The Top Causes of Gut Inflammation | Podcast #260
It’s Thanksgiving season! For today’s episode, Dr. J and Evan Brand talk about diet and lifestyle strategies during the holidays, how the food we take causes a few gut inflammation, how we address it and how we can treat it. Check out this podcast to learn more.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani
In this episode, we cover:
00:01 Thanksgiving, Instant Pot
06:38 Oils for the body
13:34 Food additives
28:52 Circadian rhythm
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are live it’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan Brand. Evan, how are you doing man? How was your Thanksgiving?
Evan Brand: I’m doing very good. I made my first Turkey. And it turned out wonderful I was in the in the Cooksey this year and I really enjoyed it. We did a pasture fed turkey that we got from like 20 minutes down the road. And we did the brine we went to Whole Foods and got this like organic seasoning Brian combo that we put in a big ol VAT basically let the turkey sit in there for 1314 hours and rubbed a bunch of grass fed butter on it the next day, put some herbs and stuff on top and bake the bad boy, I want to hear about your experience because because baking is kind of boring. You did something a lot more fun.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I’ve been smoking my Thanksgiving Day Turkey for the last five years. You know, being in Austin and with Texas barbecue. I was like hey, let’s let’s let’s do it. The old Texas style so I got a trigger smoker. I think we did. I posted an Instagram and Facebook picture honest I didn’t want it wants to take a look, you can feel free to head over to my Facebook or Instagram page. And we smoked it. I think it was Apple, cherry and oak. And it came out great did about four hour time cooked it about 250 to 280 degrees or so. And it came out phenomenal. So really great.
Evan Brand: Well other people can do Turkeys like people that are in other countries, if you don’t celebrate Thanksgiving, it doesn’t mean you can’t smoke a turkey. That’s the interesting thing. Like we do these really, really good meals, but it’s only for like one day a year. It’s like why not smoke a turkey? Just randomly maybe we should do that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I like it. I mean, I paid a little bit more money to have the turkey be like pasture fed, organic, high quality. So great meal. Excellent. My animals are still benefiting from all the the kind of the, let’s say all the cartilaginous connective tissue that I could scrounge off the carcass afterwards, so they’re loving it.
Evan Brand: Oh, yeah. Speaking of I threw the carcass out in the woods and my shih tzu she went out there and found it and I guess she gorgeous herself on the carcass and so she spent the rest of the day you can guess what she was doing. She was throwing it all up. She ate her her body weight and carcass. Oh man. That’s crazy. Very cool. So that was a bad mistake and then the turkey vultures came in the next day and finish the carcass off which was pretty cool to see. That is cool. Excellent. The life cycle thank you for the turkeys. Yeah circle of life totally.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, that’s cool. I mean, we’ve talked about a lot of diet and lifestyle strategies during the holiday. So you know some of the sites that I did good quality mashed potatoes grass fed butter, we did a gluten free grain free pumpkin pie kept it really simple. And then we just did it like green beans with some bacon in there. Some asparagus. Some squash, kept it really simple, really clean, high quality food. So it was overall great, great holiday love Thanksgiving.
Evan Brand: Yeah, we did green beans and the pressure cooker the Instant Pot which turned out good aids, put some garlic salt in there. It took like six minutes. Throw your green beans in threw in some butter threw in. She might have threw in a little avocado oil too. I can’t remember. But then some garlic salt, and of course some bacon six minutes. It was perfect. We did bake sweet potatoes, slice them up. Just put some cinnamon and coconut sugar on them with butter, put them in the oven, bake them. What else did we do almond flour muffins. Those were good. Put some almond butter on top of those bad boys. That was kind of our dessert. And yeah, so people talk about their board, and then they go off their diet. So we’re kind of transitioning into the topic of gut inflammation and the causes of it. Yes, but a lot of people sabotage themselves because they say that they get bored of their diet and they don’t know what to eat. But you could eat sweet potatoes and Turkey and green beans all the time and be totally healthy and not bored.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s typically not a good excuse. Because people that say that say they’re bored. It sounds like their diet is that of a world traveler where they’re eating all this fine cuisine. Every now and then I see it but most of the time it’s not. It’s kind of like boring grains are boring, boring, kind of conventional. Food I think I’ve seen data on it that the average person only eats 12 foods in their lifetime on at-
Evan Brand: I’ll believe it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So the fact that someone’s like well I’m bored it’s like yeah yeah but on average you’re not eating that many foods and you can really create a lot of variety eating some of the you know, paleo template foods there’s a lot of options especially with me obviously any kind of meat any kind of vegetable within reason and then healthy fats and then dialing in the carbs according to what you need and really emphasizing on food quality is important so I like that also in support man, mashed potatoes 10 minutes Easy peasy done where like you may be boiling potatoes for like, you know 45 minutes to an hour or baking them for an hour before you mash them. So really saves time. Now this may be a dumb question, but are you you’re not mashing those beforehand. You’re just throwing in like the chunks and then pressure cook the chunks. Not even a chunk, man, just the whole potato. Oh, wow. Okay, like I just throw the whole potato in done 10 minutes. Put it out, throw it on a Pyrex tray, maximum Mash mash mash mash butter salt done, beautiful like, Okay, I’m gonna try it the Instant pot really saves a lot of time you can do ribs on that thing and like 30 minutes or normally may take you five hours, I think is a really good invention. The only issue with the Instant pot is you just got to be really focused and you got to make sure that you vent it when you open the thing up. And also make sure that little kind of little thing that pops up. It’s like a little kind of meter device that pops up make sure it falls back down below so you know it’s not pressurized when you open it up and a couple of patients will burn themselves or you can read stuff online where people open it up and it is like a bomb if you open it up without depressurizing
Evan Brand: and thank you to today’s sponsor Instant Pot.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, Instant Pot! I’ll put will put our Amazon links below so if anyone wants to access the Instant Pot will put the link below we’d like it. It’s really good.
Evan Brand: That is a joke. They’re not technically sponsoring the podcast but I did see some good Black Friday deals on those. So even if you’re listening to this like a year from now, I mean the instant pots generally 100 bucks or less. So I think it should be It should be in your cooking strategy. And that way, you’re not going to be eating some of the garbage that we’re talking about, like industrial seed oils. Why don’t we talk about this, let’s dive into some of these big causes of things that people are doing to destroy their gut lining.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And just to highlight one more thing before we move on is anytime we talk about a product, we’ve actually used it ourselves and we like it. So we want to be 100% authentic about products, if we if we like it, and we’ve used it, we will talk about it just know if we are talking about it. It’s because we’ve used it and we like it. we approve it. Awesome. So let’s go dive into so you were just talking about the some of the top things that drive gut inflammation, take it away.
Evan Brand: Yeah. So the the big oils, that’s that’s the problem is a lot of these oils. And if you look at the standard American diet, just even 100 years ago, your grandparents or your great grandparents, they did not have access to these type of oils. They were going to be cooking with your traditional fast like they’re going to be doing a lot of lard and maybe some beef tallow Some of these traditional fats like if I asked my grandfather, what did your grandmother cook you? And what does she cook it with? She was not using soybean oil. She was not using corn oil. She was not using grapeseed oil, which is canola. She was not using peanut oil. And if they did something fried, it was going to be fried and possibly bacon fat, which came from the pig in the backyard of the farm, or it was going to be cooked in some type of like a beef tallow where the cows were on the back part of the farm. my grandpa’s grandparents had like 300 acres, and they had a bunch of cows back there. So it wasn’t, hey, we’re going to take this canola oil, we’re going to coat which really annoying as I’ve seen some gluten free fish out there like some breaded fish, but the problem is it’s loaded with canola oil. So it’s kind of like do you take the risk, like the pros and cons does the implement the implement inflammatory component of the canola oil does that counteract this this damaged Seed Oil, does that counteract the benefit of the cod or the salmon or whatever else you get? And the answer is, I don’t know. I think you kind of have to choose your battles. What’s your what’s your comment on it?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so when it comes down to fats, most plant fats are not going to be the best unless they’re cold extracted, or unless they’re minimally processed to extract the fats, partly because of the processes of extracting attends the damage to the fats, because the heat and the extraction process also makes the fats rancid and taste bad. There’s a lot of like deodorizing and filtration, and different processes to make it more palatable that you would never be able to have it a natural state. So the best plant fats are going to be obviously number one is coconut oil, because it’s a saturated fat, it’s any more temperature stable. And then number two would be like either a cold pressed olive oil or a good quality avocado which is primarily amodo one saturated fat and then premier something like a palm, which is more in a kind of saturated state. And then of course, you can do outside of that, and avocado oil would be pretty reasonable. And those would be my top ones on the plant side. Is there anything you wanted to add there, I mean, there are some nut based some sea based oils, but then you start ramping up the Omega six. And those may not be the best. There are some supplemental oils that are more GLA based that I’ll give supplementally like black currant seed oil, but will give it supplementally and that’s coming from great sources that are going to be in capsules that won’t be oxidized and such that will be really good and you know, wouldn’t be an oil, I hope it wasn’t my top animal or top plant based fats. And yeah, that’s going to be really helpful because bad fats are going to one create a lot of oxidative stress. And they’re going to deplete a lot of your antioxidant reserves. Because if those fats are oxidize, your bodies need a lot of vitamin C and vitamin E to help with the oxidative stress that those fats may cause your body.
Evan Brand: Very true. Let me ask you the question about the The breading so like you find a good fish, but it’s a gluten free breading. So it’s not covered in wheat. But it’s some type of non gluten containing flour, but then you’ve got canola oil. Do you think you’re still going to be net positive in terms of nutrition because you still got the good fish, but yet you’ve got the inflammatory oils? Or would you say, just get you some grilled fish? And then if you want to read it, you read it yourself?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, I’m, I’m on the fence with that there’s a product that we like, I think it’s Alexis, and they have two potato fries. And my wife will do that for my son just because it’s really easy, but they have a little bit of canola oil in there. So it’s like Ah, so you have this kind of convenience factor where ideally, if you could, you always would want to put your own fat on there if you could, and my eat my easy saturated fat or my easy fat for cooking. That’s plant based would be like avocado. I like all avocado because it tastes a little bit more neutral. I do not like olive oil as much olive oil is better for dressings, but I’ll do it Hello for cooking so I’m kind of on the fence with that but I would tend to if you have control over it You always choose the better fat over the junkie fat if you can.
Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, well said so, the interesting thing is like coconut oil and avocado, they’ve become kind of trendy and I would say avocado is not going to be a traditional fat meaning like traditional people, we’re probably not doing it because you’ve got to have some heavy duty equipment to extract oil but coconut oil would be super traditional. I mean, this would be something that help historical use
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, if you’re eating a whole avocado you’d be able to have access to that that wouldn’t be a problem but the the actual oil portions what you’re talking about, right yeah,
Evan Brand: I’m talking just you know, pouring it in your in your pan and cooking something with it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, your your big fats that are going to be plant based would probably be primarily coconut. But then your your biggest ones that I think are going to be used more, you know, long term from generation to generation will be your like your Talos, right? Your bacon fat, your duck fat, those kind of things because saturated fats don’t go bad, right. They stay good for Long time because the carbon is saturated with four hydrogen bonds between them, which makes the fat really really really temperature stable.
Evan Brand: It’s beautiful. Alright, so we hit the we hit the oils, those are bad, they’re bad for your gut. They cause inflammation, oxidative stress, food additives. Let’s talk about those next. Here’s the hard part is food additives are in literally everything you could even go and get like an organic. I was looking at some organic gravy, like a gravy mixture, but it had added stuff to it like maltodextrin and flavors and stuff like that. And so of course you always there’s a spectrum right there’s the straight garbage MSG, caragenin Splenda type things that will go into but then you’ve got the spectrum where maybe you find organic spices that had a little flavor added but it was an organic flavor, and you don’t worry about it as much.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. Yep. I like that the spices and the flavoring are going to be big, MSG, aspartame, they’re going to be more excited toxins. They can increase brain fog. They can stimulate your brain neurons to death, so to speak. That’s where some of that data came from. So not the best thing long term. And of course, you know, inflammation in the gut can create inflammation in the brain. So if you’re listening to this, and you don’t have any gut issues, most people associate foods or additives or bad fats with gut issues, but a lot of times it could just be increased inflammation. And that inflammation could be manifesting from joint pain or headaches or mood issues or brain fog. So just remember when we talk about some of these things, it may not necessarily be connected to a digestive issue or a gut issue. And that’s the hardest thing people to wrap their heads around.
Evan Brand: Yeah, let’s talk about this study we’ve got here on food additives, specifically Splenda, it’s ridiculous. You’ll see things that are promoted as healthy but then they have added Splenda to them. You have to there was a paper it was 2018 inflammatory bowel disease was the paper I guess I don’t see any other any other journal it was from but long story short, Splenda. It says here in the in the conclusion of the study Is that Splenda promoted dysbiosis. And we did a whole show on that. We’ve done many, many, many on dysbiosis. But basically an imbalance of good and bad bacteria, which then creates inflammation, intestinal permeability, and on and on. But all you could do that just with Splenda. So it’s like, oh, I eat paleo, but yet I put Splenda. We’re like when those little fake drink packets, you know those little Have you seen those the little packets where it’s like a fruit punch and you put it in your water, but it’s got Splenda instead of stevia. It’s just
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: not good. Not good. Yeah. If you want something like that, you’re much better off getting their Sweet Leaf brand and put a couple of drops of stevia in there with something like that or using an essential oil like lemon or lime or just grabbing a lime or lemon and just squeezing in and that’s a much better way to do it.
Evan Brand: I like to do monk fruit, I’ve got a lot of some monk fruit liquid. And so we’ll just take half along half a lemon, about five drops among crew and you’ve got an amazing lemonade and you’re not going to need any of those little face. Splenda, flavor packs, they’re just terrible.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and with flavoring in general, you want to make it a minority of the time, because when you’re putting something a whole bunch of sweet stuff in there, and your tongue is hitting sweet your brains like program that sweet means calories. And calories also mean sugar as well. So there could be a minor insulin spike that could happen. And it’s just not good to program your brain. Sweet, sweet, sweet, no nutrition, no calorie. So it’s not good to have that long term. But if we’re kind of doing an 8020 thing, and that’s kind of in your 20%, and you’re trying to use a healthy cheat option as a replacement, I think it’s fine.
Evan Brand: Yeah. And you’re saying, basically, the body’s getting tricked, even if it is a natural sweetener. You don’t want to hit that sweet button over and over.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I just want to draw a line between everyday staples and things that are healthier cheat options that’s in the healthier cheat option. categories, not a healthier staple category.
Evan Brand: Yeah, you don’t want to live on like the stevia soda, for example.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Yeah, exactly. Your Much better off staples would be Topachico Pellegrino filtered water, maybe add an essential oil to it or add a squeezed lemon or lime. Those are going to be more of your staples and these other things they’re going to be in your 20% category.
Evan Brand: Let’s talk about this to those another paper that we had here on karijini which is a seaweed based polysaccharide. A lot of times it’s put in toothpaste, but it’s often in a lot of food and like sauces and anything that needs to be thick. So a lot of times now you’ll see caragenin free in certain products, but that also can exacerbate inflammatory bowel disease. And there are some papers on both splenda and Caragenin, so caragenin is probably healthier than Splenda. But it can still negatively affect the gut. And at the end of the day, we’re just saying eat real food because if it’s not processed, if it’s a process, paleo style food, it could still have some negative qualities to it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it? Yep. 100% 100% agree. Yeah, you have a courageous And there’s another one I forget. That’s like an emulsifier. Like that was like guar gum. Yeah, that’s what it is. Some of those I think are also a little bit higher at fodmaps, too. So people that have significant tseebo can sometimes get a little bit more bloated from some of those things. So it’s good to keep those in mind. I know there’s I think its native forest. It makes the coconut milk coconut cream without the guar gum. So another thing that could be there, there’s some studies showing that can be beneficial and not bad. So kind of go back and forth on it. So if you have a negative implication with it, that could be it and you may want to just find a healthier, healthier option. Yeah. What’s next on the list you want to talk about? Well, let’s go over gut infections. We talked about gut infections all the time. We see patients that come in that think their issue is a Candida or they think it’s an H. pylori, and sometimes it can be all the all of the above, and we don’t even know that. So it’s really important that we get some good testing done. It’s really important that when we have a gut infection, we have to have a sequence and how we deal with it. So people that have got infections you got to make the day changes you have to work on the digestion first because those can be serious impediments for your body healing. And the gut infection a lot of times can be part of the reason why you don’t feel good. Sometimes it can be all of the reason, but I’d say most people, it’s part of a couple other things that are happening. But people you know, we’re in a culture that’s very antibiotic driven. Oh, you have staff you have strep, kill it now antibiotic, you know, laser beam focused, hit it. And that may not be the case. And number one, it can be a big letdown. People are like, Oh, man, you know, that didn’t that wasn’t it. But number two, a lot of times they can feel worse. So you really want to make sure if there is an infection, that you have a plan that’s comprehensive in nature, that’s addressing what’s going on and again, this may be a little different if it’s totally acute, like hey, I’m in Mexico, I’m feeling great. Boom, I eat something. I feel like crap, I have diarrhea I have. Okay, we may create a different plan based upon the clinical history leading up to this point, and then how acute the symptoms are
Evan Brand: Im glad you mentioned too there’s a sort of an order of operations to that too, because there may be higher priority infections driving inflammation, as opposed to if you’ve got some Candida. Yes, Candida can be a huge problem. I did a whole summit on Candida. But if you had h pylori, we’re going to prioritize H. pylori over Candida because it’s going to affect much, much more mechanisms in the body.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% 100% I’d also say next thing is just adrenal stress. In general, we know that high levels of cortisol are going to decrease gut barrier function, it’s going to break down IGA or immunoglobulin A, which can have a beneficial effect on helping the immune system it can gobble up or potentially attack some infections that may make their way into the gut. The idea that like you get exposed to an infection, and that you automatically get infected, isn’t necessarily true. So there’s a couple of ways that may happen. Number one is you get exposed to a large amount of an infectious material overwhelms overwhelms your immune response and you’re sick no matter how healthy you are. This could be like, you’re healthy, you go for a hike, you drink some lake water, boom, you got grd or you’re sick. There’s that. There’s also Hey, you get exposed to just, you know a lot of different microbes over time. your gut is stress from cortisol and IGA imbalances. Maybe you have some food allergens too. Maybe your stomach acid and enzymes have dropped. Now boom, a stressful event happens. Now you start getting sick, because your gut your digestion, your inflammation accumulates. All stress summit’s are accumulates in the body, and the gut barrier breaks down and cortisol and stress can go high, which can cause your gut barrier to break down. And then when it finally drops, that’s going to make it hard for us to deal with inflammation. It’s gonna make it hard to build back that immunoglobulin barrier. And it’s going to make it hard to have energy and deal with stress.
Evan Brand: Yeah, so when people hear stress, they kind of just tune out because they’re like, everybody talks about stress. What am I supposed to do just meditate and do yoga. So here’s kind of the, I guess the granular in the flesh example of what could happen. Let’s take someone who has a bad boss, and every Monday when they go to work, they get a knot in their stomach, they feel sick to their stomach, because they know they’re going to go in, they’ve got this micromanaging boss that they hate, or I’ve got somebody that wears perfume that makes them sick next to them. So they have this fight or flight reaction, every Monday morning, and then Tuesday and on and on and on. So it might not be that your relationships are stressed, it could be but your relationships could be great your family life, your kids, I mean, your home life, all that could be great. But then you have this stress everyday of a boss that is still enough to degrade the gut barrier and cause issues over time. And we’ve seen that happen where, let’s say the boss gets transferred out and then they have a new boss that comes in and it’s a better boss and all of a sudden this person’s got complaints magically goes away. It was just because of that fight or flight reaction getting turned off. They were able to relax it. They’re just And then that parasympathetic healing reaction came in and started to work on the gut.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, many people, they kind of like categorize their stress, they kind of just say stress is, and they put it all their stress in the emotional category, work relationships, family finances, but they forget that the gluten that a meeting, or the Gup is now putting stress on my body. So now my emotional reserves drop. So instead of being able to have three or four emotional stress problems at one time, now I can only deal with one. And then now I’m flipping out on my kids or I’m arguing with my wife and we’re fighting more or losing my cool at work part of that is is because that emotional stress bandwidth drops when other stressors come in. So it’s like, people just kind of look at emotional stress, like it’s this, this thing unto itself and I just have to change my strategy or or meditate more, but a lot of times, fixing the other stressors that we talked about, allow more bandwidth to be allocated to that part. The system.
Evan Brand: Oh, well said Amazing, amazing, important point. It’s like, Okay, I’m gonna eat my avocado toast, and then go do yoga. It’s like, Ah, you gotta realize that bread or whatever it is that processed stuff is damaging the gut. So you could just have a completely stress free life. You might even be retired. But yet you had a donut, and then you feel like crap. And you don’t know why it sounds so simple. Like when we pointed out, it’s like, duh, but I’m glad you brought it up because people skip out on that. They don’t realize, Hey, I ate this. Now I damaged the gut. Now I have this emotional response, or I have an overreaction, because then then you get into the whole conversation of blood sugar too, right? It’s like, Okay, I’m eating these foods that are causing the blood sugar to spike and then crash and spiking crash. That is a stress. Even if your life is not stressful, you’ve still got stress
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and again, a lot of these things, they aren’t intuitive. The reason why they’re there are Our radar is because we see it clinically play out over and over and over again. It’s like, Hey, you change the diet, you you see some new nutritional compounds or nutrients are low in the person’s diet, we stopped them that we fixed digestion, hey, there may be an infection we work on that we support the adrenal, and now the person’s productivity at work. And they’re like, yeah, work isn’t as stressful. It’s okay, because your bandwidth has been freed up. It’s like you got this program in the background, that is just sucking up all of your RAM. And then now we close down that program or we update the software and get a better version for your operating system. And it’s like, boom, now, things aren’t as big of a deal.
Evan Brand: Not to mention, if we throw in some adaptogenic herbs or some liver support, you really start to have a lot more RAM available. So it’s amazing because people they may not have much change in their day to day life, but the way they respond to that day to day stress is significantly better. And that’s priceless.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And I see it can affect women a little bit more because of their cycle. And a lot of women they know like always week before their cycle, they are up in arms regarding headaches or breast tenderness or back pain or mood stuff, or they’re just losing a lot of blood, which causes them to be anemic. And then they have low iron and their energy drops. So a lot of times it can compound a lot of those female hormones and make them feel not good for a week. And so a lot of times, the first thing we see with women is that PMS starts to go from maybe seven days to like one or two. And that’s a huge thing, or their irritability or breast tenderness switches a lot. Because with women, progesterone is actually a precursor to their stress hormones. So when they start getting stressed, they lose their progesterone, and they start becoming estrogen dominant. And then all of those estrogen dominance symptoms, some I just mentioned, start to become activated.
Evan Brand: Yeah, the thing the the issues with the hormones are more apparent during the cycle,
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: it’s more apparent. So if you’re a woman listening to this and your PMS starts getting worse. That’s the first thing we Look at is what stressors have been activated. You know, women’s cycles are more women’s hormonal rhythms are more intricate. They’re like a beautiful Symphony that has the the, the the wind instruments, the string instruments, the percussion instruments. And when one instrument starts to go off, that Symphony turns to noise pretty fast for men are just kind of, like a foghorn, are kind of like a one note instrument that’s just kind of in the background the whole time. So it’s a little bit it’s a little bit harder to knock that the foghorn off. But the symphony, it’s easier to make it sound not so good, fast.
Evan Brand: Yeah, the women are like, Oh, he just won me over. He called my hormones and beautiful Symphony.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s a lot of stuff happening underneath the hood. And it’s amazing when you can just get the estrogen dominance under control, and now you’re not as anemic. And then now you’re able to carry oxygen better and your mitochondria works better and your thyroid works better. And then also when your progesterone levels come up a little bit more. Now you’re able to open those Gabba chloride channels. You’re not as anxious you’re not as Moody, the estrogen dominance drops to the breast tenderness and the muscle contraction causing the back pains now gone. It’s amazing what happens. And some women, it’s sad they live some have half their cycle is is almost like a PMS kind of up and down wagon. The goal is maybe we have one or two days or maybe it’s a half a day and it sneaks up on you. That’s the ideal goal. And it’s because you know, the husband’s benefit too. And the women are far more productive, and they feel better.
Evan Brand: Absolutely. Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And also just kind of like comparing contrasting, you know, what are your options, right? Ladies listening, you know what your options are? It’s going to be birth control pill, and then those have their own side effects. It’s going to be an antidepressant. And that’s pretty much it. And then if you’re menopausal, maybe it’s the HRT hopefully they’ll recommend the Premarin provera which is horse hormones, right? So those are your pretty much your three options. And then of course, you know, ibuprofen, might all those kind of things to manage any pain or cramping, you don’t really have that much so and none of its true causal, right. None of its true causal.
Evan Brand: Yeah, so I just want to point out that just because something is common doesn’t make it normal so if you and all your female co workers or your female friends you all complain about your periods together and oh my god my periods so miserable my PMS and my husband better watch out today it’s like ah yes common but not normal My wife is a breeze through her cycle and even in the postpartum period, it was great and her cycle came back normal and there wasn’t anything crazy and I think it’s just because we’ve we’ve tried and put so much work into this years and years and years you do start to get this point where Hey, the periods sneaks up on you and you had the golden points
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: we wanted to sneak up on them or at least get it down to like one or two minor days versus you know major or even a week or plus of major stuff.
Evan Brand: And this is not a pipe dream. This is a reality that we see all the time clinically and thousand percent and also.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundreds for sure. Yep, hundred percent. Also, let’s go talk about circadian rhythm or sleep stuff right? We know sleeps a big deal because That’s where we recharge a lot of our hormones, our adrenal and our neurotransmitters. And these are really important for stress. So if we don’t recharge these glandular systems, if we don’t recharge our neurotransmitters, that our ability to deal with stress gets forwarded. And the more we’re not able to deal with perceived stress, the more our guts going to be broken down and affected, the more our sympathetic nervous system will be affected. So it’s a lot of stress is perception based where you could take someone who has a larger bandwidth to deal with stress, put them in the same situation and they may not have the same physiological sympathetic nervous system response because they have more bandwidth than you. And then if that response isn’t happening, then they’re not going to have all the side effects of you know, the sympathetic nervous system, decreasing stomach acid or enzymes are breaking down their gut lining or making it hard to break down food. So the more we can allocate good bandwidth through recharging our neurotransmitters adrenaline dopa mean Gabba recharging are glandular systems, right pituitary adrenal thyroid ovaries, the better chance testicles, a better chance that we are going to be able to deal with stress the next day.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Well said, Well, we’ve got a couple papers on this. So why don’t we talk about this here regarding the circadian rhythm disruption. You know, we’re talking to people specifically that are working night shift or swing shift, or people that are just using artificial light at night. They’re not protecting themselves from the nighttime EMF and light exposure, even just a couple of days, which is kind of hard to believe but even just a couple of days of circadian rhythm disruption. So what that means is I’m talking to the people who they go to bed at 9pm on the work day, but then they stay up till midnight or 1am or 2am on the weekends. Just those two to three days is enough to create changes in your gut, increasing the pro inflammatory bacterial species. So long story short, you need to go to bed at the same time, every day. You’re not typically going to benefit. I mean, maybe you have more social life and you go out and I don’t know drink some poison at the club and poison your gut and start to kill your liver even more. And then you stay up all and then you’re hungover the next day. I mean, God, I just don’t see the benefit of that lifestyle if that’s what you got to do. Okay, but just know hey, there’s paper showing you doing those weekend benches just on Netflix, if even if you’re like, I don’t drink alcohol evidence, poison, I know you’re right. Okay, you stay up till 1am watching something. But on the weekday, you went to bed at nine, that is still messing up your gut and if your gut is messed up, then you really can’t afford to, to lose that benefit. That could be another 10 or 20% of your issue right there.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. So do your best. People are going to stay up later on the weekend. It just is going to be what it is. So we can always use extra magnesium. We can use glutathione before bed. If we’re going to drink alcohol, we can always use activated We can make sure we do our best to get to sleep a little bit more to get sneak it up on the back end and just do our best to maybe take a tiny bit of melatonin or a little bit of natural sleep support to kind of get us back on track start the week. So we kind of have like our goal of perfect and then we have things that we can biohack to get us back on track and still cheat a little bit.
Evan Brand: Call me boring. And maybe it’s just because I have kids that are young, but I go to bed pretty much the same time every night. So maybe in five years, you’ll be listening to this podcast and be like, oh, Evan, remember when you used to go to bed at nine every day? Or 10? You know, I don’t? Maybe Maybe I’ll change but for now, every night is about same time for me and I feel good.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep, I agree. I think it’s great. A couple of the things on medication side of the fence we we got to talk about this is important. So there’s a couple of different medications that I consider to be destructive. Number one are going to be the antibiotics and sometimes it may be necessary if you’re in a difficult situation. But if we can have a couple of tools that we can utilize, we may be able to avoid it right we have different herbs that we can use. Oil of oregano golden sea We have different formulas like in my gi clear line, we have chapter one through six that will use in certain occasions and evidence the same as you will with you, you have some of the microbiome products that are used in similar situations, a lot of times this can be beneficial and prevent the need for antibiotics to be just given right off the bat number one. And then of course number two would be things that affect digestion, proton pump inhibitors on nippers, old pentapresol, any acid blockers or h2 blockers that are designed to disrupt or lower stomach acid can be a big deal because that’s going to make it hard for you to break down your food. Think of HCl as your natural kind of bleach or disinfectant for the dirty picnic table, right. So it keeps the gut microbes from growing out of control. It helps break down the proteins, it starts initiating all the domino reactions for digestion. And that good acidity helps close the esophageal sphincter and prevents things from also rising up as well.
Evan Brand: I’ve seen probably no joke within the last six months to a year 50 to 100 children ranging from six months old to 15. And above years old, have kids that are clients of mine that were put on proton pump inhibitors by their pediatrician or by the gastroenterologist. I’m talking like you got a one year old kid that has some skin rashes, or there’s something going on maybe it’s burping or maybe it’s gas or something’s just not right with a one year old. And they don’t even bring up diet changes at all. If they’re still being breastfed. They don’t bring what’s in the mom’s diet into the consideration. It’s just here’s a PPI for a one year old. I mean, it’s almost criminal.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It is, I mean, they’ll do the tagamet a lot of times, and most of the time, it’s just the, the mom typically is eating a food allergen that’s usually driving it or they’re just could be some needed some extra probiotics and that can be a big one. So we’ll do some of the infantis blend of probiotics to help with some of the newborns And we’ll really look at some of the food allergens in the mom that can help a ton.
Evan Brand: There’s dysbiosis and kids all the time though, man, we’ve talked about this before, but my daughter when we first ran her stool test, she was around two years old, and she had various parasites and bacterial overgrowth, got rid of that retested showed up with H. pylori, got rid of that retested showed up with some other bugs. And so these bugs are everywhere. We don’t expect you to avoid them tap water, soil food, I mean, your kids are playing in the dirt, you’re playing in the dirt. Hopefully, you’re going to get exposed to these things. A lot of people ask us the question of Hey, Dr. J. Evan. How do I avoid these you can’t it’s just a matter of you trying to be resilient enough and you have, like you said adequate levels of stomach acid to prevent if you do drink tap water or you eat the sushi and you get exposed to blasto. Hopefully your HCl kills it off and it doesn’t become an infection. But most of the time, people are too stressed and too overwhelmed and that system, the protective response is altered or reduced
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% 100% Last thing I wanted to highlight was just environmental toxins. This could be things ranging from heavy metals, like aluminum or mercury or lead that could be damaging to the gut lining and also the neurological tissue. Right. Remember your nervous system and your entire nervous system is located in the gut. So that can have a big impact and as well as things like mold and mycotoxins, as Evan knows, environmental mold, can cause lots of gut issues I’ve seen it caused lots of digestive distress, bloating, I seen it affect motility. And then of course, when that happens, then it can affect your vestibular system, mood, energy, everything else. So I’d say molds a big one. I’d say heavy metals are a big one and of course, environmental estrogens whether it’s pesticides or plastics, whether it’s Bisphenol A or dioxin or Falaise, any of these compounds that are kind of in plasticizer compounds.
Evan Brand: Yeah, your chemicals in your food, which we always talk about killing your good bacteria. That’s basically an animal biotic, you know, glyphosate is essentially an antibiotic in the sense that it kills good bacteria and promotes dysbiotic flora. So, yeah, I think that’s a huge point.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think it’s important and we can talk about, you know, each one of these topics could be one podcast in and of itself, and they probably already have since we have hundreds in the bank, so anyone listening really enjoys the content, click below, make sure you access some of the great handouts and great links on our websites. We have transcriptions as well that you can get access to. And if you want to dive in deeper because you think one of these things may be an issue with you feel free. Click below to access Evan brand calm or just in health, calm me, Dr. Justin, and we can dive in deeper and work on getting to the root cause. any last comments, Evan?
Evan Brand: I would just say we’re really grateful to be in the opportunity to help people so most of you all we’re just helping you because you’re listening and you’re making changes but if you feel like you’re buying random supplements, you don’t know what you’re doing. You’re building up a supplement graveyard. hire some help. I know a lot of people they they don’t want to That because they feel that they need to, like maintain their pride or like I’m a biohacker I’m going to do it myself. It’s like, I try that. I mean, you know how much Justin’s helped me, we help each other, you know, so so we’re in this to, we’re not in it to prove that you can do it by yourself. We’re in it to make sure that you can get better and get back to enjoying your life. So don’t try to like be a hero. It’s okay. You’re not a failure if you need help from somebody.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, if you need a functional medicine, Sherpa, you know where your guys in general you don’t go hike Mount Everest without a Sherpa without a guide to help you. And that’s what we are the equivalent of so hope everyone enjoys it. If you enjoy it, share it with a friend or family or member a loved one that is struggling or need some of this support. It’s totally free. 99.9% people we don’t even work with directly they’re just utilizing this free content. So we just ask that everyone to utilize some of this information so they can get healthier first. It helps everyone become a better parent, a better person, a better employee, a better entrepreneur helps everyone in every single way possible. So we love that and it’s our country. the contribution to the world. Anything else, Evan?
Evan Brand: Oh, that’s beautiful, beautiful way to end it. Nope. I’ve got nothing else you all take care.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey, excellent, everyone, have a great day. Take care. Take care. Bye bye bye
Depression Solution – Dr. J Podcast #158
Dr. Justin Marchegiani and Evan Brand talk about depression and anxiety. Listen as they discuss some of the possible root cause of such condition. Understand the mechanism of depression and anxiety medications and learn why they may not be the best possible solution to the problem.
Gain an understanding on how diet, especially a vegan diet, becomes an important factor when dealing with depression. Explore how gut infections relate to depression and anxiety symptoms and know some of the natural solutions and recommendations in addressing depression and anxiety.
In this episode, we cover:
00:56 Medications mechanism
03:40 Vegetarian Diet and Depression
05:41 Gut Infections and Depression
14:00 Natural Solutions
18:18 Low Thyroid and Mood Issues
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey guys! It’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani here. Hey Evan, how are we doing today, man?
Evan Brand: Hey man, I am great. We had a fun off-air chat. So I’m excited to chat with you about this important topic today— depression, anxiety, you know, mental health in general. But we’re gonna—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.
Evan Brand: ..specifically focus on depression, anxiety. As I was telling you, the center for disease control, they change the ranking over the past couple years. Now depression is the number one leading cause of disability. It’s actually grown over heart disease. It used to be heart disease was number one. Now depression is number one leading cause of disability. So that’s pretty alarming. I predicted this about four- five years ago I could just see the trend of society and now, it’s happened and it’s official.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally. Depression is really important because a lot of the medications that are out there. I’m just gonna pull out my little Bluetooth headset here—all the medications that are out there, typically, only treat the symptoms. So you kinda have medication from like the 80’s called tricyclics, right? And these tended to—to work with a little a side effects that a lot of the current days SSRI’s or SSNRI’s, right? These are medications that work on blocking the reuptake of serotonin and norepinephrine or dopamine. And essentially it’s allowing more neurotransmitters to sit in between the pre- and the postsynaptic neuron. So neuron—neuron, pre-post- right? Before, after and then you have all this in between area called the synaptic cleft or the uhm—essentially that’s where a lot of the neurotransmitters would hangout. The longer those guys hang out in that area, typically, what happens is you’re gonna have uhm—a recycling of those neurotransmitters at a higher level. So the longer those neurotransmitters sit in that neuro- synaptic cleft there, the faster they get broken down. So that’s why over time, a lot of antidepressant medications have to go up because of the fact that those met—those chemicals are being broken down at a much faster rate. Does that make sense?
Evan Brand: Yup. Well, the problem is, too, these medications they’re not addressing the root cause now. I know in some cases, they could be life saving therapies because they pull people out of a super deep depression or maybe they were suicidal. But as time and time goes on, the percentage used to be 80% of serotonin was coming from the gut and then it jumped up to 85 or 90% and then now, I keep seeing new literature coming out that the percentage is almost close to hundred percent now of serotonin from the gut. So we really have to address any gut infections we have to test for those, we have to find them, we have to fix them. If we really want to get to the root cause, the brain, of course, is a factor, but man, the gut seems like the biggest factor to me.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, it’s a major factor. And again, uh— one of the listeners here in the live chat brought up a lot of the shootings that have been happening recently. Yeah, these medications have a black label-warning, black box warning on them for suicidal tendencies, violent acts, these kinds of things. So it can really alter someone’s physiology and biochemistry were it may predispose them to—to these kind of violent act. So, again, I look at these type medications really only being used in a life or death kind of, “Hey, we’re gonna get this person stabilize so that they don’t do something that they’re gonna regret.” But then we have to work on getting them off these medications and get to the root cause.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And that really has to be the end goal. We need to have a transitional goal in mind so we can get to the root cause whether we start adding in specific amino acids, amino acid therapy. A lot of these neurotransmitters they come from amino acids. So there’s kind of just like the replacement model of, “Hey, let’s add more amino acids into buildup serotonin and dopamine in the brain so you feel better.” There’s that component, right? And that may be really important especially if you have a lot of malabsorption, like you’re not breaking down proteins and fats, you have low stomach acid or enzymes. It may also be important like you’re a vegetarian or vegan and you’re not getting enough of these high-quality proteins and animal source which tend to be the most nutrient dense. So there’s a lot of different things that may drive that from an amino acid perspective. And you talk about 90+ percent in the gut. The question is, “Can that serotonin cross the blood brain barrier?” I’m not sure we know if it can. From what I understand, it can’t. But uhm—a lot of the precursor amino acids like tryptophan, and/ or 5-ACP can cross the blood brain barrier.
Evan Brand: Uh—got it. Okay. I guess, so you brought the vegetarian/vegan point. This is huge. You and I both work with so many vegetarians and vegans and sometimes, they’re just not willing to add-in things to the diet. So whether it’s like egg or even fish, they just don’t want to add it in. And I’ve seen the most depression anxiety problems from vegetarian and vegan. So I wouldn’t even say it’s like just a coincidence anymore. I mean I’ve seen it so often that it’s just—it’s it’s— gotta be causation in this— in this aspect.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, you’re gonna always get higher quality amino acids, proteins from animal products. It’s just how it is. Uhm—you’re not to get a whole bunch of anti-nutrients with them, right? The way animals defend themselves with teeth and with claws. The plants defend themselves are with anti-nutrients, compounds that make it harder to break down uhm—their constituents. The lectins, phytates, mineral blockers, anti-nutrients. They make it hard to break down some of these plant. That’s how plants kind of survive, right? Animals survive through uh—claws, and being able to run, fight and flee. But once you have an animal, right? Once you already killed it and you get that meat in the table, it’s not gonna possess the same amount of anti-nutrients. And it tends to also have just pure protein and fat where a lot of the plant-based proteins are gonna have a whole bunch of carbohydrate along with it. Unless you’re doing like a pea protein powder or rice protein powder where the starch component has already been removed from the proteins.
Evan Brand: Yup. Yup. Well said. Uhm—let’s talk about some of the gut infections. How this could relate into depression, anxiety symptoms. We could talk about H. pylori. We had a question about that, too. So, we’ll go ahead and address it. How can H. pylori cause depression? We know that it’s gonna reduce stomach acid. If it’s reducing stomach acid, even if you are eating those good quality organic pastured animal proteins, you’re not gonna digest those. So you’re gonna have undigested food particles creating the leaky gut situation that can stress out the liver. We know there’s a link between mood issues and the liver. Sometimes it’s fatigue, sometimes depression, sometimes anger, irritability uh—things like that. And then you’ve got the aspect of the aminos. So I just already hit on. If you’re not digesting these proteins, that first domino could be affected all because of your low HCl production due to the H. pylori then all the sudden, you have no amino acids. Now, you’ve got no raw materials to manufacture neurotransmitters. So this is huge.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent. So—so there’s a couple different components, right? Dan writes, “Can H. pylori cause depression?” Yeah. Well, number one, it’s gonna do it by a couple different ways. Number one, it’s gonna lower stomach acid and enzyme levels which make it harder to break down proteins and healthy fats which you know, fats tend to be a really important building block for the brain. And the proteins tend to be the building blocks for the neurotransmitters. So if we have decrease in the raw material of the brain, right? And we have decrease in the neurotransmitter raw material, then we’re gonna have issues with optimal mood health, for sure. Number two, is a lot of the uhm—bacterial components of H. pylori have what I call lipopolysaccharide or endotoxins, which can cause depression by itself. It does it through going to the brain and creating inflammation to the brain. It passes through the gut junctions, creates leaky gut, goes to the brain creates inflammation and create mood issues in the brain. It also can uhm—it also can just create leaky gut and which can increase the immune system. And when the immune system is kinda over reactive, it can suck up a lot of energy. And when your energy is lower, it tend to have more likelihood of being depressed and being anxious. Typically, lower energy and depression tend to come hand-in-hand.
Evan Brand: Yup. I had H. pylori have multiple parasites. So we had a question from Dawn. He was asking what parasites are the most destructive and what parasites would cause the most amount of depression. I don’t know if we can rank it like that 1-2-3. Number one is gonna cause the most depression but I know when I had Giardia and I had cryptosporidium, I had weight loss, I had H. pylori, I had fungus, I had Candida, I had SIBO, you know, pseudomonas and bacterial infections. I was just very, very, you know, not right in the head. My sleep was off which then affect my energy, which then affected my mood. So it’s hard to say like was it chicken or egg. These parasites cause depression or was it the fact that my sleep was disrupted, therefore I wasn’t actually waking up rested. And that made me tired and depressed. Uhm— Justin, do you have any comments to add about that, like parasites, could you rank them at all, saying crypto or Giardia’s worst than dientomoeba or blasto in terms of the amount of depression it creates?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, I would definitely say you—your parasites that are tending to cause more problems because they tend to be a little bit more endemic. They tend to cause more information. But regarding in which ones, it’s hard to say. I’ve seen people have other parasitic infections that cause more problems uhm— than what they typically say on paper. Like some people have uhm— Dientamoeba fragilis but that’s typically one that may not cause a lot of symptoms. So the question is, well, why did it cause a lot of symptoms for you and not the other person. So, again, things like histo and crypto, it tend to cause more problems, but sometimes you may have a less virulent type of parasite infection and it may cause just as many issues for you. So the question is if you have an infection and you have symptoms, especially if you have an infection and you have digestive symptoms, we got out work on getting the digestion better and then fixing the infections next.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said. So we have a question about “Is it possible to for your partner to give you a parasite or if it enters your body while your system fight it off?” The literature is not clear on parasitic infections. Now Justin can tell you about like some of the correlations we’ve seen where partners have infections. We know 100% H. pylori is passed all the time. 90% of the time, I have someone that shows up with H. pylori, the spouse eventually has to get involved. We have to get them tested and we end up having to create a protocol for them, too, because I’ve had people where we create a protocol, the H. pylori’s gone on the retest of the stool and then the symptoms come back a few months later. We do another stool test, then all of a sudden H. pylori’s back again like what the hell happened. Typically it’s the partners. So then we have to get the spouse, boyfriend, girlfriend tested. They usually are the source and also we create a protocol for both of them and all of a sudden they get better. Now parasites, though, I don’t know. Justin, what’s your thoughts on passing all the parasites you know, kinda back and forth between each other? What have you seen?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I think that’s a 100% probable. We see it a lot with our chronically ill patients that tend to get reinfected over and over. That’s a factor that we always look at to make sure we get the partner, the spouse addressed coz you can definitely pass it back and forth. And I’m more worried about the inflammation, I’m more worried about leaky gut, I’m more worried about the LPS and the endotoxins making the way to the brain and creating inflammation and symptoms there. I’m also worried about just of the maldigestion, not breaking things down well not having enough stomach acid, enzymes, bile salts. So just affecting the digestion, number one. Affecting the leaky gut, number two. And then eventually making its way to the brain. Leaky gut will also cause leaky brain and that could also create more symptoms as well.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said. I mean the leaky brain thing, most people don’t talk about it. I think we’ve— we’ve hit or— we’ve hit on that topic on many episodes but I don’t think we’ve done a full one. So maybe we should add that to the list. The whole leaky brain episode. But, people, you do want to realize, if you have leaky gut and this could just be caused from non-celiac gluten sensitivity. If you’re eating gluten, we know that’s creating the leaky gut situation. That’s creating leaky brain. If you take a GABA supplement and you get relaxed from it, you have a leaky brain. And that’s not good. Because then you’re sitting in traffic, you’re breathing in diesel fumes and other pollutants. That stuff is having direct access through the blood brain barrier, which normally would protect you so that the integrity of that barrier is super important. Uhm—there’s another question here about depression. Could it be caused because of a lack of dopamine? Is supplementing with tyrosine sufficient enough to help depressive moods? Yes and no. The thing with the amino acids is it’s like a spider web. So if you do start modifying serotonin, things can get messed up with dopamine. If you just start pounding L-tyrosine, that doesn’t necessarily mean that it’s gonna fix your problem either. So, really, you wanna get organic acids test first and figure out what’s going on coz we can measure dopamine. A lot of people think they have low dopamine but it’s actually too low serotonin or some people have low serotonin and they think that it’s that. But it’s actually not. It’s actually low dopamine instead. So, vice versa. I hope that made sense. But across the board, you could be low in GABA, you could be low in your catecholamines, you could be low with your norepinephrine, epinephrine, you could be lower cortisol. So even cortisol can be a component of depression because if you’ve got adrenal problems, that cortisol rhythm is too low, your batteries aren’t charged or you’ve got too high cortisol, or your cortisol is all over the place fluctuating high and low, which could all be due to these infections. That’s the perfect recipe for depression. So tyrosine may or may not be the solution for you.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally. And I have one article here. It talks about dietary proteins having a substantial effect on the composition of gut bacteria. And they talked about for instance, suggestion of intake of dairy and meat protein at recommended level may be beneficial to maintain balance composition of gut bacteria compare with soy protein. Now, again, some of the studies are rat-based so it’s not gonna be a direct correlation, but having a healthy gut bacterial level may decrease some of that gram-negative bacteria which is some of the not so nice uhm—bacteria that tend to cause more of the LPS, right? The lipopolysaccharide and endotoxin. So if we can get the gut bacteria more in the balance, that may decrease the LPS, help with healthier gut integrity, help with less LPS getting into the brain, which creates a mood issues that way, too.
Evan Brand: Yup. So did you want to go into some of the natural solutions now? I mean, we’ve hit on neurotransmitters a bit. We hit on infection, so finding and fixing those. What about some of the free stuff, like just exercise alone just increasing BDNF, getting the movement, getting the blood going. I mean that’s huge.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.
Evan Brand: I mean exercise has change my life.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I would say that the BDNF, the Brain Derived Neurotropic Factor really helps with mood, helps with healthy, uhm— myelination, improvement of brain building uh—keep staying away from grains is really important because that can decrease blood flow up the garden hose. It’s called the carotid artery to the brain. If we decrease blood flow, we’re gonna, one, not be able clear out inflammation as well. We’re also not gonna be able to bring oxygen and nutrition to help the brain, too. So gluten is a big one. I would say, of course, your amino acid, serotonin 5 HCPL tyrosine, of course, B6 is really important. And if we’ve got bacterial imbalances that will affect B6. Also, healthy probiotics can help with gut inflammation. Remember inflammation in the gut will create inflammation in the brain. So healthy levels of Lactobacillus, bifida bacter, probotics will help cool down inflammation in the gut, which may help decrease some of that that glial site activation in the brain, which again is—is an inflammatory cell in the brain. It’s a white blood cell that it’s in the brain called the glial cells and when those get activated, it can create uhm—brain fog and it can also create mood issues, too.
Evan Brand: Oh, I wanna go back to the diet piece. So there is a piece of literature out there, a study of 9,700 vegetarians including some vegans, they were twice as likely to suffer from depression as meat eaters even after adjusting for variables such as job status, family history, and number of children. And then it goes on to talk about the lower intake of omega-3 fats, B12 and folate, which all can affect depression risk. Uhm—so on that note of the Omega 3’s, yeah, DHA, fish oil supplement could be helpful, but also, you’ve got pastured meats. You know, grass-fed beef alone contains so much more Omega threes than your standard typical low-quality meat. So, that is a really, really good piece of the puzzle.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Uhm— definitely getting 3 to 4 servings, 4 ounces of healthy fish per week is gonna be great, wild Alaskan, sockeye, skipjack tuna, you know, kinda high selenium to low mercury type of fish. You can just google that, high selenium to low mercury fish. It’s typically the higher ones are gonna be like the uhm— the shark pilot whale, those things, swordfish are gonna be much higher in mercury to selenium. Skipjack’s gonna be great. Wild Alaskan sockeye is gonna be great. Cod, Haddock, Sole. These are all gonna be higher selenium, lower Mercury. That’s great. And if you want to be on top of it more, you can do your 2 to 4 g of fish oil per day is excellent. That will have EPA and DHA in it. You know the ones like my Omega supreme has lipase in it. It’s also a triglyceride form, so it’s better absorbed, number one. LS oxidation, number two. And then the actual lipase will help you break it down in case there’s some fatty acid, you know, the digestion uh— digestive compromise things going on in there, too.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Well said. If you’re buying fish oil supplements, people, if it smells fishy, throw that stuff out. It’s garbage. It’s ethyl ester form. If you go to Target, Walgreens, uh— any of these big box stores and you’re buying fish oil, it’s crap. Do not waste your money. Buy professional grade supplement. Check out Justin’s site, justinhealth I’ve also got one, evanbrand Just look us up. Find our stores. And we’ve got good fish oils because if you’re not doing professional grade, you’re wasting your money and there’s actually literature now that if it is an oxidized rancid fish oil, you’re actually creating more inflammation when the whole goal is to suppress inflammation and help depression. You’re making it worse if you’re doing the low-quality like a Kirkland’s or a Costco or Sam’s Club or these big box uhm—fish oils, vitamin Shoppe, GNC. All those guys. That’s all consumer grade. It’s all ethyl ester. That’s not good. You want triglyceride.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And Teresa mentions a low T3. So if you have low thyroid levels, poor T4 to T3 conversion, right? Or lower thyroid or active fiber hormone T3 or tri iodo thyronine, that’s important. Low thyroid can create mood issues. It can create depression. So we’d want to get to the root cause of why the thyroid is low. It could be just a combination of an autoimmune issue driven by gluten and other infections it could be a nutrient conversion issue like selenium and vitamin A, copper, zinc, magnesium. It also could be uhm—you know, gut bacteria issue. It could also be a stress issue like cortisol, right? So adrenal function has major effects on mood, too. If the adrenals are hyper or hypo functioning, there could be some mood issues there. It could be fatigue, it could be anxiety, it could be depression, it could be a combination of all three. Typically, anxiety and depression tend to come together. Some people can have them just individually where they are either anxious or depressed. But some people they tend to ebb and flow between the two.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said. So if you have thyroid problems, you’ve got to investigate the gut, you’ve got to investigate the adrenals. We talk about that, but we can never stop talking about it because your conventional doc is not bringing this up. When you go there and you show up slightly off with your TSH, they’re not gonna say, “Hey, maybe you have gut infections. It’s causing conversion problems. Maybe you have adrenal problems that’s messing up your conversion of active thyroid hormone.” They’re not gonna say that. So we have to keep talking about it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent. And so outside of that, yeah, Tessa makes a note,
“Hey, I don’t have a thyroid.” Then you really have to make sure you’re on a full-spectrum thyroid glandular and your T3 levels are at a therapeutic level, at least above 3.0 for T3 free. Ideally, I’ll make sure T4 is above 1.0 That’s a really good starting point. And then James mentions, “What about Olympian labs omega-3 fish oil?” I’m not quite sure. It could be good, it may not. Typically, you get what you pay for. Number one, you want to make sure it’s a triglyceride form. Number two and ideally you want to make sure it’s in, you know, this is like a plus, like I , add in the lipase coz I have worked with a lot of patient that have compromised guts and I want to make sure they can break the fish oils down well. So that is another important component.
Evan Brand: Yeah I’m looking at it right now. I can’t find any information about whether that brand is a triglyceride form or not. So I’ll keep digging and see if I could find it. But, Justin and I were biased because we want people to get better. We have to actually follow up with our clients and speak with them. And if they’re not getting better that comes back on us. And so we really want to use and we always use the highest quality professional grade formulas, which tend to have tighter quality control and better certain—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And also just better potency, too. I remember I had some issues in the supply chain because some of the nutrients that we were getting, were testing positive with some—some metals and some other not—not so nice compounds. So they sent it back to the manufacturer. So the nice thing is we’re always trying to look and make sure there’s no other contaminations where let’s say a lesser quality company may just say, “look the other way and just let it go.” So we’re trying to put that quality control on it to ensure that there is not to be any extra crap in it that could throw you off, so to speak.
Evan Brand: Yes. So I ended up on the Olympia labs website here for this fish oil. It looks like and this is just to cheap, right? So if you see something for 30 bucks for a 120, that— it just sounds too cheap already. So to me, that tells me not gonna be triglyceride form. I read the entire description. I don’t see one word that includes a triglyceride form. So to me, it’s ethyl ester. You could always contact them and say, “Hey, is it up ethyl ester triglyceride?” But I’m gonna bet a hundred bucks that it’s gonna be ethyl ester which is inferior. You don’t want to put that in your body.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. But again, if you’re doing three or four servings of 4 ounces of fish a week, you may not even need fish oil. Uh—again, if you have extra inflammation, or extra brain stuff going on, cognitive stuff, mood stuff, then I would recommend supplementing it. Just so you get extra bit on top of it. Just to ensure that you know, what you’re getting is getting to where it needs to go. Is there anything else you want to add, Evan, about depression or mood stuff regarding functional medicine here?
Evan Brand: I think that’s it. We hit the gut, we hit the adrenals, we hit the thyroid aminos, liver function, digestive, anti-inflammation. I think we’ve hit all, man.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Awesome. Well, hey, great talk today. We’re doing some quicker podcast so we can get more content out there to everyone. Hope you appreciate it. If you enjoy it, give us a thumbs up. Subscribe. Click on the bell now. With YouTube, they make it so you don’t get a lot of the notifications of new videos and new content unless you are subscribed and you hit the bell. So click on that bell. Do it for Evan’s channel as well and myself. That way, you can get all this really good spoon-fed information for you guys to continue to improve your health and your friends and family health, too.
Evan Brand: Yup. If you need to reach out for a consult with Dr. J or myself, go to Justinhealth.com Evanbrand.com You can schedule consult with this. We’ll help you via phone and Skype. We work with people worldwide. We’ll help you get tested, get to the root cause. So look us up. Book a call if you need help. Don’t try to piece it together for suffering. We’re here for you. So have a great day. Take Care.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Thanks, Evan. Take Care.