Post Viral Immune Support To Improve Energy | Podcast #363

What you eat after a viral infection, when symptoms of fatigue persist, can have a marked impact on your speed of recovery. Dr. J and Evan discuss that specific foods need to be avoided or included in your diet to improve your immune system. So what are the truth and the evidence about diet and post-viral immune support?

The good news is that most people will benefit from some considerations when recovering from illness or infection. Having post-viral fatigue means that you will not have your usual energy to think, shop, prepare or eat as before. Be very practical and kind to yourself. Dr. J and Evan added that diet modification is vital in your recovery.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

0:00 – Introduction
1:57   – The role of acid-pH level in the digestive system
5:01  – The link of depression and anxiety to bloating
10:02 – The benefits of probiotics and effects of stress to digestive health
18:17 – Functional medicine strategies and testing to find the root cause of bloating

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are live. It’s Dr. J in the house with Evan Brand. Evan, how you doing man? How are your holidays? How’s everything going brother?

Evan Brand: Everything’s going pretty good. I’m trying to start 2022 off with a bang. I suspect it’s gonna be a better year than 2021. People are becoming smarter. They’re becoming more educated. They’re becoming more resourceful. People are waking up. There’s a lot of, we’re in the great awakening and so I think, this is an important time to be alive and an important time if you’re a parent, if you’re a husband, a wife, if you’ve got kids, if you’re a teacher. It’s important time to keep your eyes open and keep your ears to the ground because stuff changes quickly and you got to be like a little speedboot. You got to be able to take turns quick, you don’t want to be the titanic right now, you don’t wanna be slow in taking big turns, you gotta be nimble in these times and so what I’m alluding to is just you got to be able to navigate the world of health which is quickly evolving and that’s true. What we’re trying to talk about today is post viral fatigue and really that’s just the title but this really could apply to bacterial infections and parasites and mold exposure but we just wanted to try to zoom in a little bit specifically on post viral fatigue and things like Epstein Barr virus, many people are familiar with and there’s a lot of people that report their chronic fatigue, picking up after something like EBV, we’ve seen it a lot with the virus going around now which would probably get flagged and censored so we won’t say it but you know what it is and there’s a lot of post, uh, viral fatigue going on from that and so you and I have dealt with some of that, you’re still going through the thick of it right now but I think you’re coming through pretty well, you’re still working and obviously you’re on your feet right now literally standing so that’s exciting and yeah.  

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: For the listeners, I had COVID last week, actually symptoms started on Wednesday. Really two hard days of symptoms, I was able to work the whole time though, I mean I think that the symptoms for my COVID that were, um, tough was I would say achiness and then like sensitivity to cold like it was like 45 degrees out and it felt like it was minus 10. So, I would say sensitivity to cold and then also getting really hot at some points, getting out where I would sweat through my shirt. So hot and cold, achiness/ headaches and then like easily out of breath but I mean for me I mean, it was still fine where I could work and still do the things I had to do. So it wasn’t that bad, I mean, I had a flu in 2013 where I was literally laid up for over two days and I couldn’t do anything so I know laid up feels like it wasn’t even close to the flu of 2013 for me, that was really hard. So, definitely, um, not as bad, I actually was my own worst enemy because on Friday I was feeling like really good like 80-90% better and did like 2-3 hours of housework like cleaning my house like doing all this different stuff because it was a beautiful day and I’m like all right let me get on top of some work, work 3 hours probably walk like 15,000 steps and that next day there was a major relapse in how I felt. It was probably like I went backwards 30-40%. Here I was at 80% probably going backwards to 50. I was like whoa what happened and so then I just kind of got in the straight and narrow and just said okay I gotta really make sure I kind of make sure I kind of keep it easy until I get back to 100% because, you know, um, it just you didn’t realize how much, uh, things could go backwards so fast so you really gotta wait till you get a 100% on things and so overall I mean the only thing lingering for me right now is a slight bit of um out of breathiness and, uh, this little lingering deep tickle cough like right now you can feel it like someone’s tickling the back of your throat with your finger and you want to cough to scratch it, kind of like that and so that’s where I’m at now. That’s like kind of makes it feel like I scratch it right there, right. So, I’m doing some ginger tea, I’m doing with the Manuka honey that soothes it like that helps with the irritation. It’s not knocking the cough down. Doing some, Elderberry, um, doing some thieves, uh, natural cough drops with essential oils, um, also doing some nebulizer so I’m doing some glutathione nebulization so those are couple of things I’m doing and then obviously sinus flushes, the amount of mucus that is coming out of me is out of control so sinus flushes are really, really important because if you do not flush your sinuses, the amount of stuff that stays inside of you, oh my God. So, flushing my sinuses out 3-4 times a day, you know, really good saline reverse osmosis with a little bit of silver in there to kind of keep things flushed out is helping a lot. So, that’s kind of where I’m at but honestly feeling pretty good, um, the whole family got it purposefully, my wife had it and I’m like come over here honey gave her a big kiss and then I kissed all my kids, I’m like we’re done. We’re gonna get this thing all together, be done with it all that way we’re not, you know, I get it next month and then I’m isolating for two weeks and then my kids get no we’re gonna get it all at the same time and surprisingly my kids’ symptoms were 80% less than the adults, super, super minor.  I couldn’t believe how minor it was for the kids, so very interesting. So, that was kind of my experience with, uh, with the big C, uh, so to speak. And also, the big correlation I was listening to someone talk about this, the, a lot of the post C symptoms that we see after, right, people that have dysglycemia, and blood sugar issues tend to be a big driving factor of a lot of these post viral symptoms afterwards. Talking about post-viral fatigue, one of the big things is make sure you manage your glycemia, meaning you’re having good protein, you’re having good fats, you’re not eating a bunch of refined sugar, grains, those kinds of things. Make sure you put good metaphorical logs on the fire, good proteins, good fats to really work on blood sugar stability. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. Yeah. We’ll I’m glad that you’re coming through it. Regarding the shortness of breath, I would kind of put that in the same category as the post viral fatigue because that shortness of breath can create fatigue and the best thing that’s helped me and has helped many clients is doing the color oxygen. So, ChlorOxygen, you can get that on amazon, it’s readily available. And it’s just a, it’s a liquid chlorophyll extract. So, when you do that within probably 5-10 minutes, you can feel a difference, so it’s like C-h-l-o-r-Oxygen, ChlorOxygen. I would probably do 10-20 drops up to 3 times per day. That thing is absolutely incredible. You can go as high as one tablespoon in 20 ounces of water and just sip on that throughout the day. I had one guy in New York, major, major issues with shortness of breath in the acute and the long term and that ChlorOxygen literally just turned his situation around. So, I’d get some of that stuff. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So, it’s C-h-l-o-r Oxygen?

Evan Brand: Yeah, ChlorOxygen. Yeah, and it comes in a little bottle tincture and it’s incredible. Also, something I’ve used personally, I’ve used with several clients too is Ailanthus. Ailanthus is three of heaven which is an invasive tree. I see a lot of it in Kentucky but you can buy Ailanthus tincture and that one is also really, really good. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting. Is this the one, right here, Is the ChlorOxygen? 

Evan Brand: Yeah. That’s the one. Yep. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay. Cool.

Evan Brand: Get you some of that but should help because that’s the problem is, you know, the shortness of breath was pretty bad for me and I felt better, you know, I got infected a long time ago. It was like August 2020 and then six months later that’s when I started to have some shortness of breath which I was like, holy crap and so luckily, I was able to knock it out, uh, with Demectin and uh, yeah, Demectin really helped me and then the nebulizer and the ChlorOxygen, I would say that combination was an absolute game changer, luckily, I haven’t had any issues since then. But what we are seeing is that the mitochondria have a role in this and some of this post-viral fatigue we’re seeing is due to mitochondrial damage so I’ve been fortunate enough to see a few dozen people now. And in terms of organic acids testing after the virus, and we are seeing that the mitochondria definitely showed dysfunction. You and I talked about this many times on other podcast about the mitochondria. We can measure the dysfunction and so what we’re doing is we’re coming in with mitochondrial support nutrients so CoQ10, we’re coming in with carnitine, ribose, a lot of these amino acids and B vitamins like riboflavin which can help fuel the krebs cycle and then also we can use things like PQQ to help get the mitochondrial biogenesis going, meaning we’re literally making new mitochondria so we can measure this on paper. So, if you guys are suffering, you know, one of us can reach out or you reach out to us rather and then we can get the urine looked at because we can measure this. You don’t have to guess where is this fatigue coming from. If it’s a mitochondrial induced problem, we can measure that. Now, you have permission to have multiple things wrong with you so there could be a dopamine problem, there could be a mitochondrial problem, there could be toxin problem. So, rarely is there one issue causing this fatigue but the goal is for us to try to get as many puzzle pieces laid out in front of us and then make an appropriate protocol.    

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. I’d say, the worst thing about COVID for me right now, coffee tastes bitter like it tastes bitter, almost a little bit sour, does not taste like coffee. I’ve almost been like I’m not even gonna drink it right now until this thing gets better because it does not taste that good but for me I’m just alright, I got, you know, 20 grams of collagen in there, I got some good fats, I kind of look at it as like a meal replacement for me. So, that’s probably the worst thing the whole time. For me, it kind of felt like a cold. I’d say a mild, mild to middle of the road cold. The only thing that really surprised me was that, that back swing where I was like 80% better and then went backwards that was the hardest thing. 

Evan Brand: And, it could have been you overdoing it for sure, I mean, 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: oh, you totally did. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. I mean I did have a little bit of that too where I kind of felt like I was better, overdid it and then I heard it again, so. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. 100%. So, excuse me, anything else you wanted to highlight on that so far? I would say post-viral stuff, the things that I’m doing right now and I recommend people do, in general, are gonna be Adaptogens and I like medicinal mushrooms. So, Shiitake, Maitake, Reishi. Reishi is great. I love it because it does deactivate viruses. It does build up and support the natural killer immune cells so I do like that, uh, any type of ginseng, Ashwagandha, these are things that help support energy production, support the adrenals, help buffer the HPA excess. So, any of these types of things are gonna be, uh, helpful too.  

Evan Brand: You need to get on some Lion’s Mane too for your taste because what I’m finding is that the nerves are damaged and that’s affecting the sinus. So, the sense of smell, sense of taste, some of that is related to nerve damage. So, I would probably hit Lion’s Mane, maybe like two caps twice a day. That’s been helpful to restore the sense of smell and taste in some people. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s probably not damaged. It’s probably just more inflammation, right? 

Evan Brand: Well, the long-term stuff, I’m talking to people just long-term. I’m talking to people that you know 6-8 months later say, I still can’t taste or smell. Bringing in Lion’s Mane, like 2 caps twice a day. It takes a few months but you know it does increase nerve growth factor and so I think that’s the mechanism. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s interesting. Yeah. I do have some Lion’s Mane. I’ll definitely add that in. I mean, I think medicinal mushrooms are gonna be really good to, um, be on top of, uh, just supporting your immune system and like helping with, um, the body regenerate and heal better. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. Gabe was asking a question in the live chat on YouTube. How did you guys catch it? I don’t know, I mean I work from home. You know, I’ve got a home office, uh, Justin has a home office as well, you know, I do go out, uh. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Personally, it’s the new variant. The new variant has an R-naught of seven, which is that’s equal to, uh, measles so the delta variant had an R-naught of 2 or 3 so that means for every one person that gets it, it can be passed to 2-3 on average, right. The new omicron variant, it’s seven, so you can literally pass it to seven people so I think my wife was in a yoga class with three people and they were like spread out across that broom like they were like way you know spaced apart, you know, for just all the safety reasons and it was still able to get it so my whole take on omicron, it’s very, um, I think the symptoms are milder than delta for sure. That’s what everything’s been reported but, um, it’s way more contagious. Everyone’s gonna get it at this point, you just gotta have your plan and, um, be ready ahead of time, right? People don’t have a plan and then when they get it then they get stuck and they feel like they have to go to the hospital and you don’t have as many options there so try to have a, um, outpatient plan ready to rock and roll but yeah, you’re gonna get it because the, um, our knot on this thing, right, is that seven which is at a level close to measles so it’s right there. So, if you haven’t got it yet, you will. Anything else you wanna highlight on the immune side, on the post-viral stuff obviously I’m a big fan of ginger, I think ginger is nice because it’s anti-inflammatory, anti-viral, uh, helps with lymphatic. So, if your kind of like have a lot of like stagnant lymph in the chest area or in the neck I really keeps the lymph moving all that’s very helpful. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. There was, uh, one person that commented if you’ve had delta you should have some memory T cells that will help if you get infected. Yes supposedly. Supposedly, um.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. You definitely should have memory T cells as well as memory B cells, right? So, even if you were to get sick again, um, you’re gonna be able to recruit antibodies way faster, right? Normally when you get sick if you’re first time getting exposed to an infection it takes about a week or so to really get those antibodies ramped up and so even if you were to get sick twice, you’re gonna be able to make those antibodies inside of, you know, 24 hours or so. So, you’re gonna be able to bring those antibodies to the table a lot faster and so that’s, um, that’s pretty cool. That’s pretty helpful. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. Other strategies, uh, post-viral fatigue hyperbaric oxygen has been helpful. I’ve seen several clients that luckily have lived in a city where they’ve had access to do hyperbaric oxygen. Essentially, what it is, is it’s replicating being under water under water about 10 to 12 feet so that pressure is helping to get oxygen deeper inside of you. So, some of these tissues may have been starved of oxygen. This sort of mild hypoxia or hypoxemia, you know, you can basically reverse that by getting the hyperbaric oxygen. There are some people that can do there’s oxygen cans, little portable oxygen shots, if you will but it’s nothing compared to an oxygen concentrator with the hyperbaric oxygen so that’s good ongoing, I mean, I’ve had clients with Lyme that have done hyperbaric we know that’s incredible for traumatic brain injuries and concussions and that sort of thing. So, even if this is just a long-term fatigue problem, not related to viral issues at all, you know, hyperbaric is another good tool, you’re looking at probably around 100 a session but, you know, what, what’s your health? What is your health worth? So. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. One thing I did was very helpful was use my infrared sauna the last couple of days. That was helpful, just getting a really good sweat in felt very good, you know, raising that body temperature up can be very helpful just at um at your body knocking down viruses. That’s part of the reason why you get, um, chill while you get the nutshells but, uh, why you get a fever right. It’s part of the reason your immune system is actually knocking down some of that bacteria and or viruses by doing it that way so using an infrared sauna can be helpful too. 

Evan Brand: So, look at your mitochondria, get your organic acids test done, we can measure that and look at mitochondrial function come in with specific support whether it’s B vitamins, adaptogenic herbs like Rhodiola, you mentioned, Siberian ginseng or Eleuthero. There’s medicinal mushrooms like cordyceps which there is some benefits. There are some papers on cordyceps and athletes and improving blood flow. There may be some level of oxygenation that happens with cordyceps too. So, cordyceps, reishi mushroom, I think the Lion’s mane for the brain and for the nerves would be beneficial, the ChlorOxygen for any of the shortness of breath along with the fatigue, rest, I mean just getting good quality sleep, making sure you got to do whatever you can to get good quality sleep. So, all the same sleep hygiene habits we’ve talked about for a decade together apply in regards to candling down at night if you need some passion flower. Even melatonin, there’s some really cool studies on melatonin. We know, it’s a very powerful antioxidant and we are seeing higher doses of melatonin be beneficial. So, in general, somewhere around 5 milligrams but there are some papers going wat up 30 – 40 – 50 milligrams and beyond. I don’t know a ton about the high dose so I’ll just tell you that the regular dose standard dosing is better than nothing. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It was that melatonin?

Evan Brand: Melatonin. Yes. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Usually, it’s like the higher dose is like 10 milligrams and that’s gonna help with the oxygenation and then 30 – 500 milligrams for the arginine that’s to really increase the oxygenation. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. The arginine for like nitric oxide production. Beet powder, you know, beet powder would be good too. So, anything you could do to create some vasodilation is gonna be smart. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Very cool. Anything else you wanna add, Evan?

Evan Brand: I think that’s it. If you need help, reach out, get tested, hopefully you get back on the full mend here so, keep, keep rolling. You’re doing a great job and hope everybody is doing well and we’ll be in touch next week. If you need help clinically, please reach out. You can reach out to Dr. J at or me, Evan Brand, at We’re happy to help you guys. Keep your head up. keep moving forward.   

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think the big thing out of the gates is to make sure you have time to sleep, rest. Don’t overdo it. Just know your body still needs more time even when you, when you’ve gotten through the whole thing to recover. Don’t overdo it. That’s really important. Keep the foundational nutrients dialed in so that would be like zinc, vitamin C, vitamin D, you know, you can keep those things in there. You may not have to use them at such a high level that you did with the infection but keep some of those nutrients. Don’t go from something to nothing. Keep something in there the whole time, find a medicinal mushroom that you like, find an adaptogen that you like. Maybe keep a little bit of ginger tea going. Something that has some antiviral support and um, you know, try to get a little bit of movement but if it’s making you feel winded then just try to do just enough where you can feel like you’re doing something but not where it’s overly taxing you. I think it’s really important to kind of meet that right in the middle. 

Evan Brand: Last thing, two last things, a low histamine diet is generally pretty helpful because there are a lot of issues with mast cell activation being triggered from this. So, a lower histamine diet, fresh meat, and no leftovers is very important. And then, histamine support. I’ve got a product called histamine support but essentially it’s quercetin plus some other nutrients so anything, you can do to stabilize your mast cells that’s gonna be helpful because muscle activation can cause fatigue, meaning, after the viral issue was over, the immune system can sort of have PTSD for lack of a better terminology and the immune system will go into this crazy state where it will shut you down so that fatigue trying to rebuild that energy back up is re-regulating the immune system so like the quercetin, other mast cell stabilizers are very helpful. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Love it. Love it. Love it. Makes total sense and again not everyone’s gonna have that issue but you know, it’s kind of good to know if you fit into that camp. Those are a couple of strategies out of the gates. Anything else, Evan?

Evan Brand: No, that’s it. Take it easy. If people need help, reach out and will be available. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. We’re here to help you guys. I’ll probably be back later on today here. So, keep a lookout, comments down below. Let us know your thoughts on the topic, we appreciate a review. We appreciate shares to friends and family. Really helps us get the word out. You guys have a phenomenal day. We’ll talk soon. 

Evan Brand: Take it easy. Bye-bye

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Bye you all. 


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Audio Podcast:


Meditation Using Muse Device with Ariel Garten | Podcast #304

We all have thoughts, and none of us are good at meditation at first, during, or maybe at the end. Here’s Ariel Garnet, introducing us to the Muse and the use of an approach NOT to get rid of those thoughts but to help you make yourself aware of those thoughts and increase the choice of what to do with those. 

Are you doing it right? The Muse uses Machine Learning Approach, which has an algorithm that analyzes brain wave activity. There, it shows focused attention (when it’s quiet) and distracted or wandering thoughts (when there’s a storm pick-up). Also, concentrated attention and meditation have a natural anchor such as word, part of the body, or our breath, which is more accessible.  Ariel added that we have different forms of meditation and focused attention is the most common one. It puts the attention to your breath instead of following your thoughts and shifting it to yourself. 

What’s the minimum dose? Twenty (20) minutes can be heavy, so it’s acceptable to do it up to what’s bearable for beginners and usually ten (10) minutes for regulars. It also shows that there are improvements with the body’s cognitive function, inhibition, and decrease in stress. Don’t miss the full video to see how it works!

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

0:36      Muse Meditation Device

3:49      Basics of Meditation

9:30      How Muse Gets the Data

13:34    Biofeedback Devices

21:07    How Muse Works

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are alive. It’s Dr. J here in the house with Ariel Garten, the founder of the Muse meditation device, really excited to have her on today we’re going to talk about this awesome new cutting edge technology. And we’ll kind of also just bring it back down to the basics of meditation. What is it? What are the benefits? What’s happening in your brain and how to actually apply it? Ariel, welcome to the podcast.

Ariel Garten: Thank you my sincere pleasure to be here. Hello, everyone.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. Well, why don’t you tell the listeners a little bit more about yourself? And how did you make this journey into meditation and then what made you want to come up with this new technology to enhance that?

Ariel Garten: Sure. So my own background is a training in neuroscience. So I was fascinated by the brain and how it works. I then became a psychotherapist and began dealing with patients every day helping them shift their own mental state and recognized how difficult it was. And meditation was a skill that I was taught as something to use inside of my practice with my patients. But I would teach my patients to do it, and they would rarely actually start the habit. So it became this really frustrating process of teaching someone to meditate, and then not actually seeing the benefits rolling out into their life. I, at the same time was working in a research lab with Dr. Steve Mann, and he had an early brain computer interface system. So using eg electrodes, we could track your brainwaves and then turn that brainwave activity into sound. And we really had this aha moment, myself and my co founders of muse, Chris and Trevor, we had this aha moment that if we can make this invisible, intangible process, in your mind, visible and tangible, maybe we could apply that to meditation, maybe we could actually help people hear what was going on inside their mind while they meditated. And in doing so actually get people to start and maintain their meditation practice, if they could get real feedback and have real data from their brain. And that was born.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Cool. So you have this kind of biofeedback, that kind of help you distinguish if you were in a good kind of brain wavelength state, so to speak. And then how does that how does that sound compute? So like, is it what’s the wavelength in your brain? That’s supposedly good? And how does it know that you’re there? And how does it How does it do all that connection back and forth?

Ariel Garten: Sure. So the old school approach to doing biofeedback or neurofeedback on meditation, is just to look at your band. So if you’re in beta band, you’re thinking in your brains all over the place, you’re likely not meditating. If you’re an alpha, you’re seeing an increase in meditation. And if you’re seeing some data, then there’s even more meditation. That was the old school way of doing meditation. At this point, we’ve now taught literally hundreds of thousands of people to meditate using news. And so we use a machine learning approach. And we have an algorithm that understands when you’re in focused attention, versus when your mind is wandering. So it analyzes every aspect of your brainwave activity at that moment, and knows if you’re specifically in focused attention, which is the fundamental of a focused attention meditation, or if your mind has wandered and is distracted. And what we do is we turn that into a sound that’s very easy to understand that it’s your mind. So when you’re focused, the sound is quiet. And when you’re distracted, you hear a storm pickup, it’s like my mind is stormy. Oh, okay, let’s bring it back to calm. And when you focus a calm again. And when your mind gets distracted on a thought up mind to stormy, then bring it back down to calm.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s interesting, because I find a lot of people and even myself when they’re doing a meditation, one of the first things they kind of think to themselves is, am I doing this, right? Like, I’m not sure there’s kind of this hesitation of is this, is this all wrong? So I kind of like the fact that you get a little bit of a feedback. And so let’s say you’re using the device, right? And you get the storm clouds coming in, what should be the focus, like, what should that switch be to bring you back on track? 

Ariel Garten: Sure. So you bring your attention back to your breath. So a focused attention. Meditation always has a neutral anchor, it could be your breath, that could be a word, it could be a part of your body, breath tends to be the easiest because your breath is always there. By simply counting your breaths, you’re bringing yourself back to a neutral anchor. You’re taking your mind out of your wandering thoughts into a place that is neutral and unintentional. Because most of us spend our life just wandering in our thoughts. Most of us just spend our life with the mind with thinking that just keeps going and we assume it’s supposed to be that way. But when you actually start a meditation practice, and recognize that you can identify when you’re thinking and choose to take your mind away from there and put your attention on something else other than your thoughts. At that moment, you fundamentally change your relationship to your thinking. You fundamentally can now choose the contents of your mind. And since most of the things in our mind are negative, repetitive, not particularly helpful, when we’re able to actually have choice over the contents of our own mental space and how we attend to it, you can dramatically shift the amount of stress, negativity, anxiety etc. in your life.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, very interesting. All right, so now someone’s coming into this or like, Hey, I haven’t even started meditating at all yet. So what does meditation look like for you is it just kind of what you kind of implied earlier where you’re just bringing that anchor, bringing that focus of that anchor back to the breath. And you’re just focusing on that, while you breathe in and out throughout the nose is that pretty much it to keep it simple for the listeners?

Ariel Garten: Totally. So that is the basis of a focused attention meditation, there are lots of different forms of meditation of focused attention is the most common. And what you’re simply doing is you’re putting your attention on your breath, your mind will eventually have a thought, because all of us have thoughts, it’s okay, you then notice that you have that thought, and instead of following the thought and thinking about your grocery list, or your husband, or whatever, you choose to say, Nope, I’m gonna let that thought Go and bring my attention elsewhere. Other than my thinking, I’m going to bring my attention back to my breath. And you just do this very simple activity over and over again. And the simple activity triggers those profound results, by the fact that you are actually now shifting the relationship to your own mind.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting, okay. And so it’s okay, you shouldn’t beat yourself up, if your thoughts go off, just kind of recenter it back, be the observer of that, like, there should be no shame or any of that kind of feeling. If you can’t quite do it, or you can’t quite stick on it.

Ariel Garten: Exactly. None of us are good at meditation at the beginning, or even halfway through or even at the end. You know, we all have thoughts, and that’s okay. You’re not trying to get rid of your thoughts. You’re trying to make yourself aware of them and increase the choice about what you do with those thoughts.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay. All right, interesting. So what’s the minimum dose to get some benefits? So if someone’s coming in is five minutes enough? Like what what do you recommend as a beginner to kind of see some benefit, but make the make the step to commit? Pretty easy?

Ariel Garten: Yeah, so with studies with news, we’ve looked at 10 minutes of meditation per day, and at 10 minutes of meditation, over six weeks, in trial studies, we’ve been able to see improvements in your relationship to your body, so less self reported, headache, nausea, etc, you’ve been able to see improvement in cognitive function as measured by the script task and go nogo tasks, improvement and inhibition, and obviously, a decrease in stress and improvement in calm. Okay, so in a lot of the studies in the literature, they look at 20 minutes a day, but 20 minutes a day is a lot to meditate for a novice. So the best amount of for you to meditate right now, if you’ve never meditated is whatever amount you can bear it for initially. That could be three minutes, that could be five minutes, you just want to start and try to do it consistently. Just five-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Five minutes be done twice a day?

Ariel Garten: Absolutely. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay. All right, cool. And what’s the goal wavelength that we want our brain to be in during this meditation state.

Ariel Garten: So there’s, as I said, the old school way was to look at a goal wavelength. Now it’s no longer so much about the goal wavelength, it is about the state that you are in, and our brains are much more complicated than simply being an alpha or simply being in beta. Okay, what we see when you meditate is a significant increase in alpha activity. And also sometimes an increase in beta coherence. When you it’s not so just as simple as alpha, because alpha peak frequency changes as you age, okay, so when you’re young, you have the most amount of alpha at around 10 and a half hertz, let’s say, quite fast. As you age, your alpha peak, frequency slows down. So your alpha peak might be at 11 hertz, 12 hertz. And so as you engage in meditation practice, some of what might you might be looking to do is both to increase your alpha activity, and potentially to increase your alpha, decrease your alpha frequency to a faster wave. So it’s, it’s a lot more complicated once you start looking at the nuance of it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, all right, got it. And then what’s our active wavelength state when we’re just totally alert, doing stuff and working throughout the day?

Ariel Garten: Again, hard to say, when you’re active and engaged, you tend to be in beta waves when you’re thinking, but being in flow has a slightly different brainwave characteristic. And we also have different brain waves that we emit from different parts of our head. Okay, so you know, high, high, theta frontal midline, is going to be associated with really high attention, but high data from another part of your brain is also associated with mind wandering and ADHD. You know, it’s nuanced.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, got it. That makes sense. And so how is the device grabbing all this Intel? So is it I know it’s a device you put I think you guys have a Bluetooth connection or Bluetooth connection now. Correct?

Ariel Garten: Yep. So it is four channels of eg data. So it kind of slips on just like a pair of glasses. For those of you looking at the YouTube you can see the device now.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Video guys, if you’re listening on the podcast, we’ll put the YouTube link below if you want to see the actual demo.

Ariel Garten: Yep. Or you can go to We also have videos there. That shows you what the device looks like. And so there’s two channels of eg data on the forehead and two behind the ears. And so that’s enough to track your brainwaves associated with focused attention versus mind wandering. And then that data sent to your smartphone or tablet where it interprets your brain activity. And lets you know, when you’re in the meditation zone and when you’re not. So you’re getting this beautiful guided feedback during your meditation. And then after the fact you see data, charts, graphs, scores, things that actually show you moment to moment what your brain was doing, and let you see your improvement session on session.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, that’s really cool. And now when you’re doing the muse, you have the device on. Is there any concern at all from you with the Bluetooth radiation that that’s connecting the headset to the to the phone or the smart device?

Ariel Garten: So the Bluetooth antenna faces outwards? So the radiation is going out towards your phone? It’s okay, low energy. So I mean, the amount of radiation that’s coming off there is infantile asmall, relative to even having your phone on the table. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, good. That’s good. Excellent. All right. So we have this device on right we’re utilizing it. What do you notice as correlation with a device meaning like if I’m eating diet changes, certain supplementation? I’ve noticed some patients of mine that have done the Muse device before and they’ve done magnesium and l theanine and different nutrients they’ve noticed, improve Muse scores, what associations have you guys made just on your own or clinically in practice with your patients?

Ariel Garten: Oh, that’s a great question. Nobody’s ever asked me that. That’s super cool. Definitely, we notice when people start to meditate, they start to improve more habits in their life. So this is actually something that you see in the meditation literature that when somebody starts a meditation practice, it then becomes easier to adhere to the other things that you’re trying to do. Because you become more mindful, and you become more intentional. So you know, the the suggestion there is that you’re then more likely to take your supplements, you’re then more likely to help, you know, improve your sleep patterns. One of the things that we see when people start musing is that they report better sleep, and that they use Muse before they go to bed in order to improve their sleep. And so I we haven’t actually looked at what are the things that make your meditation better, but we’ve looked a fair amount at what are the things that when you meditate, also seem to be getting better in your life and in your health, and got their vast.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it. So you’re looking at Muse and then the effect benefits of it versus hey, these things over here may actually help make that Muse session better.

Ariel Garten: Yeah, and we have a number of studies running. So there have been over 200 published papers using Muse both as a clinical grade eg and a meditation tool. And the Mayo Clinic recently ran a study with breast cancer patients awaiting surgery. And they saw that using Muse through their surgery process was able to decrease the stress of surgery, improve their fatigue and quality of life. And now Mayo Clinic is looking at this relative to breast cancer patients going through chemotherapy, because they’re interested in understanding the impact of meditation with different forms of other interventions, be it surgery, chemotherapy, etc. And they’re also looking at a number of other disease states and studies using news to see how meditating with news can improve the outcome of those states.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Very cool. So what was your experience like with other neurofeedback devices? While you were a clinician seeing patients? We did you have a lot of experience with those devices? And then did you feel like Ah, this could be better, or we need to make something more portable for patients? What was your experience like with that early technology? And then how did it morph with the newer one?

Ariel Garten: So as a clinician, I didn’t use neurofeedback devices, but I had experience with biofeedback devices, and definitely felt that they gave interesting information, but that they didn’t actually give information about the brain. You know, they might tell you what your heart rate is doing, what your galvanic skin response is, but all of those are downstream effects of what war probably was initiated in your own mind. You know, the the anxious thoughts, the triggers that were mental that then ramp the body that then ramped the mind in this feed forward way. So, you know, we saw that there was a great opportunity. It was really at the beginning of the tracking movement, where you had wearables that track your sleep and your steps, but absolutely nothing that tracked your brain. And so we were able to develop Muse as an eg that would track your brain during meditation. And then since then, we’ve added more biofeedback methodologies to the same device. So in the Muse to you have eg degree feedback on your brain, there’s accelerometers and gyroscopes give you feedback on your body, there’s a breath sensor so you can get feedback on your breath rate and train yourself for different breathing exercises. There’s a PPG sensor to track your heart rate. And so you can actually hear the beating of your heart like the beating of a drum and learn to tune your interoception your understanding of your own internal state, and to know when your heart is increasing and decreasing can help you train your heart rate variability. So we’ve you know, pilot On a whole bunch of biofeedback methodologies on top of the neurofeedback as we’ve been on the path of creating and releasing news over the last six years.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Cool. So biofeedback would be more things related to heart rate breathing or neurofeedback is more biofeedback, specific to the brain wavelength, that kind of stuff. Okay, good. That makes sense. How does this correlate to like devices that are HRV heart rate variability, which a lot of people like the M wave devices that kind of connect heart connection to the brain and that coherent state of coherence we hear of that helps with with parasympathetic kind of repair and stress reduction. How does that? How do they connect? Is there a connection at all?

Ariel Garten: I can talk about that a little. It’s a cool question. So when you’re looking at your HRV, most people don’t understand what it is. So when you breathe in, your heart rate increases. As you breathe out, your heart rate decreases, this pattern is called your sinusoidal arrhythmia. And what your HRV is, is the difference between the fastest heartbeat on your intake and your slowest heartbeat on your exhale. So that’s why extended exhales actually make you more relaxed, because your heart rate is slowing more and more and more throughout the course of your exhale. And so an extended exhale is actually going to increase your heart rate variability. Now, when you’re super stressed, you have a very shallow change between your increase and your decrease of your heart, you’re probably breathing shallowly and your heart rate is going in parallel. So when you’re super stressed, you just see like a tiny wiggly line for your heart rate variability. When you’re relaxed, you have a great increase in decrease a great like up and down a nice, beautiful sinusoidal wave that goes with your HRV. And so that’s how you see the increase in your HRV. When you’re relaxed. In terms of the correlation with meditation, as you do the breathing through your meditation and relax your body and take your mind away from stressful thoughts. You are typically inherently increasing your heart rate variability, the correlation is not perfect one to one. But as you start to relax the mind and the body relaxes through deep breathing, you also see a beautiful change and shift in your HRV. And when you look at long term correlations for HRV, you see that people who are depressed for example, have very low HRV. And people who are not depressed and unhealthy states have an increase in HRV. So the kinds of effects you get with meditation also parallel the kinds of things you might see in somebody’s HRV.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s awesome. Is that a device? Or is that a biofeedback tool that you may add to the Muse at some point.

Ariel Garten: Um, so with the existing Muse Muse to and are new and Muse as you’re able to see a graph of your heart rate. So you can actually see your heartbeats like the increase in the decrease, you can visually see your HRV, we don’t give you an HRV calculation, because there’s actually a little bit of a controversy in the scientific field around how accurate instantaneous HRV is. So the pure science says that you need long term calculations of somebody’s heart rate in order to really get their HRV. So we’ve steered away from a specific HRV calculation, but you can see it on the graph like you can see actually what’s going on in your heart. And it’s quite amazing. You can see when your HRV is good, and when it’s short.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Very cool, what other little kind of nuances with the device you can share with us that could be could apply to improve our health on top of what you already mentioned so far.

Ariel Garten: Sure. So we have a new device that just came out Muse s, and for those of you watching the video, it is right here. It is a soft, comfortable form factor, and the module just pops off, you can watch the band. And we made it specifically for people who want to track their brain overnight and help them to fall asleep. So we found a lot of people were using us to help them fall asleep. And but you’d have to take your Muse device off when you fell asleep. So we made Muse s super comfy, so you can just fall asleep with it on. And we give you these beautiful things called sleep journeys, guided sleep journeys, they’re guided meditations that lull you into sleep. And you also get a soundtrack that’s actually built from your body that’s designed to entrain you into sleep faster. So you might hear the beating of your heart like the chirping of crickets and the soundscape. Or the movements of your body like the lapping of waves, you’re literally hearing your own body. And then what we do is as you start to get into a rhythm and slow down a little bit, we actually slow down the soundtrack in a way that’s designed to train you to fall asleep faster. And so it’s a super beautiful experience. And then towards the end of this year, we’re releasing comprehensive eg sleep tracking. So you’ll be able to see all sorts of details about your night’s sleep even you know coffee details like the amount of sleep spindles you had.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s really cool. I think anytime you’re trying to teach someone to develop a new habit, especially when they don’t have a lot of confidence, it’s important to have a coach or someone to kind of pat them on the back or give them encouragement that they’re doing the right thing or, or feedback after doing the wrong thing. And I think the benefit of this device, it really provides that little bit of a meditation coach over your shoulder to give you a pat in the back or give you feedback if you’re not on the right track. So I think it’s really beneficial. Because if people can can do it and feel confident about it, they’re more likely to make it part of their kind of day in day out habits.

Ariel Garten: Absolutely. That’s literally why we built this, whether you’re somebody who’s never meditated before, and is just like what’s going on, or you’re an expert meditator who wants more insight into your process. This is a device that’s literally like a little coach or guru inside your head, encouraging you showing you what’s going on giving you your feedback, so that you can know when you can improve.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Cool. So how does this work? So you put the device on? Is there any way you can do it while we’re on live on the podcast here?

Ariel Garten: Not while holding my microphone simultaneously.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’d be amazing. 

Ariel Garten: So so this is the Muse here. It slips on. Great, it then would connect to the app on my phone. So here is I don’t think you can see there’s too much glare right there. There you go. There’s the Muse app. And so inside, that’s my notification that I have new content available. Inside the Muse app, you have meditations for the mind. And there you can set the length of time that you’d like to meditate for the soundscape you’d like to use what you’d like guidance or not. We also have meditations for the heart, where you’re hearing the heart like the beating of the drum, you can actually see your own heart rate variability and what it’s doing more meditations for the breath for the body. We have an entire section of guided content here. Let me open that for you. Where we have literally hundreds of meditations for stress, anxiety sleep, we say if you’ve got a problem in your life, we’ve got a meditation for that. So whether it’s performance, workplace, etc you can go in there and really find the thing that you’re trying to work on or is bothering you and get a meditation and guidance and insight to help you in that process. With or without your Muse.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I love it. I totally love it. I’m really excited to try this out get my own device go and that’s awesome. We’ll put a link here for the listeners, And the discount code will be welcome 10 we’ll put the links below. So if you guys are driving and you’re active, we’ll put that below so you can access the later areas or anything else you want to leave the listeners with right now.

Ariel Garten: Really the understanding that if you’ve tried meditation before, and you’re like, I don’t know, I’m not good at it, whatever. Put all of that behind you because literally anyone can meditate. It’s not about whether you’re good at it. Whether you feel like you did it well or not. None of that matters. Meditation is just a process that you practice a little bit every day. And when you do it you will start to see the fruits and the benefits in your life.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Love it is there anywhere else people can get more information about you or the device.

Ariel Garten: At There’s lots of information about the device, the neuroscience behind it and more.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Awesome. Ariel, thank you so much for being part of the podcast.

Ariel Garten: My sincere pleasure. Thank you.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Thank you.


Audio Podcast:

Coronavirus Updates, Herd Immunity, and Asymptomatic Population are Increasing | Podcast #281

Hey everyone! In today’s episode for Beyond Wellness Podcast, Dr. Justin and Evan give a live virus update, highlights on approaches for a good immune system support aside from the defensive approaches. This podcast will give a lot of information in preventing viruses from entering your body. Check out the transcription below. Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

2:17 Virus Global Statistics

7:53 Effects of Unhealthy Lifestyle

16:40 Asymptomatic Cases

30:15 Questions on Virsues

39:44 Herbal Immune Supports

This image has an empty alt attribute; its file name is itune-1.png


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey guys, it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani here, I’m with Evan brand Today we’re going to be giving you guys a live Coronavirus update, want to tell you about our thoughts and things and of course just highlight offensive approaches to in supporting your immune system. Most approaches are totally defensive, social distancing, quarantine, washing your hands all fine and dandy, but those are all defensive approaches. We want to talk about offensive approaches where you guys can be in the driver’s seat, Evan, how you doing this morning?

Evan Brand: I’m doing well. And let’s give a brief intro to who we are in case people are new to the podcast. So Dr. Justin Marchegiani, he’s a chiropractic doc who’s studied functional medicine extensively for over a decade, he successfully treated thousands and thousands of patients around the world. And he works virtually where he sends lab tests to people’s homes and creates functional medicine programs to find and fix the root cause of various health issues. I do the same but I’m not a chiropractor. I have other functional medicine credentials and also work with people online worldwide. So that’s what We do on a day to day basis is help people reverse health issues that they previously had trouble with, and maybe got limited results working with the conventional medical model. And we had our own health struggles that led us into fixing our own problems, which is why we love and we’re so passionate about what we do. So that’s the brief bio behind us. And what kind of spurred today’s conversation is that we were looking at some stats here, and many people have heard about Italy being a huge hotspot, so to speak of this whole Coronavirus issue in Italy having, you know, massive amounts of infection and higher rates of death and such. But what we’re finding now is even higher percentage of comorbidities and what we reported on last time we reported on a smaller number now it’s looking like more than 99% 99% of fatalities from COVID occurred among people who had underlying medical condition. And so it showed that 0.8 so less than 1% of people who died had no underlying condition at all. So let me just break it down real quick. 76% had high blood pressure, almost 36% had diabetes 33% had heart disease that is insane.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% also i’m going to share on screen with you guys as well. So you guys can see, according to the telegraph on reevaluation by the National Institute of Health only 12% of death certificates show in Italy a direct cause from Coronavirus, while 88% of those who had died on the death certificate had at least one pre morbidity but also maybe up to two to three. So I think that’s also pretty powerful is out of all the causes of death on there, only 12% they can show a direct cause to and I’ll put this on screen here so you guys can see what I’m saying here. So right here, this is the telegraph article only 12% of death certificates show direct causality that’s important to know. And you know, when Evan and I watched the news How we do it is we compartmentalize opinion, and the pundits talking head with the data. So ideally, you just try to get the data. And then you try to formulate your opinion versus get swayed by a talking head. Now, the better the news station, people just give you more of the data versus their opinion. And that’s better, the more a lot of times the opinion and the data do do not go hand in hand for obvious reasons, right for yourselves if it leads to bleeds. And so we always want to make sure you guys are watching things with the compartmentalised brain so you don’t fall for it.

Evan Brand: So it’s tough to do. And it’s tough to do, right what you’re what you’re saying sounds easy, but it’s tough because sometimes the data may be mixed in with a testimonial, and then there’s a footage of a hospital and then there’s like a lady walking in a mask and some B roll footage. So it’s really tough to dissect that. It’s really tough to just pull out what you need from it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and I recommend don’t ever fall for any ask exposes, when someone’s doing a one off on someone dying. Don’t ever fall for that because number one is people die all the time. And you don’t know what their health history is you don’t know anything about their life. Number two, for instance, 150 people die a year, 150 kids die a year of the flu. You don’t see any expose on kids dying. You know, you could do an expose literally every single day on a child dying of the flu throughout the winner maybe even twice a day, right? But you don’t see that. Right? So why, right? There’s a reason why they’re trying to get you to feel something that they’re not really caring about that much one of the flus in, you know, in town, so to speak. So in order that you want to look at the global percentage, you want to look at averages across the board. That’s the better way to handle it so you don’t fall prey.

Evan Brand: Yeah. And you’re talking about how they’ll just do a specific story on this woman and how she had three kids and she worked two jobs, and she worked so hard, and here’s her dog and what are they going to do with her dog now that she’s gone, that kind of stuff you’re talking about where it’s more emotionally focused on one person and they they separate that they kind of leave the statistics away and hyper focus in is that what you’re talking about?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, exactly. So they’ll hyper focus And they won’t give you of course, most people aren’t going to get a background on their health because of all the HIPAA stuff, right? So they’re not going to really give a big background on their health or comorbidities, or even what their diet or lifestyle is like. So then a lot of people just feel like it’s it could creep up on them and get them just as easily right. And I think this empowers people. So I recommend staying away from any of the one off exposes and just kind of look at the global statistics, because that gives you a better perspective on what’s happening. And the global statistics show, you know, 99% plus are going to have comorbidities. That’s really important. And most of the comorbidities, as I’ve already shown, involve some level of diabetes and blood sugar dysregulation, 60 plus percent. There was a journal article in the New England Journal of Medicine last month, looking at a lot of people that died up in Seattle and 60 plus percent had diabetes. Now once you have diabetes, 80% of diabetes, people are going to have kidney issues. So if you have kidney issues, then probably I also have blood pressure issues. So once you have blood sugar issues, you’re going to have two or three comorbidities over time just because so the older you are, the reason why the elderly is so at risk is because chronic degenerative diseases, they’re just that they’re chronic. So bad decisions may today compound over time, just like if you invest money when you’re younger in your 20s and 30s, compound interest grows it so it’s bigger and better in your 50 60 70s. Same thing with bad habits and disease, we start putting bad habits in the health bank, and that starts to compound over time and we start generating symptoms and disease over time, just like wealth investment generate wealth over time. So keep that in the back of your mind. Number two elderly are going to have typically less vitamin D, they’re they’re going to be indoors a lot more. They’re also going to have less hydrochloric acid. And then a lot of less hydrochloric acid means are not going to be breaking down protein as well. They’re going to have less muscle mass. Because they’re not having protein, they’re also going to be on more medications. And those medications create more side effects. And remember, antibodies and part of your immune responses. antibodies are made from protein. So we don’t have or digest and protein, that’s gonna be a problem. And then if we don’t have the minerals like zinc or magnesium, that’s going to create more problems. So it’s not like because you’re elderly like and you hit a certain age, you’re just magically susceptible. There are key physiological things that happen over time, that make elderly folk more susceptible. And here are the things that we can do to stop it. And that’s the digestion the vitamin D, the blood sugar issues, right, the older and the longer you have this glycaemia right imbalanced blood sugar from too much carbs or refined carbohydrate or a cellular carbs. Over time, those insulin cells will get numb and that’s a big mechanism with this whole thing that’s happening here.

Evan Brand: Yep, well said and the fact to the sedentary lifestyle that older people are having to I mean, especially if you’re someone who has in a nursing home, for example, I don’t I’ve never heard of a story of, you know, a client of mine who had a parent or a grandparent in a nursing home going and get an exercise program. And you know, it’s not like they’re getting five days a week of high intensity interval training or anything like that. So it’s just, it’s crazy. And you mentioned the bad habits. So what what do you mean by the bad habits? Well, this is mainly like the high carbohydrate processed food diet that most people are on. I mean, if you look at in general, unfortunately, if you look at my grandparents pantry, it’s loaded full of garbage, honey buns and peanut butter crackers and hydrogenated oils and corn syrup and chocolate milk. I mean, just crazy, right? It’s just it’s really, really bad stuff. So there was a lady named Dr. Sandra Webber. She’s the president of the American Association of clinical endocrinologist. She said, we know that if you do not have good glucose control, you’re at high risk for infection, including viruses and presumably, this one COVID-19 as well improving glucose control I would put you in a situation where you would have better immune function. So I mean, that’s straight from the horse’s mouth if you want somebody who’s established and has a good, a good pulse on this, really beating and reversing insulin resistance should be your number one focus right now. So instead of like being upset, here’s something kind of like, embarrassing, but here it is, you’re ready to hear it. So my wife’s sister, and their whole family. They’re posting all these challenges these quarantine challenges they’re doing and their latest challenge that they’re sharing with everyone on the world by posting on social media is a the best store bought cookie challenge. And her sister’s husband, he already has diabetes, but here they are going to the grocery and they are buying 10 different brands. I’m talking Oreos, the fudge covered Oreos, that Elmer Fudd cookies the way I don’t even know all of them. And let’s, let’s eat every single cookie to figure out, you know, during our quarantine period, what is the best store bought cookie? It’s like, no, don’t you get it, you’re missing the whole point of this. So it’s crazy. You know, people would think that based on us being who we are that people, anybody close to us would have it all figured out. Right that that all of our family members and friends and all that would just have it so dialed in. But unfortunately, that’s not the case.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you’re never going to be a prophet in your own town. Right? That that’s kind of a, a biblical quote there. So keep that in the back of your head, the people closest to you tend to under appreciate the the information you bring to the table. So just kind of looking at a couple of things here. Let’s go look at some of the statistics. I want to break it all down. We’re over the hump. My original estimates, I said, half of the flu kind of be where we’re going to be at overall from a data perspective. The problem is, it may even be way less than that. The problem is the criteria. diagnosis on the corona virus is very difficult. Number one, the symptoms overlap with a lot of other diseases IE flu, other types of Corona viruses, other types of rhinovirus there’s a big overlap there. Number one, number two, because the testing is so let’s just say shoddy meaning it’s a 50 to 80%, false positive on that 30%, I think on the sensitivity, so there’s a great chance of a lot of false positives. So that’s going to aid in more positive diagnosis. And you could have another virus another issue that could look like it and then you could have that one, be diagnosed because it’s one it’s false positive number two, on the vital and human statistics criteria, you don’t even have to have a positive test to get diagnosed. I’ll say that again. Well, you do not have to have a positive test to diagnose. Let’s go look at let’s go look at the data, bringing you guys the actual facts. Alright, so this is an article right here. This is you guys can see it. This is the guidance for certifying deaths due to Coronavirus 2019. This is the vital statistics reporting guy. This is 2020. Okay, this came out last week.

Evan Brand: And let me just preface this by saying this is absolutely insane what you were about to show us because this is why the numbers, even though the numbers look far better than initially predicted, the numbers are actually probably even better than that based on what you’re about to read.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so number one, is let’s look at this. So this is how their diagnosis in case where a definitive diagnosis of COVID-19 cannot be made, but it’s suspected or likely, right? The circumstances are compelling within a reasonable degree. Remember, the symptoms for COVID-19 are going to overlap flu and many other respiratory viruses, lung issues breathing, hypoxia potential pneumonia symptoms in and around that on a death certificate as okay so right here, it is acceptable to report COVID-19 on a death certificate as probable or present In these instances, certifiers should use their best clinical judgment to determine COVID-19 infection was likely. However, please note that testing for COVID-19 should be conducted whenever whenever possible. So what they’re implying here is that you do not need testing to make that diagnosis. So whenever it’s possible, but you can still make it without the diagnosis because it’s probable or presume so if you presume it based on symptomatic significance or symptomatic parody, it seems similar, right, then you can make that diagnosis. So that’s just just want to show you the exact criteria that they’re that they’re looking at.

Evan Brand: All right, and this is, this is Yeah, and people that are listening, they probably are not going to see this screen that you’re showing. This is from the Center for Disease Control’s dot gov website.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes, that’s really important to know. And then the other issue is going to be on the false positives. I’ve already posted a bunch of studies on this already. What I’ll do is I’ll pull my study on that up in a second here. I’ll let you kind of riff on that for a minute. Go ahead.

Evan Brand: Yeah. And regarding this stuff you’ve already talked about with the false positives. It’s not that you’re saying this doesn’t exist, it truly does exist. And it’s not that you’re saying people are not dying, they truly are dying. But what we’re saying is, it’s really tough when you’re looking at the amount of response that’s happened, based on everything being shut down, when people that are dying from other things are getting tagged as that and then you have the state by state governors coming on the news and saying, oh, my goodness, we had 30 more deaths in the past 24 hours or 50 more deaths or whatever, and you don’t have you don’t have any idea of actually, how many of those 30 were truly that versus just the naturally occurring 30 deaths that would have happened in that city based on some other respiratory thing.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 110% Yep, that’s 100% true. And that’s the concern. It’s always it’s always about proportion. Okay, that’s really the key thing. It’s always about proportionality is what we’re doing proportional to what’s happening, right? Because we don’t want to overshoot in any of these things either. So we got to look at everything and proportionality perspective, I think gets really important. So we already talked about that or anything else. Evan, you wanted to highlight on that?

Evan Brand: That’s it for that. I just wanted to get back to the to the real point here, which is that if you’re kind of blessed with more time on your hands now and you’re thinking, Okay, what can I do to be proactive? That’s what you said in the beginning, which is that we want to be more action based. We want to be more action oriented, as opposed to just having so much fear you don’t know what to do with the fear. If you are fearful, I totally understand, but we want you to channel that. So possibly intermittent fasting, which is going to help promote insulin sensitivity and improve your blood sugar management. Now, this is important for if you’re a type two diabetic, this is important for high blood pressure that can help reduce that. If you’re obese that can help that possibly going ketogenic or Close to ketogenic or maybe cycling in and out of ketosis is going to be helpful as well. This is going to significantly reduce your risk of becoming seriously ill if you were to get infected that is the point is that you may possibly could get infected, but you want to do as much as you can to reduce your potential risk of severity and getting blood pressure regulated, getting blood sugar under control, those are going to be very, very important based on what we’re looking at here with this whole Italy paper.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and let me go share here one more article with you guys so you guys can see what I’m talking about. All right. Okay, so this is the big thing, right? We’ve already kind of talked about if you guys have been following some of my podcasts on this topic, is the fact that one study right here found 86% of all infections were actually undocumented. Undocumented means you have the antibodies or you actually got the infection but you have no symptoms at 86%. That’s one that’s one out of 7.14 people are actually showing symptoms. It could be even higher, it could be 10 to 20 symptoms 10 to 20 people have no symptoms for everyone that does have symptoms, okay? So for every seven to eight on the low end are going to get the infection and have no symptoms per one, or up to 10 to 20 are going to get the infection make antibodies and have no symptoms. That’s really, really important because that creates herd immunity, right? When you get 90 95% of the population with an infection, after two to three weeks are no longer spreading it, they’re going to have an immune response. So here’s 86% of all infections are undocumented. Here’s the whole higher temperature thing, right? They’re looking at basically, here are basically different cities in China and they look at the temperature and they look at as the temperature increases Celsius, the infection rate drops, and that’s important and that’s partly because of UV light, kills viruses and humidity actually makes it harder for viruses to spread. I want you to keep that in the back end. Hey guys. And there was one more study here. This has potential false asymptomatic rate, and they’re looking at nearly half of even more of the asymptomatic infected individuals reported the active nucleic acid screening might be a false positive. That’s important. This kind of supports the whole false positive thing. If you have a test, that’s half correct, you’re going to get more people stacked on. And the other component I want to highlight is, this is an article out of the LA Times large scale COVID-19 antibody testing study launched in California, so they’re doing a COVID-19 antibody study already, because there’s only 300 deaths. There’s about a 10 to 15 x difference between California and New York. That’s crazy. When we go look at the United States, we break it down. Let’s go look at their stats. And when you compare California number one who has a higher homeless population, because of the weather, so you’re gonna have more transmission because you know, the homeless are going to be malnourished they’re going to live in tight close quarters. is gonna be less sanitation, plumbing, all that stuff, right? Look at California they have 681 total deaths. Let’s look in New York, they have 9385. Okay, we do the math on that 9385 divided by 681. That’s a 14 x difference, nearly 14 x difference. And they’re supposing the reason why that happened because there’s only about a two day difference between social distancing in New York and California. And remember, it takes two weeks for social distancing to actually take effect. So two days would not explain a 14 to 15 x difference. And we also have other countries that didn’t really shut down their economy. Alright, so for instance, if we just do desk per 1 million just as a good reference point. That way we can compare smaller countries whereas the US the US is at 67. Desperate 1 million. We’re Sweden that Sweden just a little bit higher at 91. So there are only one country in between us and Sweden. Sweden didn’t shut down their economy. Okay, who else didn’t? I can tell you Denmark didn’t and they’re actually less than us. Okay. I could tell you who else didn’t was Brazil?

Evan Brand: Yeah, tell us the number since people may not be watching some people may be listening. Denmark is 49 deaths per million.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep. Denmark’s 49 We also are going to have Brazil here. Let me just do a Ctrl F on this so I can find it faster. So Brazil’s at six deaths per million. I can also tell you who didn’t shut down their economy was South Korea. Okay, South Korea didn’t shut down their economy either and South Korea is at 37 out that South Africa South Korea, ads I can find them on here. I’m not sure whether or not there but they are actually less as well. I’ll try to pull them up here in a minute.

Evan Brand: That’s okay. That’s That’s enough. That’s enough points. I mean, that’s crazy. Oh, there it is. That’s Korea.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So therefore, yeah, they’re under S dot Korea 4 per million for Wow. You can see the US is at 91 and then you can see a couple of countries ahead of us. So the nice thing is we have a Decent control, meaning other countries that didn’t go to the full extent. And there’s a couple of theories out there. What does this do? So number one by us doing all the quarantine stuff and in socialized social distancing, that helps flatten the curve. Now, let’s see the curve. Here’s the curve. All right, we’re already at peak, we’re already coming down the bell curve now. Okay, I predicted this two weeks ago, this would happen like around April 10, April 11. It happened April 11. They actually predicted April 16. And they backed it off a bit. Okay. Remember, these are the same experts that came in at two to 3 million deaths. Without social distancing, then then with just social distancing being intact. They went from 2 to 3 million to 2 to 300,000. And they went from that to 100,000 to 85,065. And now they’re at 60,000 projected deaths. Okay, here it is 61,545. Now, I’ll just tell you, that’s a massive variance. That’s a massive variance when you go off 10 20 x by plugging in simple variables, and you’re that far off, that’s concerning. Okay, that means we have a bad model. But anyway, if we go look at the hospital resources, the whole goal of flattening the curves, so we don’t go outside of the shaded area, right? These are all of our resources up here.

Evan Brand: And what he’s showing resources for people listening on audio, he’s looking at a graph here, there’s a big shadow, we TP sort of over this dotted line, the TP is the capacity. And the capacity is insanely higher than what the reality of need is for various beds and things like that. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So the the purple dotted line is kind of where we’re actually projected. And then the shadow is kind of where our resources max out. So the whole reason why we do all this social distancing is to flatten the curve. But now that we’re on top of the curve, and our resources were more than adequate, well, now I think it’s time at some point for at least help people to start going to get get getting back out there and becoming asymptomatic, getting antibodies. They I already know what’s happening in California. That’s why they are, are doing the study right now. Right? Why have so many people in California not gotten sick compared to New York? It’s because there’s antibodies. And they’re actually doing this study over at Stanford right now, testing antibodies at a large scale. So that’s important to note.

Evan Brand: Okay, well, I’m gonna sneak out. I’m gonna sneak out of this podcast. But I think if you have more things to say, don’t let me end your podcast short, but I gotta run.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Sounds good. Having a good chat with you. We will be in touch this week. Take care. 

Evan Brand: Sounds good, everybody. Take care. Bye. Bye. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: All right, so just to keep on rolling with you guys here. Let’s go look at the stats. So the US is already over the bell curve. So the problem a lot of people interpret statistics as a logarithmic thing like this. So they kind of look at it as like, Whoa, it just keeps on going forever, right? That’s kind of how they look at it. But no, it typically works like a like a bell curve. All right, so you can see our cases are already dropping for the last week, which is great. Now, again, are these case numbers correct? We don’t necessarily know if the case numbers are correct. But if we’re using the same faulty testing for everyone, we at least have the same baseline. Right? So we have the case numbers dropping, we have the deaths actually dropping as well, you can see that so we have a nice decline here on the bell curve, which shows us we are on the right track. Okay. And let’s compare us to Italy. All right, Italy, deaths totally dropping. And daily new cases totally dropping as well. So we’re on the right track there. So my general suggestion is people that are healthy, and people that are younger, the best thing we can do is get herd immunity going via natural passive exposure. So eventually, at some point, when we start getting back out there, the Healthy People getting out there first will be the best thing that we can do, because that will one will get over it fast or we have a 90% chance of having no symptoms. And then we create this natural passive immunity that will last me Minimum a few years, it could even last decades, right? Think about every childhood illness, chickenpox, right? I got chickenpox. I never had to worry about chickenpox. Again, that’s a lifetime thing, or at least a three or four decade thing. But either way, a couple of years on the short end, decades on the long end. 

But one thing that’s interesting look, look at India. India is a big country, right? India’s over a billion people and we know like places like Bombay or other areas where their close quarters maybe not the best plumbing maybe a little bit inhospitable. In regards to that stuff, cleanliness, their cases are pretty darn low and their deaths are already dropping. They’re already kind of trending down a little bit and they only had 300 deaths in the country of 300. I mean 1.2 million people I think so I think what you’re seeing here is more antibody more herd immunity stuff, right? This is more herd immunity. This is India and again, the data is coming from World meters dot info. All right. Same thing with Italy Italy’s already on the downward track. We already talked About the study here in LA and Stanford where they’re looking at the antibody testing, I’ve actually already ordered antibody testing for myself. And I’ll be getting it tested really soon. And then we talked about the diagnosis, the diagnostic criteria and why it’s a little bit suspect. I think that’s really important to kind of highlight because it’s probable or presumed, and that’s concerning, because when there’s a lot of hysteria and symptoms overlap, which they do, okay, symptoms overlap, probable and presumed is a really easy logical step to make. Okay. 

And then I wanted to highlight the the study here. So this is the 50% false positive rate there. And then we have at a minimum we have at a minimum 86% of infections are undocumented meaning they’re asymptomatic, okay, meaning you have the antibodies. You have the infection, but no symptoms. That’s one that’s 7.14 people are going to get the antibodies and no infection for everyone that gets it and that’s on the low. End it It can be even as high as a 95%, which would be 19 people out of 20 actually are asymptomatic. Okay, keep that in the back of your head. And the major mechanism I want to highlight here is going to be the blood sugar mechanism. This study here looking at type two diabetes and metabolic improvement, what they found is your phagocytes which are part of their an activity that your immune cells to like neutrophils, lymphocytes, monocytes, they act like Pac men and Pac women and they gobble up and invalidate viruses. So here’s a virus here, and it’s going to eat this virus up and it’s going to digest it and break it down. Okay? This process gets weaker when we have high levels of insulin. And so here they say glycemic control is related to phagocytic activity. Our results suggest that improving improvement in the phagocytic activity can be added to the beneficial effects of metabolic optimization. Man, people write these things as if they don’t want you to understand what’s going on. What they’re saying is Hey, the less insulin we make The better our blood sugar is, the more your phagocytes are going to act are going to gobble up viruses and bacteria in your body. So better immune health. So we have better blood sugar and better insulin levels, equal better immune levels. I wish they could just write it that simple in a bullet point type of thing. And then we know just to bring it up for you guys. Um, so we have New England, New England Journal of Medicine, I’m gonna pull this up for you guys.

And then we’ll do COVID-19 patients. And I already pulled this study up recently, but here you go. This came out last month, March 30th. And what I wanted to highlight in this study was the diabetes mechanisms. So you’re going to see right here of 58%, had diabetes mellitus 58%. And again, this is a small patient sample, but I just wanted to highlight that because it’s very, very important because we know the mechanism of blood sugar issues and weakened immune system. response. So if I can just get people to just focus on sunlight, natural vitamin D, getting their blood sugar under control, while at the same time getting on some things to support your immune system I’ve already talked about it vitamin A, C and D are going to be great things first line on the nutrient side if we can stack in and AC or glue to tie on even better. And then if you want to add a immune booster on the herbal or medicinal mushroom side we do Reishi astragalus as a good kind of stack and now my line I have a product called them you know supreme that has a combination of those in it as well as one called viruses. That’s kind of like my back label one that I’m doing now I backorder one because my other ones getting sold out. So I have two products that I’m that I’m personally taking right now my family is taking but those are options if you guys kind of want a combo product. If not you guys can also piecemeal some of the general suggestions that I’m making. I hope that helps. Let me just see if I have any questions guys and I’m happy to help you out.

Alright, let’s see what’s up. Let me go into questions for you guys. Okay, here we go.

What about the role of processed food and lowering immunity 100% Why? Why would processed food do that processed food is tends to be higher in junky crap oh hydrates and refined sugar and also bad fats, bad fats. So those things are going to weaken your cells and they’re going to increase the insulin and weaken your immune system. Yeah, Kathy writes, it makes me sick. Oh, people are falling for the fear mongering. Thank you guys for doing what you’re doing. Yep, absolutely. I appreciate it. Kathy Jane Friday Not today. Nevin does hi BP groups of deaths differentiate between uncontrolled high BP BP or control BP with people control meds. It’s gonna go with comorbidities. So if someone has a diagnosis or a disease But they’re actually managing it and their blood pressure is normal, they’re probably not going to fall in that category. There are multiple people that are going to have blood pressure problems primarily because of blood sugar, and then blood sugars and to create kidney stress and, and kidney stress is going to create blood pressure as well as blood pressure is also going to be intimately connected with heart disease. So it just depends kind of where you’re at. If you’re on a medication, and you’re managing your blood pressure, and it’s, you know, under 120, over 80, you’re probably going to be fine. But I mean, in general, why are you on the blood pressure medication because a lot of times those medications over the long term actually create more problems because a lot of them, a lot of them work by being a diuretic. And when you have a diuretic, you’re going to be pulling out a lot of important minerals that are actually important for the heart to work properly, like potassium and magnesium. So you just got to make sure you’re supporting the nutrients so your heart works good to Justin and Evan, I was wondering if I’m a high risk for COVID. Since I have HSD. You have to give me the abbreviation HST I could probably figure it out in arthritis in mass cell activation. I do eat healthy take vitamins and light exercise and 51 K. Let me just see if I can figure out what you mean by HST. See here? Nope, does not come up here. For me. I was at the the hypermobility spectrum disorder. So yeah, the third danlos syndrome issue. Yeah, it’s an autoimmune thing that affects connective tissue. Yeah, you definitely would be at higher risk. It just depends if you’re managing it now or not, like, are you stable with it or not? Of course, if you’re not stable, and you don’t have the good habits that we’ve talked about, then you’re definitely at risk. TNF alpha aisle six concentrations are high enough. rightous. Yeah, I mean, if you have an arthritic issue that’s going to be especially autoimmune based, your immune system will be more stressed. And if it’s more stressed, then it won’t have the resources to fight other infections appropriately. So of course glutathione and vitamin D is going to be one of the easiest low hanging fruit to modulate your immune system outside of just fresh air, clean water and a good whole food paleo template, favoring the lower side, the lower carbohydrate side. Doc JC writes in, great job guys. Have you heard about the FDA approved blood for blood purification devices seem to seem to figure it out. They have been mistreating to some degree thus far. Yeah, so a couple of things. I’m not sure what device you’re talking about. But the big issue that we’re finding is that there’s a lot of hypoxia. So most like flu causes more like a pneumonia. The problem with the pneumonia is we’re not quite seeing that as much we’re seeing more hypoxia, partly because the virus is destroying hemoglobin, and hemoglobin carries oxygen. Hemoglobin also has iron attached to it. So when you destroy hemoglobin, you’re also releasing a whole bunch of iron, which creates a lot more oxidative stress and inflammation. So part of the the underlying theory is maybe giving blood transfusions or purifying the blood in a way to get the iron out and add fresh human load them back in so they can carry oxygen. The next thing is let’s get them on maybe a seat, pap or just increase the oxygenation. Because the ventilators not fixing that. And in a lot of places, when you intubate, and you do ventilator under higher pressure, you can create damage to the lungs. So a lot of people are rethinking how ventilators are being used. So my general suggestion is if you have a family member or yourself, going under a ventilator one try to maximize oxygen First, use a C Pap, of course, on the conventional side, I would talk to your doctor and ask about hydroxychloroquine out ask about the azithromycin. As long as you don’t have heart issues, and I’d ask about adding the 230 milligrams of zinc, I’d follow that acute protocol. And again, that’s going to be more defensive or offensive approach, but it’s kind of late stage offensive approach, do all the nutrient things ahead of time, and that I think will help even better but in general, cleaning out the blood, getting fresh hemoglobin in pulling the iron out Also if you have access to hyperbaric oxygen hyperbaric chamber oxygen therapy, where you can increase the oxygen saturation that may be a really good option.

It’s BS, it’s a virus it’s a blood disorder. So basically the virus is destroying the hemoglobin. So yeah, I do agree the virus is a destroying the hemoglobin and the hemoglobin carries the oxygen, thus, the hypoxia. Yeah, Cindy writes and I strongly agree the news is false Toronto old man 94 black face at home the died. They claim it’s a virus. Yeah, I mean, there’s definitely a lot of issues going on here. We look at the facts don’t ever don’t ever, you know, take a single person story, a emotional piece, you know, puff piece. You know, it’s sad that someone dies. I mean, all all lives matter. Right. But in general, when we look at things, we have to look at it over a broad spectrum. We have to know what the comorbidities are at See here? It’s Elon Musk satellites. Not sure about that. I can’t speak to that, Ben. A lot of people saying it’s not I’m not sure. I mean, I just know that something you know, something is being tested, something’s coming back up, something’s affecting the immune system. I’m not sure if there’s data that it’s not a virus, but I think there’s something there for sure. See here what to do about intrinsic factor to absorb vitamin B 12. In leaky gut patients. So I mean, fix the gut, fix the gut, but in the meantime, you can always take high quality methylated b12 sublingually to improve the absorption. What’s the best sugar soft do any recommendations you can also do an organic high quality stevia, you know, do it in moderation, because when your tongue when sugar hits your tongue, it still can spit out a little bit of insulin so you don’t want to be training your body to to taste sugar in the field sugar all the time, even if it’s stevia or monk fruit, because you will maybe release a little bit of incense So you got to be careful with that. So at 20 on that meaning 20% of the time, you can use a little bit of high quality stevia without maltodextrin or monk fruits a good option. Patty rice, and thank you for sharing your facts so we can make our own decision. Excellent. Thanks, Patty. Any over the counter medications to manage if we get it, so if you actually get it, the first thing, it just depends if you’re in that risk factor group, and it depends on how severe it is because most people this thing won’t be that bad, right most. So 90% are going to be asymptomatic. And out of the out of that 10% that get it 80% will be totally mild. Write a little bit of an ache, like kind of feel like you have a mild flu or a mild cold for a couple days and it’s done. Okay, and it’s done. I know my brother actually got it. My brother works at a hospital and test for COVID-19 patients. And he felt like he got exposed. It was a two day kind of cold for him and he was up and over it but what gotta know afterwards because we’re going to test everyone with antibodies after the fact. Someone with IBD is more at risk, even though not taking immune suppressant medications. So Riley with yourself, because I know your history that you have Crohn’s. I would say only if you’re flaring. If you’re flaring with your Crohn’s. And your immune system is really stressed because of a flare, and you have blood in your stool and you’re not absorbing nutrition, I would say you’re definitely more at risk. But if you’re keeping everything at bay, because the inflammation under control, you’re digesting you’re absorbing, I would think you’re going to be in great shape. The question is, are you in the middle of a flare or not? And if you’re not, then that gives you a much better chance to be totally fine. When dealing with iron deficiency and infections, do you recommend taking iron food supplements on its own or adding some probiotics or herbs to the mix? Well, it depends. So I mean, in the context of COVID-19, I would not want to be adding any additional iron, unless we’re someone that’s a vegetarian and we know iron is very low, or a woman that’s menstruating. Quite a bit, or we know that we’re not dealing with infection, we’re just dealing with a malabsorption issue, and or maybe a poor diet issue because we’re vegan or vegetarian. So those could be possible players. It just depends. I would need more context. Tina writes in what dose of vitamins for children’s six years old? Well, I mean, I would need a little bit more reference on that. Like what for vitamin C for cod liver oil, I can just give you like vitamin D, you’d probably be fine with two to 3000 I use a vitamin D right now at least maybe for a month and retest. I would say on the vitamin C side, you could probably do a gram to just monitor loose stools. Here’s your kit. Your child’s tools are getting loose, we just back off on that. That’d be a really good you know, first thing, okay.

And again, there are some herbal immune supports that you can get for your kids I use one called immunoberry for my son, I have a couple and we use that and we do like one full dropper twice a day on that. Alright guys, hope that makes sense. Any other questions? For me, and let me know, was fun chatting, I just want to bring you guys some good Intel. I don’t want you guys to be scared. I want you guys to be in the driver’s seat. No one’s talking about offensive measures that can be done. Everyone’s talking about flattening the curve, which I think we done right, I showed you the data on that we’ve already done that. I think at this stage of the game, we you know, when the right health authorities come out and say it’s time I’ve been getting a lot of the Healthy People out there first is going to be smart, because we’re going to develop more herd immunity, and that will prevent the infection from being passed around. All right, and then if you’re in that really compromised group, then it makes more sense to me to be a little bit more quarantine, keep a little bit more distance in the meantime, and let everyone have a good chance to develop herd immunity first. And then number three, do all the immune boosting things, especially if you’re if you’re of that older age. You know, make sure you’re digesting your protein well if you need some hydrochloric acid, get that in there. Get your vitamin D Get your C up, if you need to proactively be on some glutathione or NAC do that in the meantime to really support your immune system and just kind of use common sense. I mean, people know when they get sick or if they’re immunocompromised, they kind of keep distances right. So I think just kind of do that. And if you’re stronger and healthier, I’m okay, still use common sense. Listen to what the you know, your local people are saying some places in the country are really strict right now. Some aren’t. I don’t want to get you guys arrested and tell you to do the wrong thing. But just do all the right things offensively to keep your guy’s immune system strong. Why are young people with strong immune system is dying? So that’s that’s news crap, right? Of course, people will die that are young. Of course, the problem is we don’t know anything about their background. And we need to know the statistical significance of that. Are we talking point 2% point 1% of the population, we have to know it as a percentage. So we can get a perception I can tell you like in the state of Massachusetts, where I’m from Started article saying one, not one person under the age of 60 has died of this and that was in mass. I’ve seen it in Italy, the average age of death in Italy was 79 and a half. So what you’re saying is not statistically significant by any means. And just to kind of give you guys an idea, the flu this season so far has killed 150 pediatric patients that’s between zero and 18. Okay. So you’re not seeing a puff piece. What think about a flu seasons? What, 90 days 100 days, you could almost see one to two people killed every day of the flu but you’re not seeing an X ray on those young people killed by the flu every day. You’re not okay. Because there’s not an emotional investment there is now so just know that that’s happened before and the media has responded differently. Now it’s happening again, and they’re responding differently. So just think right. Context is everything context brings you comfort, okay? contacts brings you comfort, is coconut or dates, sugar, a good surface. Dude, um, coconut sugar is and have a glycemic index to 15. So it’ll be okay. It’s still sugar, sugar more natural, but it’s still going to be sugar. So that’s okay. If you want to put it on that 20% cheat side, I typically would recommend something that would be we would have no sugar in it. And now the more the stevia or the monk fruit, first, maybe a little bit of birch trees out what’s all second or third Be careful animals can, if they eat it, they could die. So be very careful with that. And then the more natural, slower sugars maybe second or third, but again, they are still sugars is lipids, omo vitamin C equivalent to vitamin C from food sources. So vitamin C like was almost you’ll need less of a dose to increase your vitamin C levels when compared to, you know, a buffered vitamin C number one and then number two food sources. I mean, it just depends; it would probably absorb a little bit better for sure. [inaudible]

Is it okay to take Zinc in how many mg? I would say in Zinc you can take anywhere between 10-30mg, you could do a Zinc Sulfate, or Zinc Aspartate, this would be totally fine. The Zinc Glycinate, usually a good Zinc bound to a good clean amino acid is good. 10-30mg, and again in the Covid-19, Dr. Zulenco kinda had a clinical trial or more of a case study, he said 800 patients did not wanna pass from Covid, and they had a 99.9 success rate and he was doing 220-230mg of Zinc. That’s very acute. And again, Covid-19 a disease, SARS Covis-2 is the virus. Covid-19 is the disease, it’s kinda like HIV is the virus, AIDS is the disease. Okay, just kinda keep that in mind. People are combining the two. Ordered supplements from your store, I usually have them shipped to Detroit but can’t cross the border now. Will you ship it in Canada? Yes we can Dale, absolutely no problem. Sometimes there’s a little bit of delay with customs right now but we have no problem with that. I have a lot of Canadian patients. Mark writes in, could sudden loss of eyebrow hair be due to low thyroid, Yes it could be. Also see if there’s low temperature with it. And if you’re concerned we can always get you tested thyroid. If you need to order that, go to, click on the lab tests section, and there will be a place for a full thyroid blood test that you can click on, order and get a prescription for and go to your local test lab, even today if you wanted. Labs are pretty sterile with protocols, our worst case just waits till everything is good to go.

It was phenomenal chatting with everyone. I’ll be back maybe later on for a live Q&A on all topics outside Covid. I hope you enjoyed the podcast, if you enjoyed, give a thumbs up, sharing is caring, comment down below, share to friends and family and if you want to reach out to me personally for a consult, we’ll put the link down for you guys. Alright have a good one, take care y’all. Bye.


Audio Podcast:

The Top Causes of Gut Inflammation | Podcast #260

It’s Thanksgiving season! For today’s episode, Dr. J and Evan Brand talk about diet and lifestyle strategies during the holidays, how the food we take causes a few gut inflammation, how we address it and how we can treat it. Check out this podcast to learn more.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover: 

00:01 Thanksgiving, Instant Pot

06:38 Oils for the body

13:34 Food additives

20:55 Stress

28:52 Circadian rhythm


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are live it’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan Brand. Evan, how are you doing man? How was your Thanksgiving?

Evan Brand: I’m doing very good. I made my first Turkey. And it turned out wonderful I was in the in the Cooksey this year and I really enjoyed it. We did a pasture fed turkey that we got from like 20 minutes down the road. And we did the brine we went to Whole Foods and got this like organic seasoning Brian combo that we put in a big ol VAT basically let the turkey sit in there for 1314 hours and rubbed a bunch of grass fed butter on it the next day, put some herbs and stuff on top and bake the bad boy, I want to hear about your experience because because baking is kind of boring. You did something a lot more fun.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I’ve been smoking my Thanksgiving Day Turkey for the last five years. You know, being in Austin and with Texas barbecue. I was like hey, let’s let’s let’s do it. The old Texas style so I got a trigger smoker. I think we did. I posted an Instagram and Facebook picture honest I didn’t want it wants to take a look, you can feel free to head over to my Facebook or Instagram page. And we smoked it. I think it was Apple, cherry and oak. And it came out great did about four hour time cooked it about 250 to 280 degrees or so. And it came out phenomenal. So really great.

Evan Brand: Well other people can do Turkeys like people that are in other countries, if you don’t celebrate Thanksgiving, it doesn’t mean you can’t smoke a turkey. That’s the interesting thing. Like we do these really, really good meals, but it’s only for like one day a year. It’s like why not smoke a turkey? Just randomly maybe we should do that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I like it. I mean, I paid a little bit more money to have the turkey be like pasture fed, organic, high quality. So great meal. Excellent. My animals are still benefiting from all the the kind of the, let’s say all the cartilaginous connective tissue that I could scrounge off the carcass afterwards, so they’re loving it.

Evan Brand: Oh, yeah. Speaking of I threw the carcass out in the woods and my shih tzu she went out there and found it and I guess she gorgeous herself on the carcass and so she spent the rest of the day you can guess what she was doing. She was throwing it all up. She ate her her body weight and carcass. Oh man. That’s crazy. Very cool. So that was a bad mistake and then the turkey vultures came in the next day and finish the carcass off which was pretty cool to see. That is cool. Excellent. The life cycle thank you for the turkeys. Yeah circle of life totally.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, that’s cool. I mean, we’ve talked about a lot of diet and lifestyle strategies during the holiday. So you know some of the sites that I did good quality mashed potatoes grass fed butter, we did a gluten free grain free pumpkin pie kept it really simple. And then we just did it like green beans with some bacon in there. Some asparagus. Some squash, kept it really simple, really clean, high quality food. So it was overall great, great holiday love Thanksgiving.

Evan Brand: Yeah, we did green beans and the pressure cooker the Instant Pot which turned out good aids, put some garlic salt in there. It took like six minutes. Throw your green beans in threw in some butter threw in. She might have threw in a little avocado oil too. I can’t remember. But then some garlic salt, and of course some bacon six minutes. It was perfect. We did bake sweet potatoes, slice them up. Just put some cinnamon and coconut sugar on them with butter, put them in the oven, bake them. What else did we do almond flour muffins. Those were good. Put some almond butter on top of those bad boys. That was kind of our dessert. And yeah, so people talk about their board, and then they go off their diet. So we’re kind of transitioning into the topic of gut inflammation and the causes of it. Yes, but a lot of people sabotage themselves because they say that they get bored of their diet and they don’t know what to eat. But you could eat sweet potatoes and Turkey and green beans all the time and be totally healthy and not bored.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s typically not a good excuse. Because people that say that say they’re bored. It sounds like their diet is that of a world traveler where they’re eating all this fine cuisine. Every now and then I see it but most of the time it’s not. It’s kind of like boring grains are boring, boring, kind of conventional. Food I think I’ve seen data on it that the average person only eats 12 foods in their lifetime on at-

Evan Brand: I’ll believe it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So the fact that someone’s like well I’m bored it’s like yeah yeah but on average you’re not eating that many foods and you can really create a lot of variety eating some of the you know, paleo template foods there’s a lot of options especially with me obviously any kind of meat any kind of vegetable within reason and then healthy fats and then dialing in the carbs according to what you need and really emphasizing on food quality is important so I like that also in support man, mashed potatoes 10 minutes Easy peasy done where like you may be boiling potatoes for like, you know 45 minutes to an hour or baking them for an hour before you mash them. So really saves time. Now this may be a dumb question, but are you you’re not mashing those beforehand. You’re just throwing in like the chunks and then pressure cook the chunks. Not even a chunk, man, just the whole potato. Oh, wow. Okay, like I just throw the whole potato in done 10 minutes. Put it out, throw it on a Pyrex tray, maximum Mash mash mash mash butter salt done, beautiful like, Okay, I’m gonna try it the Instant pot really saves a lot of time you can do ribs on that thing and like 30 minutes or normally may take you five hours, I think is a really good invention. The only issue with the Instant pot is you just got to be really focused and you got to make sure that you vent it when you open the thing up. And also make sure that little kind of little thing that pops up. It’s like a little kind of meter device that pops up make sure it falls back down below so you know it’s not pressurized when you open it up and a couple of patients will burn themselves or you can read stuff online where people open it up and it is like a bomb if you open it up without depressurizing

Evan Brand: and thank you to today’s sponsor Instant Pot.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, Instant Pot! I’ll put will put our Amazon links below so if anyone wants to access the Instant Pot will put the link below we’d like it. It’s really good.

Evan Brand: That is a joke. They’re not technically sponsoring the podcast but I did see some good Black Friday deals on those. So even if you’re listening to this like a year from now, I mean the instant pots generally 100 bucks or less. So I think it should be It should be in your cooking strategy. And that way, you’re not going to be eating some of the garbage that we’re talking about, like industrial seed oils. Why don’t we talk about this, let’s dive into some of these big causes of things that people are doing to destroy their gut lining.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And just to highlight one more thing before we move on is anytime we talk about a product, we’ve actually used it ourselves and we like it. So we want to be 100% authentic about products, if we if we like it, and we’ve used it, we will talk about it just know if we are talking about it. It’s because we’ve used it and we like it. we approve it. Awesome. So let’s go dive into so you were just talking about the some of the top things that drive gut inflammation, take it away.

Evan Brand: Yeah. So the the big oils, that’s that’s the problem is a lot of these oils. And if you look at the standard American diet, just even 100 years ago, your grandparents or your great grandparents, they did not have access to these type of oils. They were going to be cooking with your traditional fast like they’re going to be doing a lot of lard and maybe some beef tallow Some of these traditional fats like if I asked my grandfather, what did your grandmother cook you? And what does she cook it with? She was not using soybean oil. She was not using corn oil. She was not using grapeseed oil, which is canola. She was not using peanut oil. And if they did something fried, it was going to be fried and possibly bacon fat, which came from the pig in the backyard of the farm, or it was going to be cooked in some type of like a beef tallow where the cows were on the back part of the farm. my grandpa’s grandparents had like 300 acres, and they had a bunch of cows back there. So it wasn’t, hey, we’re going to take this canola oil, we’re going to coat which really annoying as I’ve seen some gluten free fish out there like some breaded fish, but the problem is it’s loaded with canola oil. So it’s kind of like do you take the risk, like the pros and cons does the implement the implement inflammatory component of the canola oil does that counteract this this damaged Seed Oil, does that counteract the benefit of the cod or the salmon or whatever else you get? And the answer is, I don’t know. I think you kind of have to choose your battles. What’s your what’s your comment on it?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so when it comes down to fats, most plant fats are not going to be the best unless they’re cold extracted, or unless they’re minimally processed to extract the fats, partly because of the processes of extracting attends the damage to the fats, because the heat and the extraction process also makes the fats rancid and taste bad. There’s a lot of like deodorizing and filtration, and different processes to make it more palatable that you would never be able to have it a natural state. So the best plant fats are going to be obviously number one is coconut oil, because it’s a saturated fat, it’s any more temperature stable. And then number two would be like either a cold pressed olive oil or a good quality avocado which is primarily amodo one saturated fat and then premier something like a palm, which is more in a kind of saturated state. And then of course, you can do outside of that, and avocado oil would be pretty reasonable. And those would be my top ones on the plant side. Is there anything you wanted to add there, I mean, there are some nut based some sea based oils, but then you start ramping up the Omega six. And those may not be the best. There are some supplemental oils that are more GLA based that I’ll give supplementally like black currant seed oil, but will give it supplementally and that’s coming from great sources that are going to be in capsules that won’t be oxidized and such that will be really good and you know, wouldn’t be an oil, I hope it wasn’t my top animal or top plant based fats. And yeah, that’s going to be really helpful because bad fats are going to one create a lot of oxidative stress. And they’re going to deplete a lot of your antioxidant reserves. Because if those fats are oxidize, your bodies need a lot of vitamin C and vitamin E to help with the oxidative stress that those fats may cause your body.

Evan Brand: Very true. Let me ask you the question about the The breading so like you find a good fish, but it’s a gluten free breading. So it’s not covered in wheat. But it’s some type of non gluten containing flour, but then you’ve got canola oil. Do you think you’re still going to be net positive in terms of nutrition because you still got the good fish, but yet you’ve got the inflammatory oils? Or would you say, just get you some grilled fish? And then if you want to read it, you read it yourself?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, I’m, I’m on the fence with that there’s a product that we like, I think it’s Alexis, and they have two potato fries. And my wife will do that for my son just because it’s really easy, but they have a little bit of canola oil in there. So it’s like Ah, so you have this kind of convenience factor where ideally, if you could, you always would want to put your own fat on there if you could, and my eat my easy saturated fat or my easy fat for cooking. That’s plant based would be like avocado. I like all avocado because it tastes a little bit more neutral. I do not like olive oil as much olive oil is better for dressings, but I’ll do it Hello for cooking so I’m kind of on the fence with that but I would tend to if you have control over it You always choose the better fat over the junkie fat if you can.

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, well said so, the interesting thing is like coconut oil and avocado, they’ve become kind of trendy and I would say avocado is not going to be a traditional fat meaning like traditional people, we’re probably not doing it because you’ve got to have some heavy duty equipment to extract oil but coconut oil would be super traditional. I mean, this would be something that help historical use

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, if you’re eating a whole avocado you’d be able to have access to that that wouldn’t be a problem but the the actual oil portions what you’re talking about, right yeah,

Evan Brand: I’m talking just you know, pouring it in your in your pan and cooking something with it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, your your big fats that are going to be plant based would probably be primarily coconut. But then your your biggest ones that I think are going to be used more, you know, long term from generation to generation will be your like your Talos, right? Your bacon fat, your duck fat, those kind of things because saturated fats don’t go bad, right. They stay good for Long time because the carbon is saturated with four hydrogen bonds between them, which makes the fat really really really temperature stable.

Evan Brand: It’s beautiful. Alright, so we hit the we hit the oils, those are bad, they’re bad for your gut. They cause inflammation, oxidative stress, food additives. Let’s talk about those next. Here’s the hard part is food additives are in literally everything you could even go and get like an organic. I was looking at some organic gravy, like a gravy mixture, but it had added stuff to it like maltodextrin and flavors and stuff like that. And so of course you always there’s a spectrum right there’s the straight garbage MSG, caragenin Splenda type things that will go into but then you’ve got the spectrum where maybe you find organic spices that had a little flavor added but it was an organic flavor, and you don’t worry about it as much.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. Yep. I like that the spices and the flavoring are going to be big, MSG, aspartame, they’re going to be more excited toxins. They can increase brain fog. They can stimulate your brain neurons to death, so to speak. That’s where some of that data came from. So not the best thing long term. And of course, you know, inflammation in the gut can create inflammation in the brain. So if you’re listening to this, and you don’t have any gut issues, most people associate foods or additives or bad fats with gut issues, but a lot of times it could just be increased inflammation. And that inflammation could be manifesting from joint pain or headaches or mood issues or brain fog. So just remember when we talk about some of these things, it may not necessarily be connected to a digestive issue or a gut issue. And that’s the hardest thing people to wrap their heads around.

Evan Brand: Yeah, let’s talk about this study we’ve got here on food additives, specifically Splenda, it’s ridiculous. You’ll see things that are promoted as healthy but then they have added Splenda to them. You have to there was a paper it was 2018 inflammatory bowel disease was the paper I guess I don’t see any other any other journal it was from but long story short, Splenda. It says here in the in the conclusion of the study Is that Splenda promoted dysbiosis. And we did a whole show on that. We’ve done many, many, many on dysbiosis. But basically an imbalance of good and bad bacteria, which then creates inflammation, intestinal permeability, and on and on. But all you could do that just with Splenda. So it’s like, oh, I eat paleo, but yet I put Splenda. We’re like when those little fake drink packets, you know those little Have you seen those the little packets where it’s like a fruit punch and you put it in your water, but it’s got Splenda instead of stevia. It’s just

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: not good. Not good. Yeah. If you want something like that, you’re much better off getting their Sweet Leaf brand and put a couple of drops of stevia in there with something like that or using an essential oil like lemon or lime or just grabbing a lime or lemon and just squeezing in and that’s a much better way to do it.

Evan Brand: I like to do monk fruit, I’ve got a lot of some monk fruit liquid. And so we’ll just take half along half a lemon, about five drops among crew and you’ve got an amazing lemonade and you’re not going to need any of those little face. Splenda, flavor packs, they’re just terrible.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and with flavoring in general, you want to make it a minority of the time, because when you’re putting something a whole bunch of sweet stuff in there, and your tongue is hitting sweet your brains like program that sweet means calories. And calories also mean sugar as well. So there could be a minor insulin spike that could happen. And it’s just not good to program your brain. Sweet, sweet, sweet, no nutrition, no calorie. So it’s not good to have that long term. But if we’re kind of doing an 8020 thing, and that’s kind of in your 20%, and you’re trying to use a healthy cheat option as a replacement, I think it’s fine.

Evan Brand: Yeah. And you’re saying, basically, the body’s getting tricked, even if it is a natural sweetener. You don’t want to hit that sweet button over and over.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I just want to draw a line between everyday staples and things that are healthier cheat options that’s in the healthier cheat option. categories, not a healthier staple category.

Evan Brand: Yeah, you don’t want to live on like the stevia soda, for example. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Yeah, exactly. Your Much better off staples would be Topachico Pellegrino filtered water, maybe add an essential oil to it or add a squeezed lemon or lime. Those are going to be more of your staples and these other things they’re going to be in your 20% category.

Evan Brand: Let’s talk about this to those another paper that we had here on karijini which is a seaweed based polysaccharide. A lot of times it’s put in toothpaste, but it’s often in a lot of food and like sauces and anything that needs to be thick. So a lot of times now you’ll see caragenin free in certain products, but that also can exacerbate inflammatory bowel disease. And there are some papers on both splenda and Caragenin, so caragenin is probably healthier than Splenda. But it can still negatively affect the gut. And at the end of the day, we’re just saying eat real food because if it’s not processed, if it’s a process, paleo style food, it could still have some negative qualities to it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it? Yep. 100% 100% agree. Yeah, you have a courageous And there’s another one I forget. That’s like an emulsifier. Like that was like guar gum. Yeah, that’s what it is. Some of those I think are also a little bit higher at fodmaps, too. So people that have significant tseebo can sometimes get a little bit more bloated from some of those things. So it’s good to keep those in mind. I know there’s I think its native forest. It makes the coconut milk coconut cream without the guar gum. So another thing that could be there, there’s some studies showing that can be beneficial and not bad. So kind of go back and forth on it. So if you have a negative implication with it, that could be it and you may want to just find a healthier, healthier option. Yeah. What’s next on the list you want to talk about? Well, let’s go over gut infections. We talked about gut infections all the time. We see patients that come in that think their issue is a Candida or they think it’s an H. pylori, and sometimes it can be all the all of the above, and we don’t even know that. So it’s really important that we get some good testing done. It’s really important that when we have a gut infection, we have to have a sequence and how we deal with it. So people that have got infections you got to make the day changes you have to work on the digestion first because those can be serious impediments for your body healing. And the gut infection a lot of times can be part of the reason why you don’t feel good. Sometimes it can be all of the reason, but I’d say most people, it’s part of a couple other things that are happening. But people you know, we’re in a culture that’s very antibiotic driven. Oh, you have staff you have strep, kill it now antibiotic, you know, laser beam focused, hit it. And that may not be the case. And number one, it can be a big letdown. People are like, Oh, man, you know, that didn’t that wasn’t it. But number two, a lot of times they can feel worse. So you really want to make sure if there is an infection, that you have a plan that’s comprehensive in nature, that’s addressing what’s going on and again, this may be a little different if it’s totally acute, like hey, I’m in Mexico, I’m feeling great. Boom, I eat something. I feel like crap, I have diarrhea I have. Okay, we may create a different plan based upon the clinical history leading up to this point, and then how acute the symptoms are

Evan Brand: Im glad you mentioned too there’s a sort of an order of operations to that too, because there may be higher priority infections driving inflammation, as opposed to if you’ve got some Candida. Yes, Candida can be a huge problem. I did a whole summit on Candida. But if you had h pylori, we’re going to prioritize H. pylori over Candida because it’s going to affect much, much more mechanisms in the body.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% 100% I’d also say next thing is just adrenal stress. In general, we know that high levels of cortisol are going to decrease gut barrier function, it’s going to break down IGA or immunoglobulin A, which can have a beneficial effect on helping the immune system it can gobble up or potentially attack some infections that may make their way into the gut. The idea that like you get exposed to an infection, and that you automatically get infected, isn’t necessarily true. So there’s a couple of ways that may happen. Number one is you get exposed to a large amount of an infectious material overwhelms overwhelms your immune response and you’re sick no matter how healthy you are. This could be like, you’re healthy, you go for a hike, you drink some lake water, boom, you got grd or you’re sick. There’s that. There’s also Hey, you get exposed to just, you know a lot of different microbes over time. your gut is stress from cortisol and IGA imbalances. Maybe you have some food allergens too. Maybe your stomach acid and enzymes have dropped. Now boom, a stressful event happens. Now you start getting sick, because your gut your digestion, your inflammation accumulates. All stress summit’s are accumulates in the body, and the gut barrier breaks down and cortisol and stress can go high, which can cause your gut barrier to break down. And then when it finally drops, that’s going to make it hard for us to deal with inflammation. It’s gonna make it hard to build back that immunoglobulin barrier. And it’s going to make it hard to have energy and deal with stress.

Evan Brand: Yeah, so when people hear stress, they kind of just tune out because they’re like, everybody talks about stress. What am I supposed to do just meditate and do yoga. So here’s kind of the, I guess the granular in the flesh example of what could happen. Let’s take someone who has a bad boss, and every Monday when they go to work, they get a knot in their stomach, they feel sick to their stomach, because they know they’re going to go in, they’ve got this micromanaging boss that they hate, or I’ve got somebody that wears perfume that makes them sick next to them. So they have this fight or flight reaction, every Monday morning, and then Tuesday and on and on and on. So it might not be that your relationships are stressed, it could be but your relationships could be great your family life, your kids, I mean, your home life, all that could be great. But then you have this stress everyday of a boss that is still enough to degrade the gut barrier and cause issues over time. And we’ve seen that happen where, let’s say the boss gets transferred out and then they have a new boss that comes in and it’s a better boss and all of a sudden this person’s got complaints magically goes away. It was just because of that fight or flight reaction getting turned off. They were able to relax it. They’re just And then that parasympathetic healing reaction came in and started to work on the gut.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, many people, they kind of like categorize their stress, they kind of just say stress is, and they put it all their stress in the emotional category, work relationships, family finances, but they forget that the gluten that a meeting, or the Gup is now putting stress on my body. So now my emotional reserves drop. So instead of being able to have three or four emotional stress problems at one time, now I can only deal with one. And then now I’m flipping out on my kids or I’m arguing with my wife and we’re fighting more or losing my cool at work part of that is is because that emotional stress bandwidth drops when other stressors come in. So it’s like, people just kind of look at emotional stress, like it’s this, this thing unto itself and I just have to change my strategy or or meditate more, but a lot of times, fixing the other stressors that we talked about, allow more bandwidth to be allocated to that part. The system.

Evan Brand: Oh, well said Amazing, amazing, important point. It’s like, Okay, I’m gonna eat my avocado toast, and then go do yoga. It’s like, Ah, you gotta realize that bread or whatever it is that processed stuff is damaging the gut. So you could just have a completely stress free life. You might even be retired. But yet you had a donut, and then you feel like crap. And you don’t know why it sounds so simple. Like when we pointed out, it’s like, duh, but I’m glad you brought it up because people skip out on that. They don’t realize, Hey, I ate this. Now I damaged the gut. Now I have this emotional response, or I have an overreaction, because then then you get into the whole conversation of blood sugar too, right? It’s like, Okay, I’m eating these foods that are causing the blood sugar to spike and then crash and spiking crash. That is a stress. Even if your life is not stressful, you’ve still got stress

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and again, a lot of these things, they aren’t intuitive. The reason why they’re there are Our radar is because we see it clinically play out over and over and over again. It’s like, Hey, you change the diet, you you see some new nutritional compounds or nutrients are low in the person’s diet, we stopped them that we fixed digestion, hey, there may be an infection we work on that we support the adrenal, and now the person’s productivity at work. And they’re like, yeah, work isn’t as stressful. It’s okay, because your bandwidth has been freed up. It’s like you got this program in the background, that is just sucking up all of your RAM. And then now we close down that program or we update the software and get a better version for your operating system. And it’s like, boom, now, things aren’t as big of a deal.

Evan Brand: Not to mention, if we throw in some adaptogenic herbs or some liver support, you really start to have a lot more RAM available. So it’s amazing because people they may not have much change in their day to day life, but the way they respond to that day to day stress is significantly better. And that’s priceless.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And I see it can affect women a little bit more because of their cycle. And a lot of women they know like always week before their cycle, they are up in arms regarding headaches or breast tenderness or back pain or mood stuff, or they’re just losing a lot of blood, which causes them to be anemic. And then they have low iron and their energy drops. So a lot of times it can compound a lot of those female hormones and make them feel not good for a week. And so a lot of times, the first thing we see with women is that PMS starts to go from maybe seven days to like one or two. And that’s a huge thing, or their irritability or breast tenderness switches a lot. Because with women, progesterone is actually a precursor to their stress hormones. So when they start getting stressed, they lose their progesterone, and they start becoming estrogen dominant. And then all of those estrogen dominance symptoms, some I just mentioned, start to become activated.

Evan Brand: Yeah, the thing the the issues with the hormones are more apparent during the cycle,

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: it’s more apparent. So if you’re a woman listening to this and your PMS starts getting worse. That’s the first thing we Look at is what stressors have been activated. You know, women’s cycles are more women’s hormonal rhythms are more intricate. They’re like a beautiful Symphony that has the the, the the wind instruments, the string instruments, the percussion instruments. And when one instrument starts to go off, that Symphony turns to noise pretty fast for men are just kind of, like a foghorn, are kind of like a one note instrument that’s just kind of in the background the whole time. So it’s a little bit it’s a little bit harder to knock that the foghorn off. But the symphony, it’s easier to make it sound not so good, fast.

Evan Brand: Yeah, the women are like, Oh, he just won me over. He called my hormones and beautiful Symphony.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s a lot of stuff happening underneath the hood. And it’s amazing when you can just get the estrogen dominance under control, and now you’re not as anemic. And then now you’re able to carry oxygen better and your mitochondria works better and your thyroid works better. And then also when your progesterone levels come up a little bit more. Now you’re able to open those Gabba chloride channels. You’re not as anxious you’re not as Moody, the estrogen dominance drops to the breast tenderness and the muscle contraction causing the back pains now gone. It’s amazing what happens. And some women, it’s sad they live some have half their cycle is is almost like a PMS kind of up and down wagon. The goal is maybe we have one or two days or maybe it’s a half a day and it sneaks up on you. That’s the ideal goal. And it’s because you know, the husband’s benefit too. And the women are far more productive, and they feel better.

Evan Brand: Absolutely. Yeah. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And also just kind of like comparing contrasting, you know, what are your options, right? Ladies listening, you know what your options are? It’s going to be birth control pill, and then those have their own side effects. It’s going to be an antidepressant. And that’s pretty much it. And then if you’re menopausal, maybe it’s the HRT hopefully they’ll recommend the Premarin provera which is horse hormones, right? So those are your pretty much your three options. And then of course, you know, ibuprofen, might all those kind of things to manage any pain or cramping, you don’t really have that much so and none of its true causal, right. None of its true causal.

Evan Brand: Yeah, so I just want to point out that just because something is common doesn’t make it normal so if you and all your female co workers or your female friends you all complain about your periods together and oh my god my periods so miserable my PMS and my husband better watch out today it’s like ah yes common but not normal My wife is a breeze through her cycle and even in the postpartum period, it was great and her cycle came back normal and there wasn’t anything crazy and I think it’s just because we’ve we’ve tried and put so much work into this years and years and years you do start to get this point where Hey, the periods sneaks up on you and you had the golden points

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: we wanted to sneak up on them or at least get it down to like one or two minor days versus you know major or even a week or plus of major stuff.

Evan Brand: And this is not a pipe dream. This is a reality that we see all the time clinically and thousand percent and also.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundreds for sure. Yep, hundred percent. Also, let’s go talk about circadian rhythm or sleep stuff right? We know sleeps a big deal because That’s where we recharge a lot of our hormones, our adrenal and our neurotransmitters. And these are really important for stress. So if we don’t recharge these glandular systems, if we don’t recharge our neurotransmitters, that our ability to deal with stress gets forwarded. And the more we’re not able to deal with perceived stress, the more our guts going to be broken down and affected, the more our sympathetic nervous system will be affected. So it’s a lot of stress is perception based where you could take someone who has a larger bandwidth to deal with stress, put them in the same situation and they may not have the same physiological sympathetic nervous system response because they have more bandwidth than you. And then if that response isn’t happening, then they’re not going to have all the side effects of you know, the sympathetic nervous system, decreasing stomach acid or enzymes are breaking down their gut lining or making it hard to break down food. So the more we can allocate good bandwidth through recharging our neurotransmitters adrenaline dopa mean Gabba recharging are glandular systems, right pituitary adrenal thyroid ovaries, the better chance testicles, a better chance that we are going to be able to deal with stress the next day.

Evan Brand: Yeah. Well said, Well, we’ve got a couple papers on this. So why don’t we talk about this here regarding the circadian rhythm disruption. You know, we’re talking to people specifically that are working night shift or swing shift, or people that are just using artificial light at night. They’re not protecting themselves from the nighttime EMF and light exposure, even just a couple of days, which is kind of hard to believe but even just a couple of days of circadian rhythm disruption. So what that means is I’m talking to the people who they go to bed at 9pm on the work day, but then they stay up till midnight or 1am or 2am on the weekends. Just those two to three days is enough to create changes in your gut, increasing the pro inflammatory bacterial species. So long story short, you need to go to bed at the same time, every day. You’re not typically going to benefit. I mean, maybe you have more social life and you go out and I don’t know drink some poison at the club and poison your gut and start to kill your liver even more. And then you stay up all and then you’re hungover the next day. I mean, God, I just don’t see the benefit of that lifestyle if that’s what you got to do. Okay, but just know hey, there’s paper showing you doing those weekend benches just on Netflix, if even if you’re like, I don’t drink alcohol evidence, poison, I know you’re right. Okay, you stay up till 1am watching something. But on the weekday, you went to bed at nine, that is still messing up your gut and if your gut is messed up, then you really can’t afford to, to lose that benefit. That could be another 10 or 20% of your issue right there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. So do your best. People are going to stay up later on the weekend. It just is going to be what it is. So we can always use extra magnesium. We can use glutathione before bed. If we’re going to drink alcohol, we can always use activated We can make sure we do our best to get to sleep a little bit more to get sneak it up on the back end and just do our best to maybe take a tiny bit of melatonin or a little bit of natural sleep support to kind of get us back on track start the week. So we kind of have like our goal of perfect and then we have things that we can biohack to get us back on track and still cheat a little bit.

Evan Brand: Call me boring. And maybe it’s just because I have kids that are young, but I go to bed pretty much the same time every night. So maybe in five years, you’ll be listening to this podcast and be like, oh, Evan, remember when you used to go to bed at nine every day? Or 10? You know, I don’t? Maybe Maybe I’ll change but for now, every night is about same time for me and I feel good.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep, I agree. I think it’s great. A couple of the things on medication side of the fence we we got to talk about this is important. So there’s a couple of different medications that I consider to be destructive. Number one are going to be the antibiotics and sometimes it may be necessary if you’re in a difficult situation. But if we can have a couple of tools that we can utilize, we may be able to avoid it right we have different herbs that we can use. Oil of oregano golden sea We have different formulas like in my gi clear line, we have chapter one through six that will use in certain occasions and evidence the same as you will with you, you have some of the microbiome products that are used in similar situations, a lot of times this can be beneficial and prevent the need for antibiotics to be just given right off the bat number one. And then of course number two would be things that affect digestion, proton pump inhibitors on nippers, old pentapresol, any acid blockers or h2 blockers that are designed to disrupt or lower stomach acid can be a big deal because that’s going to make it hard for you to break down your food. Think of HCl as your natural kind of bleach or disinfectant for the dirty picnic table, right. So it keeps the gut microbes from growing out of control. It helps break down the proteins, it starts initiating all the domino reactions for digestion. And that good acidity helps close the esophageal sphincter and prevents things from also rising up as well.

Evan Brand: I’ve seen probably no joke within the last six months to a year 50 to 100 children ranging from six months old to 15. And above years old, have kids that are clients of mine that were put on proton pump inhibitors by their pediatrician or by the gastroenterologist. I’m talking like you got a one year old kid that has some skin rashes, or there’s something going on maybe it’s burping or maybe it’s gas or something’s just not right with a one year old. And they don’t even bring up diet changes at all. If they’re still being breastfed. They don’t bring what’s in the mom’s diet into the consideration. It’s just here’s a PPI for a one year old. I mean, it’s almost criminal.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It is, I mean, they’ll do the tagamet a lot of times, and most of the time, it’s just the, the mom typically is eating a food allergen that’s usually driving it or they’re just could be some needed some extra probiotics and that can be a big one. So we’ll do some of the infantis blend of probiotics to help with some of the newborns And we’ll really look at some of the food allergens in the mom that can help a ton.

Evan Brand: There’s dysbiosis and kids all the time though, man, we’ve talked about this before, but my daughter when we first ran her stool test, she was around two years old, and she had various parasites and bacterial overgrowth, got rid of that retested showed up with H. pylori, got rid of that retested showed up with some other bugs. And so these bugs are everywhere. We don’t expect you to avoid them tap water, soil food, I mean, your kids are playing in the dirt, you’re playing in the dirt. Hopefully, you’re going to get exposed to these things. A lot of people ask us the question of Hey, Dr. J. Evan. How do I avoid these you can’t it’s just a matter of you trying to be resilient enough and you have, like you said adequate levels of stomach acid to prevent if you do drink tap water or you eat the sushi and you get exposed to blasto. Hopefully your HCl kills it off and it doesn’t become an infection. But most of the time, people are too stressed and too overwhelmed and that system, the protective response is altered or reduced

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% 100% Last thing I wanted to highlight was just environmental toxins. This could be things ranging from heavy metals, like aluminum or mercury or lead that could be damaging to the gut lining and also the neurological tissue. Right. Remember your nervous system and your entire nervous system is located in the gut. So that can have a big impact and as well as things like mold and mycotoxins, as Evan knows, environmental mold, can cause lots of gut issues I’ve seen it caused lots of digestive distress, bloating, I seen it affect motility. And then of course, when that happens, then it can affect your vestibular system, mood, energy, everything else. So I’d say molds a big one. I’d say heavy metals are a big one and of course, environmental estrogens whether it’s pesticides or plastics, whether it’s Bisphenol A or dioxin or Falaise, any of these compounds that are kind of in plasticizer compounds.

Evan Brand: Yeah, your chemicals in your food, which we always talk about killing your good bacteria. That’s basically an animal biotic, you know, glyphosate is essentially an antibiotic in the sense that it kills good bacteria and promotes dysbiotic flora. So, yeah, I think that’s a huge point. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think it’s important and we can talk about, you know, each one of these topics could be one podcast in and of itself, and they probably already have since we have hundreds in the bank, so anyone listening really enjoys the content, click below, make sure you access some of the great handouts and great links on our websites. We have transcriptions as well that you can get access to. And if you want to dive in deeper because you think one of these things may be an issue with you feel free. Click below to access Evan brand calm or just in health, calm me, Dr. Justin, and we can dive in deeper and work on getting to the root cause. any last comments, Evan?

Evan Brand: I would just say we’re really grateful to be in the opportunity to help people so most of you all we’re just helping you because you’re listening and you’re making changes but if you feel like you’re buying random supplements, you don’t know what you’re doing. You’re building up a supplement graveyard. hire some help. I know a lot of people they they don’t want to That because they feel that they need to, like maintain their pride or like I’m a biohacker I’m going to do it myself. It’s like, I try that. I mean, you know how much Justin’s helped me, we help each other, you know, so so we’re in this to, we’re not in it to prove that you can do it by yourself. We’re in it to make sure that you can get better and get back to enjoying your life. So don’t try to like be a hero. It’s okay. You’re not a failure if you need help from somebody.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, if you need a functional medicine, Sherpa, you know where your guys in general you don’t go hike Mount Everest without a Sherpa without a guide to help you. And that’s what we are the equivalent of so hope everyone enjoys it. If you enjoy it, share it with a friend or family or member a loved one that is struggling or need some of this support. It’s totally free. 99.9% people we don’t even work with directly they’re just utilizing this free content. So we just ask that everyone to utilize some of this information so they can get healthier first. It helps everyone become a better parent, a better person, a better employee, a better entrepreneur helps everyone in every single way possible. So we love that and it’s our country. the contribution to the world. Anything else, Evan?

Evan Brand: Oh, that’s beautiful, beautiful way to end it. Nope. I’ve got nothing else you all take care.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey, excellent, everyone, have a great day. Take care. Take care. Bye bye bye


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The Thyroid, Adrenal and Microbiome Connection | Podcast #255

Together with Evan Brand, Dr. Justin talks about the adrenal, thyroid, gut, microbiome, brain connection and a lot more. Go through this podcast to discover more about functional medicine world. Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

4:13 Potential probiotics to treat thyroid nodule

9:06 Microbiota modulate anxiety like behavior

15:02 Stress in gut

20:16 Chemicals in water

23:10 Eating organic


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Getting ready to go live now go get it live this week. And we are live. It’s Dr. J here with Evan brand. Evan, how are you doing today? Man? I know in the pre show. We’re gonna we’re going deep, deep into the adrenal thyroid gut microbiome connection. How are we doing, man? 

Evan Brand: I’m doing really good. Yeah, this is trippy. You know, people talk about the gut brain connection. But when you actually look into the papers on this, you actually just found a paper that was from just a few months ago, that will have to dive into on gut brain, adrenal connection, thyroid cancer, all being tied into the gut. So where do you want to? Where do you want to start?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so this one article, I just want to read the summary of his articles. I think this really shows you the connection of the microbiome with the thyroid and of course, we have some scientific articles looking at the microbiome with the HPA access and connecting to the adrenal, so this is really, really powerful. I just thought this one conclusion here, and I really wanted to highlight it because I just think medicine is just really going in a totally different direction. So the title of this article here, I’ll read it all for you all here is dis bios of the gut microbiome is associated with thyroid cancer and thyroid nodules. And there are correlated with thyroid function. And essentially, we know that autoimmunity which is the number one cause of thyroid issues with almost all people, right, that is a major association with cancer and with nodules, of course, the major cause of thyroid nodules are going to be autoimmunity. But the conclusion of this study was interesting they found our results indicate that both thyroid cancer and thyroid nodules are associated with the composition of the gut microbiome. These results may further support a clinical diagnosis to a great extent, and helping in developing potential probiotics to facilitate the tree Men have thyroid cancer and nodules. So conventional medicine in the Journal of endocrinology starting to come to the conclusion that, hey, we need to have probiotics to treat thyroid cancer and thyroid nodules. That’s pretty amazing.

Evan Brand: That’s a trip trip. Well, I’ve got another paper I was looking at here that was about babies. So let me read this one because this is pretty interesting and, and kind of up the same vein here that this was looking at 78 infants who were premature and were in the queue. And it was found that the infants that had despite AOSIS, which I just call an abnormal gut microbiome. They had more gut issues, even at age four of age, they followed these kids for four years. And if their gut was screwed from day one, even four years later, they still had gut issues. So not related to thyroid but just crazy how much the stress of the mom The diet of the mom the microbiome of the mom, if the mom doesn’t have enough good bacteria, not giving good bacteria to baby, this is crazy. I don’t want to get too off topic from from thyroid to babies, but there’s countless papers coming out on even there was another one I looked at two, which was about sun exposure, right. And the sun exposure paper was looking at people getting UVB as in Bob UVB light exposure. And they had significant changes with their gut microbiome but it only worked in the patients that were deficient in vitamin D. So there’s this you know, our mutual friend jack crews, he’s always talking about Sunlight, sunlight, sunlight, everybody gets sunrise get your skin exposed to the sun. It turns out Yes, that is totally true because in various studies, living in higher altitudes means there’s a higher risk of developing inflammatory bowel disease and Ms because at a higher latitude and higher altitude both you get less UV light. So now There’s this gut flora, sunlight link as well, but it only was in vitamin D insufficient patients. If the vitamin D levels were normal, the sunshine didn’t do as much to boost the gut bacteria.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting, very good. So I want to just kind of connect the dots here with some of the more valuable Intel. So in the study that I just looked at, where they’re talking about potential probiotics to treat thyroid nodule, and of course thyroid function issues and thyroid cancer, the couple of things to highlight is what does that mean? So despite doses typically means a higher amount of bad bacteria in relationship to good bacteria. Now in this one study, just kind of giving people to take home is the bad bacteria they were looking at that they were looking at they were higher in these cancer patients was the streptococcus and the nice Syria bacteria, and the beneficial bacteria was the lactobacillus and they also looked at the beautiful record bonus and beautiful components. I think it’s just bacteria that helps make beautiful Beauty rate is the same fat that’s in butter. Okay, so eating healthy butter and things that help improve beauty rate bacteria could be very beneficial. Also, anything that’s going to be fermented is going to give you healthy levels of lactobacillus and support puter rate is great. So those are the big bacteria that we’re looking. So I mean, these studies are limited because you’re not looking at a whole suite of bacteria, right, or a whole suite of positive probiotics. So these studies are still a little bit myopic, and their focus, but I think it still gives us a little bit of insight that probiotics, beneficial bacteria important and some of the despotic bacteria can have negative implications even affecting your immune system and even cancer. So I think it’s good to keep that in the back of our head. So when we’re seeing patients, we’re recommending comprehensive gut testing, that’s DNA based, it’s looking at all kinds of normal Flora imbalances, despotic balances, we’re measuring it to, you know, the umpteenth degree because the DNA testing is about two to 3000 times more sensitive than your typical stool testing, and then we’re also looking at infections because the bigger thing here I think is we could have an H. pylori issue or a fungal overgrowth, or we could have a, a major parasitic infection that could be thrown off the bacteria too. So sometimes the bacterial issue isn’t necessarily the root cause. It’s an effect of something deeper in the gut. That’s kind of going wrong. And then also, we have to look at the fact that gut stressing gut inflammation can throw off digestion and when our digestion is poor, we’re not ionizing minerals. We’re not breaking down our Selenium and zinc and magnesium. We’re not breaking down protein as well. We’re not absorbing all the the hormonal building blocks like cholesterol and fatty acids and protein and fats to make our hormones and our neurotransmitters. So you can see this isn’t just an isolated issue, it spirals off into other systems not working well. That’s why you need some more the clinical picture clinical, I’m for this like me and you to dive in deep and kind of spiral off the intimate connection. And how and how and why this is a big deal.

Evan Brand: Well, I love that this paper exists because between you and I both we’ve put a combined 15 plus years of education and content about gut and how important it is and how it affects every other body system. But you still have people that go to their conventional doctor and they’ll say, hey, my guy and work with Dr. Justin told me that my gut is affecting the thyroid. And the endocrinologist says, No, it doesn’t know your hormone levels are just low. We’re going to bump up your your Synthroid, we’re going to give you extra t three and supplemental form and blah, blah, blah, and they never bring up the gut. Well, now here’s the proof in the pudding. Here’s the paper that proves what we’ve been saying the whole time. So it’s good. I like I didn’t need the validation, but I guess for maybe for our ego sake a little bit when you get good results with people. And we’ve seen countless time and time again that the thyroid antibodies and Hashimoto is go down when we fix the gut. I’ve always loved seeing that. But now we have the proof to be able to show why this is working.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and I saw a patient just from a few years back, her antibodies were well over 2000 2000 regarding feral globulin and they were around 30. Now, so I mean, you’re looking at a 99% reduction with thyroid antibodies. And I’ve seen that quite frequently, and people listening and may not be practical to get your antibodies down, even below the reference range or even negative or to zero. That may not happen. But if we can have a 50 to 90% reduction regarding those antibodies, that’s going to be huge.

Evan Brand: Let’s Let’s move on. Let’s go into this other paper that you had sent me this was the one that was from frontiers and cellular and infection. microbiology. This was a 2017 paper. It was called microbiota modulate anxiety like behavior and endurance abnormalities and hypothalamic pituitary adrenal axis. Let’s go into this because this is another frickin awesome paper that proves what we’ve seen with regarding mood and the whole adrenal connection type into the gut. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. So if we go into the what’s that again? 

Evan Brand: This is the one I’ll I’ll put it back in the chat for you here. This is the pub man one, go check your chat I just put it in your chat on on zoom. This is the one that’s called microbiota modulate anxiety like behavior. And so I’m going to go into Yes, kind of the bottom section of this, where it’s showing all the pictures here about the connection between you’ve got your cortical, yes, hormone, your AC TH you’ve got the metabolic effect picture here. And what we’re finding is the microbiome, the gut, your microbes, your intestinal microbes, they are changing this whole brain gut access activity, and all of your gut microbes are responsible for your dopa mean, your Gabba, you’ve got histamine, you’ve got acetylcholine And regulating the function of the CNS, which is your central nervous system and the stability of the HPA axis. This is the crazy part to me, this last part of the sentence that the intestinal microbes regulate the stability of the HPA axis. Because when we talk about the kind of this brain adrenal connection, we just talked about, like adaptogenic herbs and you know, I meditate and and deep breathing and extra Asheville, ganda and all that and maybe you need some l theanine, which is all cool. But if you’re just doing that you’re missing the boat, you’re missing the fact that the gut is going to overpower any effort on your brain. It’s like, Oh, I’m going to go do yoga to calm my nervous system. You can’t if your gut microbes are screwed.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. I want to highlight one sentence in this study conclusion. I think it’s vitally important. They say here imbalances of the HPA access can’t cause by intestinal microbes. So now this study is kind of submitting to the fact that the microbes are calling HPA access imbalances could affect the neuro endocrine system in the brain. That’s the brain talking to the hormonal system primarily through the adrenal and the sympathetic nervous system and the parasympathetic result in anxiety like behavior. And the study suggests that intervention into intestinal micro Flora may provide a new approach for treating stress like diseases that is profound. They’re talking about altering the microbiome typically. And that’s going to be done in two ways. It’s going to be done by killing or knocking down this biotic bad bacteria or supporting beneficial good bacteria. Those are the two modulatory ways to do it. So that’s amazing. The fact that conventional research at no one even talks about this on the conventional medical side, partly because it’s about a 20 to 30 year lag between stuff and the literature making its way into conventional medicine and there needs to be a profit motive. So if a big pharma company cannot patent what’s happening here, and we probably won’t see this be applied, because there’s gotta be a reason to spend billions of dollars in research and get patents. And if we can’t patent it, what are you going to do?

Evan Brand: Yeah, so like the $30 bottle of probiotics that we sell after we do some type of a gut killing protocol, I mean, 30 bucks, is it your profit margins, not going to be like some of these cancer drugs, for example, they’re like 1000 to 10,000% markup, you know, you’ll have like, one vial of chemotherapy, that’s 10,000 bucks.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And it’s not just a, it’s not just the the money you make on it, it’s the ability to guarantee that you’re the only one that can produce it. So if you get the patent, that you’re the only one that can produce it, then you can artificially make the price higher, right. So that’s kind of how it works. It’s not that there’s not a natural profit, you know, like a 50% markup or something like in a lot of stores that you see is going to be thousands of percent markup, and it’s going to be artificial, did a patent law.

Evan Brand: Oh, that makes sense. Yeah, you’re talking rather than 20 companies all making the same thing and charging 100 bucks if you’re the only soul guy, then you’re allowed to charge 10,000.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, you can charge a lot of money for it. Yeah, that’s how it works. That’s how you saw that with the, the epi pen when the patents went out. Only one company had it and they jacked it up. And that’s kind of that’s how it happens. So the more we can use things that are natural, that can’t be patented, you know, then you have a little bit more market force keeping the prices down. So that’s nice. So interesting. In this study, they also talked about however, the precise mechanism of action and how intestinal micro Flora means unclear. So it’s really interesting they have there’s some unknown pathogenic mechanisms I think with a lot of the the infections causing problems, my gas, all right, my into intuition really comes at it from the perspective of intestinal permeability. I think the intestinal permeability aspect is a big one. I also think a lot of the good bacteria has a modular Tory effect on your immune system, because we know your immune system is in the gut. So if your immune system is hyper regulate or hyper stimulated, that can do a lot of different things from increasing gut permeability, to just sucking up a lot of resources for energy. And I think it also has a negative impact on your mitochondrial function as well. And then I think the low hanging fruit is you may not be digesting, absorbing and assimilating a lot of the key nutrients in your diet, which go to make other systems work like your mitochondria, like your thyroid, like your adrenal, is we not getting enough selenium, we may have thyroid issues not getting enough. Magnesium, we may have issue with our mitochondria. So we need a lot of these nutrients. And if we have stress or interplay with the HPA axis and our gut, there could be some absorption issues for sure.

Evan Brand: We should almost just title this podcast which we already came up with a better title that you’re that you’re seeing or you already clicked on to download this, which was like the microbiome adrenal thyroid link, but really, we should call it yoga ain’t gonna fix you. gut. I mean, that’s basically the summary here.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. And again, there’s a lot of data on this where the stress in the gut and stress in the brain is bi directional. In other words, Stretton the stress in the gut can create brain stress, but stress in the brain can create gut stress. And we know this because high levels of cortisol stress in the brain that makes a CTH adrenal cortical tropic releasing hormone that stimulates the adrenal to make cortisol that can create gut permeability at high levels, it can break down the gut barrier, and we know stress in the gut through number one is gluten is a big one can easily create gut permeability, which can then also create gut stress. So these are important things. Quick Study I want to pull up here. I did not show it to you but this is called dietary gluten induced dysbiosis can create issues with the tight junctions. And that’s the summary of the title. The title is really convoluted, but

Evan Brand: I want to have that link from book market myself. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I’ll send this to you right now. So you have it. But this is fascinating. And basically they’re talking about gluten having a major impact on the gut bacteria and creating this bio system. And we know with this by osmosis, that can affect the whole neuro endocrine HPA axis cascade of things. And they talked about dietary gluten had effects on the streptococcus family, the lactobacillus family, the Koryo bacteria family, really, really, really interesting and how it affects different things. It Down regulated, the guts, absorption and a lot of different ways created inflammation. So there’s a lot of different potential cascades that happen when gluten comes into the equation. So the low hanging fruit that we talked about is kind of getting patients on a paleo template which is a grain free, grain free, dairy free legume free template. And then potentially even moving towards a paleo template where we’re going grain free, legume free dairy free, no nuts, seeds, nitrates and eggs.

Evan Brand: Yeah, you may have the autoimmune. So here’s the point that we’re trying to make is that the people who say, Oh, I eat gluten and I feel fine. It’s not about whether you feel fine. It’s about that internal biochemistry that’s changing. It’s about those microbes that are changing. Also, in that study that you just sent me here. It was talking about Prevotella being affected too. We know there’s a huge link between Prevotella and joint pain. We did a whole podcast on joint pain, you know, functional medicine. And so it’s not that like, Hey, you have to get a rash or you have to break out an acne after you eat gluten. That’s not it’s a lot more subtle, but the subtle changes over time, change the whole system.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: As a lot of people out there that I hear I won’t mention their names but their podcasts out there and say, Hey, you know, you can have gluten if you haven’t, you don’t have any symptoms. You know, you’re fine. The problem is the inflammation that’s happening here. may not create a symptom, there may be a delay in the symptoms that occur. And that that’s kind of the myopic level of thinking. You can’t just you can’t go to that conclusion, well, if you don’t have symptoms, you’re fine. In this one study, they’re looking at inflammation associated with the micro RNA. So they’re looking at inflammation at the RNA level. I mean, that is a very myopic level, very, very microscopic level, I should say. And in this study, they had some people on a gluten free diet and some eating gluten. And they saw on the gluten diet, they saw this increase in inflammation at the micro RNA level, which is pretty profound. So it may take time to manifest into actual symptoms. And we know there’s data on the fact that there are people that even if they aren’t celiac, or even really gluten sensitive symptomatic Lee, they still saw permeability with their gut when exposed to gluten. So kind of my general recommendation is try to be grain free all the time, especially if you have an autoimmune condition. And if you’re going to cheat, try to choose gluten free cheat, if you can. Now, if you don’t have a known autoimmunity, then maybe you choose a little bit of gluten here or there but be very careful with it. Try to do things like extra enzymes, extra enzymes with DPP for maybe some extra activated charcoal include a bio and to kind of deal with the stress and the inflammation associated with that you can also add in some extra glutamine and things help with the gut lining. So these are some ways that we can mitigate it. So I kind of I tear things a known autoimmunity, no gluten ever, and if you’re going to cheat, try to make sure it’s gluten free. If you’re relatively healthy and no autoimmunity, then maybe you cheat a little bit with gluten but try to make it a special occasion holidays, birthday, etc. and then try to use things to blunt the negative consequences that may occur.

Evan Brand: Yeah, well said people aren’t even aware of that. We have some little cheats in our pocket, especially that will give to people around the holiday season, different enzyme formulations that can actually sort of break up or reduce the effect of some of those food allergens. Your dairy, your corn, your egg or soy, you know, you can use enzymes to help break those apart. But we don’t want people to get hooked on those or use that as a long term solution, because then you’re still cheating and it’s not going to be reducing the the impact 100% it’s just going to blunt it, as you said. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And one thing I wanted to highlight, I saw this article come across my desk too. It’s a compound called Tributyltin, is in the chemical paint that they paint on the underside of the hall of the boats, and this compounds getting in the water, and they’re finding that this compounds actually an obese engine, and it negatively impacts the gut microbiome and then you’re getting exposed to this in the waters. So I think this is really important, why we need to be filtering our water because it’s possible that these compounds may not be filtered out with conventional filtration processes. And this compounds Aaron obesogenic and they affect your microbiome. So another great reason why you should head over our sites get a good high quality Water Filter that we personally use or slash water. I’ll put the link in the description. Waters a big component is a lot of chemicals and toxins and tributyltin and it’s just one compound that could negatively impact your gut microbiome.

Evan Brand: Oh man, that’s amazing. Well, there’s countless like that I just got the Environmental Working Groups report on local Kentucky’s tap water. And you know, people say oh, we got voted the best tap water in the US because we’ve got a lot of limestone here naturally that kind of filters out our water. It was still garbage man. There was still tons of flame retardant chemicals that PFOA which is like the Teflon nonstick chemicals, foams, heavy metals, pesticides and herbicides. I mean, we had countless pollutants in our tap water here, even though it was voted best and it does taste good. But you might you’re not going to taste these part per million chemicals that like you said can be an obese adyen or disrupt hormones. So yes, drinking tap water can make you fat and sick. Absolutely.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Of course and then the number One thing you can do, this is a no brainer. Most of our audience and listeners know this is avoid glyphosate. So you really want to eat 100% organic because glyphosate, many, many studies are shown to affect the microbiome couple of rat studies, looked at different rats and microbiome and saw significant, you know, impact on the microbiome of these rats when exposed to glyphosate. So you really just got to be careful, make sure you eat organic as glyphosate, which is the major pesticide Roundup. And again, one of the studies I have up here now 13 weeks study, guess what bacteria were knocked down with Roundup. I mean, I’m going to guess all of them but probably lactobacillus. lactobacillus was the major one. It was reduced in the roundup study. And we know that the thyroid cancer study showed what that the cancer group had lower amounts of lactobacillus and then when we improved it, you know, we saw an improvement in the cancer. So we know lactobacillus is beneficial and glyphosate, roundup same name is going to negatively impact that.

Evan Brand: That’s a trip well, so people say, Oh, I haven’t done antibiotics doesn’t matter. You did an antibiotic and the glyphosate.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep, exactly. So you really want to be careful. This is another reason why you want to eat organic. There’s two reasons right? Number one, you’re avoiding toxicity, which is going to affect your microbiome and your immune system. Number two, increased nutrient density. Typically, organic farming will have higher level of nutrient density because the soil microbiome will be more healthy and the microbiome and the topsoil produce help the plants produce more nutrition. So we’re nutrition on one side, less toxic than the other side. And even if, let’s say you don’t buy what I’m saying about nutrition, just the fact that you’re getting less toxins, right? Because for it to be organic, USDA Organic, it has to have no pesticides in that soil for three years. You are definitely getting less toxins, for sure.

Evan Brand: Yep. Well, this has beenfun. I mean, we could do Part 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 on this because this is like one of my favorite favorite things ever. So we’ll be back to talk more about I’ve got so so I’m just giving you I’ve been told you this, but this is what we’re going to cover. Next we need to cover the gut microbiome in the issue with pans, which is the pediatric acute onset neuro psychiatric syndrome and kids. I just sent you a paper on this one. Let’s Let’s hit this next time though, because it’s a whole nother can of worms, but it’s about all these children that are having behavioral issues and anxiety and different problems. And it’s related to certain species in the gut. And if you can shift the gut out of this pro inflammatory state, you can calm the brain down. I mean, we basically already hit on that but it’s a little different for kids and I’ve seen it personally and clinically, you have to So I do want to get into this and also, there’s talk about the specific bacteria this or ODR bacteria and the link to autism. And alzheimers. So Wow, this is I mean, it goes deep.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I love it totally, what I’ll do is I’ll put all the links of all the studies that we talked about today in the description so you guys can go take a look at it so you can see it for yourself. It’s amazing. Your conventional medical doctors aren’t going to know about this stuff. And it’s because of the 23rd 20 to 30 year gap between the literature and going into effect in the curriculum. And also there’s just has to have a profit incentive for the big pharma if if they can’t patent it, then you’re not really going to use it as a modality. And guess what, as functional medicine docs, we take that up and we put that in our metabolic toolbox. TV’s healing get better. So I love it. Is there anything else you want to highlight today? Evan? 

Evan Brand: We’re going to be looking into your gut if you’re working with us, so if you’re like, Okay, what do I do? How do I investigate this? How do I fix it? I mean, we live and breathe and look at labs all day every day. So we’d be happy to run some panels on you and take a look at your gut and see how is your thyroid function affected by your gut? I guarantee it is how much is it affected. I don’t don’t know yet, but we can run some labs and figure it out. So if you do want to reach out clinically, you can do so at Justin’s website, which is he works with people all around the world. So do I, my website is, and we don’t care who you work with as long as you get better. So please reach out if you need help. That’s what we’re here for. Don’t wait till you’re super miserable. We got tons of people that like buy supplements and listen to podcasts and listen to summits and they buy 50 to 100 supplements and they don’t know what the heck they’re doing. You’re spending a lot more money in wasting time and maybe getting sicker by doing that. So it’d be much better to have somebody that can help walk you through the process rather than you buying this probiotic and it didn’t work and then you bought that gut healing supplement and didn’t work and then you bought this detox supplement, you felt like crap, Okay, stop doing that. You know, let us help you through what we found to work clinically.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% also we can get a window into the HPA access as well using cortisol rhythm testing. So we’ll measure your cortisol which is your major stress hormone. That’s the hormone that Made by or that stimulated by ACTA, that’s that brain chemical. That’s the neuroendocrine connection, the brain, the ACTH, the cortisol, we can look at that rhythm. And that gives us a pretty good interplay into HPA access functioning, because the data says that, you know, as that cortisol starts to get this regulator rhythmically, that’s a big sign that the HPA access is out of balance. And so we can use specific herbs, we can use protocols, we can work on fixing the microbiome, we can look at getting rid of some of the chemicals like we talked about, we only mentioned to today, the cyberbullying and the glyphosate, mold, and others toxins and metals could be another factor as well. That’s another podcast of the day. So there’s a big is a big net that we’re kind of looking into and trying to connect everything here because everything’s intimately connected. And I hope you guys are enjoying the Intel. If you’re feeling overwhelmed, just feel free to reach out to us we can help break it down. The big connection here today is stress, brain stress, HPA access. That’s the communication all feedback loop brain to the adrenal brain to the thyroid. Think of that as the thermostat to the heater thermostat to the air condition, right? Imagine you having that thermostat not talking appropriately to the heater when you want it to get hot, or the air conditioner when you want it to get cool. And that’s a big big connection. So when we talk brain stress, or HPA access, pretend like your thermostat in your house is not working or probably that’s kind of the equivalent here.

Evan Brand: Makes sense. Makes sense. Well said.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: All right. Well, if you guys enjoyed it, give us a thumbs up give us hit the bell as well. So you subscribe. We appreciate great reviews, for reviews. And let us know your comments down below things that have helped you things that have hurt you in regards to the HPA access and your gut microbiome. We appreciate it. Evan, it was great chatting today man you have a phenomenal day. 

Evan Brand: Yeah likewise you too see you. Take care. Bye bye.


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Insomnia – Mold Toxicity and Detox Can Affect Your Sleep | Podcast #254

A healthy sleep makes a big difference in our overall health. With a good sleep, we help our body recover from all the stress as well as rejuvenate all the lost energy and repair cells.

Today’s podcast talks about insomnia and natural functional medicine strategies to get to the root cause. Dr. Justin and Evan Brand gives out information on how insomnia occurs and how we could treat it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover: 

01:46 Sleep theories

07:30 Why sleep is important

14:09 Toxic Exposure

16:36 Sleep lights, blue or red lights

22:18 Organic medicines and sleeping tips


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani I’m here with Evan brand Today we are going to be chatting about insomnia and natural functional medicine strategies to get to the root cause. We’re also going to connect in mold and insomnia to that’s a common theme that Evan is seeing. And his patients and also with himself, Evan, what’s going on man? How are we doing?

Evan Brand: Hey, not too much. You know, I’m sleeping better now that I figured out the connection. My sleep was terrible. Like a year ago, I was up 2 3 4 times a night. And of course, my daughter was young too and she was still waking up in the middle of the night. So at first I thought it was that but then I noticed is really, really interesting connection between activated charcoal and improve sleep quality. And so I had the aura ring.I don’t know what to do with I think I lost it. But I had the order ring and I was wearing it and I would notice that my deep sleep I would get 20 to 30 minutes extra of deep sleep when I would take high dose activated charcoal. So I thought okay, charcoal equals exciting to toxins equals improve sleep. What the heck is going on there? So, my, my thought is and there’s talk about mycotoxins, which are mold toxins. There’s talk about mycotoxins, impairing your sleep quality, and specifically down regulating melatonin because mycotoxins are affecting the HPA axis. So that makes sense. But to me, I think there’s probably the cortisol connection part of that HPA axis that the toxin stimulates the nervous system. Same thing with heavy metals, maybe we should tie heavy metals into because charcoal can help arguably reduce metals and we know people with heavy metals. They also have bad sleep

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% we talked about or there’s new theories. This is a sleep specialist out of university of Berkeley at Matthew Walker. He’s done a couple of podcast Joe Rogan I think Nicole was interviewed him, but he talks about the lymphatic system which is kind of this glial cell immune cell in the brain, and lymph. And this lymphatic system is really important for removing toxins and a lot of these neurotoxins, they’re going to be cleared out during sleep. So whether it’s various beta amyloid plaques or whether it’s glyphosate or various heavy metals, this lymphatic system is really ramping up during sleep. That’s part of the reason why you have this neurological neuro emotional repair because we’re getting a lot of these toxins out via the lymphatic Leo cell lymphatic system in the brain, which is really interesting.

Evan Brand: Brand new study just came out like a few days ago, October 31. I’m going to give you the link so you can have it here. It’s titled waves of fluid babe, the sleeping brain perhaps to clear waste. And basically what was done. I believe it was an fMRI or an E. Yeah, it was both so it looked like it was an eg to measure the brain. electrical activity, and then also f which is a functional MRI. And they, these researchers recorded these people while they slept in an MRI scanner, which I wouldn’t want to be exposed to that amount of magnetic fields for study but luckily somebody did that for us. And what they found was that the cerebral spinal fluid was pumping every 20 seconds, just bone and it would just pump pump pump and so of course nobody knows 100% what that means yet but the thought is that this pumping of the fluid maybe that is it lymphatic system and now we’re just now finally able to visualize it, but the pumping of that fluid they think is draining out toxins at night.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think it’s very, very powerful. I know a lot of people that have done really good increasing lithium ion at night taking life as normal go to die am also taking glycine has been very, very helpful at night and part of I think is number one glycine is a precursor to go to file right? And also lithium is its own building block itself, which I think is going to really help up regulate this lymphatic detoxification system is the glial, the lymphatic of glial cells, and the limp interacting in the brain. And then all of these toxins that are removed via the lymphatic system, eventually reach your liver, they are going to go back to the hepatic portal vein, which is going to go back to that big filter in the liver, and then we’ll all be dumped out a lot of it will be dumped out in the kidneys, and then a lot in the stool. So that’s where a lot of my common recommendations for detox kind of go outside what most people think of as detox, meaning you need good digestion. If we have any gut issues or SIBO or slow motility or poor digestion, you may be reabsorbing some of those toxins, especially if you have slow transit time.

Evan Brand: Yeah, well said so that they call it intro hepatic recirculation, basically, it’s really energy intensive to create and manufacture new bile. So I don’t know Know what paper I looked at that said this, but it was talking about 95% of your bile being reabsorbed and 5% of your bile being freshly made. And so when you use binders, especially if you’re using like a prescription cola star mean, like I’m using that attaches to the bile to bile acid sequestering, and that’s how it works lower cholesterol, but the lot of the toxins are in the bile. So I can tell you 100% if I take binders closer to bedtime, I don’t wake up as much in the sleep is more restful, and I dream more. So I’ve noticed a lot of that with clients to using a lot of chlorella and different liver support. A lot of people will say, Hey, I haven’t been dreaming for 510 years, and now I’m dreaming again. So to me, I think dreaming is a good sign that you must be clearing out some brainwaves. What do you think?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I think it definitely is make your processing a lot of the emotional stress for the day. That makes a lot of sense to me. So we’re removing toxins via the lymphatic system. We talked about glycine and we talked about you already mentioned Some of the binders, like with mold, mold could be a stressor that enters the lymphatic system. Some of these mycotoxins could cross the blood brain barrier and stress out the glial cells, and that lymphatic system may be stressed as well. And of course, we’re trying to filter all these things out, get it back to the liver and flush it out via the stool as well, hence, where the coolest ironing comes in, which is a bile salt sequestering agent, like you mentioned, 5% is new. So if you can decrease that amount down, maybe only maybe 50% new and now you’re reading, you know, your research, writing and re filtering out and making fresh file while that old files getting flushed out into the stool, which is really good. And then of course, better sleep is going to promote better memory, right? Because if we have less brain fog via the activation of the immune cells in the brain, cognitive wise, we’re going to be able to have better recall will be faster on our feet, you’ll be able to think more clearer because one of the big things in regards to brain inflammation is going to be cognitive and brain fog issues. Anything else you want to highlight there?

Evan Brand: Well, yeah, I’m going to take what you said take it a step further and people will ask us about, well, what brain supplement Can I take? What can I do to get more focus? What can I do to get more concentration? And part of that answer is to improve your sleep quality think people think about what supplement what herb, you know, what drug what stimulant, am I missing, to help increase my brain? It’s like maybe some things but if you’re not sleeping, I don’t care how much caffeine or whatever else you do, you’re not going to be optimal.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. So of course, getting enough sleep is number one, trying to get sleep at the right time is important because we want to sleep within our natural circadian rhythm. So cortisol naturally drops you know, at that 10am time, and then when the cortisol drops, melatonin increases. So this is natural inverse relationship between cortisol and melatonin. And Melatonin is a very powerful antioxidant help stimulate that really good deep sleep. So you want to tap into it during that natural cortisol rhythm of the dropping cortisol. Followed by the rise in melatonin. That’s very, very important as the reason why shift workers have the highest rate of cancer, World Health Organization, put shift work in the same category as substance carcinogens as non sub OS substance carcinogens like smoking and assesses. So it’s definitely toxic to your body even though it’s a non substance, right? I mean, shift work is in the substances. It’s a it’s a lifestyle tactic, so we can shift that, that’s going to be big. And then of course, some amino acids are going to be what you use to make a lot of your sleep hormone. So the first thing I look at is how is your digestion? Are you eating enough protein? Are you vegan? vegetarian? Are you getting enough protein number one, number two, are you digesting it? Are you assimilating it? How your stools looking? Are they floating it all too? Are you processing your fat soluble vitamins as well? These are really really, really important things we want to look at when it comes to sleep. Because all of our neuro chemicals most are going to be made from amino acids, amino acid peptides, right? serotonin is going to be made from tryptophan or five HTTP, dopamine and adrenaline getting made from phenylalanine entire scene. GABAs you know itself it’s got gamma amino acid l theanine plays a big role in GABA. I’m trying to think Melatonin is also made from serotonin, which is made from five HTTP and trip the fan. Anything else you wanted to highlight on the protein connection there?

Evan Brand: Yeah, you need to B6 to–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: B6 is a very important cofactor that’s involved in the synthesis that you have. If you have a lot of these amino acids there, but not enough B6, you’re not going to have this synthesis happens. It’s like having a whole bunch of wood. And it’s like having a whole bunch of wood that’s wet. And then you have the flame will you need dry wood, right? So it’s really important cofactor to that equation. So that spark takes.

Evan Brand: And will and we’ll ask people that too. So when we look at the urinary organic acid test, we can measure the B six levels. And I’ll ask people Hey, look, your be six is really low. How’s your sleep? And I would say nine times out of 10 people say my sleep is not good and the other brain cancers You markers may look okay, like serotonin may look adequate. But if you’re not having that cofactor I think of it like the spark plug. Really, if you don’t have the spark plug to make melatonin, then adequate serotonin may be helpful for mood but your sleep could still suffer.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. Yep. 100% So we talked about the amino acids, I would say blood sugar is a really important thing. Now, there’s a lot of people doing a whole bunch of fasting, which I think is had can have some good benefits as long as we’re getting enough nutrition. Right. There’s a fine line between fasting anorexia. I mean, you tell me, what’s the definition of anorexia? It’s essentially starving, right getting an adequate amount of calories, right? Eating Disorder? Well, if you’re fasting to the point where you’re getting an adequate amount of calories, well, that means you’re automatically getting an adequate amount of nutrition. If your calories are cut in half, how do you get enough nutrition? I think it’s impossible. Now if you’re doing lots of organ meat and lots of nutrient dense foods and bone broth and green juice, you know, really good organic green You know, you have at least a head start there, but your body still needs enough overall calories, calories or energy. And if we’re eating whole food, nutrient dense calories, calories are attached to nutrients. And this day and age though it’s possible especially with Halloween, we got a whole bunch of calories and very low amount of nutrition. So you could have a lot of calories and low nutrition. But if you don’t get enough calories, it’s going to always be difficult to have adequate amount of nutrition. That makes sense. 

Evan Brand: It does. Yeah, well, you’re pointing out the fact people will just when they go into a fasting protocol for cognitive benefits or try to lose weight, they may just pull a meal completely out so they’ll just not eat breakfast. Now they’re only eating two meals a day but they did nothing to replace those nutrients they lost at breakfast. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And especially if they’ve added in some exercise or they’re doing some resistance training, that could be an extra stressor on top of that. So you really have to look at your nutrition, run it through chronometer, just double check to make sure you’re getting enough because if you aren’t getting enough, that’s also a stressor. So you’re now trying to make your body less stressed by fasting and giving your tummy a chance to rest while at the same time you’re adding more stress. And that could create some cortisol surges at the wrong times. It may even create a little bit of a hypoglycemic drop at night. And those hypoglycemic drops can stimulate cortisol and adrenaline to pick up that low blood sugar. So that’s always a possibility. If you’re waking up in the middle of the night, so you have going to sleep and then you have waking up in the middle of the night. And so waking up the middle of night a lot of times could be a blood sugar thing. It could also be a gut or liver thing, right that liver hours between one and three it could possibly be connected with that as well.

Evan Brand: Yeah, I’ve had people do this experiment where we’ll give them a liver tincture, like milk thistle Shonda berry combo or will do some encapsulated liver support before bed. And a lot of times that will improve that 1-3 am wake up time. So yeah, Chinese medicines, right Chinese medicines who said Oh, it’s got to be the liver. It has a circadian rhythm and it’s true

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean taking some activated charcoal and that liver and gallbladder pump stuff out that activated charcoal sitting in your tummy and it’s kind of soak it up. It also gives some good of iron and glycine before bed if that helps, you know, and like you mentioned giving some liver tone defying herbs like whether it should just Sondra milk thistle or artichoke or dandelion just things to naturally support the liver gallbladder that’s a good sign that there could be a toxicity issue as well.

Evan Brand: Yeah. So the blood sugar piece is great. I love how you tied it into the adrenal. So I mentioned the organic acids help. We’re looking at some brain chemistry markers there that could affect sleep. But in terms of saliva and your urine testing, we may be looking at that to measure that cortisol. Yeah, a lot of times we’ll see that inverse pattern where you’ve got that spike of cortisol at night and then it’s always up to us as practitioners to try to tease that out and determine what caused this evening spike was this someone who was looking at a bright blue iPhone screen before they collected the urine, where they you know, because the lab will tell you on the instructions if you read them correctly. It says Don’t be around a lot of bright lights at night because we want to try to get an accurate picture of whether the body’s doing this or was it some type of environmental exposure that caused the cortisol spike?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. We talked about how important the toxic exposure is. So this heavy metals are mold issues or the mycotoxins which them offer mold and there’s hundreds of mycotoxins, right. So if you have a mold issue is, it’s always pretty safe to assume it’s probably some kind of a micro toxin exposure.

Evan Brand: Would you agree? Yeah, absolutely.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And then we have just, you know, lifestyle strategies, like, for instance, if my son uses the iPad, we try to let him use it in the first half of the day, what we do is we put the blue light filter on, so there’s no blue light, and then we cut down the screen intensity by about 80 to 85%. So it’s like it’s really faint. You could barely see it. He doesn’t notice it. That way, if he has it a little bit closer, I don’t have to fight with him. It’s like, all right, the intensity is down. 90% we filled it out, you know, most of the blue light and it’s at least a good strategy in the meantime, while we put a timer on it. Do you have any strategies like that that you use for your kids?

Evan Brand: Yeah, so my daughter, like To watch a show that’s called Daniel Tiger, which is like a PV, my son watches that too. So, luckily, when I made a custom manufacturer of some blue light glasses, my buddy Matt, who made those, he also had access to some kids frames. So we got him to make some kids frames, kind of like hipster looking blue blockers for my daughter that fit her perfectly like toddler size. So that’s what she wears, if it’s anytime, anywhere even close to the sun going down. She’s got the glasses on, while she watches that they have TV filters that you combine. So Richard handler, the PhD guy, he’s in his 90s. Now who makes like the low blue light bulbs, they make TV filters that you can put over the screen, but our TVs like a 52 inch and they only go up to like a 45 inch or something so it just wouldn’t work and it’d be-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s not worth it. It’s not worth it. Just wear glasses. It’s like you can fit these screens or you can fit these screens. Exactly. You know, with my son. There’s no way I’d ever get Keep glasses on like that would be like an absolute that’d be futile.

Evan Brand: But like my like him though he might want it

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Maybe he’s a little older-

Evan Brand: There was a little battle at first, but we just told her Hey look, if you want to watch this, you got to have these on and she was like, okay, and she was pretty compliant. But so you’re asking other strategies. We basically either use Edison bulbs like the little old school Edison-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: One like an incandescent one.

Evan Brand: Yeah, where it’s really warm, really warm color and- 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: More orange color at night. Yep. 

Evan Brand: Or just the salt lamps will just use salt lamps. So the real lamps again?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so for us, same thing, I just find it’s easier to put an app on your phone, you mean with an iPhone, you have night shift, right? And I just have night shift on all the time and then I just cut the intensity, right? Because if you have a little bit of blue light there, but then I cut the intensity down 80% Well, whatever blue light is left is now down. 80%. So I just cut the intensity down, put keep night shift on all the time. And that’s like an easy Good strategy there are other apps that you can download that would you know even knock out even more blue light like with my iPhone here I have the new iPhone 11 Pro and at nighttime if I really want I have it set up so I hit the side button now three times boom boom boom. Now I every ounce of blue light is knocked out.

Evan Brand: Yeah, people that are listening on audio they can’t see but his screen is like blood red blood red

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Now is that Yeah,

Evan Brand: Is that a special app to do that little bump bump bump and then red? Is that an app or is that something built in that you can do

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s in the settings and then you can go in there and this used to be the home button down here. So the new iPhone 11 I’m not loving it yet, but there’s no home button. So the side button is the new home button essentially or it replaces it and there’s a way where you can say okay, if you triple tap the home button or the side button, then you can make the screen change colors. And I’ll try to find the article of how to do that will put it in the description. So this is nice at night. So if I’m looking at something right before bed, or if I want a nightlight for my son, right or if We’re looking at something, you know, on the on the phone, my son pictures, I can just knock out every ounce of red light. So I have a blue light. So that’s pure red light. So that’s a really nice feature. And then I want to back Boom, boom, boom, that’s back. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, I’ve replaced the, you know, you shouldn’t be really eating before bed, but sometimes I have to go and get some type of drink out of the fridge at night. So I actually took the LEDs that were super, super blue and replace those with incandescent bulbs in the in the fridge and freezer. Our friend Luke story, he went like, above and beyond, he’s like, got red lights and everything like red lights in his oven, then red lights in its fridge. It’s like, Man, you shouldn’t be up that late at night anyway, so to me, I don’t care about doing that because I’m going to bed when it’s dark.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So it just depends. It just depends how bad you’re in or how stressed your nervous system is. So like for me, if I get exposed to a little bit of light before bed, it doesn’t affect me whatsoever. Now I try to keep everything down. So we’ll have a fireplace on at night for most of our light. If US lights I have dimmer switches on all key rooms at night so I can knock down the light at least 80%. So at least have 20% I’ve stubbed my toe a couple times not fun. I do have the low blue light night bulbs and all of my kids rooms and our rooms. I will use that for like the bathroom. And I do have that and then my son does have a nightlight on we put it on a little bit because we have this little Baby Einstein thing, which makes pure blue light by the way. Yeah, so he loves it. But we find that if we put a nightlight in there and he’ll whack the Einstein much less than there’s less blue light coming out because it’s just a pure orange light. So we use the low Blue nightlight and all the rooms and that’s just absolutely amazing. So for parents listening low Blue is going to be excellent. Get the light bulb, try to have good dimmer switches on all key rooms. And then the easiest thing is if you’re really that sensitive, just wear glasses because when you have the glasses and you’re pretty, you’re pretty dialed in now I get it there’s research showing that if it hits your skin to it could definitely you know, create some stress response, but it just depends upon how bad or how stressed your nervous system is. your nervous system is designed to adapt to stress. So if you’re really stressed, okay, fine. If you’re kind of in between, you may not need to go to all those extremes. So just do your best.

Evan Brand: Yes. And for moms listening, it’s been shown that the melatonin goes through the breast milk. So young children, they can’t manufacture their own melatonin. So they’re getting melatonin, through through through your breast if you’re breastfeeding, which hopefully you are, if you’re able to, and so I’m trying to pull it up now. But Richard handler, who we spoke about, he’s a low blue lights guy. He’s done some books on this. And he and this has been like, five, six years since I spoke with him. But he’s got books about the blue light connection to autism, bipolar disorder, reduction in cancer. We’ve already talked about that. Yeah, he just he calls it the silent killer, you know, concussions and how Avoiding blue light is super important when you’re trying to recover from concussions as well. So it’s a it’s an important topic. And this is not something that was around a long time ago like, you know, 50 years ago even there weren’t LED bulbs. He had incandescence where the blue was much, much less. I bought, you’re talking about a nightlight, I bought the little mini amber flashlight, it hooks up to a nine volt battery. So for live, I feel fine. So for trying to find a pacifier in the middle of the night, we could just turn that on instead.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I have that too. But for the most part with the iPhone doing this going all read that kind of replaces it. So I’m like, Okay, this is just really easy. That is not going to read out. So that’s not going all the blue out. So I like that. So we talked about the diet and lifestyle strategies. I think that’s really important, especially when it comes to your kids. I think some of the apps on the phones can be helpful, obviously big things like when I give my son, his iPad to watch so I can have a little bit of sanity and watch a show with my wife. We put it on airplane mode. We turn Bluetooth off, right? We try to keep a lot of the EMF out. All those things can be helpful. I try to put it on top of a pillow. So I’ll put a pillow on his lap. Yeah, then put up the iPad on top of the pillow that way, it’s not up against you know, any any private areas, you don’t want that. Those are all good, helpful strategies. Anything else you want to say about that?

Evan Brand: Just the testing piece, we hit on like organic acids, where we’re measuring brain chemistry to try to help people resolve this issue that talked about cortisol, either saliva, or urine. And then you mentioned the gut. So gut infections playing a role. I know when I had parasite infections, people say that parasites are more active at night and parasites are more active on a full moon. So if you notice that you or your kids are getting worse sleep around a full moon, it’s possible that it’s related to the gut. So we would be looking at some functional stool testing to try to investigate this problem.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, functional medicine where you’re going to plug in some of the organic acids or some of the intracellular nutrient test to assess nutrients. We’re going to look at infections that can be overly stimulating. We’re going to look at either some of the Dutch hormone testing or some of the salivary hormone testing to assess cortisol and then also women if you’re having issues especially where it’s more cyclical progesterone is a big part of Gabba Gabba really helps you shut down and relax your nervous system. So if you have a lot of stress going on there, your progesterone could be part of the problem. And part of that is progesterone is a precursor to cortisol. So if you’re under a lot of stress, your progesterone will drop and estrogen dominance is a natural side effects. So that’s a big part of the hormones and then blood sugar could be a stressor. So you mentioned not eating before bed. Some people that have blood sugar issues, they may do better eating before bed, they may do better having more carbs at night. Also, blood sugar stress can lower magnesium. Magnesium is a really important cofactor for blood sugar. So if you have a lot of up and down blood sugar fluctuations, and we’re constantly kind of react reactive hypoglycemic, that means eat some carbs, blood sugar goes up and then it crashes down with too much insulin because of the blood sugar being off with the carbs. You’re going to deplete some of your magnesium too. And magnesium is really important for promoting relaxation before bed. And during the day in general,

Evan Brand: Yeah, good point on the mineral depletion, because that’s a stress you mentioned, it’s a stress, you’re going to get to burn up those reserves because of that crisis of blood sugar getting too low. So what’s the remedy? Well, I mean, hopefully, your dreams are strong enough to handle going from say 6pm dinner to 8am breakfast, but if you’re not, then you may need to do some type of bedtime snack, a little piece of grass fed jerky, or maybe a scoop of almond butter or something like that. It’s relatively easy.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, a lot of times I’ll do some vitamin C, some powdered vitamin C and some collagen. And then I’ve been doing a little bit of brain glandular tissue. before bed. We talked about that that’s really kind of helped with dreams. That’s kind of interesting. I think dreams do have a kind of a way of processing a lot of the emotional stress throughout the day. So we’ll do some brain glandular tissue. I’ll do vitamin C in collagen before bed, sometimes they’ll take some probiotics before bed too. So I like that That’s kind of nice little cocktail for me.

Evan Brand: That’s a good idea. That’s a good idea. I usually do my brain in the morning, but I might need to try it at night because you are getting some of that pineal gland in there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Yep. I think that’s really good. And there’s some really good. There’s some really good CDs and music you can listen to before bed too. I’m pretty sure it’s either Delta or theta. I forget which ones is the Big Sleep wavelength.

Evan Brand: I believe the delta is your deep phases where people meditate. I believe delta is like your super deep wave, not 100% Sure. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I’ll figure it out here. But there’s lots of ways that you can download specific music even just on YouTube. And that will help promote that frequency. I’ll pull it up here in just a second. Yeah, so delta or slow wave sleep. So delta is gonna be the big one. Yeah, so delta is gonna be the sleep so you can easily go on YouTube or just go online and you can get delta wavelength is also bionic. beats you can get different bionic beats as well, which are very, very helpful for promoting relaxation. So if you’re more stressed, you can go and download some Delta type music or bionic beats that may even incorporate Delta type me that’s very helpful to promote good, parasympathetic nervous system response. And if you have a hard time going parasympathetic, be very careful with exercise to close the bed, because that will ramp up your sympathetic response. And it may take you a while to turn off so you may be too revved up with that sympathetic response. So things that I’ll do to help kind of calm down as Gabba I’ll do higher dose actual ganda higher dose phosphor, let it serene higher dose magnesium, it to accelerate it you could do a magnesium footpath like Epsom salt, which is magnesium sulfate. Then you could also do it with a foot bath or a full bath, magnesium sulfate to really stimulate magnesium absorption.

Evan Brand: Good. Yeah, I’m also a big fan of lemon balm. We’ll throw that into the mixture you can use your passion flower, you could use hops, you could use catnip you can You skullcap. Valerian is great for some not good for others. Mother Ward is my favorite I love mother work for harp helps, especially if you’ve got that kind of worried anxious mind You’re overthinking and ruminating mother Ward will settle that down, I’ve actually measured put my heart rate monitor on and measure my heart rate variability and increased about five minutes after I took a shot a mother work. So that’s they call it like bypass in a bottle because it helps so much with the heart issues and circulation problems. So that’s another side benefit and I’m glad you brought up the brainwaves because some people may benefit and they may need if the nervous system is screwed, and herbs can’t fix it alone, meditation etc. Can’t help nature walks, they may need some brain training, you know like some neurofeedback can be very helpful to try to get you more in those theta like tranquil state or more the deep Delta State.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and easy for that as you can get the inner balance the new m wave plug and then you can plug it right into your phone and that kind of gives you almost an HIV. Then you can do five seconds in, five seconds out breathing wise all to the nose can be very helpful. And you could put it on and you could just pitch it to your ear type

Evan Brand: Have you have you tried different types of breathing strategies and see which increases your HRV score the best?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I just do five in five out there are some different ones using box breathing where you do for in so it’s.. and then you hold for seven.. and then operate. So it’s a 478 and that’s been very helpful for just kind of relaxing and tranquilizing the nervous system and again, that’s seven, that’s seven hold. It does something with increasing co2. The hold is what’s increasing the co2 and then followed by the out and you try to make almost all of that you know through the nose on the outside it’s going to be probably okay going to the mall but try to go as much of the nose as possible.

Evan Brand: Yeah, tapping is good to you know, you could do some herbs, take a shot of some herbs and then tap, tap, tap calm the nervous system down, we know you can shift in a person. But the trick that way too.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, the big thing with tapping is if there’s things on your mind that are just bugging you, and you’re just you’re kind of ruminating on it, this is where tapping is the best. So I just take our I’m going to take three to five minutes, and I’m going to just think about, and maybe I’m just going to have a conversation about all the things that are bothering me. And I’m going to just talk about the emotion, hey, this conversation I had with this person today really, really pissed me off, right, I felt very irritated. I felt very anxious. And you may just talk about what happened and just talk about the emotion and then just kind of go through and tap all the major points. I double tap it because I just feel like it’s really effective. And then once I have, you know, once I have that, like, let’s say I’m at a seven once I drop a little five or four, or ideally two or three. Once I had that big drop in my emotions, and I just don’t care. It’s like, okay, whatever. That’s where I’ll kind of, you know, go into prayer, go more into meditation or go more into just gratitude and thankfulness. It’s hard It’s hard to be thankful and focus on what you want when you’re pissed off. So these are good strategies to kind of just calm down once you’re calm, then you can focus on, you know, the things you got to do tomorrow, which I’m not a huge fan of doing that too much. I think what you’re better off doing is before you go to bed, have like your little app on your phone or some paper and write down the top three things, right? Boom, than hates there, you downloaded it, it’s there. And then you can come to it tomorrow, you don’t have to worry about it. And then you go into a kind of appreciation, gratitude, and focus on what you want to manifest those kinds of things. So the more you can kind of create parasympathetic is better. So I use the tapping to decrease the stress first, and then go into what I want to manifest. If you’re too stressed. It’s too hard to do that.

Evan Brand: Yes, it is. You’re exactly right. I had a client last week told me that her husband would always get mad when he would see her tapping, because he would assume that she was tapping because she was pissed at something he did. I’m like, that guy needs to get over himself. You’re just tapping to help yourself. And so she kinda like After that,

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it could be something from work it could be. And who knows, it could have been like, maybe they had a little bit of a conversation before bed. And either way, it’s not a sign of whether you’re right or wrong and an argument because you could still be stressed, you know, and you’d have to decrease that stress from whatever that conversation was. Maybe it was just a really intense conversation about, you know, family, right. Okay, let’s, let’s calm it down and get into that parasympathetic. I think it’s a good rule is just, you know, no, no strenuous conversation within an hour or two before bed. Everybody go, 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, money and moving and travel and anything super intense. Yeah, I probably save you for waking hours. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s hard sometimes, though. Because if you’re waking up early, and you don’t see your wife to the next day, or vice versa. It’s like, well, you gotta put it out there because you need you know, you need to address it, but it’s tough. You try to do your best.

Evan Brand: It’s always a balance. It’d be interesting to hook ourselves up to like an EKG machine and see what our brain waves are doing while we’re doing a podcast together. I bet word and I’m sure we’re both probably in the beta state, like to fully alert awake Beta, but it’d be interesting.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, that totally makes sense. I agree. Well, anything else you want to kind of dive into here I’m just trying to connect the functional medicine the nutrition, the blood sugar, trying to prime in some of the labs that we can do to dive in deeper if people are listening to this and they’re like, okay, I’ve tried some of these diet and lifestyle strategies I want to dig in deeper feel free to reach out to Evan,, reach out to me Dr. J at, feel free and schedule with us if you want to dive in deeper to address some of these root cause issues. Anything else you want to say Evan?

Evan Brand: Well, CBD since CBD so popular and trendy. I’ve used it I mean, I take CBD all the time just because I have access to a lot of different companies that have sent me stuff. I haven’t noticed a huge difference to be honest, you know, I’ve played with the dosing and and this and that, but I think if you’re just doing straight CBD without a tiny bit of THC is kind of the entourage effect which helps it work better. I just don’t think it’s a huge needle mover. If people may argue all CBD is a miracle. I mean, I’ve done a lot of high grade brands and higher doses and without the THC, I’ve just not noticed much benefits. So people that do report relief and like pain relief that allows him to sleep better, it’s always going to be more like an edible version versus like a sublingual version. So if you’re going to go for that, you know, you may want to do something that goes to the gut, as opposed to just doing like a like a soft gel versus vaping or smoking, soft gel under the tongue, those type things may work a little better.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% so CBD I find it can be relaxing for me, but not any more than like magnesium or something nutritional so I rather just use a nutrient over time I can use a nutrient nutrient over like an herb that may not be a root cause kind of thing I always stick with the nutrient. I have found a really good success like if I have you know words with my wife or getting a stressful thing before bed. Actual ganda magnesium are just like they are my jam. They work really well. And tapping can be a little bit helpful. And then of course, white noise White noise is great. For the most part, I have my Austin air, crank it up on the highest setting that makes a really good bit of white noise. I have the white noise app on my phone. This is the one that I use. I’m going to hold it up so people can see it. If you’re driving, don’t worry, look at the link later.

Evan Brand: And what’s it titled?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s actually just called white noise. So I’m going to just pull up the picture of the app. So y’all can just see what it looks like. And then I’ve tried over the years, all kinds of different noises. So I’ll tell you exactly what I use.

Evan Brand: That’s a very that’s a very astute comment that you made that you would rather use a nutrient over an herb. I love that that makes total sense because yes, you’re not just like sedating yourself. You’re actually giving the body a nutrient to calm down. For example, this magnesium versus CBD. I think that’s just wonderful.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. I totally agree, man. Glad that you appreciate that. So I do I do the paid one. The white noise here. There’s a you’ll see one in pink, red. Then one reddish pink and then one in blue. So I paid the $2. And it’s great. And that’s the one that I use. And I’ll show you the exact setting I use, I do brown noise. So the first couple of years I used it, I did white noise. Okay, here’s white, kind of a little hissy high pitch. And then I went to pink because I saw some data on pink for a while being very helpful for sleep waves, which is ok. Ok. And then I went to Brown, so just a little bit softer. So here’s Brown. The little bit softer. Like Brown. And then there’s also a violet, I think this is this is blue. Don’t do high pitch your hissy for me. And then violet was also very hissy.

Evan Brand: It didn’t really come through too good on the recording, so people have to just look up the app and check it out. That’s it. Oh, there you go. Yep. Okay. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So that’s, that’s violet.

Evan Brand: And I think your microphone switched over to your, your headset instead of your big microphone to maybe it caught your Listen here and things. No, that’s still going good. Okay, good. No, I’m still good.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s violet. That blue. That’s Brown. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, like brown less horse than paint. I hear that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. So my favorite number ones Brown. number two Pink. There’s some data. There’s some data on pink being very beneficial for sleep waves probably brown as well. I haven’t looked at it. But browns, just the nice the most softest thing. And then also, if you want to have one fans are just really nice too. So they have a-

Evan Brand: Here’s the question. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Listen to a fan to like that. And so the nice thing is if you if you sleep with your wife or a partner, guess what? You just get the same app and you synchronize it so she’ll have her phone on and in the corner across the room on airplane mode. I’ll have mine as well. And then it’s synchronize But it becomes not that big of a deal because the Austin air that loud setting is so loud and it’s so nice, but that’s enough most of the time.

Evan Brand: Exactly. So I was going to ask this to you set a timer for that, like are you noticing any benefit on leaving that on I just was curious if you’re exposed to that noise all night versus just long enough to get you to sleep all night. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: All night. I keep it in my bathroom. My wife sleeping in my son’s room just because the breastfeeding and you know having to wake up a couple of times that makes it easier on her and then also a nice I’m not getting disturbed. So she’ll have it she won’t have it now because she needs to hear my son. But when she comes back to the room, she’ll definitely synchronize it up but the Austin air has been pretty darn good but when we travel for sure it’s 100%

Evan Brand: Yeah, I love the Austin too and I sound the molecules to molecule for one, it’s you got the stupid blue light your light Turn off the light and the sound it sounds more like a vacuum on a low speed rather than the Austin is just a more comforting fan sound. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Austin is the best sounding air filter out there. It has no light on it, which is awesome. And the next thing is the little Turner guy. I wish they made out of metal, you know, and we talked about that as plastic a little switch. But the cool thing is you can put a setting on and then pull it off. So if you have kids that are monkeying with stuff, use pull it off, put it up high, and then they can’t touch it. So that’s kind of nice, too.

Evan Brand: Yep. Cool. All right, well, let’s wrap this thing up. But I put out and reach out clinically, Justin’s website is And we can definitely help with sleep issues. But I’m going to tell you straight up your sleep issues are going to surprise you meaning what he or I uncovers, that’s going to surprise you because you’re going to come and you’re gonna think oh, I just have sleep issues and then we’re going to reveal you know, it’s it. Yeah, you do have sleep issues, but it’s because of XYZ and that’s the fun part is getting to the root cause of this stuff. So that’s what we do. Every day all day we live and breathe this stuff literally.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And if you guys are enjoying this information, give us a share a thumbs up, put your comments below. Let us know what What you guys have done regarding sleep regarding functional medicine and nutrition for your sleep what’s worked for you and then if you guys are really enjoying this give us the share and also write us a review, we appreciate your feedback and getting this out there so more people can help improve their health we really appreciate y’all

Evan Brand: Yep take care my website if you want to reach out to so, and we look forward to helping you so take care.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You guys have a phenomenal day. Take care y’all. Bye.

Evan Brand: Bye bye.


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