The Leaky Gut and Hashimoto’s Connection
Most bacteria in foods that slips through is a big stressor that can wind up the immune system and start attacking the thyroid gland. If one wants to get to the root cause and get the immune system boosted, start where it is mostly found, at the gut.
Today’s talk focuses on the root causes of leaky gut and its connection to Hashimoto’s. Listen as Dr. Justin Marchegiani explains the underlying mechanisms, how most thyroid issues and the underlying root cause are autoimmune in nature, and how the gut can affect the immune system. Stay tuned for more!
Dr. Justin Marchegiani
In this episode, we cover:
01:49 T3-Deficient Thyroid Hormones
03:58 The Immune System
05:29 Steps to Help Address Autoimmune Attack
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey guys this is Dr. Justin Marchegiani here. Today’s video is gonna be on leaky gut and Hashimoto’s, autoimmune thyroid issues. We’re gonna dive in to the underlying mechanism, we’re gonna talk about how most thyroid issues and the underlying root cause are actually autoimmune in nature, and we’ll talk about how the gut can affect your immune system. So, let’s dive in. Before we do that, give me a thumbs up, hit the bell so you can get notifications of future videos and our awesome live Q&A videos too.
Alright, so, off the bat, we have Hashimoto’s which is an autoimmune condition that affects the thyroid gland. That’s essentially when we have antibodies that are attacking our thyroid tissue. We have TPO antibodies that may attack the inter-cellular enzymes in the thyroid gland, we may have thyroglobulin antibodies that are attacking outer surface proteins of the thyroid. And over time, that gland is gonna be stabbed and attacked by all these B cell infiltration, these are parts of the immune system that are coming in and attacking, and that thyroid can spill out, spew out thyroid hormone which can make us feel even hyper, uhm off the bat ’cause hormone comes out, it gushes out, but then over time, that hormone can be depleted because your thyroid follicle can only hold about maybe 3 months or so of thyroid hormones. So, over time that autoimmune attack can really deplete that thyroid, and of course the inflammation in this tissue can affect how thyroid hormones interact at the receptor site level. Every single cell your body has, a receptor site for thyroid hormone, so the more inflammation we have that can affect how s- a receptor sites and the hormone interact with all these inflammation and antibodies, and of course, as we attack that thyroid gland, we’re gonna lose functional tissue, functional aspects of the thyroid gland that are actually producing thyroid hormone. So, over time, we may need to actually be on a thyroid hormone replacement.
And again, a lot of people may not do well with the conventional thyroid hormone partly ’cause of the fact that it’s missing T3 a lot of times; it’s a synthetic T4. A lot of times there can be additives in there, gluten-like cross-reactive molecules or compounds that can exacerbate the immune system. And a lot of times these compounds, they just have T4 so you’re not really having the full T4, T3, and then even the other metabolically active components called T2, T1 and T0. So, when you give T4, there’s an assumption that it’s gonna go downstream to T3, and that may not happen. Again, check out my Thyroid Reset Summit at thyroidresetsummit.com. I interviewed 30 amazing experts and we go into a lot of these things. But, there’s an assumption that T4 goes to T3 and I test patients, I tested thousands over my career, where I would say about 80% don’t make that conversion optimally. So they do better with a natural thyroid glandular, some even may need T3. But, we need that T4 to T3 conversion, we need to add in that full spectrum of glandular that actually has the T3, and we may even wanna add in additional nutrients that are gonna help with that conversion and activation. Zinc, magnesium, selenium is really important, the major enzymes that’s cleaving the iodine molecules off the thyroxine that which is what thyroid hormone is. T4, thyroxine, 4 molecules of iodine, and we pull one of those molecules off that and becomes T3. That deiod- deiodination, pulling off that iodine is a selenium-based enzymes. So we need healthy levels of selenium to be able to make that conversion happen. Uhm, also, other nutrients are really important like I mentioned, zinc, magnesium. CoQ10 is really important for the autoimmune attack, uhm, so is magnesium, so is selenium, so is copper, so is vitamin A, really important. Glutathione is also really big and important too because glutathione comes from the liver, and when there’s liver stress, there tends to also be glutathione stress as well. So we have to address it from all angles. Liver, gut, right? And the gut is so important because that’s where most of the immune system is.
So, we come back to the title of the video which was “Leaky Gut and Hashimoto’s”. Well, most of your immune systems’ in the gut, in the GALT, the Gastric-Associated Lymphoid Tissue, the Mucosal Associated Lymphoid Tissue. And when that gut’s leaky, we’re gonna be activating and calling on our immune system to calm and be more active. And, essentially foods and bacteria that are slipping through, our immune system will be reacting to those and attacking those. And that can be a big stressor on our immune system, and they can wind up our immune system so it can start attacking the thyroid gland as well. So, we have to get to the root cause of the leaky gut which could be food-based, it could be in a combination of poor digestive compounds, poor digestive enzymes, HCL, bile salts, infections could be at play. We know, infections wind up the immune system, infections like H-Pylori, blasto, or lyme, borrelia burgdorferi, uh, yersinia enterocolitica, these infections can and make the gut more leaky, wind up the immune response and can exacerbate the autoimmune attack on the thyroid. So, get to the gut, get to the nutrients. Selenium’s really important ’cause it calms down the immune system and lessens the immune attack in the thyroid. There’s a lot of studies showing that selenium can help reduce thyroid antibodies, so can CoQ10 as well. So, things that are anti-inflammatory, curcumin, resveratrol, they can calm down some of the immune response and they can help lessen that autoimmune attack. You also have to get to the root cause of the gut underlying issues.
So, number 1, understand the ideology. Number 2, if you need thyroid hormone replacements, we may have to come in there but you need to see a good functional medicine doc that can look at it. Number 3, support the nutrients that thyroid needs to make the thyroid hormone, right? Thyroxine, be careful with iodine, that can exacerbate autoimmune attack, vitamin A, zinc, CoQ10, magnesium, right, really important. Little bit of copper, a good healthy paleo template, work on the liver, work on the adrenals which help with that thyroid conversion, get to the underlying cause of why that gut is leaky. 50 to 98% of thyroid issues are autoimmune in nature. So, you really wanna make sure you’re getting to the root- underlying cause of why it’s there.
So, head over to thyroidresetsummit.com. You wanna click in deeper with myself and my colleagues that work on these situations. Click below, schedule a consult with myself and we can dive in deeper. Hope this information was very helpful, hit the bell and subscribe, appreciate it, leave all comments below. I wanna know what you think, and I wanna engage in a deeper conversation with you on this topic.
Alright, thanks a lot, have an awesome day! Bye now.
Thyroid Testing and the Importance of TSH | Podcast #214
There are different symptoms of thyroid issues that need to be considered in thyroid testing. These are symptoms that are subclinical, the less talked about and the typical. A bit overrated? Find out more and learn from Dr. J’s interactive and live podcast!
Today’s podcast talks about thyroid tests and the importance of TSH. Learn about the symptoms of thyroid issues, the physical assessment of thyroid gland or palpation, addressing different TSH issues and all other factors that may affect thyroid functions. Stay tuned for more!
Dr. Justin Marchegiani
In this episode, we cover:
00:42 Thyroid-Stimulating Hormone
02:38 The Less Talked About Symptoms of Thyroid Issues
03:57 Physical Assessment of the Thyroid Gland
04:36 Poly Autoimmune Conditions
05:40 Indicators used by Endocrinologists to Assess Thyroid Hormones
07:42 Optimal Thyroxine Conversion
08:47 Addressing High TSH Volume
12:32 Other Factors that Affect Thyroid Functions
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani. Today, we are doing a live podcast. We’re gonna be talking about thyroid labs and TSH. Why is it important? Why is it- maybe a little bit overrated. We’re gonna go into this. And again, make sure you hit the thumbs up, give me a uhm- subscribe, hit the bell as well so you get notifications. I’m one of the only health professionals that sees patients and does lot of these live, interactive podcast, slash Q&A hybrids. I really wanna get lots of uh- interactive involvement, and I wanna get your feedback, I wanna get your thoughts and I wanna interact in the podcast live information so we can make it even better. Alright, so, let’s dig in.
So, when we’re sessing thyroid function, you know, one of the big obvious things that we’re gonna do is- is blood testing, to look at your thyroid. Now, even before that, you may have thyroid symptoms, you may have cold hands or cold feet, you may have hair loss, outer third of the eye eyebrow issue, you may have mood issues like brain fog, mood issues, depression, constipation, those are more of a subclinical, meaning, let’s say- a typical, like they aren’t typically- they are what comes to mind if you go see your medical doctor when it comes to thyroid. The typical ones are gonna be cold hands, cold feet, hair loss, for sure. The depression, the anxiety, the mood issues, uhm- the constipation, low or slow bowel motility are typically gonna be less talked about, just FYI.
So, we’re gonna- maybe do a palpation. They’re gonna look for thyroid swelling. They’re gonna look for thyroid inflammation. Why would that thyroid be swollen? It could be because TSH is elevated. TSH is the whipping thyroid hormone. Its the- it’s the person that sits on the horse-carriage that whips the horse to make the horse go faster. Think of the conductor whipping that- the harder, and the more he whips that, that’s like TSH going up, tryin’ and get that thyroid to make some thyroid hormone, typically T-4 – tetraiodothyronine. T-4, tetra means 4, ‘kay? And then iodothyronine, so that’s 4 molecules of iodine bound to typically uh- thyroxine molecule that makes your T-4, your active thyroid hormone. That gets converted and activated down the road with the 5-deiodinase enzyme that’s selenium-based, so we need selenium. And we need other nutrients like vitamin-A, copper, zinc, magnesium, uhm- ye- yeah, Vi- Vitamin-C, uh- typically some glutathione, maybe some superoxide dismutase, a lot of good compounds there that are really designed to help with that conversion. Also, cortisol imbalances, too high or too low, same with insulin, too high or too low can also thwart that thyroid conversion.
So your conventional docs’ gonna- number 1, kinda do an audit of your symptoms. Number 2, they’re gonna do some palpation to look at the swelling, could be high TSH, could be an elevation in thyroid antibodies, TPO, thyroid peroxidase , or thyroglobulin antibody. And that could be whipping the thyroid- not quite the same as the TSH but more like someone putting daggers or stabbing your thyroid, your antibodies actually attacking. So TSH is different ’cause that’s your pituitary talking to your thyroid but raising the volume, and that can cause swelling if the TSH goes too high, then we have the thyroid antibodies which are your immune system coming in for the attack. And that’s really trying to attack the thyroid, that’s a little bit different ’cause that can actually cause a lot of long-term damage as well, and a lot of that functional thyroid tissue that makes thyroid hormone can really be impacted and produce less hormone overall, and you may need to actually be on thyroid hormone for a longer period time, if not, your whole life, depending on how long an autoimmune attack’s been going on. For most people that I see, there’s been an autoimmune attack to some degree for at least a decade, typically, before I see them. So, tends to be happening at a very subclinical level for many years, before people even notice any symptoms. That’s kind of a scary thing about it that can be going on for such a long period of time.
Alright, so we talked about kind of the physical assessment, right? They may have you swallow some water, they may palpate just above and below the Adam’s apple while you swallow. So here’s your Adam’s apple, they’ll go and just- maybe just a centimeter or so outside. And they’re feeling, if there’s any nodules, right? Typically, you’ll just feel like a little bump, it’s a nodule, they’ll feel if it’s swollen, where- it’s just- it’s a little puffy, it’s sticking out more the normal. Of course, you need a- a baseline to know what normal feels like. But when it feels a little bit more puffy and kinda sticks out a little bit, once you feel a couple of normal, once you can get an- a sense of what that feels like, and looks like.
Now it’s a poly autoimmune, TPO thyroglobulin. It could also be potentially Grave’s, but that’s usually a- a minority percent of the cases, usually 1 or 2%, 90, 95%+ are gonna be hashimotos in origin. Now, hashimoto’s is an autoimmune attack that involves TPO and thyroglobulin, and it tends to fatigue the thyroid out overtime, but you can’t hyper off the bat, and then, the Grave’s tends to affect the receptor sites or the stimulating imm- immunoglobulin that causing the thyroid to make more thyroid hormone. Hashimotos can feel like Grave’s in the beginning, so it’s really tough to know the difference. Typically you’re gonna be looking at TSI and thyroid receptor site antibodies to differentiate the two. Again, hyperthyroid symptom with hashimoto’s isn’t that big of a deal. With Grave’s it could be a bigger deal because it can cause potential stroke, because you can really ratchet up those uh- thyroid numbers very-very high, much higher than you could with let’s just say hashimoto’s type of an attack, but, always good to get both of that asses.
Now, most people that are going to see their doctor, they- they’re kinda in this “no man’s land” where the first thing that’s really being looked at, to assess what’s going on is TSH. Now, I mentioned earlier, TSH is like the whipping hormone, right? That’s the con- that’s the person in the- in the carriage whipping the horse, right? So, they’re looking for that- that whipping to start going up a little bit above. Now, according to the American Clinical Association Endocrinologists, AACE for short. AACE, anything above two and a half, may be a problem. So, we start looking at things a little bit more closely, once the TSH goes above two and a half… me, about 3. Once it’s going above 3, I’m a little bit perked up and I’m paying very close attention. Now, conventional endocrinologists typically won’t care until it goes above 4 and a half, to 5 and half. I always tell patients, “The easy way to cure your hypothyroidism, if you’re diagnosed ‘conventionally’, is if you have a high TSH on the west coast”. Remember, the TSH on the west coast is a 4 and a half. You go to the east coast, its 5 and half. You have a 4.75 on the west coast, think of ship from L.A. to Boston and now you’re cured overnight. I wish it was that simple though, that, seriously, you’ll see in the lab-reference range that changes that easily. So, 4 and a half to 5 and a half I think is a little bit late when it comes to assessing thyroid hormones. Some don’t even care ’till it goes even 10 or even above. So, we like to use that TSH of an indication of 3- 3 or so. But we also wanna look downstream, you wanna look at T-4, 3 and T-4 total. We wanna look at how much hormone that the thyroid actually making. ‘Cause sometimes we see TSH high, right? And then we see T-4 is adequate. Meaning, okay, the thyroid is compensating by making enough thyroid hormone, but it’s having the whipped at horse a lot. Meaning, “Hey, that horse is going that normal speed, but having a whip it a little bit more than we should”, meaning, we’re eventually gonna fatigue that horse out, over time if we have to maintain that level of whipping. So that goes, okay, good- so the horse is able to do its thing, but, over time it’s not a good thing if we whip it that much.
And then we have some areas where we see T-4 starting to drop. And that’s a concern ’cause that tells me that, alright, we’re overstimulating, we’re over-whipping, and the thyroid is still not motivated enough even with that stimulation to make more thyroid hormone, that’s a concern. We also have to look at the conversion downstream ’cause some people, we see, okay, that T-4, that horse is going a good speed, but the conversion to T-3, the active thyroid hormone, doesn’t really fit into the horse analogy, but that active T-3, T-4 is relatively inactive, 300% more inactive than T-3. That T-3 has to convert, and has to- you go from typically like uhm- a T-4-free, and like, let’s say around 1 to 1.5, that has to convert downstream to T-3 and about 3 to 3.5 . And if it starts dropping below that where we have a good level of T-4 around 1 to 1.5, and that T-3 drops into the low 2’s, we got a problem, ’cause that’s a relatively active thyroid hormone being that T-3. So we have to make sure it’s converting optimally, that’s number 1.
Number 2, we have to also address the TSH. We hope- we won’t want the volume of that TSH to be so high. We wanna get that under control as well, and we also wanna make sure the T-4 is good and the thyroid conversions’ good. So, we’re looking at TSH, we’re looking at T-4, number 2, we’re looking at T-4 to T-3, number 3, and then number 4, we’re looking at thyroid antibodies, is that TSH being attacked, or is that TSH compensating because that thyroid that’s being attacked in the hormone is not quite optimum. And then number 5, the 5th variable is gonna be reversed T-3. Are we converting some of that T-4 to reverse T-3? So, we have TSH is the first domino, T-4 is the second domino, T-3 is the third… this is where the T-4 to T-3 co- conversion happens. Zinc, selenium, magnesium, healthy CoQ10, uhm, of course glutathione’s gonna be involved, superoxide dismutase, uh- co- uh- cortisol and insulin. This conversion happens here, we have the sub-conversion which is reversed T-3, and this is the blanks in the metabolic gun. So when we see T-4 going to reverse T-3, that reversed T-3 congest and blocks up that thyroid receptor site and prevents active T-3 from going in there. This is vitally important if we have thyroid issues.
So, most conventional medical docs are looking at TSH, that’s it. Maybe they look at T-4, but, they’re not really looking at it in depth, they’re not running T-4, 3 or total, they’re not looking at the conversion downstream and give very rarely have thyroid antibodies looked at because, well, thyroid autoimmunity doesn’t matter, we’re not gonna do anything from a conventional standpoint, we’re not gonna give immunosuppressant drugs, we’re not gonna give corticosteroids typically ’cause the side-effects are worse than the actual disease. So they’ve kinda made- let’s just say an analysis that we’re gonna save those from more serious autoimmune conditions like crohn’s or also the colitis, those kind of things, ’cause the medications aren’t warranted for the symptoms. But, the problem is, if we see autoimmunity which we know about 50 to 90% have an autoimmune mechanism involved, that means a lot to us functional medicine docs. Why? ‘Cause we’re gonna look at leaky gut, A.K.A. gastrointestinal permeability. We’re gonna look at infections, we’re gonna look at gluten sensitivity, we’re gonna look at certain nut- certain nutrient-deficiencies that are really important for autoimmunity such as low zinc, low selenium, low CoQ10, really important nutrients to run our thyroids. And also CoQ10 is gonna get blocked if we’re taking a statin. So of course if you’re taking any statin medications, you’re gonna have some problems with your thyroid as well, ’cause you’re not gonna make your own internal CoQ10.
So, kinda recapping, right? Conventional analysis, alright: analyze symptoms, palpation. Palpation’s only gonna be good if there’s an extreme autoimmune attack, and then of course, uhm- they’re gonna assess, maybe run TSH, T-4, if you have a better doctor whose assessing the autoimmune stuff, they may run a thyroid ultrasound. Okay, great. So now, we get in assessment of inflammation, typically, not too much will be done with that because the drugs typically are worse than the actual symptoms of the autoimmune thyroid. Next step is how does that hormone cascade look? TSH, T-4, 3, and total. T-3 for you and total, reversed T-3, thyroid antibodies only can even look at T-3 uptake as well. We wanna look at the whole kit and kaboodle. Now, if you wanna dive deeper I’d refer you to other podcast where we can look at adrenal halve ’cause cortisol plays a huge impact. We also know as a female, right? Estrogen-dominance, alright, A.K.A. higher estrogen, lower progesterone relatively speaking.
Progesterone has a big impact on thyroid function as well. And then we add in the elements of insulin-resistance, excess carbohydrate, insulin resistance or reactive hypoglycemia, can exacerbate autoimmunity, affect thyroid conversion as well, and obviously deplete a lot of nutrients just through having a run more glycolysis for our fuel. We tend to burn up a lot more B-Vitamins and magnesium and really important minerals. And then if we add in the extra vector of hypochlorhydria, those stomach acid from gut infections, then it makes it even more apparent, that we don’t have enough acidity to ionize our minerals, get ’em into the blood and be able to breakdown, absorb and digest our fatty acids, cholesterol and amino acids, so it’s quite the cascade. So, most people need to get the full thyroid workup, ge- go to your conventional doc, fine, get at least the big things ruled out. But then once your- once your to- hey, it’s all in your head, you really wanna go see, or they don’t give you much of an option, or maybe they just say, here’s some centroid, the other option with that is a lot of people, when we talk about that T-4 to T-3 conversion, my clinical experience is about 80% don’t make that conversion optimally because of all the other important nutrients that are involved in that conversion. So that’s why you gotta look at the full, complete picture. And most people, centroid won’t get the job done and may make your TSH look pretty, meaning get it back below- get it back to about a 1, but it may not help the rest of that hormone cascade because the conversion is not there, it’s just T-4, and many people don’t have all the other nutrients to make that conversion downstream.
Alright, so I’m live here, I’m gonna open it up to some questions in the topic of thyroid, thyroid health and anything that we can tangentially connect back to thyroid and thyroid lab testing. So, let’s go dig in to what the listeners have to say here, will be got y’all.
Neem writes in, “Low TSH, insulin, bile and cholesterol due to chronic infection, any recommendations?”, yeah. So if TSH is low, that means your hypothyroid, your- your- I mean your pituitary is going basically low, right? You- almost the hypopituitary issue, and if you’re not taking too much thyroid hormone, it’s probably just because of stress and cortisol and inflammation so you have to get the diet right, get the adrenals right, and get the gut right. So, 6 hours on the gut, remove the bad foods, replace the enzymes and acids, repair the gut lining and the hormones, all of it, thyroid, female hormones and adrenals, and then eventually deal with body system too and getting rid of the gut infections.
Hey Ahmet, hope you’re enjoying today’s show. Uhm, Soupper writes in, “Hashimoto’s, high cortisol, please the Vitamin-C”. So, yeah, Vitamin-C’s helpful, I have no problem with that, it’s gonna help with inflammation, no problem there.
Justin G writes in, “Hi Dr J. I am 64 Male, low to normal T-4 and T-3, 6.4 TSH. No swelling, no symptoms other than anxiety. No meds taken. Some evidence of autoimmune antibody. Doc says monitor without meds”. So if you’re having some thyroid symptoms, personally, with low normal T-4 and T-3, I’d wanna know is there any antibodies at all? You mentioned some evidence of autoimmune antibodies, so I wanna know what those levels look like, and I would definitely add in a little bit of bioidentical thyroid hormones to knock that TSH down. I didn’t go into this but I think it’s important. A lot of doctors get freaked out over TSH going too low. I had a patient just before I jumped on today’s uh- live podcast, whose doctor was concerned about TSH that was too low. And this is the problem when were you- actually using thyroid supports, sometimes that TSH can go too low because we’re supporting the thyroid, that the brain saying, “Hey, we can lower our volume because the thyroid’s getting extra support, so let’s lower the volume”. Now, when that TSH go so low, let’s say below .3, a lot of doctors get concerned of grave disease. Remember, we talked earlier, grave’s is uh- autoimmune attack where it affects TSI, thyroid stimulating immunoglobulins, or TSH receptor antibodies where it stimulates the thyroid to make more thyroid hormone. So when they see TSH low, they’re thinking that maybe a grave’s attack that’s hyper stimulating the thyroid. But, really, it’s just we’re giving a little bit of thyroid hormone and we’re- we’re focusing on the thyroid hormone being in the therapeutic range and not necessarily worried about the TSH being in the right range. The problem is, TSH, when we give exogenous thyroid support or hormones, the TSH tends to be more receptive to these exogenous hormone than the actual tissue is. So, what does that mean? My analogy, my famous analogy is, go outside and try to figure out on the hot- in the hot day, what the temperature is by touching the sidewalk. Well, the sidewalk conducts heat, more or better than the air temperature does. So, a hundred degree outside in Austin, is gonna be like a hundred and seventy degrees or- like a hundred and fifty degrees sidewalk. So, your pituitary is like the sidewalk in this analogy, it’s more sensitive and picks it up so, you tend to see a lower TSH when we give thyroid support. Now, problem is, if we base everything off a TSH, we tend to be under supporting the thyroid hormone levels. Meaning, if we’re shooting 50% to 25% of the reference range, right? So if we have a range of let’s say T-3, T-3 is like between 3 and 4 and a half. Let’s say we’re shooting for 3 and a half to 3.75, we may undershoot it if we’re trying to just hit the TSH. So, essentially, you wanna look at the thyroid hormone, you wanna look at the TSH too. Ideally if we can have the TSH not go below .3, maybe ideally have it settle around 1, that’s great. But sometimes, my patients that, their TSH is at 1, but they still have low thyroid symptoms, we go up another grain with their thyroid support and it’s like boom, the symptoms are gone. So, what should we do? Should we make the TSH in the lab look pretty? Or should we focus on the patient’s clinical outcome, their symptoms, and their actual thyroid hormone levels. Meaning, let’s say they’re in the top 25% of the range, that’s where their symptoms go away, but at the top 25% of the range for T-3, 3, that may cause your TSH to go a little bit low. But if we go let’s say, 50% of the range for T-3, their TSH looks perfect but some symptoms creep up. So you got to gotta weigh out all the options. A lot of doctors, even some natural ones, prioritize TSH over the patient’s symptoms and thyroid values. I weigh both of them up. Sometimes we can do both, sometimes we can’t. So we have to look at all of the issues. Are we addressing the adrenal issues, check. Are we addressing the thyroid issues, check. Are we addressing any female or male hormone issues, check. Are we fixing the gut, check, are we supporting the nutrients that help the thyroid get better? Are we supporting blood sugar and insulin resistance. If we have to look at the whole, entire picture, if you just look at the thyroid and your whole treatment plan off a TSH and these numbers and that’s it, maybe missing the forest for the trees, so to speak. So, we gotta have a complete perspective we have to take, the TSH and the T-4 and the T-3, all in context ’cause most people on the conventional side, they prioritize the TSH, partly because that is the main thing they are looking at to analyze grave’s, and I think because conventional medical doctors are conce- overly concerned about grave’s ’cause it can mean stroke or heart attack, so they are v- you know, are thyroid storm essentially, so they are hyper focused on the TSH where in- in functional medicine land, we look at the the full thyroid hormones typically, so if there is grave’s we’re gonna see it down the road with T-3 being excessively high, and our T-4 being excessively high, and then we’re rule it out by ordering additional thyroid stimulating immunoglobulin and TSH receptor antibodies as well. We won’t just ever take it for granted.
Okay, let me keep on rolling guys. I went into a pretty in depth on that one, but hopefully it was helpful. Uh, “T-4 to T-3 conversion issues?”, yeah, that’s gonna be nutrients. Uhm, the 5-deiodinase enzyme is gonna be an important enzyme, it’s selenium-based. It comes from the liver. So liver stress, liver issues, toxic livers, low selenium, low glutathione, uhm- magnesium, zinc, important digestive nutrients and minerals, Vitamin-A, cortisol higher or low, insulin too high or too low. And this is probably why lower carb can sometimes cause low thyroid symptoms, we had a little bit of starching, boom, low thyroid goes away, or the other way around. We see high blood sugar, we get the blood sugar under control, we go on a keto-paleo template, and then boom, magically, insulin gets better and thyroid gets better too. So we gotta look at everything is connected, alright?
Uhm- pa-pa-pa, Ahmet writes in,”Hypoglycemia, autoimmune relation…”, yeah, so when you have reactive hypoglycemic, blood sugar swings, this is when you make- consume too much carbohydrate, alright? Not enough proteins or fat, or you’re just going too long between meals and then you’re eating a bunch of carbs, blood sugar goes up, and then your body over secretes insulin and it crashes. And the crash is the reactive part, meaning, you’re going, you’re reacting into low blood sugar because the pancreas made extra insulin. And that drop creates lots of cortisol, lots of uhm- adrenaline to bring that blood sugar back up. So, what you’re seeing is lots of cortisol and blood sugar, cortisol and adrenaline surges to bring back up that blood sugar if you will.
“Would very high TSH and normal T-3 and T-4 in postmenopausal women mean adrenal issue due to estrogen dominance?”, “Would very high TSH and normal T-3 and T-4…”, potentially, I mean, it’s one thing that would be on our checklist that we’d wanna cross often. Make sure it’s not a vector. So, yeah, it’s potential but it could be autoimmune, it could be other things with the adrenals too.
Uh, “Best grave’s treatments?”. So, I mean, we treat grave’s the same way as we treat hashimoto’s in general. Of course, if thyroid hormone’s really high, we may recommend PTU or methimazole which is a- the conventional drugs that actually block iodine uptake, or we may use more natural things like carnitine, or lithium lithium orotate, uhm, or blue flag, various herbal compounds. Again, it just depends on how severe, how bad the symptoms are, and we wanna look at the numbers. Make sure they’re not too high. Typically, refer out to an MD just to get stabilized while we work on all the other underlying things, gluten as well is a big one. But you wanna have a good conventional MD as well as a functional MD. The problem is, a lot of conventional MD’s can over-freak out, and sometimes I had some patients get recommended to get their thyroid removed right away, which is a terrible move, right? You kinda- you gotta understand what’s going on here and try to give the body a chance to get back in the balance as long as the levels, let’s just say aren’t excessive, and we’re having cardiovascular issues, worst case, we use a medication to stabilize while we go deeper.
Uhm, Sherry write in, “Do I still have grave’s disease if my thyroid has been completely removed; it’s been 2 yrs and my levels are all over the place”. So, number 1, you never actually get your thyroid all the way removed. Getting your thyroid removed is like ripping up gum on your shoe. And it’s probably always gonna be some, and some of it can grow back, not all the way but you may have some grow back. And then number 2, the underlying autoimmune stress is still there. So you have to get the autoimmune mechanism whether it’s leaky gut, or other nutrient issues or gut permeability or infections or foods, you have to slow, get the underlying mechanism removed, right? Why there’s grave’s or hashimoto’s, or an autoimmune thyroid, a- happen. Well, what happens, ’cause the conditions are just right. If I remove my thyroid, does that change the conditions being just right? No, it doesn’t.
Lisa writes in, “What are appropriate levels for reverse T-3?”. Ideally between 10 and 20. 12 and 20-ish.
Yoli writes in, “Dr. J., my lymph node on my neck is swollen and it’s uncomfortable and painful what can i do if anything, uhm, to help… and can I continue doing my sinus rinse?”. Yeah, continue doing your sinus rinse. Obviously there’s swollen lymph nodes in this area, so there’s obviously bacteria or your lymph system and your macrophage are trying to gobble up stress in the throat area. So, adding ginger, add natural things are gonna help with flushing out the lymph. You could do lymphatic massage right here by the back angular of your jaw, and you can just do kind of clo- kinda clockwise turning and massaging, like this, and then you can just drain one side right into the- thoracic cavity, and just drain it all down, that’s helpful. You could also add in some burdock tea which is great for the lymph, and or ginger tea, and you can even throw in some red roots or red clover is great for the lymph. But something is going on with your immune system it’s attacking stuff, and it could just be bacteria and junk that’s making you sick so continue with the sinus rinse because any mucus here can go down the Eustachian tube and then- and then go to your ear and create an ear rakes, so you wanna keep your sinuses flushed out with Xlear and Neomed, that’s fine. And also make sure you’re doing the ginger and/or some immune support or you can even do some Reishi mushroom to make sure you are fully supported.
Emmah writes in,”Graves’, pins and needles on my feet. and extreme discomfort. Hair loss and eyebrows. On neurontin, not as effective anymore”. So, yeah, you gotta go see a conventional MD. More than likely Emmah, all the issues that we talked about in today’s podcast are happening to you, and you need to get a full workout to see which one’s are the top priorities.
Roshan writes in,”Outside of hashimoto’s, what are the hardest to cure thyroid issues? Are most thyroid issues completely curable?”. Uhm, it just depends. The more severe the autoimmune attack is, obviously the harder, especially if- it’s because of infections and leaky gut, and there’s lot of other autoimmune conditions like let’s say you have, uhm hashimoto’s but you also have rheumatoid arthritis, or crohn’s, right? It’s something called PGAS, polyglandular autoimmune syndrome. If you have one autoimmune condition, there’s a- a 76% chance that you have a second autoimmune condition. And if you’re a female, it’s even higher. Uhm, females have issues because of the fact that they have more estrogen than guys, right? Part of the reason why they’re fertile and the women, in general, that higher amounts of estrogen can throw off the CDH, CD4 cell balance and make them more prone to autoimmunity. So, that estrogen can really have an effect in the- and the more the estrogen dominance goes into effect, the higher risk of autoimmunity, ’cause that CDH, CD4 ratio. CDH being the natural killer cells, the T- uh- the CD4 being the natural- or the helper cells. When that balance goes out of whack, increased autoimmunity, that’s why estrogen dominance is such a big deal and needs to be addressed. And again, that also includes environmental estrogens, right? Pesticides, round-up, uh herb- herbicides, rodenticides, uh- fluoride in the water and junk in the water, birth control pills in the water, hormones in the meat, all of that stuff, hormones in the milk, all of it.
Rhonda writes in, “Is it bad to have any TPO antibodies? My levels are 9”. No, that’s okay. It’s natural to have some antibodies because there’s a natural recycling process that happens, we just don’t want it to be excessive. So, like LabCorp uses a range of I think 34 or higher as positive. I think Quest uses 9, so I typically say keep it below 15-ish, and that’s pretty good.
Roshan writes in, ” How do fungal or bacterial infections drive hypothyroid?”. Well, I mean, bacterial and fungal issues can increase leaky gut, of course, bacteria contains lipopolysaccharides, fungus consain- contains acid aldehyde and mycotoxins that are put stress in the liver, uh, more leaky gut, and of course they can eat and uhm, that cause malabsorption of nutrients as well.
Paul writes in, “Could Hashimoto’s cause Crohn’s? Or other way around?”. Well, no, basically, hashimoto’s and crohn’s are the effect. None of that’s the cause, right? These are the effect, crohn’s, hashimoto’s, rheumatoid arthritis. The underlying cause can be a combination of genetic predisposition, which is then triggered by gluten sensitivity, by cortisol fluctuations, by insulin resistance, by inflammation in your diet, by high amount of Omega-6 to Omega-3, nutritional deficiencies, gut infections, poor sleep, right? So, of course, genetic predisposition, is what loads the gun, what pulls the trigger is gonna be the stressors that I just mentioned and then the effects are hashimoto’s, crohn’s, RA. Now, the difference is, you may just have that gun ready to go and that hammer already backed, right? So, you’re more predisposed. Or others, let’s say that can actually put the bullet in, cock the hammer back and pull the trigger, meaning, a lot more things going on for a lot longer for that effect to happen. But either way, we have control if we pull the trigger or not, whether your guns are already loaded, we still have control over- over you pulling the trigger.
Yoli you are totally welcome there. Uh, Paul writes in, “How does low thyroid give cold hands and cold feet?”. Well, because thyroid hormone controls metabolism, and that’s basically the sum of all chemical reactions in the body. So, of course, uh- the more chemical reactions you have which is controlled by your thyroid hormone, which increases metabolism, the byproduct of your meta- having a healthy metabolism is heat. It’s kinda like, you know, do you get enough heat to keep you warm from a small fire or a large fire? Well, a large fire, why? Because there’s more reaction with the oxygen and the fire and the wood, right? And that gives off heat as the byproduct, of course. So, of course, you need more fuel, you need more metabolic reaction happening, more metabolic reaction with the air, and the combustion of the- of the wood gives you more heat. It’s the same thing with what’s happening in your body. And then of course we need thyroid hormone to be able to break down cholesterol and breakdown our hormone metabolites and hormone building blocks so we can make more female, or male, or adrenal hormones too. So, when you have low thyroid it can affect a lot of your other hormonal systems as well.
Rhonda writes in, “Are all thyroid hormone tests reliable (ZRT, Everlywell)?”. Well, great question. I mean, when it comes to some of the ones like ZRT or- they have some good spot tests. I- I’ve use ZRT, I use their spot test only if someone does not have a conventional lab to get an actual draw on. My concern is, I used to run some of the Theranos test like couple of years ago before they went out of- out of business, uhm and I found, I would compare ’em to like LabCorp, Quest and they were very inaccurate. So, the spot technology, meaning like it’s a little finger spot, hmmm- it- it’s getting better but it may still be off a little bit so I only use ZRT or the spot ones if someone does not have a lab test within 3 hours. If not, we run a- a Quest or LabCorp, which is pretty standardized. You need more blood to run those so it’s hard to do it with the spot. Meaning, just a little finger print one like you went on a blood sugar meter. Uhm, but the technology is getting better but if I can run a Quest or LabCorp and actual, you know, vial or 2 is run, and that is always better.
Let me jump on to Facebook here and give here and give you some Facebook love. Sorry you guys, I did not given you the attention here. Alright, Annie writes in, “So, a whole bunch of…”, let’s see here, “…I was 17 years old. Ever since recent illness resulting in gall bladder removal, my body has been out of whack – gut issues, anxiety, never had that before”. Yeah, I mean, here’s the deal. If you don’t have a gallbladder, it probably means you have hypochlorhydria, it definitely means you don’t have enough bile salts to break down fat. You’re gonna have a hard time probably breaking down protein and fat because of the- the low stomach acid and the low bile. And that puts you in the position to have a lot of nutrient i- issues, so you really have to work with a good functional medicine doc to get the diet better, to get the digestion better, and to get your hormones better. Lot of issues going on there.
And Lara writes in, yeah, gluten is huge, I totally agree, it’s a big issue. It’s a one of the major drivers of leaky gut. So here… “Without giving synthroid can we cure better hypothyroid situations?”. Well, I mean, yeah, if there’s an autoimmune attack, as long as we’re getting the autoimmune attack under control, synthroid will help bring that TSH down which helps prevent whipping of that thyroid, right? Remember, TSH, the whipping of TSH is not the same as an autoimmune thyroid attack. Not the same but still, it’s still stimulating the thyroid. So, by giving a little bit hormone that does bring that TSH which is good. Lots people were concerned about, you know, excessive bone loss, or thyroid nodules with TSH going too low. Uhm, but again, err- from my s- situation here, as long as it’s not excessively too low from grave’s, you’re more than likely okay. Just make sure your doctor’s monitoring your thyroid levels.
Megan writes in, “Can excessive sweating in warm weather be your thyroid?”. Hard to say, I mean, it’s pretty normal to sweat in the warm weather. Uhm, I would just run a basal body temperature test and- and make sure you’re utilizing your, you know, regular indoor room temperature. That way you’re not using any extreme high, low, to assess your metabolism. So, we wanna be between 97-8 and 98-2 for an axillary temp, armpit, and 98 to- to 98-6 for your oral temp. Do it first thing in the morning before you move around and eat.
Paul writes in, ” When is last time your hashimoto’s gave you issues Dr. J?”. I- I’ve been able to keep it under control. I mean, my levels, my TSH stays below beneath 2, my T-3 stays above 3, my T-4 stays between 1 to 1.5, my antibodies stay right in the border, been able to keep in control.
Donna writes in, “Is intermittent fasting ok with hashimoto’s?”. Only if it’s in control. Only if it’s stabilized and in control. If it’s not, do not do it. Make sure you’re having your hormones stable first.
“What nutrient support the pancreas?”. Well, I mean, of course, for you to give enzymes- for you to give more enzymes to prevent the pancreas to have to make extra enzymes, we’d give a stomach acid to help. Those are gonna be the big things is, you know, the exocrine function of the pancreas which are gonna be enzymes and lipase, enzymes, pancreatic, proteolytic, or cer- essentially these are- they’re pancreatic enzymes and they have proteolytic function, meaning, protein, and then lipolytic functions, meaning, fat digestion. So we’d to give a lot of those things to take stress off the adre- uhm, the pancreas, and we give more acidity as well to the stomach which is an important trigger of pancreatic enzyme sec- secretion.
Ahmet writes in, “Hypothyroid situations. Some doctor recommends low fat, low calorie diet. Is it true?”. I mean, would some doctors recommend it? Yeah, it’s terrible. Go into PubMed, type in “hypocaloric diet”, and “hypothyroidism”, low calorie causes low thyroid. It make sense because if the sum of all your chemical reactions, essentially your metabolism, right, is controlled by your thyroid and you stop giving fuel into your thyroid, or meaning, you sta- you start giving low calorie I- A.K.A., low nutrition, low fuel, you are not gonna have enough nutrients to run your thyroid, and that’s gonna cause low thyroid hormone functioning. The same thing, if I put less gasoline in the tank of your car, eventually you run empty. It’s the exact same thing.
Rhonda writes in, ” If my basal temperature is in the lower 97 degrees, is that thyroid problem?”. May- maybe not, it really depends on your symptoms, and it depends on what your thyroid test says as well. I don’t ever go all one- all in on the- the basal temp, because that can be other issues, and sometimes that can just be a broken thermometer too, so we wanna look at your symptoms, and we want to look at your hormone levels.
Alright, jumpin’ over to Facebook, “Hypothyroidism and diabe…” uhm- “Hypothyroid and diabetic, have beginning of gastroparesis and concerned of the meds prescribed… Armour, might not be metabolized if it sits in my stomach too long”. So, yeah, so- if we have digestive issues Kathi, I definitely recommend absorbing your thyroid hormone in your mouth sublingually to bypass a lot of that, then swallow after 1 to 2 minutes. But you wanna work with the good functional medicine doc as well.
Uhm, Rejjiie writes in, “Been suffering from autoimmune thyroid condition for the past few years. My throat was enlarged, but after taking some herbs mixed with garlic, pau de arco, oregano leaf, zinc and Vitamin-C, it has gone back down”. Yeah, a lot of those herbs are also anti-microbial, so I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s some gut issues, bacteria, yeast or fungal that could be part of what’s stressing out the body, it’s very possible.
Alright guys, I think we answered a lot good questions here. Just make sure you guys sign up for the thyroid reset summit. We’re gonna go into all these things. I have 30 experts that I’ve heard, interviewed, amazing interviews where we go into depth in all these different topics. So, totally free to sign up, thyroidresetsummit.com, you’ll be able to see my own personal interview, Evan’s interview, and a bunch of other amazing expert’s interview. You guys are gonna love it, and it helps support the channel, and it helps support more content coming to you. So, appreciate you guys signing up, and I will be back tomorrow for a live Q&A. I’m trying to get better at giving you guys heads up, so sometimes I’m like, “Oh, a patient”, like, you know, is “mister console”, I jump in, or at the end of the day, and I put my sun down for bed, I have a half hour free, let me jump on. So, I’m gonna try to get better like giving you guys, what, maybe 24-hour heads up. Let me know how much time you want, put your questions down below, I’ll answer it later. And uhm, let me know future topics, future live podcast topics you guys would love to hear about. I love being on the fly and dynamic so we can make the show interactive ang get your questions answered. So, I appreciate it, you guys have a phenomenal day, and I will be back tomorrow. Take care, bye.