, that that’s in the small intestine and the golf, that’s the gastric associated lymphoid tissue that’s in the stomach. And we have immune cells in these tissues. And the more stressed they are, the more gut permeability we have due to infections, that can really exacerbate the immune system. And they can wind it up so to speak. And the more wound up the immune system is that can facilitate an autoimmune attack. And that means your immune system starts making B cell or antibodies to the thyroid, and you may make things like TPO antibodies, which may affect the enzyme that helps bind that thyroid together, thyroid peroxidase. And that can affect the thyroid. And you may make thyroid globulin antibodies, which work on the extra cellular protein on the thyroid, and that can attack that. And so when you start damaging and beating up the thyroid due to autoimmune attacks, that can impair thyroid function and thyroid hormone binding. And a lot of that can start with the immune system. And the biggest trigger for that can be a gut infection. 

Evan Brand: So let’s roleplay a little bit if you don’t mind. So, you know, I’m Joey, and I go down to the the local gastroenterology clinic and I tell him that I saw this guy named Dr. Justin on the internet and he told me that, you know, blast over crypto or God may be causing my thyroid issues and the gastro doctor says no, you live in America, you know, not gonna happen. What do you say to that guy? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, that’s kind of the the big thinking with a lot of conventional doctors is, hey, these parasite infections only happen in third world countries. And so it’s a big deal in third world countries. It’s like one of the number of top five causes of death in third world countries partly because you get amoebic dysentery, massive diarrhea, electrolyte depletion, cardiac arrest, or some kind of hyponatremia symptom, because you have massive diarrhea. Now here, you go to an ER, they put you on an IV, they flooded with antibiotics, and more than likely, you’re gonna be fine, right? You may have side effects later, that’s a whole different podcast, but you’ll be fine. The problem is, we kind of look at parasite infections having this acute symptomology that results from the infection. And a lot of times, that may not be the case, you may be in this kind of functional asymptomatic place where you don’t have over diarrhea, you don’t have over constipation. You know, you may have some but not a ton. And then a lot of times it’s just enough where they kind of throw the IBS diagnosis at you, they may run a scope they may not see anything, they may run a stool test not using the best technology so they may miss whatever’s there. Now, if you have a serious infection, there technology, you know, basic stool antigen looking under a microscope, they’ll probably catch it. But if it’s there’s not a lot of bolus of that parasitic material, they may miss it and that’s where some of the DNA technology maybe a little bit better for picking up parasites. So this is why they may miss it, number one, number two, you may have kind of these subclinical symptoms that may get lumped into the category of IBS, which is a diagnosis of exclusion, meaning they ruled out krones all sort of colitis, right? They ruled out bowel impaction acid reflux, all these other inflammatory issues, ulcers, right? And now, okay, all the serious stuff is ruled out. So they just say, okay, we’re going to just call it IBS. And then they’re going to just give you some medications to control whatever symptoms you have going on, whether it’s antispasmodics acid blockers, whether it’s um, constipation, medic medicate medication like laxatives, or bloating, medication, etc, gas x, that’s all they’re gonna do after that. And we know with functional medicine world, a lot of parasite infections can actually cause energy and mood issues. And so this is totally over their heads in conventional medicine world, because now they’re used to connecting gut infection to gut symptoms. It’s like an A, it’s like a one to one relationship. Right? Now you start going three dimensional here, when you start talking about gut infections, exacerbating your thyroid, causing an autoimmune attack, and now you have anxiety and heart palpitations in in fatigue and depression all throughout the day. Now what? And then now if those symptoms happen, you’re more than likely going to be prescribed a anti depressant or medication to treat those symptoms. So you’re kind of getting this really big cascade of symptoms that don’t quite match up with the conventional mindset. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and it blows their mind and then they get overwhelmed, and then they’ll dismiss you and then they may send you off to the psychiatrist. And they say, Well, you know, I don’t really help with anxiety. I’m focused on the gut portion of this. Luckily, you know, what we do as practitioners we come in and we’re not neurologists and gastroenterologist and endocrinologist and, you know, kidney experts, but we’ve had enough experience to where we can actually address each piece of this spiderweb. I mean, you you eloquently described it here, you’ve got the GI complaint that most people think about, they think, okay, if I have parasites, I’ve got to have diarrhea, I’ve got to have stomach pain, not necessarily. We’ve seen hundreds of people where they’re just a little bit tired. And maybe once every few weeks, they have kind of a cyclical gut issue. Right? So for me, it was definitely, it was definitely like a cyclical pattern. And I was trying to track it down to the diet. I thought, okay, you know, is it dairy? So then we got off dairy and then we like, reintroduce grass fed dairy without Okay, is it that Okay, what about the grains is the grains? No, it was the infections, but they had a cyclical pattern. So when you start bringing stuff up like that, you’ll literally you just lose the ear of the the conventional practitioner. So back to the thyroid piece, or you mentioned like the immune cells, you mentioned the immune stress. Now, we’re also going to be looking at blood for this right? So you would suggest if we are seeing a lot of these hyper hypo symptoms, yes, we’re going to run some DNA stool testing. But we’re also going to want to look at blood too, because we may find some other answers there. Now, I would argue, and I’m guessing you may agree with me that the blood is going to be more of looking at the effect, not necessarily the cause. Meaning if you look at the gut infections, that’s more of a cause. But we may see the TPO antibodies, you may see the tg antibodies, you may sit, we may see like a high reverse t three. But but that doesn’t necessarily change the game plan, right? Because you still have to go to the gut to fix the parasites that caused the high reverse t three in the first place.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. So how conventional medicine looks at things right may not pick some of these things up. So let’s say they’re even looking in the thyroid, let’s say they’re kind of let’s say they’re entertaining. And let’s say you listen to this podcast, you go in, and they’re testing your gut, and you’re like, Hey, can you also look at my thyroid, too, they may not even run these markers, as they typically run just TSH, and maybe if you’re lucky, you can get a T for free your total. That’s it. Now, if your TSH is overly high, then it’ll get picked up. But what is overly high, you know, maybe greater than four and a half to five. But it can take a long time for the TSH to go that high. Like TSH doesn’t just go high like that, in the snap of your fingers, it takes a lot of years, maybe even decade to get to that level. So if you have high TSH, you can just guarantee that that issues been going on for a long time. So that’s pretty much how you know if it’s a if it’s been going on for a while. And then now you have the downstream t four and T three that need to be looked at and T three is very important because T three gets converted from t four. So t four is your inactive thyroid hormone. T three is your active thyroid hormone. We almost never test this T three number. And a lot of times we can have a conversion issue. So your T four may be adequate. And then we have a drop in T three. So t three is not at an equal par In regards to the percentile of the reference range. And then we definitely know antibodies aren’t tested. That’s really tough. And partly because they don’t do anything because of it because treating a thyroid autoimmune condition with conventional medicine standards. They use high dose prednisone and immunosuppressive medications, those medications for a thyroid issue that would actually cause more side effects than the thyroid issue itself. So they tend to stay away from treating a thyroid issue. So they don’t really do any tests to reveal that it’s there. If it’s autoimmune, so you kind of get stuck in no man’s land. 

Evan Brand: Oh god, that’s a great point. That’s what I was gonna say. I mean, it just frustrates me where you and I will have you know, new patients come and they’ll send us bloodwork and we’ll look at these, you know endocrinologist that may have even extra credentials, but yet their their thyroid panel is still more generic than what you and I are running. And it just infuriates me, because these people, they’re spending so much money, they’re traveling to Mayo Clinic and whatever else, and they’re still not even getting what you and I would consider basic or foundational screening, it’s really frustrating.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s a combination of two things. It’s a combination of one they’re not aware, because they’ve kind of been like handcuffed, like, Oh, we can’t do anything about it anyway. So they kind of feel a little bit handcuffed and defeated. And then number two, they don’t want to piss off the insurance company. Because if they’re ordering via the insurance company, they don’t want the insurance company kicking them out of network for doing unnecessary testing, right? So you get in this position where you’re like, crap, well, how do I how do I handle this? How do I navigate as a doctor? And so we exist in the world of cash medicine, so we can do what we want and do what we recommend and need, what the patient needs. And we don’t have to worry about some insurance company dictating what we can do for the patient. The problem with insurance is they can’t they get in the middle. And they’re basically imagine someone getting in between you and your doctor and questioning everything you’re doing and saying, well, you probably don’t need that. So well. Let me talk to the patient about that. And see if the patient thinks we need it or not. I’m going to make a recommendation most of the time the patient’s like, yeah, that totally makes sense. Let’s do it. But imagine that insurance company stepping in between you and saying, Well, I don’t know about that. So we have that advantage in on the functional medicine side not going through insurance, because we can give the patient exactly what they need. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, great point. Yeah, I mean, the question my grandfather, for years, I would push him, Hey, I really want you to get full thyroid panel, I really want you to get vitamin D, and then the doctor would immediately push back, well, vitamin D is not going to be covered. Are you okay with that? You know, and then of course, it always ended up being covered. So it was this weird, like in between land where you feel like you’re not getting the proper care that you need, because they’re fearful, you know, the doctors are fearing that they’re going to go, like you said out of the network, or kind of out of their normal bounds of training. And then also, like you mentioned, that would illuminate any deficiencies they have in their treatment model, because if all of a sudden, they run TPO antibodies, and you do the follow up, and they’ve never looked at TPO antibodies, they don’t have a clue to say, Hey, why don’t we do a DNA stool test? Let’s go look at these infections in your gut. Now I’m connecting the dots here, you’re having anxiety, heart palpitations, you’ve got elevated TPO antibodies, and you’re having cyclical diarrhea, Hmm, I don’t know what the heck to do. Here is your thyroid medication. Here’s your Synthroid, or whatever. And then here is maybe, like you said, an IBS type drug. And that’s it. So let’s get back more to the action steps. I think we’ve done a great job of kind of illuminating, how does this happen? But first step, when somebody comes in and you see thyroid, you see gut issues. You mentioned DNA stool test, are you going to run blood immediately? Or is that more of like a downstream effect? So you don’t worry about it up front? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You mean blood for the thyroid? 

Evan Brand: Yes. Like, are you going to do thyroid panel at the same time as a stool? Or are you going to just focus on the gut? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Only if I see over thyroid symptoms, if there’s any family history, because a lot of times thyroid can overlap with adrenals. So I always look at the adrenals. First before thyroid unless we see a lot of hair loss, a lot of cool hands, a lot of cool feed stuff, a lot of weak fingernails, if we see a lot of low thyroid symptoms, that I’m going to take a look at it. Now most people they’ve already done some digging around their thyroid before they come see me. So usually, there’s some labs that have already been run that I can look at. And if not, then if we have those issues, then we’re either going to one, just go after the adrenals month one if we don’t have any overt symptoms, and see how we do. And then if we’re not having improvements out of the gates in regards to temperature, energy, those kind of things, then we do it. If we see that temperature and energy is a big deal out of the gates and we know cold hands cold feet hair loss, we can quantify that maybe with some basil, temperature testing, and we know it, then we’ll probably just rule out that low thyroid out of the gates just to make sure so it just kind of depends where patients are coming in from. And of course, if it’s family history that that’s we’re going to really dive into that. And because autoimmunity affects women five times more than men, if it’s a female patient, I’m a lot more on point with it. And if we have history of it, sister, aunt, uncle, mom, dad, whatever, then we’re going to be looking even more closely. But if I’m on the fence, usually I’ll just have patients do some basil, temperature testing with a really good digital thermometer. And we use the protocol in the members area, which is, you know, testing armpit axillary area and 97.8 to 98, two in the morning, or 98 to 98 six for the mouth. And we’ll just kind of test that we’ll do three, three temperatures test in the morning before you get up and move around. And we’ll just kind of get a window of how good that temperature is or not. 

Evan Brand: So if you’re on that low end, did you say 97.8 was at your low end?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s armpit axillary, same thing. So when you’re nine to 98, six for the mouth oral. 

Evan Brand: Okay. So if you’re at that very low end, is that still okay? Or you start to get concerned in that 97.8 level.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It would depend it would depend where the patient is if they have thyroid symptoms, I’d be more I start to get more concerned when they’re going below 97. Mm hmm. You know, also, I’m always I’m always in 97, like, I’m 97.8 all the time, and I’m thinking, well, crap, you know what, why am I not 98. But that isn’t that big of a deal. Like I’m getting a little more concerned, I’m below 97. But with women, you got to be careful because women’s temperature can dip right before oscillation and then peak as going through regulation. So if you grab that temperature, right before isolation, it could look a little bit artificially low. But also, if you grab it right in and after ovulation, it could be artificially high. So as a female, you know, the best time of the cycle to test is part of that first five or six days? 

Yeah, okay, that’s good information, you know, what’s it want to first aid, you bleed so that first five or six days, from bleeding onward.

Evan Brand: It’s a little bit of a tangent, but I’ll just mention it because you’re on temperature. So apparently, Lyme spy repeats affect the hypothalamus, which affects body temperature. So I’ve used temperature as well as kind of an investigation tool. And as we’ve treated people with Lyme issues, sounds like maybe the hypothalamus starts working more efficiently. And then boom, temperature regulation gets better, because that was a big issue for me, where, you know, I had major issue with the cold. And we’d always look at thyroid, we knew, you know, you know, my my gut story with parasite infection. So I would look at thyroid, and I would never see any issues, I was always perfectly in the functional ranges. So there are some other pieces to this puzzle. But I want to hit on the adrenal piece, too. That was interesting. So you had brought up like this adrenal thyroid connection to and that’s going to be tied into the gut, right, you’re going to see potential adrenal issues because of the immune stress based on the gut stress. So it could go gut affecting adrenals. And then adrenal is affecting thyroid, right? It might not just be gut thyroid, you’re saying the missing link in between those two is adrenals. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It can be because the adrenals are your natural anti inflammatory. So if you have a lot of inflammation in the body, from a infection, your adrenals are going to be spitting out cortisol, natural corticosteroids to help with that inflammation and stress. So like conventional medicine, a lot of times we’ll do prednisone, right? That’s like a really strong steroid. Well, your body has its own natural steroids it would use so of course, if you’re whipping that tired horse, that can be something that gets affected. And then of course, when your immune system starts getting overly stimulated from infections from now, maybe an increased chance of food allergens, because now your guts more permeable, undigested food particles can kind of make their way into the bloodstream and create more immune stress because now your immune system sees foods floating around the bloodstream and digested that shouldn’t be there. And so then now, you know, your, your immune is maybe tagging those proteins. And we know the surface proteins on gluten, for instance, maybe dairy, those the surface proteins look very similar to the thyroid, so your body can actually start mistakenly attacking thyroid tissue because those proteins look kind of similar. 

Evan Brand: And yeah, and I just want to clarify this issue is going to be more common. It’s going to happen more frequently, when there are gut issues disrupting the immune regulation, correct. It’s not like in every person, dairies magically going to trigger thyroid antibodies, you’re saying in these gut compromised people that may have infections because of the intestinal permeability being increased? Now there’s more antigen getting in to the bloodstream and then boom. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, it’s gonna be heightened more with an infection, because like, imagine the infection is like already kind of cracking the door open and your gut lining a little bit more. But let’s say you didn’t have an infection. It’s possible certain food allergies could be enough to crack that door as well. Right. Okay. But either way, let’s say you are sensitive and you have food allergy issues, and you have an infection now, it’s a double whammy, instead of that door being cracked open. Now it’s wide open, right? Yes, that makes makes that makes perfect sense. Yeah, for me, I mean, I used to do really, really poorly with dairy now really high quality dairy, I can get away with a little bit because I’ve healed my gut so much. So for me, I saw it. And it depends, right? Because not all dairy is created equal. So butter, fats and high fat dairy is usually different than dairy that has more casein, right? casein based areas tend to be like, more cheese or milks, right fat based areas and they’ll be like ghee, butter, maybe heavy cream. So casein tends to be the more allergenic portion of the dairy. And then, of course, we have lactose and lactose is the sugar portion of the dairy. So lactose, it’s more of an intolerance. And you just get more digestive disruptions where casein could be more of that immune stimulant. So things like people that have dairy intolerances, still may be able to tolerate ghee or butter. Because Because it’s not, it’s pretty low in casein much higher in the fat. Fats tend to be more neutral for people tend to be able to tolerate good fats, especially saturated fats because they’re, they’re not easily oxidized. 

Evan Brand: Yes, yes. Well said that’s a great point. So what about the influence of the gut healing protocols that we implement, and thyroid because people are hearing parasites, so they’re thinking, kill, kill, kill. And that definitely is part of it. And you and I’ve seen where just by eradicating infections, we’ve seen multiple things happen, which is pretty cool. So number one will see that the Secretory IgA, which is a marker, we look at on stool testing secretory, IGA will come up just as a side effect of clearing out infections. And that already indicates, hey, look, we’re starting to get on the healing path before we even did a quote healing protocol. And then we’ll see thyroid antibodies come down sometimes hundreds, sometimes 1000s of points, just by clearing the infections out. Okay, so that’s really like boom, clear infections out. But what about the gut healing phase? What are you seeing there? Are you seeing that that’s the, you know, the secret sauce, where thyroid really comes down in the gut healing phase? Are you finding, you know, if you had a pie chart, are you saying killing is doing most of the work for leaving the stress on the thyroid? Is it the gut healing phase? is there is there one that’s a bigger importance than the other? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Depends on how acute the infection is, but we’re doing so many things at once. Like, this is the question I get, like, what’s causing What? And it’s like, it’s very difficult to know that because what’s the most important number in a combination to your safe log? what’s the what’s the most important ingredient in the recipe your mom makes, right? Well, it’s a combination, everything, right. And so when you’re dealing with an infection, I’m very rarely coming in there and practicing Acute Care Medicine where we’re just going after an infection where we’re changing the diet, we’re decreasing inflammation by having a healthy anti inflammatory kind of paleo template, we’re improving digestion, that in its own right starts to improve nutrient absorption, we may add in some extra nutrients as well, that are easily bioavailable. So then we can get those in our bloodstream and start utilizing the metabolically. Obviously, the thyroid needs some zinc, it needs some selenium, it needs some iodine. Of course, we don’t want to ever go overly high with iodine because that can actually increase autoimmune attack, but a couple 100 micrograms, as long as there’s not an acute attack may be fine. And then of course, we’re working on supporting hormones, right, we working on maybe supporting thyroid, if the thyroid is depleted, meaning you’ve had a decade or so autoimmune attacks, you may need some thyroid hormone, depending on how much that that thyroid been beaten down. If the thyroid still functioning, well, then just doing a lot of the good nutritional strategies may be enough to help it do what it’s what it needs to do. And then we’re coming in down the road going after the infections a little bit later. Now we’re an antibiotic kind of focus generation, right? It’s like, Oh, I have an infection, you have this antibiotic, antibiotic antibiotic. So that’s kind of translated to people wanting to kill whatever they have right away. Now, if it’s an acute infection, you went to Mexico, you ate something like you just got diarrhea, and you’re having like a dozen VMs a day, right. And it just diarrhea, that we may have to handle that differently than like a chronic infection that’s been happening over the long run. So I always put infections in two different groups, acute or chronic. And then we always still have to work on doing all the foundational things. If it’s acute, it may be a lot more compressed over a couple of days versus a month or two, if it’s a more chronic issue, and regarding how we start going after the gut. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and the adrenal is maybe less important to deal with right away, if it’s a really bad, acute thing. It just depends upon like, Hey, I’m great, I’m great, I’m great, boom, I’m going to the bathroom a dozen times a day, it’s not good. My tummy feels like crap. If it’s that kind of an acute thing, and you were relatively okay ahead of time, then we’re going to look at that differently than a chronic infection. I love the analogy, what is the what’s the most important, you know, numeral to your to your safe code? Because I know the answer to the question I asked you, which was like, what’s a bigger deal here? Is it clear in the infections? Is it you know, healing the gut? Is it reducing food allergens? And I asked that just because I’m just playing devil’s advocate, because that’s what clients and patients always ask, you know, when we’re working with them, they’re like, Okay, well, you know, what’s my biggest priority right now? It’s like, I’m all of it. So it may sound a little overwhelming. But as we’re taking small steps with the diet, the lifestyle, we’re getting you to bed sooner, we’re helping with adaptogenic herbs to support the adrenals where, you know, let’s say you’re in between jobs, you’re moving house, I mean, there’s lifestyle stuff that’s important. You know, that’s, that’s affecting your hormones, which is affecting your sleep, which is affecting your gut and your recovery. And so we’re factoring in all of this at the same time, so rarely in a vacuum. Are we just coming in, like you said, and just boom, here’s your random microbials. Have a nice day. That’s very rare situation, right? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I mean, like, let’s say, you’re healthy, right? You go down to Mexico, you pick up crypto, and then you just start having really a lot of diarrhea, we may handle you a lot differently. But like a lot of people that come in and I see usually there’s a combination of maybe some kind of a food allergy issue happening in the background. So then we clean that out, that maybe helps a third and then maybe they’ve really had poor digestion for a while like you know inadequate HDL or enzyme levels, that starts to help maybe a third or a quarter. And then that starts to modulate and calm down the immune system. So now the immune system kind of can relax a little bit, maybe that’s 10% 20%. And that we have, we’re getting access to maybe more Selenium or more zinc in our diet now. And that starts to help modulate the immune response, maybe that nourishes thyroid conversion, and then let’s say the infection, right, let’s say that’s the last 20%. So it could be a combination of certain things, you know, 10%, here, 20% there, 30%. There, and it just adds up. And so in the end, it’s hard to know exactly which one’s going to be the winner, right? And sometimes it’s equally spread out. That’s why if we just do the things that we know, we need to do on our checklist, our chance of results, good results is going to be much higher. 

Evan Brand: Absolutely. Well, I’m out of time. So I don’t know if you have a lot more to say if so I’ll just leave but if you don’t, then let’s wrap it up together. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That sounds great. I think let’s wrap it up here to reach out to Evan head over to again, Evan and I are available for consultation worldwide, which is excellent in today’s day and age. And then myself, Dr. J over at We’re happy to help you out and work deeper on any thyroid issue. Gut issue infection issue where we can kind of dive in deeper and get to the root cause make sure you put your comments below and subscribe and share the episode with friends and family. We really appreciate it. 

Evan Brand: Absolutely. Yes, sharing is caring and there’s probably someone in your family or your life that has a thyroid issue. So please give this to them. Hopefully, even if they have to listen to it two, three times. Hopefully it helps guide them in the right direction to heal to recover to live life fully. So take care. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Awesome and have a good one man. Bye


Audio Podcast:

Chronic and Acute Nausea Root Causes | Podcast #295

For this episode, Dr J talks about Chronic and Acute Nausea causes. Dr. J with Evan Brand share their experience with nausea, and how they treat it for themselves as well as to their thousands of patients around the world. Get to know some Anti microbial herbs that you can take, as well as the acupressure points. More information below.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

0:25       Anti Nausea Medications 

3:59       Stress and Infections

10:50     What is Nausea

15:51     Root Causes to Nausea

18:48     Anti Microbial Herbs

23:35     Emotional Freedom Technique

24:14     Acupressure Points

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We are live. It’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan brand. Today we’re going to be talking about the root causes of nausea. Again, because we are clinicians, this isn’t going to be just a symptomatic type of cover up. We want to actually get to the root cause and because we have so much experience with it, we’re going to be sharing with the All Things that have worked with our own personal cells as well as our thousands of patients. So Evan, let’s dive in How you doing today, man? 

Evan Brand: Doing really well excited to dive into this topic that conventional medicine doesn’t have much to offer. They may put you on like Dramamine if you’ve got some kind of nausea issue, but it doesn’t go much further than that. Maybe as Oh, Fran, in the conventional medicine world, you know, I’ve had clients that have had gut issues and mood issues and major nausea. If it’s been an extreme situation, they’ll go into the ER and they’ll say, Oh my god, I have the worst nausea of my life and what do they do? They put them on zofran. A drug which is an anti nausea drug and it works. It is effective. But then they send him home and they said, Oh, you must have just had an anxiety attack and you know, for your gut symptoms, you need to go see a gastroenterologist because I don’t know what’s going on there. So then they go to the GI doc the GI doc doesn’t say much about nausea besides possibly giving a prescription or maybe an acid blocker or something else. So it’s not really it’s not pretty and so many people out there suffering, but I’ll just tell you my story and then we’ll get into some of the clinical pearls too, which is that when I had h pylori and parasite issues, man, my nausea was terrible. I was telling you before I press four, we press record here live, man, I tell you not only did I lose weight, but I had no appetite or my appetite would swing or some days I’m really hungry and other days I couldn’t eat anything and it’s just because I had this baseline nausea going on. And h pylori, I can do it to you. So I don’t know if that’s the this is in no particular order. So I don’t know if that’s the top number one cause but I would say it’s definitely in the top three clinic H pylori infection, which is a bacteria that damages your parietal cells, and it reduces your stomach acid levels, just that reduction of stomach acid alone can cause that nausea, but also, your gut lining can get irritated it can get inflamed from the bacteria, and that can further the nausea.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. 100%. And a lot of these anti nausea medications, they kind of work on the histamine receptor, right? They’re like an h1 blocker h2 blocker or an h3 blocker. Is that correct? 

Evan Brand: That’s right. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so a lot of those medications are going to have a anti kind of serotonin type of effect. So what does that mean? Right? Anytime we have issues with histamine, almost always there’s going to be some level of inflammation brewing, right? Anytime histamine becomes a problem, think of your inflammation bucket is being overwhelmed or overflowing. So now we have to really get to the root cause of why that is so you know, palliated wise, you could do an anti histamine if it’s an every now and then thing, but if it’s a chronic thing well now the question is why and that’s where we’re just trying to take the conversation and go deeper to the root cause versus just talk about the palliative symptom cover up. Plus, not to mention a lot of anti histamine medications, they have a lot of fatigue and cognitive issues as a side effect. So that’s not really a good long term solution for a lot of people anyway.

Evan Brand: Yeah, it’s just not sustainable either. Now, unlike my grandfather, I know he would when he would go on a plane he would take like a Dramamine which would, which would help the plane nausea, but what was causing the bucket to be so full so you’ve alluded to histamine? I think it’s a huge piece of the puzzle. Why does histamine become an issue though? I would say SIBO, intestinal bacterial overgrowth with histamine producing bacteria what other things would you say are putting in the histamine bucket? Are you talking like, you know, high histamine foods that are putting in the bucket along with the microbes? Are you thinking those are the two big factors that are filling up the bucket or what else.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So definitely Just stress from all different areas. So being a functional medicine doctor, you have to be really good at being a stress detective. So what does that mean? That means we’re looking at physical, chemical and emotional stressors. And we’re looking at those stressors and how they accumulate. So if I deal with someone and we hate what’s going on in your life, right now, when did everything start, I’m like, oh, there’s a divorce going on. Oh, there’s a significant move or an upheaval in the family. Okay, that’s something we’re going to make a note on right. Now, a lot of times, you can’t fix some of that you can just make sure they have support or you know, recommend a good counselor or someone else to make sure that that issue is being supported and being processed in a healthy fashion. But we have to make sure now health is even higher, when there’s lots of stress. So when someone’s stressed, we have to make sure diet is really good, amazingly anti inflammatory, nutrient dense kind of low toxin paleo template, really important. We have to make sure because of that nausea, do we have poor enzyme and acid secretion, so a lot of times that’s part of the stress responses, you have low enzyme and acid secretion. And so then when you eat food Do you feel more nauseous, you feel worse because of all that stress and inflammation, inhibition of enzymes and acids. So then we have to really make sure we can actually digest and break down our foods. People think that’s a given, oh, I’m eating a healthy paleo template. I’m going to have good digestion because my food’s Great. Well, maybe not. So we have to make sure the common sense things are in place. Are we chewing our food? Well, are we hydrating with food? Right, hydration with food may not be the best unless it’s a couple ounces of water to get down pills. And then the third thing is, are we taking enough acids and enzymes and maybe even bile salts because we know not enough bile? and not being able to break down fat can also be a nausea issue. Right? gallbladder issues are a big one. We see that with pregnant women, right? high levels of HCG and poor fat digestion can easily create a nausea environment there too.

Evan Brand: Yeah, well said and the infections too. So if you’re trying to get to the root cause of the root cause it’s like okay, low acid. Low enzymes why well, the H. pylori could be one factor, parasites, various bacterial overgrowth, so you always have to address those infections, and maybe your infection free, which would be pretty rare and awesome, but age alone can also do this. So after age 20, we’ve talked about him many times, but Dr. Wright’s book why stomach acid is good for you. Age 30, age 40, age 50, age 60. enzymes and acids are going to go down every year, but of course, majorly every decade. And so by the time you’re 60 70, if you’re not taking supplemental acids and enzymes, we’re going to quantify this too, right? When you say we need to make sure you have adequate digestion. You’re not just saying, Hey, here’s some enzymes, we’re going to be looking at an organic acids, we’re going to be looking at a stool panel, we’re going to look at gut inflammation, we’re going to look at stouter crit, which is a fecal fat marker. We’re going to look at pancreatic elastase. We’re going to look at the neurotransmitters. We’re going to look at the amino acid metabolites, how are people digesting so there’s a ton of data by Behind this, we don’t just say you have bad digestion, here’s a supplement. It’s no, you have bad digestion. Let me show you on paper. Here’s the infections, reducing the enzymes. That’s the first domino. And then here’s the inflammation from the mal absorb food that’s further affecting your gut barrier. And then three, here’s your amino acids. They’re crap because you’re not digesting your proteins. Now, here’s the protocol. So it’s not just bad digestion, nausea enzyme there, there’s more to it behind, you know, behind the scenes

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 110% 100% agree so we have to get to the underlying issue. Now there’s some natural things that can help right. Lemon juice is a really nice one right? Why does lemon juice help? Well, lemon juice has acid in there so I think lemon juice Prime’s the digestive tract to make more acid and help better break down the food. Number two ginger now I have ginger part of my ginger tea kind of recipe protocol my patients know this is something that I recommend across the board. board. So when we had killed doing a lot of killing or we have a lot of stomach upset ginger number one can calm down the guts of the guts inflamed, it can calm that down, which can help better digestion helped move along motility and calm down the inflammation. Ginger also has a natural anti nausea side benefit, safe to take if you’re a pregnant woman too, by the way, but it really helps with nausea from a natural perspective. So we love that because it’s going to really help calm down the inflammation, which is part of the root cause but also help with the nausea so we don’t have to be on a Dramamine or zofran or some kind of an h1, h2, or even h3, anti nausea medication, which may only have side effects. So those are a couple of natural things we can dive in and go deeper as well. Peppermint is also a great one. Canna meal is a great one guess what peppermint kameel ginger, guess what their natural digestive bitters. So part of how they work is they’re going to help your digestive system work better in regards to secreted enzymes. an acid which is very powerful, and a lot of those oils have anti inflammatory benefits. So reducing inflammation and increasing digestive secretions is part of, you know, a good palliative solution. We can talk deeper because you kind of alluded to SIBO and maybe you’re in the past when you have H. pylori that cause nausea. So if we’re just doing HCL enzymes and ginger and not getting to the root cause it’s still a palliative fix, but better than a medication because it doesn’t have all the side effects

Evan Brand: True and I think it was probably the Giardia, too, right. We know the Giardia can be an issue with the gallbladder. If you just look up grd a gallbladder there’s a huge connection there and that was probably part of my fat digestion issues as well. So even after I cleared out the H pylori, you know, there were some parasites that I was still dealing with. So that could have been part of my nausea as well. You and I were talking about a guy earlier. client of mine in his early 20s, who has had constant nausea. He described it as 24 seven nausea for several years. Conventional doctors can up on him, he sought out my help. I told him and this is what we do as practitioners sometimes we’ll say, hey, look, I don’t know the exact number one end all be all puzzle piece to this issue. But I’m going to run you through looking into these body systems. We found some infections, we found a lot of mold. And I’m like, hey, look, fingers crossed. This is gonna work. We made a really good protocol. And now six months later, he’s 99% better, and there’s no more nausea so much that when we do a follow up call now I’m like, hey, do you have any complaints or concerns? Nope. And I’m like, Oh, well, did you forget when you first came to me you had nausea 20 470 Yeah, I remember it’s gone. I’m like yay. Because sometimes going in you and I were talking about the importance of foundation so so let’s hit that real quick because people don’t get to enjoy our pre recording chat. But what-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I wanted to just was just the time and I wanted to just define nausea. Someone in the in the live video kind of say, What’s nausea? Well, nausea is that queasy kind of upset feeling in your stomach. It’s kind of you You may get a little bit dizzy. It’s that in between of puking and vomiting. But you’re kind of just feel like your tummies upset. You feel queasy, you feel a little bit dizzy. You feel about ready to to puke, but not quite there. 

Evan Brand: I’m sure everyone’s experienced nausea at one point. Yeah,

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think everyone has for sure.

Evan Brand: Yeah, but so so with this guy, which can happen with nausea. And it did happen with nausea. I didn’t know on paper. You know, looking at the labs, we saw some issues, but I didn’t have a number one smoking gun that I was convinced was the root cause of his nausea. But we went through the foundation’s getting the diet in order addressing the infections using binders to pull out mold and other toxins. And hey, look, he got better. It’s amazing. So there are certain cases where we may have symptoms that sound weird, or maybe we don’t have the end all be all smoking gun right in front of us. But we’re gonna run, run you through the system address these body systems. And there’s so many things that just happened. Have you seen that where you kind of say that the symptom improvement is a side effect of getting healthy? It’s like hey, Yeah, we made you healthy and your issue went away. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The problem with conventional medicine is they give you a drug that may help with that side effect or help with that issue, but then the side effect may be worse, where we’re going after something, something totally different. Right and H pylori infection or not enough stomach acid from SIBO. And then the side of benefit is the nausea goes away. So this is what happens when you go upstream and you deal with system issues. Symptoms downstream manifests when you treat symptoms by themselves downstream with medications, then you have more symptoms that happen from the medication called side effects. And so that’s the difference between when you get to recall stuff versus symptom care.

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah. And the peppermint man, I’m glad you brought up peppermint. I drink my bodyweight in peppermint. When I add H. pylori. My gut was just raw. I was doing some dgl I was doing glutamine. I was doing other gut healing nutrients which we can talk about now. I think that could be part of the palliative care with nausea. The you mentioned kameel already but the glutamine, the aloe, so Like the gut soothing nutrients, we did a whole podcast on that. Go check it out, early July, top seven nutrients to heal your gut. A lot of that stuff could could actually help with nausea too. So there may be some overlap, but it’s always working backwards. So number one thing, get your stool looked at number two thing, get your urine looked at number three, I’d say get your environment looked at this guy. This young guy, he had tons of mold in his bedroom. So we actually had him start burning some of the candles that we have some mold candles and then doing the Mr. In his bedroom, and we retested his plates in his petri dish that previously looked very moldy indicating had a lot of colonies growing in his room. We retest the petri dish and it looked much better. So for him, I do believe there was an environmental component as well. So when you’re working with the practitioner, hopefully they’re addressing all these root cause body issues, but in some cases, it could be an environmental issue. I had a lady who lived with her mother, and her mother was always burning candles and somehow the candle was making her nausea so she swapped out the candle for an essential oil one got rid of the synthetic fragrance and the nausea went away. So some people are going to have nausea from smells whether it’s car exhaust or cigarette smoke or perfume or deodorant, you know, the chemically sensitive people out there. Nausea can come from those chemical sensitivities. So if you’re not already addressing your body care, your skincare, any hair products, soaps, shampoos, laundry detergent, dryer sheets, you know going free and clear go unscented or essential oil based with all those products that could also improve nausea.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes, 110% 110% I think we’re on the right on the right track always trying to get to the root cause someone wrote in would you suggest giving lemon or ginger if someone’s on a histamine diet, I think it’s worth it. If anything that can help stimulate digestive support is great. Typically I’m going to come in there with enzymes and acids off the gecko because that really helps. Of course right there. If you want something more at home, you can do the ginger an apple cider vinegar or lemon juice, that’s fine. If not, we’re going to use Use our own digestive support. I think that’s a really, really good first start. Because if you improve digestion, that makes a big difference. Now, testing, we’re going to do some deeper stool testing to get to the root cause of what’s happening and see if there’s an H. pylori infection. If there’s a cebo infection, we’re going to run some organic acids, we’re going to look at gut bacteria and yeast in the urine. So we’re always trying to get to the root cause. But then we have these palliative things that are up our sleeve with the ginger and the B six and peppermint and our gentle kind of common meal and Swedish bitters.

Evan Brand: Yeah, I love the gut healing herbs. You can use them if you don’t know what’s going on. But hopefully just by clearing infections, nausea is going to get much much better.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. That’s really good, man. we’re on the right track here. Anything else you wanted to highlight here for me root cause perspective in regards to nausea?

Evan Brand: Well, I’ve had many, many clients get their gallbladder removed, and now they’re just in really bad shape. They’ve got constant nausea, and these People that and this is not to make me sound good. This is just a reality. But if they would have come to me before they got the gallbladder out, hopefully we could have saved their gallbladder by removing infections, increasing bile salts, things like that to save the gallbladder before it became to a crisis level where they had an emergency gallbladder removal, but it’s a huge, huge problem, the gall bladders removed because, you know, you’re still going to be producing bile. You’re just not going to be able to store it and concentrate it and so, you know, people that are going on paleo or keto or high fat diets, they’re like, Well, why am I so freakin nauseous now? I thought paleo was the answer. Their autoimmune paleo Why am I so nauseous? Well, if you don’t have a gallbladder, you’re your disadvantage. So you’re going to need a little more help than the average person with the digestive piece.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I 100% agree. I got sick last year, up in Boston in the north end that was at an Italian restaurant, I ordered a steak and I really felt nauseous and I think I got food poisoning or a gut infection. And it was a Friday night and I was just nauseous until I got back home. Monday morning and when I got back the first thing I did was I hit my gi Claire for and within 30 minutes the nausea was gone.

Evan Brand: What’s in there?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: GI Claire 4 had a lot of berberine a lot of goldenseal and a lot of burdock birdbox. Excellent for the limp. But as soon as it hit my tummy, I felt 1000 times better. And so there was probably some kind of a food poisoning or some kind of a microbe in the gut. That was really triggering a lot of that nausea like receptor site activation, whether it was a histamine or an inflammation issue. It was really driving that but my giac therefore made a huge difference. I was doing a lot of ginger and apple cider vinegar drinks. So that’s what I had access to at Whole Foods. That helped a little bit but you could feel it. It was just palliative. It wasn’t getting to the root cause as soon as I did my giac there for us, like gone. Yeah, whoa, it was like someone just flipped the switch and turns it off. I couldn’t believe it.

Evan Brand: That makes sense. Well, I guess one thing we didn’t define yet is the difference between acute nausea which I I would consider your situation they’re more acute versus cute with with the guy I was talking about. That was a more chronic knowledge issue. This guy been nauseous for years you were nauseous for day. So in that aspect there would be a little bit of difference for you. You didn’t need any testing. You didn’t do a stool test and wait for the results. You know, you count you got home you took some herbs you felt better, so that’s good. So I guess you know, so far we’ve been talking more more chronic. But regarding the acute. Another thing I would throw into the mix would be some type of binder, whether it’s like a fulvic acid, charcoal, zeolite clay, bentonite clay, those type of things could be a game changer. And I always have, I always have a bag that in the diaper bag. So my wife and I are out somewhere. Let’s say I got food poisoning. Maybe it helps but it’s definitely not going to hurt to papa capsule or to a charcoal. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It can and don’t get me wrong in this situation. I had charcoal, I had oil of oregano. I had probiotics. None of that touched it when I hit my giac there for it. Within 30 minutes. I couldn’t believe it. It was like I was in this fall. And then it was just totally lifted.

Evan Brand: It makes sense. Well, so the charcoal wouldn’t work if it was like a bacteria histamine issue, right?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, if it was a food poisoning kind of bacteria issue probably was it probably wasn’t enough because it’s like, you know, you send in 10 police to to arrest 100 people, you know, think of the, the charcoal was the policeman, right? Well, it’s not enough but if you kind of drop a bomb, so to speak with the herbs in the tummy, all these unruly bacteria, you’re just going to knock everything down. I think we just needed bigger guns, right? The gut microbes, there’s just a lot of unfriendly microbes out of balance there and once I dropped the giac therefore, it moved the needle now I didn’t want to know ahead of time. So I’ve just learned wherever I go, I bring that gi Claire 4 because the burdock root with the golden seal and the high dose berberine ‘s and the grapefruit and the black is just a good synergy of herbs there that have really helped me a couple of different times in Mexico with parasites. And with this nausea episode. It’s an absolute game changer.

Evan Brand: I’ve Yeah, I’m I’d love to hear that, you know, I’ve used a lot less oregano in the past couple years clinically, because of the synergistic herb formulas that you and I have. I just find they work so much better than just a regular like if I used to see like a Candida or maybe a parasite, I may throw some oregano and on top of it, but I don’t know about you, but I’m using a lot less oregano in isolation and much, much more happy with our complexes.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, I tend to do a combination of the two, especially if there’s Candida, but yeah, I totally agree. Some of the the combo stuff is really really nice and helps with the root issues. So recap what are some of the big things we have to look for? We have to kind of draw a line between an acute episode of nausea and a chronic episode. If there’s an acute episode, we always want to thank food poisoning or infection. Okay. If there’s a chronic episode when we want to thank potential infection, right, but we also want to thank stressed out Nervous System sympathetic overload, not enough enzymes, not enough acid, not enough bile. Put, right not enough file, we’re gonna have a hard time breaking down fat, liver and gallbladder and poor fat digestion issues are known to cause nausea. So adding in good, whether it’s just bile support or whether it’s phosphatidylcholine, or some taurine, or some dandelion root or some fringe tree extract are all very good for the gallbladder also just the enzyme, the lipase and the and the bile salts can be helpful. Good proteolytic enzymes, good hydrochloric acid, all of those can be incredibly helpful at supporting good digestion, and then which is a side benefit. The nausea goes away. See, with a lot of combat a lot of natural stuff, we don’t really have side effects, we have side benefits, you know, if you’re really sensitive, and you’re inflamed, there’s always can be a little bit of issue because your tummy may or your body may just be so inflamed, but if you’re relatively healthy and stable, most of the time you get side benefits with natural compounds, not side effects,

Evan Brand: Right. So if you’re using the antimicrobial herbs, you’re knocking down the pathogens, which is the main mechanism but then number two, the nausea when way. So that’s awesome. I love how that works. And regarding the testing, like I said, in your case, it was cute. You didn’t need testing, but in chronic cases, yeah, we’re going to be looking at store we’re going to be looking at your impossibly environmental, like I told you for this young guy, you know, he did have mold in his bedroom. The levels were quite high mold can cause nausea. It can cause dizziness. So some people have that combo, where it’s a little bit of nausea, vertigo, dizziness, combo, it could be related to that. And then I would say, stress and trauma too. I mean, I had a woman who had a really, really bad interaction with her boss. And every day on the drive to work, she would get nauseous and I thought, okay, what’s in her car? She had a mercedes, mercedes benz did a recall on 2.5 million cars for mold growing in the HVC system. So I thought, is this lady getting exposed to mold? Nope, we did petri dishes on her car. It wasn’t moly, she was fine. But why was she nauseous everyday on the way to work? And I thought, well, I don’t know. She thought she was EMF sensitive. So We had her disable all the Bluetooth functions and all that on the car. Nope, that didn’t help. And then we talked about this boss, how she had this really, really bad interaction with the boss. And I’m like, Okay, well, does the boss still work in that same office? Yes. And then the boss goes on vacation. Guess what her nausea magically goes away the week that she is driving to work where she knows the boss isn’t there. She has no nausea, like oh my god. So there it is. It’s some type of emotional trauma. And you have this like cortisol response, which cortisol could cause nausea from the stress. And so we just had her start doing tapping, we had her do Emotional Freedom Technique, tap, tap, tap it out, and the trauma went away. And now she could drive to work without getting nauseous. So sometimes you have to probe and sometimes you think it’s going to be something simple, and it ends up being related to that. So don’t forget about the emotional component. If you’ve got bad boss, bad spouse, let’s say you’re getting nauseous on the drive home and you’re going to go in and you know, you and your husband still have some stuff to resolve. It could be a normal reaction to be nauseous about that. Please don’t forget about the emotional work and Emotional Freedom Technique is free. It’s effective. Justin and I love it. We personally use it, we clinically use it tapping could be another strategy and sort of a bandaid. That could be palliative and root cause and with nausea, so I think it’s a great, great tool.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, also, if you look at this acupressure points, too, so here’s your hand. It’s called P6. So it’s right about here. So it’s about an inch or two down from the wrist. And if you massage this P6 can also be helpful.

Evan Brand: Yeah, they have bands in that, have you seen those? I tried them. I bought those nausea bands to try to go out on the boat. I mean, it was kind of limited success for me, but some people it works. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And again, this is kind of more a palliative. But nice thing is I mean, what kind of side effects do you have with this and it’s free, right? So you can rob here this area? 

Evan Brand: Yeah. So people listening, people listening on audio, he’s showing you right on the right on the inside, it’s in. It’s in between the two tendons right there right on the wrist, kind of maybe maybe three inches. Have your wrist headed up towards your elbow but on the inside of your arm and then the other point he’s showing is right on the back of the hand sort of in that little crevice where the thumb and the pointer finger are going to meet right then in between there, you could you’re saying just hold it there. And that could help. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, you can just massage this area right here in the web between your thumb and your index finger, that little web that little fleshy area and again, this is on video here for y’all. So if you guys can see you can rub this area here. This is a great area like my wife was in in labor giving it and it does help massage this area here. This is not like some placebo stuff. This really does help. This helps and then right about two inches or so you feel like the the the app neurosis here, this kind of connective tissue right below it right in that area right in the middle below the middle finger all the way down just below where the tibia and the oma sorry, the the radius and the owner connect to that little gap there. Yeah, and if you guys are listening, Watch the YouTube video we’ll put down below. I know it’s hard to describe this stuff here. But we’ll try To put in the notes maybe an image of that so you guys can see it, but that’s very helpful. So if you’re feeling nauseous give that a rub. This is P6. This is another point right here. You can do that one. And then if there’s a certain stressful event that’s causing a problem right the boss or a stressful situation with a friend or family member, you can do all your EFT tapping points. I like to double tap. Yeah, like collarbone. Chin, you only got one chin, only one tap there under the nose, under the eyes, tip of the eyebrows, medial eyebrows. 

Evan Brand: And you always talk about how we’re thinking about it too. Like you would be thinking you know, I’m stressed about this person or you doing the remedy you’re thinking I’m calm, which which are you mainly doing?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I always start with the problem because it’s really hard. If you’re thinking about a problem to be like stop thinking about the problem. You kind of need to calm the problem first and then you can start thinking about what you want to manifest so I’m just like, hey, that boss issue like, Man, this person’s really driving me nuts man. I’m feeling really anxious about this boss issue. Wow. Like really stressed to go to work today. And I’m thinking about that. And then once that kind of once I do a couple of rounds and that levels down, but I switch that it’s like, Alright, we’re going to have a great day at work, we’re going to have awesome communication, we’re all going to be on the same page, we’re going to have a really great meeting today. I’m going to communicate my needs clearly on a set my boundaries clearly. So you know, then you can kind of talk about what you want to manifest afterwards. So I try to get the sensation level down below five or so you know, a scale of one to 1010 being the worst, maybe you’re an eight, get it below five. And then you can start doing it while you focus on what you want to manifest. That’s very helpful. I think it’s really good when you can do it the points to you can also you can also tap these points if you want P5 or P6. You can tap these points too.

Evan Brand: Yeah, I love it. Also the peppermint oil and some of those things. Essential Oils topically can be very beneficial to whether you’re just sniffing them whether you’re putting like an anti nausea blend into diffuser. I know when I had gut infections, I was doing a lot of peppermint essential oil mixed with coconut oil to dilute it and I would rub that topically on the belly. It was a game changer. game changer. There’s been studies on that with IBS and it’s awesome. So orally you know, taking things and capsules doing peppermint teas, also topical oils, the EFT addressing the emotional stress, getting tested for the infections clearing those out. So a lot of a lot of good tips in this thing. So if you need to replay this podcast twice, do it and share it with people because there’s a lot of people suffering and they don’t get the answers they need. I really hate when I look at a a list of supplements or medications that our clients are on when they first come to us and they’re looking they’re doing 234 things just to try to help get them out of bed. You know, it’s like an anti anxiety. It’s an anti depressant. It’s an anti nausea, it’s an IBS drug. It’s like oh my gosh, we got to help this person.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% 100% Now a couple patients right in here about cleansing the liver well if you have a lot of gall stones, and your your gallbladder is not functioning properly and you’re not breaking down fat that could definitely be part of it. I typically don’t try to go flush out stones because if you flush out a stone think of a stone could be like a porcupine. It’s like giving a porcupine a hug when that gallbladder contract so I just try to gently emulsify the stone and my line we use the liver supreme because it has some herbs in there that helped kind of emulsify it and gently kind of smooth it out. And also it has bile salts in there and phosphatidylcholine and taurine. So I try to use things that smooth out the stone versus flesh it out because you can potentially cause a gallbladder attack and then extra bile to help break down the fat to then we’re not having the poor digestion of fat causing nausea either.

Evan Brand: Yes, yes. good points. Yeah. HCL enzymes, ox bile, the taurine and I do a lot of artichoke, beet powder.  There’s a lot of good things you can do.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And then just to be clear, this point is Li four, Li four. Okay, and then this one here on the wrist is you take the wrist and you put three fingers across the wrist. Right, and then it’s the pinky finger that that third finger down below I’m sorry, the index finger, third finger down below to measure you’re saying that’s how you measures. So that’s how you measure it to find it.

Evan Brand: Yeah. So people listening, you’ll put three fingers at the bottom of the hand, right? We’re connected to the wrist on the inside there. 123 fingers, long ways down, boom, there is

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: a horizontal and that can help with pain and nausea. Yep, that’s the LDL six and the P six or stay the L. They call it Li four. I’m pretty sure l four is an abbreviation than PC six or P six. Those are the big ones. If you guys want to Google that you can find some images and videos on how to do that.

Evan Brand: Good. There could be some Lessing I’ll mention here there could be some issue with the IRS. I’ve had some clients that have had issues with their sinuses and or their ears causing nausea. And so I’m not saying you need to do this, but I’m telling you what I’ve done before is I’ve done like some grapefruit seed extract in the nose or grapefruit seed extract in the ears to try to clear out inner ear type issues that could cause nausea and it has been beneficial. Some people have reported silver being good up the nose and silver in the ears. If there’s some type of a viral issue, there are some viruses that can affect the inner ear and that can cause some nausea as well. So I am not an EMT, so consult with your EMT and ask them about that. But ears, nose, throat, those kind of issues could possibly be related to this.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, usually with ear stuff, you’re gonna have a lot more vertigo, dizziness and nausea. So if your usually your vertigo is the primary issue, followed by the nausea as a secondary issue, we’re talking, we’re talking more nausea as the primary issue. If that is a problem, you got to get to the root cause. So even with vertigo, a lot of times autoimmune stuff can be at play, thyroid stuff can be a play. If it’s in a odorless crystal issue, where there’s different techniques that you can do a lot of chiropractors will put you on your back, imagine I’m lying on my back, they’ll tilt your head back and they’ll have you turn one way to kind of move the crystal through a lot of times they’ll do massage or a precursor on the back of the occiput area to kind of jiggle out those crystals and They’ll tilt this way as well. So they’ll go back until one way hole for 30 seconds back till the other way hold for 30 seconds that can be helpful if it’s a true otolithic crystal issue. But it may not be for everyone. So there’s a lot of different root causes. That’s why coming up with one medication to treat it is silly because there’s so many different root causes. That’s why the more you know, the better.

Evan Brand: That’s true. That’s true. Well, I think that’s all I wanted to cover. If you have anything else, let us know. But otherwise, let’s wrap this thing up.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so a couple patients right in the chat here will can slippery elm or can fennel help with the tummy? Well, it just depends, right? So if there’s inflammation in the tummy causing the nausea, anything anti inflammatory for the tummy, like glutamine, or ginger, or slippery elm or dgl, or aloe could potentially help with the nausea. Like let’s say you had a food poisoning issue. Would that be enough to help with the nausea maybe not because you’d probably need more antimicrobials in there as well. So you always have To connect it to the root cause. So, if it really helps some of those anti inflammatories, healing, soothing supports aloe bone broth, collagen, it’s probably more of an inflammatory issue, probably less of an acute infection issue. So you’ve got to figure out the root cause. And that’s why seeing a good functional medicine doc like myself, or you evidence gonna be great. And if you guys want to go see Evan,, and, we are available worldwide to help you if you want to dive in deeper and get to the root cause of what’s happening.

Evan Brand: Yep, well, thank you for the plug. I’ll mention it too, in case people like my voice better than yours, if you want to reach out to Justin, He’s available worldwide. And me, available worldwide. We love helping people. We’re truly blessed. We’re truly grateful for the opportunity. You know, we’ve suffered and been our own our own journeys, and we’ve recovered from significant things that many doctors just threw their hands up at, or maybe they threw the prescription pad up at us and we denied those things. And so we’re really honored to be able to have this knowledge personally and clinically. And, you know, we learned so much from you guys. So please reach out if you need help. And we’d love to get to the bottom of this with you

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% We are here to serve. And if you guys enjoy this content, please let us know. Let us know what you’d like. Let us know what you’ve experienced in regards to helping improve your nausea. Again, everything that we’re talking about is not just something theoretical, you see in PubMed, or you read on some blog posts. These are theoretical things that we’ve done with hundreds of patients out of out of the thousands that we’ve seen. So it’s all actionable, hope you guys apply it and at least take away one thing that you can work on here. And you guys have a phenomenal day and continue to maintain optimal health. Take care y’all.

Evan Brand: Take care, bye bye.


Audio Podcast:

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