Natural Ways to Improve Your Sleep | Podcast #199

High-quality sleep is essential to one’s overall health. For numerous people, sleep deprivation led to risks in blood pressure, heart disease, obesity, and diabetes. Upkeep your well-being through the natural ways you can enhance your sleep.

Watch this video to know how Dr. J and Evan Brand explain the relationship of sleep to temperature, exercise, gut issues, blue light exposure, and smoking. Don’t forget to like and share!


Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

01:00    Temperature and Sleep Quality

02:45    Top Metabolic Things Moving Sleep Issues

09:42    Benefits of Sleep

04:00    Work Hard, Rest Hard

18:30    What Keeps You Up at Night?


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey, there. It’s Dr. J. Welcome ladies and germs. Hope you guys are having a phenomenal Monday. Evan, what’s going on with you?

Evan Brand: Hey, man. Not too much. Uh– The sun is shining still. Summer is still here. I thank the Lord. Uh– We had some weird like cold weather for a couple of days, and I thought, “Oh, man. I don’t know if I’m ready for this yet.” But today, it’s back to the heat so I’m enjoying it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Summer down here has been hot as you know what. But-

Evan Brand: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -I got like a little portable air conditioner unit outside of my central air, just good. It’s like, dude, I just can’t keep up with it. I got like my three or four monitors and then my treadmill and my– my– my stepping desk as well. I got like a little step or so. From sitting, I can– I can bike. From standing, I can walk and just all the heat that comes off in like a– a smaller office, it just gets contained in– I think I just get it– get it out.

Evan Brand: Yeah, maybe that should be strategy number one for today’s topic on improving sleep, which is make sure your environment is cool enough, because I’ve seen that some of the literature where they do like sleep studies on people that have the temperatures above like 70-72 Fahrenheit, people start getting restless.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, yeah. Hundred percent agree with that. Yep. Sleep quality, sleep– We were talking about sleep today, in case you guys didn’t know yet. But, temperature’s important. I mean, I try to keep it in the upper 60’s, low 70’s. Uh– One thing I’d done recently because, you know, I’m in Texas right now. It’s hot as heck and it’s really expensive to keep everything super cool. So one thing I invested in recently is called the BedJet, and the BedJet’s excellent. I’ll see if I could put a link down below for you guys to get that–

Evan Brand: I love– I love that thing.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Have you gotten it?

Evan Brand: No. Remember you showed me when I was at your house?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah! Yeah, I showed you at my house. Yeah. So you saw it-

Evan Brand: I love those.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -but it’s great. It basically goes underneath your sheets, and then it pumps in air. Now, it can warm the air up, but it can only cool the air as low as the air temperature. But it’s nice because it can pull in if you have like 75° or 76°, you know, temperature in your room, and it’s cool and already air-conditioned. It can pump that air in and it kind of stays underneath there that can kind of cool you a bit, and it’s very, very cool. And I put it on low like– I mean, you know, it’s the very low speed.

Evan Brand: Yup.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Maybe like it’s a 10%-20% of max, and it just comes– keeps a little bit of air in there, which keeps me cool, which is really nice. And– You know, especially in the summer, if a little bit of humidity that kind of– it can– the sheets can kind of stick to you. It feels a little uncomfortable. It’s just enough to cool that off.

Evan Brand: Yup. That– That’s– So temperature’s huge. I mean, many people-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Temperature’s great.

Evan Brand: -work that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, I agree. Totally. So, the temperature aspect’s great. I mean, I always sleep great when it’s like uhm— when it’s colder, when it’s around 69 or so, and then you can kind of really stay warm underneath through. That’s really the kind of the optimal temperature, 65-69, but in summer, it’s a little hotter, especially if you’re in a hotter place– places in the US. And then next step to that, let’s kind of go into a couple of other metabolic things? What are your– What are your top few metabolic things you want to start with?

Evan Brand: Well– I mean, blood sugar’s the biggest one. I had so many issues with my blood sugar for probably my whole life, just being raised on a Standard American diet, rich in carbohydrates, refined sugars, and so my blood sugar was probably one of the biggest, you know, movers for my health. And if you’re blood sugar’s crashing at night, your adrenals have to kick in to crank up and create some extra Glucose through the Gluconeogenesis process, and then all of the sudden you wake up and your heart could be racing, your mind could be racing, etc. So for me, you got to work on adrenals. I just want to give a couple statistics first. People may, you know, feel like sleep is just their issue and they may not know that many, many people struggle with it. So, if you’re looking at some of the CDC– I mean, they’re– they’re saying 50,000,000+ people have some sort of issue with sleep. Fifty million people in the US alone, so that is huge. And then, of course, they’ve got this whole list of uh– health conditions that are tied in to sleep issues, so it could be things like Stroke, Cancer, Arthritis, Depression, Diabetes. We know that if you’re not sleeping well, you’re blood sugar’s messed up from not sleeping well. And blood sugar can mess up sleep, so it’s like this big connected spiderweb. That’s a lot of people. Fifty million people struggling with sleep.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Definitely a lot. New study that just came out uhm— over the weekend actually, and the study looked at what’s the optimal amount of sleep for healthy– for– for cardiovascular health. They found six to eight hours was the optimal dosage for sleep. Too high actually had an increased risk factor, and then too low also had an increased risk factor. So six to eight was a sweet spot. They weren’t quite really sure what that mechanism was of that. Could just be a correlation versus causation kind of thing. I really have a hard time thinking that if I get 8½-hour sleep, uhm— I’m gonna increase my risk of heart disease. That doesn’t quite make sense to me from a mechanistic standpoint.

Evan Brand: No, it doesn’t.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But, hey. Six to eight, that makes sense, so if you’re getting less than six, for sure, you got to curtail that. But I do think, for me, if I’m not doing a ton of higher exercise– harder exercise– seven hours is essential. I do notice though, if I’m exercising more and I’m lifting more weights, you know, eight to nine becomes like important. So if I’m like more busy, I actually cut down a little bit on the morning tense exercise ‘cause it just requires me to get more sleep to recover.

Evan Brand: Yep. Yep, well said. So the exercise piece– I think exercise is a great sleep inducer, as long as it’s not too stimulating and not too close to bed. So, you know, depending on the weather, like 7:00 PM, if we can go for a walk– you know, I’ll try to take my wife and the baby down the street and back.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: You know, 15 to 20-minute walk, I’m much more ready for sleep if I do that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, totally. I– I agree. I mean, the big thing with sleep, in general, and exercise is the fact that it revs up– it revs up your sympathetic nervous system. So the healthier you are, the more you can kind of go on and off. Right? On-off. So, if you can turn off– on and off, and you can regulate and get that sympathetic stress response down, that’s great. Awesome. So maybe, like for me, I do like Tabatas around 7:30. Maybe some push ups, I do like, you know, ten to fifteen thousand steps during the day on top of that. So I get my 10,000 to 15,000 steps and I do like a little bit of Tabata action, and that’s–

Evan Brand: And you’re saying 7:30 PM?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I do it, but I mean, my Tabatas five minutes, so it’s not like-

Evan Brand: Okay.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -you know, a long thing. But I’m fine with that. That’s not a problem. So that’s– that’s helpful but if you have some neurological adrenal stuff, you may got– you may want to be careful of the timing of when you do your exercise. Maybe do it in the morning, or you may be fine with a Tabata or an interval thing that’s shorter, right? We just want to make sure, number one, we feel good after the exercise; two, we can emotionally repeat it. If the workout’s shorter, it’s u– most people can wrap their head around to it emotionally. It’s not draining them out. And then, three, how do you feel that next day or that next night, if that was a morning workout. That way you can kind of gauge in the intensity, the frequency, and the duration of how long your workout is, and you can adjust those variables accordingly to get you in that place where you can check all three of those boxes. Do you feel better? How do you feel emotionally afew minutes after? Can you repeat the movements? And then how so you feel later that day or that next morning?

Evan Brand: Yep. Well said. The next thing we have to mention is the timing or the schedule of sleep. If you’re working swing shift or night shift, that is bad news. We know, if you just type in “night shift nurses sleep study,” it’s something crazy, like a 50% increased risk of breast cancer if you’re working night shift. I mean, think about it. We didn’t evolve to be up at night. And if we were up at night, we were hanging out by a fire, which is gonna be a pretty orange or red colored light, and we– maybe we were chasing away a hyena or something or a bear that was gonna come eat our children when we were hunter gatherers, but we weren’t up at night under fluorescent lighting working in a hospital, looking at a computer screen. So if you’re a night shift nurse or a night shift anything, like I was when I was in college, I mean, it destroyed me. And I think one of my biggest down– you know, I guess one of my biggest downfalls or the thing that destroyed my health was working at midnight, and would work all the way through the night and I would get off at 5:00 AM and I would go to sleep at 6:00 AM. And I would try to sleep from 6:00 AM to 2:00 PM, and I survived but I did not thrive at all. So, people may yell at us, “Oh! Just, Evan, I have to work this shift.” Okay. If you absolutely can’t change it, you can’t get another job, you can’t work with the sun, I hear you, but I hope that there’s an alternative to where people can get off of that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I a hundred percent agree. If you have the ability, great. Awesome. Make it a priority. Or if you get paid in a lot more and that’s what you need to do, fine. It is what it is. You just kind of have to know that you’re going up to the plate with two strikes against you, so you really gonna have to make sure that your nutrition is– is borderline perfect. You’re gonna have to make sure you have some good adaptogens going and some good adrenal support going. And then, ideally, you know, make sure– It’s tough because then what do you do on the weekend? Do you keep that same cycle going? Do you go back to a normal rhythm? Uhum– That’s where it becomes dicey. I mean, I would probably say, “Keep the rhythm going to keep it consistent so you at least have a good rhythm.” But you got two strikes against you, and you really have to make sure everything else is dialed in regarding hydration, regarding uhm— adrenals, regarding adaptogen and regarding nutrients, and not even say gut function because we got to make sure there’s not a lot of gut stress and we’re absorbing and assimilating and then utilizing our nutrients efficiently.

Evan Brand: Yeah. I tell you, when I worked that shift, my lunch hour was like 3:00 or 4:00 AM. Your body’s not wanting to digest food. I don’t care how long you work night shift, you never feel like you’re fully satiated after a meal at 3:00 or 4:00 AM. I mean, there’s a lot of hormonal stuff going on in the middle of the night that your body’s not really wired to be eating a grass-fed steak and veggie, so I never felt good no matter– no matter how quality the meal was. So I think, in that aspect, you can hack it. Maybe you can hang in there, but eventually, you got to get off the night shift. I mean-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: -it is a killer.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I agree. Now, regarding sleep, what are some of the benefits of sleep? Now, getting– not getting enough sleep can cause blood sugar issues because part of the sleep is its restoration of your hormones, repairing  your— your organs, repairing all the– the physical and the biochemical structures of the body so you can function optimally. So, 10:00 PM to 2:00 AM is that Growth Hormone Window so we have a lot of physical repair happen at that time. And then, 2:00 AM to 6:00 AM, we have more of the biochemical kind of repair happening. And, ideally, getting closer, going to bed on the other side of midnight is ideal. I mean, for me, I’ll be straight up. I’m not perfect. I typically get to bed around 11:30. I try to do like 11:30 to 7:30. That’s kind of my gig, and then I’m operated to go at 8:00, but you got to figure out what works best for you. I mean, if I had more health concerns and more issues, I would be more on top of that, but I– I feel relatively good and– and I manage my stress and I wind down at night, so I feel pretty good with that. But in general, if you have any health issues, you’d want to be more on the other side of midnight. So getting to bed closer to even 10:00 o’clock would be ideal, just so you maximize that growth hormone output steroids that happen around 10:00 PM.

Evan Brand: Yup. Well said, and bright light in the morning, that’s really important. People don’t talk about what you do during the day to influence your sleep. People think, “Okay. What’s the magic supplement I need to take before bed to help me sleep?” Well, the magic supplement may be getting outside first thing in the morning in getting bright light exposure. So right before we jumped on this call together, I was on my bike. I rode my bike without my shirt, getting as much sun as I can, just down the street– down the street and back, you know, 5-10 times. I felt good. I felt amazing. I still feel good from it. I know I’m gonna sleep better just because of the exercise piece plus the sunlight telling me that it’s morning. It’s daytime. It’s time to get going. It’s time to peak the cortisol.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: And you and I test cortisol on every client, and we see a lot of times that people in the morning or in the afternoon, they have a lowered or a flatline Cortisol rhythm. And we have to improve upon that because if you don’t have a peak, then you can’t have a drop. So if you’re just flatlined all day, you’re not gonna feel very good. And then sometimes, what you and I see on the testing is we see that they have an inverse cortisol pattern or maybe it’s too low in the noon and afternoon, and then it kind of spikes at night. And then those people are the ones who they laid down but they’re too wired and tired. So we really have to focus. We have to test, first of all, you got  to get the data. We have to test the adrenal function, and then we have to help modulate that cortisol rhythm if it’s off. Otherwise, it doesn’t matter if you take Melatonin or some other magic sleep supplement. It might not work.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: One hundred percent. So again, that reverse cortisol rhythm is the hallmark of a sympathetic kind of overload or sympathetic dominant person. Their fight or flight nervous system response is more activated and is starting to go up at night. And the WHI ha– HERS II study show the greatest correlation of cancer was a decreased cortisol gap between their cortisol in the morning and their cortisol at night. So the lower their cortisol got in the morning, which should be higher, and the higher their cortisol at night, this gap– this spread between morning and night– the smaller that spread got, showed a greater increased correlation risk of cancer than even smoking.

Evan Brand: Whoah!

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So, it’s really important that we keep the sympathetic nervous system– you know, we keep it so we can oscillate and adapt between parasympathetic and sympathetic. So a couple things we do is adaptogenic herbs; can be really helpful.

Evan Brand: What are you taking there?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s just some Ashwagandha-

Evan Brand: Oh, okay.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -and some extra vitamins. Uh– On top of that would be, of course, a really good anti-inflammatory nutrient dense diet, uh– along with blood sugar stability, ‘cause sometimes low blood sugar going into bed can create cortisol uhm— surges in the middle of the night.

Evan Brand: I remember when my nervous system was screwed up. This was like 2015. It’s like three and a half years ago. I was about to move back to Kentucky, and– and I called Justin. I was like, “Justin,” I was like, “I’m freaking out, man.” I was like, “My heart is beating a thousand beats a minute. I can’t get it to slow down.” And that was when I was about to move so the house was in boxes. Do you remember this?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup. I remember this.

Evan Brand: The hou— The house was in boxes. We were getting ready to pack up and move the next day, and you said, “Hey. Just try like a gram of Magnesium.” So that’s what I did, and then I ended up doing like an Epsom Salt Bath too with some essential oils, and I calmed it down. But I’ll tell you from firsthand experience, if your nervous system is screwed up, if you have more stress– you know, people say the term, “Work hard. Play hard.” If you don’t work hard and then rest hard, you’re– you’re gonna be messed up. And for me, you know, I had all of these impending uh– transition of moving and such, and I was not mitigating my stress properly. I was doing my adaptogenic herbs, which is great, but I was probably not getting enough exercise, sunlight, etc. So I’ve been there, done that, and it’s not fun. So, you have to make sure– I’ll just kind of say it in a different way. However much stress you have in your bucket, you’ve got to have an equally large bucket of de-stressing activities: meditation, massage, float tanks, herbs, going to bed on time, blocking blue light at night, etc.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: One hundred percent. Like in my line, I have a product called Magnesium Supreme, which is a Magnesium dimalate, which is great. There was this other Magnesium uh– powders that are great. I’ll do a little bit of Magnesium with some Collagen, which has Glycine in it, and the Glycine can be really calming and relaxing too at night time. So I’ll do that before bed as well. People can also do some of the decaf Tulsi teas are excellent ‘cause that kind of has an adaptogenic effect. Some people would do even the Ashwagandha, which is great. Ashwagandha Supreme’s awesome. Do that one to two caps before bed. Just do recommend testing it out during the day just to see how you do. Some people, they get really energized with it, so you– you want to just make sure it’s not– you’re not one of those people that really get over– overly stimulated with the Ashwagandha. You can always do some other teas like the Camomile tea. The Tulsi decaffeinated teas are excellent ‘cause that’s Holy Basil, which is kind of a– a similar adaptogen as Ashwagandha, where it help– really helps calm and relax. You can always do some sublingual or liposomal GABA. We can even add some L-Theanine, too, which is an amino acid that’s really calming and– and relaxing as well. Uh– Anything else you wanted to ask, Evan? Al– Also uhm— Phosphorylated Serine is a nice adaptogen that helps calm the Hypothalamus’ response to Cortisol, so it can help really relax that Cortisol response at night, in case you got this reverse Cortisol rhythm pattern that’s happening.

Evan Brand: Yeah, and–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What, Evan?

Evan Brand: yeah, I do. Yes, and I’ll first comment on the Phosphorylated Serine. People may think you’re just pronouncing it different or wrong. You’re not. No. This is different than Phosphatidylserine. This is Phosphorylated, so there is a difference that’s he is talking about. I’m a huge fan of Lemon Balm. I have Lemon Balm tincture [crosstalk] in my– Yeah. I’m growing it in my garden but it’s a lot easier to just buy an organic Lemon Balm tincture. So I do that, and then, Motherwort, another favorite. Uh– There’s a couple different herbalist that I look to for education about herbs. And one herbalist said that taking Motherwort is like getting a hug from planet Earth, and I would agree with that statement completely. It’s a weird thing to describe how are you getting a hug from planet Earth? But when you take Motherwort, you just feel like you’re cuddled. You feel like you’re getting swaddled like a little baby. And so I take Motherwort and I just go lay down, and it’s basically– uh– I mean, It just takes all of your worries away. It’s a very, very calming thing to do, and it’s really great for people with heart issues– you know, atrial flutter, atrial fibrillation, any other type of like a sympathetic overdrive heart issue. Obviously, if you’re taking pharmaceuticals, you got to see if that stuff matches up. But if you’re not on pharmaceuticals, Motherwort is a really good go-to.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. We can also do things like Melatonin. I always recommend if you’re using Melatonin, if you have good benefits with Melatonin, try to use more of the 5-HTP with B6 first ‘cause that provides more of the building block amino acids to make the Melatonin hormone. I always like providing more of the building blocks and precursors. Some people, they just have burnt out their Serotonin from stress or from too much sugar or inflammation. So those building block kind of pulls to make their Melatonin can be lower. So I was recommend that utilizing some of the 5-HTP with B6 first. I think that’s great. And if you need Melatonin kind of in a punctuated fashion, I always have some lipo– a sublingual version by my bed. So if I’m just coming off a weekend where I was up a little bit later, [clears throat] or if I’m up at night where I’m more stimulated, I can just get it in my system in five or ten minutes and have it be done ‘cause it’s going to my sublingual tissue so it’s there right away.

Evan Brand: And dosing on that is how much, typically?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I tend to always start super low, so anywhere between two to three hundred micrograms and up to one milligram. Most people they all start at even at three milligrams, right? So I try to start super low because I just need the– the kind of the sedation-relaxation, kind-of-going-to-sleep effect. I don’t need it to kind of nurse me throughout the night.

Evan Brand: And most people overdose on Melatonin.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mm–

Evan Brand: What we see when we test people is that people that are doing like 5-10 milligrams Melatonin, well, look at their Cortisol pattern, and they don’t have that morning spike with their Cortisol like they should ‘cause the Melatonin opposes Cortisol and vice versa.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so– I always say, we’ll give them like a 1 mg like sublingual lozenger and we’ll have them nibble off a third, and just see how they’re doing. And they can gradually increase it if they need it. So I’m fine with that. And also, just– sometimes people wake up in the middle of the night. They have a pattern or a rhythm of having a hard time going back to sleep. There can can be stress that happens just sitting there wondering if they can go back to sleep. So, sometimes, if you’re that person that’s– it’s better to almost as nibble on a little bit of Melatonin ‘cause then at least you’re done what you need to get back to sleep, and that helps negate that Cortisol response from you wondering if you’ll get back to sleep.

Evan Brand: Yeah. I would also like to bring up emotional stress too. If that’s unaddressed, that’s gonna keep you up at night. So if that’s a financial worry, or a relationship problem, or you hate your job and you don’t want to go to work the next day– something like that, you got to address it. So, I would try to write down a big list of all of the stressors. What are the things you can control? What are the things that you can do? What are the action steps to resolve those stressors? And then, for some of the stuff you can’t control, like maybe you’re stuck in this job, you don’t like this boss right now, maybe you can do some EFT– and you tapped about it. You know, even though I don’t like this boss, I deeply love and accept myself, and you just do your tapping and affirmations. That could help too. And then– I know you may have a couple of other things to go into, but we should definitely just really hit on the fact about testing ‘cause you brought up the Serotonin and how people burn that out due to stress. We don’t just guess with that. We always test people, and we can measure it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, totally. Yeah. I mean, on the stress thing– I mean, what I’ll do is I’ll just use my– my to-do list, either on Google Task or just on my iPhone, and I’ll just punch in what are– what are the top three things that are keeping me up. ‘Cause the big thing is, as long as I’m taking action on those things, it’s usually the– the uncertainty and the lack of action taking on a– a stressful task that creates the uncertainty. So– Hey, what are those top three things? And just make sure we’re doing something to close the loop, so we’re always doing something. So we’re not sitting back and kind of being a spectator so to speak.

Evan Brand: Yeah, being paralyzed from it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hmhm– Yeah. Always make sure you’re doing at least something to get the monkey off your back.

Evan Brand: And then did– did you have other categories or body systems you wanted to hit on? I think we hit the gut briefly. I will say that gut infections can mess up your sleep. When I had parasites, my sleep was terrible.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Infections can be a stressor, and these infections are more active at night time, so the inflammation they create at night, the body may respond by producing more anti-inflammatory hormone, i.e., Cortisol. Cortisol’s also stimulatory as well, so that could wake you up. So we– you know, we do our best to clear out the gut infections. That could be more of a long-term strategy. We may use palliative things first, like I mentioned, the Magnesium, the Calm, the Motherwort, the– the 5-HTP with B6, the Melatonin, all of the healing and soothing and calming herbs, and adaptogens first. And then, of course, we get the patient ready so they can get to that next step and do the killing efficiently. We may work on the blood sugar stability before bed and have something by their nightstand in case they are waking up with low blood sugar. They have uh– easy smoothie or an easy bar right there at their nightstand, and they access if needed.

Evan Brand: Yeah, good. Like a little fat bomb, you know, like a little big chunk of coconut or something like that that’s gonna give you some fats.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. EPIC Bar, one of these collagen bars, or a little smoothie that’s already made in a shaker cup– It’s already ready to go. We just don’t want you having the to get up, go to the fridge, the bright light pops on, or you having to use your head to make– to mix whatever you’re doing. I just kind of want to on autopilot. So if you need something, it’s just there, ready to go.

Evan Brand: Yup, yeah. So parasites for me, I mean, that was the biggest one. I had an H. pylori infection too. That screwed up my sleep. My sleep is much, much better now. Of course, you know, with the baby, we’re– we’re getting there. We’re almost out of the woods with her sleep, so I’m gonna be sleeping much better. I already am sleeping better than– than previous, but uh– Let’s talk about the testing too because I think it’s important. People can go and buy all these supplements. You can buy Melatonin, Ashwagandha, etc., etc. And as you mentioned, it’s more palliative. It’s not really root-caused. So you hit on the adrenals. We talked about testing for that. We do that with Saliva panel. You can measure the 24-hour rhythm or you could do urine, but either way, you want to look at the morning, how the day progresses, and then evening, take a snapshot there. If there’s Cortisol issues, you have to fix it because that could be messing up your gut, ‘cause if the Cortisol’s too high, that’s catabolic. So then it’s eating your tight junctions away in your gut. Then you have leaky gut. Then you get autoimmune condition. Then you’re really screwed. So, you got to test adrenals, and then step two– you mentioned the brain chemistry, the serotonin– so we run organic acids testing on everyone through urine. It’s a great test, and it looks at, also bacterial infections and yeast, dopamine levels. It looks at your endorphins, amino acids, etc. And then step three– we talked about the gut– getting the gut tested, running a stool test– we do this at home. So if you work with Justin or I, we send a test kit to your house. You collect stool. You look for all the infections, and then we come in and we address those. And then, maybe, we’re doing some of the stuff behind the scenes along the way, but you have to fix those big body systems if you really want to sleep good and have long-term health.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. So we have kind of the anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, low toxin diet going. We’re working on the gut. We’re working on the hormones. Oh! Also, low progesterone and some hormonal imbalances, I see it with a lot of my women that have severe PMS or they’re perimenopausal or menopausal, postmenopausal. The hormonal imbalances from progesterone and estrogen, either going low or being out of balance at certain times of the month, can easily throw off the cycle, or– I’m sorry, sleep– easily throw off your sleep.

Evan Brand: Now, would you say that– would you say like Estrogen Dominance is what’s happening?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, it can because Estrogen Dominance tends to imply lower progesterone, and progesterone kind of open those GABA chloride channels and GABA is an inhibitory neurotransmitter, which means it helps you relax and turn off. So, GABA’s kind of the switch that allows the sympathetic nervous system to go off and the parasympathetic to go on, which is important so you can wind down and chill out. So, that can be helpful. So some of our cycling patients or even our menopausal patients will give some progesterone at or around bedtime, or we’ll have them dosed their progesterone at around that time of the day anyway. So it really help with relaxation.

Evan Brand: And you’re talking like how much?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh– It depends, but typically with patients, we’ll do anywhere between 25 mg to 50 mg.

Evan Brand: Man, that’s like a typical dose. Like you’ll see like a teaspoon of like a micronized progesterone. It’s like a pretty standard dose.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Twenty-five to 50 milligrams is pretty good. It just depends on how low the person is. We may go up more, above that– you know, go up to 200, and just if we continue to see benefit or improvements, that’s good. And if we see lower levels that will give us more motivation, then we should go higher. But I always like to start lower with hormones because progesterone can sensitize Estrogen receptor sites, so people can get symptoms of Estrogen dominance as they increase their progesterone because of that receptor site sensitivity. So starting lower tends to help the body adapt to the dose-type of responses. Kind of like it’s easier to get into cold water if you can kind of start with warm water and gently nudge the temperature downward. Kind of like that.

Evan Brand: Yup. Well said. Were there any other body systems or things we didn’t hit on yet?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, we talked about the amino acids and the neurotransmitters. We talked about uhm— B6. We always like to combine there ‘cause B6 is really important to uhm— these neurotransmitters converting and synthesizing. So, if we have Mitochondrial stress, if we had dysbiosis, B vitamins are made in the gut. A significant amount, obviously a lot, will come with food and– and healthy meats, and good animal proteins, and good plant material. And then after that, uhm— minerals are important. People that tend to eat lots of sugar and excess carbohydrate and refined sugar, they’ll be depleting their Magnesium ‘cause Magnesium’s one of those nutrients that gets burnt up with excess carbohydrate metabolism. So Magnesium’s really important. That will help uh– have a– a really good relaxation kind of effects. So that’s important as well. And then, just some of the diet– some of the lifestyle strategies is keeping the– the lights down at night, blue-blocking glasses can be great. I use them sometimes. For me, I can go from sympathetic to parasympathetic like that, so it’s not like this huge thing. But I think if you have a hard time coming off of a TV or a movie, or just in general, that could be a good thing to kind of help the parasympathetics turn on faster and better, so keep that in mind. I will find like– I find watching TV like at 9:00 o’clock or 8:30, and I have those glasses on. I’ll want to go to sleep so– so much faster.

Evan Brand: Oh, yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Really, just like, “Whoah!” I’m just like– So I mean, it’s like go to bed a little too early so– so I like a little bit of stimulation so I know I’m ready.

Evan Brand: Yeah. I mean, I– I’ve got a pair of it I gave my wife to wear, and we both wear them. We get super sleepy quick and we basically just–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: We have uh– salt lamps on at night, and that’s pretty much it. We don’t really have any overhead lights at night, so we– we try to live like we’re hanging out at a campfire in the evenings-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: -and it– and it works great.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And for me, we have blue-blocking uhm— night lights so– In my son’s room if we need to or– In our room, if we need to, we have night lights. So if we need a little bit of light, which sometimes we do, is at least not emitting any blue light, so that’s not gonna stimulate the Melatonin. Right? It’s the blue light that gets the Melatonin going, so more of the infrared uh– red frequencies tend to be less Melatonin s– uh– less Melatonin-inhibiting.

Evan Brand: Yep. Yep. Well said. So the light piece you cannot ignore. Like you take all the perfect supplements, you got a big bright light or you’re checking your phone right before you go to bed and you’re not using blue-blocking technologies, then you’re screwing yourself up for sure. I saw a question uh– if you’re ready to hit questions, it was a-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: -question about PQQ, and whether it improves sleep or not. I did find a study on that, and it was just titled exactly that, “Oral supplementation PQQ on stress–”

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uhmhm–

Evan Brand: “-fatigue and sleep,” and turns out that yes, it definitely does help in terms of sleep onset sleep duration. And it does help to reduce fatigue, tension, anxiety, depression, anger, hostility, and confusion. So, PQQ’s great. I mean, we do use some of PQQ and some of our protocols. It’s a great [incomprehensible]

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: [incomprehensible] from mitochondrial function? It’s– There’s research showing that it actually can help regenerate Mitochondria.

Evan Brand: That’s so cool ‘cause when you hear about Mitochondria, it’s kind of like brain cells. People used to think that once your Mitochondria get damaged, you’re toast, but you’re not. You can actually regenerate Mitochondria, which is cool.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: A hundred percent. Any other questions you want to highlight here, Evan?

Evan Brand: Yeah. Let’s see here. There was one that said, “If I’m in a toxic environment, is it smart to do fasting if I wake up at night hungry?” That’s kind of a confusing question. Do you understand that one?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well– I mean, I would say– So like, do you mean– I’m gonna make some assumptions– meaning toxic like poor air quality or mold in the environment? I mean, I would say, number one, you’re gonna– as long as you have access to good quality food, I would say, eating is gonna provide the nutrition to run those detoxification pathways. Alright, part of the benefit off fasting is uhm— you’re not putting any food in your body, so you give your gut a chance to rest. So if your gut’s inflamed or stressed, that makes sense, but if your gut’s already healthy and you’re putting really good food in your body, well that nutrition’s important to run your metabolic pathways. Your metabolic pathways either go in debt to run, meaning they– they burn up other tissues, which may be good if it’s fat, but they need nutrition to run. As far as I’m concerned, your fat does not store a whole bunch of uh– vitamins and minerals. It has a lot of caloric reserve. It doesn’t have any mineral or fat reserve, and you may have some fat-soluble vitamins stored in your liver– A, B12– B12 tends to be a little bit– even though it’s a water-soluble vitamin, it tends to be stored in higher amounts in the liver from what I understand. Uhm– But in general, I would say, you– you want to make sure you have good nutrition to run those pathways optimally.

Evan Brand: Another question here. It was about uh– Samuel. He said, “Seems like the blue light blocker fad is winding down. Is it still effective for proper sleep?” Of course it is. It’s not a fad. It should stay here forever. Blue light is never gonna not affect Melatonin. Period. Once the– Once we figure that out, I think that’s a lifetime strategy.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I still don’t understand why a lot of people just have them on during the day ‘cause I just like, “What’s the point?” Because don’t you want that stimulation during the day? You want that Cortisol.

Evan Brand: You do.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So I don’t understand. I see people like Dave Asprey and uhm— Dr. uh– Jack Kruse. They have them on during the day, and I’m just like– I mean, maybe if you have some kind of timezone switch and you’re trying to adapt to a timezone maybe and you’re overly stressed and you’re trying to decrease that stress response, fine. But during the day, I would think you’d want to have that Lead exposure especially in the first half of the day, and then the last half of the day, maybe after 5:00 PM if you’re trying to get that nervous system to quiet down, maybe you’d throw in the blue-blockers to help accentuate that parasympathetic shift.

Evan Brand: Yeah, I chatted with Dr. Mercola about it. He says the only time and reason that he wears the blue-blockers during the day is if he’s in like a conference hall or something where it’s all artificial lighting-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Artificial light.

Evan Brand: -and he has no sunlight. So, if it– if you’re getting exposed to fake blue light during the day, and you still have sunlight-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uhmhm-

Evan Brand: -opposing it with windows or your outside, you’re in good shape. But whe— when you have nothing and you’re in like a dark hall, and all you have are these fake lights, that’s when I know Mercola said he will use the glasses. And so that’s kind of the– the two cents there. Charlie asked, “Should you eat carbs like a sweet potato or honey before bed? How long before bed for optimal sleep?” I don’t worry about the timing, but I do feel like I sleep a little bit better with some starch at dinner.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I think people that have lower Cortisol at night, tend to go lower at night do little bit better with some carbs. So I think, number one, if you know your adrenals tend to be a little bit lower in the cortisol side, try it. Just try doing a little bit of carbs before bed. If you have a device like a FIT-BED or an Oura Ring but has some HRV attached to it, try it and then see how your HRV, which is kind of uh– window into your nervous system. See how that looks at night time. But I mean, if you’re having times where you’re waking up at night, definitely throw a little bit of carbohydrate in there with some protein and fat, and see if that makes the difference.

Evan Brand: Yup. Uh– Elizabeth said she used to have trouble sleeping and she was told she had parasites, so she got rid of the parasites and she slept. So yes, that’s awesome.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep. We see that a lot. That’s great. Awesome.

Evan Brand: I know–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And you got uh– major questions here you want to run down that are pertinent to the podcast here guys? Do you have any questions? Try to keep it to the sleep podcast. I’m gonna try to, in the notes, always put like in the beginning like, “Hey this podcast is on whatever topic.” In that way, you guys can chime in accordingly.

Evan Brand: Uh– Yeah. Mike asked, “Blue light is for the light of the morning, why would you want that all day?” So– I mean, the sun emits blue light all day until-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: -the spectrum starts changing and then you start to remove blue light naturally as the sun sets. So that’s how it’s supposed to happen. The atmosphere starts to filter out the blue and greens, and then you transition into darkness. So that’s how it suppose to work, which is why being on the computer at night with no blue-blocking software or the glasses is– is not good. So I don’t do any– pretty much any screen too late, and if I do, it’s always with the blue-blocking glasses or software on.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: I think that’s all the pertinent ones.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. On my iPhone, I have the night shift on and I went in and I– I like turned off all the blue so it’s only red at night. And that doesn’t mean I can be on my phone right before bed, like if I’m like– I don’t know– like getting my alarm set or making a couple of notes on my to-do list for tomorrow, doesn’t affect me at all, but I also have to have all of the blue off, 100%. And I have the light on the lowest possible uh– setting as well.

Evan Brand: Yeah, like the brightness itself-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: -turned down? Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The brightness all the way down. All of the blue totally off so it’s just red that’s showing and it’s just the– the tiniest bit. But then if I have to like– let’s say I have to go on a comp– the computer like late to do some work, something got missed, then I will use my blue-blocking glasses just because I got all these monitors on. So that’s when it’s really nice. If you have to do work a little bit later, use your glasses for that.

Evan Brand: Yep. Excellent. Kruse said something interesting last time I spoke with him, which is he thinks people should be wearing scarves around their neck because the blue light penetrates through the skin and it can affect the thyroid and cause Hashimoto’s. I think it’s an interesting thought.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh my gosh! Okay. Uhm– [laughs]

Evan Brand: I’ve been interviewin

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Here’s the deal. I’m always open to trying it so like if you feel less stimulated, great. Awesome. Give it a try. Will that cause Hashimoto’s, I’m not really worried about it. Uhm– There’s way other– way more triggers that people are already activating with Gluten and with infections and blood sugar. I’m not worried about that. Now, if uhm— And also VItamin D is really important, right? Vitamin D has a major effect on the immune system and can help modulate the immune response, but I wouldn’t– I wouldn’t [laughs] jump to that conclusion on the Hashies first but I think it’s worth trying if it helps you feel less stimulated for sure.

Evan Brand: Right. Right. Yeah. I mean, I think if you’re desperate, that’s something you should definitely look at. If it reduced your antibodies like let’s– I think the only way to track it would be if you had all other variables dialed in and then you put on the scarf at night, so therefore the blue light didn’t penetrate to the thyroid and then all those antibodies went down but you did nothing else. That may be a way to quantify it but that’s hard. It’s hard to quantify.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. For me, like blue light I think is optimal because there is some data, I think, In TS Wiley’s book, uhm— “Lights Out.” She talked about, I think, a study at the University of Chicago where they had people like a sleeping– sleeping, and then they would like shine a light. They would like put a light right in the back of someone’s knee.

Evan Brand: Yes. That’s right.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And it would like wake them up or pull them out of sleep. I’m not sure if it woke them up or it just made their– their sleep uhm— their sleep study look, you know, more unfavorable so to speak.

Evan Brand: I– I think it down-regulated Melatonin too.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: And it was literally a light the size of like a nickel behind the kneecap, and that was enough to affect Melatonin.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. So I look at like blue-blocking glasses at night time is like the lights are down to a– a dimmable level, and maybe you want to watch TV or some Netflix or check out your iPad or whatever, like that’s where I find it’s really good. Ideally, you want everything kind of dimmed down.

Evan Brand: Agreed.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So you don’t want all the lights on, all the lights on, and then the blue-blockers on.You’d want everything down and then you’re using it just so you can engage with your technology, or watch a show and not be– you know, overly sympathetically stimulated.

Evan Brand: Yeah. That’s an important note. Is environmental light needs to be reduced as well. You can’t just blast yourself. “Oh! I have blue-blockers. I’m fine.”  I agree. It’s got to be both-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.

Evan Brand: -which is why I did nothing but salt lamps at night.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Best investment everyone can get is number one, uhm— like for your bedrooms, get blue-blocking night lights and/or like a night– a bulb that’s like a blue-blocking bulb, and/or number two, in all the major rooms that I’m in like around night time, they all have dimmer switches. So if I have to use lights in my bedroom, I put on the absolute lowest setting; of my TV room, lowest setting; or for like– you know, around my TV or bathroom, absolute lowest setting. That way, I can at least, you know, decrease the intensity if light has to go on.

Evan Brand: Yup. Yup. I think that was all the questions. So if people want to reach out– I mean, we always test people. Could you take some of these supplement recommendations and benefit? Probably so, but we do like to test people and figure out what’s really going on. So if you want to reach out, you can do so to Justin at his site, And if you want to reach out to me, it’s We love helping you all. We love getting the data. We love seeing the difference too, like after we implement something and then the Cortisol rhythm’s fixed and then the sleep is fixed, it’s like, “Oh! That’s why you’re sleeping better. Look at your Cortisol. It went from 12 units at night to now it’s one unit at night.” It’s really satisfying to see the results on paper.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: One hundred percent. And we appreciate the awesome questions from everyone who kind of chimed in, and we think we’re one of the only people that does a live podcast like this and answers questions just live, right? We’re functional medicine health improv here so we appreciate the great questions. Give us a share. Give us a thumbs up. Make sure you hit the uh– notification bell. And anyone that– your friends or family that that needs more help or wants to chime in and be part of this great conversation, we appreciate uhm— you sharing the word. So thank you so much, everyone and Evan. Today was a– a great podcast as always and let’s talk real soon.

Evan Brand: Take care, bye.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Thanks. Bye.


A recent study about Optimal Amount of Sleep for Cardiovascular Health

Night Shift Nurses Sleep Study

The WHI Estrogen/progestin and HERS II Study

“Lights Out” by TS Wiley

Dr. Jack Kruse – Functional medicine mistakes, EMF, sunlight and your mitochondria – Podcast #135

Dr.  Justin Marchegiani and Dr. Jack Kruse talk about the mitochondria and the environmental effects on it. Learn more about the importance of sunlight exposure and other light exposure as Dr. Jack shares his views and personal experiences about it.

Know about solar callus and be informed on ways to optimize light exposure including the processes and benefits involved. Discover more about biohacking the environment and get some valuable insights on the different types of diet that correlate to the location where you live.

In this episode, we cover:Dr. Jack Kruse

07:44   Sunlight and blue light exposure

16:20   Diet and its correlation to environment and climate 

32:30   Optimizing light exposure

44:11   Biohacking the environment

52:37   Assessing redox potential







Dr. Justin Marchegiani
: Hey there! It’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani. We are live here with Dr. Jack Kruse, neurosurgeon. Again, really excited to be having Dr. Jack Kruse on the show. Again, Dr. Jack Kruse went to dental school, then medical school, and then a neurosurgical residency. This guy is a modern day Renaissance man. Put a lot of time and effort into get to where he’s at now. So we’re really excited to have Dr. Jack Kruse back in the show.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Hey, what’s going on?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s not too much, man. You just got back from the neurosurgery uh—just a little while ago trauma, you mentioned so I’m glad that we had better connection here. We’re connected again.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So we we’re talking—

Dr. Jack Kruse: Sorry about it—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. No worries. I mean you’re in the trenches. I love it. You— your clinically getting your hands dirty every day, you are on-call last night like you mentioned, too. But before we had cut off, I want to bring back the couple key topics you were mentioning. One was the top functional medicine mistakes. And you were kinda echoing some of the EMF stuff, some of the sunlight stuff. So I’m gonna let you roll on that for a few. Go ahead.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah. Well the two biggies for me. I’ve been in that rehab to have everybody uhm—restate their position on—on their theories. One is SNP’s and the other one is probably adrenal fatigue.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And I think adrenal fatigue, the number one thing that we both need to agree on is the name should probably go by the wayside.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Because functionally, it’s uh— it’s a problem with brainstem and specifically the periventricular nucleus. And that nucleus is supposed to be balanced by another nucleus called uh—vagal motor complex.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And that’s six different nuclei in the brainstem and basically that system  runs  the parasympathetic system and the periventricular nucleus  runs the sympathetic system. And when we talk about homeostasis or balance, those systems are designed to be yoke properly with the proper circadian signal that are present in the environment. The thing that people do not realize is when you alter the environment, it alters the response of all these brainstem nuclei. And the key way it happens is actually via the mitochondria. And mitochondria are, you know, these double layer uh—organelles that deliver most of the energy in the body. And when I say most of the energy, I wanna give people a really good visual so they understand it. Uh— I think we can compare it to like plants because I think that’s a good way to start. Uhm—when we think about plants, plants are completely connected to the earth’s magnetic field and the 

canopy is into the sun 24/7 so the reason they don’t have to eat is their pulling all  of their electrons that are excited by photons uh—in those two ways. Uhm—they’re not designed to move across the tectonic plates so they use a different system. Uhm— most people know that system is called photosynthesis. The uh— interesting part are us since we’re animals, more complex, we move across  the tectonic plates and we’re moving in and out of the canopy. That means that we have to have backup system in us that plants don’t have to have. And what people functionally do not realize is they look at a chloroplastin and they look at mitochondria, they’re exactly the same.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Meaning they were both once bacteria, that compare with what we consider endosymbiosis. In other words, we_them and we change their function to be uh— an energy producer. Uh—what people don’t understand in animals, is that, on average and I’m giving you averaging on being a 70-kg adult, meats on average to make 85 kg of ATP per day. So I want you to think about that. If you have to make more ATP per day than you weigh, that is the function of a mitochondria. But here is where it gets really interesting. Food only provides 1/3 of the amount of electrons to make ATP. Well, guess what is—is supposed to provide the other two thirds? Sunlight—and how does that happen? It’s a function of the protein in the intermitochondrial membrane called uh—Cytochrome C Oxidase which I think most people know. And Cytochrome C Oxidase is a heme protein just like hemoglobin in our skin. Uh—and what it does it absorbs best in what we call the optical window. And the optical window grows from about 700-1400 average specifically in the red infrared range. And what does it do? It makes ATPase spend much faster and we create uhm— several things from that. Not only do we create ATP, we create the other 2/3 of the ATP that food don’t  provide us. The other key thing is the faster the ATPase spends, the higher magnetic flux we create in a cell. And that’s where magnetic fields come and—and most people who are in the allophatic and functional medicine don’t functionally really understand how the magnetic field is generated and how it’s designed to alter as current that comes across the intermitochondrial membrane in the form of electrons. And also—In fact, everything in the environment, okay? Everything functionally comes down to electrons.  If you don’t believe me, there’s your— And I know everybody who’s a doctor, if you remember back to basic Chemistry in high school, they said that just the change in electrons show changes chemistry everywhere. That’s what valence chemistry is all about.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So electrons are really important to talk about how to— how do you affect, how do you change or reduce the oxidation of these electrons coz oxidation is essentially a loss of these electrons. That’s what causes the rust—the nails—

Dr. Jack Kruse: That’s—that’s—that’s too far down the path. You need to understand something you’ve got more simple. How do we program electrons? Here’s—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Here’s the interesting thing. Everything in the world—everything has electrons in it, okay? So how do we program electrons naturally? You do it by sunlight frequencies. In other words, an electron becomes excited and once it gets excited, it goes up to this state. The difference between this state and this state is the redox potential. That’s what you just asked me. But you have to realize what excites the electron first is the key. And the interesting thing if you look at the mitochondria, as it’s laid out, Cytochrome 1 and Cytochrome 5 which is ATPase that redox potential is designed go from about -400 all the way to zero where oxygen is. So it’s the same effect. So what is light’s real goal? Light’s real goal is to figure out how to take an electron after it’s been programmed as it falls to the ground state, it capture the light energy that programs that electron. And that’s what makes a tomato’s electron different than a cucumber than a stake that you’ve just said. And there’s a frequency—a rosetta stone frequency in everything, in all our environment and your mitochondria pays attention to that. That’s the reason why I told you earlier that we’re designed to pay attention to the environment, and it’s not an endogenous defect within us. The defect is created because there is a disconnection in the system in terms of how it’s able to connect to nature and the reason that’s occurred for our species is because we think all the things that we come up are really great because we don’t understand the owner’s manual, what’s built into the mitochondria and how it works.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So how are we applying this with the sunlight? Is there an optimal time of day? What exposure look like? What part of the body is getting it? Are you wearing the glasses all day long to block out the blue light? How are you applying this so that you can get the maximal electron benefit in your life?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well, Justin, you have a pretty interesting perspective already coz when we first started talking outside, you noticed I wasn’t wearing these.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You asked me to come into my office to do this coz you’d get better audio, I was not kinda like not terribly into that—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Haha—

Dr. Jack Kruse: I was up all night uh—on trauma call. Just finished a big spinal reconstruction so I’ve been inside. I missed the sunlight today. So I wanted the  actual sunlight. I mean—I don’t—I don’t wanna be around any blue light right now because of what I had to do last night. So what happens to me last night uh— the blue light that I was around uh— from the operating room and everything else, took my respiratory proteins and stretched them out. And see, here’s the interesting thing, those fibrous respiratory proteins, Cytochrome 1, 2, 3, 4 and the ATPase which is Cytochrome 5, the further they get stretched out, the less electrons. Meaning, the cart drops precipitously. And just so you know, what is the linkage between that? And this is very important for everybody to understand. Every one 1 Å increase, decreases electron calling between those by a factor of 10.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: So any time you’re in blue light, for example, I’ll give you a perfect one for right now. Since we’re talking on Skype, you’re on a computer monitor, you have no protection on your thyroid gland.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You have no protection on your eye. You are creating adrenal fatigue and hypothyroidism as we speak.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And I don’t care how much medicine you take to off-set that. If you do that long enough, it ain’t gonna work. And the functional medicine paradigm says, “NO, if I replace this, I can get you back to normal.” And I’m gonna tell you, epic fail.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Ok. So this is good. I’m learning—I’m learning a lot of new things. I typically do the blue light sunglasses at night to—to lower the cortisol and raise the melatonin at night.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Let me tell you why it’s a bad thing. Do you know, there’s a thing in Physics, when they talk about uh—degrees Kelvin and the color temperature. You know what, uh—when the sun rises in the morning, do you know what the Kelvin is? When it rises, it’s 1800 Kelvin. Right now, what you’re looking at, is 5700 to 6500 kelvin. Here’s where it’s good news. You asked me to call you at noon. Noon central standard time where we both are, that’s when solar light is at 5700 Kelvin. You know what it is around 5 o’clock in—in our CST? It’s 18—I’m sorry—16,000 Kelvin. So here’s the point that I’m trying to make to you. That change in Kelvin adapts over the day. Your pituitary gland via hypothalamic pituitary axis, that’s the rosetta frequency that’s turned on. That’s where circadian comes. That’s the reason why your testosterone is supposed to be  highest at 10 am. But if you do, what I had last night or what you’re doing right now, you’re ruining that. You’re also ruining your—your thyroid because what people don’t realize our thyroid’s exposed. Blue lights penetrate all the way in to the fat layer. That is where actually the arterials are.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: That’s actually a problem. So when you’re inside, I always want people covered up coz I don’t want that effect. Now, when you go outside and you have this exposed, that’s a really good thing. Why? Because 42% of sunlight is your—it’s infrared-A. It’s 42%. You know why? It’s what we talked about before. Cytochrome- C oxidase is the red light Chromophore. Meaning that it works in that window. And here’s the biggest issue—what’s the biggest red light Chromophore that we have in our body? Water.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uhm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And that’s the reason why cells are 99% water by uh—molecular size and what’s—what surrounds the mitochondria? It’s called the minos layer. It’s spelled as M-I-N-O-S.  What surrounds the ATPase’s so it suspends? Water. Do you know there’s very few things thermodynamically in the world that 100% efficiency? But guess what we found in the last two years?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What?

Dr. Jack Kruse: The ATPase when it’s surrounded by exclusions in water, spends at a 100% efficiency. See? That is the stuff that people need to learn in functional medicine—to understand how to optimize people because if you take someone, say who’s an IT worker, who’s 12 hours in the basement of the hospital. You know, inputting data for the hospital and they have, you know, retinal tears, there are RTE in their eyes, they can— their glasses look like coke bottles. And they have all these uhm—different things like adrenal fatigue, hypothyroidism, migraine, headaches. You cannot fix that person with anything in your office until they realize that they are suffering from a light deficiency problem. And that’s the key because that’s the levers that turn on this anterior semiconductor circuit that goes from your retina into your pituitary, and from your pituitary, goes right in to your brainstem to turn all these things on.  And what controls them is the frequencies of light that are in there. See? We are beings of light. And people do not realize this. This is what the science of quantum biology has been teaching us over the last hundred years. But the problem is, if you don’t read it, you don’t realize what’s already been published.  And when I talk to people, people are really surprised to find out that this stuff is actually published like 10 years ago, I was crazy __. Now you can go out and buy books about this and read about it and go, “Wow!” Coz I know when I went to Dental School  and I went to Medical School, I never learned about any of it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So what does it all look like from an application standpoint? Because I’m in trenches seeing about 50 or 60 patients a week and I’m trying to create diet and lifestyle application shift habits to make these— to make the person heal or help them send out their body into an anabolic state? So sunlight— walk me through your routine. What does that look like for you? Daily basis.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well, let me—let me just say this, uh—if you remember the equation I gave you before about ATP for uh—a day?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And food is only one third. Let me ask you a question, just from third grade Math. Does it make more sense to focus in on one third or the two thirds?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Now two thirds, of course. So you’re focusing on—

Dr. Jack Kruse: Two thirds.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The reducing EMF and then getting the sunlight, getting the right exposure.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well, that’s where the 2/3 come from.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And that’s the point. The point is it’s kinda like Dave Ramsey, you know, always go for where the— you know the best thing for the buck is.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And I—I get very frustrated, you know. All my members know my position on this. I don’t think food is important as everybody else does. But the one aspect of food that’s critically important is DHA and it has to come from seafood and it has to be, you know, ordered in SN-2 position coz it has to be paired by medic to get into the central nervous system and get into the peripheral nervous system. And that is what actually controls the central retinal pathway that turns the things on and off at the appropriate times that a functional medicine doctor wants and that an allophatic doctor wants, in fact, the patient wants. They don’t know this. They don’t know the level of complexity uh— that’s present there and it’s really important that we begin to teach people that. So for example, the number one thing I tell everybody the—the best healing in the world uh— for anybody, I don’t care what their disease is to make like the sphinx every morning. What does that mean? Go google a picture of the sphinx, much looking in the direction of the sun. And I want all four extremities grounded. Why? Because when you’re grounded, you have a complete wireless connection. It’s no different than your coffee maker at home. Does it work as well when it’s not grounded? The answer is no. The current is decreased. What do you know about current? Basic Physics. Well, the slower the current, the less the magnetic fluxes. What did we talk about before about the ATPase? We want that __. We want it kicking out as much ATP as it can because the more it kicks off, the less that we eat. That’s the real cause of obesity. It’s not what everybody else believes. So you’re a fat slob. Uh— and you eat too much and you don’t exercise, right? I got news for you. I got pretty damn good data that I actually I ate more and exercise less and lose a 150 pounds and you know, 12 years on now and I still have a 130 pounds of that off.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Now looking at your diet recommendations and in your epi—Epi-Paleo Rx book.  We’ll put links down below so people can access that book. But you really talked about people overemphasizing macronutrients and you want to bring it back to the micronutrients and you really stress and emphasized the DHA for the electron benefits that you mentioned. But the bottom of your peer__ primarily the shellfish, the oysters, the crustaceans. You also emphasize a lot about organ meats, too. Now, those types of foods are gonna be—are gonna promote a lot of insulin sensitivity. Meaning they’re gonna help with insulin resistance. Is that a possible mechanism that help— help you lose a lot of that weight or you—

Dr. Jack Kruse: No.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Put more on the sunlight piece?

Dr. Jack Kruse: What—what people don’t understand in functional medicine, actually in medicine, insulin is a solo hormone. In other words, you can eat carbohydrates at a high level as long you live on the equator. And that’s the reason why the Maasai are able to do what they do and why somebody in Chicago can’t do that. Since Chicago is set at 40—42nd latitude. What’s the power in sunlight?  Are those electrons as power—the photons is powered to do that. At the end of the day, the answer is “No.” And see, the reason why this is really important for people to understand, we are right now in a paradigm that is wanting to blame food and GMO’s and all these. I agree that it’s bad. But it’s not the key source. The key source is the altered light frequencies that we have built into our climate in ways that we don’t even see. Because remember, our camera only allows us to see the center part of the visible spectrum chance. Guess what part we can’t see? UV and IR. That’s what the single, most important for regeneration in our system. Purple and red light which is reason why when you bind it and you see all the pictures—take a look at the picture—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: —on the wall. That’s the brain working at the sun, okay? Look at the colors__This is—this is not just my opinion. These are reminders when I come into a podcast with a guy like you here after what I did last night. I need to go home and get into pool and do the things that I need to do to offset how I killed myself faster last night and have 3 color. Why? Because I know how to recover.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, okay.

Dr. Jack Kruse: I know the prescription to do it. The prescription to do it is to get as__ as possible and a strong sunlight and get cool into the pool while this is going on. I happen to be fortunate. I live in the 28th latitude. Right now, the temperature up is about 90 degrees. You know, even though it’s__. Uh—it’s a beautiful sunny day. Uh—with my skin type, I will be able to probably recover most of my chronocycle about 2 to 3 hours. Now, is there other way to do it? You may know I built a device with one of my co-inventors called the Quantlet. Well, a quantlet even on it’s best day, can only replace about 10% of the joules or centimeter square that sunlight does. So I always tell people nothing can replace sunlight. But if you happen to be, say a neurosurgeon that does 500 cases a year and you rarely get outside, a quantlet is probably a pretty damn good investment. Or if you’re an investor banker works in New York City, you probably need one of these. Why? Because we can turn your radial artery into another eye to deliver more light energy in that optical window to do what? To make that ATPase speed faster.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay. So let’s talk about what your—kind of a day in the life of Dr. Jack Kruse. So forget the fact radio called in for trauma surgery last night. So if you have the ability to wake up, how are you getting all four extremities grounded at the same time? Are you in the water? Are you lying on your back? What does it look like?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah. For me, the simple things I do outside. And I have a place where there’s grass out my front door and the sun comes up right there. Most people who are friends with me on Facebook, I’d usually take a picture of the sunrise and send it to people and show up. I never miss—I miss today which is kinda what pissed me off but uhm—and I usually will slap down, put my hands down. Sometimes I’ll sit uh—in the__ with my hands down and I make just like the sphinx.  And I do that for about anywhere between 5-16 minutes. Uh—it’s easier obviously when I’m in different places like at the beach or in Mexico. But that’s been a routine of mine probably for the last 12 years. And the reason that you wanna do that, you are resetting 2 light signals in your body. Both the Vitamin D cycle  and the Vitamin A cycle. And the Vitamin A cycle happens to be the most important cycle in the morning. Why is this important? Because remember, no matter where you are, except on the equator, you don’t make any vitamin D until UVB sunlight kicks in. Well even in the equator, it’s not present at uh—the AM_

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.

Dr. Jack Kruse: The key thing that’s present there are the most powerful light is usually uh— UVA or more infrared. Uh—it takes about an hour on the equator for it to show up. But where most of us then outside of the tropics, uhm— you don’t make that until a lot later. And people are surprised to hear this. The key frequencies in the morning uhm—is from blue light.  And blue light is good.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.

Dr. Jack Kruse: When it comes to the sun. Because that’s the switch that actually tells the pituitary gland to make all the hormones—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The cortisol ramped up—

Dr. Jack Kruse: Right. We make all the hormones that we secreted between 6 and 10 o’clock. Here’s the interesting part of this that people don’t realize. Do you know what your off switch is for the pituitary gland?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Melatonin.

Dr. Jack Kruse: UVA and UVB light.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Dr. Jack Kruse: When the sunlight hits your skin, what happens? You release nitric oxide, the arterials come to the surface.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh yeah. Of course. Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Guess what it does? It turns off all your sex target hormones. I want you to think about something. The first light you see everyday is your computer or your cellphone. And I already told you that’s 5700 Kelvin. Are you gonna be able to turn on the signal since it never sees 1800 and gradually goes up to 5700? The answer is, “No.” You just told your brain that it’s the middle of the day. You slept all day until it’s noon. You just created a mismatch and you don’t even realize you’re creating this mismatch. And that’s the reason why when people do this 2-3 weeks at time, when functional docs or allophatic docs were—say you’re—all their melatonin, cortisol and your sex target hormones, they’re always flat. And you know, people always talk about like an adrenal fatigue, everybody’s completely crushing low. But what you guys tell people and what I tell people, the reasons why are radically different. And it completely is tied to light cyles and it can only be fixed until you understand the light cycles and how this anterior visual pathway works in the eye. Because the two major reason why we get light in are through the eye, and through the skin. The mechanism are different and the proteins that we used to do it are radically different but the ones we started off talking about this morning, you know, with the sunlight rises is the Vitamin A cycle. Why? Coz anytime blue light comes through the eye, it has low color temperature, it separates retinal from the photo receptor and that separation has to then be recycled. The other thing that happens that turns over DHA in two loops in the retina. One is called the short loop, and one is called the long loop. If the vitamin A cycle is right, short loop completely recycles DHA. That means you don’t need eat a ton of seafood. That’s the reason why people on the equator don’t have a big need for the fish. And if you look at the fish, they’re endogenous on the planet, they’re low DHA sources.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So you’re saying that people —So if you’re saying that people were on the equator, living on the equator but they were still eating refined, kinda junk food diet, you’re saying that they—they would be sidestep obesity if the  EMF—

Dr. Jack Kruse: Correct.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And the UV light is dialed in?

Dr. Jack Kruse: If they have strong light cycles. That’s the reason why we have endo—indigenous peoples who live inside the tropics. Like the perfect one for you to learn about is Maasai.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And also the Hadza. They are able to eat very high carbohydrate diets and the reason why is they live in a strong UV and IR environment. The problem is, all your patients, my patients—no, they never get there. And that’s the reason why we have the false precept that carbohydrates__ they’re not bad. The environment that we are in makes them appear bad. And that perception—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So how are you—go ahead.

Dr. Jack Kruse: is important.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm. So how are you applying this with your patients? Are you seeing these functional medicine patient one-on-one? What kind of clinical results are you getting?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Very good. I mean that’s part of the reason why I came down to the gulf south because you know, down here we’re 50th and 60th uh—in just about everything. And everybody is a train wreck but the cool part is all the—the uh—how shall we say it—the recipe for recovery is built into this environment. Promise you gotta get them clicked in. And I’ll give you a perfect example. Where I am in the gulf south, uh— a hundred years ago, when it was really hot, people would be outside on their porch and—and having cake and doing all these things, what happened over the last 100 years? Now when it gets hot, people come inside, out of the sun and into air conditioner. Well, that means the best time for you to be outside, they’ve been brought inside. What does technology do? Same thing. It has brought us out from outside to inside. So let’s talk about the flipside. What do people on the South do when it’s December? Like when if it’s below 50°, people  here look like they’re dressed for the__ when in reality, what should they be doing? This is the perfect weather. If you ask somebody which is from Chicago, 50° in December, they would be like 2 thumbs up. They’d be like, “I’m all in.” And people don’t realize that your eyes and your skin pay attention to that. And Tristan talk about this, me and you, you have the shirt on, I have the shirt on. We have clothes on—that’s—that’s society’s belief that have been put on us. But let me ask you a question. When you crawled out of the vagina, did you have any clothes on? Stop for a minute and I want you think about Discovery Channel. Do you any animal that comes out of it’s mom’s vagina that has clothes on?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Of course not.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Okay, so let’s think about this. When me and you get together at some point, we plant a tree. You put all the nutrients in the water ground but I put tarp over it. Will that tree live or die?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely won’t live.

Dr. Jack Kruse: So guess what? The first specie ever created was 700,000 years ago didn’t start to wear clothes. Got it?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And so sunlight is incredibly important. You—you made that clear. I think you made some good points on that. And—and what does that look like for you, though, from an exposure time? How do you prevent getting burned and getting all this collagen deterioration from being__all night?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well, I’m not worried about that. That’s a bunch of horse shit, okay?

The bottom line is I’m looking to see for myself on this but I just tell you there’s an app called D-minder that Dr. Robert from Boston University as well.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You can get it down there. What it does? It download your GPS coordinates, where you are, and it tells you precisely how much sunlight you’re getting and how much vitamin D you make. So the easiest way for a novice to learn about their light environment is you know, to download this app and begin to play with it and see how much Vitamin D you can make at your specific location, your altitude. Because what people don’t realize the three variables for Vitamin D function are latitude, altitude and population. That’s—population density is the one that most people don’t understand. The more you live around the other idiots, the more you get dehydrated coz they’re all using non- negative devices. And the reason why this is an important thing and why you see me here drinking my green valley mountain water is the isomerization step of vitamin D3 that occurs in your skin, requires you not to be dehydrated; otherwise, your cholesterol will be really high and your vitamin D3 conversion will be low. And that pretty much describes just about everything with diabetes and metabolic syndrome. In fact, I think the epidemic uh—in most patients with lipids is tied to this factor and anybody who then says well giving them the statin makes any sense. What does a statin do? It actually increases the respiratory protein distance and we already talked about what that’s a bad idea. What is the link between Cytochrome 3 and Cytochrome 1? For your listeners who don’t know. It’s called Coenzyme Q10.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Coenzyme Q10 ferries electrons between those cycles. So if you’re stretching them out, are you making Cytochrome C more happy to make more ATP or less happy? It—and see, this is what I’m saying, when you understand how the system is wo—how the system is built, you begin to start to go, “Yeah, why are we doing some of these?” This doesn’t make any sense but the key factor, the reason why it continued—we continue to miss health and functional medicine, allophatic medicine, is because we’re focused on food and not on light. And that’s the key problem because that 2/3, 1/3 thing. And allow me to make one of the point, Justin, while we’re here. This is very important.  For those people who don’t get science, let’s give you another analogy to understand it from say, a car. If you and I went out and spent $250,000 and you bought a Ferrari, pulled all the money together, does it make more sense to focus on the fuel? Like should we put 87 in, 90 or 93 octane? Or does it make more sense to make sure that me and you spend our money, tune in the engine up so that we go 200-220 miles an hour all the time? See that’s the difference between functional medicine and the mitochondria. And I’m with the mitochondria. 30:08 And I’m the mitochondria. You guys focusing on food.  I don’t even wanna talk about food. The only time I wanna talk about food is when we talk about electrons and protons because the input in mitochondria is electron chain transport. It’s not called protein transport. It’s not called carbohydrate transport. It’s not called fat transport. And until you come to my level, I refuse to go to anyone else’s level because nature has built this into us. It’s there. We know about it but we ignore it. Why? Because the science is too hard for some people. Well, I’m sorry. It’s our job to understand how these things fit together. Until we give people the truth, not the half-truth, we’re gonna continue to struggle. And I look at it like this. All—everybody is a practitioner. We’re all in these together; we all wanna do the right thing, but we all gotta start focusing now. You go to your next functional medicine uh—talk, I hope you get on the microphone and you say, “Hey, let’s think about this. How can this one there, you know, be a provocateur?” Uhm— because they’re not. Until people start talking about these things, we’re not gonna change anything,  Justin. And to be honest with you, that’s why I do podcast. That’s the reason why I go out and talk to people. Because I want them to understand: A. Am I Crazy? Or maybe do I have some interesting perspectives that people haven’t thought about? And then B. I wanna direct you to things that are published and books that are written that surely did— maybe this is something that we have missed. Maybe we’ve been stepping on the stone at the 6th level instead of going to the 1st level. Maybe that’s the reason why people still wanna give Rhodiola for adrenal fatigue because that’s not gonna work until you fix your environment. And I always told functional guys, Rhodiola works because they have excited electrons from the damn cell. That’s the only reason it works.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So we create a checklist here so the patient’s, people listening have that checklist to optimize their light exposure. What does that look like? So we get up, we see the sun rise, we get all four extremities with the view of the sphinx as you said, right? We dial that in, we get— what’s the exposure amount look like? And we just try to get in the morning? What does the rest of they look like? Can you go to your daily routine?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well, I would go to my daily routine but remember, my routine is based on my N=1 and that is why __. And as practitioner, you have to start to realize that what you gonna recommend to one person is not the other person. What—what are the variants? A.  What diseases they have? How bad is their mitochondria? What’s their heteroplasmy rate? What’s their appetite look like?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: What’s their job? Uh—what are you—what’s the goals? There’s a lot of different variables but for me, I’d give you a perfect example. I know as my day job as a neurosurgeon is my single biggest risk. So for example, days that I am in surgery, I spend more time in the sun than I would in days that I’m in clinic.  Anytime that I have a chance when I’m clinic to go outside, I tend to go outside as much as I can. So lot of people would call that coffee or smoke break, I call it the sun break. Even if you get 5 or 10 minutes at that time, it’s a help. Anytime you’re out in nature, it’s a help. So the answer is try to do it. Uhm—anytime that you can be connected, for example—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Are you worried about getting burned, too, though? Like—

Dr. Jack Kruse: No. Not me. And you can see that I’m Irish and I have freckles. Uhm—

10-12 years ago, I would be out on the sun at night, get burned pretty quick uh—but I built up a solar callus. Why did I built up a solar callus? Let me explain something to you uh—and you’re probably interested in this. The two diseases that you know very. One is psoriasis and one is type B diabetes.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You know it’s common to both diseases? The skin gets thicker.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And you know why the skin gets thicker? Because the skin is looking for more sunlight. People who are diabetic usually are designed to be in a strong UV environment. That’s the reason why. They eat carbohydrates. Carbohydrates will actually thicken your skin. Turns out in psoriasis, a lack of UV light thickens the basal level. That’s the reason why Dermatology use 312 megameter light to shrink that well and plaques go away. That’s what the plaque is, it’s thickened at high internal rates almost like a pre-cancer state. If you look into the science of psoriasis, you should see everybody who has psoriasis, they’ll tell you it’s pre-malignant state. You—you’ve risk factors for all the cancers. Why is that? Coz you’re not near the regenerative uhm—light sources which is UV and IR light. So what’s the answer? You just have to go outside. Coz guess what? The shit outside is free.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: How long does it take you to build that tolerance so that you can get that to work out?

Dr. Jack Kruse: It took me—It took me about 2 to 3 years. But did I know what I was doing when I started? No. Because all the variables that I just told you, I didn’t really realize how important they are. Now I do. Now, you know, I have a__, my uh—heteroplasmy rate I got it pretty dialed in coz I did a biohack for about 12 years. On average, I would say in the winter time I need about 1½ to 2 hours; In the summer time, I usually go 3-5 hours per day.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: In the sun? And you’re doing no sunscreen at all?

Dr. Jack Kruse: There’s no freakin’ chance that I would ever wear that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And you’re not at all either?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well if I get burned, if I get red, I have no problem. The next day, I come out and I look like uh—the way sun is designed to work. This is probably a good thing for people to hear. You’re designed to absorb all the UV frequencies in your melanin. So my freckles hold the UV light. That’s where all the excited electrons are. At night time is when you off load this into your system. So you noticed if you hang out with me for 3-4 hours, say now and the__, the next morning when you saw me, I wouldn’t be as pink. And why? Because I’ve off-loaded those things into my cellular structure. See the problem is you have to think about yourselves kinda like plant. When it’s really thirsty for water, that is gonna be delivered to places where you need it the most. So think about for your skin. Most people have their arms exposed, they don’t have their belly or their legs or other thins exposed. So those parts of your body are starved—absolutely starved for light. So if you’re smart, you start looking at, “Okay, what do I always have covered all the time? Those are the parts that I nee to uncover and get out there.” And what you do is slowly build up your solar callus. You do this through what I call, mitoact. You start to figure out empirically how your system is optimized. There’s no different than looking at the dashboard of your car, figure out, “Okay, look. My temperature’s too high. I need more gas. I need to use that.” The thing is we’re not teaching the people in allophatic medicine or in functional medicine. And if you go to one of my blogs called the redox rx wall. I give you 30 different labs that link directly to redox and  I told you how those things are linked to redox. So you read this and you start looking at your labs and you start, “Okay, I’m gonna start doing this. Let me see how these things go up and down. And when people really see how it really goes and when they start to become—what I’ve been calling—more connected with nature, in other words, you reconnect with nature. You—your wireless relationship to the sun and your complete connection  to the earth through your feet or through leather su—sole—shoes. This is something you can’t miss. And if you don’t fix this, I don’t care what your idea in a clinic, it ain’t gonna work.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it. So with the glasses—you’re wearing those glasses all day long. Is that correct? Not just the night?

Dr. Jack Kruse: I’m wearing these glasses anytime I’m inside.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Inside.

Dr. Jack Kruse: In this light day. You’re making me look—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hahaha—

Dr. Jack Kruse: You know that I didn’t have these on when we first started talking.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: No. You’re in the car and the sunroof opening you. You can get exposure. Totally.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Exactly. And that’s the point. And the thing is, one of the things in functional medicine that I think I can take a lead on because it’s not talked about enough is that we need to wear protection from blue light during the day when we’re inside.  We really do because people don’t understand that circadian variation occurs. That’s why I wanted you to understand. There’s 1800 Kelvin all the way to 16,000 Kelvin. Computer screens are optimized. Most computer screens between 5700 and 6500 globally by technology companies. So the safe—you’re working all day. And say for 10 hours-12 hours seeing patient, that means you’re getting a complete solar signal for noon the whole day. What do you think that does with your central retinal pathway? What do you think that does to your HP axis? What do you think that does to your brain cell? And then—then you wonder why people are coming in to you are zombies and they’re trash. The problem is selling the pills and herbs aren’t gonna fix that problem. That’s like—I had a saying that—that I get in trouble with with someone. It’s like pissin’ in the wind.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Haha— Yeah. I totally understand what you’re saying. Just so I understand your routine, 1-2 hours in the winter, your 3 to 5 hours in the summer.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Correct. Like today, I can tell you. When I get done with you, it’s gonna be a lot because we don’t get—just because of what happened to me yesterday, I will increase it and I’m gonna use something called the__. How am I gonna get more sunlight because it’s already 1 o’clock. I’m gonna get in the pool and stay in the pool and keep it. Top half in the sun, then I’m gonna reverse it. I’m gonna put my head in the water, a lot of my top body out. The reason why is I’m creating a bigger circuit so I can move current more from my body. And I’ll do that this afternoon to offset what I did last night. Because last night I killed myself faster and that’s why I told people that are talking to me, “Health is the slowest form of death we create.”

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it. So you’re not worried about any collagen degradation or any skin cancer at all with the sun exposure? You feel like you’re doing it in a way you’re not burning per se, you’re and where you’re building up that solar uh—what’s that? What’s the word?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Solar callus.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Sollar callus. The melanin exposure. Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well, it’s just—it’s normally that. It’s also your skin thickness becomes optimized. The thing—the thing that becomes interesting it means to you, you realize what your optimal amount of sunlight is per day. And it’s pretty easy to figure out within 4-6 weeks. The real problem that most people are gonna find if they live in the 42nd or the 50th latitude, they’re gonna realize that is a problem. Like for example, that’s the reason why people have that vast number of big problem and the reason why is they live in the wrong latitude. Because their mitochondria is not optimized for those—for that latitude. And it’s magic when they go south. Well, here’s the problem. Telling people about—MS, like you know, there’s a functional allophatic medicine doctors pretty famous in Iowa State, you know, Terry Wahls

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: She tells everybody to__ And I just scoff at it. And if she was so right, you know, she’s got her MS better coz she’s doing well. Is she reversed,yeah? No. She’s not. And you know why? You know where Iowa is? The 42nd latitude.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You wanna get better? Guess what? Go down in__. You wanna do better? Go down to Ecuador.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Now how much would that has to do with Vitamin D as well? Because we know there’s a big correlation with vitamin D. So if you are at the higher latitude, what can you do? Can you supplement Vitamin D? What kind of light could you put in your house?

Dr. Jack Kruse: No. The question about supplementing sunlight, I have a blog it’s called Time 11. It’s—the title of it says 10 Supplement Sunlight. The answer is no because when you give somebody a supplement, what did you just do? You learned it in—in school that we are a series of negative an positive feedback control so when you design to mix something in the body and you take an exogenous source, you completely uncouple that system. You actually make it worse.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But if someone is that environment, what can they do?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Change. Change the way they think about it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Are you saying move change? Or—

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well move or go up to a higher altitude, like for example, I have a member who I’ll share one of things he did. He lived in uh—Seattle. And he knew that he had these big problems becomes huge__he’s got all__. What did he find? He found that if he went to end Oregon because it’s out uh—5000 feet elevation.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: People don’t realize when you go about 5000 feet, you can actually raise your vitamin D levels even if you’re at a higher latitude. That’s the reason why the Swiss uh—do so well in Swiss Alps. Yet people in Finland in Helsinki are—have record rates of autoimmunity, diabetes and obesity. And that’s the reason why. Now, the other reason effect, they have big effect  for the United States, is population. So if you happen to live in a very popular state, I don’t care if you’re naked outside on Rodeo Drive in Los Angeles outside, Jack R. Stan speak in San Diego and Los Angeles. You’re not gonna raise your Vitamin D. I talk to functional docs all the time like try to know what I can understand. These people live in San Diego, they live in Los Angeles and I check their Vitamin D and they’re at 31. I put them on 20,000 a day with you know, 5 milligrams of K2. They come back and they’re at 38. He goes—they just don’t understand why. That’s what __ out a little dehydrated. And the reason why? I __ being in crap relations. Just do a regular chem 7 and—and—and variably you’ll see they’re over 15:1. And I explain to people the reason why? The isomerization step is—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup.

Dr. Jack Kruse: It needs water to make Vitamin D. And people don’t understand this. So when I hear people default straight to the vitamin D thing, it’s either they  have to make the Mercedes aim it, or they’re trying to get people on a program. That’s not the answer. And the thing is we’re gonna make those people worse if we just throw Vitamin D down the__ Now, we need a flip side. Since I’m a surgeon, I’m trying to deal with these issues on a much more acute basis and If I can raise somebody’s redox potential by utilizing these things during that timeframe, those are the times that I’ll use it. But what do I always make sure to tell the person? We’re gonna do this in the __period but then you’re gonna change.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So what kind of case studies do you have? You have patients that you’ve seen that you’re doing—making these clinical changes with? Adding these different protocols and what kind of clinical outcomes are you seeing? And also, what if people are doing these things they’re not getting better? What do you look for next?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well that’s when you—that’s when you have to become a biohacker of the environment. In other words, there’s something in the environment that your—that you don’t see. See, here’s the big—the big risk for most people. Non-native EMF, see your mitochondria is essential that’s connected to all the way forms in your environment. Non-native EMF, you can’t see, sense, taste or touch, but your mitochondria does because of that oscillation I told you earlier. So the key is that’s when you have to start buy gear. For example, you know that none of us can see–uh—uh—uh—X radiation. And none of us can see uhm—uhm—radiation decay. But if you had a guided__ you can see it. Well there’s this thing called the trimeter. There’s a thing gauss meter. That’s why guys like my—the friend I told you about from Seattle. I teach him how to __and biohack our environment. When they do that, then they find their problem pretty damn fast. And they’re like, “Whoa!” I mean I had people literally did not even realize that we’re—there uhm—their power source coming into our house is right where they sleep. I said, “Okay, well if you’re not gonna change it, what you need to do is have the electrician out put a kill switch to kill.” If you got some time, I got a great story of one of my members in New York City. This—this will blow your mind.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I wanna hear it. I’m gonna grab my Tri-field meter real quick, hold on. So this is the one you’re referring to, right? The Tri-field meter?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And how are you using this? How are you applying it to look at EMF sources?

Dr. Jack Kruse: The one other big one is probably the most important one especially for the coming 5G explosion is gonna be a Cornet 88F. RF—RF radiation is horrible.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Almost anything that uses uh—pulse electro magnetic frequency, PMF, you know—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup.

Dr. Jack Kruse: It’s talked about all the time.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: I’m not a big fan of anything that uses PDMF.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You don’t like it, huh?

Dr. Jack Kruse: No. It has to be understood. I like it but it has to be understood. And most people who are prescribing me things don’t really understand truly what they’re doing to people who have these problems. So—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: The easiest way to—to really understand your environment is when you see these bad signals, you do something about it. So one of my members who happens to be a laser physicist, him and his wife, they own a company that sells fiber optics in the city of New York, okay? 3 out of 5__ they have the contract for that. Verizon has the other two. So I have a thing on my website called the EMF boot camp. We’re teaching you basics of how to hack your environment, you know, with these devices and I hired an electrical engineer for everybody to learn. So he bought a house in Brooklyn and he tested it and it tested pretty well for this area, so he bought it. And he lived there for 2 or 3 years and he noticed about 2—I think it’s 2 ½ years he told me—that 6 out of 8 of his neighbors came down with cancer. And he was like, “This is crazy. I wonder why this happened?” So he’s got two sons and you know I told you that him and his wife are both laser physicist. They do a lot in fiber optics. The kids started playing around with his gauss meter. And his gauss meter, imagine this is magnetic field—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: The kids came in and told this person that uh—“Dad, you need to look at this.” And it was red light. It was over 2,000gauss

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Wow.

Dr. Jack Kruse: So him and his brother put painter’s tape. You know that blue tape everywhere in the living room. The center of the living room is where the biggest field is coming. They trace it up into the wall, up into the ceiling, and they knocked the holding ceiling to look and it turns out the gas line and the water line were there. They follow it all the way right the street. Now I told you this guy has got a really big company. So he’s got a construction on. He follows it out with a plumbing system all the way to a tree. And the tree, right outside, like the big maple tree you have in New York City. And what did he find? The roots of the tree grew into the___lines. And the reason he always saw the magnetic field is the electric field is dissipated by the ground. So he had just an isolated magnetic field and he knew exactly what the cause was. And he went to all the different places on the block and found that the gauss meter was off the charts in those places as well.

So here’s the point, he tested it. If you can’t assume that how it is today, it’s gonna be how it is next week especially when you have those idiots outside your window putting the new fire G cables in or putting direct TV on your neighbor’s house. Putting the smart meter in your neighborhood—and that’s the mistake that most people make. It’s the biggest mistake that I think allophatic doctors and functional medicine doctors don’t realize. They don’t realize the number one question that you should ask as soon as somebody comes in, “Tell me about your environment.” And when they tell me, I wanna know how they know. Do they have these devices? They understand how to use them? And do they need to be doing it? I—I told people it’s kinda like carbon monoxide sensory house. You should go around with these devices once a month in your environment and never assume anything.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So what does that look like? We get one of these meters maybe a try feel. What are the key meters everyone should have at home to test these things?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well i—instead of wasting our time talking about that. I will tell you, this guy that I told you, in Seattle.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: His name is__. He wrote a guest log about his experience.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: In the side stair, I list all the meters that everybody should consider. It has amazon links to all of them. And you can learn about them and pull them up. So I don’t want people going out and spending money on things that really is a waste. I want them to start the simple thing. So for example, a tri-meter is relatively cheap.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And the Cornet meter, the RF meter’s also pretty cheap. I think those are the two.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: That people will start with. But then I think you need depending on your environment, for example, if you live in city, you absolutely need a __50:22. You absolutely have to have it. Uh—if you live in the downtown area, there’s no question, you need to have it. But then, there’s other effects and the effects uhmm—in fact I just wrote about this. I wrote at ALS blog because the upcoming NFL draft.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: I did it uh—because there’s a couple of players in this draft that have significant soft tissue injuries. One of them is named uhm—Marshon Lattimore, from Ohio State, best quarterback in the draft. He’s missed two uh—seasons at Ohio State. But he’s back in at 42nd latitude in Columbus.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh. Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And see, everybody he has surgery to fix it, the kid’s a phenomenal player but if I was the Chicago Bears, if I was leaning at Patriots, I wouldn’t draft this guy. Now if I was a Jacksonville Jaguars or say the San Diego Chargers, he’d be much harm on my list. Why? Because I understand that he needs to be on a much higher light environment. Best place for him is probably Miami. Now, does anybody in the NFL understand—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: — this garbage. No. And why did these players develop neurodegeneration when they’re 40, 50, and 60 years old? That’s what the link is what I just told you.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So you’re saying more melanin in the skin is gonna decrease theUV absorption essentially?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Right. Where did blacks can come from? From the equator.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: My friend__

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. Natural sunblock.

Dr. Jack Kruse: That’s the reason why when you said to me earlier. The shade is one way to do it. But how to make you do it? It make dark skin first. Why?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Coz that’s where we evolve. We evolve in East Africa West, okay? White guys like me and you.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: We came much later when we went to higher latitudes. And that’s where SNP’s came from, that’s where heteroplasmy rate change. Remember there’s an equatorial DNA but there’s all these other DNA’s for our mitochondria that are altered based on where we live. What is the key drive?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And what test are you running for the uhm—for the SNP’s? Is that the 23andMe and what are you testing?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well the 23andMe is one thing you do but just now there’s now SNP testing that you can order for Genova.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And some of the other functional places to figure it out. But the key thing that I wanna know is I wanna assess somebody’s redox potential almost as soon as they come in. Why is it their redox potential? What am I saying—I’m saying that amount of net negative charge in the body. So how could somebody simply do that? You have a body voltage meter. You could tell that way. I think there’s an easier way.  How can I look at that labs. That’s why I told you earlier when we talk, read my redox rx. There’s 30 different labs there that tell you how we all link into it. Are some of them simple, Justin? Yeah. You know what, one of the simplest ones are? Next time you talk to somebody look at their teeth. Look at the color of their teeth. If their teeth are naturally white, that’s a pretty good sign that redox potential is good. If their teeth are yellow, guess what? Their redox potential is not as good as what they think. And the reason why? Dentin and one is uh—both of them are floor for proteins. They __when their body, when the cells are emitting specific frequencies of light. They’re on the blog on that, too. Remember what you asked me, “Jack, you used to be a neurosurgeon” See? This stuff, every place you look, you can find an answer but the problem is—and I would say this, Justin, and I say this, it’s really important. Humans are really good at seeing but they suck at observation.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And—and let me tell you something. What makes you a really good doctor, what makes you a really good scientist is the people that observe nature very carefully and don’t put their precepts, their beliefs, their dogma on the observations they see. And one of the biggest problems I think that I see in modern science is that we have allowed dogma, beliefs and paradigms to affect the way the study is done. For example, you know how there’s this big thing right now in nutrition where there is a fight between the low carb and the high fat  people and all those nonsense. You know where all our ideas came from? From metabolic studies that were done 1940’s and 50’s that we can read about in many books. Let me ask you a question, Justin. Where are metabolic studies done?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well they’re don in the hospital, inside. There’s obviously gonna be—

Dr. Jack Kruse: On the blue light?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: On the blue light, okay? Now you open up Albus__ or Western A Price’s book. You know, Western uh—diseases of civilization.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s all in the environment.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And just for disease, see these guys that look like the Donna__ 70 years old.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You know what the difference is my friend?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What’s outside—

Dr. Jack Kruse: They’re in the natural environment. And we __ and we think that’s the same. And it—it’s that simple. Remember, when we talk about earlier about the tree. I said to you, “Would the tree grow with the top covered?” And you got it immediately.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Hopefully the people listening just got it. Well, what am I saying to you? The beliefs that we have in nutrition, I don’t believe anything that’s published in nutrition today. Why? Coz it’s never been studied the right way.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So how are you applying it? How are you eating? So walk me through that. I know you mention as a matter as much. So give me the run down, right  now. It’s gonna be—

Dr. Jack Kruse: First, simple—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Spring, summer—more carbs now?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah. Yeah. And it’s very simple.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What  is breakfast like?
Dr. Jack Kruse: Eat what grows in your environment. Eat what grows in your environment. Let me explain this to you coz this is so important.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: What is the entire food that this planet is built on, my friend? It’s called


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Okay. The entire food web. That means when you talk about food, you need to understand light. So can you eat a pineapple uh—in_ Gourmet right now? The answer is, “Yeah, you can.” You go to whole foods and get it. But what is interesting about that? The answer is, “No.” You can’t do that coz it never grows. Therefore, when you’re a stupid, idiot that feeds the pineapple at the 4th latitude, even in May, you’ve created a mismatch. You’ve created a gut problem. You’ve created a mitochondrial problem.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And you don’t think it’s a big deal. Why? Coz you don’t understand how photosynthesis links to those electrons. So you’re at the ground state and this state and what is your body designed to do? Capture that. Well, if you do that, your respiratory proteins are stretched out, you can’t capture that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So what does that look like for you? So you’re saying lower carb, higher fat?

Dr. Jack Kruse: I’m not saying that at all.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Dr. Jack Kruse: I’m saying your environment dictates what you eat.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So let’s go for some of the examples. Go ahead, yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: For example, I’m not—uh—say in December, gonna eat kumquats. I’m not gonna eat pineapple.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: I’m not gonna eat coconut. I happen to live at a latitude where those things are—are present. 28th latitude is the most that you can get. Uhm—so what I usually do in the winter time, I’m just like the—I’m going to be uh—ketotic and I’m gonna drink more water and gonna be more connected to cold and the light environment around me. So I’m gonna be pretty naked a—a lot of the year.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Nice.

Dr. Jack Kruse: With my shoes off in the backyard when it’s like 30° and 50° here. Now what happens in the summer time? In the summer time, all—my carbs increase all the way up to June 21st. Why? That’s the summer equivalence.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: When do they start to decline? From that time—the time that I eat no carbs, the only time I eat no carbs is for about two weeks before and after December 21st.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it. So right now, you’re  on higher carb cycling?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Correct.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay. Good. Higher carb right now and then fat—is that pretty high as well?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Uh—I wouldn’t say pretty high coz you know you don’t need a ton of fat in the summer time when you live in 28th latitude. Remember what I told you before about the Maasai? Got it?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: It—it’s—it’s that why I said, the paradigm that you believe in and I’m glad that when your non verbal communication talking to me is very interesting coz when I say something, I know that you’re like, “Man, I don’t know If I’m buying that.” That’s—that’s the belief system that he got.  He have to realize that when you understand what I’m saying, this seasonal approach, it is linked to photosynthesis. And every place on this planet, it is tied to that. Just—you have to change that system doesn’t mean we can do it. You know, it is like we can do it but should we do it? That’s the asked question we ask people. And that’s not the question that most people do.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So how do you tie in cold? How you cut tie in the cold thermogenesis with the sun and with the—with the UV? Like how do you package this all together?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah. I’ll try to make it as simple for you as possible. The easiest way is to understand what this cold do. It condenses the respiratory proteins so that means it bring it  closer together. Anytime they come closer together it makes electron toning easier. So eve in if you have fewer electrons, or fewer higher power electrons, the fact that they are closer, they are more energy-efficient. So can you be more energy-efficient doing it? Yes and it turns out when you’re energy-efficient closer together, that means you release more free heat. When you release more free heat from mitochondria, what does that do to the water around it? It heats it up. What happens to water when it’s heated? It shrinks. That’s how the respiratory proteins come together. You don’t put water and stick them in your fridge. Right now, what will happen in two hours?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: It flows because water is different than just about any other liquid in this planet. Thermodynamically, it expands when it cools and it shrinks when it’s heated. But we don’t realize the best huge reason why the mitochondria recede. Then I want you to look at something else, Justin. I want you to think about this. What is the basic plan for uhm—for photosynthesis? CO2 + water and sunlight makes sugar.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You know what the mitochondria does? It reverses that equation. It takes glucose, makes CO2 and makes water.  How do you like that?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Both of them are endosymbiotic bacteria that we have figured out. IN other words, this is the yin and this is the yang.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: So a mitochondria can only work and this is working right. So let’s go back to your original question. You want to jump straight to every functional doctors and I said, “I’m not letting you do it.”

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hahaha—

Dr. Jack Kruse: It’s the biggest mistake you all make—everytime. And you need to understand why my perspective is what it is and when you do, you start go get all, “Hmm.” So for example, I’ll give you another good one. I don’t know where you’re located but just—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I’m in Austin, Texas. Somewhere in the nice, lower latitude.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah. You’re close to me as well.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Are you in Nashville or New Orleans?

Dr. Jack Kruse: I’m in New Orleans.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: New Orleans. Okay. New Orleans. So uh—the issue—the issue is if you live in Austin, say you’re a computer programmer and you’re inside in the blue light all day. So you’re giving yourself a chronic summer time signal, okay. And say you eat carbohydrates 24/7. What do you think the result will be? You’re gonna get just about every disease  on the planet. What the problem is that we believe the food is what caused it. What we don’t realize is that the blue light is what really cause all the changes and it stretched out the respiratory proteins because of the mitochondrial work. So when you give somebody prescription who does that—ketosis. It helps things. And what does ketosis do? It t__things down a little bit not enough. And those people staying in ketosis diet kinda ketosis is a bad thing to be in because you never get autophagy.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: In other words you never get to recycle your new mitochondria. The key thing with our bodies—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: How about if you eat and fast, though. If you combine some minimum fasting in there, couldn’t you increase the autophagy?

Dr. Jack Kruse: __the key things to do. But what happens like when you follow my leptin reset.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: What you will find is people who have to eat like six times a day, wind up finding out that in 6 weeks, they can eat 3x a day and then eventually when they do long enough, you’re only gonna eat once a day. I only need once a day. That’s it. And it’s usually at the 4-6 window, okay? Now in the beginning, when I started all these, I didn’t have to do it. I had to do it differently. Why?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Because my Ferrari was a Nissan Central blowing black smoke.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it.

Dr. Jack Kruse: See how the pieces fit together?  They’re all dynamic and you know, I think in both our paradigm, see how we’re trained is we don’t realize that it’s that dynamic. You know, we think it’s more static and I think it makes more sense to our brain to think about that way coz it’s easier to understand but I don’t buy that. And I don’t buy that now because I become a mitochondria. I become that person that is understanding nature through that organelle and that organelle was the key to making understanding food differently because  I began to look at food in terms of chlorophyll A and chlorophyll B. In terms of an exciton, what an exciton is, how it’s made, how seed get its basic energy. Food is basically light energy. It’s no different in that the key to deciphering I think to understand, we need the resetic code. And that resetic code is built into the latitude, altitude and population that is where we are. That—that is actually how the food chain is optimized for this planet. That’s the reason why people around the equator can eat a much higher carbohydrate diet and not get any problems with it. It’s also the reason why the Inuit diet primed in1950 is highly ketotic because they were never around, UVA or UVB light except for 3-4 months out of a year.  So most people don’t realize that vitamin D foods, there’s only two. It’s uh—its’ seafood and mushrooms. Well guess what? That’s a big staple that made in the Inuit diet. But to get the vitamin D you need, you gotta eat the eyeballs and you gotta eat the skin of the fish. Well the Inuit do that. That’s the reason why they’re the indigenous people that did well.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So when you’re eating at 4 pm at 4 PM to 6 PM window, are you still getting adequate calories during that two-hour time period? And I know it’s not what you’re eating—

Dr. Jack Kruse: I’m trying to think what I eat for dinner last night. Uhm—Oh, I know what I had. I had a—I had beets that were baked and I took the uh—you know the greens off the least—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And—and cook them in uh—butter. Put some—some uh—spices like I think I put basil, oregano, salt and pepper and turmeric. And I had sausages, pork sausages. Uhm—and pork is much bigger part of my diet time of year because you need the cysteine content because of sunlight. And if you wanna know why I’m not gonna give in to it, I got a blog called energyandepigenetics12, cysteine is the rarest amino acid. It’s the one that glutathione is made out of.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Huge. Yup.

Dr. Jack Kruse. So you have to know that when you live in a strong solar environment, you wanna have a little bit more sulfur in your diet. And—and it turns out that sulfur—sulfate cholesterol, sulfate in vitamin D3 is the key to high solar environment and turns the skin thickness, you know, it goes back to the solar callus that you and I talked about.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You know in the past, all these stuff is yoke together.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And I think people do vitamin or do some UV exposure and made it kinda like chronic uhm—hemochromatosis. The elevated iron levels, very high ferratin 3-400 levels and they’ve seen their ferritin levels drop. Do you see that as well clinically?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah. I mean you can see a variety of different things but here’s the funny thing. If you really, really pay attention—This to me is one of the most interesting things that happened in the last 2-3 years. Well hospitals are now starting to look at zip codes.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uhm.

Dr. Jack Kruse: In terms of diagnosis codes, so we in medicine are now seeing some very interesting trends. There were certain diseases tend to show up more in certain zip codes and no one in epidemia kinda knows why and I think I kinda figure it out that it has to do with the local environment. The non-native EMF in different environments is highly variable. So say when you’re using first and I just said before, you may find one person have from one part of town have a very variable response compared to somebody else. And you’re gonna say, “Oh, wait a minute, I’m at uh—28 latitude, it shouldn’t be like this.” Well I’ll give you, for example, I happen to have a friend who lives in Austin, who lives around that _ place and he just recently moved somewhere else. His results have been—radically different. In the nude part of Austin__ I told him I give him a couple of ideas to what to check out. He winded buying uh—an acoustimeter and he wound up buying uh—buying a flicker uh—uh monitor and he found out that the lights in his new neighborhood at night time had a much higher flicker effect and that was the cause of his problems. Actually  the simple thing is when we go out at night, make sure most of your skin is covered and make sure your eyes are protected. And flicker is really hard to protect yourself from. I told them because you move from the low flick environment to a high flick environment, and he found out that Austin had just changed the lights and the street in his neighborhood like three months before he was there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it. Interesting. And what do you think about UV and thyroid? Is there any specific dose of UV—good. So let’s hear it.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well hypothyroid—hypothyroidism is uh—is absolutely deficiency.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: How does it affect reverse T3, though, and our T3 and the deactivation of the thyroid?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Reverse T3 is leptin resistant. Remember what I told you about the semi conductive circuit. The retina, SCN and leptin receptor. It’s gotta work properly. You turn the sun, once the leptin receptor is properly turned on, you don’t make any reverse T3. Everything goes T3. Because what is T3? It’s thermogenic and makes—and releases heat from the mitochondria than shrinks water.  All—all these things I gave you already. It’s all there. The key thing is when the semi conductive circuit’s broken, that’s what causes disrupt and that’s why reverse T3 goes up and that’s why the  optic resistance functionally is a light-mediated problem.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Now I also heard you talk about leptin resistance from using

 hCG to modulate leptin resistance as well.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You can. And that—that is one of things I did a long time ago before I realize  how the physics of  the organism truly works.  And I called that one of my you know, seminal biohacks to figure out.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Why this work. Because you know, most allophatic doctors I’ll be the first one to be honest with you—I thought 15 years ago,  that hCG  was a bunch of horse shit.  And then when I started to learn about this intricate brain circuits, I started to realize, actually, there is a role for this. And actually is uncovering—actually how this whole system really works. And the problem is I think the practitioners at UJCG don’t realize that it’s—it’s kinda like rhodiola for adrenal fatigue. It works while you use it but as soon as you take__ you don’t realize that you have to have the light change with it. It’s an epic fail. It’s great for clinicians.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Coz it’s like uh—it’s what I called uh—Uhm—but you cannot sustain weight loss using hCG until you fix the light environment that makes it—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So you gotta get the light and the EMF dialed in. That totally makes sense. And then you mention some stuff about the MFL a little bit earlier. What’s your take on this uh– TCE the Traumatic Chronic Encephalopathy—the Will Smith movie.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What’s your take on that as a neurosurgeon? What  do you see coming into your clinic? And would you let your kid play football?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Read my card wall. It says all. The implications—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We’ll link to it. What’s the reader’s digest version, though?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Readers digest version: Anything that disrupts electron change transport mitochondria is something you need to stay away from. And what happens is this kid started off when they’re younger and you have to realize the more damage they have when they’re younger, the worst it is when they get older. Uhm—in terms of what I let my kids play, uh—knowing what I know now, No. I wouldn’t let them play soccer, I wouldn’t let them play hokey, I wouldn’t let them play football. Uh—but I would let them play—like if they didn’t play when they were younger and they wanted to play like uh, say late in high school or college, I personally think that’s the reason why if you think about—coz you know we got the NFL draft last week. It’s kinda some interesting thing. I looked at it like this kid from Washington University. I want you to think about this is gonna be really interesting for you. You know, John Ross ran the fastest 40—He run 40.20 but when he run it, he actually pulled uh_ and he didn’t run the second one. He was inside the RCA Dome in Indianapolis under Xeon blue light that was not run by a DCA converter. It was run by the AC current. So he was set up that the flicker effect of those lights are ridiculous. But he still run that time. I told you, if you can run that fast, your redox is good. But I want you to think about where he originally lived. He lived in Los Angeles.  He used to plant Snoop Dogg’s uh team when he was a young kid. And Snoop Dog said, “This kid was the faster kid ever.” So I want you to think. Now, when he went to Washington at the 45th latitude, that’s where he went—the University of Washington. He tore ACL’s and they repair them and obviously he’s doing pretty good. Uhm—but if you’re in NFL asking me the question you just asked, would you draft John Ross knowing that he’s gonna have a 10 or 15 year career? The answer is, “No, I would not.” But will he be good the first 5 years of his career? The answer is, “Yes.” If you have to beat the Seattle Seahawks, the New England Patriots, the answer is, “No” because they played at a high latitude. If you were the Miami Dolphins, the Tennessee Titans, the Houston Texans, the San Diego Chargers, my answer would be, “Yes.” Now I’m gonna tell you why I said that, when you get off this podcast, I want you to open up the google box.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse:  And look at the top 20 rushers in the NFL history, you know what you’re gonna notice about 19 out of 20?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Throughout south

Dr. Jack Kruse: The south east of the United States. Everybody knows the most famous guy, Emmit Smith.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Emmit Smith.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You know where he’s from?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: From Florida. He went to University of Florida, so probably Florida area.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Pensacola right on the gulf of Mexico.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Florida. Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Okay.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Got it.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Gulf of Mexico happens to be one of the best places to grow up. Why? 600 miles from Pensacola. Do you know what’s in the the bottom of the gulf?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What?

Dr. Jack Kruse: A hole when an asteroid hit 65 million years ago. And do you know where— where you came from? You came from that change. Coz what’s out there? Dinosaurs. What came? The age of mammals. What—what is different? Mitochondria. See that? You’re back to the same story again. And you didn’t even realize it. The only guy in the top 20 list that breaks the rules is John Riggins.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: How about Jim Brown, though? Didn’t he play for the Browns? That’s Cleveland.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Played for the browns but where was he originally from?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uhm he went to Syracuse, too.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yup, Syracuse. But what time did he—was in college? Played for in his early 50’s.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. 57, first round draft pick.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Let me ask you a question. Was there uh—  a google then that you come in to do what we’re doing now? Or is he outside riding his bike, playing ball in the sun?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. He’s from Georgia originally, so yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: There you go. See that?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Pretty shocking. He was north. He was up north for a good 15 years. That’s still pretty good.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And you know, he played how long, my friend?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 10—

Dr. Jack Kruse: 19 years.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But for a running back, that’s pretty good, though.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Was he smart to bail when he bail?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, yeah. Definitely smart.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Well, here’s the point that I’m trying to make to you. We can have this conversation. Most people who are sports fans never even think about these things. So far, I’d give you another, for example, uh—Well I’m trying to give you a really controversial one. I’m talking about Junior Seau. You know he comes from—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: middle of the Pacific Ocean. He played in San Diego. He was probably the dominant—dominant line backer, right, of his time. When did he start going south? When he last San Diego.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Patriots.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Everybody knows what happens after. He wanted to kill himself. And why is that the case? Where do—where do humans vary in mitochondria? Here in their heart. What is the other thing that we know about NFL players? Their cardiac longevity also is in_. See? The thing is the way mitochondria work is very similar to __. Those guys are really good early in their career but they burn out fast. That’s what we call__.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: What is—what are the stars in the world that live the longest? It’s red giants.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.

Dr. Jack Kruse:  You think about all the things that earlier about cytochrome C oxidates, proteins and red light force. And what I—we just say about blue light? Blue makes you burn and live faster. It speeds time up. Red slows time down. So does purple. And the reason why purple works is because purple electrons actually gets sliced by this slicer in the mitochondria called the Q cycle. And the Q cycle is run by cholines and Q10. One of the biggest functions of the  Q cycle is to take a highly excited electron and turn it into light frequencies in the red light. So what do we do with purple light? You’re slowing it down and then turning we’re turning it into red light for cytochrome C oxidates, which is the third—uh—the third cytochrome. And what does cytochrome do? It makes more ATP. We’re back to the story we started. 2/3 vs. 1/3

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 1/3, right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: That’s the reason why UV light isn’t toxic. That’s the reason why dermatologist and your question before, you asked me I think three times about collagen.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Now you know the reason why. Because the reason that he got this belief, the reason why dermatologist got its belief because they don’t understand how light works. The physics of organisms, the physics of cells, what you understand it. Makes sense. And I’m sure—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But you’re also not getting burned either. You built up that solar callus—

Dr. Jack Kruse: I don’t care if I get burned. I don’t care if I get burned.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Really?

Dr. Jack Kruse: I don’t. I could care less.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And here’s the uh—here’s the—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But you have a nice thick solar callus now, though. So you built that thing up.

Dr. Jack Kruse: I know. But you know, next week I’m getting ready to go to Mexico. So the sun is already—probably like July—June and July is strong down there. So from that standpoint, I don’t really worry about it. Uh—but I’m not gonna tell you if why I’d be going to the equator and stay up for 12 hours a day. I know. Obviously, I wouldn’t do something like that. But once you do this long enough, it becomes pretty obvious and intuitive how long you need to be out there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And why you start seeing improvements in your own redox potential. There’s labs I told you. You don’t have to be a doctor to figure this out. You can actually look at it yourself and go through it and say, “This makes sense.”  I mean one of the easiest things I tell people, if you’re anemic, you need to get out on the sun. And you know, how many times do you hear about the B12 and the D3 story from functional docs. They have no idea anybody who’s B12 deficient is light deficient. They have solar deficient. They’re missing UV and IR light. They’re missing purple and red light. And what’s the first thing that they do? They reach for the pill. And I’m like—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So if you’re a vegetarian, you’re not eating, you’re not consuming B12, if you’re just getting sunlight, would that be enough to replete that macrocytic anemia?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Probably not. Because you know, and the reason I say that uh it’s kinda interesting. Take a look at where vegetarians tend to live. And the best country to go for that is India. If you draw a line in India.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Right to the middle and below it is all the vegetarians and above it is all the meat eaters.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup.

Dr. Jack Kruse: What’s the difference? The light. The light vegetarians get light in India coz they’re always in strong light cycle.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm. Interesting.

Dr. Jack Kruse: And guess what happens in the north part, up by the Himalayan Mountains? They’re up at 29,000 feet. Why are all the_ is dark skinned? Now you know the reason why. Because they’re getting more UV light even though they are at a higher latitude because their altitude is high and what else is the benefit? No people are there. Why? Because the mountains are huge.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right.

Dr. Jack Kruse: See, all the things we talked about, when you start thinking about it, you start going, “Damn, I actually never have thought about this.” And I told people this all the time. Remember the terminal electron receptor for mitochondria’s oxygen. How do you make oxygen? UV lights hit ozone and you make O2. UV lights make oxygen. And you don’t even think about it. But you have this thing, “Oh, I can’t go outside coz UV light is bad for me.” Why? It’s what’s put up in your head by your mother, your doctor, or somebody else. That’s the reason why you feel that way. For me, the strong UV light usually mean that you’re gonna have pretty good O2 and anytime you have O2, O2 is you’re thermal electron receptor.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey, Jack, I lost you there.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Yeah. And you went totally dead you just—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I know. I know.

Dr. Jack Kruse: You just froze.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: No problem. I’ll add this to it. We’ll wrap up here. I’m gonna recording again. Right. Go ahead. So you we’re saying there before we were cut off.

Dr. Jack Kruse: I don’t know what I was saying. Uh—Uh—

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So you were talking about the redox—

Dr. Jack Kruse: Oh, yeah. The redox potential is the key to healthy living. The more negative charge you have in your body, you’re better off if you do.
The fastest way you develop net negative charge is realizing that you have to have electrons to be programmed by somebody. And the more electrons that you can contain, the better you are. That’s the reason why the density of the water at the pools is much higher and colder because there’s more electrons in it. That’s the reason why DHA and—and the fish comes from colder—colder water. So if you understand this, basically, you just need to get your shoes off, take as much cold off as you’ve had or go to these clothes that they now make anything that penetration of UV and ion light. You know I think one of them is called__ That’s what I would use. Uhm—so that you can actually be naked without being naked when you’re outside no matter where you are. And this is fundamentally why just about every research study you read about vacation uh—told you that you spend 7 days in a strong light environment, everything gets better, your diet, your weight and everybody says it’s just relaxation. No, it’s a lot more than just relaxation. It’s about balancing the—the vagal motor system and the periventricular nucleus through light assimilation through the skin and your eye.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. I appreciate that. And if you’re stuck in a dessert island, what would be the one supplement you can bring with you outside of the sun?

Dr. Jack Kruse: Water.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Water. Okay. I appreciate that. Any last words here? You wanna  put out there for the listeners?

Dr. Jack Kruse: I just tell you that keep your mind open like a parachute. The thing is that made me say some things that you heard here today that are very counterintuitive to your beliefs, concepts. But remember, beliefs and paradigms all they are is precepts to the truth. The truth is always a moving__ of approximations. And the truth is designed to evolve so what maybe true today we might found out tomorrow is not so true uh—and the best way for us to define these things are is to observe nature in her form. She always morphs. You know the nature, the—the environment that we have in the United States in 1900, 1930’s in not applicable to 2017 anymore. And if you don’t believe me just go over your grandmother’s house and ask for how many people she knew who had Alzheimer’s disease or Parkinson’s disease when she was 6 years old. See these diseases came out of nowhere, same thing with autism. Autism is a mitochondrial disease. That’s where it comes from. It comes from the modern environment that we built in. We’re not cognizant enough and when we hear that the first time, it shocks you and it shouldn’t shock you. It’s the reason why in  1900, colon cancer is the 37th leading cause of cancer and today it’s number 2. Did all of a sudden our genes change in 5 generations for a lot of that to occur? No, the answer is not. But change the amount of assimilation of that energy in mitochondria is what changed the gene. That’s the key. There’s 2 genomes in us the one that’s most important is the mitochondria. Become a mitochondria then you’ll be a lot better, folks.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Dr. Jack Kruse, I appreciate it.

Dr. Jack Kruse: Alright. Take care, man.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You too, Jack. Take care. Bye.



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