Low Potassium, Adrenal Dysfunction Your Immune System | Podcast #288
For today’s live podcast, Dr. Justin and Evan Brand talk about Potassium and our immune system. Among other minerals, Potassium also acts great especially in our body, energy, mood, blood pressure and a lot more. Let’s dive into why potassium is important for our immune health. Check this podcast’s transcript.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani
In this episode, we cover:
2:18 All about Potassium
9:11 Oral Supplementation
20:57 Foods with Potassium
27:11 Vertigo and Dizziness
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there, it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani, we are doing a live podcast here on potassium and your immune system. Potassium is an essential mineral. And it has major effects on the sodium potassium pump, how your cells function, energy, mood, blood pressure has a huge effect on the adrenal glands. I’m excited to dive in here with Evan Brand, Evan, how you doing today man? doing really well.
Evan Brand: So we were looking at some papers on this thing. And turns out a national survey found that approximately 98% not nine not 8, 98% of Americans are not meeting the recommended potassium intake. A Western diet is to blame as it favors processed foods over a whole plant foods such as fruits, vegetables, beans, and nuts. Everybody knows that the American diet is crap. And it’s not just the American diet. Right? This is the standard European diet. This is the standard Australian diet you know, kind of most developed first world Countries they’re doing too much. Too much potassium devoid food. And let’s tie that directly into what we were also looking at which is this paper this based on the names of these doctors. And yeah, actually it shows it right here. When Zhu Zi Yong ha, Province, China, so yeah, so this is a Chinese hospital and Chinese medical universities to study that came out of hyperkalemia and clinical implications and patients with Coronavirus and long story short people that had potassium deficiencies. They had severe hypokalemia, which is the technical term for potassium deficiency. And it said here that the patients responded well to potassium supplements. And they were inclined to recovery so they don’t say directly Hey, low potassium means you’re going to get the virus or low potassium means you’re going to be really sick, but they just talk about how, because of this whole Ace to enzyme thing that you and I’ve covered many times, and the whole relationship to the virus that one of the side effects of the issue can be low potassium, and if you’re already low potassium to begin with, then you can end up in potentially fatal shape, which is not good.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% in potassium is very important because our sodium potassium pump is requires potassium. So what happens is, you have your cell, and then you have sodium inside the cell and you have potassium outside of the cell. And they do a little switcheroo ski, right. This is called the sodium potassium pump. The enzyme that’s involved in making that happen is ATP. And then you know, it’s an enzyme because of the word Ace next to an ATP ace. So ATP is important because ATP is generated from your mitochondria, right? We have glycolysis outside of the cell in the cytoplasm, and then we have our Krebs cycle, right? And we have our electron transport chain within the cell we generate 36 to 38 or so ATP from that that eight TP part of that ATP runs their sodium potassium pumps that ATP takes that sodium that’s in the cell and that potassium outside of the cell, they do a dance, they switch. So it’s three coming out to come in, right? Boom, just like that. And the cell needs that healthy fluid fluidity to work and to communicate. And if we don’t have that healthy fluidity, we’re going to have side effects. So one of the big side effects is we’re going to have muscle or nerve issues because potassium and sodium are very important for the muscles slash nerves to work, right nerves help control muscles, so very, very important there. You’re also going to see it with you’re going to see it with potential mood issues as well because sodium and potassium play an intricate role with the adrenal glands and part of the reason why people’s potassium gets low outside of a poor diet is going to be because of adrenal function. Now, typically with adrenals. Your dosterone starts to go low, which is a mineral corticoid that exists in The cortex to the adrenals. And what happens is as your dosterone starts going low, your sodium can start to drop. And as your sodium drops, sometimes your potassium can look like it’s not too bad, it can look actually a little bit high, but you could still actually have potassium issues because of the fact that you are your adrenals are weak and you’re pulling out a lot of your minerals. So muscle and cramps are going to be a big deal, weakness and fatigue because your nerves need that. Also, if you don’t have good sodium potassium pump issues, you probably have energy issues because the mitochondria healthy mitochondrial function for ATP is needed for that sodium potassium pump to work so potassium works better when there’s the ATP so that whole sodium potassium pump works. We talked about cramping as well because of the the muscles needing the wiring the fluid wiring sodium and potassium and minerals. So cramping is gonna be a big deal. We’re also going to have potentially digestive issues right? your bowel movements and your motility starts to Coming slower when your potassium drops, so we need healthy levels of potassium. So we have good bowel movements. Also heart palpitations, we need potassium and magnesium. So our heart could pump right our hearts a muscle as well. So if your heart skipping beats or beating harder or faster, that’s a sign of palpitations, which could be from that. And also just achy muscles, muscle breakdown, feeling tired and stiff, right? the breakdown of muscle was known as rhabdo. My license or my analysis, right? And that breakdown is going to be very much helped with good potassium levels, right, you’re gonna have less muscle breakdown, with potassium levels being adequate, of course, tingling and numbness issues are going to be a big one difficulty, you know, using your lung muscles mood stuff because of the adrenals as well. I’ll pause and give you a chance to comment.
Evan Brand: I’m glad you mentioned magnesium too, because, uh huh. You and I were kind of looking with a microscope today, right? We’re kind of spot picking right? One thing to talk about, but all these people that are deficient in potassium, I’m sure they’re going to be deficient in magnesium as well. I mean, we know how hard it is to get it from the food, even if it’s organic, because the soil is so depleted. So it’s a really common problem. And then on that whole mood changes, I just wanted to talk about that real quick. There was one study, and this wasn’t a necessarily a causation, but just a correlation study that we were looking at here. 20% of patients with mental disorders that came into this psychiatric ward 20% of them had potassium deficiency. So it’s not saying directly, the potassium deficiency caused the mood issue, there could very well be other things going on you and I’ve covered hundreds of times about gut infections, which could lead to mineral and electrolyte imbalances you hit on the adrenals. So, of course, as we know, when we hear something like that, we say, Okay, well, if you just give these people potassium, are they not going to have mood issues anymore? And the answer is, they could still have mood issues, even if they supplement Potassium, but it’s interesting and it’s something that often gets skipped. This is really low hanging fruit. Somebody could go to something very nuanced as this particular herb for this retrovirus or this bug, but the person’s just simply dehydrated and they’re not getting enough electrolytes, it could be something very, very simple like that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and low potassium is so common, just like low magnesium is common. I think you said what 98% are going to have some kind of an issue.
Evan Brand: Yeah, and I think this idea that yeah, I think this study I was referencing was probably just a survey where they looked at diet and figured out whether people were even getting the the the recommended daily amount, and 98% of people are not getting the recommended daily amount are already on the recommended daily intake. So I guarantee magnesium is in the same boat, probably 90 plus percent.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, 100%. I agree. And then also there are medications that are going to affect potassium, right. We know a lot of the blood pressure medications as well as things that like water pills or diuretics. So if you’re on a BP medication, right, there’s a good chance some of that’s going to be actually driving further potassium deficiency. So low potassium levels are super common because of that. Also, we’re going to have problems with potassium if we consume too much alcohol, right, alcohols gonna cause us to pee a lot more potassium out because things like diuretics are going to cause you to lose more minerals, right? diuretics basically activate a hormone that causes you to kind of continue to pee. And the more you pee with a diuretic in your system, whether it’s, you know, excess coffee, or even access alcohol, you’re going to pee out a lot of those minerals. So that’s kind of like vitally important, right?
Evan Brand: And even Yeah, and even tea, I mean, even tea could be to blame. I think herbal teas can be great, but there is somewhat of a diuretic effect of certainties as well. So if you’re just like sipping on tea all day and not drinking enough just straight water or our preference water with a pinch of salt or water with some electrolytes, actually to it, you know, this can happen easily. And this is not just a problem in athletes, people hear the word electrolyte and they think you only need that if you’re in the NFL No, you need electrolytes just to function.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly, the problem with a lot of people with their potassium is, it’s hard to get too much if you’re taking it orally, right? Obviously, you go back to like the lethal injection people are actually you know, in the lethal injection in the prison system, people are actually being killed by potassium IV right or injection. Now, it’s hard to get too much potassium orally because some of the vomiting and from some of the vomiting and diarrhea side effects and the nausea side effects that you get from have actually having too low potassium. Well guess what, you actually have similar side effects when you go too high. So usually you get so nauseous, and you’ll either throw off or you’ll get diarrhea. So it’s very difficult. The only way to really do it orally is going to be with an oral supplementation. And you’d have to do a lot of it and all those symptoms would come into place. It’d be really high. The only way you You can get your potassium levels to the point where you’re going to be too high is going to be on an IV. And what they do actually on an IV to reverse potassium overdose is they do a bicarbonate infusion, bicarbonate actually neutralizes that high level of potassium. But some of the major causes are going to be diarrhea, right? So if you have a parasite infection or a gut infection that’s causing chronic loose stools, guess what? You may be having low potassium because of your gut. I have some patients that need five or six or seven grams a day of potassium supplementation, whether it’s because of a stress or a malabsorption issue, but all of their low potassium symptoms go away when they hit that level, meaning like the cramping, the twitching, the heart, the mood stuff all go away when they hit that higher level. So I mean, the goal is let’s fix the stress. So you’re not dumping the minerals as much let’s fix the gut. So we’re absorbing but, you know, I don’t typically don’t recommend doing more than one to two grams of potassium supplementally and we’ll do a good high quality keylight whether it’s a discoloration A or A potassium bicarb or we’ll do a potassium citrate like a new salt, which is a cheap source, and then we’ll try to plug in the recipe of the diet but if we have to go above, you know, we’ll do it incrementally and we’ll start looking for those low potassium symptoms to go away but alcohol is gonna be a big one, chronic kidney issues. uncontrolled Type One Diabetes will do it diarrhea, like we mentioned. So gut issues, diuretics is a big one. So if you’re on a diuretic on a blood pressure meds side, that could be a problem. sweating a lot. So if you’re sweating a lot, yeah, you’re gonna need a lot more minerals. Again how Gatorade was figured out I think it was the 1968 late 60s I want to say was the Orange Bowl one of these big bowl games the Florida Gators were actually playing halftime I think one of the exercise physiologist or PT people, trainers said hey, let’s get these electrolytes in and they had a kick butt second half and they just they killed it and won the game. And part of it was the electrolytes they put it and now we have all these things. Gatorade substitutes, but the real they were called Gator lights, right? Gator lights, not Gatorade. They tasted like absolute crap. So what you have now are a whole bunch of minerals with a whole bunch of sugar and dyes. Back then they just had the minerals and it tasted awful. But from a performance standpoint, they did really well because the other team didn’t have it. So they their muscles were functioning better. So sweating, not having enough full later B vitamins, having high amounts of aldosterone, whether it’s a tumor, or just our adrenals being overstimulated. Some antibiotics can actually have problems as well. And then vomiting vomiting too much can create low potassium too. And then obviously, just that junk food diet, we’ll talk about what it takes to have enough potassium in a minute.
Evan Brand: Yeah, and one thing too, that people miss out on a lot of these new companies, they’re doing a good job because they’re getting away from the corn syrup and the fake sugar and all that stuff, but you still do need based on some of the stuff we’ve looked at. I believe you need a little bit of glucose to help get potassium And your other minerals and electrolytes into the cell. So you’ll see if you look at they call it o RS oral rehydrating solution. This is like the military grade electrolytes. There has to be a little bit of sugar there has to be a little bit of a blood sugar spike, I believe it somehow opens the channel to let the electrolytes in. I’m not sure the exact you know, molecular level stuff that’s going on. But I’ve read into formulas that are just stevia or just monk fruit, some of these natural sweeteners that if they don’t affect blood sugar, you don’t actually get the benefit. So when you look at legit like military grade, electrolytes, they have a little bit of glucose spike associated with it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and the glucose is better, right? The problem is a lot of these places they have fructose, the fructose doesn’t target the muscles the same way as glucose does. So if you’re looking for an electrolyte formula, you you really want you can get the electrolytes by itself but then if you want if you’re doing a lot of sweating or a lot of glycogen depleting activity, whether it’s football or some kind of a sport that requires a lot of sprinting or running, then you’d want a formula that’s going to have more glucose in it for the sugar source, not fructose. fructose is a problem because it hits the liver more than the muscles. Glucose hits the muscles more than the liver. And like you mentioned, that helps open up that cell with the insulin and helps deplete the glycogen levels and helps that sodium potassium pump work better if you’re using a lot of glucose or if you’re sweating a lot, but if you’re not, and you’re just the average everyday person, probably getting the minerals in without the extra glucose is probably okay.
Evan Brand: Yeah, we talked about mold and detox and sauna and all of that, but I’m really shocked at how many people are doing sauna 234 or five times a week and they’re just drinking water. I’m like, Are you nuts? You gotta be doing electrolytes that is a critical component of detox in my opinion, is you have to make sure you’re replenishing and rehydrating because you’re losing a lot of minerals. You’re not just magically sweating out heavy metals and mold toxin, you’re sweating out minerals and electrolytes. You have to replenish those and you You were drinking a green juice earlier, I think you said your green juice had like 1200 milligrams per bottle or something crazy.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, this is a great brand right here. It’s called evolution. They sell them in Austin and Selma, even in target now, which is kind of cool. Like, I like the fact that a lot of these healthier things are coming into kind of more mainstream box stores. But organic greens, I’ll typically drink the celery juice, but I’ve been doing the essential greens, they have the celery is the first ingredient so it’s still great. I love celery because of the minerals in there the electrolytes and then potassium is really high in celery, but it’s got cucumber, spinach, romaine kale, lime and parsley. And then they have a green devotion instead of lime. It’s got lemon, so they go back and forth, but there’s no actual fruit outside of the lemon or lime which is pretty low sugar. And this has got just alone It’s got I’m almost about 1200 milligrams of potassium. So I got about 25 to 30% all my potassium right here. So that’s pretty cool. So I just kill that after I have my really nice good breakfast with collagen and then I’m already a you know, a quarter of the Through my potassium needs for the day, which is great.
Evan Brand: Don’t you feel more like your thirst is quenched to like when I drink regular water compared to something like that. It’s just not as quenching to me as the good stuff, the green juices, they’re more thirst quenching. I’ll do like a little bit of electrolyte through a pinch in, like with some beet powder and stuff like that. And I feel great if I’m just doing filtered water and I’m not using aro I’m using like a carbon system even then though I water just doesn’t cut it for me. I like a little extra bang.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, I think a lot of people what they’re really craving is they’re craving some water, but they’re also craving minerals, right? And so because they’re craving minerals, if there’s no minerals in there, yeah, you’re going to feel like you’re missing out on something, right? So that’s definitely a big part of what’s happening is your body’s craving the minerals, and if they’re not there, that’s a problem. Also, I’m pretty sure Cushing’s is going to be another potassium issue, right? Cushing’s and potassium is going to be a big problem as well. So now what does that mean? So the kidneys excrete large amounts of potassium when you make a lot of cortisol. So what does that mean? So If you have Cushing’s that’s kind of more tumor induced where the cortisol is so high probably because of some kind of a tumor. But what if you’re in between? Right? What if your your adrenals are just overstimulated, you’re not on the adrenal, you’re not on the Cushing’s disease side but you’re just making a lot of cortisol because of chronic stress. So it’s possible your chronic adrenal stress could be causing you to dump a whole bunch of potassium out. So that’s where when you’re getting stress, under stress, physical chemical emotional, maybe that gluten is causing the stress, right? You’re gonna probably need more potassium, more minerals. potassium and magnesium are the most common ones. It’s so hard to get them most people get enough sodium and chloride because of just it’s in their natural junk food. I don’t get they don’t get the good quality from like a good high quality sea salt or Redmond Real Salt, but they’re getting some it’s really the magnesium and potassium I’m seeing as the big big missing pieces and today we’re really focusing on potassium.
Evan Brand: Yeah, makes sense. I mean, think about what happens when you’re dealing with somebody that’s really stressed right? They may have issues with constipation, they may have issues with Sleep, they may have issues with their blood pressure, they may have issues with anxiety as you hit on earlier, potentially Heart, heart pumps. So all of that, to me sounds like stress induced mineral depletion, which then causes other symptoms and you’re stressed about your blood pressure being elevated. So then that cortisol dump and adrenaline dumps more minerals, and then it become more mineral deficient. So you see how this thing can get out of control. And it sounds really cliche and corny to say, well, stress did it but it really does. And it’s not just the emotional, it’s the gut stress. It’s all of it that we always hit on.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. Also people are talking about in the messaging. Well, what about if I’m in ketosis and I don’t have glucose to open the cell? Well, I mean, we’re just talking about with x with extra exercise, right extra exercise, extra sweating. If you’re doing a lot of glycogen depleting kind of movement or exercise, you’re probably going to want to do some type of a glucose kind of refeed the night before the movement. And a lot of athletes who do keto still have a punctuated kind of glide And reefy the night before just other tapping their muscles out, because your muscles can hold anywhere between 250 to three to 400 milligrams or grams of glucose or glycogen, right? glucose in the muscles is glycogen, it’s stored, right? That’s the storage form of glucose in the muscles. So a lot of people, they’ll be in ketosis most of the time, they’ll do a refeed the night before, that way they have access to that glucose The next day, and again, depending on how depleting or how long you’re exercising, you probably want a nice little bit of a glucose, electrolyte drink. And again, that’s not most of the time, that’s going to be just more timed up according to exercise and kind of what your metabolic needs are. But for most people, you know, a good natural Gatorade source, guess what coconut water, got a little bit of glucose, a little bit of sugar in there, and it has a lot of potassium, so that can kind of be mother’s nature’s natural kind of Gatorade. It just depends on what you’re doing. If your kids playing football and sweating a ton, they may need a little bit more than that. You’re going to have to just feel it out. See what works. Test it on your own when your practice To sing and playing and see how you feel with that you may not need pure coconut water, maybe just diluted half and a half with a really good clean mineral water. And then you have a little bit of glucose, a little bit of extra potassium plus the other minerals working for you.
Evan Brand: Yep, you want to hit a little bit of the diet piece. Yes, you and I were kind of looking at some of this before you pointed out. Interestingly, and we’ve probably talked about this in previous but if you look at 100 grams of food as a measurement, the potassium per 100 gram of avocado is higher significantly than bananas. If you look at a full avocado, versus a full cup of banana, which maybe is a full banana, you’ve got almost double in the avocado. So you know as a kid, I remember thinking potassium banana, and that’s just kind of this thing you grow up with. But in reality, there’s things that are much much higher like beet greens takes the cake with number one here. 1300 milligram per cup of potassium that is insanity.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So most people don’t get it. So if you’re sitting Get in there. And you’re on keto, right? Well, what are the biggest easiest things you can do? Well, beet greens is number one. Okay? What’s number two salmon, high quality fish that’s per hundred grams. So what’s 100 grams? 100 grams is about 3.3 ounces ish. Let me just double check that hundred grams and ounces. I’m pretty sure that’s what it
Evan Brand: sounds about, right? Because it says here, potassium per six ounce filet of salmon.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So 3.5. So what does that mean? So Alright, so if you’re keto, right, and you want to really be on top of this, or you’re keeping your carbs down, what does that mean? That means Okay, if I eat seven ounces of meat, seven ounces of fish, I’m at 1300 milligrams of potassium, boom, you’re right there. And then you throw in some beet greens with it right? That’s three ounces worth right hundred grams. You’re at another one gram almost. And then guess what? You cut up an avocado with that. Right big avocados. Another 500 I’m sorry, another per avocado. You’re about one gram per full avocado you’re set. Right?
Evan Brand: I want to look up cassava because I love cassava. And what if you like did some guacamole with like cassava chips? I wonder if we’re getting any?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh yeah, so we could do like Yuka in potassium because Yuka in protect you guys same thing as cassava. Yeah. So one cup of cassava is 558 milligrams, boom.
Evan Brand: So because our chips and I mean now, some would argue, well, you know, the, the baking process and whatever of the chips, okay, whatever, but it’s still better than zero.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, but a lot of times if you don’t bake it or cook it, you’re not going to be able to get the nutrients anyway. Like, if you look at broccoli, raw versus broccoli steamed, you’re going to see the nutritional value in the content goes up once you cook it, because then the fiber is broken down so you can actually access some of those nutrients.
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So cooking a lot of times can make certain nutrients more bioavailable, too. It’s not Oh, cooking bad all the time.
Evan Brand: No, I’m just thinking. I’m just thinking of the one devil’s advocate out there saying oh well you’re eating. you’re advocating Eating, you know, chips fried and avocado oil. It’s like Yeah, I am. I think it’d be great.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think it’s okay. I think it’s fine. I mean, don’t make it a staple. But I mean, I think it’s if you’re gonna have something like that it’s all about not going to the place in your head about like, Hey, what do you have to cut out versus Hey, what can I substitute? When you have a substitution mindset versus the cutting out mindset? One, you feel a lot more free and you feel like you’re not missing out on stuff because there’s always a good healthy stuff the tuition option that works. So let’s let’s kind of just create a simple day like what does a day of potassium look like? So off the bat, you know, on the vegetable side, one cup of you know, your typical vegetable greens will be anywhere between 500 milligrams to about 800 milligrams depending on the vegetables, right? Like one avocados gonna be about a gram, right? One cup of Swiss chard is gonna be about a gram. So you’re really at the top with those. One cup of spinach is about 840 milligrams, and then you have on the lower side, which would be like broccoli and brussel sprouts are closest 500 milligrams. So just to kind of give you a sample day here, let’s say we start out with a full avocado, boom, you got one gram of potassium so that now you’re like you’re like really on the way there. If you do a serving of fish like a good six ounce serving of fish, now what? Well now another gram is added, right? No problem. All right, and then now you’re at about now you’re at about two grams. And then if you throw in a green juice like this, you’re over three. And then if you have a serving of squash, or even white potato, or sweet potato, well now you’re at another 500 to 800 milligrams. Okay, now you’re at 35 to 3800 milligrams. And then you just need about four more servings of vegetables. And most people when they have veggies, they’re probably going to have two servings at a time, right? They’ll probably have close to a gram anyway. So you need about, I would say about four to six servings of a good quality green vegetable, you’re probably going to need one full avocado, and then one full serving of a good quality fish. And then you’ll get right about there and then you can always add in an extra avocado, you could always add in a little bit more fish, you could always add in a little bit more beet greens or green vegetables to get you the rest of the way there which is about 4500 to 4700. And then if you’re doing a lot more sweating, you could always throw in some coconut water. So I would say about six servings of green vegetables one full avocado, a good serving of fish and then you can always plug and play coconut water or banana according to what your metabolic needs are. What do you think?
Evan Brand: Yeah, and yeah, very good. And you didn’t mention any nuts which is another easy low hanging fruit so if you can get away with doing like pumpkin seeds, you can get a ton there if you do almonds or almond butter or you put a scoop of almond butter in a smoothie, you can get some there pistachios are super high and then I was looking on this other foods like-
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: potatoes potatoes are huge so it means depending white potatoes if you’re trying to keep low carb or autoimmune find Nick’s that go to a squash or a potato but potatoes are very, very high in potassium. He will forget that.
Evan Brand: Yep, yep. I was looking on this nutrient density chart. Whey Protein is number four 100 grams away, you’re getting over two grams 2200 milligram potassium 400 grams away. So if you can tolerate a good high quality Grass Fed Whey protein, that’d be easy. Think about if you made a smoothie with some greens, some whey protein in there, he threw some pumpkin seeds and a scoop on the butter, man, you’re set.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: How many milligrams in the way?
Evan Brand: 2200 for 100 grams of, you know substance 2200 potassium.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: okay, I put 400 grams in the whey protein. Okay, so your typical servings probably like 25. So how many again, per 120 200? Okay, so if you’re doing maybe 25 or 30 grams of protein, which is what most people do in a scoop, I mean, you’re probably about what 500 milligrams.
Evan Brand: I’m going to look up I’m going to see what the serving size is because you and I use a couple professional grass fed powders. Let me see what the what it looks like. Yeah, so so one scoop Typically is 30 grams. So exactly, exactly, yeah, so you could almost call it you could almost call it one third then so you know 2200 divided by 600
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: ish 656 50 ish. Okay, that’s cool. Someone else also asked about the vertigo and dizziness Yeah, low potassium can cause that vertigo and dizziness kind of feeling. So we kind of gave the general recommendation of 45 to 4700 milligrams of what you need per day on the potassium side. Most people aren’t hitting it, you’re getting six to eight servings of green vegetables, a high quality serving a good fish and some potassium and maybe I’m sorry, potassium from a full avocado or a green drink or some extra say starch, squash or sweet potato or white potato, you’re gonna be there at about 45 to 4700 milligrams. Most people may need more if they’re sweating, or if they’re under a lot of adrenal stress. So you may want to think about supplementing, if you’re still doing a great job on your food and you’re not there. You may want to fill in the gap, or you may want to just try it out. Add in a couple more of these nutrient dense foods that Evan and I just hit, and see if that fixes the issue. So, a lot of times people have these low potassium symptoms and they see it go away the BR and all I see is you’re going to see a lot of heart stuff, and a lot of muscle cramping stuff, those are going to be big things. So if you see the heart start to get better or the cramping get better. That’s an easy sign that you’re on the right track.
Evan Brand: What do you think, Kevin? Well, I think this is fun, and it’s something that can’t be ignored. So please address this, work on this, tweak it and see how you feel, I definitely feel better. I feel in a better mood. I feel more energetic when I’m staying regular with getting enough electrolytes as a whole. So I think he could be a game changer. And we can run some of these analyses on your body. You and I kind of talked before we hit record about how the blood really doesn’t change much. So looking at serum potassium may not be the best. So there are some other panels that we can look at, but as a whole, when we’re looking at organic acids testing and stool testing and we’re looking at gut infections a lot of times We can infer just based on observation symptoms, and what else is going on that you probably got a new issue. So the good news is, you can fix this, it’s relatively cheap to free to fix it outside of just tweaking the diet a bit at the grocery or farmers markets, but you can make it happen and make a big difference.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Now, someone else chimed in about the evolution drinks and the plastic. I’m not too worried about the plastic with these, these are all cold pressed. Alright, so they’re cold pressed so that the juice that’s put in here is cold and these are refrigerated right away. So you’re gonna have leaching of plastics more when it hits UV light and or higher heat. So not now not that concerned about plastic plus, these things have a short shelf life. So it’s not like the the juice is sitting in there for like a year. It’s just sitting in there a very short amount of time it’s not being exposed to UV light or high temperatures going to being refrigerated, right. So you got to keep all that in mind. So I think if someone’s worried about the plastic, I think the extra extra nutrients that’s in there, it overlays any risk from the planet. Plus you’re not getting the heat you’re not getting warm substances and you’re not getting the UV light so I think the plastic is isn’t as big of a deal versus like a dishonor water that sits in there for a year or two and who knows if it’s going to be exposed to light when it sits out back the the the convenience store or the supermarket thought-
Evan Brand: That’s what I’m thinking when you go to the gas station. You see the guy taking a smoke break you got the palette of dishonor water sitting there getting blasted by the sun on 100 degree day and then he goes and puts the water in the shelf at the gas station. So yeah, I think you got to choose your battles, right so I mean, the other argument would be well, if you were too busy this morning, you’re working with the kids you got to jump on here with me you got to go into clinic after this. You might not have got that green juice and you would have had zero minerals and zero potassium and zero greens because you didn’t know plastic because you would have tried to go for a blender instead. So you know.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly plus the higher quality grocery stores like Whole Foods for instance, they got a big dock the truck just goes right up to its full containment and some of the stores refrigerating it. If you’re going to a gas station and you’re kind of limited, some gas stations have the Pellegrino so you could always go by glass at the gas station. That’s probably a safer way but I’m not necessarily worried about the plastic with that but in general, a lot of sulfur in here anyway which will help you to toxify any lingering estrogen. So if you have the option I think it’s worth it.
Evan Brand: All right, well, let’s wrap this thing up. I think we covered a lot if you want to reach out clinically, Dr. Jay and I we work around the world with people we’re very grateful we’re very blessed for the opportunity to help you guys so thank you so much for not only commenting on these live videos, but of course just being there clinically because you help us learn we learned so much from working with people one on one way more than you learn in any book or any study is seeing how do people feel Hey, when you recommended this or that my energy went up 20% we love stuff like that it’s addicting for us. So we’re very very grateful and if you do want to reach out clinically, please check out Dr. Justin at Justin Health. JustinHealth.com and me, Evan brand at EvanBrand.com and we’ll be back next week to talk more.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent chatting with you guys. And if you enjoyed the content put your comments down below really want to know what you guys think. And if you have any future podcast recommendation topics we’d love to see it as well and sharing is caring. Get this to your families and friends and people that can use this information to help take control of their health. Alright guys, enjoy the fabulous holiday weekend. Take care y’all. See you later. Bye
Evan Brand: Bye.
Apple Cider Vinegar and Functional Medicine Application | Podcast #242
Apple Cider Vinegar, a popular type of vinegar, is claimed to lead to all sorts of benefits. Weight loss and reduces belly fat are just one of the things that it’s most well known for. Made by fermenting the sugar from apples, this turns them into acetic acid which is the active ingredient in vinegar.
Listen to this as Dr. Justin and Evan Brand discuss the wonders of ACV, their amazing benefits, contraindications, topical applications and more! Most importantly, how this infamous vinegar can help you in a functional medicine world.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani
In this episode, we cover:
1:08 All about Apple Cider Vinegar
06:59 ACV in Meal Times
09:52 ACV’s Amazing Benefits
15:41 ACV Topical Application
32:59 Low Potassium
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are live. Hey Evan, how are we doing today? Today’s podcast is going to be on Apple cider vinegar and its application with functional medicine and we see patients all over the world and we’re always trying to use supplements and natural medicine tools to help improve blood sugar, to help improve energy, to help improve a whole host of various physiological markers. So I’m excited to dive into this topic. How are you doing today, man?
Evan Brand: Me too. I’m doing great. I’m actually surprised at how effective Apple cider vinegar can regulate and change insulin sensitivity, blood sugar levels. We’re going to get into some of that because you’ll see some of these articles that are geared towards moms or just women in general, like here’s all these weight loss miracles and it we’ll discuss using Apple cider vinegar as a weight loss remedy, which on the surface seems kind of silly and it seems like there’s no way that’s possible. But you and I were looking into the research and this is totally true, what Apple Cider Vinegar can help with blood sugar. So let’s talk about it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, absolutely. So one of the biggest things that we look at in functional medicine world is going to be blood sugar stability and or insulin sensitivity slash insulin resistance. So blood sugar, the more we can keep blood sugar relatively stable in between meals, there’s going to be less surges of insulin on the high side and less surges of adrenaline and cortisol on the low side. So by just keeping blood sugar relatively stable, we prevent a lot of our adrenal and pancreas from having to come to the rescue to help buffer the highs and lows. So of course we make dietary changes, you know, protein, you know, eating more of a good quality protein and fat, having carbohydrates adjusted to our macronutrient needs, right? If someone’s more insulin resistant, we’ll adjust carbohydrates, focus more on non starchy vegetables versus a starch and fruit. Now that being said, there may be extra supplements we use to help improve insulin sensitivity. On top of that, we may use things like magnesium, vanadium, chromium, gymnema, various berberine. But Apple cider vinegar is shown in many studies to have a similar effect as Metformin, which is kind of an extract from a French lilac flower. But Metformin has great ability of decreasing glucose hepatic uptake, decreasing gluconeogenesis, a gluco gastric uptake, meaning less glucose absorbed through the intestine, less glucose being produced by the liver. So Apple cider vinegar has some great benefits in that it actually is shown to reduce insulin secretions and blood sugar in that first hour after eating. And that’s really where most of the insulin and blood sugar is going to bump up is that first hour. So for instance, one study showed reduced blood sugar by 34% after eating 50 grams of white bread. I have one study here in the journal of the American Diabetic Association, vinegar improves insulin sensitivity to a high carbohydrate meal and subject with insulin resistance. And just looking at the graph here, you see a significant reduction in insulin levels, 55% in subjects with diabetes compared to the other. So fasting glucose concentrations, we’re 55% more elevated in the group that did not have Apple cider vinegar. So great benefits. They are a lot of that is happening via acidic acid and its effect on the insulin receptor sites and its effect on the liver producing glucose and on the effect of the intestines absorbing that glucose. Pretty cool.
Evan Brand: It seems too easy. You just do some Apple cider vinegar with your meal times and you’re going to be better. It sounds like too, let’s say you were more lower carbohydrate even indicated genic diet and you want to go do some carbohydrates. You want to eat a big baked sweet potato but you don’t want to have as big of a glucose spike. Sounds like this would be a good time to whip out a tablespoon of Apple cider vinegar, throw with some lemon juice in there with it, a little bit of water and drink it down.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and in functional medicine world that we’re dealing with lots of people that have adrenal issues and thyroid issues and frankly blood sugar imbalances and high insulin levels tend to be a big thing. We see lots of hormone and fertility patients that have PCLs or polycystic ovarian syndrome and there’s a strong etiology and those types of conditions with insulin secretions, I mean high levels of insulin, insulin resistance, which is like the higher your insulin becomes. It’s like your kids kinda like fighting in the corner after you told them to be quiet like 10 times. You just kind of tune them out and ignore them, right? You become resistant to their, uh, to their, uh, noise, right? So the same kind of thing ourselves become resistant to that high level of insulin. So we can kind of get that volume turned down a little bit. That resistant volume turned down a little bit by using Apple cider vinegar, but we’re never going to just rely on one thing. So we’re kind of focusing on one tool in that tool belt today. But I want people to, to know that we are zoomed out and we’re trying to look at a big picture, but we’re trying to zoom in today and give you one tool and that tool belt and talk about where it really benefits and helps.
Evan Brand: Yep. So that was another piece of literature here. This is all in pub med so people can look it up themselves if they want to. We could put links with your show notes for just two tablespoons a day of Apple cider vinegar over a 12 week period resulted in four pounds of weight loss with no other modifications to diet or lifestyle. So I mean that’s pretty easy. I mean it sounds like as long as you don’t have any major gut issues that would cause you to, uh, you know, have heartburn or anything like that. And even if it’s diluted, it would help heartburn. Why don’t we talk about the stomach acid connection a bit and how it can help with basically inspiring the body, is kind of my way of looking at it. It’s really the, the catalyst, if you will, almost as if you’re taking digestive enzymes by taking ACV.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, absolutely. So off the bat, if we’re not absorbing and digesting a lot of our nutrition in our food, that’s going to be a problem because all of those nutrients go work out, work their way into the Kreb cycle, the January energy. They’re gonna work their way into beta oxidation so we can generate ATP and energy from fats. They’re going to be involved in our neurotransmitter function, which allows us to manage stress, to feel good, to focus, to feel energized, to have reward pleasure for certain activities that we engage in. And then also they’re going to help provide building blocks for our thyroid and our adrenal hormone. So very important. If we can’t digest and break down these things, there’s going to be a problem. Also, if we don’t digest and break things down, then things raw inside of us. They putrefy, they ran certify, they ferment, and that’s an a create stress in our intestinal tract as well. So if we can make sure we’re digesting and breaking things down, that gives us a huge one that takes stress off of our body. And number two, we get all the nutrients on the back end that helped run all these important metabolic pathways. Very important.
Evan Brand: Yup. So Apple cider vinegar could be used before meal time. To me, that’s the best time to do it. If you’re going to go for it, you could start out, maybe just one teaspoon, dilute it. I like to make a little homemade lemonade out of it. So I’ll do like Apple cider vinegar, lime or lemon juice, sometimes both. And then a little shot of Stevia or monk fruit and some good clean filtered water. And that’s it. And just drink that. Not saying drink a whole huge cup of it, but I’m talking maybe like a three to four ounce large shot glass worth of this combination.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So Apple cider vinegar is acidic, right? It’s a C to gases. So it’s got a pH of like three to 3.5 or so. So we’ll help lower acid. That acidity helps activate enzyme levels, right? So then that’s going to help with getting your enzymes and your proteolytic enzymes. And then the more that your food is acidified, that triggers your pancreas and gallbladder to work better and make more bile and more lipolytic enzymes and proteolytic enzymes. So that’s really helpful. Also, the nice low pH. Um, and also some of the antibacterial and antifungal benefits may help with CBO and it may help with fungal overgrowth. There’s lots of studies on, um, let’s say Apple cider vinegar right here, antibacterial action of Apple cider vinegar for foodborne pathogen bacteria, including the really nasty E.Coli 0157. This is the journal of food protection and they showed that E. Coli was significantly altered and endo or destroyed with Apple cider vinegar. So that’s really, really, really awesome benefit because we see lots of patients with SIBO and lots of patients with fungal issues and it could be beneficial. Now that being said, I do see some patients with a significant amount of SIBO that sometimes can feel worse with Apple cider vinegar because there is some fermentation with like a healthy Bragg’s Apple cider vinegar and that fermentation may increase the FODMAP content of Apple cider vinegar and people may, some may feel more bloated. So that’s the case. There may be more significant SIBO that you need things outside of Apple cider vinegar to address that bacteria or that fungal overgrowth. So most people are going to need something stronger than ACV to address those issues, like an herbal actual program and they’ll need specific testing to see what’s there. But for someone that’s kind of pretty stable, you’re going to have pretty good benefits, but it may not be enough if you’re trying to go after things very specifically when you have chronic gut issues or deeper infections.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Well said. I’m glad you brought that up, which is that this stuff is great, very helpful, but it’s not going to replace your diabetes medication if you’re still trying to regulate diabetes. It’s not going to eliminate parasites and candida overgrowth. It may be an adjunct if you will, but you can’t just get rid of gut bugs. Would just drinking Apple cider vinegar all day everyday won’t work.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup. 100% yeah, also, Apple cider vinegar has amazing benefits at flushing out and Guana Dean from protein metabolism and this is part of how it can increase, um, this how we can increase fat burning is it can flush out this Guanidine which the more that’s flushed out, that can upregulate your metabolism. And then the glucose six phosphate pathway is upregulated, which allows you to burn better fat and allows you to burn fuel better, like glucose six phosphate is part of that pathway involved in glycolysis and the Krebs cycle. So glycolysis is basically burning of glucose. And that happens right before the Krebs cycle where we have [inaudible] in all these different metabolic pathways that run round. And those spit out ATP. We create a whole bunch of, um, extra hydrogen molecules there. They can enter into beta oxidation, which allow us to generate more ATP through beta oxidation and the electron transport chain. So really, really good benefits with Apple cider vinegar and energy. And then of course, we already talked about the insulin resistance. The more insulin resistant we are, the more we’re gonna burn up things like magnesium and B vitamins because those pathways are, let’s say, upregulated when there’s more sugar and more insulin. So we actually deplete magnesium and we deplete B vitamins more when we have higher levels of blood sugar.
Evan Brand: Man. So let’s go back for a second. That’s pretty crazy. So I’ve seen articles and things mentioned where people say, Oh, Apple cider vinegar increases your mitochondrial function based on what you just said, talking about Krebs cycle. That makes sense. So you could argue that Apple cider vinegar could almost be like a pre-workout if it is going to help fuel that Krebs cycle. You could use it, maybe mix it with some of your pre-workout amino acids or something like that. Is that what you’re saying?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup, exactly. Yep. So here’s one study here talked about vinegar as a functional ingredients to improve postprandial glycemia control. And they talk about that. Um, the molecule mechanism by which vinegar can improve, I seem to control the mechanism include activation of the free fatty acid receptors. So it’s helping you burn fat better. It upregulates the A M P K pathways, which are, let’s just say, um, this is the adenosine monophosphate activated protein kinase. These are going to be pathways that are upregulated. They’re anti-aging pathways and they get upregulated with certain antioxidants and I’m pretty sure they also get upregulated with fasting as well, leads to increase fatty oxidation. So oxidizing fat is basically shuttling it into the mitochondria and burning it for fuel. It decreases gluconeogenesis. So gluconeogenesis is when the liver makes glucose out of either stored glycogen or protein, which is great. Um, and then also it lowers the free fatty acid in circulation. I think it’s cause it’s burning it more, it increases blood flow to peripheral tissue, which is amazing. Better blood flow to peripheral tissue is going to help with inflammation because inflammation tends to cause constriction in regards to blood flow increases satiation. So the more satiated we are, the less chance we are. We overeat, the less we overeat, the less insulin we surge. And then, um, so those are the, are the big mechanisms in this one article. So we want people to understand why most people that talk about these things just say, Hey, check out these cool benefits. But then it’s like, Hey man, we’re the heck the science about it. So we want to make sure that these articles are present. We’ll put them in the reference section down below. So if you guys want to take a look at it either on YouTube or on the iTunes podcast, feel free and check. We’ll take a take a look at that.
Evan Brand: So blood pressure. There was some research on this too. I saw one study, it looked like it was an animal study. There’s probably a human study I haven’t found yet, but that the acetic acid, which is the main component in the outside of vinegar, reduce levels of blood pressure. Now, if you’re like in a major hypertensive crisis and you are trying to prevent yourself from having a major issue, no, don’t just go drink Apple cider vinegar. Make sure you get help from your doctor and get a blood pressure medication, even if it’s temporarily while you work with somebody like us to get to the root cause. But this could be a good regulator if you will. Like maybe you’re just slightly hypertensive. Maybe you’re at like a one 30 over 90 maybe you can help get that closer to your one 20 over 80 with the help of Apple cider vinegar.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. Yep. I think it’s excellent. Also, we talked about fungal kind of eradication internally. So we may take anywhere between one to three teaspoons as a great way to kind of start things going, mix it in water because the Asita gas, it can be a little bit hard on the enamel, the outer part of the teeth. So we want to mix it with a little bit of water. That way it’s going to be diluted and then we just kind of shoot it down and do it like five or 10 minutes before your meal to kind of get your digestive juices going. And that will kind help the application of it. Also you can, um, if you have a sore throat, you can do that same thing and just kinda gargle with it and let it hit your throat for a minute or two. If there’s any mucus hanging out in the back of your throat, the acid will kind of emulsify it. Meaning, if you have a whole bunch of fat on the pan and you put a whole bunch of ’em soap on it, emulsifies it, it breaks it off so it can, it can be flushed down into the drain. Same thing with mucus from a throat infection in the back of your mouth. It really emulsifies it. So from an application standpoint, one to three teaspoons is pretty good. Three teaspoons of the tablespoon and at the highest we may even go to two tablespoons on the high end. And that can be great for just the digestive aspects. And then higher more for like weight loss benefits. So you want more benefits outside of just the digestive, you can go even higher and see how that goes.
Evan Brand: Cool. Good advice. Let’s talk about topical application.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So yeah, I wanted to address that. Go ahead.
Evan Brand: Yeah, so you know, we talk about poop and all that a lot, so I’m not embarrassed to talk about my story. When I had major gut bugs like four or five years ago, I had hemorrhoids and it was very uncomfortable. You’re trying to go walking and you feel the hemorrhoid. It’s not comfortable. It’s a huge, huge common issue. Many, many people don’t even talk about it. Everybody just kind of deals with it. And Apple cider vinegar was what I use topically. Just took a cotton ball, put it right on topically. Uh, you know, dabbled in some Apple cider vinegar, dab it directly onto the hemorrhoid and literally within two days it was gone. I did nothing else. I believe I had some Witch Hazel. You and I were kind of talking off air about that too, about witch hazel being a good sort of a stringent, but I don’t think I had it with me. I think I only had Apple cider vinegar. I have used witch hazel with many, many other benefits, but I believe Apple cider vinegar was my only remedy and I used it when I had poison Ivy too. I had poison Ivy real bad when I used to work at the park system and I would just do the same thing. I would just do topical, a cotton ball or cotton swab and just rub it right onto the poison Ivy. And it was a huge.. it sped up the recovery time much, much faster and reduce the itching. That way you’re not spreading the poison Ivy oil everywhere.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh 100% yeah, that’s totally smart. Love that.
Evan Brand: I’ve heard of natural remedies like using Apple cider vinegar along with essential oils for like killing fleas and such like on your cats and dogs. But I don’t know. I don’t know if I would, I’m not sure if it’s powerful enough to really do that. Do you have any, you have any feedback or experience with your pets using Apple cider vinegar and..
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so typically there’s a Cedar oil that I use from my pets for fleas and I have a couple of herbal callers that have a lot of Cedar oil as the main ingredient. So that’s the big thing that I’m using for them now for feed stuff, Apple cider vinegar, I use a herbal nail foot fungal soap or to soak it to herbs and you mix the herbs with Apple cider vinegar and that works phenomenally. I’ve seen amazing benefits with just cracking heels and extra skin from fungal overgrowth on the feet and or fungal nails and that can work amazing. And the Apple cider vinegar is great because the acidity on it can help decrease bacteria on the skin. So you can either use it kind of topically on your face, almost like as a toner or cleanser. And that can kill some bacteria on your skin. You’d want a moisturize, have a good moisturizer on the back end because it could dry things out. And then you can also topically use it on the hair. So any type of psoriasis or dandruff, a lot of times the dandruff is going to be fungal based. Psoriasis may be autoimmune based, there may be other things that happen have to happen there. Eczema, it could be autoimmune based as well, but it’s worth trying it on some of those things. But definitely for seborrheic dermatitis and or dandruff, Apple cider vinegar can be very helpful with too.
Evan Brand: Cool. Yeah. So acne scars, we found some limited research on that. Helping with scarring, so helping just reduce the skin issue. So, I mean, I may even go as far as to say possibly stretch marks. I mean, if it’s the same mechanism of tightening things up with the skin, it’s possible. I’m not going to sign in blood, but it’s possible it could help with stretch marks, but I know at least acne scars, you know there was some cool stuff on that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% yeah, of course. Other nutrients are going to be important for that. Like vitamin C and vitamin A are going to be really important because those actually provide building blocks as well as collagen. But it could be an important stimulator.
Evan Brand: Yeah, it’s not, it’s not a a miracle, it sounds like one, but it still, you still have to address these root causes. Like you could put Apple cider vinegar on your face five times a day, but if you’ve got bacterial overgrowth in your gut, you’re going to have skin issues. You have to get the proper testing and eradicate your bacterial overgrowth problem.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup. Absolutely. Yeah, 100% I’m also Apple cider vinegar has been shown to help reduce cholesterol. Now is that necessarily a good thing? Well, here’s the deal. The worst way to reduce cholesterol is going to be a statin medication because that’s gonna decrease cholesterol formation via the melodic acid pathway and that pathway is very important for producing cocuten. So when you take medications to reduce cholesterol, you’re blocking internal cocuten production, which is really important for your mitochondria. So we never want to use things that are going to really block internal nutrients, but there is some good benefits on helping it help lower cholesterol. Part of that could be through metabolism. It’s not quite sure how that’s happening, but it seems to be through healthy metabolism, which is really good and all you need is a tablespoon or two to help improve that. I think a lot of that could be via insulin because when you lower insulin, the hemo method, literary coli reductase enzyme is the main enzyme that’s involved in making cholesterol. 90% of your cholesterol is actually made by your body. So when you decrease insulin, insulin’s the major stimulator on that enzyme making more cholesterol. So I think the more plausible benefits and to be more metabolic and or through decreasing insulin when insulin is down, you’re going to make less internal cholesterol, which is good because then you’re, you’re only getting what you need and you’re not going through it and a means that are gonna have to block it and create more side effects.
Evan Brand: That makes sense. You may, and we probably did a show on this several years ago, but we should probably do it again on cholesterol. Talk about like plant sterols and some of the things we’ve seen, because we’ve had a lot of people bring that up with us with, Oh my doctor’s freaking out, my cholesterol is this, and we’ve been able to help regulate those levels using just natural plant sterols and some other nutrients.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, exactly. And we talked about the endothelial synthase and nitric oxide, which is kind of a vasodilator that kind of opens the blood vessels up. We talked about how mold exposure may have caused less of that compound which would constrict more of the vessels. We talked in the past about fructose, high amounts of fructose and sugar. Actually, well, fructose is going to be fruit sugar, but you’re going to see more of it with high fructose refined corn syrup that actually decreases nitric oxide endothelial synthase. That’s the enzyme that helps vasodilator, opens up your blood vessels. So if we decrease that enzyme, we’re decreasing blood flow and acidic gas that which is the main component in Apple cider vinegar is actually shown to increase that which is going to increase blood flow, which is great to help combat inflammation. The more we can, um, open blood flow up, that’s like a firefighter having a hose that’s wide open when they’re putting out a fire. Right? The better waterflow someone can have, the more we can put out the fire or decrease inflammation in your body, which is really important.
Evan Brand: Well that would make sense why it would lower blood pressure too, right? If you’re getting more blood flow, more vassal dilation, you know, people may say, Oh well I don’t do fructose. I don’t do corn syrup. But even if you’re not doing soda, for example, corn syrup is in so much, I mean if you’re doing just conventional ketchup, for example, let’s say you do some homemade sweet potato fries and you’re going to do some ketchup, there’s probably some corn syrup in there if that’s not like an organic ketchup. So you know, sugar and corn syrup can be very sneaky. So just cause you don’t drink soda and you’re not literally putting a spoon of sugar on your food, it can be hidden in so many different sauces. So make sure you look over that. Even some organic sauces I’ve seen like organic barbecue sauces I’ve found that have been loaded with a guy, the nectar, which is going to be really um, blood sugar spike. And then also corn syrup. I’ve seen corn syrup, like solids for example, in organic flavoring and organic spice mixes, which is just not good.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally. Also, some of the questions coming in on the live chat, some are talking about the taste. Brags actually makes a really good Apple cider vinegar drink sweetened with Stevia. There’s a couple that have sugar, but some have Stevia in it. The lime ones are really good one ginger and Apple cider one have a little bit of sugar in there at the Lime one and there’s one other one that’s pretty good, that’s pretty low in sugar, so those are great options. If someone doesn’t like tasting it, you can get one of those strengths and as a full [inaudible] they’re really nice. I really enjoy them. The lime ones.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Had the lime one the other day I tried to get my wife to drink and she’s like, Oh, so whatever, you know, just get it over with then fine. Put it with a shot of some lemon and lime juice and water and just get out.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. My wife and I are going to be delivering our second child next week, at the end of next week, so we’re really stoked. But early in the pregnancy she was having some nausea, so we did ginger, Apple cider vinegar and she did a really good with it and it helped with her digestion. She avoided any acid reflux. We also did some enzymes and HCL, but it really helped with their digestion and to help with the nausea. So if you can kind of pack it up with ginger, ginger is a mother and natural bitter. So it also helps with digestion of you can combine it. It’s even better.
Evan Brand: Beautiful. Well I’m, I’m excited for you. I was going to ask you when the countdown is, I forgot to ask you about that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s coming. It’s getting real man. And so we’re almost there down the final stretch.
Evan Brand: Oh, awesome.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So any other questions here or any other things you want to add regarding important topics on the Apple cider vinegar?
Evan Brand: I didn’t have, I didn’t have my questions pull up on my end. Is there anything else that we should hit from the people?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Um, see here? A couple of questions here. Let me kind of dive in and see which one’s most relevant.
Evan Brand: If you’re reading those. Let me, let me just mention this one other study that we had here, which was about the circulation benefits and the, this is, this is a legit study, uh, from complimentary medicine. The effect of external Apple cider vinegar on varicose veins and guess what? It seriously works on varicose veins. Now my personal preference, I’ve helped many, many, many women with varicose veins. I’ve got some amazing before and after pictures I could show you of using a pine bark extract. The pycnogenol extract on an all helps.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Those bioflavonoids are very powerful.
Evan Brand: It’s amazing. I had a woman who in six weeks, literally 80 to 90% improvement with her varicose veins, but turns out Apple cider vinegar topically can help reduce varicose veins as well, so that’s pretty cool. I’m still going to be using the pine bark, but maybe I could throw in some ACV too.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Some patients or some people here are asking about Apple cider vinegar helping with blood flow. I’m going to guess it does help with blood flow, partly because anytime you reduce inflammation and earth, any blood, their question was more around sending blood. Anytime you open up the vasculature and you reduce inflammation, blood’s gonna flow a lot better and the stickiness and the coagulability of the blood will drop so it won’t, it won’t create clots or stick as much cause inflammation and insulin are big driving factors of that. That’s part of the reason why diabetics have so many side effects, especially when the vessels go into your eyes. They’re really, really small capillaries. So any stickiness or blood flow issues can decrease blood flow to the eye, which can create cell death. So of course that’s going to be a factor. So I’m going to go out in the limits. Apple cider vinegar will help thin out the blood and of course will help improve blood flow based on all those mechanisms just mentioned.
Evan Brand: Makes sense now is they’re going to get you to a point where you’re, your blood is dangerously fan and like you shouldn’t be drinking Apple cider vinegar before you go into surgery. I mean if you’re doing a teaspoon a tablespoon a day, I really don’t think it would be that powerful.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right? You’re probably okay. But worst case, you just cut it out a couple of days ahead of time. That fish oil, any systemic enzymes like Sarah pep, today’s can be helpful. Yup. She wrote in, um, is it okay to add baking soda to an ACV? Drank? Well, if you remember like the old volcano experiments and in science class you had a whole bunch of baking soda, it will cause it to foam up. So that may be an issue for people and that may, uh, decrease the palatability. So I would probably say no. Also baking soda has a more, it will alkalize it will neutralize the pH of the Apple cider vinegar. So I’m going to, I’m going to go out on a limb and say that it will actually decrease the benefits of it. Cause part of the benefits are the acidity. And by you neutralizing the pH, I think by carbon it’s like a pH of 10 or 11. You’re taking away some of the digestive acids stimulating benefits of it. So example soda with it.
Evan Brand: Yeah. I don’t even think you’re going on a limb. That’s totally valid to me. You’re, you’re literally counteracting the ACV by doing that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and we want to kind of look at Apple cider vinegar as a tool plugged into a functional medicine program. Some patients are talking about like, Hey, what if I have stomach irritation or stomach pain from taking Apple cider vinegar? Well, my sentiments would be that you have probably thinner gut lining, like some atrophic gastritis. Now if that’s the case and you’re taking it five or 10 minutes before a meal, maybe we want to do it with food. Maybe we want to take it with food. Instead of doing a teaspoon, maybe you do a quarter to an eighth of a teaspoon. See if you can tolerate that. Maybe you do it right before you eat, just a couple ounces of water and that’s a problem. Maybe you do it with food already in your tummy that way food’s already kind of coating your gut lining. So it’s not hating raw mucosa, it’s hitting some food. So those would be the ways that I would kind of paradise it or kind of titrate it in if someone was already pretty sensitive.
Evan Brand: Well, and let’s add an extra layer on top of that conversation, which is, well, if that’s happening, there’s probably a root cause that hasn’t been addressed yet. So make sure you look at getting organic acids testing done. Get some proper stool testing done. You could have some type of infection. It could be something as simple as H pylori that’s messing up your gut. It could be bacteria, parasites, worms, it could be any of, it could be all of it. So you’d want to get some biomarkers looked at and measure your inflammation in your gut. Measure your gut lining. You can look at that secretory IGA number on the stool test. Those are all the data points that Justin and I would refer to if we had that come up in conversation.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and someone wrote is ACV Ok if you’re on blood pressure medications, magnesium, ACV, any of these nutrients, Hawthorne, that helps improve blood sugar, I’m sorry, blood pressure levels as well as blood sugar too, right? Um, it’s fine. Just make sure you’re monitoring your blood pressure and as your blood pressure drops, you go talk to the prescribing doctor. And have them decrease the medication. That’s right. That’s simple. So blood pressure is nice cause it’s very objective. You can measure it daily. There’s no blood draw. Um, the key blood pressure is tested when you’re like getting up, test it when you’re like relaxed. Cause most of the time people are in a relaxed state, right? If you’re sleeping eight hours a day and if you’re, you know, you’re not super go, go, go, go, go. You know, hopefully you know, 15 hours a day, 16 hours a day maybe outside of the Workday you’re in a more relaxed state. So kind of get a window where your blood sugar is when you’re more relaxed, when you’re stress, blood pressure because blood pressure and or blood sugar should go up because your body’s trying to manage that response and it’s trying to get more blood flow to those stressed out areas. Right. The fight or flight mechanism, the hands and feet. So definitely monitor it, use other nutrients. Don’t be all in one where it’s just one thing and work with a good functional medicine doctor so you can help drop those, that dosage.
Evan Brand: Yeah. My grandfather was able to get off his blood pressure medication he had been on for several years by using Hawthorne and some other blood pressure nutrients. Also. I got them off of fructose completely and his blood pressure was like one 20 over 80 now I still keep them on some kind of a baseline blood pressure support protocol, but he’s off the drugs. So it is possible.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. When you get to the root cause it’s amazing how much your body can just heal on its own. It’s like it’s on autopilot. We just got to remove some of the stressors and there’s a lot of natural compounds that can help accelerate that. And if we make the right diet and lifestyle changes, just like we really accelerate that path of healing.
Evan Brand: And are we saying drink Apple cider vinegar and go cold Turkey on your blood pressure drugs? No. Obviously you still gotta get to the root cause of the blood pressure drug may be needed and I’m not a huge fan of drugs, but it may be needed until you do fix those root causes. You know, if my grandfather was at 190 over 120 or something and he tried to go off the drug, that’d be dangerous. So we got it back to a really healthy level using the nutrients at the same time as a medication before we even talk with the doctor about changing the dose or getting them off of it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and one major side effect I want to highlight because someone in the chat already mentioned this and it’s really important, high amounts of Apple cider vinegar can lower potassium. So one person writes in, I usually to drink about two tablespoons of ACV a day, but one day I drank almost eight tablespoons a day and I led to me feeling anxiety after every drink. Why is that? The mechanism is that it can decrease potassium. So when you do with that much amount of Apple cider vinegar, it can lower potassium levels and more than likely that’s affecting the heart heart rates. You can just go online and type in hypo kalemia with a K that’s low potassium and that can have a lot of effects on heart and breathing. And metabolic function. We need healthy levels of potassium to run our sodium potassium pump. So more than likely, if you’re going to opt the potassium, if you’re going to up your Apple cider vinegar, that much one probably don’t go that high. But if you do, when you’re going to push it, make sure you’re getting extra potassium, whether it’s do potassium citrate in new or cream a tar tar or you’re eating extra avocados to give you that potassium, just make sure you’re not, um, you know, letting that potassium drop too low. So just be aware of that.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Any other comments there Evan?
Evan Brand: No. Did you see any other good questions? Those are really helpful. I think those added to the conversation significantly.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So I just wanted to highlight one thing here. So when we look at low potassium, this is a really, really important thing. Most people’s potassium levels are low just because you’re not consuming enough. So you’re going to get enough potassium through consuming six to eight servings of green vegetables a day. You know, one full avocado, maybe a serving a squash or sweet potato, you’ll get enough potassium. But the big signs and symptoms of low potassium or hypokalemia are going to be muscle weakness, muscle cramps, heart palpitations. So if you’re having those heart pals, difficulty breathing, feeling moody, muscle aches, stiffness, just poor digestion. That’s a big sign of low potassium and we need 4,700 milligrams of potassium a day. And if we’re more stress and our cortisol is all jacked up, we could be peeing out potassium as we’ll pee it out when we’re stressed to how buffer that that acidic load from our body’s internal acids from being stressed. And so our body will lose potassium. So you may need to get even more potassium when you’re stressed and too much Apple cider vinegar will definitely cause you to dump more potassium and be careful with that.
Evan Brand: Yeah, and we’re not pharmacist, but we do have some basic knowledge of drugs and think about the mechanism of things like Lasix and some diabetes medications, some blood pressure medications. These can cause you to go pee more. And if you’re going pee more, you could be dumping out potassium there. So I’ve had some family members that were on Lasix temporarily and they ended up getting low potassium. So then of course the doctor puts them on some really garbage potassium tablets to try to help prevent them from going into a low potassium state while they were on these water pills basically. So you’ve got to always factor in your drugs. How does that factor into the equation? But it’s not, uh, not too common for somebody to be on those.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I do find Apple cider vinegar though does help with a lot of cramping. So even though you’re not getting extra minerals, I do find there’s some mechanism where Apple cider vinegar is mobilizing minerals at some level because I do see cramps, eye twitching, muscle twitching, little fussy collation, things do improve. So that’s important. So if you do have a little bit of eye twitching stuff or a little bit of like kind of cramping or twitching a little bit of Apple cider vinegar may help. Of course you want to add in the minerals like Redmond’s real salt, potassium, magnesium are going to be the low hanging fruit from a mineral perspective.
Evan Brand: Here’s one funny one that I’m not going to do but I’ll just mention it because it was in some of the articles we were reading. Uh, Apple cider vinegar acts as a natural deodorant.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: I wouldn’t want to walk around smelling like Apple cider vinegar. So yeah, I may help the armpits but I’m not putting it on there.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. Yeah. I have a brand that I like. I’ll put the brand below Native COS, they’re great and they use Shea butter, they use probiotics in there and they use um, caprylic acid from coconut extract. So it just blends in really well and it smells really nice. Um, but yeah, I agree. Not the most pleasant thing, but also just kind of a side note, Apple cider vinegar bug bites. Really good. You get your, this is the time of year bug bites are happening. Put a little bit on your outside table there and get a little cotton swab and just any bug bites hit it. Also, if you have a wart or any lesions, you can get like a um, cotton swab, soak it up, put it on that area and then put a bandaid or a bandage around it and hold it there for a day or two. That will really help potentially these warts heel and other potential skin growths like skin tags, heels, so that can be helpful too.
Evan Brand: Cool. Well let’s wrap it up. No, I think we hit it really good. I just want to point out one more time, the fact that we’re just using this as a tool in the toolbox. This is not something we’re going to go to. If somebody says, Hey look, Dr J, I’ve got bloating and gas and burping and you know, I look six months pregnant after I eat a meal and I’m not pregnant. What do I do? We’re not going to say just drink a bunch of Apple cider vinegar. No, we’re going to say, well we need to run some organic acids testing and measure rabid nose levels, right? Acid. We’ve got to look at mitochondrial function cause you’re tired. We’ve got to look at all your nutrients, amino acids, we’ve got to take a stool sample on you and look for infection. So this is just one fun tool to discuss in the toolbox, but it is not a replacement for getting a good functional medicine workup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, the key to a good plan is we need a cohesive program that makes sense over a period of time and you need to assess the body systems and see which systems are working and aren’t working and then, why, what’s the root cause, how do we get here and make sure the root cause is fully addressed. While we may implement tools that fix the root cause and then some tools are just palliative, they just allow you to feel better in the process with the least amount of side effects in the interim. And so if you guys enjoy this, feel free to click below. You can head over to Evan’s site, EvanBrand.com or my site, at JustinHealth.com we are available for consultation worldwide and if you guys are enjoying this, thumbs up comments below. Want to know your ideas and your thoughts and um, you know, comments for future podcast topics and also, um, feel free to leave us a comment below like regarding like on our iTunes, let us know, let people know this helps us go up in the rankings. And then last thing, last but not least, as we improve the audio quality. So on the actual podcast we have upgraded crystal clear audio. So if you want to even get better audio than what you’re hearing now, feel free and subscribed to the actual podcast channel on iTunes and you’ll get like DVD quality audio. So if you want to hear our voices and even better light, that’s your opportunity.
Evan Brand: Yeah, I think it’s even better than DVD. It’s like in studio broadcast in studio.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So we’re trying to up that, trying to make a better product for you guys to enjoy, make the ride home a little bit more enjoyable. Anything else Evan, you want me to do?
Evan Brand: I would just say take care. And if people are suffering, we’re a huge fan of people going to the internet and looking out, looking up and finding like natural remedies, home remedies, that type of stuff. I’m a huge fan of that stuff. But you know, please don’t replace our podcast on Apple cider vinegar. As you getting medical help, you know, if you need help, you gotta reach out. Whether it’s to us, whether it’s, you know, talking with your doctor about modifying your diet to help you with, with blood pressure. I mean you’ve got a, you’ve got to work backwards. So I just, I, I got to keep reminding people of that because I’ve had comments from clients before where they’ll say, Oh, you know, I did this home remedy for urinary tract infection and it didn’t work. You know, I did this or this suppository and it didn’t work. And then I had to go to the ER cause I had such bad –. It’s like, okay, well yeah, I mean you read an article on the internet that was a remedy for a urinary tract infection. Not the best idea.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: May not be enough. Totally. Well, great feedback, Evan. Really enjoyed today’s podcast. We’ll be back next week and you guys have a phenomenal week. We’ll talk to y’all soon.
Evan Brand: Take care.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Bye.