Mitochondrial Dysfunction & Other Causes of Chronic Fatigue- Mold & Candida Contribute | Podcast #287

Welcome to another episode of Beyond Wellness Podcast! For this episode, Dr. J and Evan Brand talk about chronic fatigue, which is a disorder characterized by extreme tiredness that doesn’t go away with rest. Because sometimes, chronic fatigue can also be associated with mold issues, Candida and etc. Check this podcast out. Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

1:06     Mitochondria

8:26    Toxins that damage Mitochondria

14:40   Mold Issues

22:22   How Mold and Candida affect Mitochondria

31:05   Nutrients and Vitamins

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are live. It’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan brand. Today we’re going to be chatting about chronic fatigue, mold issues and other different causes that could drive chronic fatigue. Evan, how are we doing today? 

Evan Brand: I’m doing really well. We’ve got just a couple of papers on this. And we don’t really more than that, because we have so much experience now ever since I had my issues. And you and I started digging into this. It’s like you and I jumped into the mold whirlwind over the past few years together. And it’s been really fun learning and educating people simultaneously. We’ve implemented stuff in our houses that have been game changers for us. We’ve implemented stuff clinically, that have been game changers for others, but I believe this is one of the biggest triggers of chronic fatigue is mycotoxins and I experienced it personally and so I can tell you my own issue, I was exhausted and I’m still recovering from that and your exercise intolerance goes down and a lot of that has to do with the mitochondrial damage to happen. So could you just give us maybe like mitochondria 101 What like, how do they help people? Why are they so important? What happens when they get damaged and all that? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so your mitochondria, they exist inside of yourself, okay? And it’s going to generate ATP. And part of you know, so you have glycolysis, right? That’s going to be outside the cell where you’re kind of taking glucose generating energy. And then you have the Krebs cycle where you’re spitting out different amounts of hydrogen and ATP. And those hydrogens then now go into so you have these things called reducing agents, called FADHNAD and they gather up hydrogens, okay? And then these hydrogens, right, they enter the electron transport chain, they generate more ATP. So you have glycolysis to the Krebs cycle, right, or citric acid cycle, same thing. And then we have from there into the electron transport chain. And this is where we start to enter the mitochondria. And we need things like carnitine to help shuttle fat into the mitochondria. We need B1 B2 to help with fatty acid oxidation in the mitochondria, it’s part of how the mitochondria burns fuel to run the Krebs cycle and to get the electron transport chain set up we need B vitamins, we need magnesium we need carnitine like I already mentioned before, we need creatine we can use things like ribose we can use things like co q 10. These are all really really important nutrients that fuel these different metabolic pathways obviously, intermediary nutrients like Fumarate and malate and succinate. And then different amino acids are involved with the electron transport chain and or the citric acid cycle, Krebs cycle the leading up to it. So all of these pathways, they roll and they really help generate energy and generate ATP, which is that energetic fuel source. 

Evan Brand: And there’s a really good picture of the citric acid cycle some of the stuff that that you and I’ve learned from some of our books and study so we may be able to put that up in the shownotes to where people just want to download it look at it, I think it’s kind of cool because you could look at it and you could just quickly learn all the different nutrients that fuel each part of the cycle. So then I don’t want to say you could spot treat but for lack of a better word, you could kind of spot treat and go, Oh, magnesium, boom, I might be missing that be six. Oh, I might be missing that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% Yep. 100%. I’m gonna try to pull up a good picture for everyone to see here. So they can kind of wrap their head around it. A picture’s worth 1000 words. So if you guys can kind of understand the concept. I think that makes it a lot easier. I’ll pull that up here in a minute. Okay. All right, cool. Anything else you wanted to highlight on that before we dive in a little bit more? 

Evan Brand: Well, you mentioned a bunch of different nutrients. And so I think the most important part to pay attention to is that today we’re focusing kind of zoomed in. But you mentioned a lot of stuff that people could be deficient in for other reasons that we might not cover today. So parasite infections, bacterial overgrowth, any kind of dysbiosis. That’s not allowing the gut bacteria to produce some of these nutrients that may be involved. But that’s not the highlight of the show today. Today we’re focusing on other triggers and other causes. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 110%. Exactly. Very good. So of course, the first thing is we have things that enter the mitochondria. And that major nutrient, that major compound that’s going to enter that mitochondria is going to be acetyl co a, and acetyl. co a is made from fats, carbs and proteins. So the first thing I always tell people is we have to make sure we can digest and break down our fats, carbs and proteins. And we have to make sure we have good proteins, good fats, primarily carbohydrates. You know, of course, if you’re more active, you know, you can always do more safe starches and make sure you’re not doing too many grains and an inflammatory refined sugar. But we need good fats, we need good proteins because that performs and creates a really good building block for that acetyl. co a, and we need that for really, really, really good mitochondrial production. 

Evan Brand: Yep. Let’s dive into this study. This is really cool. One of my favorites, this guy, Dr. Brewer-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: If you don’t mind, I want to just hit one more thing. Just I want to set the table a little bit more for the listeners. Okay, let me just do this here real quick. All right. This is a really, really good picture. Can you see that on my screen yet?

Evan Brand: Yep, there it is. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, good. This gives you a pretty good idea. So the mitochondria is kind of the powerhouse of the cell. All right. And so when you look at energy, we first have the cytosol that’s outside of the cell. This is glucose. Glucose comes in glycolysis means breaking down glucose. glyco means glucose. And then license means breaking down. So we generate a little bit of energy here, ATP from glycolysis. Okay, then that then that little bit of energy then moves into the mitochondria. So this is the mitochondria here right now. So we have acetylcholine, acetylcholine then starts going into the Krebs cycle, that Krebs cycles in a turn twice and it’s typically forget exactly, I think it’s two to three NADH or going to be spit out for one fa, d h2. And this is going to turn around twice. And then these different electrons, these hydrogens that are collected from the Krebs cycle, the NADH and the FA, d h 22 to 3, NADH, one fA d h two going to enter the electron transport chain, and then more ATP is then created. So I want to say it’s like 36 to 39 ATP are created from glucose to Krebs cycle to electron transport chain, and I want to say it’s two or three for glucose. Like Allah says two or three for the Krebs cycle, maybe six for the Krebs cycle. And the electron transport chain is the majority where it happens. I want to say 33 or so I want to say it’s about 36 to 39 total ATP, per this whole thing and this is a mitochondria right here. So all most of this stuff happens in the mitochondria and then some of it happens outside in the cytosol. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s what I was going to ask you. So if someone has major mitochondrial issues according to this picture, it looks like you would still be able to generate some, but it’s going to be a minimal amount of ATP created from glycolysis. Is that true? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct and then glycolysis is going to be dirty fuel right? So you’re going to get a lot more oxidative stress because of the advanced glycation end products that occur when you start making a lot of sugar right? A lot of sugar you coat your proteins right this increases oxidation oxidation and and then require more electrons to stabilize because when you when you oxidize something, right, think of cutting open an avocado, and it browns right or think about cutting open an apple and it browns, you’re losing electrons. That’s what’s happening there. Now you can easily go take a nice lemon or lime and squeeze the vitamin C from that on there, and that will prevent it from oxidizing. So the difference in your body is going to require a lot more antioxidant reserves. If you start creating a lot of oxidative stress, so glucose always burns dirty, okay, and there’s a really good book by Kristofferson called ‘Tripping Over the Truth’. And it’s a book all about mitochondria in glucose and cancer. So there’s a lot of data on this stuff already. So it’s really important to know that’s why we want to be more fat burners, good proteins and you can get carbs, you know, according to your metabolic needs. If you’re more active and, and you’re healthy, healthier and more fit and more lean and more active, then you can definitely add in some good high quality safe starches, but you really want to dial that in according to your metabolic needs. It’s not a set kind of size for everyone. 

Evan Brand: Very cool. Thanks for the picture. That’s awesome to see. So where do the toxins come into the picture? Well, the toxins are going to damage the mitochondria. So as you showed here, you can make some energy outside of the mitochondria. So you can still quote get by, but you may be exhausted if that Krebs cycle isn’t working properly due to potentially some of those nutrient deficiencies you covered that could be fueling the Krebs cycle. Maybe you’ve got infections or malabsorption issues going on. But we know that mold toxin damages the mitochondria law as well and actually sent you another paper in the notes if you wanted to look at it. It’s called mycotoxin its impact on gut health and microbiota. And this is pretty cool, because the end of this paper discusses that if you have good intestinal flora, they say here, it’s now well established that a healthy gut microbiota is largely responsible for the overall health of the host findings revealed that gut microbiota is capable of eliminating mycotoxin from the host naturally, provided that the host is healthy with a balance of good gut bugs. So long story short, and there’s a cool picture on that paper to just I don’t know if you can pull it up, but it’s called frontiers, cellular infection, microbiology, it’s a really cool picture of the gut and it just shows on the right that you’ve got all these different infections, like helicobacter, you’ve got E. coli, you’ve got reduction of beneficial bacteria, and therefore, the mycotoxins are not going to get treated as they should. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, I see that right here. Yep. So on that you see a whole lot bunch of decrease in good beneficial bacteria. I can share it right real quick here with y’all. You can see a decrease in a lot of your beneficial floor right here, man, you don’t see an increase in a lot of the pathogenic floor right here. And then of course, you have lipid polysaccharides. These are going to be your endotoxin that are the outer coating of the bad Gram negative bacteria. And then of course, you have more than mycotoxins. And of course, that’s going to stress out the microbiome stress out the immune system is going to increase gut permeability. The more gut more your gut is permeable, aka leaky gut, the more immune stress you’re going to have, because now your immune system is interacting with compounds and toxins that normally wouldn’t Is that correct? 

Evan Brand: Yep, that makes perfect sense. And this makes sense of why probiotics can be beneficial right out of the gate. A lot of people discuss and you and I discussed binders and Bluetooth ion and fixing the environment and all of that, but I mean, this shows here that bumping up your good bacteria is going to be a critical component to so I personally implemented a 50 to 100 billion have some multi stream probiotics and I have felt better. Is that the magic here? No, I’m doing a lot of things, but it has been pretty beneficial.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% Yep, pull up that pull up that Brewer paper. Now I think that’s going to be the next thing we should talk about. So let’s go over that. 

Evan Brand: This is crazy. This is crazy. So if you scroll down, long story short, in clinic, Brewer and some of his associates in this in this paper, they were testing using urine testing, which is what Justin and I run in clinic as well. We do a urine mycotoxin screen. And right here on the first page. It’s crazy says right here that urine specimens showed that 93% of his chronic fatigue patients these are known chronic fatigue sufferers. 93% of those were positive for at least one mycotoxin

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. So if you look here, right, here’s 112 patients 93% had at least one mycotoxin, again you have different mycotoxins, you have the aflatoxin- This is common like peanut stuff okra toxin and then you have the tri coat the scenes which is common in the in the black mold the Stacie buttress black mold, okay, so these different toxins we can actually test and now it’s important. Some people may test these things and they don’t do a really good glute. If I don’t push people that have really poor to toxification they may not push these things out. So you really want to make sure a couple of days ahead of time you do a good Bluetooth ion push and and even that you may just want to even look at the home too and do a really good play test on your home. Again, we use immunologic labs, we’ll put some links down below if you guys want to procure those tests, but some people they may have a hard time pushing it out. So yeah, so number one is I always recommend do a glutathione push. If you feel achy or really bad or brain foggy or tired or fatigued that could be a good time. Also, if you have a lot of mold in the home, especially molds that have these mycotoxins The nice thing about the amino Linux. It’ll tell you if these mycotoxins are produced by the species of mold they find so they see Aspergillus, or different mold that can be produced during water damage, then usually there’s an oak, there’s usually going to be a mycotoxin attached to it. There are some molds that are natural, like in soil and just plant degradation outside. Those are different some more from pet dander and those kind of things. So you’re able to get a window into all those things, as well. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and I just want to say one comment about the push. When I first did my original mycotoxin urine screen, I did do Bluetooth ion for maybe three days and I guess that wasn’t enough because my Michael phenolic acid, which is a mycotoxin that comes from Penicillium, which I was exposed to my level was a 12, which was in the red range, but it was just barely. And then when I retested six months later after trying really hard and doing sauna therapy, which is another way you could actually do provocation. If someone doesn’t have glue defi on, you could do a sauna session, then collect urine, that could also help but six months later, my levels went from a 12 to a 1700 my levels were off the chart, even though I’d been trying for six months to get it out, and I did feel better. Some may look at that. And I’ve had some clients, you know, call me and they’re like, I’m crying. I’m freaking out, my levels went up what’s going on, and we explain most of the time, that doesn’t mean new exposures happen. That just means you’re getting better at detoxification, and you’re pushing more out. And that’s what happened to me. So my levels were really, really low. Six months later, they were really, really high. And then another six, eight months later, they were low again, indicating that I did actually detox it and push it out.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Now part of the reason why we were able to stick with it is because we knew that you had high levels of mold in your old home, correct? 

Evan Brand: Well, so it was a crawlspace exposure. Looking back at the plates. The house was minimally bad honestly, what I think happened based on talking to Scott force grant, he his theory on it is that my tick bites that I got sort of set the mold in motion because I had the most exposure when I was a kid hanging out in my grandmother’s house. Were her babies basement flooded many times. And I remember going down there and smelling musty basement. So I guarantee you, I’ve had mold toxin, you know, just because I’m genetically unable to detox it like a lot of people are, I probably had it since I was a very, very young child. But his theory was that the tick bites basically weaken the immune system enough to allow the mycotoxins to really take me down. Whereas before, I may have had some symptoms, but it wasn’t as it wasn’t as brutal. So it was the combination of tick bites, and then some more recent mold exposure, that kind of retriggered things. Yeah, and I think it was just the straw that broke the camel’s back. I think it was a combination because I didn’t really get exposed to that much upon looking back at my plates and comparing those to some of my clients. I’m like, you know what, this wasn’t that bad. I mean, we had a though, I remember them being more high. So everything in the house was in single digits. It was just the crawlspace that was in double digits. And then once we did the fog treatment, everything was back to normal but what really screwed me is when we modified the the hva system. And we were trying to circulate the air in the crawlspace. Better. So the ductwork was changed to make a complete loop system from the crawlspace, sucking that air pumping that air into the house, and then the house pumping back in. So it was a continuous loop. And that’s what really screwed me because that setup wasn’t there before. And that’s what really cranked the levels up. And that’s where, even after we did an initial treatment, the levels went way up. Because now we were bringing in bad air into the breathable air. And so once we reverse that correctly, so if I remember correctly, is you had this crawlspace right, there was mold in the crawlspace. That was really high. The rest of the house was okay, but there was a lot of whole mold in the crawlspace they fixed the ventilation part of the home before they treated the crawlspace. Is that correct? Yeah. So we Yeah, we treated the home silly. I mean, absolutely. I can’t believe that happened. I’m just like, How the heck did these guys screw that up? I know, I know. So So then we treated it again though. And then the reverse the duck system that we had put in we reversed all of that. And then treated it again. And then it was fine. So technically, I could have stayed because the plates were incredible after that, but I needed a bigger house. Anyway, we had another kid come in. So it was a good excuse for me to just say, hey, let’s just go ahead and leave. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right but that was a big trigger for you. And then I think even in the new home that was still a little bit more mold that came back on that home to right near the retreat that address. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, we treated this house as well. We had some high colonies near the kitchen, which is potentially from the kitchen empties out into a screen room. So if those screen doors were always open, bringing bringing in outside air outdoor molds over time can accumulate in the house and make mycotoxins so yeah, we’ve we’ve treated it and now we just do some of the maintenance solution and we do some of the candles and such and now we’ve got it under control. So and then-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Also in general, you have the dehumidifier put in so then the humidity is now a lot less in the home. So that helps so there’s less breeding ground for it. And then you also just have air filtration throughout the home. So even if things were to come in your filters would naturally grab it anyway. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, I would assume my house is probably one of the few in Kentucky that doesn’t have mold in it because even with our whole house dehumidifiers, I mean, it’s pouring rain as we speak right now the ground rarely dries out because we have so much rain here lately. And even with the whole house dehumidifiers running, we’re barely keeping the house at 50% 45 to 50% humidity if you didn’t have those Running Man, who knows outside right now is like 86% humidity. And you and I’ve discussed this many times on the podcast, but you know, if you have humidity levels above 50% continuously in your home, you don’t have to have a water event. You don’t have to have a dishwasher overflow or a toilet leaking. Just the high moisture from the humidity alone can create mold, and that’s what happens in many homes that you and I’ve tested. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it really happens in areas where the temperature is just a little bit low. So you don’t have the AC because the AC will act with a natural dehumidifier but it’s temperature driven where humidifier is humidity percent driven. So I had a little bit of so if you have a you know 65 or 70, and it’s not quite triggering the AC, that’s where you really get screwed, but it’s not cold enough, not hot enough to trigger an AC but it’s also very humid 6065 70 or it’s just a basement area where basements are really cool but humid, that’s where you really need it because then if you get a humid basement, that’s cool. Well guess what it’s going to that ventually those molds are going to go upstairs to the rest of the home even if the rest of the home is is you know nice in and low humidity because of the air conditioner. So having a dehumidifier is important. I had a little bit of water issues over the weekend I was changing my water filter. And there was like three vowels you have to turn off. I only turned off two out of the three so it leaked a bit. Nothing bad I you know, got three or four towels cleaned it up. But what I did is I went in crank that dehumidifier down to 40%. And within two, three hours, any residual water that was hanging out was all evaporated, gone. But if you had 60% humidity in that basement, that water would just sit there for days on end. Once that water sits for 48 hours. It’s gonna start raining mold toxins. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, I’m glad you got the dehumidifier too. That’s, that’s pretty much essential for where we live with higher humidity. So, back to the chronic fatigue thing. So let’s keep going back on this paper because this is what I had.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: If you want you can go share your screen here, Evan, you can share your screen if you like. Evan, are you there? Can you hear me? I lost that and guy, so I’ll wait for him to kind of come back on here. I’ll just keep on riffing. While we are waiting for him. I’m just gonna give him a message here.

All right, awesome. So just chatting with Evan here on the on the side here. He’ll be back on the show in just a minute. Let me keep rolling with you guys. So in general, we have the mitochondria we have different mold toxins that can affect and poison the mitochondria. One of the things that we get with fungus or mold is we get things called oxalates. And oxalates can enter the mitochondria enter the Krebs cycle, and make it harder for that Krebs cycle to work and harder to generate energy. So of course, that’s going to be a big component to stressing out the mitochondria. So when we look at molds coming into the end environment, whether it’s mold from outdoors, whether it’s molds or fungal because it kind of have molds, right, and then you have different things like funguses in your gut like Candida, they kind of have a similar mechanism where they’re going to affect and poison the mitochondria. and different things like that can create oxalate and they can really make it harder for the mitochondria to generate ATP. 

I’m going to show a couple of articles here I got an article on mold and how it can affect or Candida and how it can affect the mitochondria. I’m gonna pull this up with you guys here right now so you guys can see it. So this is interesting right here, you guys can see my screen chronic intestinal candidiasis as a possible ecological factor in chronic fatigue syndrome. We talked about Candida syndrome, also known as Candida related complex, putatively caused by an overgrowth of Candida, so that’s an overgrowth, not the Candida is not ever going to be there. It should be there and maybe at very low levels, it’s the significant overgrowth. That’s the problem.

And essentially in response of large number of patient with chronic fatigue to an oral antifungal agent, there’s evidence that Candida infection of the mucous membranes depress our T cells and natural killer cells. Similar abnormalities of the immune function are found in chronic fatigue. So it’s altering our immune function. So our body’s ability to deal with an immune response and deal with infections and deal with stress is going to be impaired big time. This is this is really, really, really important to kind of highlight and then it says, um, and it’s important in preventing reactions like epstein barr cytomegalovirus, herpes virus, there are other viral infections that could play a role with chronic fatigue. Right? And again, with chronic fatigue, the question is what comes first? Is it the chicken or the egg? In other words, when you have a an infection, is it the infection is cause is the underlying cause or did you have a weakened immune system leading up to the infection that caused the problem to begin with. 

That’s really what the underlying issue is, did you get the infection first? Or did the infection come as a result of the weakened immune system, and I’m not sure if it matters too much, we always try to line up what the what the likely causes. But we know here things like Candida and gut issues can affect the T cell and the natural killer cell, this is going to be our th one branch of the immune system. So our th one or those kind of special forces, they get in there and really do a lot of killing ahead of time. And they kind of the first line defense of the immune response. That’s like kind of really, really, really important to highlight and then it talks about here. And so then when you have a compromised immune system, other parasites other viral issues may be an issue then mold may be more of a problem. So now when you get exposed to mold, you may have been able to whip through it no problem you adapted to a bun now it’s like dang I think really knocked on your butt. So then said yes. The immune dysfunction found in the sorter has been considered the primary underlying cause. So this imbalance of cytotoxic T cell and T helper cells and natural killer cells is the underlying cause. It proposed that the chronic intestinal combat is maybe an agent, which leads to the immune depression in many chronic fatigue patients, and therefore, it could be a causal factor in chronic fatigue. So a lot of times we have the guts stuff leads the way. Okay, the guts stuff leads the way and then everything else happens after that, that makes sense. All right, excellent. Excellent. Very good.

I’m going to just take a pause here for one second. We lost Evan here, so I’m gonna see if I can get him back on the show as we chat. All right, let’s keep on rolling. So we talked about some of the guts stuff now you can see some of these things here with Candida and mold. We can see the same thing with CBOE as well. All right, if we look at small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, SIBO and chronic fatigue, guess what we’re gonna see similar things and why? Why is it? Well, it’s because of the fact that the God is where 80% of the immune system lives this is important. So when you look at research, research suggests the high prevalence of SIBO among chronic fatigue patients, One study found 77% of chronic fatigue. patients had SIBO why because when you start to have gut issues, the immune system starts to get revved up, right. And when the immune system gets revved up, it gets weakened or you start to create an imbalance like that th one part of the immune system starts to become depleted. And when that th one becomes depleted, that’s going to make it harder for you to go after and deal with other stressors like SIBO like Candida like mold, right. This is why the gods plays a big role is because you have this tube.

That’s technically outside of your body yet when you swallow food, it’s technically outside of your body because when it goes into the bloodstream, that’s now inside, technically, it’s outside of the body, you’re have 80% of the immune cells in the golf, the gastric associated lymphoid tissue, that’s the part of the stomach. And then we have the mall. That’s the mucus associated lymphoid tissue that’s in the in the small intestine. And if you have stressors, whether it’s bugs or bad food that stresses out the immune system, the more chronically the immune system is stressed. It creates imbalances and makes it so other things that now encounter your body like mold or Candida or viruses like epstein barr mano, right? The kissing disease. Now that’s going to create more stress and really, really, really knock on your butt. So we always have to look at what the underlying root cause of everything is. So, so we don’t lose sight of that. So we always want to understand what’s the root cause? What are associated causes and just because it’s an associative cause, you still want to make sure you fix it. Because sometimesyou’re not really sure if there’s three or four different infection 234 different bugs, does it mean that hey, each one is 25% equal, maybe, sometimes one’s a bigger one. And we also have to make sure we set the table. So if there’s food or other issues that are driving the problem, to begin, we got to make sure we fix that. What if those things have created an autoimmune issue? And now you have Hashimoto is because of the mold or because of the bug issue. Right. And now, the thyroids been attacked for a decade. Well, now what do you got to do? You can’t just ignore the thyroid and be puritanical and say, well, the root cause is Candida. 

Therefore, if I only fix the root cause, then everything else should be fixed. No, you may still have to go in there and support the thyroid because the hormone levels have now dropped, or the adrenal levels now have dropped. So you, you, you know, it’s easy to be like, well, the root causes this, everything else goes downstream, yes, but you may have to come in there and support those other pathways so you can get better and feel better faster. If not, you may be suffering for a long time. Really, really, really important points. All right, I’m going to roll with questions guys and see where you’re at with everything. So in general, with foods, big things that are going to stress this out, if you’re eating lots of refined sugar, and you’re and you’re spitting out a lot of candy to the candy doesn’t make a whole bunch of lactic acid, and that can make it and though that can easily eat a lot of your B vitamins, so the more Candida and the more bugs we have, the more you’re going to be consuming and ripping up a lot of your B vitamins. So B vitamins are very important. When you have bad bacteria, it’s gonna make it a lot harder for you to consume a lot of those good healthy B vitamins because your bugs in your gut are going to be consuming it for you. That’s like super, super important bugs in your gut are going to be consuming it. Number two is the bacteria is and it produced toxins. And this is big because these toxins now put more stress on your guts. So put more stress on your detoxification pathway. 

So when you have a lot more gut toxins, like polysaccharide or endotoxin, or the different mycotoxins may be made by Candida, and now your detoxification pathways get stressed. And now the sulfur that your body needs to run detoxification pathway have to get up regulated, you’re going to need more B vitamins like b 12, and fold a and be sick. So you’re going to need more of those nutrients as well to run those detoxification pathways. And so that can also drive fatigue as well because if you’re really like your body only has so many so much resources, so if you’re really toxic, if you’re really toxic, your body’s gonna allocate a lot of the nutrients on the B vitamins side or the sulfur side that may plug into the mitochondria. ….. ossification have less resources over here. So just just very, very, very, very important to keep that in the back of your head. Okay, awesome. Okay, very, very good.

All right, excellent. So it’s very, very important to really keep an eye on all the resources here because the more stressed your detoxification pathways gets, they’re going to pull a lot of that sulfur, they’re going to pull a lot of the B vitamins, and those are all nutrients that would plug into that mitochondrial pathway to begin with. So really, really, really, really important. You need so for people forget you need sulfur to actually make a lot of your dopamine and adrenaline. So dopamine and adrenaline. You need good sulfur. All right. And so if you if you’re chronically stressed, you’re going to be making a lot of adrenalin and eventually you’re going to be depleted because you’re not going to have that good software to take dopamine to norepinephrine, epinephrine, so you deplete sulfur because when you have dope mean that’s your feel good neurotransmitter you feel good, helps you focus. It’s a good reward center neurotransmitter, and that will go downstream, the more stressed your app is epinephrine, norepinephrine, that’s basically adrenaline or catecholamines. And these things are going to get very, very depleted, the sulfur will, will get very, very depleted, the more you’re chronically stressed, and then you’ll have less sulfur. And then the less sulfur you have, you’re going to have less building blocks for glutathione for your methylation, for all your detoxification nutrients, so it really plugs in. You want to look at everything holistically, so it all makes sense. All right, wonderful. All right, guys. Hey, phenomenal chat with you. If you guys enjoy today’s podcast talking about Candida talking about mold and mycotoxins connecting it to the mitochondria connecting it to energy. These are all very, very important components and on how and why everything you know is vitally important, why it all connects. So in general, co q 10. Very important, you know, anywhere between 100 to 500 milligrams a day. B vitamins, you know, a good high quality B Complex especially if we see on an organic acid test more forming a glutamate or more methylmalonic acid that tells us B12. And it also tells us full later benign, we may see things like xanthi urinator, kind of urinate which tell us B6 is important because B6 helps with our brain it is needed for the synthesis of neurotransmitters, right serotonin and dopamine. So if we don’t have good neurotransmitters that’s gonna really really affect our body’s ability to sleep to deal with stress mood, our adrenals right B five is a really important one pens authentic acid, we need it for our adrenals and also plugged into our mitochondria. Krebs cycle amino acids like I’ll see on these mitochondrial tests, we’ll see low sulfur like we’ll see low sulfate or low power of glutamate, or we’ll see low Pokorny, which is a sign of lower amino acids and these amino acids plug in to the Krebs cycle. 

And you can see here I’ll try to pull it up on screen how the amino acids plug in, but there’s a bunch of amino acids and the Krebs cycle. I’ll try to pull it up here. Now, why is this important? Well, because if you have poor digestion, because of mold, because of Candida, guess what’s going to happen to your body’s ability to break down protein? It’s going to drop, it’s going to significantly drop. Okay, I’m going to pull this up here so you guys can see how amino acids plug in. They plug in significantly. Okay, I got it right up here for you guys. Alright, cool. Let me just show this to you guys so you can see it. So this is what the Krebs cycle looks like. Okay, so you have remember this is the glucose here is in the site is all that’s outside of the mitochondria. Okay. All right, and then this stuff here comes in glucose phospholipids animal pyruvate pyruvate to acetylcholine. Now this starts to enter into the mitochondria, so sudo Coase now in the mitochondria, so look at these building blocks a Piru a to acetal koi look what it is people listening here we have a video version two so you guys can see my screen alanine cysteine glycine serine three Nene trip the fan right I so loosing all these things are big these are all essential amino acids that plug in to pyruvate and the seal co a and these kind of provide the building blocks to ratchet through your Krebs cycle and this thing is going to turn around twice. So you have saturate the ISO citrate and then you have alpha ketoglutarate more glutamine more prolene more histidine more origin and get plugged in. Then you have [inaudible] when you have more isoleucine more veiling right these are branched chain amino acids. Now this is part of the reason why working out with branched chain amino acids helpful refining 3d and then it goes from succinylcholine to succinate or we have tyrosine and phenyl alanine, which helps dopamine and adrenaline and then Fumarate to melee, melee to oxaloacetate, which is aspirin gene and aspartate. And then it plugs right back into we’ll see the code so you can see how that works. All right, you can see how that works very, very important amino acids. So if we have very poor, if we have very, very poor digestion, we have low hydrochloric acid, we have low enzymes, that’s an a play a really, really big role in this whole thing. So getting your enzymes and your stomach acid up really having a clean diet, really breaking down your food, and then really working with a good practitioner to look at the mold toxins or the gut stress the Candida in the gut. Right, and it’s more of an overgrowth, maybe looking at SIBO maybe looking at H. pylori or other gut infections. Looking at the environmental mold, if there is mold, how do we fix it right? What’s the root cause of that mold? Is it a muted humidity issue? Do we just need an air filter? Do we have to do a bio balance protocol in the home to get the mold level down right? So we have to look at the whole picture so we get to the root cause I hope that makes sense. 

Any other questions? Feel free I’ll chime in and try to answer them here for y’all. I think we got most stuff here that’s on point kind of already dialed in. So if you guys want to reach out to Evan, is a console link you can feel free and schedule. Also head over to my site to schedule a consult with myself if you want to dive in deeper we’ll put links down below. If you guys enjoyed this content, share it with friends and family make sure you subscribe hit that like button hit the bell so you get notifications. It’s phenomenal chatting with y’all really appreciate it. Just do me a favor try to apply some of this information so that you can make yourself healthier. It’s really important when you’re healthier. You become a better parent, a better person a better employee, a better boss, and it just it really helps the whole world get better the healthier you get the whole world gets better. Alright guys, it was phenomenal chat and you guys have a great day. Take care. Bye


Audio Podcast:

Mold and Mycotoxin Remediation | Podcast #221

Mold can be a potential stressor that could be affecting someone’s ability to heal. It’s also a big rabbit hole of functional medicine because every symptom potentially could be mold.

In this episode, Dr. J and Evan Brand give us the updates on their battle with molds. Each of them shares with us their pre and post mold remediation results. Do you have mold, or do you have blood sugar, do you have hormonal issues or gut issues? What is it and how do you know? Continue and learn some ways to naturally address it.

Stay tuned for more!

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

00:54    2 Biggest Variables to Know Mold is a Problem

04:57    Pre and Post Mold Remediation Results

13:16    Dehumidifier and Mold Issues that May Not be Due to a Leak

18:21    Mold Issues in Tropical Regions

29:10    For those Living in Apartment, Condo, Townhouse, etc.


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey guys, it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani here. Today is gonna be another podcast on mold remediation. I got my pre and post mold remediation results. I’m looking forward to sharing them with you all today. So, mold can be a potential stressor that could be affecting someone’s uhm, ability to heal. It’s also a big rabbit hole, rat hole of functional medicine because every symptom potentially could be mold. So, do you have mold, or do you have blood sugar, do you have uhm, hormonal issues or gut issues, right? What is it, how do you know?

So, off the bat, I found a little bit of mold here behind my stove top. We were able to remediate it in a way that was natural, meaning, we didn’t create more harmful metabolites and increase allergenicity or toxicity in the house with some of the metabolites that may form with some of the more conventional killing methods. So we chose a more natural approach to address the underlying issues.

So, first off, how do you know mold is actually a problem? So, do you have any active visible mold, that’s number 1. Again, that doesn’t tell you the whole story. Number 2, do we have any uhm, let’s just say leaks in the house, visible water stains, visible drywall damage, uhm do you have very high humidity in the house where you can almost s- almost smell or scents you may have some mold in the house? Does humidity get a very high? So, typically there’s gonna be an active leak, and/or, uhm, a very high humidity throughout the year, or certain times of the year that can cause mold growth. Those are gonna be the 2 biggest variables.

Outside, the potentially some insulation issues that can kind of create the same kind of thing. That’s gonna allow mold to form. And then of course, that can get into the household that can get into the ventilation of the house and that can kinda go systemic so you have one room with an issue and that can totally go systemic. Now my situation, we had a- issue, I think what it was, was the seal with the- the stove top, uh, water from previous owners had gone back behind the baseboard, and the actual uhm, the baseboard of the- the stove top in the cabinet in the drywall. So, kinda got right in between that area. Overall, we checked for moisture. Moisture reading are all coming back low, that’s a good sign that it’s not an active leak ’cause is- if it’s an active leak, or if it’s- you know, been going on for a long period of time and- and the underlying issue hasn’t been resolved, you’re gonna see the moisture readings coming back on the higher side. So, the great thing about that is, we can get a window into moisture being a problem or not if we see these moisture readings up high.

Number 2, uhm, we can kinda come back there and we can do some testing to quantify what’s going on. So, one of the big things that I do was uhm, mold plate testing to assess pre – the levels of mold I need to run. So, we did one in the basement, we did one in the kitchen, we did one upstairs, and it was the kitchen area that showed the highest. Everything was at 3 or below, and the kitchen was at 15 or higher, and we want everything to be below 5. So, we are good everywhere else, but we did comeback with a negative reading in the kitchen on our pre-reading. And actually, Evan just popped on the hang out, so, Evan, what’s going on man, today, we’re talking about mold remediation.

Evan Brand: Oh, good, good, good. I’m glad I made it. So, my- my appointment took less time than I thought it would, so I’m glad I could join in man.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. I’m gonna put you on my little headset here, just to get a better audio- audio quality set up.

Evan Brand: Good.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So I’m just talking about some of uhm, what we found on the pre-testing. And, I’m gonna share screen to you in a little bit. And I know, you’ve done some pre-testing, you wanna share some of your pre-test info?

Evan Brand: I definitely could, yeah. I mean, here’s the thing that’s- that’s good about you, is that you weren’t really symptomatic. See, I’m like way, you know, ten times more symptomatic than you, so, you and I, we were talking off air, I was so glad that you preemptively figured out your problem before it made you sick versus me, I didn’t figure out my problem until I was already sick.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So, I didn’t have a big issue but I know mold is a stressor, it’s a big stressor in your stress bucket. I know for you, you didn’t have many symptoms at all for a long period of time until you got in contact with a whole bunch of mold. So, it’s not worth chancing it, right? So, that was one of the big things is taken that stressor out of our stress bucket. Yours came back really high in the pre-testing. Let me share my screen, so some people can see what my scores were. And then, today’s topic here will be mold remediation, it’s like part 3, I think, right?

Evan Brand: Yeah, I mean, err- this will be a never ending series, so, hope people enjoy it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I think it’s- it’s important because uhm, we found some really more affordable ways to address the situations which uhm, were phenomenal, because a lot of other ways are expensive-

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -and number 2, they sometimes can create more harsh metabolites that can be a stressor on the body, right?

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s the thing, these people go and, “Oh yeah, we heard the mold remediation guy down the street”, uh, but the problem is, uh, the- the guy down the street could be using toxic chemicals, you know, people talk about using bleach to wipe stuff down. I mean, it’s just terrible idea and that’s gonna make you way socker.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, 100%, exactly. So, let me just show you my screen here. This is my first test here that we did. And you can see the basement island was at 3, uhm, which was great because I actually had a little bit of uhm, baseboards that had some mold on them in the basement, but the guy that did the mold remediation said, “Yeah, that’s probably just from them sitting out in the lumber yard”. Initially it’s pointing out an active mold issue, it’s just kind of stained, right?

Evan Brand: Aah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And it seemed like he was right, so that was a 3, and then the master bedroom which is good, was a 2, and the kitchen island you can see was a 19. So, that was really on the higher side. And some of the mold that came back I think was more from a water type of species. What was that species refer to for the- for the water one?

Evan Brand: Uhm, aspergillus and penicillium, those are the 2 main ones, there could be others like fusarium-based mycotoxins but it’s usually aspergillus penicillium is a water damage boulding.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And then if you look on my post-testing, right? Here’s the dates, you could see my kitchen island is zero. So, like, nothing came back, and then look at the basement, uh, 1, and then the master came back at 1, and we’ve done previous podcast, so take a look at the previous ones on mold remediation which go more into depth on how we addressed it, but just in general, make sure the underlying cause of the leak is fully addressed. We topically hit the mold with 20% hydrogen peroxide which is very effective. And- and the formula that I use, the hydrogen peroxide plus parasitic acid, so was like a hydrogen peroxide-apple-cider-vinegar kind of mix, topically hit it, uhm, we cleaned it up first in a negative pressure environment, topicly hit it with the apple-cider-vinegar, hydrogen peroxide 20%, not the 3%, but the 20%-

Evan Brand: Yes.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -and it can burn your skin, so be very careful. And then we did a fogging, a dry fog solution of the citrusafe formulas which I’ll put links below, that are- are- ver- very effective. The benefit of- benefits of the dry fog is, it can get to a 1 to 10 microns size. So, that’s really-really tiny, can literally get in between your baseboards and the floor, it’s that powerful. So it gets in the nooks and crannies, and the cool thing is, you can leave all your clothes up, and all- all your furniture there ’cause you want that to topicly get treated. And when you spray it, it’s gonna kill it but then when it sits down, it’s gonna lay down on your clothes and on your walls and everything, and then as the mo- any potential mold particulate settles from the air and settles down on the ground gets what, there’s now a layer there that will kill any mold that falls to the ground.

Evan Brand: Yup, and I’ve got my reports now, I’m just tryin’ to get these downloaded here, so I can discuss this with you and we can share my screen and I’ll show you mine before and after-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes. Exactly.

Evan Brand: -I’m just trying to download here. Uh, I had more samples than you, uh, you know, I had- I wanna say maybe 6 or 7 samples total, uh, but then I also had a lot more insane difference in terms of my levels.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: So your levels were not too bad. Mine were pretty crazy. So that’s why I wanted to show these because I was just amazed. I- I- I saw- I was very skeptical, just to kinda educare people on-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: -about what I did is that-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.

Evan Brand: -we did this enzyme solution that was like $5 a square foot.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah?

Evan Brand: I mean, I literally spent $10,000 out of pocket on that, and we got the plates back on it and the enzyme stuff did work, but the dry fog worked even better, and it’s so much cheaper.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, 100%. 100%. Let me see if I can get my camera back on me here…

Evan Brand: I see you so I think people should see you too.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, let me just see here, I’ll just click over manually, no problem. Uhm, so, in general, yeah, you could see- the dry fog’s phenomenal because it’s a little bit more effective. Now, I can do my whole entire house, I got a pretty big house and I was able to do it for about a gallon. I got a- maybe- uh, 6,000 square foot house in change and like 1 gallon was enough to cover it. And I think that’s like right around a thousand dollars-ish for 1 gallon- for most. Most people are gonna be fine within a gallon or ha- or half a gallon, and it- it includes the dry fogger which is really cool and, I paid someone to do it, but I mean, I had in sight, uh, I could probably done it myself, it wasn’t too hard, it wasn’t too bad-

Evan Brand: Yeah. It’s not too hard, but I mean, at the same time, you know, you got a kid, you don’t wanna be-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani:  Oh yeah.

Evan Brand: -in that environment with the kid and potentially breathing it in ’cause the fog, even though it is safe, it does deplete oxygen from the air, so I think you were better off in your case and my case, just to hire somebody to do it because you wanna make sure it’s done right too, ’cause, see if the fog wasn’t done thick enough, you know, that would be a problem too. So, uh- you know, you definitely did the right thing. Okay, I’ve got my report, you want me to share my screen here?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Do it, yeah.

Evan Brand: Alright. So, share screen… Okay, so there is you in the middle. So, uh, what we’re lookin’ at, let me get this even here so we can kinda compare apples to apples. On the left, you can see all these numbers. So, like attic, a bonus room which was uh, exposed to outside air, so that’s obviously gonna be higher, but then like a basement storage room, look at this. Basement storage, penicillium, on the left here, too much to count, too numerous to count. So we had some problems, look the kitchen, it was a 44.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Wow.

Evan Brand: That’s really-really not good. So that- so let me go down and show you the pictures, look at how disgusting. So here is the before plates. Okay, and then here’s the after. So, now we got the kitchen down to a 7, but here’s the thing, the 7 sounds bad ’cause you want like 4 below, but when you look at the kitchen, uh, 3 of it is candida. And so we have a dog bed in the kitchen. So, 3 of it is candida. So if you take 2 penicillin to microsporum, really your score is a 4, ’cause you always subtract candida form the total colony numbers, see. So, 7, mine is 3, you get your 4. So, everything is really a 4. So, when you go back up the top and look at the numbers here, the C-room, I don’t remember which room that was, but C-room says a 6. So let’s go to that one-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: So, C-room, so that one still could use a little bit of work. See, so, C-room, you know, we only had a 1 candida, so that puts us at a 5, and optimal is 4 below according to the lab. But let’s look at the after pictures. So much better. Now, here’s the thing in this first one, you’re gonna look at this first on Justin, you’ll gonna be like, “Oh, my God, what happened?”. So, this is something interesting, this- this plate, I left it out, I- I didn’t shift it, soon enough to the lab. So, uh, what J.W. told me is that this is called second stage growth. So, this big black thing here or green thing in the corner, this is the penicillium, and which is only like a 1, but then it had babies.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Aah.

Evan Brand: So that’s the babies.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I see, that makes sense. And then, the candida isn’t necessarily as- as bad ’cause that’s what, that’s more of like a internal kind of uhm, mycotoxin than it is like in external environmental one, is that why?

Evan Brand: Well, so the candida is basically like on dog fur. So, the candida can just like come off the dog’s fur into the-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Evan Brand: -air, and then it’s in the air. But look at- I mean, look at the difference in the pictures, I mean, they’re equally disgusting in their own way, but you can tell that you’ve only got just a couple of species here, versus here, you’ve had a whole family of dis- disgusting-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, yeah. Totally. I’m just curious, what was the me- how do they make it grow? When they shine it under specific light that cause it to grow?

Evan Brand: Oh, you’re telling me, how do they get this and turn into this?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: Honestly it’s just time. If you pu- uh, if you have any extra plates out or you can order ’em, here, let me, stop sharing, I’ll come back to you now. Uh, so, if you just put a-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hmm…

Evan Brand: -plate like if you have an extra one, you can just leave one out in your kitchen today if you wanted and then just put- leave it on your countertop. Just sunlight, it’s- it’s the media that they use on that- on that plate that’s like a sticky substance. There’s something on that that makes it grow.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting. So-

Evan Brand: Any people that can’t afford to do the testing, they can just-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: -buy the plates, and then you can just watch the plates grow at your house. And if nothing grows, you’re- you’re good.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, wow. That’s great.

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so in general we were able to do some pre and some post uhm to quantify it which was great. And it wasn’t too expensive to actually address the underlying issue. Now in your situation’s a little bit more unique, ’cause we’re on that, the climate’s a little bit more dry, but where you’re at is a little bit more hu- humid. So you ha- you had some water issues in general, but I think your new house didn’t necessarily have any water issues. So talk to everyone about what you did with the uhm, the humidifier to help rectify, uhm, mold issues that may not be due a leak.

Evan Brand: Right. So, if you’re 55-0, 50% relative humidity or higher, you’re gonna get mold growth, no matter what. And so, in the basement, we tested it and we were at around 56% humidity, which is really high, relative humidity. And so, we put it in a whole house dehumidifier. So, basically what it is, is it’s a- a dock work, you know, about this big around, and it hooks up to your dock work, and they cut a whole in your dock work so they have a return and a supplies. So, basically, what it does, is it kinda stills air from your dock work, pumps it through this dehumidifier, which is basically like- kinda like an air conditioning system-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Really?

Evan Brand: -t’s got a compressor-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: -and all that in there, it takes the moisture out of the air, and then it pumps out drier air back into your dock work. Now, this is a whole house system versus, you know, some people-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: -they get like a plug in… dehumidifier, but then you gotta drain the bucket of water. This- it’s completely hands off. I mean, I would be downstairs draining a dehumidifier bucket every couple hours if I didn’t have this system. So, this system has a little, uh, drain pipe that runs out of it, so it’s 24 runs- 24/7 or as needed. If it gets it down- the lowest that can go is to 40. So we actually- [crosstalk] switch 40%, no mold will grow there, and then it drains itself. So, I mean it’s- it’s a- the brain is called Aprilaire. That’s the one we did. So, a local, you know, heating and cooling company could install that if someone needed it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, the benefit of that is, you don’t have to constantly empty the- the dehumidifier with all that water because I mean, God forbid, you forgot for a couple days you may have a flood down there, with all these extra water coming back-

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -into the air.

Evan Brand: Good. The- that- that’s the one point of the second point is the ability to remove more air. So a portable dehumidifier is like for one room. You’re never gonna be to dehumidify a whole house with a little plugin job.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: Just like  you can’t de- you can’t uhm- you know, with one air, you know, like you and I, we ike a couple different brands of air filters, we wouldn’t just put one air filter and assume that’s-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly.

Evan Brand: -gonna take care of the whole house.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. That totally makes sense.

Evan Brand: So, that’s why you needed it because, here’s the problem that people don’t understand, they’ll go like, “Okay, well-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: -you know you and Justin talked about the dry fog, okay, I’m gonna do the the dry fog…”-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Evan Brand: -but there’s a disclaimer to that, which is that you can’t remediate your house if you stop the moisture problem, because if you’re a 55, 60% humidity and you do the fog, yeah, you’re gonna kill all the existing mold, and you’re gonna drop it down, but then it could just come right back. It could just regrow again if you’re 60%.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And speaking to J.W. at the lab, as well as, I think it’s Jeff Bookout, err- don’t go crazy in house if you don’t see any active water damage, and/or someone’s coming, and with a moisture meter and assess some of the- the walls and the various areas and there’s no actual active water damage where you can’t see anything, don’t stress out, it could just be a humidity issue. And then you just need this really good Whole House Dehumidifier, to fix the humidity issue. Does that sound right?

Evan Brand: It does. Yeah, so, you know, a lot of people, when they see those plates, you know, they may get concerned. So step 1 is really do plates, I would say step 2 is get a portable humidity monitor. I just bought one on Amazon, 10-11 bucks and you can just, you know, take it to a room, “Hey, what’s my bedroom? My bedroom’s 34%”, okay, perfect, you don’t have a problem. Uh, and then of course, it wouldn’t hurt if you- if you’re someone who has been sick, you know, we- you- you and I work with a lot of women who they’re stay at home moms, uh, housewives, so they’re home all the time, right? So, this is why some-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly.

Evan Brand: -people, they quit their job, right? ‘Cause, “Oh, I- I’m so tired I can’t work”, so they quit their job. Now they’re- they’re home 99% of the time, at house that’s making them sick. So, if you have been sick, do the plates. It wouldn’t hurt to have like a roofer come by, check your roof, check your attic, make sure there’s no water getting in, I mean, the price you pay now for some of these stuff is 5 to 10 times cheaper than if you’re so sick, and now you’re tearing out walls, and now you’re doing major-major stuff, I mean, you can fix stuff before it becomes super problematic.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Now, a lot pf people, if they have a Central Air system, that may be okay in the summertime because Central Air is gonna dehumidify the house essentially, correct?

Evan Brand: It does some. Yeah, but in- in our climate, uh, the Central Air would not be enough. We need more firepower than what-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: [Crosstalk] Right, so- so essentially, what I was leading to was the fact that, okay, great, you know, it’s no longer the hot months, let’s say it’s 50 or 60 degrees out, or even 70 degrees out, that may not be hot enough to have the Central Air on but you still have a high level of humidity. So, I think where the dehumidifier comes in, is when, okay, it’s not really hot enough to have the AC on, that’s where the dehumidifier matters ’cause you’re not really changing the temperature at all, which the AC will change to temperature and remove humidity at the same time, but you’re just focusing on the reduction in humidity, is that correct?

Evan Brand: That’s right, yeah. So, even in in the winter here, you know, we’re running the heat, so theoretically the heat would dry out the moisture, we were still at 56% humidity. So-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Wow!

Evan Brand: -that tells you in the summer, I mean, it could’ve been 70, 80, I mean, who knows? I mean, if you’ll look at like average humidity in Kentucky, I mean, outside in the summertime, it’s 80, 85% humidity. There’s no way you can live here and not have a moisture problem unless you dehumidify, that’s my opinion.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I think this is really important. So, if you’re living in an environment, ’cause I have a lot of patients that live in tropical environments too, where they’re like, “I don’t have a water leak, I’m good”, but it’s like, yeah, humidity is up and you probably need a dehumidifier. Maybe even a dehumidifier on top of top uhm, the AC unit. I mean, I- I wonder how much- ’cause like, with your unit, that’s gotta sep- uh, separate piping where it gets that moisture out. You probably even need a separate thing if you really live in a tropical climate where there’s even higher humidity.

Evan Brand: Oh, man, you would have to like we have run. I’d have a few clients in Hawaii since all these stuff happened to me and you and I not being going down this rabbit hole together. And we’ve tested people in Hawaii, I’ve had ’em just buy this little humidity monitor, I mean, we’re seeing people’s homes at 78%, 76%, it’s like, “my God”, mold forms at 51%. So, if you live in Hawaii and you got the beautiful beach house in paradise, it doesn’t matter. Now, Jeff, on the podcast we did, he claims that saltwater, uh, if- if your home is being filled with moisture due to saltwater, it theoretically it would keep the mold count down. So he says that at- you know, once you go a hundred miles inland, so the beach front should be good because it’s salt water, just coming in the home through the air, not like lake water. But he says a hundred miles inland or a hundred fifty miles inland, that’s where we would see a band of problems.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Aah…

Evan Brand: However, however, it’s so very interesting, however, I’ve seen people that have houses on the beach, they have mold problems. And even, uh, Erin Elizabeth, Dr. Mercola’s partner, she’s been posting on some of her Facebook pages about her house. So her- her and Dr. Mercola, oop, sorry, notification ding, uhm, her and Dr. Mercola, they live on- on the beach in Florida and they’ve got stachybotrys, they’ve got black mold right now-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, a hundred percent.

Evan Brand: -and they live on the beach.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah I guarantee you-

Evan Brand: They live on the beach so-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah and they- they probably need a dehumidifier as well.

Evan Brand: Oh man, I- I mean, so- so- so- you know, when I talked with Jeff, he said, “Yeah, you know, the beach is not a problem but I- I’ve proven it not to be the case. I- I’ve proven the beach can’t be a problem, and these Hawaii houses, you’ve got no other option but to have dehumidifiers running all the time.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah we see people in the notes talking about humidifiers. Just make sure it’s uhm , we differentiate, right? Humidifiers are what we do to add moisture to the air. So in my house I actually have a Whole House uh, humidifier ’cause it gets so dry like around 10 to 15%. It’s just your skin gets super dry ’cause the moisture is so low. So we actually have a humidifier where I am. So just make sure dehumidifier, we’re removing moisture, we need the high levels of moisture about 50 for mold to grow, we’re removing it, uh, humidifier, we’re adding it. So a lot of times like with infants they may have drier, you know, sinuses, whatever, we may add humidity to it. And actually, one thing we did is that, one point we left the humidifier on too long, we actually got mold growth in one of the carpets. We had to like-

Evan Brand: Oh.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We had to like clean it up and throw it away. So be careful even if you have the humidifier on, you’d really wanna make sure the humidity isn’t get too high ’cause then you’re gonna have mold growth.

Evan Brand: Good call. Well, especially if that humidifier is like sitting on a night stand over carpet versus if it were like-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s what happened to us! That’s what happened.

Evan Brand: Oh.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup, exactly.

Evan Brand: See, ’cause if you had a hard wood under it, or- or- or like maybe it were uh, like in a bathroom next to the main room and the- and- and the bathroom floor was tile, maybe that moisture wouldn’t do- do damage and create mold on the tile, you know?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well that’s if you had hard wood beneath it, so-

Evan Brand: Oh.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -we just picked the carpet up, we rolled it up and just throw it away and then just, uhm, clean the uhm, the wood with a really good citrus solution to kill everything.

Evan Brand: Okay, okay. Uh, so we had a question from Missy. She was asking, “How do you know if the fog is thick enough?”, uh, you can’t see your hand in front of your face, Missy. Uh, I was- at my house when Jeff fogged it for me, and I laughed so hard because he uh- he said, “Evan, if you have people ask you, how thick does it need to be, it needs to be this thick”. So we went down my staircase and when he stepped off the bottom stair, it looked like he went to another dimension. I mean, I couldn’t even see him, he was gone. I’m like, “Where’d you go?”. [Laughs]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. You sent the pictures and the videos, I mean, that was hilarious.

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Technology is so great because, you know, I think- I mean, if you topicly have mold though, I mean you probably wa- you wanna hit that up. You probably want a higher professional because some of the solutions are very-very costic, but if you don’t have actual water damage, uhm, you know, and you can have an easy solution of getting a dehumidifier in the house, and potentially even fogging it your- yourself, it wouldn’t even be that bad, I mean, I know that I am- the Immunolytics guy, they have some pretty good instructional videos walking through everyone how to do it.

Evan Brand: Yeah, it- it- it- it is definitely this is all do it yourself unless you have damaged materials like you said, then you’ve gotta take out walls and put in new drywall, whatever, remove carpet in your case-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And it has to be done- the carpet situation wasn’t that big of a deal but, ’cause it was isolated we knew what it was but, when we have the water damage in the wall, we needed to have the whole entire remediation done in a negative pressure environment ’cause you don’t want everything to go systemic. So the negative air pressure keeps everything isolated and- and pulls it out versus let’s say sprays it all around.

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, good call. So yes, you could do s- this stuff yourself, you could hire it all out, I think it really just depends on your budget, and then it depends on your illness, right? I was so symptomatic, I did not wanna chance doing something wrong, I needed my environment, this is my work, environment, this is my home environment, I couldn’t take any chances because I won’t be on this podcast, you know, if I were- if I were too sick. So, I needed- my health was like number 1. So, for me, I just hired him. I’m just like, “Hey, you- you gotta do it for me, I- I couldn’t take any risk”.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh yeah. And because we have a lot of home offices, you know, was- it worked out as a nice business expense which, you know, we- we’re here all the time. So, that was good, we were able to utilize that. Uhm, but people that aren’t at home as much, you may not notice an issue as much. I know you did, you worked at home, but the fogging is a really good option to a- do it yourself if you need which is great.

Evan Brand: Here’s the thing. Even if someone works outside of the home, right? Like they’re 9 to 5 or in a typical office setting, they still sleep at home for 8 to 10 hours-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: -at night. So, like, even if you’re like, “Oh, well my house is bad but I’m out at the office all the time, I work all the time”, well, so what you’re still at the house sleeping for those 8 hours, and we know that mold exposure reduces melatonin production, it reduces nitric oxide productions so you have uhm, decrease circulation, I think it may be a contributor to sleep apnea, and insomnia, and other sleep problems as well. So, you can’t justify not doing anything because you work outside of the home. You still gotta fix it ’cause at your- at your environment where you’re sleeping and where you’re trying to rest and recover, your glymphatic system kicks in and detoxes you, and that all just gets disrupted if you have mold in your bedroom.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And uhm, I spoke with, I think it was J.W. and Jeff Bookout, they talked about the more conventional products like the Concrobium, which I spoke with some of the mold remediation guys, you know, Concrobium is an extract from, I think Olive leaf.

Evan Brand: Oh.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And they were talking about it being little bit more natural but it seemed like uhm J.W. work from Im- Immunolytics lab was talking about the fact that it can create some more hyper allergenic metabolites that people could react to. Do you have any insight on that?

Evan Brand: I- I don’t. I- I’ve just would say that I’ve had people who said, “Hey, I’ve already remediated using that”, and they still were symptomatic. But that’s all I can tell you, it’s just a couple clients said, “Yeah I’ve already done that, it didn’t work”, so, uh, here’s another interesting thing that- that him and I talked- talked about is when- when they were mixing all these blends for the fog, I don’t know if I’ve told you this already, if I did I’ll tell you again, but when they were trying to come up with the formulation for this stuff, certain uh- certain ratios of essential oils made the mold problem worse. So they would do a plate, build a- build a- a supplement basically, fog it and then retest and, “Oh my God, the mold is way worse”. So then they would tweak it again, “Oh, the mold is still worse” and they’d-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Wow.

Evan Brand: -finally kept tweaking it, and then finally there’s the perfect ratio, boom, now we see that acts- takes numbers down not up.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting. Very-very interesting. And then, one of the things I wanna highlight is that a pre to post testing on the air. So, they would do air samples. Mine actually went up higher after the remediation-

Evan Brand: Mm-hmm.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -which is interesting but, he- the- the gentleman that did the remediation said my levels were so low, uhm pre and post anyway, it wasn’t even an issue. But the plate testing showed high in the kitchen, and then at significant drop, lika I showed you on the testing from I think what I say, 16 to 0, or 19 to 0. So-

Evan Brand: Wow.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -the plate testing I feel like they were, you know, they really showed the difference pre and post where the air didn’t quite give that range, even though it went up it wasn’t that big of a deal. And, I think from what I understand, ’cause you’re- you’re sucking uhm, air, so, I think-

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -you could pull more of a general samples so you could grab 1 particle, 2 particles that can increase it, where the plates are just kinda there in a natural environment and they aren’t, you know, air is not being pushed on it, upon it more artificially if you will.

Evan Brand: Yeah, I- I- I like the idea of having both, you know, the air and the plates, it’s kinda like in functional medicine, we’re not gonna make a whole work up on somebody, just based on a stool test. ‘Cause we can look at a stool test and we could see, “hey, they didn’t test for candida”, so then this person thinks, “Well, I don’t have any candida”, but then we get their urinary organic acid test back and were like, “Woah, you have a big candida overgrowth”. So-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly.

Evan Brand: -instead we have multiple testing methodologies and the plates, you know, you can’t beat them. The- they’re- they’re good thing for your buck.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And in my situation you could see the mold, here’s the plate, it was high, we addressed it, we treated it, came back and then it was a hundred percent gone. So it did fall through clinically what we observed.

Evan Brand: Yeah, and people talked about like the ERMI test and the EMMA, E-M-M-A and all these other tests, I just haven’t needed them. I haven’t needed them. If- if the plates, you know, so I- I kinda take 2 things in a consideration, 1 is how do I feel any environment? If I feel bad, if I feel dizzy, if I feel sick, if I don’t sleep well, well, my symptoms are there, so now did the plates correlate? And if they did, okay good, and then I fixed the plates, and then I feel better, right? So, I think you could go on and do more of like the Dr. Shoemaker protocols, the ERMI, the EMMA, there’s a lot of other tests out there that are more expensive. But for me, I just haven’t needed to go there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and the cool thing about the plate is they actually send you the picture so you can see how the plate actually looks. So it’s not some a theoretical, I’m guessing, you can actually see it, which is kinda cool.

Evan Brand: I thought it was just like a sample photo. When I first got the repot back, I was like, “There’s no way this is real, there’s no-“, I had to call ’em. I’m like, “Is this seriously my picture of my plates, like, yep, oh my- haaaa?!”, so it’s a very good convincer for people that are skeptics, you know? We have a lot of women that they feel sick but the husband’s not sick, so then the husband thinks you’re crazy, “Oh, it’s not mold, this couldn’t do that to you”, and then when they see the picture, they’re like, “Oh, I’m sorry, why if you are correct, this is a problem, let’s fix it”. So it’s good convincer at- at the- at the least.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And I had some patients that are literally spending a hundred thousand dollars to remediate their house, so I just- so fortunate that we found some methods that are so much more cost-effective. Now, if there’s tons of visible water damage, for sure, it may cost a little bit more, but we should definitely be able to get it way beneath that. And then even for people that are just, you know, on the- on the borderline, right? If we just fix the humi- the humidity aspect and we fog the house, that should be a good solution in general.

Evan Brand: Yeah, now let- let’s talk about this real quick. Uhm, so if you live in an apartment or a condo, or a townhouse or something, then, you- you are at more increased risk of having problems, right? Because let’s say you’re on a second floor apartment, you’ve got people above you that, maybe their dishwasher overflowed, or their toilet leaked, or they left their sink on, or they let their shower water leaked out onto their floor, and then your ceiling, is their floor, right? So, in that cavity between their floor and your ceiling, there could be water and creating mold above you, and there could be- err- people with a problem below you, uh, with a hotel, it could be a central system where you share all the same and eating dock work, so the hotel room 3 doors down could have flooded, and that moldy air gets pumped through the whole hotel, so then everybody’s sick, versus if you have an individual unit in your hotel, so, you are at a bigger risk. And, when I was in a hotel temporarily, uh, it took me 3 tries to find a hotel room that I could actually sleep soundly. And my wife reported the same thing. So, we saw water spots on the ceiling in the hotel, so we asked to move to room 2, and then we went to room 2, I still slept terrible, and then finally we got the room 3, and then I started sleeping and wife did too, and even our daughter. She was waking up all night complaining of a stomach ache.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: And then she started sleeping through. So, it- it is a tricker situation when it’s not like a single family unit, uhm, you may have to try a little harder, but with the fog still working in apartment, condo, town home, yes, but, I mean, there may be some extra work where you gotta get to landlord or somebody else involved because the guy next door could be messing up your air.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So, at least in that situation, if it’s a hotel room, or if it’s an apartment, and it’s smaller, you could probably get- at least get a personal dehumidifier, and you could at least get a uhm- a personal air filter, and you could probably just fog it at least to, would it address the HVAC situation, but it’s better than nothing.

Evan Brand: Yeah, I mean, before I went in signed a lease on a place, I would probably 1, see how I feel. Most people aren’t as sensitive as me so they wouldn’t know, “Hey I feel bad in this environment”, most people wouldn’t pick up on that, but you could always take a plate with you-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Always take a plate with you.

Evan Brand: That’s what I did.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: [Crosstalk] really high grade filters too, you know, ’cause the air is moving but it’s gotta go through a filter, typically to get out or get in, so you could always just upgrade in some really good quality air filters and get ’em changed frequently to make sure they’re- they’re good.

Evan Brand: Yeah, but that’d be a good bandaid to keep you afloat. But if I were gonna go buy a place or sign a lease on a place, I was kinda in the middle of houses or apartments or whatever, you know, you can buy some plates, you get a meter from immunolytics directly, or I carry ’em on my site as well, uh-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: -it’s still- it’s just- it’s- it’s 5 plates for- at the current, at the time of this recording it’s- right now, it’s $158, that’s the lab’s price, uh, for 5 plates including your report and a free consult with the laboratory. And, if I were gonna go and buy plates, I would have some plates with me, and I would tell the seller, or the- the relator I was working with, “Hey I’ve got a- uh- uh- uh- sensitivity, I need to make sure this is a clean environment for me, I’m gonna out this plates out for one hour, so we need to make sure we reserve this house showing for an hour”, and then okay, and then you seal the plates uo, and then you send them off to the lab, and then you- I mean, the rule state mark it’s kind of aggressive, so people, you may to like, try to hold the house, I don’t know if- you know, and this is- I don’t know how to advise you on that part but-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: If you like it, you would just- you’d bet on it and then in the auction period you could always pull back.

Evan Brand: Oh, there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Everyone has a one week auction period, in this- in U.S. at least.

Evan Brand: Okay, good. So if you have the auction period, then that’ll give you enough time to send your plates back to the lab, and then if the levels are just insane, or we see like stachybotrys, black mold, we see mucor, mucor usually indicates active water leak-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s the water damage one, mucor.

Evan Brand: Yeah, mucor, yeah. Uh, so- so, based on the report, you could decide, “Is this the house I love enough to proceed and fog and remediate, or is this a house that’s so bad there could be undiscovered water damage and leaks and etc., that you don’t wanna get into. ‘Cause the worst thing that could happen is, you pull the trigger on something else and then that other place makes you sicker than where you’re at now.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, worst case scenario, you just tell the inspector, “Hey inspector”, let’s just really- I would even get a mold remediation personnel to- to really inspect as well if you like the house and just make sure they bring a good moisture meter to assess everything. And it could just be as- as simple as,”Hey, we gotta just maybe negotiate uh, an upgrade on the a- a- dehumidifier whole house”.

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s- that’s a good call, yeah. [Crosstalk]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: …and then you fog it.

Evan Brand: Put that in your- your bordering.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, exactly. Well, anything else you wanted to highlight today on today’s uh, topic here Evan. I think we got a lot of different things addressed.

Evan Brand: No, we did great. I don’t know what the heck all you went into so you probably discuss other good stuff before I joined in, but uh, we’ll just send people back to the websites if they do wanna reach out. We can help talk you this further, uh, please reach out to Justin at his site, justinhealth- so, and you could schedule a consult anywhere around the world, and for me, if you wanna reach out,, and we look forward to talk with you again next week.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we offer the plate testing as well for all of our patients and people outside of uh- our patient network. Click below to get our links if you wanna get some of the plate testing, and then talk to us on the interpretation side of what that looks like. And then uhm, the next thing will be, if you wanna get some of the natural solutions to address some of the mold, the whole house fogging, some- I even have the laundry detergent, I did all my laundry yesterday in the uh, mold- anti mold laundry detergent as well just to- to be on the safe side. So I just kinda run like one cycle a close a month through that, just to be on the safe side.

Evan Brand: Yup, that’s what we’re doing too.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup. And we’re gonna have the links below, so if you guys wanna get any of those products or support the show we appreciate it, we wanna give you guys as many tools as possible so you guys can live an optimal life and have an optimal energy and focus and be pain-free. We appreciate you guys being part of the podcast. Thumbs up, give us a like, give us comments down below, we really appreciate you guys being a part of the show.

Evan Brand: Take care, see you later.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Take care Evan, bye.


Addressing Mold and Mycotoxins in your House | Podcast #217

Mold in the house is a big problem. The issues it brings are sometimes mistakenly diagnosed to be linked with things other than molds. To address these issues, functional medicine, then, guides you to the walk of a wounded healer.

In today’s podcast, Dr. Justin Marchegiani and Evan Brand discuss how they are addressing their own mold issues. This update highlights the non-toxic products and cost-effective means that address the underlying mold issues that Evan Brand has been going through. Also, listen as they discuss how Dr. J’s own personal journey approached the same issue through moisture readings, scrubbers, pre-imposed test on the house air, dry fogging and many more. Continue or more. Sharing is caring!

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

06:51    Mold as the Rabbit Hole of Functional Medicine

12:55    Steps to Know if you have a Moldy House

18:11    Do all the Foundational Things Right

19:39    Cautions and Reminders to “Doing it Yourself”

26:14    Preventative Maintenance Protocol


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there, it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani. Today’s podcast, we’re gonna do a little mold update, we’re gonna talk about how we are addressing our own mold issues. Evan, how’s the mold issue that we’ve been keeping everyone update on? I actually found out, I have some mold behind my stove. So, not good news, but we are remedying it, we are on top of it and we’re gonna share a little bit about our journeys. And again, Evan and I see patients from all over the world that actually have mold issues. So, because this is happening to us and our families, we researched, we- finding out some of the- the more non-toxic products, the more cost-effective means to be addressed in this issue. So, we’re really excited to share the solution with everyone.

Evan Brand: Yeah, it’s the best thing to suffer, because then you have the best solutions, you know? I was told that I would have to take pharmaceutical drugs for my gut issues, and I would have to take acid-blocking medications, and I would have to take Alinia and Mebendazole and all these drugs for my parasites, but instead, with your advice, I was able to get rid of my parasite infections using herbs. So, I just love to basically challenge the status quo, and I love to just deny, deny, deny the conventional options because now even with all these mold illness, you know, people are saying, “You have to do Dr. Ritchie Shoemaker’s protocol”, which is a bunch of different pharmaceuticals like taking these resins, like cholestyramine-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: -and doing all nasal antibiotic sprays. And I don’t wanna do any of that crap. So, I’m gonna prove that wrong, and maybe I’m stubborn, and maybe I’ll fail, but I’m gonna try to prove it wrong and do this natural way just like I did everything else.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it totally makes sense. So, let me get people a little update on my situation and then we’ll come back and we’ll follow-up on yours, that sound good?

Evan Brand: Sounds good.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So, in general, last week, we’re having a frozen pipe issue addressed, there was no leakage in the pipe but we have to go in to uh- underneath the cabinet and put some extra insulation around that pipe. In the process, we saw some mold on the- in between cabinet board and the outer side of the drywall. So, most of the molds have actually sandwiched in between the cabinet and the outer part of the drywall. And there was a little bit of mold inside but not much, and then the back wall, where the outside of the house was, there was no mold. So it seemed to be sandwiched between the cabinet and the outer dry wall and uh- and uh- maybe- f- maybe 70 or 80% less mold on the inner drywall. So, it seems like some kind of a water leak must have happened in the past. Could’ve just been water that went down in between, there could’ve just been not enough uhm, adhesant, or sealer, or cement, you know, that uhm- that you seal the cabinet with or you seal the uhm- the various tile up against the wall, it could’ve been that sealer was just- lo- loose and wider overtime, accumulated down there, it could’ve been the vent pipe on top of the- the stove, could have some flushing issues there. So, my mold guys are coming in tomorrow to- to break down that wall behind the cabinet and look and see what’s going on and assess it. Based on going in there and looking at the moisture readings, the moisture readings are all very low in that area. So, based on the low-moisture, it doesn’t seem like it is an active leak. Of course, if it’s a flushing issue, it could only happen when it rains. There- there is that, but you’ll think there be some level of high moisture. So, what we’re doing is just making sure- the- the cabinet’s we’d already had re-sealed because we have a uhm- you know, a kitchen remodel done, but now that it’s exposed, we’re gonna be coming in there now, we’re gonna be uh- trying to assess the root underlying issue as much as possible and rectifying it whether it’s a flushing issue, whether it’s just the sealant behind the stove. Obviously, all that will be addressed either way. So, now, we’re gonna go in there, any visible mold we’re gonna hit, and we’re gonna topically get it with hydrogen peroxide and acetic acid which is like an apple cider vinegar mix formula to kill it. And this kind of formula is non-toxic which is great, and it will kill that mold on contact. We’ll gonna have it all remediated in a negative-air environment, so the air- so the mold spores do not go systemic around the house. I’ve been Scrubbers on the last 5 days, so it’s keeping the- the air pretty darn filtered. And we’re also doing a pre-imposed test on air and plate so I can assess the quality in the house. So, that’s really important number 1, and then kind of to finish everything off, we have a special herbal ss- essential oil-based solution that’s kind of tangerine, lemon, grapefruit seed extract, ___[04:16], it’s a product called CitruSafe that we have links for below, some of the products that we are now starting that- to promote because we’re looking at finding the most effective yet also non-toxic. Some of the more conventional products can leave almost like a- a residue or leave a metabolite behind that says, as virulent, or as reactive as the mold was originally. So, a lot of people who are sensitive can have problems. And again-

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -so, this is kind of where we’re at right now with this kind of 3-step solution, actually 4-step. We’re figuring out where the mold is, identifying how that moisture got there, 3, we’re killing it in a negative containment, negative air environment so it doesn’t spread. Number 4, we’re doing it the whole thing, with Scrubbers on in the background that keep that air clean. And then number 5, we are topically using the essential oil fogging solution afterwards. And we do the Dry Fog. Dry Fog seems to be the best because the Dry Fog gets to a- a size in about 1 to 10 microns that’s small enough to get in between baseboards and in between, uhm, really hard area. So, mold that maybe hiding behind the board or hiding behind certain things will still get touched and hit by it, so we have the best ability to kill whatever’s going on there.

Evan Brand: Yeah, and the good thing is for you guys, that… err.. unless we just don’t know yet because you haven’t been in the house too long, but, your family seems to be doing pretty good, you all don’t seem to have any major symptoms.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly, no major issues. Now, the difference is, once that mold is now exposed, we all know that kind of moves around. So, we scrubbed it, we’ve done our best, we’re doing pre-imposed air, pre-imposed testing on the plates. So, we’re doing our best to quantify what’s going on, and then we’re gonna be doing the Dry Fog throughout the entire house. So, my whole entire house, all the ventilation, all the drywall in my kitchen area, out- after it’s been fully killed, and then we’re also gonna be doing a- and the HVAC or- there’s a little bit of mold on some of the 2×4’s, uh, which is common. Anyone that gets the house built brand new, most uh, people are gonna have mold on their 2×4’s. I’ve had a- I’ve spoken to people with the mold companies where patients or people have requested like “Hey, I want none molding 2×4’s”, and the- the builders can’t even accommodate that. So-

Evan Brand: Oh my God.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So, I know people who basically said, “Hey, uhm, let’s choose all the boards that we’re gonna use for the house”, and they would just show up that day with a little sprayer and they would just spray it down with the 28% hydrogen peroxide and just kill it all, but then you’re good to go.

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s the hard part is, you know, even during construction, right? If the house gets rained on during construction, if it doesn’t dry out in 48 hours which it’s never going to around here in Kentucky ’cause it rains so damn much, then you start building up and putting walls around those 2×4’s that are still wet. So, just like us, we moved in to a brand-new home with a mold problem, right? So, people may say, “Oh, my house is new, and my apartment’s new, or my condo’s new”, “new” doesn’t mean that it’s clean. And, same goes with the age, you can have a 10-year-old, 20-year-old house that’s pe- perfectly perfect. So, it’s- that’s the hard thing. Uh, there was a question here which I think is relevant to bring up now, which this question, uh, from somebody on YouTube comments says, “Does mold still qualify as a functional medicine rat hole, or is there something about mold toxicity that you can identify from the GetGo, when diagnosing a patient?”. I’ll just tell you with my own personal story, yes, mold is sort of a, I like to term “rabbit hole” rather than “rat hole”-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes, yes.

Evan Brand: But, but yes, I would say, mo- mold is a “rabbit hole” because it’s the great mimicker just like lyme disease, meaning, I had blood pressure spikes, I had heart palpitations which did get resolved after I got my cavitation surgery, my heart palpitations disappeared. But I still had blood pressure issues, I still had cold hands, cold feet circulation problems, my sleep was terrible, I had random rashes, I had brain fog, I had some joint pain, I had some anxiety issues just like this weird sympathetic overdrive for no reason, and that was all mold. So, you can go by looking at all the symptoms but ultimately you have to test your environment which is like the plates that Justin has discussed. I’m giving the plates to every single new client now. Every single new client that comes in, we say, “Hey, we’re gonna do your functional medicine test, we’re also gonna do plates and we test your house”. Just like standard protocol now, and then we test your urine, if the budget allows, we run the urinary mycotoxin panel so we can look at the body and see what is the accumulation of bile toxins. For me, I grew up in my grandmother’s house which flooded. As a kid, I remember she had box fenced down there trying to dry out the basement, and have like a 2 ft. of water down there. That place had mold, so, long story short, if you do a mold-urine test, that is your whole lifetime accumulation, that’s not just current. And that’s why I think it’s important ’cause what if your environment’s clean now but you lived in a moldy house a year ago or 5 years ago, or 10 years ago, you could still have the accumulation in your toxin bucket.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So that’s good to know that those tests are more of accumulation. My biggest concern is, healthy people that aren’t reacting to mold maybe just naturally detoxifying it from their environment and not be reacting to it-

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -that’s my only concern, right? Is how do you- how do you, ugh, differentiate and draw the line between people that have a- a body borne of mold and people that are just naturally getting exposed to it and re- and re- uhm removing it, remediating it from their environment to their natural detoxification, ’cause we know, you’re going to a forest, I mean, part of the reason why leaves don’t stack up to infinities, ’cause hey, they decay and they produce mold as a result. So, you going out to a forest, you’re gonna get, ___[09:51], basically exposed to mold as well.

Evan Brand: Yeah, well that’s why I would go hiking and I would get super dizzy in the woods, right? I didn’t know, I mean, I love hiking so much but I didn’t realize it was making me sick until this whole mold thing. To answer your question, I do have the an- the answer to that because I asked, uh, William Shaw over at GreatPlains at question. I said, “Okay, so, let’s say you- you take a buddy of mine, my friend Justin, he’s not symptomatic at all, if he’s living and/or near mold, is his urine test gonna show mold?”. And he says, “Not necessarily” because if your body is making the antibodies to work on the mold, your body will push it out, and your mold test should show nothing. Well, my test- my genetics are not as good as yours for mold, my test show tons of mold. You and I could live in the same environment, I may show high, and you may not ’cause you’re detoxing it and I’m not.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But why wouldn’t it show up in the urine, because isn’t the urine part of a natural detoxification system, for eliminating mold?

Evan Brand: Yes, that is true but- [crosstalk]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: …why you wouldn’t see something there?

Evan Brand: You could see something but you’re not gonna see it off the chart. It’s because for me, what I did was the glutathione challenge test where I did a few days ago. If I have to mobilize it, so, because my uh- levels were so off the charts, the idea, and this is not all black and white but the idea is that I’ve probably had mold in my brain, my kidneys, everywhere else, and the glutathione pushed it out of the hiding spots, whereas you, you don’t have any hiding spots. Yeah you probably still have some baseline urinary excretion, but probably not an off the charts excretions like I had.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and I think anytime you do a mold test, I think it’s good to do that glutathione pushed. It’s kinda like doing a heavy metal test, urine and doing like a DMS or DMPS, uh, doing it like a challenge product. So, you can kinda get more a tissue burden, I think it allows you get more of a- a whole body burden if you add some type of a- a glutathione Calpol to it.

Evan Brand: Yeah, and the- the reason that glutathione is the best at least in my reading, is because mold depletes glutathione. Now, interestingly enough though, I did an organic acid test, and my glutathione according to the oh, look somewhat decent, but I’ll tell you, I don’t feel well if I take too much glutathione. So, I know that I probably am at a deficient state. Maybe a functional deficient state where, maybe the test doesn’t show it, but when I take glutathione, I can feel that I’m mobilizing toxins with it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: E- exactly. And again, you’re in a high level of function, I mean, you’re seeing patients, you’re doing a lot of deep- deep level thinking, so I mean, potentially if you have lower glutathione, that- that may have even worse or more exacerbated, right?

Evan Brand: I’m uh- yeah, I mean, you’re right, I’m so glad that my symptoms are more related to dizziness and blood pressure and all that, and then my cognitive function is still good because I would hate not to be able to be helping people throughout this. Luckily, I’m still grateful that even with the symptoms I have had, I’ve still been able to work. Where many people, they can’t work, and they have to go on, you know, if you talk with J.W., many people say they go on disability, they’re living with family members and friends because their house is too moldy, but, luckily, I didn’t have to do that. You know, we did stay in the hotel for about a month, but that hotel is moldy too, I still had problems there. That’s the hard part, is, where is your safe place?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: And the answer [crosstalk].

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Now, my perspective about it is this. It’s like number 1, I wanna do a deep timeline and find out, number 1, is there any visible mold where it dry- you know, stai- w- water stains on the ceiling or drywall stains, number 1, can you visualize any mold? Number 2, any history of water damage in the house? If you can answer negatively to those, that’s- that’s step 1. Step 2 is do you feel better when you’re out of the house? If you’re at a better environment and it’s not like you’re just on a beach having a vacation, meaning, you’re outside of the house, and you’re still doing better, uh, you’re doing better outside of the house, and that’s consistent, that’s another sign there could be mold. And then number 3, is let’s work on some of the foundational diet and lifestyle things, do some of the functional tests, see if we start to move the needle and start improving. If we start improving with some of those things, and that’s a good sign that there could be other, let’s just say, higher priorities on the list, so we’re gonna go after those first. Those are the first 3. And then of course in between there, forever in doubt, we may wanna do some of the mold plate testing to at least get a baseline and see what’s going on. And if we don’t have any area that specifically target, right? That’s where doing some of these essential oils dry fogging could be helpful, and I would only do that if we have some plate testing that’s showing some higher levels, and maybe we’re just finding that we feel better when we’re outside of the house.

Evan Brand: Yeah, well said. And remember, you and I used to have this conversation where I was upstairs in my office working and I felt fine, and then I would come downstairs to the dinner table, and that’s when I would get a blood pressure spike, and it was because my dinner table area in the kitchen was right where the crawl space issue was and that’s where the vents were, and the bad air from the crawlspace came into the living area. So, all day at work upstairs I had a separate heating and cooling system up there that did not have mold, I felt fine, and then I come into the moldy environment, eat dinner, and then I would feel bad. So, yeah, it may even be a difference of room. When I sleep in this bedroom versus that bedroom, I feel better. Or, when I go to work at the office, I feel worse, and then when I come home I feel better. Well, then, your- your office, you’re work environment, could be a source too. Someone’s working at, let’s say at old moldy building like a courthouse in their city, that probably a moldy building and then you gotta try to find remedies to still keep your job. Maybe you have a portable HEPA air purifier on your desk to pump good air into your face, maybe that’s all you could do in certain situations. Teachers, schools are very bad, schools are notoriously moldy. If you’re a teacher in the moldy school, you gotta try to hack that situation-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, I know, I mean, if that was me, I would probably bring a fogger in and just fog it really fast without anyone knowing, just to be on the safe side of having really good air filter. What’s your take on it?

Evan Brand: Yeah, if I was a teacher and I had moldy classroom, on a Friday afternoon, I would just stay a little la- a little extra after hours, I’d fog the classroom, leaves, so, over the weekend that fog is that doing its job. Put the fogger on a timer, so after the x amount of hours or whatever, it just shuts off, and then Monday morning, you come in and then you got a cleaned- you got a clean room. The problem is, of you don’t have like a window unit in your classroom, ’cause we have a lot of teachers, you know, I have teachers as clients, I know you do too, uh, if you have like a single unit, you could probably fix it, but if you’re on like a central system where the entire school is connected to some giant HVAC room, that fogging is only gonna buy you time until that HVAC central kicks on again, throws more spores back in your classroom.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and again, ye- we have- you should be having like if you’re in a school like that, the newer schools probably run almost like a hospital level of filtration, right? The newer ones?

Evan Brand: Hopefully so. I don’t know.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hopefully. I know, that’s the [crosstalk] situation- that’s the tough situation there. But at least you can have an air filter in your classroom and maybe talk to the school, see if you can get the whole HVAC system, you know, uhm, fogged. It doesn’t take much to fog it, you know [crosstalk]…

Evan Brand: No, [crosstalk]… and the co- and the cost is not that bad and, you know, if we talk about how this problem of mold affects society, I mean, we’ve seen- uhm one of the- one of the biggest symptoms of people getting re-exposed to mold, is suicide. It’s suicidal thoughts.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: And, think about all the suicides we’re seeing-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: -how much of that is linked to mold. Obviously, pharmaceutical drugs and media and all that, so don’t say, “Evan said, it’s all mold”, no, I didn’t say that, I’m saying it’s a factor. And I’ll tell you, when I went to this moldy building, I went to go get my driver’s license changed out, I went to the old courthouse like down the road, after I came back-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: -from that- that courthouse-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm-hmm.

Evan Brand: -I was sweating, my blood pressure was spiking, and I just had a super big wave of depression and anxiety for no reason, I just felt miserable and terrible. And that was me getting re-exposed to mold. So, I know from a mental health perspective, this is huge. And how many times is your psychiatrist saying, “Hey, I think your problem is mold”, they’re never saying that. They’re saying, “Oh, this is a problem with your marriage”. Well, when I talk with J.W., he said the number 1 and 2 problems people have when they’re exposed to mold, number 1, financial problems, number 2, marriage problems, ’cause if you’re sick, you’re not gonna be as happy, your family members are gonna have to deal with you being sick. I see how it could strain marriages and relationships. There’s your counselor or therapist bring up mold in your house is the cause of your marriage issue? Absolutely not. But they should be ’cause this is a huge factor, this is a smoking gun. For so many problems that we see, but nobody knows.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. Now, my perspective on it is this: is not everyone is genetically succinct- or super sensitive to mold. I- I know I am not, at least right now. Number 2, there’s the idea of having a stress bucket, so, the better you do other things in your life, diet, blood sugar stability, keeping inflammation down, keeping external exposure to toxins down, that’s gonna make a bigger difference, so then when you are exposed to mold, i- it may be the less of an issue versus if you’re carrying 50 or hundred pounds overweight, you’re inflamed, your diet’s poor, your sleep’s poor, you’re over under excising, those things are gonna add to your stress bucket without mold may be an issue versus if you have everything lined up, the mold may not be an issue, may be more of a speed bump than a s- than a stop sign. So-

Evan Brand: Don’t say…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -the first thing is, I think anyone that has any potential mold issues, do all the foundational things right. See how much that moves the needle. Uh, person on the Q&A question list has a really good pertinent question, they wrote, uh, “How can you find if there is a mold inside the ceiling separating 2 floors. One of our kids let the water run ’till it poured to the kitchen ceiling spotlights”. [Crosstalk] I would- I would say number 1, if you have the root cause addressed, meaning, you know how the water got there, that’s good, right? So, don’t repeat number 1. Number 2, if you can see water in the spotlight, I would definitely cut out anything you can visibly see, I would at least have a mold remediator come in, open the ceiling up and at least spray anything in there that they can topically get with the hydrogen peroxide solution, and then fog the rest and then put clean, drywall up where the water spots were.

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s good- [crosstalk], that’s good advice, yeah, and- you know, definitely have somebody if you’re gonna try to do it yourself, you’d wanna have a mask on, you don’t wanna try to, disturb a wall cavity, uh, and make yourself or your kids sick, so you wanna have the proper, uh, PPE, the personal protection equipment if you are gonna try to do any that work on your own, it sounds like there’s probably not an ongoing water or moisture problem, I would still look into getting a uh, portable humidity monitor to check your house. So, make sure your humidity level’s below 50%. And then what you could do too if you have somebody cut open the uh, the wall cavity, you could always just throw a plate in there, just for curiosity’s sake, and if you do have any symptoms or any of your children have symptoms, you know, put a- put a plate in your master bedroom, put a plate in your kid’s room, just make sure your sleeping areas are covered. That goes directly into this other question here from someone that says, “Is there a range delivered in the report to indicate an overgrowth that needs to be remediated?”. In other words, is there a safe amount? Yes. For the plate, we’re talking about the company we’re using, you have a “health score”, 0 to 4 is normal. Some mold in the environment is normal, you’re probably never gonna get to 0, but when you go 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 96, like my issue was, then you have a problem. That’s when you know you need to remediate it, so, 4 and below, generally, you’re okay.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and the big areas to look will be obviously the roof to make sure there’s no leakage there. And, for the most part, like you’re gonna see, if there’s an active leak, you’re gonna see some level of exposure. I think you saw a lot of depthness in your attic, right? You’d a big pool of water in your attic?

Evan Brand: I did. Yeah, and-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh.

Evan Brand: -that was from the uh- the dripping. It was dripping from the uh, from the rafters.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So, you saw water and moisture in the attic, and, most people with an active leak, they would see on the drywall, they’d see on the roof of the ceiling. If you don’t see it, and there was other major vectors haven’t addressed, and you’re still concerned because of high level of plate testing. I mean, I would a mold personnel with a good moisture meter to check all the major areas for moisture, higher levels of moisture, you can even do the infrared heating to assess cold and hot spots. And then once that’s been addressed, if there’s no major issues, then that’s where I think just the fogging would be the next logical step throughout the whole house.

Evan Brand: And- and uh, one other point is like apartments and condos and hotels and all that, you know, these are places to have multiple units. So, for example in the hotel we were staying at, there was a huge water spot that looked like mold above our hotel room, and we asked the staff about it, and they said, “Oh yeah, you know, the dishwasher overflowed above you guys on the 2nd or 3rd floor whatever it was”, like, “get us out of this hotel room”. So, we moved to another hotel room, it took me to go to 3 different rooms in the same building before I could sleep through the night. And my wife, she was waking up too, she had terrible sleep, our daughter had terrible sleep, so we just kept moving hotel rooms until we found one that was clean. So, if you live in a place where you got somebody above you or below you, what if they are not as careful about their dishwasher, or shower, or sink, or whatever, and they have a plumbing issue, their plumbing issue then becomes your plumbing issue because it’s affecting your breathable air.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly, exactly, that makes so much sense. So, in general, can you smell mold? I mean, I can just tell you like, I’ve been in moldy houses where you can smell that moldiness, but I can tell you, when we have that visible mols, I could not smell that. Could you smell mold in your house?

Evan Brand: No, we did not smell it, and-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: – it was not visible. We couldn’t see it and we couldn’t smell it. That’s why it’s like the invisible assassin. And uh, they say, when we say “the”, we’re talking to mold experts that Justin and I consult with, the experts say, “When you smell mold, it’s a very, very, very bad problem at that point”.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s a very bad issue. But, in general, it’s just the plate testing’s simple and cheap. So if anyone’s watching to- to reach out to my office, we’ll put information below where you can just email me and we can get you that. Same thing if you’re listening to Evan’s, check below and you can reach out to Evan directly and we can give you access to some of that testing. But that’s a good first spot, and if you had health issues and not there’s like no water spots, there’s no active leak, uhm, there’s no major issue off the bat, there’s no timeline history in and around water damage, or with the house, don’t worry about it off the bat. Don’t- just focus on the foundational things yet, and then we can always do a little bit of cheaper testing in the meantime to see if there’s an issue, but work on the foundation ’cause sometimes that can move the nail so much and it can take so much stress booze out of your stress bucket and allow you to heal significantly.

Evan Brand: Yeah, you make a good point, you know, I’ve done all the foundational work, gut, adrenals, etc., so, my diet’s dialed in. I’ve done everything which is probably why I stayed afloat, because when I talk with Dr. Shaw at the lab about my report, he goes, “Dude”, he didn’t say “Dude”, but he was like, “This is very high”. And I was like, “Well, luckily, I’m just dizzy and have blood pressure problems because I’ve still been able to work, versus if I didn’t have all the other, you know, 10 years of, you know, herbs and adaptogens and all that in my system, maybe I would’ve collapsed further and had further health problems.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, you may not have been functional and being able to help all the patient to do all that, but it’s great, it’s good to walk the journey of the wounded healer. I feel, like for me, this is been a such a great journey ’cause I’m gonna be so much more, you know, when you take a crash course when you deal with the experts and you get concentrated, actionable information, it’s so much more valuable that just popping your head and do a book, or watching the documentary because you’re- you’re getting actionable steps to fix the issue. It’s not fluff or theoretical nonsense if you will.

Evan Brand: Yeah, you know, and- and that was the same thing when I knew, uh, that you were gonna be having your first kid, I thought, “Oh, this is so exciting because I was gonna be alone on the parenting journey and now, you’re a dad, with your son, and I’m a dad with my daughter. And then same thing with this mold issue, I was like on this road alone, and then now you found your issues, so I’m partially kind of glad that this happening to you-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: [Laughs]

Evan Brand: -because now, I’m like, “Yes, now he gets to empathize and now he understands what I had to go through to fix it”, so-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s a good journey, and you know, I think most people. And here’s the hard part, right? Is people listening, “___[25:31], oh my God!”. Like, “I don’t just have any water spots”, “I don’t think I have any damage”, “I feel like I’m gonna have to tear my house down to go figure out what’s going on”, don’t worry about that. Uh, ge- get the plate testing, if you can’t see anything visibly if you- if you know your roof’s good, if you know those things that the common areas are kinda dialed in and there’s no leaking, nothing visible, then, the easiest first thing is get- get a little bit of testing for your house on start there. And then number 2, we can always move to just a simple, systemic, kinda dry fogging solution that’s totally essential oil based, non-toxic, that’d be the first natural step and, we talked with some people at the labs, they even do this kinda once a year, once every couple of years on their house anyway, just kinda for preventative as well.

Evan Brand: Yeah, and we have one comment here, and then we can wrap up, uh, guy put, “We had a major wind storm that rolled through with 70 mile per hour winds, causing a lot of roofs shingles to be blown off. Time to examine those roofs for leaks”. Yes, it is time, I would get a plate, put it up in your attic, I guarantee your attic could have potentially a roof leak or mold, and that’s not to freak you out or cause panic, it’s just to say the reality is very high. The- even the uh- the EPA, the environmental protection agency in some of these major government entities say that 1 in 3 homes has a water event every year. So, the- this water problem is huge, water, moisture, equals mold. So this is like a huge epidemic that has just way underdiagnosed.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I’m putting on my- my kind of like preventative maintenance protocol for my house is, to get my roof looked at preventably once a year. Just to have someone go up there, check all the flashing, check any pipes, check any area where there could be something, I mean, my roof is like 3 year- it’s only 3 years old. So, it’s relatively brand new. [Crosstalk]

Evan Brand: When- when Jeff came to my house to do the fog, uh, he went up in the attic, which we’re gonna turn into a playroom and he said, “Evan, there’s a lot of staining on this plywood up here…”, he said, “…this scares me, get a roof around here”, and the roofer came, and he said, this looks like it was a water event from when the roof got put on. He says this is not a current leak.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: So, the staining we’re concerning, but luckily, you know, it was not a red light.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So, it’s not an active issue, then you just fog it, and- and leave it alone, right?

Evan Brand: Yup. Exactly.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: ‘Cause there could be a water stain and there’s no active, you know, if you can’t visualize the mold on there, then you just stain it, or you just do the fog on it and then you’re pretty go.

Evan Brand: Yeah, he did a peroxide on a couple spots ’cause they looked a little scary, but he said no, this is fine, so.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So, I think when in doubt, right? You just peroxide it, and then- and then fog it afterwards.

Evan Brand: Yup, absolutely. And this is the stuff that we like people to do it on them- with the- you know, DIY sure but when we say hydrogen peroxide, that’s not your standard 3%. This is very potent like 30+ percent that’s been diluted to the mid-10 to mid-20% hydrogen peroxide that would really burn you, and it will really hurt you. So, don’t just like, “I heard this podcast, I’m gonna go fix my house”, no, please like, speak with Justin, speak with me, speak with some of our friends and experts because this is something that, you know, you may wanna have expert help. I don’t want you going and “oh, let me open up this wall panel”, and then to get hit in the face with black mold and you end up in the- you know, in the hospital, or so.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and if you do visualize it, you- if you wanna kill it, you wanna do it in a negative air containment so the- it does not go systemic. So, if you visualize it, if it’s like, you know, on the outside of the wall, then you know it’s a bad thing, right? But you’d wanna have a, you know, take off, or bagged off, while you’re waiting to get a mold person up there, and then they would address it in a negative kinda containment environment with the right type of uh, respiration and the right type of uhm, type of material to- to- to shoot out that hydrogen peroxide in a way so they don’t get burnt. So, you wanna have some expert do that as well. And for me, this gonna have them do the fogging as well because, why not, they’re already doing 80% of the job, I’d- I’ll have them do the whole- the whole hundred percent.

Evan Brand: Yup, absolutely.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: One thing I would say, maybe if uhm- if there’s no active issues and you wanna do it from a preventative standpoint, where, hey, there’s no active leaks, there’s nothing I’m trying to hit specifically, I just wanna do a general dry fog, I think that would be doable by yourself. I know you and uhm, you and the other expert did it together, right?

Evan Brand: Yeah, Jeff. Yeah, he- he- basically showed me the ropes but, I let him handle it all because I was so overwhelmed with moving and, I was living out of a suitcase for a month, so I just said, you know, well, I’m just gonna- just have him do it for me and it turned out to about a dollar per square foot, uhm versus some of the other enzyme based treatments I’ve previously discussed on the podcast was around 5 dollars per square foot. So, significant difference in cost, but we’re seeing just as good, if not, better results.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, exactly. And I think, if you buy it, it’s way cheaper than that, ’cause I know, with my house…

Evan Brand: Yeah, if you buy it- yeah, if you buy it, I think he said around 50 cents a square foot.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Yup. So, you’re looking at 50 cents a square foot, I would even say potentially a little bit less than that. I think you can get it down to, yeah, 50, 40 cents a square foot, makes about sense, totally.

Evan Brand: One comment on here, “If we built homes with solid concrete, we may not have this mold issue? Hmmm, maybe. But a lot of concrete holds moisture, and moisture creates mold, so. Uh, I’ve heard of plenty of different cases speaking with the lab where they’d have concrete walls in the basement that are absolutely covered in mold. So, uh, it sounds good in theory. There are other building materials that are better, but there is no like, sure all, ’cause there’s houses in the middle of the desert that- that J.W. has seen that are moldy, so-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: E- exactly, and then, you know, if you have, let’s just say you can’t make a whole house out of uhm, concrete. You know, Edison back in the 1920’s I think was trying to do that, really interesting. But, eventually, you’re gonna have some type of a break and then moisture will get in there, mold will form at a- at a acute, you know, at a level when you can’t see it and you may have high levels of moisture in the basement, so that’s where I think the fogging is- is really good, either way, just having a really good HVAC system in there. Uhm, like when we put our basement in, we’re like, “Uh, should we put an HVAC in them like, heck yeah”, ’cause I wanna have really good air circulation and really good control over the environment down there-

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -keep the humidity low, and to keep the air- air moving in a way. So, it’s not- the- the more that air just sits, if you get moisture in there, it’s more likely to mold versus, you know, dry up and evaporate.

Evan Brand: Yeah, absolutely. Well, let’s wrap this thing up, but, uh, in terms of consultations, if you wanna reach out to Justin and get help, you know, we noticed a lot of clients get better on our protocols that we use for the gut because we’re using a lot of anti-fungal herbs. We see a lot of fungus show up on stool test, so, fungus in your home equals fungus in your body which is why people dose- do so well on our protocols. So, if you wanna reach out, you can get a hold of Justin at his site, justinhealth- Reach out for a consult, we love helping people across the world, if you wanna get in touch with me, the website is, and we’ll send the lab test to your house. So, if you reach out, say, “Hey Justin”, or “Hey Evan, I’ve got this problem”, we send the test to your house, whether we’re talking plates, urine test, or looking at your home, or looking at your body, that’s done, for anywhere in the world, literally, and then we get a protocol together. So, you know, yes, you could do a lot of these on your own, is it better to have a “tour guide” so to speak who’s been through it, yes, it is. Am I biased to say that? Yes. But I hire people to help me. So, I think having a teammate is helpful especially ’cause this topic gets overwhelming quickly.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly, 100%. Well, today was a really great I think podcast, actionable information. I think if anyone’s dealing with these issues is gonna, hopefully it make it seem a little bit more simpler, a little bit more bite sized, give you some good non-toxic solutions to address the issue and- just get- and maybe just one part of your- kinda healing health journey.

Evan Brand: Absolutely. Well, you all take good care and we’ll be back with more updates on this whole mold topic soon.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Thanks so much and give us the thumbs up, uh share, and leave your comments below. We wanna get your feedback on it and we’ll go up through there and try to answer some of y’all questions. You guys have a phenomenal day, thanks for listening.

Evan Brand: Take care, see ya.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Take care, bye.


Creating a Healthy Home | Podcast #201

We all care so much about the sense of wellness around our home. But sometimes no matter the cleaning that we do, we wonder why we still feel not comfy, and healthy. Chances are, we’re missing out important details – details on molecular levels.

Today’s podcast talks about molds, air filters, the scents that we wear, even the healthiness of waters we drink. Watch this video as Dr. J and Evan Brand give us the geeky advice in creating a healthy home.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

01:15    Mold Issues

02:41    Air Filters and Paints

14:30    Bug Sprays

16:49    Chemicals in Water

20:02    Air Filter Systems

27:10    Enhancing Detoxification

32:23    All About Scents


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there! It’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani, Evan how we doing today my friend?

Evan Brand: Life is good! Look, it’s like 88 degrees in October this is unreal in Kentucky everybody is like freekin‘ out, but– I’m loving every second of it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent man! Love to hear it. So, what’s going on? any other updates for me on the health front? Let’s cook ’em.

Evan Brand: Hmm… Not too much is cooking I’m still working on my course as you know our time these days is so valuable and limited that its– I had this idea in my head like I was gonna get this thing done by the fall and then here it’s comin’ out on the fall and I don’t have it done. So, I know we’ve chattered off here about our– our courses that we’re working on and we just have to make time to do it. But that’s my only update and in terms of projects everything else is just– stay busy with the clinic and us keeps spreading the– spreading the good word, I mean, we get so much good feedback that I know we’re on to something great and we need to keep goin’ until– I don’t know when, I– I don’t see an expiration date for– for– for when our hustle stops.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I hundred percent agree with that, that make sense to me. So, we chat about in the pre uh– show here that we wanna chat more about kind of healthy home, creating a healthy environment, air water and such, uh– in that realm so, why we don’t dive in? Go ahead.

Evan Brand: Yeah. So, the reason I– I brought this topic up is because I had a guy who– uh– came to me for his wife’s health issues and what he noticed is that everytime they left the house, her symptoms would get a little bit better. So, even if they went to the grocery store for an hour, if they went to their parent’s house for a night or two, you know his wife’s joint pain, her brain fall, her energy levels her symptoms would all change, it would get significantly better. We’re talkin’ 60-70% better just by leaving her house, okay. So, some would say well maybe that’s EMF, maybe that’s magnetic fields, maybe that’s charged electricity, maybe it’s this or that. And turns out it was a mold issue. And so they had mold in their basement that they weren’t aware of–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh huh…

Evan Brand: –and I guess that mold was circulating throughout the whole HVAC system they got a test on from the E– E as an Evan, M as in Mary, S as in Sam, L as in Larry. em–, they’re like the mold scientific laboratory. They got a test kit from them and the mold levels in their house were off the chart. And so they’re moving. Because they already had paid somebody to remediate and it didn’t work. So– they just decided to downsize anyway into a smaller house ’cause their house didn’t need the size than it was but now they’re moving, and so hopefully she gets better but man, this just goes to show you, no matter how perfect your supplement protocol is, if you got an environmental–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh huh…

Evan Brand: –issue, like molded home or other toxins in your home maybe bad paints or lead or whatever else, you can still be sick despite having a good supplement protocol and all the lab testing and all that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, hundred percent agree. The couple things that I do with my home is I got a couple of different air filters. I have uh– an advance air– air filter I have uhm— an Air Doctor one as well as a Molekule. So, I have three different air filters and they work really well, keeping the environment good, I mean, for a while, I just didn’t need to even have an air filter in my office and I’m like, “Wait a minute, I’m in this– couple hundred square foot room like most of my life, like let’s make sure the air quality is phenomenals“. That’s one thing I’ve done in the last handful of months to upgrade some of the air filters, get more of them and, that’s made a big difference, I mean I definitely feel like uhm— I’m breathing cleaner air, uhm— you know, you’d walk into– your office and you kinda’ feel like “Hah! I just kinda feels a little bit, you know, just not fresh, you know, not super fresh and that’s really improved which I– I do enjoy that. And then of course, uhm— the water filtration aspects’ great, I mean I have a whole house water filtration set up, as well as a, under the counter reverse osmosis set up with a– a post filter that adds minerals back. And those are the two big things, getting the air right, and getting the water filtration right. I like the whole house, ’cause it takes care of everything, and if I’m in like, you know, upstairs, like in– don’t have to buy shower filters for all the showers like and, just drink out of the water in my– in my bedroom at night if I need to. But I typically, you know, ninety percent’s gonna be consumed through my under the counter reverse osmosis, and it’s doubly filtered right through the whole house and then through the countertop.

Evan Brand: Yeah, your hair, your– skin, your nails, I mean you can see a lot of like, physical improvements too. People say, “Well why is it so important to filter the air?”. Well we hit on like the mold piece, VOCs are another thing, the Air Doctor that you and I both use, uh– that does filter out– VOCs which is great so if you did for some reason have like a toxic paint that’s off-gassing, you can’t filter some of that. Now I would say it’s best if you can go in and use like a mineral-based paint. The one I use is called Romabio— R-O-M-A-B-I-O, they’re out of Georgia–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Ain’t that water-based though?

Evan Brand: oh, it’s potassium. It’s literally like ground-up potassium, and you mix it with water and then you paint it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So it’s water-based

Evan Brand: I guess so, yeah ’cause you mix. It’s half and half.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Evan Brand: You take this bucket they give you, you add water, and then you put it on.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean it’s tough ’cause you go water-based, it definitely doesn’t quite last as long.

Evan Brand: Ahh.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The oil-based paints, they have a lot more VOCs but they get hard. They get really firm afterwards and it becomes more solid so its– you know, double-edged sword. We’re having some painting on this week so– guess what, we’ll be out of the house for the weekend, just we’re– goin’ on a family trip. So– when I’m gonna have my air filters crankin’ anyway and–

Evan Brand: What are you gonna, are you doing any– are you doin’ any special brand or what are you– what are you looking into for paint?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh I just use the standard Sherwin Williams uhm— because it– it works really well and it last long. Cause for me it’s like, there’s gonna be VOCs, but I’m just gonna run the air filtration and keep the windows open.

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And I’m not gonna be in the house so– that way when I’m back, I’m good to go.

Evan Brand: And I don’t know, it’s like cause that stuff’s gonna off-gas after it’s dry, or do you think that the off-gassing is not as much?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: No, it– it’s after 7 days, it’s– it’s done.

Evan Brand: Really?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But I mean having the air filtrations gonna– you now, mitigate it. Cause that, the air filtration will mitigate all the VOCs.

Evan Brand: True. I just was more paranoid than you so I just got the mineral-based stuff. It’s still on the walls so far but if it– if it fails then I’m– I may switch over to something else.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well it depends like if you’re doing wall stuff, water-based paints’ fine. If you’re doing like cabinets, or things that are opening and closing, and getting wear and tear, that’s where you want like, an oil-based paint.

Evan Brand: Okay, we just did walls.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so for like a harder door that’s being opening and– opening and close or cabinets, uh– for your walls I think water-based is probably fine cause you’re not– you know, there’s not wear and tear on the walls.

Evan Brand: Okay, okay, good point. So– so let’s go back to the water piece, you know, I was mentioning like hair skin, nails, you know, we have a lo– a lot of compliments from people that– that do start to filter their water, they’re like “Man! I didn’t know my– my hair would get better”. So for example my wife and I with her skin. In the winter time, we used to put on lotion all the time. Now, I never have to put on lotion. My skin is so much more– I would say regulated I guess with– with– the– the filtered water that we bathe in so I had to recommend it if you don’t have it already if you don’t want to invest in a whole house filter. They’re really not that expensive, they’re, you know– with plumbing, paying a plumber included, maybe a thousand bucks for your whole house. And the one I have from the Pelican System, it last for 5 years before you have to change it so– that’s pretty awesome. But if you don’t wanna do that, you technically could just get the shower filters. Justin and I have talked about different brands, the Berkey one is what I like, the Berkey shower filter. And it reduces I think like 98% of the chlorine and some of the other chemicals.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it, yeah, I mean I thi— I think those are gonna be, you know, very very important kind of things that you can do to help improve health. Now, I mean– with the air you mentioned we have the VOCs that we’re cuttin’ out, we’re also cutting out potential pet danders. Uh– wh– what else are we removing ___[07:20] the air filtration?

Evan Brand: Well, I think the Molekule – correct me if I’m wrong, cause you have one, I do not – is– I believe that thing kills viruses and bacteria too. I do remember reading something on their sales material about killing pathogen so, I mean, not that random people that are sick are coming into your house but if you’re concerned about living in– a place where– you’re– let’s just say you’re having people come in or out, or maybe you’ve got roommates or something, I’d like to have something that kills bacteria and viruses too, and I believe that system does. What about molds? Didn’t they say something about molds’ pores that it can kill too ’cause it’s like a Zepa instead of a Hepa filtration?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah it has this– electrical component to it that– that actually kills a lot of the viruses and a lot of the compounds and it has the– the post-filter afterwards. So it has this component there using light where it kills a lot of these compounds and then it goes to the post-filter. So I mean that’s this interesting new technology so, you know, I have all three of these different kinds of filters. So I’m experimenting and trying them out but, I think it’s something that’s noteworthy; I think a lot of people are using it; also it looks really nice. I like it. It just really– it’s like a nice piece of furniture that sits in the corner and it’s taller and skinnier so– it doesn’t take up a lot of room. A lot of these air filters that look so steril and medical–

Evan Brand: Yes.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: –where it’s like “Oh, man! It’s just appalling seeing it in the corner of your living room”. Uhm–

Evan Brand: [laughs]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But this new– I like this one. And the other ones, we just hide iin the corners in our bedrooms but this looks really great and it does filter out the viruses. There’s this uhm– this– this– light kind of compound to it that really makes a– a big– a big difference. So I mean–

Evan Brand: [interrupts] Okay. So I– [crosstalk]. I wanna chat about testing a little bit you know, people are like okay, “Is my home toxic?”, “what can I do to test?”. Well the – that’s a mold laboratory – I think they also do water testing as well. So just check out and you can actually order test kits from there. They have facilities all across the U.S. and maybe internationally, I’m not too sure on that part, but you can do a mold test. I believe what you do is you collect a bunch of dust, like let’s say on your dresser. You just scoop some dust into this, and you send it off, and they’re gonna let you know what the contents of that are. So that’s the first step in terms of testing. The second step is to test your body. Uh– Justin and I use a test from Great Plains, it’s very good called a MycoTox Panel and you can actually test for Ochratoxin and– Stachybotrys and all sorts of other potential pathogens that could have come from food but could also come from environment. And then also, we ran a panel called the GPL-Tox which is a chemical profile test done via urine, and we looked for certain chemicals. One that I look for all the time is Perchlorate. And Perchlorate, is– it’s– crazy how many people in Florida have this chemical off the charts because of rocket fuel. When you use rocket fuel, I guess Perchlorate is an ingredient in rocket fuel. So people that live Cape– where Cape Canaveral is, where they’re lau– launching a– rockets and such, the people that I– I’ve worked with near Cape Canaveral, their Perchlorate levels are off the charts. And on the lab, it says, it disrupts the Thyroid’s ability to produce hormones; and– you and I were looking at some research earlier, the mechanism of this is it’s inhibiting the iodine uptake. So it’s almost acting like fluoride or bromide what it sounds like. Well maybe it’s blocking this receptor and then iodine can’t do its job so– uh– that’s– that’s huge and– and– where this Perchlorate come from, well if it’s not from rockets then it’s from fertilizers, it could be coming from bleach, but then it’s also in your tap water. The good news is, some of the filtrations we talked about can actually filter out Perchlorate. So literally, every single day if you’re drinking your tap water at your house and the fridge filter does not count, because the fridge filter does not filter Perchlorate–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly.

Evan Brand: And you’re cooking, let’s say like you’re doing some steamed broccoli, you put that water in there, that water is now coated all over in your steamed broccoli– that’s Perchlorate, and you could be eating little small bites of Perchlorate every day and you wonder why your thyroid doesn’t get better when you take thyroid supplements. So this is the level of– specificity you have to have in the modern world and I don’t get paralyzed by it, I mean you and I focused so much on action steps that– some people are like, “Oh my God the world’s so scary and dangerous”, but it’s like, there’s an action step associated with this though.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup, a hundred percent. So on the water side, you know, we just really wanna make sure at least and under the counter– slash countertop filter that– you know, that has a– a tank that can filter everything out really well. There’s a couple of cheaper options if we need as well. Of course, we can always go to a whole house which makes it even easier because in all rooms, and everywhere, and showers are taken care of as well. Uhm– there’s various air filters like I mentioned, the– the Molekule, they have– the– the Peugeot technology which is interesting. That’s the– the phyto-electrical– uhm— component one. That’s the newer technology that’s just come out in the last couple of years. So, with that, the Peugeot is the photoelectroche— electrical– electrochemical oxidation. And it– basically uses light to break some of these chemicals down. So it uses basically an oxide component and oxygen component. It creates C02 water trace elements as– as it reacts with the various virus or component and actually kills these things. So that’s kinda’ cool. And then we just have our basic Hepa Filter technology that just– is– you know, down to a 3-micron level that filters these components down, so we have that as well. Uhm–

Evan Brand: The reason it’s good that we also have the Air Doctor and we recommend you all get one too is because, that one filters down to .003 microns, so most Hepa systems especially something you wanna get at like Walmart or Target, filters down to 3 microns, but like car exhaust and diesel for example, a lot of these industrial pollutants, those are actually 2.5 microns in size, meaning that a 3 microns’ system won’t work. You’ve gotta go smaller, you’ve gotta get .003. So that’s the– that’s the specificity, you gotta pay attention to, cause if you go to Target and you get a Hepa filter for like a hundred bucks, yes it’s better than nothing but we want you to have no pollution, no car exhaust floating around in your bedroom.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Yup, 100%. So, I mean, lookin’ at that, is there anything else you wanna talk about in the chemicals like the Perchlorate, I think it’s really powerful because that’s just the component like you mentioned with the rocket fuel that can kind of come in there and bind in and it– it– affect iodine, the uptake into the thyroid gland and iodine’s used to make thyroid hormone. Remember T-4, T stands for thyroxine, the 4 stands for the number of iodine molecules. And then you have this iodination process where all these iodine molecules are bound up. And then you have uhm— the enzymes, the ___ [13:40] uhm— comes in, pulls off an iodine and makes T-4 to T-3 which is your active thyroid hormone. So we need a healthy iodine but, you know, we also make– need to make sure that chemicals aren’t coming in and blocking the uptake. And a lot of uhm— a lot of toxins that are again aquarium based, they put stress on the liver, and when the liver’s stressed, that’s gonna deactivate the amount of these enzymes that are being produced cause these enzymes come from the liver and they help activate, take the T-4 and convert it to T-3. So if we have more liver stress, it’s gonna affect the conversion enzymes. It’s also going to affect the iodine uptake as well, so it’s couple of different mechanisms. We have the iodine uptake, and then we also have the conversion of the thyroid hormone.

Evan Brand: Yeah, the other thing I wanted to mention in terms of like home toxins, are like bug sprays. Lot of people talk about bugs whether it’s like ants, or roaches, or wasps, or bees. And a lot of these insecticides, these also are tested on the GPL-Tox. And I see most people add elevations in these toxic chemicals. So if you’re spraying for bugs, even if you’re not doing it, and you’re hiring a “bug man” to come and spray. I had one client– she was off the chart with the Permethrin category of uh– toxins, and she said, “Yeah, I’m scared of spiders every time I see one I call the ‘bug man’ and have him come just bomb my house.” And I was like, “Oh my Lord…”. So– there is a uh– a company, I th— I don’t know if it’s the brand name or the product name called Orange Guard that we have used with great success, it’s like an orange peel extract and we had a–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep.

Evan Brand: –we had an ant problem at our old rental house and so I just sprayed the perimeter of the house with an Orange Guard, it smelled delicious like oranges and it got rid of the ants in like two days and there was no toxins in walls.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah in my property here we use the company called “Chem-Free” and they came out and they use some essential oil blends and, a lot of times like for the bees, they would use like a peppermint oil type of blend, and they use that for like the cockroaches as well, and they would spray. That one’s good. I mean, I like it, because a lot of these components, they aren’t super toxic, or they aren’t gonna be as toxic on the essential oil side, and– you can– and they worked. They actually knocked some of these uh– insects and roaches down which is great so you can still have– you can still have y– you know, the effectiveness of knocking some of these animals out but not creating the toxic environment as well.

Evan Brand: There’s another company that you can look up, you can even get them on Amazon. They first were revealed on Shark Tank it looks like, but it’s called the Wondercide. And Wondercide they had like natural pet care products but then they have home pest protection stuff too. So they do have like uh– a p– a peppermint insect repellent. And they have like an indoor pest control, and then they have an outdoor one which is what I use for all the ticks, because the ticks are really bad in Kentucky; and it’s a cedar oil. So you hook it up to your water hose, and you just spray it, and it makes your whole place smell like cedar, which if you like that smell, good. And– we did see reduction in ticks for sure. It didn’t cure it, like it’s not gonna magically eliminate bugs but it sure repelled them.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally, yup. I think that’s great. [crosstalk]

Evan Brand: So Wondercide– Wondercide, if people wanna look it up they have like organic soaps and stuff like that too but mainly I’m talking about for their home protection.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. You know, what other compounds are we worried about people getting exposed to that could be an issue. And of course we have the pesticides from our food, uhm— we have ate with the chlorine based water. Not just the chlorine but the chloramines that may form as well. So that’s one of the nice things that filtering out a lot of the chlorine is the chloramine compounds also get reduced. We have the reduction in fluoride. Remember, fluoride can have an effect of blocking out that thyroid receptor side as well because it is a halide. It’s in that 7th row on the periodic table of elements and that could be a problem. And remember, the fluoride in your water isn’t just fluoride, it’s Hydrofluorosilicic Acid so there are other nasty components that are in there. It’s not just like oh– uh– sodium fluoride, it’s other stuff that’s uhm— in there as well. So if you go look at it in your water filtracing— water filtration center, you’ll see it’s got this number, I think number 4 on there which by the CDC it’s– means it’s pretty darn toxic.

Evan Brand: Yup.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And again I would say they dilute it down to a certain amount part per million but still uh– not good if you’ll look at the amount of part per million in– two phase, right. You’ll look at the pinky side of it, read the back of it, it says, “do not swallow”. It’s– it’s got a poison control label on the back of it. So I– I’m very careful on fluoride. Just go to PubMed, you’re gonna see a lot of studies on fluoride decreasing IQ poi– I– your IQ by 10 points. Uhm– studies up in Great Britain, study that came out about 2 years ago, looked at fluoridated communities and non-fluoridated communities and drew correlation of more thyroid diagnosis or diseases, diagnoses, in communities that have more fluoride consumption. And we know the mechanism potentially could be that these fluorides, the halides that’s then blocks out the iodine and we need iodine for this iodination process to make thyroid hormone, right?

Evan Brand: Yup. And the– the other chemical I forgot to mention so far, lot of it is being banned and removed but it’s Triclosan or Triclosan, and that comes from a lot of your conventional soap, it’s an antibacterial. There’s studies on that showing that it does reduce your uh– T-4 level. So it does reduce thyroid hormone levels. If you’re washing your hands 5 times a day, let’s say you’re a nurse or something in a hospital setting, you’re using this conventional toxic soap, that’s not good. That means it’s no surprise that a lot of people in the healthcare field themselves have issues, I mean, some of it could be the toxic soap they’re using 20 times a day. And then all the skin care stuff that’s in the– that’s an easy one we test for all those chemicals. Nail polish, on that chemical profile test, they look for nail polish, they look for resins, they look for hair dyes, lot of women dye their hair, and then cosmetics so– gotta make sure all that stuff’s clean. If your shampoo or conditioner has like artificial fragrances in it, we know those fragrances can hide Phthalates and all sorts of other endocrine disrupting hormones.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%, absolutely. So the air stuff we talked about, the VOCs, right, the vo– volatile organic co– compounds, right. Uh– we just talked about, you know, a lot of the pet stuff, the allergenic stuff, the mold stuff a lot of these good– the better filter can filter out some of the mold, of course we have to figure out where that molds coming from, so you may wanna do an ERMI Test, to see if there’s any mold in the house, or if you can visualize or see it, it’d be good to have that remediated by an expert– typically use some concrobium on it afterwards to help, but you really wanna get someone that can remediate it, it–  if it’s an issue. Uhm– so that’s on– another component there. Anything else on the air side, the air allergen side Evan?

Evan Brand: Well I was just gonna– I was telling you before we got on air here. I brought– maybe you should look into this. It’s really this fun, you don’t need it but it’s fun. The uh– IQAir system, they have a portable air quality monitor system and I can test the levels instantly of the CO2 level in the house as well as the pollution level. It’s looking for the 2.5 micron molecules so I guess in the city or to be– pretty helpful but where I live, you know, there’s not much around to– to pollute the air. But what I’ve noticed is, in the morning, you know, you’re breathing all night, so you’re exhaling a lot of CO2, and we know that CO2, once you hit like a thousand parts per million I believe, the– headaches, fatigue, can start to happen, and my C02 levels in the home typically in the morning are about 1500. And if we just open the windows up, for 10, 15 minutes, we can get the CO2 levels down by like a thousand points. So we go for like the red category to the green category in this meter. So I mean, that’s free, first of all to open your window. Now if you live like in India, and your air is so toxic, you probably don’t wanna open the windows. But if it’s a decent air outside, and– you could open the windows, that alone, is something that could significantly change how you’re feeling.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. Yeah I– hundred percent agree. Uhm– anything else with the water component. Of course, we talked about all the different compounds in there, now the big things that I use, one of the good ones that I like is the Air Doctor, that’s a good one. If you go to my site, I have the Air Doctor as well as the advance air setup those are both good units. If you go to and click on Justin Health approved products, I have some links to those, and again, Evan and I only gonna recommend products that we actually use. I think it’s important that you actually use the product and you believed in it, I think it’s great. Uhm– it’s nice to have people that are guinea pigs that can kind of sign off on it as being a good product which is great, so if you wanna purchase that, you can do that, you can get more information there. Uhm– the other component is the Molekule, is a nice one. It’s a little bit more expensive. So the other two, the Advanced Air and the Air Doctor, are about half the price, that’s a good first step if you’re tryin’ to get your foot into the– into this area of cleaning out air quality and improving it. If you wanna go a little bit more whole hog then the Molekule’s a– uh– a better option uh– on top of that, looks a little nicer as well. So those are my top three. Now there are some whole house systems but you gotta look at the fact that, you know, I like the fact that I can bring my unit with me if I were to travel, if you– if you’re moving, those kind of things and maybe a little bit more difficult to– pull it out, install it so you have to look at you know, are you gonna be in a long term. And also it’s nice to be able to bring it and put it right in your room and be able to have control over it.

Evan Brand: Yup, well said, and a– the whole house system is I mean, they do exist on the market but I do not heard too many good things about ’em. I know they can work but I think it’s better off to just have a purifier in your room because it does. In this, maybe this is just like theory or marketing talk but in theory, the– HVAC system has to work harder because when you’ve got a– a whole house air filtration system sitting on top of your– what do you call that, your– What’s the name of that Justin like where the fan is connected to your HVAC system?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: A blower, where it’s connected to the blower? You have to–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: –that blower has to blow harder through all the multi-layers of the filter. So it makes that system work harder and make shorter the life of it. [crosstalk]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah and you also– yeah and you also have these vents and things. There’s a lot of– there’s a large distance between where the air is coming from and getting cleaned out, and then through all of the vents to where it gets to your room. It’s just nice having it purified right at the spot where you’re at, so it doesn’t have to really travel more than a few feet to get to you.

Evan Brand: Right. Yeah, so, that’s what I would do. And I have test– that’s cool thing. I’ve tested Air Doctor and all the other systems to discuss with a portable monitor. The lower the number the better. The number coming out of the Air Doctor it’s a zero. So, I know that it’s legit, pure air coming out of it which is great. [crosstalk]. Yeah you gotta check it out man. It’s uh– if you just type in IQ Air, and you type in– it’s called Air Visual Pro, I’ll put the link up in the Hang Out for you.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh great!

Evan Brand: I’ll send it to you. I don’t think the– the– the listeners will be able to see this link but I’ll send it to you. But it’s called Air Visual Pro, and– you know, I’ve got a practitioner account with them so you do get a slight discount as a practitioner. And uh– and that’s what I have and it’s just a little small thing, and it’s like, you know, smaller than a computer but it runs on batteries and I just– I just– I’m ___ [24:15] with it man. I’ll take it to the restaurant and say, “Hey what’s the air quality in your…”, take to my friends’ house and say, “Hey, what’s the air quality in your house?”. It’s just fun.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, that’s really cool! Oh wow. Amazing. I wonder what the– what 2008 Olympics, was it 2010 in China? What they had in Beijing?

Evan Brand: Oh gosh.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I heard the air quality was just absolutely terrible. I– I just see on the IQA website it has one looking at– at Beijing, versus the one looking at the office in the Beijing has the ratings that are to the roof meaning mo– more toxicity.

Evan Brand: Yeah the cool thing is there’s an app with that uh– device as well so you can check your air quality and see how it compares to like other cities. It’ll show you what’s the tiniest air, what’s the most toxic air, and– and people they can, if you want, you can have that thing hooked up to Wi-Fi which I didn’t but, that way you can upload your data and people can see it around the map, “Hey, here’s this guy in– wherever, and here’s his air quality”. So it’s pretty neat.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Love it. Anything else you want to address here so far Evan? What do you think? Anything missing?

Evan Brand: I– I think– I mean– we’ll always do a part 2, part 3, you can never stop talking about toxins but I think we’ve covered a lot today. Clean up cosmetics, look at yourselves, look at your shampoo and conditioner, don’t dye your hair– Now there is an organic hair dye but I don’t know anything about it. I know it exists, so seek out like organic salons, don’t get your nails done like, “that’s bad”, like maybe go to an organic salon. I measured a nail polish resin every single week in clients, the women who get their nails done every week on the GPL Tox, their certain chemical is off the chart. And it just– it causes headaches, nervous system issues, thyroid issues, so– I don’t– I’m– I’m a guy so I don’t get my nails done so maybe for women, they’re like, “Oh my God, I have to have them done”. Maybe there’s a better way to do it I just don’t know of any.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Evan Brand: But– but look at it, get the GPL To– if– if you have– if you’re a woman listening, and you don’t believe me, run a GPL-Tox, look at your toxic load, and then maybe you’ll believe me. Right.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Or it’s this you know, do your best to find a higher quality organic salon that has some products that are gonna be less toxic. And, or– if you need to, just– take some extra antioxidants and or glutathione before you go or at least support those path while you still spread it out. A lot of those toxins are gonna be more water soluble, so it– it’s not something that you’re gonna like hold on too as much, so if you take good detoxification support you’ll secrete it pretty fast. And you just try to find you know, I know like some of the salons my wife would go to there’s like a small little upgrade where they can– choose an organic product that’s less uh– toxic low. So that’s a good option–

Evan Brand: Yes.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: –if you– have that.

Evan Brand: Yup, and a– I interviewed doctor Shaw, the guy who invented that toxic lab, if you wanna hear more about detox, just look at fandbrandwilliamshaw, S-H-A-W, calls and that interview, because we chatted all about mitigation strategies, and then also more about like you said glutathione, NAC, uh– precursors for detox, amino acids to help detox, sweatings, saunas, so that’s a good one.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And also one of the things that shaw said from that interview if I remember correctly, you tell me if I’m wrong, he said something like one of the best things you can do to e– to enhance detoxification is to to sweat more.

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s a– that’s a– it was a number one thing. He personally did not use a sauna, all he did was he– likes to go for runs and ride his bike outside and sweat. And he keeps his chemical levels tested and they’re always relatively low. He said, he did not see more of a benefit unless someone was too sick to exercise. To exercise and sweat, versus sauna and sweating. He said the whole near infrared, far infrared, the whole– debate about it all, he said sweating is the key, it didn’t matter how you achieved it in his words.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s interesting too because remember, Shaw also– didn’t really eat organic either.

Evan Brand: You know, that guy he– he taught at restaurants every single day.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so there was a differen— I mean, I find that with a lot of my– my PhD researcher friends, there’s kind of a disconnect uh– with what they’re studying and applying it in their real life. It’s kind of this weird thing. I f–

Evan Brand: I agree.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: –I forget uhm— I think it was Alessio Fasano? He used to be a gluten researcher over at Harvard, he’s got a lot of uhm— you know research on gluten and how it increases ___ [28:07] which can create leaky gut. Yeah I’ve seen– I’ve heard people that have gone out to dinner with them and they’ll order a big freakin’ ball of pasta, and eat it right in front of you. You’re like the premier glutton researcher and you’re talking about how gluten creates you know, gastrointestinal permeability a.k.a leaky gut, and you’re sitting there eating a bunch of gluten?

Evan Brand: Tell me about it, that’s a [crosstalk]–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You know, here’s the deal, like if I’m gonna cheat, right, I get it, like I may cheat sometime, I always try to just do to a gluten-free cheat, and I’m sure it hel— aren’t gonna cheat in front of people that are health-oriented or patients, I wanna be a good example. If I’m gonna cheat, it’s gonna be like, you know, no one’s gonna be seeing me, so to speak right?

Evan Brand: [laughs]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So the fact that you’re– you’re doin’ it openly in front of people means that you’re probably doin’ it a lot more frequently…

Evan Brand: Right. I know. Well doctor Shaw, I was blown away by that, I said, “So you eat out everyday?”, he said, “Yeah, I don’t pack my lunch”. And I thought, “Man, so you’re getting glyphosphate exposure everyday”, and we know parts per billion is enough to damage gut bacteria and affect mitochondria. I mean, that just means bold to me so, I don’t know man, I guess they always say once you uh– there’s– there’s a saying about this I– I don’t know the exact saying but something along the lines…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That you don’t want to bless or something? [laughs] or–

Evan Brand: well, well, no, he used to say–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: He knows. He’s not– he’s not– he’s not ignorant but I guess, there– there is uhm— what is it, there– there— there’s knowledge is power, but– but true knowledge is applied, uh– no, uh– knowledge is power only if acted upon it, only if applied. So you could know all these stuff but you gotta truly apply it to get the benefit right.

Evan Brand: We– well the saying, I was thinking of was something along the lines of like your hero, like a lot of times people have like a hero, or an idol like, “Oh I really look up to this person”, and then they figured out how they truly are, and they’re not what they think they are. There was a movie about that, I don’t remem— oh, w– wait– it was uh– it was that– it was called “The Fault in Our Stars”, it was a book, it was a movie about the girl who had cancer and she loved its author, and this author, she was just obsessed with him and she goes to meet him and he’s like a miserable alcoholic drunk.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: Did you see that movie?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I– I saw that movie, that’s a good one and the I think– yeah, I won’t give the spoiler but that was a good movie, yes.

Evan Brand: Yeah, so– so– yeah, so– maybe your— your idol may not have as dialed in as even you do.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. Let me just add one la– last thing, so, the–

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: –the key things that we’re lookin’ at on the– on the water side, of course, are gonna be– fluoride, chlorine, uh– pharmaceutical drugs, whether it’s birth control pills or statins or antidepressants, people flush things down and it’s hard to get those filtered out.

Evan Brand: Yup.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh– we’ve mentioned the chloramines,

Evan Brand: Hard drugs–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And–

Evan Brand: There’s hard drugs in there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hard drugs, potentially heavy metals, mercury, lead, parasitic cyst and or infections debris, so those are gonna be the big things on the water side, and on the air side we have the asbestos, right? That’s can create the– the Mesothelioma cancer, we have– various dust mites, uh– pollens, fungus, bacteria, viruses, we have the phemaldehyde, right?

Evan Brand: Poten– [crosstalk]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup, we have the uh– the PBDE– the– what is it, the–

Evan Brand: It’s a PDB–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Pyrrhotites.

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, PDBEs, yeah. uhm— the wha— what does it stand for? Help me out, uh it’s– it’s a– it’s a bromidated compound. Polybrominated diphenyl ethers. [crosstalk]

Evan Brand: So that could be– in your couch cushion, that could be in your the– your office chair, that could be in your children’s pajamas unfortunately, which is ridiculous,

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. They put a lot in the– the kids’ mattresses, so we spend extra money to buy an organic wall mattress that didn’t have the flame retardants…

Evan Brand: Yup.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we also spend extra money to not get the flame retardants in– our babies’ uhm— not stroller, what are they call, not the– what’s the terminology the–

Evan Brand: The car seat?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: A, the– the carrier– the carrier. So there was one brand I think it was uhm— I think it was Uppababy, I think it was the Henry, it was the only one on the market last year we bought and it did not the PBDEs the flame retardants so we did the Henry one, we did an organic mattress that didn’t have any flame retardants. And of course we have– we have uh– a fire alarm in my son’s room so if there’s an issue, we’re gonna know. We don’t need a– heaven breathing toxic chemicals for such a– a low-risk issue.

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Then we have the leads, especially if you have houses before 1978– 1978, lead could be used in that. We have various pesticides esp– especially spread out on the lawn, or if you live on the golf course there could be a potential pesticides going in that way. We use various uhm— phthalates which could be from vinyl flooring, it could be from shower curtains, it could be from detergents it could be from the PVCs in your piping, it could be–

Evan Brand: Oh.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: –from the food packaging.

Evan Brand: Here’s a– here’s a PSA man, this is the biggest announcement ever, please, everywhere I go in society, I smell people’s terrible laundry. You go in line in the grocery and you stand behind somebody in their flower-fragrance on their laundry. It didn’t used to be like that back back in the day, I don’t remember smelling people’s laundry.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Dryer sheets man. People use, like a– we have the most hypoallergenic uhm— cleanliness detergent, I mean we have one I think, we upgraded, we’re using seventh generation like un-scented but we upgraded one more beyond that. If you go to we searched the number one brand on there, just zero smell. People are using one, they’re using– laundry detergents that’s got a whole bunch of crap in, but then they also use a dryer sheet on top of it. And it is like–

Evan Brand: So that’s what it is…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s the dryer sheets.

Evan Brand: Oh my.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s totally disgusting, I mean, oh my gosh, it just gives me headache.

Evan Brand: I get yeah– I get an immediate headache and part of me thinks well, does that mean I have a leaky brain, or does that mean that I’m just sensitive to it because it’s a toxic chemical. I feel like everyone should get a headache from it because it’s toxic.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well for me it just smells nasty. It’s just so overpowering– it’s so overpoweringly– str– overpoweringly strong. It’s like people that need to– consume very high sugar foods. Like for me, my taste buds get overwhelmed, right?

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So it’s kinda like that I mean, I think you just– you get a little bit uhm— you know, the less alcohol you drink, a beer kinda gives you a little bit buzz, it’s kinda like that, the more you gotta exposed to it. I imagined that probably it wouldn’t be an issue.

Evan Brand: So here’s my– here’s my– here’s my couple announcements–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Sure.

Evan Brand: –and then I know we gotta–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Sure.

Evan Brand: –we gotta wrap up. Switch over to free and clear, unscented laundry detergent, even whole food cells, their own brand of organic laundry detergent it’s all plant-based and packed in so I they help the grease and all that crap. How do you close– Go fragrance-free, and then, do a fragrance-free or free and clear dryer sheet if you absolutely have to have it. We personally use the wall balls on our dryer, and that works as a replacement of dryer sheets and you never have to buy dryer sheets, the wall balls work perfectly. And then number 2 thing is– the perfume. So there’s a chemically can test for called xylene, that’s the parent chemical on the toxin report. So many people wear perfume, especially like I go to the park and you’ve got these women in their work out clothes, and they run past you, and then 2 seconds later comes the breeze with them of their perfume. It’s like good Lord, let’s go to nature, to just pollute it with– with pot– so many different potential toxins from the laundry, to the perfume. So please, please please, nobody wants to smell that crap, and you’re making yourself toxic, I measure it everyday so from a clinician perspective, I’ve got proof– what these perfumes are doing to you and nobody else wants to smell that crap either.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, for me, the deodorant that I use actually has a really nice scent. Uhm– I use a brand called native COS– native COS and they have a coconut vanilla uhm— it’s actually a women’s uhm— deodorant but it’s smells great, I mean it doesn’t smell overly feminine at all, it smells very neutral.

Evan Brand: It’s real though.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s real, so like for me, the deodorant that I use, I– I can smell it from the outside so it has the slight kind of uhm— you know, nice coconut vanilla smell, but it’s totally natural essential oil based, so– for me that’s where I get my scent from a native of couple brands. I– I put another ordering last night for a nice little uhm— rosewood, sandalwood blends. Sandalwoods are great essential oil for– for a guy. If you wanna have like a nice little– kind of slight masculine, kind of musc smell to you, sandalwoods’ great for a guy. My wife would use some lavender every now and then, and that’s a great– great kind of lil— a little bit more of a feminine undertone. So if you want a– a slight kind of smell to yourself, a good essential oil that’s non-toxic can be great.

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah. I’m not against scents completely. But if you have to smell, if you just wanna walk around smellin’–[crosstalk]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Wow, and you know, sometimes, less is more, right?

Evan Brand: Absolutely, so yeah, look at those natural ones, the native, I do have some of the native too. They sent me some some stuff there, I want to respond to the podcast, and then– I– never heard anything back, so I may have to reach out, say “Hey, free deodorants for all listeners!”, that’d be cool.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah I’m sensitive like I will react like my armpit will get super red, and their coconut is excellent. There’s citris herbal musk, I didn’t react a little bit too but I can use it for like 3 or 4 days in a row and then take a week off and I’m fine; it’s just like…

Evan Brand: Good you said that cause my wife had the same thing happen with the citris one and the lavender.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: She can only do it three days and then her armpit goes super red and inflamed she has to do with unscented only.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup, unscented, try the coconut, vanilla too. That’s worked great for me. And they have uhm— they have a rosewood or sandalwood that just came out and they have one other– I think eucalyptus– mint one that’s out as well. So I ordered like 3 or 4 flavors last night, and the coconut vanilla is excellent.

Evan Brand: [laughs] Is that flavors? You could– you could it eat, you could–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, you can– it– I mean, it’s clean, you know. And again for me it’s like, “You know, I’m– I’m busy, I’m working, I’m sweating– I wa— I also want protection as well. And let’s face this, a lot of these natural, you know, deodorants, they don’t really provide much protection at all and–

Evan Brand: The native– the native works man.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Very good, I mean, at the end of the day, I’m like, “Yeah that smells great!”.

Evan Brand: The listeners didn’t hear that but he sniffed at himself. That one– that one in the Primal Pit Paste was the other one for me that worked pretty good but is a little harder to put on so the native is the best in terms of like, I’ll rate that number 1 for now.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And like, the– the Primal Pit Paste is got a little bit more of a sticky coating to it, where like the native is like a very dry coating, so if you like, put your shirt on whatever, you don’t feel like it’s stuck up in your armpit there so that’s kind of a nice thing about that.

Evan Brand: Yup, we went longer than we were supposed to but we just– we started thinking of all these other tangential toxins that people need to be aware of so I hope it’s been helpful, uh– if you wanna reach out to Justin you can, his website is justinhealth— so, you could reach out and schedule a consult with him, and he’s also got another doc on staff, so if his availability is crazy you can get with him. And then for me, my website is, you can reach out there. And– either way, whether it’s us or whether it’s somebody else that knows what they’re talking about we just hope that you get the help that you’re looking for and that you can achieve the next level of health as soon as possible.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. Let me just hit the last three things.

Evan Brand: Yup.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right on to another big one which is a– you know, it’s a– element in the soil and that can come up at– you know, for its– its– it’s actually in the rock, you know, in the foundation of where your house would be deep underground. And when you’re there it can come up to the house and that’s linked with potential lung cancer at levels I think greater than 4 ppm as what the CDC wants to blow. Uhm– we tested our house at one point, it was 8, so we have uh– we got a right on kit in there to help filter that out. We haven’t– down below .5 so radons and ___ [38:47] especially, you know in the midwest, in south that can be a potential problems so if you haven’t got it tested you can buy a radon meter on Amazon or you can pay someone I think for 75 bucks that come out and have your house tested, that’s important.

Evan Brand: Well said.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Of co– of course just like respiratory particles such as, you know, wood stew, fireplace, kerosene pipes, cigarettes, those kind of things, cigar smoke. And then we mentioned the volatile organic compounds. These are gonna come from paints, paint strippers, woods, aerosols, air fresheners, auto products, dry cleaning, clothing, household products, those are the big ones so. A good uhm— air filter will help with a majority those and of course a good water filter will help at the components we mentioned. And again, for me,, water are the ones that I personally use in my house.

Evan Brand: Yeah, you mentioned that a– the air freshener so I forgot about that. I’ll tell you, uh– one little thing I do, this is a secret, I’ve never revealed this, but now the secret’s’ out of the bag. If I go to a place- a public place and there’s a plug-in air freshener, I pull that thing out and throw it in the garbage before I leave. So if I go in the– if I go in the bathroom, and there’s a plug-in or you walk in and then– [sneezes], and you get sprayed with fake chemicals as soon as you walk in to go pee, I just pull the thing out the wall and throw it in the garbage.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%.

Evan Brand: That’s my little public uh– that’s my little public duty. I’m helping all of you guys have les fragrance in your bodies.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well you were doin’ that uhm— survey last year where you tryin’ a– a petition where you’re tryin’ to get the uber drivers to pull the– the scented things out of the car, right?

Evan Brand: Yeah, I got over 2000 signatures on it and there was someone else kind of uh– I don’t know if it was food [crosstalk] benlycnh who shared it or something– somebody shared it and then they got thousands more signatures but I’ve still heard no updates on it but uh– luckily it’s very rare for me to have to take an uber or taxi but this problem happens every day where me– even they’ve asked preposted about how he talked in uber and the guy had like seven little Christmas tree fragrance–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Awful.

Evan Brand: They have like– he had a headache, he was dizzy, and etc. after he got out of his uber so, this is a real problem and I hope one day that we can educate people and just do natural fragrance or no fragrance at all.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, uh– the good– the essential oil, there’s gotta be some essential oil like, you know, the–

Evan Brand: The citrus one. They have a citrus– there’s a citrus like odor-absorber that would work perfect to people can put under the car seat–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes, yes.

Evan Brand: No one would know it’s there and it would take care of all the toxic–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It would stop a lot of the odor. That’s to– totally make sense Evan.

Evan Brand: Yup. But that’s all I gotta say so check out the links and then you can check out for consults or We love helping you guys. We really appreciate the good feedback, so feel free to write us a review on the podcast on iTunes because it does help us.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Great, and we’ll put the links below on some of the products that we like and use personally so you guys know it’s already betted. Give us a thumbs up, give us a share, give us a shout out, give us a comment down below; we appreciate you guys engaging; sharing is caring, thanks for everything. Evan, you have a phenomenal day, we’ll talk soon.

Evan Brand: Take care man, bye.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Bye.


Air Doctor Air Purifier

The entire contents of this website are based upon the opinions of Dr. Justin Marchegiani unless otherwise noted. Individual articles are based upon the opinions of the respective author, who retains copyright as marked. The information on this website is not intended to replace a one-on-one relationship with a qualified health care professional and is not intended as medical advice. It is intended as a sharing of knowledge and information from the research and experience of Dr. Justin and his community. Dr. Justin encourages you to make your own health care decisions based upon your research and in partnership with a qualified healthcare professional. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Dr. Marchegiani’s products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. If you are pregnant, nursing, taking medication, or have a medical condition, consult your physician before using any products.