The Top 5 Anti-Aging Techniques to Age Gracefully | Podcast #342

Hey guys! In this video, Dr. J and Evan discuss the factors that affect the aging process. They are more straightforward—and less invasive—ways to look younger than mainstream or conventional ways. Dr. J suggests incorporating a few of these habits into your daily routine that won’t just leave you fresh-looking and it’ll boost your overall energy. Watch the video to learn how. Of all the places on your body, your gut is silently receiving different food that can cause the entire aging process. That includes standard precautions such as maintaining a well-balanced diet rich in good fats. But there are also quite a few ways that you may be aging your body without knowing it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

3:00:   Inflammation

7:21:   Insulin Resistance and blood glucose

16:59:  Sleep in the aging process

27:46:  Fasting Techniques

30:26:  Importance of movement and exercise

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are Live! It’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan Brand. Today we’re gonna be chatting about natural strategies to help detoxify round ups or glyphosate. Really excited to be chatting with Evan today. Evan, how are you doing today man?

Evan Brand: Doing really well! This is a super important topic.You sea many many lawsuit around the country happen and bayer who bought monsato. They’re really trying to get out of it. I’ve seen several, I’m no law expert but I’ve seen several stories how basically they’re trying to just, throw one lump sum out there for all the cases, as there are thousand and thousand of cases coming at them, because of different cancers like non-hodgkin’s lymphoma that people are claiming that has been linked to their glyphosate exposure. Whether it was like the school grounds worker who was a famous story  or other people. They’re really coming at them hard and they’re really really trying to weasel this way out of it and then I saw news just uh, last week actually, that glyphosate is actually going to be phased. I don’t know if you saw this but it said it’s going to be phased out by 2023. So I sent this new article over to Stephanie Synep who I’ve interviewed several times about glyphosate, and she goes “yeah, I saw this. They’re probably just going to come out with another slightly different molecule that’s just as toxic”. So she didn’t think it was that exciting news.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting! Yeah, I mean, I wouldn’t be surprised. It’s kind of like a lot of the medication they have many me’s for it right. Something they can re-patent, um, almost the same molecular structure so they know it’s going to work based on the previous medication or compound but they don’t really have to do too much RND on it because, it’s so close to where it was. So yeah, I get that maybe, probably, the same toxicity profile too. So that makes sense, hopefully that’s not going to be the case but either way, we have a lot of toxins in our environment and roundup’s just one that we have a lot of other pesticides, herbicides, or genocides that are out there. Obviously, a lot of potential chemicals in the water, air, and so roundup or we can kind of put roundup of pesticides – all in the same category, I think that’s pretty fair . So you know first thing is, try to mitigate the use of them on your property, I mean, I use a little bit of pesticides in a spot treating, man. Are we trying to avoid anything blanketed or anything just, you know, blanketed across the board, and you know, we don’t really play out in the grass that much, I mean so if your kids are rolling around out in the grass definitely pay extra money and have those weeds picked up by hand. I think that’s a better way to do it but every now and then, there may be a necessity to spot treat stuff but do your best to avoid that especially if your kids are playing near glass like that, or just have a grass in your yard that you know, this is the play area this where the kids go. We put a nice little rock pit in our backyard just because we know that the rock pit’s going to be perfect right? Put some like, soft help you know, small pebbles in there, um, that are you, um, still fun to play in and they have a digger pit and all that so just try to do your best if you have kids that are young that are playing; mitigate any playing on areas that have any pesticides at all; try to mitigate the use of them, 100 percent and try to have safe, safe spaces in your yard that, you know are perfectly clean.

Evan Brand: There is an alternative to roundup. I’m trying to figure out what it was the moms across America did and article on it-I’m trying to fin it here-it was like a non-toxic weed control. I don’t care about weeds; my grass looks cool and it’s got clover. We’ve got many other different species of plants besides just grass. I mean, I think it’s a myth and it’s dumb you have all these neighborhoods where they think you got to have the grass looking perfect, and grass is just like another version of monoculture. It’s like if you go and walk through my yard, you’re going to see so many different types of plants so I just don’t care. I think people have been brainwashed by the mainstream industry. Even our neighbor we’ve seen you know just out in flip-flops, spraying the glyphosate on their weeds. It’s like who said dandelions are bad? Like, that’s the first food for bee so for me, I’d rather see the field full of dandelions. I guess it’s personal preference but I kind of like it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. It just depends. You know, the biggest problem with weeds in relationship to grass as they grow like, three times the speed, so if you haven’t cut your lawn for a week your grass in this long and your weeds are this long, right? So you missed the nice homogeneous, kind of, clean lawn. I’m a big long guy, I like a nice, clean, homogeneous lawn so I’ll walk out there, you know, halfway through the week if I see any weeds popping up; it’s easy because they grow twice the speed, it’s grass, and I’ll just go and take five minutes, and I’ll just pull my hand. You know, I’m like I  like a really nice pretty front lawn. So I’ll go there spend 5-10 minutes a week walking around, pulling by hand, just to mitigate the chemical usage but. First thing is, decrease the chemical usage, decrease the chemical dependency out of the gates. I guess that’s the easiest first step.

Evan Brand: So here’s one. So it’s called, there’s one called Dr. Kirchner natural grass and weed killer. I’m gonna to try to look it up, see what the ingredients. There’s another one, another competitor to it called, Green Gobler. And that’s a 20% vinegar weeding grass killer. And this thing’s got crazy high reviews of it. This Dr. Kirchner k-I-r-c-h-n-e-r natural weed killer . This is just, so it’s four percent sodium chloride, interesting. And they say this ocean water-based product is made for non-selective control of broad-leaf weeds and wheat grasses results in hours. So there you go, I mean it sounds like they’re just using like, concentrated ocean water, they’ve got thousands of five-star reviews on people, people on Amazon are posting their reviews of them in their garden after spraying this stuff and it literally kills it all. This lady said here that it’s magical and safe. So there you go!

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So we’ll have to put some links down below. So you have what, so what are those two products? Those ones that was an apple cider vinegar-based, what else?

Evan Brand: Yeah, and then you got this other one that’s salt water, it’s literally like, four percent ocean water concentrate, and then you have another one called, Natural Armor which is a 30 percent vinegar concentrate.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay.

Evan Brand: My wife even saw one at Target recently. She saw like an organic herbicide. I had a picture of it, I don’t know if I could find it on my phone or not but, she sent me a picture the other day. She said there’s no excuse for people using glyphosate; I said I know, I know, and then she sent me that picture-let me see if I can find it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Good. That’s good. I mean glyphosate, what is does is, it it basically is a chelator, it pulls away all the minerals from the soil, and so it decreases the minerals getting up into the plant which then kill it. And so, if you’re using it even worse on food you’re eating, It’s it’s way worse. Because now you’re destroying the quality of the topsoil, you’re destroying the minerals in that soil, and we know that soil requires minerals so that plant can, um, let’s just say express it you know, express it’s full nutritional potential if you will. So if we have nutritionally deficient soil, like manganese for instance, you know, vegetables are going to have less vitamin C in it, right? So we know the minerals have a major role  and they and the quality of that soil, plays a major role in the kind of nutrientsthat plants will produce. So you’re gonna have less nutrition in soil where there’s a bunch of roundup that’s chelated out a lot of those minerals.

Evan Brand: Yeah. I was gonna say, let’s hit on the mechanism . So that’s definitely a big important one, and then the other one that you and I test for in the gut is, we’re seeing the glyphosates damaging the beneficial bacteria in the gut. And this is happening at even PBB – parts per billion levels. So once you kill off the beneficial bacteria in the gut, now you see the overgrowth of clostridium, and there’s a famous chart-I know you’ve seen it before and hopefully others have seen it. But you could just look it up, type in glyphosate autism chart, and you can see the correlation where glyphosate skyrockets along with autism rates, and I’ve seen many many autistic children and we test their glyphosate levels and they’re always high. So, this is not saying causation, but this is in correlation; and William Shaw, Bill Shaw-he’s a guy at great plains lab that we, that we use for these toxic chemical tests. You know, he wrote a great paper on this. He had a paper published about the mechanism . Essentially, it was like an order of operations. It was the glyphosate, as you mentioned, will cause nutrient deficiencies but then damages good bacteria. Bad bacteria like clostridium overgrowth. Now you’ve got these organic acids that go high which mess up an enzyme that breaks down dopamine, now you’ve got excessive dopamine, now you’ve got brain toxicity and the you damage the mitochondria. So it’s a long, a long route there but, this is directly damaging mitochondria which is certainly linked to chronic fatigue and other issues so, when we’re looking at someone’s picture of health, and we see they’ve got a major overload of pesticides, and they’re fatigued, we’re not gonna say, “Hey! This is you number one smoking gun of fatigue” but, it’s certainly a big peace of the puzzle; and I can tell you personally but also clinically when we use nutrients which we’ll get into to detox these pesticides-we see that energy levels go up; and you mentioned exposure, so also, you got to consider where you live too. So even if you’re having Joe Bob next door spray, that might not be as big of a deal as more agricultural areas which is you know, partially where I am which I don’t like. There’s a corn and soybean around here. This is just part of the country where I, where this happens and there’s papers on even one mile of pesticide drift. So the question is…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Far more worried about you because, just the load, you know, if you look at the, just the load coming through.

Evan Brand: Oh, yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh, and your area is just got to be, you know, orders of magnitude. 10, 100x more than just a general uh, you know, residential person that’s just trying to knock down weeds a little bit.

Evan Brand: Totally. Which, which we’re aware of. We’re working on it and we’ve got, we’ve got an exit, so we’re working on it but, yeah. Luckily, we’ve been doing a lot of things. Are you ready to talk about some of the solutions? Obviously, avoidance, external exposure, trying to stay away from it, watching out for like, playgrounds. You know, a lot of playgrounds, they’re too lazy to pull the weeds so they’re just going to spray it so you’ll see often signs at playgrounds like, “watch out!”, and you can tell that they’ve sprayed on the mulch where the kids are playing, and then you may say, “Well, oh! We’ll just go to a rubber playground”, where you have all those chopped up tires but, those are really toxic too. We mentioned those rubber chemicals on the chemical profile for children too. I had a child, a young child actually, was a client who was diagnosed with a rare type of cancer, and we looked at the levels of 1-3 butadiene and maybe some other chemicals; and these are all from synthetic rubber, and this kid was like a stup, a superstar soccer player. He was playing indoors, like 24/7. This kid was these fake rubber mats and his levels were like a hundred x higher than 95th percentile and that was a known carcinogen so we can’t say the rubber caused it but, man, it was certainly a big smoking gun in this case.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What’s the chemical name?

Evan Brand: It’s so, it’s 1-3 butadiene. It’s on the great plains chemical report. It just says using the production. Yeah, just as used in the production of synthetic rubber.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So it’s definitely possible, right? So, I mean, out of the gates, the first thing is, we look at our food. Right? First this is make sure you food’s organic because you’re going to have major exposure if you’re taking things in, internally. Right? Things on the outside of the world like yeah, if you’re touching it, right? That’s going to be a problem so one try not to use it at your property or if you do you know, like you know, we try to use it more like glyphosate but kind of more natural version in the front yard spot treated. But in the backyard or in the play any area where we know that kids actually play. Like that’s just going to be off-limits. We try to make sure it’s super clean and good there; and then number two is um, you know, air is going to move all this stuff around. So even if you know you yard’s clean, your neighbors may not be clean. So you got to make sure air filtration in your home is dialed in so you can mitigate it potentially being in the home and breathing it in constantly. So air filters in the home, water filer because there’s also the worry about it getting off into the water table, and if we have a well or anything else, very concerning so you want to make sure good quality water filtration and then like I mentioned earlier-organic food and try to mitigate it’s usage around your property, or try to choose natural sources.

Evan Brand: Yeah. I’m glad you mentioned the water too because that’s important. Believe it or not, even glyphosate’s being found in rain water which is crazy. It’s literally raining down glyohosate because it’s evaporating from various farms and agricultural than it’s moving through the wind currents and then getting rained down on people, and you may say, “Oh well, that’s got to be such a trace amount it doesn’t matter. Well that’s the thing, we’re finding that these, these compounds are active against the beneficial bacteria in your gut at these per billion levels. So you really can’t brush it off. People will try to brush it off but, it’s the small levels, and it’s the synergistic effects, right? So you’ve got a little bot of that and then you’ve got it from your diet. Plus you’ve got it from your water supply, plus you’re getting rained on in your organic garden. This adds up overtime and you and I see bacterial overgrowth everyday, all day; and we know that this is certainly linked to the disruption of the gut-these chemicals. So it’s too important to ignore the air filters is a tough one. I asked Stephanie Synep about that I said, “Hey! What is the actual size of glyphosate? I can’t find it. I’m trying to figure out because you’ll see air purifiers talk about a one micron or a three micron filtration, and she said “Oh, no. There’s no way you’ll be able to filter it. It’s too small so that’s what she said bit, I can’t find anything about the size of it. I’ve asked a couple of companies about is and they say, “Oh, yeah. NO problem. Our air filter will take care of it”, and another company said, “Oh, yeah. Our air filter should destroy the molecule” but, I don’t know how you would yest that. You’d have to like, I don’t know; Have somebody spray a bottle of glyphosate into a room and then run the purifier and see what happens but, it’s removed so many other things that it’s a non-negotiable us, and I know you do the same like, air purifier…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. It’s moving a lot. I mean, you know, we like the Austin Air just because they have the 30 pounds of activated charcoal and zeolite, and those binders, you know, would have a positive effects, binding up these things and so it’s definitely going to decrease the load for sure. If it’s blowing through a hepa filter and also  through the 30 pounds of zeolite and activated charcoal. It’s going to have mitigating effects. It’s going to be better off, you know, on when it’s out than, than before, right? So I think it’s still a good thing to have to what degree, um, I don’t know but, in general, it’s good to have, of course the water is a big one. So I try to have all my water that I drink personally-reverse osmosis, so we have a whole house filter that’s carbon-based that filter a lot, and then I have a under the counter filter where I drink my water, and like you know, make smoothies from, or make my coffee from, or use for cooking like that’s all RO. And so we have a little mineral support supplement that will add minerals back in. Because the biggest problem with RO water is the depletion of minerals but, um, I’d rather always have the water cleaner and then add minerals back. It’s always easier to add minerals back than take toxins out.

Evan Brand: Right. Yeah.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Always easier.

Evan Brand: For sure, for sure. I mean, yeah…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So like, Oh my God! The minerals In the water. There’s no minerals. Like yeah, but there’s no toxins are way less, so now I’m okay with way less toxins and just being able to add a good trace mineral support back into the water.

Evan Brand: Yep! Yeah, and people…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And you can do like, a redmond. You can do like a redmon’s real salt, you could trace mineral support with some extra potassium and magnesium-all that’s fine.

Evan Brand:  I’ll do some of the sea water too. Like some of the sea water like, quinton and there’s a couple other professional brands we use of sea water, that stuff. I tell you, I was kind of skeptical. I’m like how is adding like, basically salt water going to help me bit, it sure did. I mean, it definitely is like a thirst quencher. So it’s pretty remarkable the difference.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, yourself, your cells need uh, they run on a sodium-potassium pump. There’s this gradient of minerals on wither side of the cell. I think it’s what sodium, sodium is on the outside, potassium’s in. It does a little switcheroo. Sodium goes in, potassium goes out, and you need that gradient to happen for the cells to communicate properly. So it you’re low in sodium or potassium, that sodium potassium pump is not going to work optimally.

Evan Brand: you can feel it. I’m telling you. It’s, it’s significant. All right. Let’s hit on some of like, the detox strategies if you’re ready. I think the easy one…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So the first thing is all the lifestyle stuff. That’s foundationthat we stack up. So easiest thing out of the gate is going to be glutathione. So glutathione, whether it’s s acetyl, lyposomal, reduce, whether we do, whether we’re making it with all the precursors like, NAC, ALA, glycine, collagen, right? All these things are going to be really important to help make your master antioxidant out of the gates-that’s probably the big one first.

Evan Brand: Yeah, glycine’s huge, and there’s actually some papers just on glycine by itself in isolation helping with glyphosate which is awesome. So I actually take glycine before bed. It really helps sleep too. So that’s another cool benefit but…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, you can mix collagen, peptides, like I use my TrueCollagen with a little bit of magnesium powder before bed. That knocks it right out and glycine’s helpful with other toxins like strippers like xylene and things like that. It will, it will detoxify xylene-thses kind of chemicals too. So glycine is excellent, and then of course um, you know, roundup’s very destructive on the gut and so if you’re doing glycine, it’s very helpful to kind of heal the enterocytes and repair those too.

Evan Brand: Yeah. I would say probiotics are somewhere on the list now. I don’t know in terms of priority and the mechanism is the same as it is for mycotoxins. There’s some cool research coming out about probiotics actually being able to convert toxins into less toxic forms, and then that makes them more water-soluble, and able to excreted from the body. So there’s some cool mechanism involved with probiotics and of course, if you’re working with a practitioner like us, we’re going to coach you through when and how, and what we’re going to use. But that another cool piece of the puzzle. I’d say my next one is going to be micronized chlorella. There’s a couple professional that we use of it, and this is better than the broken cell wall chlorella because, it’s smaller molecules, and then that’s going to allow better transfer across the blood-brain barrier to get some of these heavy metals out. So we’ll actually use some products that are basically designed for heavy metals but, we’ll use them off-label for like mold and chemical detox.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and so like I have a heavy meal clear product that has some of the, some of the chlorella in there. It also has some of the sodium alginate, and then also some of the modified citrus pectin. These are really good binders that will help with metals and they’ll also help with uh, pesticides too which are great, and then, um, some of the research you’re talking about probiotics actually converting some of the mole toxins and also, they also have an effect binding them too. It’s that what you’re saying too?

Evan Brand: Yeah. I know it’s a conversion. I don’t know if it’s actually binding but, there’s a lot of like great planes they’re doing a lot of work on like promoting the idea of probiotics being like the universal mold detoxifier now – even better higher rated that charcoal for example, which is crazy .

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s why we always talk about dealing with the gut and working on the gut before we push any crazy detox because we know, the gut’s so important. It’s like a lot of these functional medicine principles are like you know, they’ve tried and true but, if you look at the science, like you find more little nitty-gritty within the science of what’s happening, why that is the case like we just kind of know clinically, you get better results doing it so we kind of go that way, and then we just see more data kind of just supporting that hypothesis.

Evan Brand: It’s cool. Yeah, it’s fun because you and I have been basically using the methods we use for years, and then new stuff comes out that’s like, “Oh, cool!” Well, we were doing that already; now we know that it was actually doing other things that we needed it to do for. It’s like get rid of toxins. So that’s, so that’s awesome. How about sauna too? I mean, sweating has been proven to help excrete so many things. I’ll tell you, you know, I had a lady that was in her 70s. We ran a chemical profile test on her. This lady’s test was so clean, I was almost in disbelief because I’ve seen 5, 6 year-old children that are just off the charts with chemicals, and then we have this lady in her 70’s who you think just lived through all sort of different eras of toxicity. Man, I tell you, her chemical tests were as clean as a whistle. I said, “What are you doing?’, and she was in a sauna three to four times a week for half an hour. I said “Wow!”, I said, ”You are living proof that the sauna works and that sweating is an incredible detox pathway.”

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I see a lot of women, too. Like “Oh, man! I’m pregnant.Like, what’s the best way to detoxify when I’m pregnant?” I’m like, well number one, we don’t want to really push any detoxification. The only thing I may gently recommend is maybe a little bit of a, kind of a natural fiber, eating organic, drinking lots of water, and maybe a little bit of an infrared sauna. But you have to shower right afterwards just because you don’t want to move toxins to the skin, and then have them reabsorb back in. So you want to make sure you use a good 10 sulfur soap, break up that film of toxin on your skin so it flushes off your skin. So would you agree that you know, potentially doing a little bit of sauna therapy as long as you’re not depleting yourself, dehydrated, is probably a safe, probably one of the more safer, gentle ways to detoxify if you are pregnant?

Evan Brand: I guess it depends on temperature. Like I’m not going to put a lady in like, a hundred and eighty, like a hot rock one.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.

Evan Brand: I think an Infrared one…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It can be infrared were it’s lower temperature.

Evan Brand: Yeah. I think if you’re probably at like a 125 degrees or something. That’s somewhat natural that you could experience on the planet. I think would be no problem; the chlorella should be no problem, too. You know, we’ve actually…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Stays in the gut. It stays in the gut. You’re probably okay, I mean, chlorella, some kind of a gentle, more food-based binder is probably okay. I mean, if you’re gonna do some kind of a sauna and you’re pregnant, one, make sure you’re hydrated, make sure you have minerals. Start with like, three or four, or five minutes, and just kind of add like a minute of two every time so you don’t overdue. I always rather know you go at a lower level where you’re confident- you can handle it, and gently nudge it up, and just make sure you shower right afterwards. It’s probably the only detoxification means that I would really push outside of a gentle binder. Uh, that’s food-based for my pregnant females. Back on that, would you agree?

Evan Brand: I would say, I, I don’t see a problem with charcoal and chlorella during pregnancy because, you have to kind of weigh the pros and the cons, right? And we know that for example, these toxins go through the placenta. We know they go through breast milk, so here you are, willingly letting this toxins go through the unborn baby, when you could simply  use a gentle binder to try to mitigate some of that or even detox; that there’s actually been crazy stuff being done behind the scenes. I won’t go into too much details because I don’t think it’s published yet but, showing that these micronized chlorella molecules can literally detox the baby before the baby’s even born. So you can actually have a baby come out cleaner than it would’ve been, chemical wise, by being detoxed throughout the pregnancy by the transfer of the chlorella from mom to baby; and then of course, once the baby’s born, through the breast milk, also there is some transfer of chlorella. So there’s some crazy, crazy stuff coming out on that but, too soon to say exactly.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Very cool. I like that. So, yeah. We have our binders, we like the binders, and again, talk to your, your OB if you’re a person that wants to look into that. When you’re pregnant, just be careful. I always recommend do all this stuff before but, if you waited and you have issues, and you got to do it now, talk to your OB, talk to your functional medicine doc before you ever do that. We typically don’t push any hard detoxification when uh, patients are pregnant just because we’re mobilizing a lot of toxins unless, we do it very very gentle-way like we mentioned before. Uh, outside of that, I would say we talked about all the big binders of water filtration. We’ll put some links down below with some of the RO and whole house activated charcoal, carbon-based filters that I personally use and Evan uses. We’ll put some recommended links that you guys have that. That’s going to be really important. I’d say air, water, organic food-those are going to be big, and then we can set them in on top of that. So uh, in my line I use heavy metal clear, my detox aminos that have calcium gluconate, and all the sulfur aminos, and reduced glutathione. Evan has some similar glutathione, and sulfur, and mineral-based products that are mineral, that are like our binders, like fulvic minerals or things that help bind up some of this things, too. So we’ll put some links down below if you want some recommended products that we personally use, and we’re kind of gave you some of the big mechanism, right? One’s binding, right? You’re binding some of it up, and the other one is you’re working on enhancing your own detoxification pathways, so they can excrete them. And then of course, low-hanging fruit, right? The solution to pollution dilution. You take any toxins, you hydrate well enough, good clean water and minerals, the more you hydrate that mineral, that toxin becomes less potent, the more it’s diluted. So that’s, it’s low hanging fruit. It’s easy to forget but, solution to pollution is dilution.

Evan Brand: Cheers! Yeah, and this is real stuff. I mean, we’ve seen many, many, I mean, hundreds of this point; before and after case studies of measuring these chemicals. It’s absolutely remarkable what can be done. So if you’re just like, “Oh, toxins are bad.”, and that’s all you get from this podcast, no. Remember that goes deeper than this. We’re talking the way you perform in terms of your mitochondreal function, your energy levels, the health of your gut. Whether you have bacterial overgrowth which then leads to bloating, and burping, and gas, and issues with your joints and potential autoimmune issues because now you’ve got chlostridium overgrowth. So if you hear this, all you think is” toxins are bad, I need to detox.”, no. Remember, this goes into every body system. This goes into adrenals, mitochondria, liver, gallbladder; I mean, the whole system is involved so don’t just blow this thing off. I still see people-I won’t name her but, there was a lady I knew from my, my town. Now she’s super big and she’s got a supplement company that’s like all these vitamin shop stores and everywhere, and she did a Q&A, and I mean this lady is a multi-millionaire, and people asked her, “Do you eat organic?”, and she said “No. I think it’s a waste of time.” It’s like you’re just, you’re just, uh, what’s the word? Not dumb, that’s the rude word. Uh…

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Ignorant.

Evan Brand: Ignorant. She’s ignorant. Yeah, that’s the word. She doesn’t know what that means. Like how important that truly is and how that’s changing everything from her offspring, and the health of her babies to her own health. So to people out there, if you’ve got the means to do it, which hopefully everyone can, I can see people have that brand new iphones but then they say they don’t have the extra dollar to buy the organic strawberries. You got to make thins thing a priority or you’ll see a brand new Mercedes SUV in the McDonald’s parking lot, like you’ve got to make organic a priority.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Absolutely. So you git to make it a priority. It’s shift that for sure, and again, people’s say organic’s a fad. Well, again, before 1950, everything was organic, right? That’s where the pesticide kind of fertilizer industry came kind of post-World War II, and so, everything was organic before that point. And again, like first thing I recommend in the order of priorities is, make sure your meat are organic and pasture fed first, okay that’s the first order of, um, let’s just say investment. The second thing is, eat from the clean 15-these are pesticides that have, these are foods that have a pesticide load; and then, avoid the dirty dozen. That’s kind of environmental working group thing. So we’ll put a link for the clean and the dirty dozen; and then from there, you can start getting organic vegetables that are frozen; that’s cheaper. And then of course, start to buy them, you know, more fresh and organic across the board but, that’s kind of the progression. So just try to at least start with the meats because the meats hold the most toxins, and so fats are in the toxins. So you want to start with meats first, and then you can work on going to clean 15, avoid dirty dozen, frozen organic, and then full fresh on organic. That’s kind of the algorithm there. Anything you want to say about that Evan?

Evan Brand: Yeah, local too. I mean, if you can get local beef too, where it hadn’t traveled thousands of miles from Brazil, and they didn’t cut down the rain forest to get that grass fed beef, then I would totally do that. I get my meat from 15 minutes down the road. It’s just hundreds, and hundreds of acres of beautiful chemical-free pastures. So I feel really good about it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s great! I love it. Well, very good. So out of the gates here also, one last thing, if you don’t have good gallbladder function, or good digestion, right? You’re constipated, you’re not pooping everyday, you’re having a hard time digesting food, not breaking fat down or protein adequately, your stools are floating, excessive skid marks streaks-those kind of things that means you’re not breaking down fat, you’re not breaking down protein adequately, you’re not moving toxins through your bowels adequately, you’re gonna be reabsorbing that, you’re gonna, you’re not gonna have good gallbladder flow to push that out in the stool. So you’re potentially reabsorbing or not eliminating toxins via your digestive tract. And so if we have digestive issues, we got to have some stool testing, we got to fix whatever is going on from a microbial imbalance or gut infection in the intestines. That’s really important. Got to work on live, gallbladder, and making sure enzymes and acids are adequate to break everything down.

Evan Brand: Yep! Good call. And if you need help, you want to get some of this testing done, investigate your gut, look into your chemical toxicity, you can reach out to Dr. J or myself. This website is justinhealth.com if you need to reach out, it worked worldwide (facetime, phone, skype) any way you need to connect there. So justinhealth.com, and for me Evan, it’s evanbrand.com. We look forward to helping you. Also reach out. We offer intro calls too! You can chat with us and figure out exactly what’s going on, symptom wise, we’ll see if you’re good fit for care, and look forward to helping you out.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. We’re here for you all, guys. Awesome! And if you enjoyed it, thumbs up, comments down below, and um, we’re here! Justinhealth.com, evanbrand.com, and write us a review too! We appreciate it.


References:

https://justinhealth.com/

https://www.evanbrand.com/

Audio Podcast:

https://justinhealth.libsyn.com/the-top-5-anti-aging-techniques-to-age-gracefully-podcast-342

Recommended products:

TRUCOLLAGEN (Grassfed)

Organic Grass Fed Meat

Air Doctor Air Purifier

Austin Air Health Mate Plus

Magnesium Supreme

What are the Natural Anti-Inflammatory Agents for Pain Relief

In general, we have our COX pathways. Now, Arachidonic acid can feed those pathways. A lot of excess, junky, refined Omega-6 from animal products can definitely feed those pathways. That sets the table like gas in the kitchen where a little spark can take it off.

Click here to consult with a functional medicine doctor for recommendations on natural pain relievers.

Where to find anti-inflammatory agents:

  1. Natural herbs like ginger can help with COX-1.

  2. Fish oil is excellent for COX-2 at high doses. If you do high doses of fish oil, you can increase what’s called lipid peroxidation because fish oil is a polyunsaturated fatty acid. It’s more unstable. It’s got more double bonds in it. Omega-3 means three double bonds. The more double bonds that are they are, the more unstable the fatty acid is to heat things like that and the more, let’s say it can be oxidized. So, having extra vitamin C or extra vitamin D on board when you’re taking extra fish oil just to make sure you don’t have oxidation is great, and we already talked about things like systemic enzymes.

  3. There is also curcumin but liposomal curcumin is better due to the absorption or something with black pepper in it helps with absorption, too.

  4. Frankincense or Boswellia.

  5. White willow bark which is kind of how aspirin is naturally made though aspirin works more on COX-1. So, aspirin can be your other natural source and you can do white willow bark which is the natural form of aspirin.

  6. There are things like Tylenol but Tylenol works more on the central nervous system perception. So, it decreases the nervous systems’ perception of pain. Note: We have to be careful of Tylenol as it can actually chronically reduce glutathione. So, if you’re taking Tylenol longer-term, you definitely want to take it with NAC and/or some glutathione, just to be on the safe side.

  7. At the extreme example, we have opiates which block pain receptors in the brain, the opiate perception of the brain. It’s not the best thing because you’re just decreasing perception of pain. Obviously, the opiates are way more addictive.

  8. We can block some of these natural pain perceptions with CBD oil. So, CBD is another great way to reduce the perception of pain.

In general, we want you to try to do more of the herbals and more of the natural stuff out of the gates because that really, really, really can help reduce inflammation.

If you have osteoarthritis, rheumatoid arthritis, sports injury, or you’re just trying to heal maybe postoperation, these things may be something to implement and then obviously work in all the other root causes, too. You are not just what you eat. You are what you digest from what you eat.

So, if you’re doing all these good nutrients, but you’ve got some type of malabsorption issue in the gut, you’ve got ridges on your fingernails, you’ve got thinning hair or falling out here, you may need to look deeper at the gut and try to find some of these more root cause issues that led you to that amount of inflammation or slow recovery in the first place.

If you need to reach out to talk about your pain and inflammation issues, click this link to schedule a chat with me!

Vitamin D Benefits You Should Know

Vitamin D has a couple of different benefits. Let’s go over some of the benefits. We’ve talked about the natural antibiotic that’s being produced by vitamin D, which is called cathelicidin, a kind of antibacterial enzyme. It is super helpful at being able to knock down bacteria. It also has antiviral mechanisms, as well as antimicrobial peptides and antiviral mechanisms.

Click here to consult with a functional medicine doctor to learn about proper Vitamin D supplementation.

Part of that is it stimulates and it can modulate the Th1 immune response in the Th1 immune system where you’re making a lot of your natural killer cells and your helper cells. Good helper cells can also help your antigen-presenting cell and it can help make antibodies more efficiently. So, you’re also going to have a better Th2 immune response. You’re going to make antibodies to whatever that infection is. Those tend to come a little bit later in the game, but good signaling to make your antibodies is super helpful as well.

There is a couple of other studies here that are talking about different things. We have a reduction in our MMP-9 concentrations. We have a reduction in bradykinin storms and reduction in our cytokine storm. So, basically we have a lot of inflammatory molecules that get produced such as bradykinin, cytokines, interleukins MMP-9. These are inflammatory types of chemical messengers. Vitamin D can help modulate that and prevent that from being overproduced. The more we overproduce those, the more our immune system responds. So, we can create more cytokine storm issues because our immune system will be on this positive feedback loop, responding and creating more issues with the cytokines. When there are less cytokines, there’s less chance of a cytokine storm, which is basically our immune system responding.

Imagine a fight between two people where one person yells out first and the other person yells back. Then they’re pushing, shoving, and hitting and the violence escalates. That’s what happens with the cytokine storm with your immune system and all the different cytokines and immune chemical signal. So, we can keep that modulated a bit which is very helpful. Vitamin D plays a really important role in that.

Recommendation

Get vitamin D supplementation from Thanksgiving to spring. At least, make that investment. If you want to come off the rest of the year, as long as you’re getting some sunlight, it’s fine. At least do that vitamin D supplementation to give you a good bump and the fat-soluble nutrients you’ll get over those four or five months will hang around months afterward because it takes a while for that vitamin D level to build up.

If you want to learn more about Vitamin D, click this link where you can schedule a chat with me!

Effective Ways to Increase Your Vitamin D Levels

Back in the 1980s, a guy named Edgar Hope-Simpson proposed that a seasonal stimulus was intimately associated with seasonal epidemic influenza. Long story short, winter comes and then all of the sudden viruses become more of a prevalent issue. There was this whole interventional study that showed vitamin D is reducing the incidence of respiratory infections in children. So, this was specifically talking about kids but there are countless of these for adults.

Click here to consult with a functional medicine doctor to find out how you can supplement with Vitamin D effectively.

What’s happening when the vitamin D levels are sufficient are a multitude of things but in particular, it’s helping to reduce Interleukin 6 (IL-6), which is one of those inflammatory cytokines that get people in trouble. So, if you can reduce your cytokines, that’s going to be beneficial. Also, another cool benefit is not only a sort of an antiviral but there’s some antimicrobial benefit. It can actually activate your immune cells to produce some antimicrobial like a natural antibiotic if you will by upping vitamin D concentration.

How do you take Vitamin D?

Is it just an ongoing thing? If you think you’re getting into trouble with illness, do you go high dose of it? It depends on what your levels are.

So, get a baseline first. I would say the lighter or more fair your skin is, probably the more efficient you are gonna be in converting vitamin D from the sun. The darker your skin is, the more melanin you have. You’ve got different spectrums and for example, a full-on African-American has the highest amount of melanin.

What is Melanin?

Melanin is like your natural UV block and it helps block your skin from the sun’s rays. So, due to evolution and where we evolved, there are people who live closer to the equator and there’s more UV light based on the angle of the sun hitting it. These people naturally evolve with more melanin in the skin. People that evolve further away from the equator get less direct UV light, so there’s less melanin in the skin because it’s all about making vitamin D.

So, the more efficient you are at making vitamin D, you probably will be able to get away with not supplementing as much or as frequently. The more melanin in your skin, the more you have to be on top of your vitamin D because unless you’re going to be outside 6 to 8 hours a day and you’re at a mid to low 30 latitude, you’re probably just not going to be able to ever make enough vitamin D. Therefore, you really have to be on top of everything in your testing.

Vitamin D Dosage, Testing, and Recommendation

For lighter skin, in general, a good rule of thumb is 1000 IUs per 25 pounds of body weight, especially in the fall and winter months. If you want to take a break in the summer, that’s fine. Just make sure you get a test here there to confirm it. The darker your skin is, you may even want to double that in the winter months. Then you may want to follow-up and retest in the early spring to see and to monitor where you’re at. If you’re someone who works outside, you have to make that adjustment. If you’re an office person and you’re inside all day, you also have to make that adjustment, too. So, in general, 1000 IUs per 25 pounds of body weight.

If you have darker skin, you may want to double that for the winter months, and then it’s always good to confirm some time in the winter and some time coming off the winter or early spring-summer to see where you’re at. We can always adjust accordingly and if there is any risk of autoimmunity or cancer, we probably want to be testing just a little bit more frequently. Once you know where you’re at, you can guess based on how well you’re doing.

If you want to learn about the most effective way to supplement with Vitamin D, click this link where you can schedule a chat with me!

Detox with the Correct Binders | Podcast #324

Dealing with toxic substances can be an overwhelming experience. With that in mind, it helps when things are simplified and made into relatable terms. Intestinal binders are a crucial part of any detox protocol. When the liver processes toxins, they get excreted through bile and into the small intestine. If the toxins are not bound to anything, most of them will get reabsorbed in the gut.

It is important to note that certain health conditions may make binder types more or less desirable. Having a good practitioner help determine those choices for you is always advisable. Also, there are some circumstances, such as in autoimmune disease and infectious conditions, that require the use of precaution and targeted choices with binders. Proper sourcing is critical as with all supplements, as each of them can come with unnecessary risks if they are not high-grade/quality. 

Binders are like free hall passes! In using a binder, your body is spared the work required to process a toxin through the liver and gallbladder and is, instead, excrete from the body. Check out this podcast to know more about what suits you!

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

0:18      How Binders Work

8:38      Binders’ Mechanism

15:11     Detoxifying

21:20    Different Kinds of Binders

29:44    Detox as a Side Effect

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We are live. It’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan brand. Today we’re gonna be talking about using binders to help detoxify, exciting podcast because we are utilizing all the things that we are chatting about with our patients every week. And we’re excited to share with everyone else, some of our natural strategies, Evan, how you doing, man? 

Evan Brand: I’m doing really well excited to dive into this. This is something that you and I got into several years ago. And it’s been really helpful for our practice, because we’ve been able to take people that were not tolerating protocols, and then we were able to get them to tolerate the protocol. And so when you’re coming in and working on something like gut infections, whether it’s h pylori parasites, bacterial overgrowth, Candida, sometimes, if people have been sick for a really long time, they may not tolerate the protocol we’re giving them. And that doesn’t mean the protocol that we’re giving them is incorrect, or there’s something wrong with it, or there’s an herb reaction or I don’t know, like a, you know, a supplement, it’s not working well for them. That’s not usually the case. In fact, that’s extremely rare. But what rather is happening is that the process of killing off these toxins, I kind of use the analogy of like a bad breakup. And when you’re kicking out the girlfriend, she’s taking off the pictures off the wall, and she’s breaking them and there’s a bunch of glass shards in the hallway as you kick her out. It’s not a clean breakup. And so when you’re killing off these bugs, they don’t want to die, they don’t want to leave. And so they may release toxins that make you feel bad in an effort to get you to stop killing them. Hence, that’s where binders will come in, and they’re acting as the janitor, and they’re going to come sweep up the glass shards that the bugs left behind. interesting way of looking at it. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I like it, like the analogy that I typically give is imagine you got a trash barrel right in your home, well, it may not be a big deal until you go buy a whole bunch of groceries. Now imagine you got a smaller trash barrel. Well, once you throw it away the egg carton and all the other trash from everything else it’s going to overflow. And that overflowing is where you start dealing with die off. And a lot of people, people that are more sick tend to have smaller trash baskets to begin with. And so essentially giving yourself a bigger trash basket or increasing the frequency that we take it out, right, empty it out, is going to help. So I think either analogy works. So in general, I think the first thing I want to highlight off the bat is well, I like to prepare patients to get there you know, to get killing done in the right way. So I’m always working on hormones and adrenals and diet and blood sugar indigestion first, I find that is the most important component to all this. So an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. So before you go in and start having to do all this killing and and use binders, first, get yourself ready for it. And most people do not like that they want to go in there and Kill Kill, kill, kill, kill, but preparations and be really important. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and it sounds really attractive. And people, they get really excited when they find pathogens on a test. So we’re going to run a comprehensive stool panel, we’re going to run an organic acids test. And we’re going to be jumping on a call with someone to discuss the lab results. And then they’re going to say, Oh my god, I have to get this stuff out of me. I knew I had parasites. I knew I had this. I knew I had that. And then they’re ready. But we kind of have to pace people, you know, when we’ve done this thousand plus times between the both of us. So we know that, hey, based on their constitution, how do you pick up on that as a practitioner? Well, it all goes into stress management? What’s in their bucket of stress? Are they going through a divorce? Are they moving cross country? Are they a teacher? Are they working overtime? Are they a CEO? Are they not sleeping? Well? Are they doing too much alcohol? Those things are going to make us say, Hmm, well, you know what, we probably can’t go full strength with this person. Or if we do, we’re going to need to come in and bring in the binders. And the binders are these tools that they can be used in isolation. And we often use those in isolation. However, the majority of time we’re going to be using them as just part of a protocol, meaning maybe during the day, we’re going to be killing bugs. And then maybe at night, we’re going to be using binders or maybe first thing in the morning when they’re fasted and we know fasting increases the excretion of toxins, including mold and mycotoxins. Maybe we have someone do a binder first thing in the morning at six or 7am when they wake up, and they don’t eat until eight or nine when they take their killing or something like that. So there’s a lot of ways to work these into the protocol. And that kind of depends on the person. It depends on the Constitution. It depends on whether it’s a kid or an adult. But these are amazing tools. And we’ll break it down here in a minute.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep, I like that. I think it makes a lot of sense. So one of the first things we can do to help it die off as decrease inflammation. We know agglutination happens or cells become really sticky when there’s a strong inflammatory environment. So like imagine walking in your kitchen and like the floor is really sticky. It’s like you’re like creeping around that icky feeling on your feet. That’s kind of what happens when you’re inflamed and you start doing detoxification, your body is just all inflamed, things aren’t moving, things are sticky. And we want to keep things loose and flowing and slippery. So the first thing kind of in preparation For all this is getting the inflammation down. So one of the things that I love doing for die off support, we talked about it before. One we’ve already worked on the diet, right inflammations down food allergens, our digestion is better. We’re working on sleep, we’re working on hydration. Getting your hydration up is super important, right? Every time you consume water, you’re diluting the amount of toxins in your body, alright significantly. And so solution to pollution is dilution, high quality, filtered water, reverse osmosis or some kind of really good filter spring water, maybe add some extra minerals in so that you’re getting some minerals to add in some ginger tea. Ginger is natural anti inflammatory, and it’s also a natural anticoagulant. So prevents things from sticking, you could do ginger tea, burdock teas also really good, that’s a good starting place. And then things are moving, your cells aren’t clumping up and sticking together. And then from there, that’s where it’s a good place to maybe add in some binders. So a good first binder would be a really good activated charcoal, especially ones that are kind of more coconut shell based at bedtime, two hours after food and supplements. So it’s kind of in your bloodstream, it’s kind of filtering things out. It’s not getting binding up to all your food and all the nutrients in your food, unless you want to because you’re eating some bad food. That’s a good first starting point to kind of get you moving. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, let’s break down charcoal just a little bit. So people understand what it is they hear it but they’re picturing maybe the charcoal, you know, petroleum based block that your dad used to put lighter fluid on and burn them down and put them in the grill. And then you cook some hot dogs as a kid or something.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, totally. 

Evan Brand: That’s not the charcoal we’re talking about. So basically, what they’re going to do is they’re going to heat these coconut shells, that’s going to be the best. And that basically, they’re decomposed coconut shells. So they’re at a very, very, very high temperature. And then they’re going to combine it with oxygen to, quote, activate the charcoal. And then what happens is, if you were to look at it under a microscope, you’ve got millions and millions and millions of what they would call micro pores on the surface of the charcoal. And it’s when people say bind, it sounds like a magnet, but it’s really not, you know, it’s called an adsorbent agent. And so you’ve got just make sure you had it right. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So it’s not like a sponge. It’s more like a magnet. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, right. So it’s like you’ve got but it’s a weak magnet is my point about the magnet is, is it’s weak, meaning that you actually can create a hurts if you do too much charcoal, for example. So I did it personally, when I went really high dose like 810 capsules, several times a day of charcoal, I actually, I started to get just a little off like I was detoxing too much. And so I found Yes, it is kind of a magnet, but it’s a weak one. Meaning that if you picture like the lava rock, that’s probably the best example in in a big form that people can visualize as those lava rocks. Maybe you had though, that was like old school landscaping. I know as a kid, we had lava rocks in the front of our house. Yep. And so the lava rock, you saw these tiny little holes in it. And that’s kind of the charcoal but but at a bigger level. And so let’s say it’s mycotoxins or heavy metals or pesticide, whatever else is kind of in those little holes. But remember, you still have to move this microscopic lava rock with the, with the toxins on through the intestinal tract. And if you have a leaky gut, some of those things can kind of fall off the law of rock and then go back into the bloodstream, which is why you can hurt even from binders alone. And so this is a really important point I want people to know because more is not always better when it comes to binders. So sometimes you can only handle one cap of charcoal three times a day, some people can handle more than that. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% so you kind of highlight a couple things. What’s the mechanism? Well, there’s gonna be an adsorbent mechanism thing absorbed more magnet absorbed more like a sponge, right? absorbent sponge adsorbent more magnet. Again, we want to take it after food and supplements. We don’t bind up nutrition. I like starting in a bedtime. So it’s working overnight because a lot of how we detoxify happens around one to 3am. So I like having it in the intestinal tract when the liver and gallbladder dump. That way, it’s there binding stuff up and we can excrete it better. Now, one of the big side effects of activated charcoal on binders is constipation. So I always tell my patients Make sure your bowel movements are regular before you go into killing and use any binders because if we’re adding things that could slow down the motility more well that’s that’s a problem. Now, it’ll at least help pull toxins in but it’s still going to be slowing down your body’s ability to get toxins out of your intestinal tract. So that’s not good. So if that’s the case, we’re going to be adding in things to help move our intestinal tract and make sure we’re passing all of our bowel movement out in 24 hours or less 18 to 24 hours. So we have that effective mechanism of elimination working. So first thing is first check is like hydration. Second check is making sure your bowel movements are working and then if they’re not, we’re going to be adding things in to make sure our intestinal intestinal tract is moving appropriately before we add in binders. And if we have Side effects of constipation with the binders, we’re going to be adding more support to keep the bowels moving. 

Evan Brand: And it’s honestly pretty easy. I mean, it’s a very common kind of gut reaction, oh my god, charcoal, constipation. But I’ll be honest with you, it’s rare that it’s something that requires special attention. Because a lot of times we’re doing extra vitamin C, because most people are low in that most people are deficient in magnesium. So we’re doing extra of that already. A lot of times the herb formulas that you are using for gut infections, those may have some extra bow moving support in those and just by clearing out infections you and I’ve talked about, in the past how bacterial overgrowth can create certain gases that will slow the transit time down, just by eradicating those infections, the bowels can return to normal. So yes, constipation can happen. But it’s usually not a huge wrench in the gears. And we can overcome it pretty easily with minor tweaks if needed.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, exactly. So it can go either way. Some people when they get inflamed, they’re pulling a whole bunch of water in to flush things out. If you’re more prone to be constipated, you just have to be mindful of it. That’s why when we’re adding in binders, we’re doing it like one capsule at a time. So there’s no big jump, where people get into trouble is they just kind of come in there with a higher dose or they jump too fast. And that’s where the problem comes in. And again, like Evan mentioned us some of the herbs that we give may have a really, you know, good laxative effects are really healthy intestinal migrating motor complex work well, if not, I’ll be using special special things like magnesium and things like that to keep the intestinal tract moving. Ginger is a really good pro kinetics. So we’ll be adding that in and really just helping to support the natural migrating motor complex of the intestinal tract while adding some binders now, once we start adding some binders at nighttime, we may do it sometime midday as well that way we kind of have coverage within a 12 hour timeframe. So we have some coverage at night, some coverage during the day. But I always start at night first, partly because that’s when we were dumping a lot of toxins at night. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, let me just address this concern real quick. And then we’ll move on to my next favorite binder, which is chlorella. So just like oh, charcoal, constipation, people go Oh, charcoal mineral depletion. I’ve talked with a guy named Neil Nathan, who wrote a great book called toxic. I often recommend people buy that to look into binders. He has worked alongside a guy named Dr. Michael gray, who’s a toxicologist, I believe he’s out of Arizona, he’s a guy who’s been working on treating mold. For decades, this guy has been using, I’ve heard insane numbers like 50 to 100 grams of charcoal per day, we’re talking literally 8090 100 capsules of charcoal a day for years. And there’s never been an issue of mineral depletion, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever. So his kind of argument after I probed him on that question was, well, what about mineral depletion? He goes well, so what if you lose one or 2% of minerals? If you’re getting 98% of your nutrition and minerals, still, the the pros outweigh the cons in the sense that you’re removing toxins that are affecting hormones, the brain, the liver, the kidney, so he’s like, yeah, maybe you lose a couple percent. But it’s never been something that’s called like a heart attack. Because you’ve lost so much potassium or anything crazy like that. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, you’re just going to be taking it away, you’re going to be just taking it away from it. So that’s going to mitigate most of it. If you’re taking activated charcoal with your food all the time. Yeah, maybe you have a problem. But you’re going to be one you’re going to be kept getting a lot of minerals in your water and food throughout the day. And then you’re going to start by taking it at night when you’re not, like overly hydrating anyway, and to at least two hours after you eat and so it’s not that big of a deal. And so yeah, as long as you time it up, right. I just think that’s a moot point for sure. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. All right. So let’s let’s go into chlorella, because I really love chlorella, and I didn’t know too much about it. Besides that you’d see like little chlorella tablets, it always comes in these little green looks like a little Pez or something and they’re kind of hard to chew, but they’re a little awkward to swallow. And then Luckily, I found a couple companies that make micronized liquid chlorella, and that’s what I often use. chlorella is an algae. But it works amazing as a broad spectrum. So a lot of people kind of market it as a heavy metal detox because it has a really unique ability to bind on to heavy metals like mercury and lead and cadmium and arsenic and aluminum things that every modern human has, whether it’s from breathing and car exhaust, to having amalgam fillings in their mouth, but it’s awesome. And I’ve seen I could show you several case studies on pesticides, herbicides, and mold toxins, and chlorella being used to pull those out. We’ve got in fact before and after results of seeing even little kids, 234 year olds that I’ve worked with where they had major, major major pesticides. These were kids that were diagnosed autistic, are on the spectrum. We give them as high doses we can go with chlorella, we retest after three to six months and guess what the pesticides herbicides are gone. And oh my god. I mean, sometimes it just almost makes you cry because it’s like, wow, how is something like this so beneficial, but you’re not hearing about this on the nightly news?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, absolutely. So the first thing we can do to detoxify I always tell patients is stop adding toxins in. So first stop adding toxins in so look at your pesticides right? Look at the food that you’re eating, make sure it’s organic, no GMOs, you know, make note, no added hormones, don’t consume foods and plastics. If you use plastic, you know, try to keep it in the fridge out of the sunlight out of heat out of the microwave. Excellent clean water, filtered water, clean water, if it’s aro, no big deal, add some minerals back in there, I see a lot of people complaining about our water, hey, I rather have my water cleaner, and then add minerals back in and have water that’s more toxic, because you can’t, you can’t add things into the water that make it more or less toxic. It’s either got to be filtered from toxins, and then you can add minerals back in on the flip side. And that’s totally okay. And then from there. And then from there, that’s going to kind of give you that the first foundation because your food’s good, your water is good. And then all your hygiene products make sure deodorants and skincare and soaps were free of toxins there. And that way when we add in binders, there’s going to be just less things that have to be binded. So our body can work on binding up more things that are released from our tissues that are more stored toxins versus toxins that are coming in every day from our environment. 

Evan Brand: That’s a great point. I even forgot to mention that which is duh. Why did people have to get into the situation where they need binders in the first place? Well, it’s they’ve been exposed to toxins. Now, some people they weren’t exposed to toxins on purpose, it was just they ate organic, but then they, you know, stayed a month in a moldy Airbnb or something and they got exposed that way. So it’s not always your fault. But you’re right, you got to empower people and say, hey, look, you can make a choice, you can either eat organic, and not get exposed, or you can eat conventional. But now you’ve got to do the cleanup work. And it’s much better to stop it before it gets in than having to remove it once it’s already in.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. Now, outside of that we can do things that help our livers function better, we can work on phase one detoxification support, which will take a lot of these fat soluble toxins and convert them into water soluble. Now these toxins are mobile. So the activated charcoal really works great when toxins are now mobilized, if they’re not mobilized, these binders aren’t going to really work well because everything’s kind of be in the tissue kind of stored up so to speak. So it’s gonna be hard to really grab it. So getting phase one detoxification support dialed in B vitamins, antioxidants, these are going to be key nutrients, maybe liver tona fine herbs like milk thistle, or dandelion or artichoke root. I have a supplement called liver supreme or antioxidant supreme are both my phase one detoxification support that gets things mobilized. Now if they’re mobilized now we can come in there with binders and we can soak it up a little bit. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, phase two is important to now a little involved, I would suppose with the with the binder conversation, because if phase two is not working, you know, phase one can be up regulated. But if phase two is not working, it’s like you’ve got a fire hose going into a garden hose and the backup can happen there. And I’ll tell you personally, and clinically, when I start to use nutrients to fuel phase to like some of the amino acids. I’ve taken it too far like with everything, you know, because I’m a guinea pig. But I’ve noticed massive, massive improvements just by helping out phase two. And then if I ramp up phase two too much, I’ll throw in binders and then the binders will kind of help mitigate the hurdles from up regulating phase two. So it’s a it can be a little bit of a seesaw sometimes. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. 

Evan Brand: All right, what else what else should we hit on? We should hit on the the Clay’s a little bit as well. You and I love clays that are awesome. You’ve got zeolite you’ve got bentonite clays, those are kind of your top big ones you’ve got like green clays and such clays are awesome. I find that they are really good at heavy metals and molds and will often use it in a blend. So we’ll use a little bit of clay a little bit of charcoal a little bit of chlorella all at once. And they’re well tolerated. I haven’t seen that many people who works from clay so I don’t have any, you know, evidence beyond clinical with this, but I would say that you seem to have less hurting with clays than you do like chlorella or charcoal. I find you can go too much with the others.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly, yeah. So just to highlight a couple of things here regarding the sulfur. NAC. glutathione glutathione is a tri peptide anyway. So that’s made from glutamine, glycine, cysteine, right, taurine, MSM, alpha lipoic acid, just getting a lot of our sulfur nutrients on board is going to be huge. That’s going to help provide a lot of the building blocks for phase two. And that way we’re going to be able to, you know, and acetylation, glutathione, conjugation, methylation, right, these are going to involve a lot of our phase two nutrients and so Phase One, like methylation will evolve, like b 12. And full eight, right? So we want to make sure all those things are working if we need Now, some people, we’re not going to be pushing the toxification directly, we’re going to just be, it’s gonna be there more to help pick up the dead debris from things that are being killed in the gut. But if the activated charcoal still not enough, we may have to push more of those phase one and phase two, just to make sure those toxins are releasing, and then the binders will be there to catch things a little bit as well. So a little bit of a push catch, if necessary. If not, we’ll just be doing more of a catch and the push will be more from the killing side. So everyone’s a little bit different. And I tend to a lot of times this isn’t a problem when you have the foundation built in first. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, the funny thing is going into this podcast, I thought, oh, wow, this will be you know, pretty easy to explain. But the more we dive into it, the more this thing gets a little tricky. And so case specific because some people, they don’t tolerate up regulating phase two that much, and other people they have trouble with the binders. So we try to make this stuff as simple as we can. But keep in mind people this is not This podcast is not designed to replace one on one functional medicine care. So if you really want to get to the bottom of these issues, you need help you need us to help guide you through this because I don’t want you to go in and just pop in a bunch of charcoal and you feel bad. You don’t know why. And then you’re confused about what you’re going to do next. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% So let’s talk about some binders. So activated charcoal, you mentioned the heating like that the you know the which is going to really have a big binding effect. It’s also going to help with mold as well. We have things like bamboo, bamboo binders are excellent as well. We have things like citrus pectin, which are shown to be very helpful for lead. We have zeolite binders which are very helpful for mold. I think activated charcoal is also very helpful for mold. We have things like beetroot powder, which has some natural binding effects for mold as well. Obviously, we have the medication coolest I mean, which is a really good mole binder. There’s some side effects, though, which can lower your sex hormones fulvic minerals, which have some mold and some binding effects to any comments on the different kinds of binders having chlorella, more on the metal side more for Mercury, though more in the intestinal tract. Anything else?

Evan Brand: Yeah, the colas. darmian is strong stuff. I used it. And, man, I tell you it works. But I do believe that it affected my gut negatively. I do believe that. Now I don’t know if I don’t know if that’s a direct influence, or is it a byproduct of dragging mycotoxins out of the system? I’m not too sure. But I would try to tell people don’t use the prescription binder unless you absolutely have to. And you’re just so miserable. You can’t get yourself out of the rabbit hole with it. Because for me necessary for most. Yeah, for me, I just I really struggled. And I was doing the natural binders for months. And I needed a little extra help. So I did it short term. But I would try to stray most people away the natural binders can be really good if you have enough patience and time to resolve the issues.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And you’ve like for you it’s more of a mold thing. So we’re kind of talking for binders for most people is more in the killing side. Right. So for that you had no problems with it. Right? It was more on the mold side, correct? 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, that’s right. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And then you find you fit on the mold binding side, you found that which is better for you when you had what more glutathione and more so for support in along with the binders? Was that true? 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, the glutathione definitely helped as long as I didn’t do too much. And then also helping the glucuronidation pathway that’s also part of this whole conversation. And so calcium D glucose rate did great things for me. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes, calcium to glucose. It’s good. And that’s a estrogen binder as well as a mole binder. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, it really helps with z, what’s called [inaudible], which is something we test for on the urine. So, you know, like we’ve talked about today, you can have a kind of a broad spectrum approach, but we really try to dial it in if we can, if we see specific mycotoxins, we’ll try to give a little more specific. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. So I think that’s really important. Anything else you wanted to highlight on that?

Evan Brand: I think that’s it. I would just say the first step is really trying to get the data, right, because, you know, people hear the word detox and like, yep, I need some of that. And it’s kind of trendy, which is, I guess, good, but also bad because people just jump into detox not knowing why or what they’re doing or what they’re after. So my recommendation as always our philosophies test, don’t guess and figure out what do you have that you’re detoxing? Do you have a heavy metal burden? Let’s find out. Do you have a mycotoxin burden? Do you have pesticides and chemicals? Do you have all that? Okay, great. Now, let’s make a plan to go after these things. So, like I said, Don’t just run to Whole Foods, buy coconut charcoal and take it if you don’t know why you need it. I prefer people have a reason. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 110% I totally agree. So a couple things, right. So number one, people say toxification. Right? Well, number one, you’re always detoxifying. The question is, are you detoxifying at 100%? Are there enough toxins and stressors in the environment that are impairing your detoxification? where certain toxins are accumulating in your body more than are being eliminated. So number one, you’re always detoxify. Number two, it’s more optimizing your detox vacation systems. Also number three people that talk about cellular detox. That’s marketing garbage. Okay. detoxification is happening at a cellular level. It’s called their cytochrome p 450 oxidase pathways that’s happening biochemically at a cellular level. amino acids, vitamins, minerals, nutrients, these pathways are being upregulated all the time that’s happening at a cellular level. So when people talk about cellular detox, that’s just marketing hooey. Anything you do to help detoxification just drinking more water, guess what you’re enhancing, so detoxification just by you, decreasing inflammation. You having really good nutrition in your food, you’re enhancing the certification. Okay, so don’t get don’t get caught up with a lot of these marketing buzzwords. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, unfortunately, detox is probably the most what would you say? Maybe sleazy snake oily type part of functional medicine? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it is for sure. I think a lot of the time it is because people come at it from that’s the first step. So they’re taking people and they’re just trying to upregulate these pathways right out of the gates. And people have gut issues, and they’re being nutritionally deficient for a while. And there have a lot of toxins that they’re consuming food wise, or in their life. Yeah, they can really feel crappy and sick. So it’s probably the last thing I do out of the gates again, specifically, right, we’re always detoxifying. So if I see a patient and I don’t hit the toxification, specifically with those nutrients, but I get them drinking better, cleaner water, and get them going organic, and get them pooping every day. I am enhancing their detoxification, like, tenfold just doing that alone. Yeah, yeah. I mean, it’s just funny, I guess, it gets a little-

Evan Brand: Cheesy, because that’s one of the few things that your average person who knows nothing about functional medicine knows about is the word detox. They probably heard it before their friend drinking detox tea or something silly like that. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right? And then you have like the master cleanse detox, right, which is, hey, that’s cool. You’re giving your digestive system a break, and you’re not necessarily detoxifying. When you when you do that, I mean, you’re not enhancing nutrition, you’re enhancing fasting and autophagy. And, and that can help with stem cells. And that can help detoxify a little bit, because you’re, you’re fasting. So detoxification is a little bit higher there, but you’re not specifically pushing those pathways. Most of those benefits happen because you’re not consuming a whole bunch of food allergens. People feel better doing a Master Cleanse, it’s typically because their diet usually isn’t that great. So when they go on a Master Cleanse, they’re avoiding a lot of those foods that are inflaming them all the time. The more healthy Your food is, when you go to a cleanse, you’re kind of like, Oh, well, it isn’t that big of a deal, because your food’s already really high quality. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah. silica is on the list, too. There are small nutrients. I mean, there’s there’s boron, there’s trace minerals. Or you may be helpful. Yeah, molybdenum can be helpful. So I think we hit on a lot of the big ones, though, a lot of the big tools that you mentioned the pack, then I’ve done packed and I’ll be honest, I haven’t noticed much from it. I do use it in combination with some other binders. But I’ve never done just like a pectin trial by itself and notice any significant difference, meaning I haven’t taken it. And my head’s clear, like with charcoal, if I’m kind of fuzzy, I’ll take a little charcoal and then boom, you know, I’ll notice the clarity. I don’t know if it’s pectins different maybe it’s not binding on to the type of toxin that’s causing the head drunkenness in the first place. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s better for lead I think and Merc, okay, yeah, we’re for the heavy metals, but it’s still helpful, you know, ya know, if you’re gonna be detoxifying, it’s not gonna hurt having that in there. It just wouldn’t be the only thing you’d have in there.

Evan Brand: Right, right. Yeah. And so, and maybe heavy metals, they don’t have as much of a quick turnaround time on your symptoms, whereas mold does, like, I know, if I’ve taken a mold hit, it’s like, Whoa, it’s a pretty quick symptom reaction. Whereas, hey, I breathe in a little car exhaust, I’m probably not going to feel anything right away from that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. Exactly. Yeah, totally. So anything else you want to add? And I think we really went to town on all this stuff. I mean, I think the key thing I want to highlight for everyone listening, if you’re having a lot of issues or hormone issues of detoxification issues, you know, do the foundation’s out of the gates. But if you’re still struggling, you want to reach out to someone like myself, and Evan, so we can help you all out. We’re available worldwide, and Evan’s at EvanBrand com. I’m at JustinHealth.com, you can click on our schedule buttons, and we can support you and help you during the process. If you need that extra help. We’ve helped thousands of patients together. So we have a lot of experience. And a lot of people have other issues going on, like gut infections, like hormone imbalances, like inflammation issues like other thyroid or autoimmune issues that are part of the issue. And just supporting detoxification by itself won’t be the fix for that. It’s part of a bigger broader plan. Yeah, on the fence. Feel free to reach out guys. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, good point. And some of our mentors that said you really have to kind of market to people for what they think they need, but give them what they truly need. So a woman may say, Oh, I need detox. Okay, so I’m like, Okay, yeah, we can help with that. But hey, guess what, detox is not your number one priority based on these labs, we really need to do this. And as a side effect of working through this, yep, we’ll detox you as well. So, don’t always assume in your head, you’ve got it all figured out. Because there may be a different set or of priorities or a different order of operations. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s always interesting when patients come in, and they kind of have an idea what they want. But then the question is, I’m gonna try to give you what you need. And I’ll try to connect the dots. Because if your goal is to get better and address these issues, then we’re totally in alignment, you just may be, you may think this is what you have to do to get there. But as long as you’re open to guidance, then hey, we can adjust that for sure. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, it’s always a fun process. So Justin mention the links I mentioned a moment of time, Dr. J at JustinHealth.com. available online. And me, EvanBrand.com. And that’s it. So we’ll be back next week. take great care. If you have questions, concerns, comments, you know, write us a review and tell us what kind of topics do you do you want us to cover we’re happy to dive into all of it. We live we eat, we breathe this stuff every day, all day. I mean, this is our life. So we’re very passionate and we would love to hear what you want to hear about. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. And we’ll put a link down below under references for products that we specifically use and formulate to help support some of the pathways and the objectives that we chatted about in today’s podcast. So if you want to support the show, you can also purchase those products that which we believe in personally use for ourselves, patients and family. Awesome, everyone. You guys have a phenomenal day. It was great chatting with y’all. Take care now. Take care.

Evan Brand: Bye bye.


References:

https://justinhealth.com/

https://www.evanbrand.com/

Audio Podcast:

https://justinhealth.libsyn.com/detoxing-with-the-correct-binders-podcast-324

Winter Skin Care Tips: Get Rid of Dry Skin | Podcast #320

Winter can wreak havoc on your skin — making it dry, itchy, and irritated. And it can feel like there’s no escape: Cold, blustery conditions outside can leave your skin feeling raw, while indoor heat zaps moisture from the air and from your skin.

In this podcast, Dr. J and Dr. Evan are talking about skin problems that you might encounter during this season. There are many simple ways to combat the causes of dry winter skin and help keep your skin feeling moist and supple all season long, including some easy changes to your everyday routine. Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

0:23    Skin Issues

4:43    Detox Pathways

13:24  Infections

22:00  Humidity Issues

24:07  Proper Digestion

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We are live. It’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan Brand. Evan, hope you had a great new year great holiday season so far. Today we’re going to be diving into skin issues dealing with skin issues coming the wintertime, all the different things that may happen due to dryness, cold. Lots of sweets from the holidays in the New Year’s all that stuff. Let’s dive in man. How you doing? 

Evan Brand: Doing well. Happy New Year to you. Happy New Year to everybody. This is the first podcast of 2021 Hooray, we need to like clap for a minute. Yeah, exciting. 2021 All right. So skin issues. While I was telling you about my daughter, Jenna, my little 1- 19 month old, she was having some really dry skin on the back of her arms and legs. And so we’ve done a couple of things to help her which is pretty cool. So I’ll share that right off the bat and then we’ll dive into some more root cause stuff. So we really upped up her fish oil we were giving her about it was two squirts of a liquid and it was a professional version so I don’t remember the milligrams but we just doubled their dose so we just kind of doubled her doubled the normal dose of omegas and that seems to help especially if we think what’s happening is like a keratosis Polaris, which is a common situation. And then secondly, we did a babo botanicals brand and it was called a colloidal oatmeal lotion and it was fragrance free. And it’s mainly just like shea butter. We tried coconut oil topically that’s always kind of my first go to for skin issues, but it didn’t touch it. It didn’t help it at all. But when we got this Colloidal Oatmeal Babo Botanical product, it was a game changer. And no This podcast is not sponsored by them. But hey, if you want to sponsor us reach out to great product above to share it with more people.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Very cool. Very cool. So we have the keratosis Polaris, which is where the [inaudible] and kind of just accumulates in the pores and, and you can get this bumpy chicken skin feeling usually like on the back of the arms on the button stuff, right? Is that what you’re referring to? 

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s right. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, you’re saying that the omega threes really helped that omega threes really make a difference and help improve the extra keratin deposits in the pores?

Evan Brand: Yeah, my wife had it too real bad when we first started dating and we’ve got around like, two to four grams a day of omegas and her back her arms feel perfectly smooth now. I mean, of course we got her gut better, we got her diet better, but I honestly think the biggest factor the biggest variable was the omegas.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, the extra omega threes can make a big difference. Also good zinc, extra zinc too can also help. That’s really good to know. So we also talk about skin diet plays a big role. So we have to kind of rule out things like gluten extra refined sugar can feed yeast and bacteria and these things can produce, you know various mycotoxins or endotoxins that can put stress on the liver in the body and you may see the skin reacting as a means to that you may see skin issues and breakouts as a means of that. Also, large amounts of sugar can cause insulin which can cause insulin surges, which can cause extra sebum and sebum, can cause can feed bacteria on the skin which can create more acne and more skin inflammation. Also, things like gluten can potentially drive autoimmune reactions like eczema, psoriasis, potentially even rosacea issues. So you got to look at dairy you got to look at gluten, you got to look at refined sugar that could be driving a lot of that insulin that could be feeding a lot of the microbe was the fungal the yeast, the bacterial overgrowth, which can obviously affect the skin too.

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah. So what about eggs? I think that’s important to mention, too. I personally feel that pulling out eggs is a good strategy for people if they’re unsure of what’s happening with their diet and reactions, that eggs may be a culprit. And then also, conventional dairy. I know that was a big culprit for me. I would like to cheat on it a little bit and do like some grass fed cheese every once in a while but then even that sometimes I’ll notice a skin reaction to it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so eggs could definitely be a role. So for unknown I’d probably want to go autoimmune out of the gates, no grains, legumes, dairy, nuts, seeds, nightshades or eggs and keep the sugar down just so we’re not overfeeding bacteria and yeast which could be causing skin issues like I mentioned earlier. So that kind of be a first step. I always want to look at omega threes, right? Because that can help to KP the keratosis Polaris that can also just help inflammation. Your skin needs really good healthy fats. So if you’re a female and a lot of your skin issues tend to be more based around your cycle. I tend to like fats like borage or black currant seed oil, which are GLA omega six fats, a good omega six, but it can these kind of omega six like GLA fats can really help decrease a lot of the sebum and a lot of the stuff that may clog the pores of the skin. So I do like a lot of the black currant seed oil can be very, very helpful for women’s skin issues. That’s excellent out of the gates. Usually women tend to help it more but if you’re a guy and you’d have more of the KP or the bumps, that’s where really up in the omega threes can make a big, big difference.

Evan Brand: Yeah, awesome. How about detox pathways? Maybe we should mention that I think just supporting the liver I’ve seen personally, especially with kids, when we see skin issues will come in with some liver support. If it’s a kid who can’t take pills, we’ll give them some kind of a liquid liver support tincture and I’ve noticed a big difference especially under the eyes, you know, if we’re talking scan, we’re not just talking like bumps on the arms. We’re not just talking acne, we’re talking possibly like dark circles under the eyes. That’s often at least in Chinese medicine, they say dark circles under the eyes, his liver, and I’ve actually noticed that correlate quite well. When we bring up liver support dark circles under the eyes go away. So if you’re a woman, every morning, you’re doing your makeup. And here you are doing your powder foundation or whatever the heck you’re putting on under your eyes. You might not have to do that if you just support your liver. It’s funny how women, they can just cover stuff up with makeup, but man, we’re not going to cover up it. So we’re going to see the dark circles, we need to treat it root cause we’re not just going to, you know, put some powder on it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, yeah. And so with the we call allergic shiners, so what you see is a lot of lymphatic pooling, so you have a lot of lymph in the face area. And a lot of times what you see is the pooling of the lymph right under the eyes. And a lot of times that’s going to be food allergies, just go on Google type in allergic shiners, okay. And that’s a lot of times because of it’s not like an aging thing. It’s a lot of lymphatic stress because of certain foods. So like I mentioned, cut a lot of those big foods out, see how much that helps decrease the lymphatic pool. And you can also do things to support the lip, right? You can do rebounding, you can do whole body vibration, you can drink ginger, or burdock tea or essiac tea, things that naturally bright clover tea, red roots, etc. Things are naturally support the limp that can be helpful. But if you’re doing that, and you’re still eating foods that are inflammatory, that may still kind of counteract it. So ideally, you know, support the limp and cut out some of those commonly offending foods that may really help decrease that pooling underneath the eyes.

Evan Brand: That’s smart. I didn’t know the the food connection there with the allergies. So what about the darkness? Do you think that’s tied into any kind of toxicity? Or do you think just with the lymph in general, it’s just going to appear dark just because it’s stagnant no matter what.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, a lot of that just has to do with the length. I mean, we’ll pull up a couple pictures here in a minute. But anytime you really increase an immune response, you’re going to just get more lymphatic pooling, and you’re going to see it underneath kids eyes, or Yeah, it’s interesting on kids, and you also see it in, in adults too. But you know, it’s people put they go to the spa, you put a cucumber over it. Why? Because the cucumber telling tends to help disperse a lot of that lymphatic fluid. That’s the reason why. And let me pull up a Google image here so you guys can see.

Evan Brand: And sometimes it’s dark. And then sometimes it’s bags too. Oh, yeah. Yes. You look at the one to the left, though with the little girl. That one. No, go to the second one there. That’s what I’m used to seeing with people. Yeah, just that kind of darkness.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, it just has to do with the increased blood flow and lymphatic pooling. It’s really what it is. Wow. And just cutting that out can make a big, big, big, big difference.

Evan Brand: Yep. I wonder if there’s, there’s got to be a histamine connection to this too. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, anytime you have a food allergy response, part of a allergenic response is going to be histamine at so-

Evan Brand: Oh go back up, go back up on the top there on that screen. The very top of there, it said, Oh, this is interesting. So it was talking about indoor allergens. So mold could be a trigger of the allergic shiners, too. I never even thought about that.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, anytime you breathe stuff into that sinus cavity, right? Whether it’s outdoor allergens, like dander or cedar or things like that, grass pollens, right of course, those can be a big role. But you know, you can see right here what causes it, right. So what happens is the the tissues and the blood vessels in the nose become swollen and a lot of excess fluid happens. People don’t understand when you have a histamine reaction. And a lot of times that causes things to vasal dilate. So these blood vessels get swollen, so you get a lot more blood, you get a lot more lymphatic flow, you get a lot more immune reaction. And that’s why all that stuff sends a pool right there because all that the sinus cavity kind of coming together right in this T zone here.

Evan Brand: There you go. Look at that pollution and perfume and other irritants. So women if there’s any left listening to the podcast, it’s still wear perfume. Stop doing that. That’s so bad. Do essential oils if you want to smell.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. If you want a nice scent do a good really good essential oil, do a lavender do a.. see trying to think of a bunch of other feminine herbs or feminine essential oils if you’re a guy do rosewood or do cedar keep it really simple. You know there’s a couple of really good blends that are out there that I like Frankincense is a pretty good neutral one. You know, I just tend to rely on my nice essential oil based deodorant tends to be really clean and, and works well. But yeah, so you want to not put in, rub toxins on your skin, toxins on the fragrances, all of that can affect bags under the eyes. All of that can affect your skin too, because it’s going to just create more toxicity, more stress on your liver in your body. Now getting back to the hormone stress, if we have more, let’s say detoxification problems that could create issues because if we have estrogen dominance, right, well we have high levels of androgens as a female, right high levels of estrogen estrogen dominance, and it can be low estrogen, but it’s just higher relatively speaking than progesterone, right? That ratio is off that 20 to 25 to one progesterone, estrogen often maybe it’s 10 to one or 15 to one That ratio starts to skew that could put more stress on the liver. And if you have estrogen issues that can be a problem. A lot of women when they consume too much refined carbohydrates and inflammatory foods, they tend to convert more of their estrogens to androgens, testosterone, right stauss rounds and androgen, it’s in the androgen umbrella, right. And those can cause like I mentioned a lot more sebum and more skin issues and more acne that way, and then having prostaglandin imbalances prostaglandin two, which is more inflammatory. Having them one in three supported with a lot of those good fats, like I mentioned, are going to be helpful. So you’re going to really help a lot of the inflammatory pathways with good fish oils, you’re also going to help prostaglandin one and three, which are going to help with the skin with the black currant seed and the borage oil. So those can be very helpful too.

Evan Brand: Good Good call. Also, when we’re coming in with detox support, you mentioned estrogen we’re going to come in with like some phase two detoxification support anyway, so we may come in with something to help with glucuronidation, maybe some calcium D glucose rates, so you wouldn’t think of it like your average person, maybe even a naturopath or a functional Doc’s probably not even going to think calcium D glue, great for skin issues. But if you think that the mechanism of helping with estrogen dominance, it may be a game changer. And then let’s go into the infections a bit. I–

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Also calcium lucre could help with some mold too, because it was any mold exposure that could also help by enough to mold too.

Evan Brand: Totally, yeah, binders plus a little calcium D glue. Great. I think you’re on your way. Let’s Let’s hit on infections. I’m surprised you and I haven’t brought this up here we are this far. And we haven’t thought about infections. I mean, that was a big one for me. I think my face was already better. But I was still suffering quite a bit when you and I first became friends my skin was still not very good because of all my gut infection history.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think you were also still consuming some higher quality dairy that may have been a problem. So some people that are doing a lot of cheese or like milk even if it’s raw. Right and good quality, you may still have a problem with that even if it’s really good clean dairy. Usually butter or ghee tends to be okay because there’s less casein less lactose in there almost none. But if you’re doing other stuff, it could be a problem. Was that an issue? Evan? Do you remember the dairy being a problem? 

Evan Brand: Man, you remember Central Market and all their amazing cheeses I would do some of those grass fed organic cheeses. It wasn’t often though I’ll be honest, it would maybe be like a chunk of cheese every few days or so. But I think even that was too much for me. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and you know, I tell you I can do well with butter or ghee, but I do not do well with milk or cheese as well. What happened is gassy, tend to get loose stools and then skin issues will tend to manifest shortly after for sure. So even high quality dairy not that good. Now the fat based dairy, right? Butter and ghee tends to be different because it’s primarily 99% fat. There’s very little casein, very little lactose, which is the sugar in dairy. And so of course, gese even cleaner than butter because there’s virtually zero casein versus virtually zero. lactose in there. So I tend to be a lot better.

Evan Brand: I mean, it’s curious. How do you do with whey protein? Are you okay with it?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I do. Okay, with wakers weighs 99% casein and lactose free? Mm hmm. Yeah. tends to be a lot better. Yeah, I do okay with it. My favorite is gonna be collagen, you know, high quality grass fed collagen peptides. So I do my true collagen blend, which works great. Because there’s really it’s it’s in a peptide form. So there’s no other larger proteins in there. It’s really clean and well broken down. So that tends to do my powder standpoint does really well.

Evan Brand: Awesome. All right. Well, let’s just talk a couple minutes about infections. I think this is an important part to consider if you have skin issues, I’ve worked with countless small children and teenagers and we always are going to look at the potential for infections. There’s nothing in particular, I’m not going to say hey, it’s got to be blasto. Or it’s got to be this or that. I would just say in general, any type of dysbiosis bacterial overgrowth SIBO Candida H. pylori, the whole party that usually happens together is going to be a potential. And I think the one of the big mechanisms here is just to reduce stomach acid by the H. pylori. So I think enzymes to fix the skin are also another important strategy we’re going to implement.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Anytime we have indigestion and our protein and our fat and carbohydrate molecules of the food that we’re eating are larger and are broken down. You’re going to have intolerances, foods not going to be broken down all the way. And those large globules, proteins, fats, etc, can get into the bloodstream create more immune reaction, also, there’s going to be a fermentation that happens when those food molecules are not broken down all the way and that can create bacterial overgrowth. And we know hydrochloric acid does have a way of being disinfected in a way it really decreases. bacteria and yeast flow to the intestines. And if we have low levels of acid, it’s kind of like missing the natural disinfectant on your table. Right? That you know that can help clean things up in your body so that that’s definitely a real thing there. And the other component i would say is being because we were kind of talking about the holidays and Christmas is it can get very dry in the wintertime and a lot of places in this country. And so having a really clean moisturizer can be helpful. Now it depends So we’re just talking about, you know, person with dry skin, we may just choose a really, really good clean shea butter, or coconut oil or just a really clean, moisturizing product from a high quality company. And you can use skin deep cosmetic database Environmental Working Group database to look at healthy skin products that have really good ingredients in there. I like to use the Marie Veronique products. I like their lipid barrier complex and their barrier restore serum. They work amazing. I use that on my skin. And I had one child that had eczema, he’s kind of gotten over it, he’s done really well. We’ve kind of cleaned out the his diet and his mom’s diet too. So things like salicylates could be a potential problem outside of just your autoimmune foods. And then we use a really clean, hypoallergenic moisturizer called Vannapply. Again, it’s not anything like nutritious for the skin. But sometimes when the skin’s inflamed, immunologically, from an autoimmune skin issue, sometimes the skin just needs moisture and not things that could potentially stimulate the immune system. So sometimes a clean thing like that can be very helpful. So that applies very good. There’s another product called La Roche-Posay, I’ll pull it up, it’s a French brand of a moisturizer. And that works very good, as well as providing just really good moisture. And then sometimes we may have to change the environment, sometimes it gets very, very dry, you know, 20, to 20%. And humidity, we may have to add a humidifier into the kid’s room or into the adults room to get a little bit more humidity in the room. The big X Factor is don’t just leave it on non stop, because you can actually create mold it with a humidifier if it’s unchecked, unchecked Uncharted. So you have to make sure that if you’re adding humidity to the room, it’s for a season, it’s for a reason it’s for a short period of time. And you may want to have a humidity detector in the room just to make sure you don’t get above you know, 50% where mold could grow.

Evan Brand: Yeah, you know what I was thinking I’ve never seen it, maybe it exists, it’d be cool to have a humidifier that actually has an hygro hygrometer built in. So like you could set your for you know, 40% and then you’re pumping humidity in and then it hits 40 and shuts off. That’d be super cool.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I 100% agree. Yep.

Evan Brand: So I think the x layer would be good too for just to implement this as a tangent, not related to skin. But the xylitol spray for the sinuses are is awesome too, because that can help moisturize it. And the next layer is kind of a good, natural antimicrobial, if you will, it can help a little bit with the sinus cavity. But yeah, back to the skin. So how we’re going to investigate this was peoples, we’re going to start with diet, we’re going to come in and say, probably remove the eggs, definitely get off the dairy, get off the gluten. And then we’re going to come in and do stool testing, we’re going to do urine organic acids. So we can look at all the different bacteria that may not show up. You see, sometimes what happens I had to happen last week, we had a guy who, on the organic acids, he looked pretty good. There wasn’t any kind of bacterial overgrowth evidence, but when we got to his stool test, he had Prevotella and klebsiella, and all sorts of bacteria off the chart. And so if someone’s on an extreme budget, maybe one test would be sufficient. But in most cases, we’re going to try to get the full picture because it’s hard to make a puzzle complete if you don’t have all the pieces. And so that’s really why we’re gonna want to look at multiple things. And then as you mentioned environment, we’re going to factor that into, and then potentially improving the indoor air quality. So what if you are having some sort of an allergic reaction to your environment, whether it’s mold or dander, pollen, or whatever, something like a really good charcoal filled air filter, it’s going to be a game changer, possibly putting charcoal in your body, you know, supplementing with binders, and then addressing any infections we see supporting the liver bumping up omegas. I think stress has a factor. We talked about hormones, we talked about the estrogen we talked about glucuronidation. I think those are really the main variables. Do you think we’re missing anything else?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: No, I think we hit it pretty well. My only other component is if you have eczema or psoriasis, and your skin’s overly dry and you’re trying to get the dryness down while you’re fixing the root issue. I mentioned the vanapply vanicream product being good. And the other one was the La Roche-Posay, and it’s the lipikar balm is a nice one. It’s just a lot of moisture, which can decrease a lot of the dryness and then when the dryness is decreased, that decreases the itching and when the aging is decreased, that can help decrease a lot of the inflammation. But you have to make sure a lot of people when the eczema psoriasis kind of Facebook groups because I follow a lot of them just to read what they’re doing. They want a magic solution. They want something to rub on their skin and have it all go away. But that’s never how it is. So you typically have to get to the underlying issue with foods and guts stuff too. So make sure if you do something that’s a lotion that’s topical, make sure you’re not ignoring the internal stuff.

Evan Brand: Well that one sounds so fancy. It’s got to be good just based on the way you pronounce the name of it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I know like a nice little long French name there with the Amazon links in the description so you guys can access it. And then you mentioned the other one that had the oatmeal in there. That was really clean. What was the product?

Evan Brand: Yeah, I’ll give it the link to it it’s like a there’s like a kid’s, like fragrance free version. It’s like a colloidal oatmeal product.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It began with a B right?

Evan Brand: Yeah Babo. Yeah let me look I’ve got it here. I was like colloidal oatmeal lotion and this stuff is awesome I tell him my wife’s like honey this look at look at her skin and I was feeling these areas on our little girl’s skin like man it’s it’s crazy and yeah here it is nine bucks can’t beat it. So it’s called Babo Sensitive Hydra lotion, Chamomile Calendula. And then like I said, it’s got the colloidal oatmeal, I’ll put you the link in the I’ll put it in your chat here if you want to look at it.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And is there any worries at all with that due to gluten sensitivity in the oats?

Evan Brand: I don’t think so. We haven’t seen any type of issue. I know there’s a possibility. You’ve got that Avena Sativa Kernel Flour. So it does have the oat flour in there. I mean, if I thought that was some autoimmune possibility, we may stay away with it. But it’s a pretty rare situation. I’ve only seen a few people where we thought that they were going to be sensitive enough to it, you know that we should pull it out or find something without oats I’m not doing like oatmeal bass or anything like that, you know, this is just like the the spot of maybe a quarter at most on the areas and that’s like maybe once a day, if that issues- 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -any kind of here and there to kind of knock it down. It’s not like a staple. 

Evan Brand: No, no, no, we’re not lathering her in it or anything. It’s just like a spa treat is is all we’re using it for. I know some people get crazy with lotions or lathering the whole thing. Now I think I’d probably stay away in that case, but for spa treats, probably. Okay,

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s smart. Excellent. I think we hit a lot of good skin stuff. Today we talked about some of the hormone stuff with female hormones. We talked about some of the androgen component and how that can tie into insulin. Don’t forget guys, high levels of insulin can drive excess estrogens in guys. And that can cause other issues too, and put stress on the liver. We talked about some mold stuff. We talked about allergen issues, food allergies and stuff and some of the eye stuff. We talked about the humidity issues in the winter, where it gets drier, maybe get a humidifier really monitor the percent humidity if you can get one that has engaged that test the environment and let’s say it doesn’t go above 40% or 35%. That’s better, because that way you kind of have a limiter on there. It doesn’t go over the top. We at one point had the humidifier on too much. This was years ago, and we noticed a little bit of mold in the in the carpet nearby. And we never made that mistake again. So if you use a humidifier, like put a timer on it, like an hour or two, boom, have it go off. Don’t leave it on all the time. Be smart about it.

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s interesting. When you think about a humidifier, right tip tip, typically, people are going to just sit it on like a wood, night nightstand or something and then that wood is probably just absorbing all that moisture. It sounds like a recipe for disaster if you overuse it for sure.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So you may be like if you can, if your kid has some humidity issues, skin issues, maybe put it on for an hour or two at night, put a timer on it done. Yeah, and that way, it’s not going to go the whole night. But we’ll provide a little bit of relief and and help the mucous membranes that may be a little bit overly dry.

Evan Brand: And then also, you know, don’t overbake don’t over with your soaps or shampoos or conditioners make sure everything’s clean there. Don’t over soap yourself. I mean, you’re not you don’t need to lather your whole body and soap. I think that’s an easy one. Regarding hand soaps, I mean, I know a lot of the conventional ones are gonna dry out hands and skin. So we got to mention that also water filters are key. That’s why you and I both have whole house water filters, because the chlorine and the trihalomethanes and all the irritants in the tap water can irritate your skin in the shower.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s a big one. Yeah. So if you have a lot of chlorine and a lot of chemicals in the water that can be very irritating on your skin. So we really want to make sure that that is addressed with a high quality filter. And that will take stress off your skin a ton really well.

Evan Brand: I don’t travel with it. I even bring like the Berkey or a comparable shower filter. Like when we went to Florida last winter, I brought a portable shower filter with us man, it was a game changer because, you know, we wanted to fill up the bathtub for the kids because the chlorine was so strong. So luckily, we just filled the tub with the showerhead filter. And it was awesome. So we didn’t take the kids and they weren’t just breathing in chlorine.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s good. That’s really good. And the only other thing I would just say beyond that is just making sure you’re digesting your fats and proteins well. So people think oh, I’m gonna just drink a whole bunch of water that’ll get moisture to my skin, it’s like well, you need a good fat carrier to bring that hydration to the skin. A lot of times the skin and the you know, these are that layer there’s a hydrophobic layer in the skin so it does not like water. So you need fat to kind of bring that moisture to that skin. So if you don’t have enough fat you will get very dry skin and dry skin can get more irritated, you tend to scratch that dry skin more and then that scratching creates inflammation and that inflammation just it’s a kind of a self defeating cycle. So you really want to make sure you have good healthy fats in there and at least half those fats should be saturated fats coconut oil, it should be high quality grass fed animal products. It should be pork, pork fat lard and if you want to do any plant fats Keep it to high quality olive oil, avocado oil, maybe some palm, obviously coconut is going to be a great fact that it’s saturated and it’s plant. So those are a couple of good things to do just to make sure you have good fats. And of course, if you don’t have good digestion, you know, at least get into enzymes and some HCl In the meantime, while you work on fixing your stress or fixing your gut In the meantime, for better absorption and digestion.

Evan Brand: You know, the way I look at it, it’s rarely going to be just a skin issue, there’s going to be possibly bloating, gas, burping, some type of food sensitivities, food reactions, right skin issues are rarely going to occur in isolation. So I think of it as a clue, right? You and I talk about clues in functional medicine, the skin is really just a clue. And then we think Oh, interesting what’s going on under the hood. So that’s where we come in, and do the testing. And if you need help clinically, please reach out. We would love to help we work with people worldwide, via phone, FaceTime, Skype, etc. We’re very blessed to be able to provide lab testing to people across the globe, and to provide solutions to healthcare that other practitioners and doctors have failed before. So if you need to reach out clinically, you can reach Dr. J at JustinHealth.com. You can reach me Evan Brand at EvanBrand.com and we look forward to 2021 together so let’s have some fun. Give us some comments and questions if you’re on watching listening on Dr. J’s YouTube channel. Put some potential topic ideas in there. We’re always open to new topics. We talk about stuff we think’s important, but if you have some issues or concerns, you know, we’re happy to do kind of like some q&a stuff too. So please give us some feedback.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. If you guys want to reach out and dive in deeper it could be a good issue could be a hormone issue. EvanBrand.com for Evan, JustinHealth.com for myself, we are here to help worldwide. Thank you guys, and I hope you guys are having a great start to 2021 and we’ll be here you guys take care. Bye now.

Evan Brand: Take care.


References:

https://www.evanbrand.com/

https://justinhealth.com/

Audio Podcast:

https://justinhealth.libsyn.com/skin-care-tips-to-improve-dry-skin-podcast-320

Recommended Products:

GPL Mycotox
Omega Supreme
La Roche-Posay Lipikar Cream
Mother Of All Cream
Babo Botanicals Sensitive Skin Hydra Therapy Lotion
Air Doctor Air Purifier
Whole House Dehumidifier
Water Filtration Device
Whole House Water Filter
Clearly Filtered
Pelican Water
Organic Grass Fed Meat

 

Can Parasites Cause Thyroid Problems? | Podcast #316

Parasitic infections are a big problem in tropical and subtropical regions of the world. In this video, Dr. J and Evan will share how to handle these cases. One of these is giardiasis that may cause diarrhea, gas, upset stomach, greasy stools, and dehydration; cryptosporidiosis, which may cause stomach cramps, stomach pain, nausea, vomiting, dehydration, weight loss, and fever; toxoplasmosis may cause flu-like symptoms, including swollen lymph nodes and muscle aches or pains that can last for over a month. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

0:05    Parasites and Thyroid Issues

8:05    Conventional Medicines on Parasites

12:50   Thyroid Symptoms

16:54   Adrenals as Natural Inflammatory

19:55   Gut Healing Protocols

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there, it’s Dr. Justin Marchegiani. I’m with Evan Brand, Evan, how are we doing today? My friend?

Evan Brand: I’m doing well. I’m excited to dive into this, you thought of the idea of parasites and thyroid issues? And I said, Well, that’s easy, because we’ve seen hundreds and hundreds of cases at this point where thyroid issues magically get better or even resolve themselves just by fixing infections. Now, I will I will say that, you know, even though the title of this is parasites and thyroid, I would argue other infections are probably going to be happening at the same time. It’s rare that you and I, when we’re doing functional stool testing, it’s rare that you and I find just a parasite, right? Like, we’re probably going to find some Candida, we’re probably going to find some cebo type stuff, maybe some CFO issues, maybe some worms, maybe some gut inflammation, but parasites can be a really big catalyst for thyroid issues. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. So we talk about these topics, you know, in a lot of different ways, so we try to nuance it a little bit. So if you’ve heard topics on parasite infections before from our podcast, we’ll try to make it a little bit different for you. So you get a little bit of a different perspective on this. So parasites are really a big deal. Gut infections is general and you can kind of lump in SIBO and Candida with this as well. Parasites can be a little bit more severe. Right, we have blasto, e, histo, Giardia, Cryptosporidium, any of the immediate miba infections, d fragilis. penta trichomonas, hominess. Trying to think of some other ones here, we have different worm infections, right. And these can all create inflammation in the body. But more importantly, besides inflammation, they can create gut permeability. And when the guts more permeable, we can have more immune stress, right, the more the immune system is stressed, because 80% of the immune systems in the malt, and the golf, right malt is the mucosal associated lymphoid tissue that’s in the stomach. I’m sorry, that that’s in the small intestine and the golf, that’s the gastric associated lymphoid tissue that’s in the stomach. And we have immune cells in these tissues. And the more stressed they are, the more gut permeability we have due to infections, that can really exacerbate the immune system. And they can wind it up so to speak. And the more wound up the immune system is that can facilitate an autoimmune attack. And that means your immune system starts making B cell or antibodies to the thyroid, and you may make things like TPO antibodies, which may affect the enzyme that helps bind that thyroid together, thyroid peroxidase. And that can affect the thyroid. And you may make thyroid globulin antibodies, which work on the extra cellular protein on the thyroid, and that can attack that. And so when you start damaging and beating up the thyroid due to autoimmune attacks, that can impair thyroid function and thyroid hormone binding. And a lot of that can start with the immune system. And the biggest trigger for that can be a gut infection. 

Evan Brand: So let’s roleplay a little bit if you don’t mind. So, you know, I’m Joey, and I go down to the the local gastroenterology clinic and I tell him that I saw this guy named Dr. Justin on the internet and he told me that, you know, blast over crypto or God may be causing my thyroid issues and the gastro doctor says no, you live in America, you know, not gonna happen. What do you say to that guy? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, that’s kind of the the big thinking with a lot of conventional doctors is, hey, these parasite infections only happen in third world countries. And so it’s a big deal in third world countries. It’s like one of the number of top five causes of death in third world countries partly because you get amoebic dysentery, massive diarrhea, electrolyte depletion, cardiac arrest, or some kind of hyponatremia symptom, because you have massive diarrhea. Now here, you go to an ER, they put you on an IV, they flooded with antibiotics, and more than likely, you’re gonna be fine, right? You may have side effects later, that’s a whole different podcast, but you’ll be fine. The problem is, we kind of look at parasite infections having this acute symptomology that results from the infection. And a lot of times, that may not be the case, you may be in this kind of functional asymptomatic place where you don’t have over diarrhea, you don’t have over constipation. You know, you may have some but not a ton. And then a lot of times it’s just enough where they kind of throw the IBS diagnosis at you, they may run a scope they may not see anything, they may run a stool test not using the best technology so they may miss whatever’s there. Now, if you have a serious infection, there technology, you know, basic stool antigen looking under a microscope, they’ll probably catch it. But if it’s there’s not a lot of bolus of that parasitic material, they may miss it and that’s where some of the DNA technology maybe a little bit better for picking up parasites. So this is why they may miss it, number one, number two, you may have kind of these subclinical symptoms that may get lumped into the category of IBS, which is a diagnosis of exclusion, meaning they ruled out krones all sort of colitis, right? They ruled out bowel impaction acid reflux, all these other inflammatory issues, ulcers, right? And now, okay, all the serious stuff is ruled out. So they just say, okay, we’re going to just call it IBS. And then they’re going to just give you some medications to control whatever symptoms you have going on, whether it’s antispasmodics acid blockers, whether it’s um, constipation, medic medicate medication like laxatives, or bloating, medication, etc, gas x, that’s all they’re gonna do after that. And we know with functional medicine world, a lot of parasite infections can actually cause energy and mood issues. And so this is totally over their heads in conventional medicine world, because now they’re used to connecting gut infection to gut symptoms. It’s like an A, it’s like a one to one relationship. Right? Now you start going three dimensional here, when you start talking about gut infections, exacerbating your thyroid, causing an autoimmune attack, and now you have anxiety and heart palpitations in in fatigue and depression all throughout the day. Now what? And then now if those symptoms happen, you’re more than likely going to be prescribed a anti depressant or medication to treat those symptoms. So you’re kind of getting this really big cascade of symptoms that don’t quite match up with the conventional mindset. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and it blows their mind and then they get overwhelmed, and then they’ll dismiss you and then they may send you off to the psychiatrist. And they say, Well, you know, I don’t really help with anxiety. I’m focused on the gut portion of this. Luckily, you know, what we do as practitioners we come in and we’re not neurologists and gastroenterologist and endocrinologist and, you know, kidney experts, but we’ve had enough experience to where we can actually address each piece of this spiderweb. I mean, you you eloquently described it here, you’ve got the GI complaint that most people think about, they think, okay, if I have parasites, I’ve got to have diarrhea, I’ve got to have stomach pain, not necessarily. We’ve seen hundreds of people where they’re just a little bit tired. And maybe once every few weeks, they have kind of a cyclical gut issue. Right? So for me, it was definitely, it was definitely like a cyclical pattern. And I was trying to track it down to the diet. I thought, okay, you know, is it dairy? So then we got off dairy and then we like, reintroduce grass fed dairy without Okay, is it that Okay, what about the grains is the grains? No, it was the infections, but they had a cyclical pattern. So when you start bringing stuff up like that, you’ll literally you just lose the ear of the the conventional practitioner. So back to the thyroid piece, or you mentioned like the immune cells, you mentioned the immune stress. Now, we’re also going to be looking at blood for this right? So you would suggest if we are seeing a lot of these hyper hypo symptoms, yes, we’re going to run some DNA stool testing. But we’re also going to want to look at blood too, because we may find some other answers there. Now, I would argue, and I’m guessing you may agree with me that the blood is going to be more of looking at the effect, not necessarily the cause. Meaning if you look at the gut infections, that’s more of a cause. But we may see the TPO antibodies, you may see the tg antibodies, you may sit, we may see like a high reverse t three. But but that doesn’t necessarily change the game plan, right? Because you still have to go to the gut to fix the parasites that caused the high reverse t three in the first place.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct. So how conventional medicine looks at things right may not pick some of these things up. So let’s say they’re even looking in the thyroid, let’s say they’re kind of let’s say they’re entertaining. And let’s say you listen to this podcast, you go in, and they’re testing your gut, and you’re like, Hey, can you also look at my thyroid, too, they may not even run these markers, as they typically run just TSH, and maybe if you’re lucky, you can get a T for free your total. That’s it. Now, if your TSH is overly high, then it’ll get picked up. But what is overly high, you know, maybe greater than four and a half to five. But it can take a long time for the TSH to go that high. Like TSH doesn’t just go high like that, in the snap of your fingers, it takes a lot of years, maybe even decade to get to that level. So if you have high TSH, you can just guarantee that that issues been going on for a long time. So that’s pretty much how you know if it’s a if it’s been going on for a while. And then now you have the downstream t four and T three that need to be looked at and T three is very important because T three gets converted from t four. So t four is your inactive thyroid hormone. T three is your active thyroid hormone. We almost never test this T three number. And a lot of times we can have a conversion issue. So your T four may be adequate. And then we have a drop in T three. So t three is not at an equal par In regards to the percentile of the reference range. And then we definitely know antibodies aren’t tested. That’s really tough. And partly because they don’t do anything because of it because treating a thyroid autoimmune condition with conventional medicine standards. They use high dose prednisone and immunosuppressive medications, those medications for a thyroid issue that would actually cause more side effects than the thyroid issue itself. So they tend to stay away from treating a thyroid issue. So they don’t really do any tests to reveal that it’s there. If it’s autoimmune, so you kind of get stuck in no man’s land. 

Evan Brand: Oh god, that’s a great point. That’s what I was gonna say. I mean, it just frustrates me where you and I will have you know, new patients come and they’ll send us bloodwork and we’ll look at these, you know endocrinologist that may have even extra credentials, but yet their their thyroid panel is still more generic than what you and I are running. And it just infuriates me, because these people, they’re spending so much money, they’re traveling to Mayo Clinic and whatever else, and they’re still not even getting what you and I would consider basic or foundational screening, it’s really frustrating.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s a combination of two things. It’s a combination of one they’re not aware, because they’ve kind of been like handcuffed, like, Oh, we can’t do anything about it anyway. So they kind of feel a little bit handcuffed and defeated. And then number two, they don’t want to piss off the insurance company. Because if they’re ordering via the insurance company, they don’t want the insurance company kicking them out of network for doing unnecessary testing, right? So you get in this position where you’re like, crap, well, how do I how do I handle this? How do I navigate as a doctor? And so we exist in the world of cash medicine, so we can do what we want and do what we recommend and need, what the patient needs. And we don’t have to worry about some insurance company dictating what we can do for the patient. The problem with insurance is they can’t they get in the middle. And they’re basically imagine someone getting in between you and your doctor and questioning everything you’re doing and saying, well, you probably don’t need that. So well. Let me talk to the patient about that. And see if the patient thinks we need it or not. I’m going to make a recommendation most of the time the patient’s like, yeah, that totally makes sense. Let’s do it. But imagine that insurance company stepping in between you and saying, Well, I don’t know about that. So we have that advantage in on the functional medicine side not going through insurance, because we can give the patient exactly what they need. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, great point. Yeah, I mean, the question my grandfather, for years, I would push him, Hey, I really want you to get full thyroid panel, I really want you to get vitamin D, and then the doctor would immediately push back, well, vitamin D is not going to be covered. Are you okay with that? You know, and then of course, it always ended up being covered. So it was this weird, like in between land where you feel like you’re not getting the proper care that you need, because they’re fearful, you know, the doctors are fearing that they’re going to go, like you said out of the network, or kind of out of their normal bounds of training. And then also, like you mentioned, that would illuminate any deficiencies they have in their treatment model, because if all of a sudden, they run TPO antibodies, and you do the follow up, and they’ve never looked at TPO antibodies, they don’t have a clue to say, Hey, why don’t we do a DNA stool test? Let’s go look at these infections in your gut. Now I’m connecting the dots here, you’re having anxiety, heart palpitations, you’ve got elevated TPO antibodies, and you’re having cyclical diarrhea, Hmm, I don’t know what the heck to do. Here is your thyroid medication. Here’s your Synthroid, or whatever. And then here is maybe, like you said, an IBS type drug. And that’s it. So let’s get back more to the action steps. I think we’ve done a great job of kind of illuminating, how does this happen? But first step, when somebody comes in and you see thyroid, you see gut issues. You mentioned DNA stool test, are you going to run blood immediately? Or is that more of like a downstream effect? So you don’t worry about it up front? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You mean blood for the thyroid? 

Evan Brand: Yes. Like, are you going to do thyroid panel at the same time as a stool? Or are you going to just focus on the gut? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Only if I see over thyroid symptoms, if there’s any family history, because a lot of times thyroid can overlap with adrenals. So I always look at the adrenals. First before thyroid unless we see a lot of hair loss, a lot of cool hands, a lot of cool feed stuff, a lot of weak fingernails, if we see a lot of low thyroid symptoms, that I’m going to take a look at it. Now most people they’ve already done some digging around their thyroid before they come see me. So usually, there’s some labs that have already been run that I can look at. And if not, then if we have those issues, then we’re either going to one, just go after the adrenals month one if we don’t have any overt symptoms, and see how we do. And then if we’re not having improvements out of the gates in regards to temperature, energy, those kind of things, then we do it. If we see that temperature and energy is a big deal out of the gates and we know cold hands cold feet hair loss, we can quantify that maybe with some basil, temperature testing, and we know it, then we’ll probably just rule out that low thyroid out of the gates just to make sure so it just kind of depends where patients are coming in from. And of course, if it’s family history that that’s we’re going to really dive into that. And because autoimmunity affects women five times more than men, if it’s a female patient, I’m a lot more on point with it. And if we have history of it, sister, aunt, uncle, mom, dad, whatever, then we’re going to be looking even more closely. But if I’m on the fence, usually I’ll just have patients do some basil, temperature testing with a really good digital thermometer. And we use the protocol in the members area, which is, you know, testing armpit axillary area and 97.8 to 98, two in the morning, or 98 to 98 six for the mouth. And we’ll just kind of test that we’ll do three, three temperatures test in the morning before you get up and move around. And we’ll just kind of get a window of how good that temperature is or not. 

Evan Brand: So if you’re on that low end, did you say 97.8 was at your low end?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s armpit axillary, same thing. So when you’re nine to 98, six for the mouth oral. 

Evan Brand: Okay. So if you’re at that very low end, is that still okay? Or you start to get concerned in that 97.8 level.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It would depend it would depend where the patient is if they have thyroid symptoms, I’d be more I start to get more concerned when they’re going below 97. Mm hmm. You know, also, I’m always I’m always in 97, like, I’m 97.8 all the time, and I’m thinking, well, crap, you know what, why am I not 98. But that isn’t that big of a deal. Like I’m getting a little more concerned, I’m below 97. But with women, you got to be careful because women’s temperature can dip right before oscillation and then peak as going through regulation. So if you grab that temperature, right before isolation, it could look a little bit artificially low. But also, if you grab it right in and after ovulation, it could be artificially high. So as a female, you know, the best time of the cycle to test is part of that first five or six days? 

Yeah, okay, that’s good information, you know, what’s it want to first aid, you bleed so that first five or six days, from bleeding onward.

Evan Brand: It’s a little bit of a tangent, but I’ll just mention it because you’re on temperature. So apparently, Lyme spy repeats affect the hypothalamus, which affects body temperature. So I’ve used temperature as well as kind of an investigation tool. And as we’ve treated people with Lyme issues, sounds like maybe the hypothalamus starts working more efficiently. And then boom, temperature regulation gets better, because that was a big issue for me, where, you know, I had major issue with the cold. And we’d always look at thyroid, we knew, you know, you know, my my gut story with parasite infection. So I would look at thyroid, and I would never see any issues, I was always perfectly in the functional ranges. So there are some other pieces to this puzzle. But I want to hit on the adrenal piece, too. That was interesting. So you had brought up like this adrenal thyroid connection to and that’s going to be tied into the gut, right, you’re going to see potential adrenal issues because of the immune stress based on the gut stress. So it could go gut affecting adrenals. And then adrenal is affecting thyroid, right? It might not just be gut thyroid, you’re saying the missing link in between those two is adrenals. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It can be because the adrenals are your natural anti inflammatory. So if you have a lot of inflammation in the body, from a infection, your adrenals are going to be spitting out cortisol, natural corticosteroids to help with that inflammation and stress. So like conventional medicine, a lot of times we’ll do prednisone, right? That’s like a really strong steroid. Well, your body has its own natural steroids it would use so of course, if you’re whipping that tired horse, that can be something that gets affected. And then of course, when your immune system starts getting overly stimulated from infections from now, maybe an increased chance of food allergens, because now your guts more permeable, undigested food particles can kind of make their way into the bloodstream and create more immune stress because now your immune system sees foods floating around the bloodstream and digested that shouldn’t be there. And so then now, you know, your, your immune is maybe tagging those proteins. And we know the surface proteins on gluten, for instance, maybe dairy, those the surface proteins look very similar to the thyroid, so your body can actually start mistakenly attacking thyroid tissue because those proteins look kind of similar. 

Evan Brand: And yeah, and I just want to clarify this issue is going to be more common. It’s going to happen more frequently, when there are gut issues disrupting the immune regulation, correct. It’s not like in every person, dairies magically going to trigger thyroid antibodies, you’re saying in these gut compromised people that may have infections because of the intestinal permeability being increased? Now there’s more antigen getting in to the bloodstream and then boom. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, it’s gonna be heightened more with an infection, because like, imagine the infection is like already kind of cracking the door open and your gut lining a little bit more. But let’s say you didn’t have an infection. It’s possible certain food allergies could be enough to crack that door as well. Right. Okay. But either way, let’s say you are sensitive and you have food allergy issues, and you have an infection now, it’s a double whammy, instead of that door being cracked open. Now it’s wide open, right? Yes, that makes makes that makes perfect sense. Yeah, for me, I mean, I used to do really, really poorly with dairy now really high quality dairy, I can get away with a little bit because I’ve healed my gut so much. So for me, I saw it. And it depends, right? Because not all dairy is created equal. So butter, fats and high fat dairy is usually different than dairy that has more casein, right? casein based areas tend to be like, more cheese or milks, right fat based areas and they’ll be like ghee, butter, maybe heavy cream. So casein tends to be the more allergenic portion of the dairy. And then, of course, we have lactose and lactose is the sugar portion of the dairy. So lactose, it’s more of an intolerance. And you just get more digestive disruptions where casein could be more of that immune stimulant. So things like people that have dairy intolerances, still may be able to tolerate ghee or butter. Because Because it’s not, it’s pretty low in casein much higher in the fat. Fats tend to be more neutral for people tend to be able to tolerate good fats, especially saturated fats because they’re, they’re not easily oxidized. 

Evan Brand: Yes, yes. Well said that’s a great point. So what about the influence of the gut healing protocols that we implement, and thyroid because people are hearing parasites, so they’re thinking, kill, kill, kill. And that definitely is part of it. And you and I’ve seen where just by eradicating infections, we’ve seen multiple things happen, which is pretty cool. So number one will see that the Secretory IgA, which is a marker, we look at on stool testing secretory, IGA will come up just as a side effect of clearing out infections. And that already indicates, hey, look, we’re starting to get on the healing path before we even did a quote healing protocol. And then we’ll see thyroid antibodies come down sometimes hundreds, sometimes 1000s of points, just by clearing the infections out. Okay, so that’s really like boom, clear infections out. But what about the gut healing phase? What are you seeing there? Are you seeing that that’s the, you know, the secret sauce, where thyroid really comes down in the gut healing phase? Are you finding, you know, if you had a pie chart, are you saying killing is doing most of the work for leaving the stress on the thyroid? Is it the gut healing phase? is there is there one that’s a bigger importance than the other? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Depends on how acute the infection is, but we’re doing so many things at once. Like, this is the question I get, like, what’s causing What? And it’s like, it’s very difficult to know that because what’s the most important number in a combination to your safe log? what’s the what’s the most important ingredient in the recipe your mom makes, right? Well, it’s a combination, everything, right. And so when you’re dealing with an infection, I’m very rarely coming in there and practicing Acute Care Medicine where we’re just going after an infection where we’re changing the diet, we’re decreasing inflammation by having a healthy anti inflammatory kind of paleo template, we’re improving digestion, that in its own right starts to improve nutrient absorption, we may add in some extra nutrients as well, that are easily bioavailable. So then we can get those in our bloodstream and start utilizing the metabolically. Obviously, the thyroid needs some zinc, it needs some selenium, it needs some iodine. Of course, we don’t want to ever go overly high with iodine because that can actually increase autoimmune attack, but a couple 100 micrograms, as long as there’s not an acute attack may be fine. And then of course, we’re working on supporting hormones, right, we working on maybe supporting thyroid, if the thyroid is depleted, meaning you’ve had a decade or so autoimmune attacks, you may need some thyroid hormone, depending on how much that that thyroid been beaten down. If the thyroid still functioning, well, then just doing a lot of the good nutritional strategies may be enough to help it do what it’s what it needs to do. And then we’re coming in down the road going after the infections a little bit later. Now we’re an antibiotic kind of focus generation, right? It’s like, Oh, I have an infection, you have this antibiotic, antibiotic antibiotic. So that’s kind of translated to people wanting to kill whatever they have right away. Now, if it’s an acute infection, you went to Mexico, you ate something like you just got diarrhea, and you’re having like a dozen VMs a day, right. And it just diarrhea, that we may have to handle that differently than like a chronic infection that’s been happening over the long run. So I always put infections in two different groups, acute or chronic. And then we always still have to work on doing all the foundational things. If it’s acute, it may be a lot more compressed over a couple of days versus a month or two, if it’s a more chronic issue, and regarding how we start going after the gut. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and the adrenal is maybe less important to deal with right away, if it’s a really bad, acute thing. It just depends upon like, Hey, I’m great, I’m great, I’m great, boom, I’m going to the bathroom a dozen times a day, it’s not good. My tummy feels like crap. If it’s that kind of an acute thing, and you were relatively okay ahead of time, then we’re going to look at that differently than a chronic infection. I love the analogy, what is the what’s the most important, you know, numeral to your to your safe code? Because I know the answer to the question I asked you, which was like, what’s a bigger deal here? Is it clear in the infections? Is it you know, healing the gut? Is it reducing food allergens? And I asked that just because I’m just playing devil’s advocate, because that’s what clients and patients always ask, you know, when we’re working with them, they’re like, Okay, well, you know, what’s my biggest priority right now? It’s like, I’m all of it. So it may sound a little overwhelming. But as we’re taking small steps with the diet, the lifestyle, we’re getting you to bed sooner, we’re helping with adaptogenic herbs to support the adrenals where, you know, let’s say you’re in between jobs, you’re moving house, I mean, there’s lifestyle stuff that’s important. You know, that’s, that’s affecting your hormones, which is affecting your sleep, which is affecting your gut and your recovery. And so we’re factoring in all of this at the same time, so rarely in a vacuum. Are we just coming in, like you said, and just boom, here’s your random microbials. Have a nice day. That’s very rare situation, right? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I mean, like, let’s say, you’re healthy, right? You go down to Mexico, you pick up crypto, and then you just start having really a lot of diarrhea, we may handle you a lot differently. But like a lot of people that come in and I see usually there’s a combination of maybe some kind of a food allergy issue happening in the background. So then we clean that out, that maybe helps a third and then maybe they’ve really had poor digestion for a while like you know inadequate HDL or enzyme levels, that starts to help maybe a third or a quarter. And then that starts to modulate and calm down the immune system. So now the immune system kind of can relax a little bit, maybe that’s 10% 20%. And that we have, we’re getting access to maybe more Selenium or more zinc in our diet now. And that starts to help modulate the immune response, maybe that nourishes thyroid conversion, and then let’s say the infection, right, let’s say that’s the last 20%. So it could be a combination of certain things, you know, 10%, here, 20% there, 30%. There, and it just adds up. And so in the end, it’s hard to know exactly which one’s going to be the winner, right? And sometimes it’s equally spread out. That’s why if we just do the things that we know, we need to do on our checklist, our chance of results, good results is going to be much higher. 

Evan Brand: Absolutely. Well, I’m out of time. So I don’t know if you have a lot more to say if so I’ll just leave but if you don’t, then let’s wrap it up together. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That sounds great. I think let’s wrap it up here to reach out to Evan head over to EvanBrand.com again, Evan and I are available for consultation worldwide, which is excellent in today’s day and age. And then myself, Dr. J over at JustinHealth.com. We’re happy to help you out and work deeper on any thyroid issue. Gut issue infection issue where we can kind of dive in deeper and get to the root cause make sure you put your comments below and subscribe and share the episode with friends and family. We really appreciate it. 

Evan Brand: Absolutely. Yes, sharing is caring and there’s probably someone in your family or your life that has a thyroid issue. So please give this to them. Hopefully, even if they have to listen to it two, three times. Hopefully it helps guide them in the right direction to heal to recover to live life fully. So take care. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Awesome and have a good one man. Bye


References:

https://www.evanbrand.com/

https://justinhealth.com/

Audio Podcast:

https://justinhealth.libsyn.com/can-parasites-cause-thyroid-problems-podcast-316

Fatigue, Tiredness, and Lethargy: Link to Gut Infection | Podcast #311

Tiredness is not a symptom that defines any one particular disease. Rather, tiredness can be a symptom of many different diseases and conditions. Causes of tiredness range from lack of sleep and over exercise to medical and surgical treatments. The lack of energy (lethargy) associated with tiredness can sometimes cause difficulty with normal daily activities, leading to attentiveness and concentration problems. 

Dr. J suggested considering to support protein breakdown by extra amino acids and enzymes. Dr. Evan also added that if you have issues, always reach your conventional Dr. or functional Dr., be tested, find the root cause and guide to fix possible infections that cause you to feel tired before you reach a crisis level.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

1:10      Mechanisms to Gut Infection

4:05      Where Gut Stressors Come From

12:12     Infections that causes Fatigue

17:41     Probiotics and Beneficial Bacteria

22:32     Supplements to Gut Infection

24:18     Immune Issues

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we are live. It’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan brand. Today we’re going to be chatting about your gut infections may be making you tired. Many people don’t think about how their gut maybe having an impact on your energy, your mood, your emotions, but it’s totally true. Most people think, oh, if I have a gut issue, I’m just gonna have bloating or diarrhea or constipation or acid reflux. Oh contraire. We’re gonna dive into that today, Evan, how are we doing today, man? 

Evan Brand: Doing really well. How about should I just go straight into my story, then? I mean, I suffered with this thing firsthand, as you know.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep. Let’s do it. 

Evan Brand: So when I was down in Austin, I was losing weight. And I didn’t know why I was losing weight. And turns out and I was exhausted. That was that was the main thing. I mean, I was drained, like, it was really tough for me to get through the day. I mean, I was to the point where, at some point, it’s kind of embarrassing. I mean, I was like, okay, am I do I have enough energy to cook a meal at night, you know, for dinner, like, the workday just drained me. And so fortunately, after I got the gut infections resolved, I mean, the story is not much longer than that my energy came back online. So I mean, we can say clinically, and personally, that this is a big, big smoking gun for anybody who’s been dealing with chronic fatigue.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, totally 100%. Now, let’s talk about some of the mechanisms why like, you could have constipation, you could have diarrhea, you could have all these digestive issues, that’s fine. And it makes sense why some of these issues may be causing problems. Because if you’re going to digest a lot of the nutrients that energize you, right, B vitamins, your amino acids, your essential fatty acids to burn them in the mitochondria for fuel, all of these things require optimal absorption, right? So if we don’t have adequate enzyme, or acid level or biliary level to break down fats, proteins, and carbohydrates, we’re going to have a problem with those nutrients getting into our bloodstream and making their way to ourselves and our mitochondria to be burned for fuel. So that’s one big mechanism. And the other big mechanism out of the gates, and we’ll kind of expound deeper into each one is the fact that your immune system sucks up lots and lots of resources. So think back to when you maybe got the flu or had some kind of illness. Were you energized? Are you tired? Most people were very tired. Now, why is that? It’s because your immune system allocates lots and lots of resources when it’s stressed. And it will make you tired, because it’ll pull some of those energy resources to put it towards fighting an infection. All right. So if your immune system is caught chronically in that state of trying to fight something, whether it’s a gut infection, cebo, or parasite, or just gut permeability issues that are upregulated, due to bad foods, and food allergens, you’re going to be really over stimulating and over allocating resources to deal with whatever’s happening with the immune system, aka the gut. Don’t forget 80% of your immune system is located in the gut, people forget that so important. So if you’re over stressing your immune system, you’re gonna have problems. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. And so for me, I was taking some immune support, but it was all just kind of a bandaid, right? Because I wasn’t focused on the underlying infection. So this time of the year, we’re, we’re talking in the fall here coming up on winter, you have a lot of people that will say, Well, you know, I really just want to strengthen my immune system. So they’ll go and do maybe some extra vitamin C, maybe some medicinal mushrooms, or maybe some other herbs, astragalus, things like that. But it doesn’t matter if you do all those if you don’t address the infection. So if someone’s like, tired and they feel weak, they feel depleted. They feel like they’re possibly immunocompromised. Sure, you could do some of the tools, like we talked about those herbs, but really, you got to test first of all, figure out what kind of infections you have. And then step two, is you come in and make a protocol to fix those infections. And not to mention, you know, like h pylori is super contagious. So, I mean, you and I’ve seen hundreds and hundreds of cases where, you know, husband and wife have reinfected each other. And so we’re not doing this to try to make more money. We’re doing this to help the family when we say, Hey, what about your husband? What about your wife when we try to get them on board? It’s because we know about this potential, you know, cross contamination.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. So we kind of look at the gut, and we’re like, Alright, where are the gut stressors coming from? So the first stressor we look at are food allergens, because if your immune system is kind of responding negatively to food, that could be a big a big issue, right? And what happens is, when food allergens kind of come in, whether it’s gluten or dairy, or just you know, processed grains, or sugars, or even things like nuts, or seeds, or just more allergenic foods, soy those kind of things. Your immune system is upregulated dealing with those foods, and that’s going to suck away resources. And also, these foods if you have an allergen to them, if your body’s hyper allergenic, meaning your immune system is over responsive. There may be some gut permeability. And gut permeability is like these little tight junctions in the epithelium in the small intestines. They’re like this. So imagine you’re putting your hands together like you’re saying a prayer now, start pulling your fingers apart a little bit, you see the little gaps that happen that’s happening at a microscopic level with the tight junction cells in the small intestine. So the more you’re stressing your gut lining, these tight junctions open up, like I mentioned, the fingers come further apart. And then food particular we call it antigens, right? These foods aren’t supposed to be in the bloodstream at the size they’re in. Now you start having these antigens go into the bloodstream at a larger level, and now the immune system’s going to start going after it with full force. And that’s gonna start sucking up a lot more of your resources. So the first thing when we’re working with patients worldwide, we’re trying to cut down the food allergenicity we’re trying to decrease the immune response by helping the foods not become so bad or stressful on the immune system. So some people coming in on a standard American diet, a paleo template, maybe enough. Some people that are really have an autoimmune issue or Irritable Bowel Disease, we have to go to a paleo template where we’re cutting out extra allergenic foods, some we have to even go to a carnivore or some kind of an STD low lower fodmap diet because the bacteria is overgrown, and it’s reacting to even fodmap foods like broccoli and onions and garlic like healthy foods, were reacting to it. And so it this whole thing becomes a little bit more nuanced with food, the more unhealthy you become, or the longer your conditions progress. So as a practitioner, right, we’re trying to meet people where they’re at some people come in at a really easy phase, they’re just diets crap. And we can just make a simple change with the Paleo some we have to get a lot more nuanced. 

Evan Brand: So let me ask you, you brought up garlic. I had a woman last week, actually. And she was complaining that garlic was a big issue for her. So we’ve already cleared out gut infections, and we’ve done a great job. We’ve retested we’ve confirmed that we got rid of all the gut infections, we are doing some leaky gut support, but she says every time I eat garlic, I get really bloated. What would you What would you do? What would you say to that garlic person? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, it could be a SIBO thing. So I’d want to test other fodmap foods. So if there’s some kind of a gut issue or like a bloat or a motility issue, or a diary or a constipation issue, we’re going to be cutting out fodmaps fermentable carbohydrates, fructose, oligo, disaccharide, mono and polyols. And we’re going to do that and then we’ll eventually do a reintroduction. And when we reintroduce foods, we’re going to start with moderate fodmaps first and then go to higher fodmaps. Last, so those foods are higher fodmap. So the question will be How did she do adding in the moderate ones? First, I want to know how she did incrementally adding things in.

Evan Brand: So like apples, she does fine, which was interesting, because to me, I’ve had a lot more people have issues with apples than I have with garlic. So I thought Hmm, you know, is it really a bacterial overgrowth thing? The stool test didn’t really show much in the in the bacterial category. So it’s kind of like, well-

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: when people like that, I just want to see is it a one off? Is it just garlic? Or is it other foods like onions and broccoli and avocado, which is a moderate or sweet potato, which is a matar, I want to test more of the moderate fodmaps? Maybe add in some fermented foods like a kombucha or a sauerkraut? Did it happen with those two, if it’s just a one off, then it could be some die off, it could just be she’s having an issue with that food. So if it’s a one off, I don’t really worry about one offs, I look for patterns, like patterns or like part of being a good functional medicine doctor, it’s pattern recognition, you’re looking for patterns, like some patient that can be Well, last week I had this happen or that like, we got to look at bigger picture, we got to have enough data points. So we can look at patterns. Anything can happen one off due to stress or a poor night’s sleep, or you got exposure to some bad foods. And now your guts a little bit rocky for a few days. So we got to look at longer trends and really have a lot of good pattern recognition. Part of what we do, we’re kind of CSI detectives, and we got to look for things repeating itself, because anything can happen one off, we don’t want to change what we’re doing, or the programs that people are on, off of just a one off issue.

Evan Brand: And that’s what it was, it was a one off and it was kind of, you know, frustrating for me because I’m thinking well, crap, you know, everything else, she’s tolerating good and any other problematic foods, I’d kind of put in that same category that we thought would be a problem. They’re not a problem. So I’m sitting here thinking, Okay, well, what kind of explanation Can I give her? Because she wants some kind of good functional medicine answer for me, right? And so that’s what I told her. I’m like, well, this sounds like just Oh, to be honest, kind of like a food sensitivity, particularly to the garlic. You know, I don’t looking at the testing. I told her I didn’t really see anything that was compelling to indicate any other sort of issue and all the other foods were tolerated. So I kind of just gave it like a political answer. It was like, wow, hmm. You know. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, well, we’ll come it’s possible there could be just a, her immune response is just a little bit more sensitive to if we don’t see extra data points correlating to it, then I just tell patients, hey, let’s just we’ll come back. We’ll work on probiotics. We’ll work on good re inoculation of good healthy bacteria while adding some prebiotic fibers every month. We can try testing it again. But as long as there’s no yeah, as long as there’s no, let’s just say, family of other foods that are interacting like this, then we’re not going to really worry about it too much. But you can always retest, make sure that gut’s doing good, but it’s possible you have one off allergen issue that’s possible. But every month, we can always retest it and see.

Evan Brand: Yeah, good point, I did end up throwing in a high dose, multi strain probiotic. So we’re with a high amount of bifido. So we’re gonna see what happens. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and this person could tolerate fermentable carbohydrates, like sauerkraut and, and maybe a little bit of kombucha it’s probably not a fodmap issue, because those things are very, very high in fodmaps. It could be she’s killing some stuff off. It could just be she sensitive to garlic. It’s possible. Yeah. And so I mean, I just tell patients, hey, you know, that’s an artifact, we just kind of make a note on it. When we follow it down the road later on. If things kind of connect back to it down the road. That’s nice. But if not, things that are one offs. You don’t want to you don’t want to one off to derail your whole investigation. 

Evan Brand: Yes. Yes. That’s a great point. You know, it’s like you’re, you’re you’re like, you know, investigating a crime scene, and you have his weird piece of evidence. That does not make sense. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Right. Okay. Well, we’ll make a note on that. And we’ll come back to it if there’s any patterns that they point back to it down the road.

Evan Brand: Yep. Yep. Great. So so small tangent, but really helpful. I think it’s, it’s helpful for people to see how do you have to think when you’re approaching these issues, it’s not always black and white, you know, we try to refer back to clinical experience, we kind of sprinkle in some of the data sprinkled in some previous case studies that we’ve done with people. So it’s really fun. But back to the fatigue piece. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So I just wanted to highlight one component, because while you’re on it, is when we are talking about these things, because we’re clinicians, and we see thousands of patients, we’re operating more off of clinical concepts than like rote memorization of like, a fax. And so when people listen to our podcasts, we really want them to understand the overarching concepts of health. If you understand a concept, you don’t really have to memorize it, if you’re trying to memorize random facts and randomness, and that becomes a little bit convoluted and a little bit stressful. So just try to get the overarching concepts that we’re talking about here. Once you get the concept, you never have to worry about memorizing, and it’s just there. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, good. So I just wanted to go back to the to the fatigue piece, because for certain people, there may be multiple layers of infections that are causing your fatigue. So for me it was H. pylori, and then once I got rid of the H pylori, then it was the parasites that were still causing me to be tired. And once I got rid of that, then I did have some Candida that I had to address. So what I want people to know is that if you double down or triple down on something, you know, the guy tells you it’s parasites, or the girl tells you it’s this, and you pursue that, and you’re not better, it’s possible that you’ve, you’ve missed something. And so I just want people to wrap their head around you, like you say, you have permission to have multiple things wrong at the same time. So you could have a bacterial issue, a parasite issue, a Candida problem, all at the same time. And so you got to make sure you get all the data if you just run a stool test. Candida rarely shows up on the stool test, you and I’ve talked about this many times. So the urine test will often fill in the blank. So if you had one test done, or your doctor ran this or that, and you feel like you’re missing something you probably are so keep, keep digging. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You also there’s one study here just looking at h pylori and mitochondrial function, I’ll put it up on my screen. But this is important, right? And the reason why it’s important, I’m going to just I’m going to do a share here. So if you guys are listening to the podcast on YouTube, you’ll be able to watch the video. If you’re on iTunes, you know, you have to just click the YouTube link, and you’ll be able to see what we’re talking about. If not, I’ll try to describe it pretty well. But you can see my screen you see my screen. 

Evan Brand: Yep. h pylori affects the mitochondrial function. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So this is important right here. So mitochondria are the powerhouse of the cells. This is really important and the powerhouse of your cell generates ATP for energy. Now, if you look here at the bottom they talked about, they wanted to investigate whether there’s an increased mutational load and mitochondrial genome and what they found was there believe that the there’s a downregulation in the mitochondrial DNA repair pathway? What does that mean? It means how your mitochondria are repaired and regenerated. It’s going to be down regulated, so you’re not going to be able to repair your your mitochondria as fast. It’s believed to be involved in mitochondrial base excision repair. Our results suggest that these genes A p one and y b one, just know that their DNA is that are involved in mitochondrial DNA repair. They’re they’re demonstrated to be involved and they’re demonstrated to be down regulated when there’s an H pylori infection. So it just means that your body’s ability to generate ATP which has decreased respiration coupled aptr. So you’re not able to generate as much ATP and repair your mitochondria as well when you have an H pylori infection. And this is something that we think is there with a lot of gut infections. It affects your mitochondria. Your ability to repair it, which then affects your ATP synthesis. 

Evan Brand: That is pretty crazy. I mean, especially if we’re talking about an athlete who wants to perform right you’ll have all these big celebrity personal trainers and stuff and they’ll just get people on different diet changes or no, you need to do this exercise or this exercise and they missed the boat. They don’t have a clue about H. pylori being the root cause of the of the fatigue or the exercise performance. So yeah, it’s just crazy. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And then also, there’s a lot of right here, right here one study, I’ve already looked at it before, if people are having gut issues, and they go to their conventional gastroenterologist, what are they typically prescribing? Well, a lot of times they’re prescribing antibiotics, right, and there’s a lot of data, bacterial Seidel, antibiotics induce mitochondrial dysfunction and oxidative damage. And so we know this is something that’s actually present, where there’s damage to the mitochondria with antibiotics. 

Evan Brand: Well, and and, and to be clear, for H pylori, it’s not just one antibiotic, it’s three or even four, they have what they call quadruple therapy now, which just the name of it scares me, it’s literally four antibiotics at the same time. And you and I have both seen patients that have had triple or quadruple therapy done and guess what we retest them, and unfortunately, due to antibiotic resistant bacteria, the infections are still there. So now we have to come in, repair all the mitochondria that were damaged, plus use herbs, which are much, much safer, and in my experience, just as if not more effective, and then we actually get rid of the bugs. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, she’s a summary of your mitochondria dysfunction and oxygen damage induced by bacterial Seidel antibiotics, which is interesting, because bacteria, all antibiotics are bacterial Seidel, so interesting. They use that description. It’s mammalian cells. I’m not sure which mammals they use. But they talked about that it’s alleviated by antioxidants. Well, guess what, when we use a lot of the clearing herbs that we use, guess what they’re rich in, I mean, tons of antioxidants, polyphenols. And that’s the benefit, a lot of the herbs that we use, they have a lot of antioxidants in them to help buffer the oxidative stress. Because remember, oxidative stress is part of what happens with the antibiotics. And we have a similar effect with herbs. But the herbs have a lot of antioxidants, which is helpful. Any comments on that? 

Evan Brand: Well, what you’re saying makes us look really good, because not only are we giving nutrients that can effectively get rid of the infections, but we’re also protecting the system or even replenishing antioxidants, because in general, and the oxidants are going to be reduced because of all the oxidative stress from the infection in the first place. So it’s literally like a win win, for us and for the person under the protocol. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep. And there’s lots of different studies here as well on probiotics and beneficial bacteria, correcting mitochondrial dysfunction with probiotics. There’s there’s definitely studies on this as well. And again, you know, these are things that we’ve seen in our practice, like when you see someone get better. So protection of hepatocyte mitochondrial function by blueberry juice probiotics. So there’s lots of studies on this, because when you see patients get better with certain beneficial bacteria, after you do an elimination, you’re like, why does that work? And so what happens is you see a clinical outcome, patient getting better when you do something. And then you’re like, Huh, what could the mechanism B and then you chase it down online? And you’re like, oh, maybe that’s it? You know, maybe it has to do with the fact that it’s helping the mitochondria and people’s feel better afterwards? Maybe that’s the mechanism. It’s possible, right? 

Evan Brand: Yeah. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We have to comment on that. 

Evan Brand: Well, it’s a lot of good things happening. And then you mentioned the probiotic piece. So that’s going to help even more. So after we get someone on a killing protocol, there’s going to be good benefits there, your energy is probably going to get better just based on doing that. And then when you go to the next phase, if we’re going to come into the gut healing phase, you’re going to get even better than so it’s it’s really fun for us to kind of paint the picture here of just how how is someone going up, up up up better, better, better? And you’ve just outlined how so pretty I talked about it right here. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: They talked about a collusion the studies show this is BP stands for blueberry juice and probiotic exhibit a synergistic effect preventing the development of a and that’s non alcoholic fatty liver disease by protecting mitochondrial function, suppressing the damage of mitochondrial ultrastructure by reducing mitochondrial swelling, right. So mitochondrial damage by antibiotics, as well as we could do the same thing when we search, let’s say pesticides, or heavy metals or mold toxins, so we know that gut plays a big role and one helping to absorb those nutrients. But number two, also helping to have beneficial bacteria that modulate these, this inflammation and mitochondrial damage as well. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah. Well said. Excellent. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, it’s good that just a couple of studies. I mean, when we look at like we look at research a lot differently, so just kind of everyone there. We look at clinical outcomes in patients. And then we chase them back to what the literature says. The problem is a lot of people who are clinicians, they’ll look at the literature, and then they’ll try to then come up with a clinical like decision based on the literature. And that’s sometimes it’s really hard to do, because a lot of the PhDs and a lot of the research out there isn’t necessarily clinically driven, and maybe driven because someone has a PhD in this area. And they’re just they’re just studying that topic, because or maybe it’s an NIH funded study. Who knows, right? So we’re looking at things that are clinically driven, not research driven, because someone has decided to dedicate their life to this topic. And this is the study they’re choosing right? 

Evan Brand: Now. It’s good that we can kind of pull out some studies to help backup what we’re saying. But it’s not like we go into PubMed to try to figure out exactly what we’re going to do the clinical stuff is really that’s where all the magic happens. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And some may say we have a confirmation bias and how we look for these things. But we’re not looking for out of the blue we’re looking for, because we’ve seen clinical outcomes support something is happening in that direction. And then we use the data, the research to say what could be if positive things are happening in this direction? A to B, what could be the mechanism of why that is? And so we kind of chase it backwards. versus the other way around? 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah. And it’s just it’s a blast. It is fun for you to pull that stuff up. Right? Because, you know, we get we get used to our our methods, we get used to our results. But when you get to see in the literature like that antibiotics, causing mitochondrial damage is like, Oh, yeah, I forgot. That’s why we do this. It’s Yeah, we’re Exactly. We don’t want people to get damaged. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And you get confident when you see things repeat itself. Clinically, you’re like, Okay, something’s happening here. Now what? So you’re going at it with a lot more confidence versus like, Hey, I think maybe, you know, I’ve heard this, it’s a hearsay kind of thing. No, you’ve seen it, you’ve seen it clinically? Well, here’s the confidence.

Evan Brand: Here’s the thing that’s always fun for me is when we’re on the topic of fatigue and gut infections. And so when you have a case where you do the follow up, and someone is reporting that they have significantly more energy, and you didn’t give them any energy supplements, you just fix their gut, you just gave them some liver, maybe some enzyme support, some gallbladder support, and then you killed the infections and all the sudden, boom, I’m 20% more energetic. I always smile and laugh simultaneously. Because it’s like, This is so fun. We have 20% more energy. And we did zero energy supplements. That’s just super cool. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s powerful. Now, if people start feeling a little bit worse, then we got to be very careful. So when people start feeling worse, I’m like, all right, we got to spend more time building up the adrenals, we got to make sure the diets clean, because if someone’s got his or, like, if you’re putting lots of bad foods in and you’re inflaming the gut, then your immune system and also your adrenals may be making more resources to deal with the inflammation in your gut. So we have to decrease the inflammation in our gut and support the adrenals by calming it down. Now, the adrenals have more resources. And of course, we always like supporting the adrenals ahead of time. So then you have natural, your more of your natural anti inflammatories, because conventional medicine when there’s serious gut issues, they’re going to give prednisone cortisol, well, let’s just support your body’s ability to make that naturally. And then when we go into a gut clearing phase, then we have more of those resources on board. And then patients are sensitive. I’m titrating the herbs in there slowly so we’re not overwhelming the system by killing more, you know bacterial toxins, LPs endotoxins, mycotoxins, we’re not overwhelming the lymphatic system that a toxification immune system. So we’re going to kind of really titrate things in a little bit slower if you’re more sensitive. And we may even add things like binders and glutathione too. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah, the glutathione is good for me. I had to take a break from it for a little while. It was just too strong. It does mobilize toxins to so this is all case by case basis. But yeah, I love glutathione when it works. But when you take too much, that’s no good. There’s always a right dose. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, if you’re slow, if you’re like more sensitive, always start low, work your way up. And then if you’re sensitive, you can always start with just a gentle binder first, as long as you’re not getting constipated. That’s a good first step on increasing things. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, that’s great. So let’s see here. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Um, the other component, I would say is people that have got issues tend to also have immune issues. We already talked about why 80% of your immune systems in the Galt, that’s the gastric associated lymphoid tissue that’s in the stomach. And then also the model that’s the mucosal associated lymphoid tissue, lymphoid meaning like lymphocytes, white blood cells, and that’s in the small intestine. And so if you have a lot of gut permeability issues, if your guts over responding well, what’s the most common autoimmune condition that affects people and mostly women, five times more women is autoimmune thyroid. And so if you have an autoimmune thyroid, that could also be affecting your energy because you know your thyroid gland is being attacked and your body is ability to generate thyroid hormone may be decreased. And it’s possible that your conventional doctors overlook that. And so knowing that there’s an autoimmune thyroid could be affecting your energy too. And if you have an attack, you could feel hyper where you’re like anxious, can’t sleep irritable, sweating, right? first and then you go into a hypo where you’re like tired, fatigued, depressed, right? So you could easily be going hyper and hypo swings based on autoimmune tax of the thyroid. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and once again, the hashimotos could be a side effect of something else. So even if you go to the endocrinologist, let’s say they were a more advanced endocrinologist, for example, hopefully they’re running thyroid antibodies TPO, TG maybe TSI. And they’re looking at that and maybe they’re treating your thyroid giving you desiccated glandulars, or nature thyroid, or just Synthroid or side ml. Even then you see how people can fall between the cracks and not get better. Because yeah, you’ve kind of cranked up the thyroid that was hypo due to autoimmunity. But you still never got to the gut infection that started at all.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: BINGO, BINGO, BINGO, BINGO 100%. That’s what we got to look at always the root cause. So anything else you wanted to talk about here on the gut and fatigue I did, we hit the thyroid, of course, I alluded to the adrenals earlier, because they play a huge role in regulating inflammation. And we know acute gut issues, they may be, they may be given a corticosteroid to calm down the gut inflammation, that’s possible too. So we want to support your body’s ability to do it naturally. I would also say supporting protein breakdown. So with maybe adding in free form amino acids, because protein can be very hard on the body to break down. So of course, dialing in enzymes and acids and maybe giving extra free form amino acids. So it’s taking stress off the digestive system to be able to access those amino acids as well. 

Evan Brand: I think I think you’ve hit it all. I mean, I would just say, kind of where do you go next is you really have to get the data. I mean, we’ve talked about a lot, right. But if you don’t have the data, you don’t know what you’re up against. You don’t know what you’re doing. So, you know, I think the best advice I could give is if you’re dealing with these issues, test, don’t guess. And so, you know, feel free to reach out to Dr. J. Justin at JustinHealth.com. And he can run labs on you anywhere in the world and send them to your door and jump on a call and discuss it make a great protocol to help you to get better. Same thing for me my website, EvanBrand.com. And we’re available we love helping you all we’re grateful to be in this position. So you know, sure you know a lot of you listening or kind of do it yourselfers. That’s what led you to be smart and find a podcast anyway. Because you want to kind of educate yourself, but there’s a certain point where it’s okay to reach out. And I tried to fix myself for a long time. And you spend more money and you spend more time doing that. So you know, feel free to reach out and get a guide.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100% and then you’re available at EvanBrand.com worldwide. We’re available worldwide and we’re clinicians, we have our sleeves rolled up and we’re in the trenches every day, dealing with patients. Also, if you’re listening to this don’t just kind of glom on to one thing. So we see lots of people they’re like, they come in like Oh, I know what’s h pylori or I know it’s Candida or I know it SIBO keep an open mind on what’s happening because you have the right to have more than one issue going on at the same time. And for instance, Evans original story was Evan had not could have it wrong if you had h pylori, Giardia and crypto. That’s correct. Yeah, yeah, h pylori, giardia crypto, those are some serious infections. Any one of those infections is serious and could could have created the symptoms Evan was having yet he had all three at the same time. So if Evan was like, Oh, it’s only H. pylori, you know, he may have missed the fact that grd and crypto were involved too. So go into with an open mind and you have the right to have more than one infection happening at same time. Sad but true. But either way there are solutions to work on it and fix it. 

Evan Brand: I was tired. Man, I was tired. Now that was a that was a that was a level of exhaustion that just doesn’t even seem real. I mean, that’s how you know something’s wrong when you’re that tire. But you know, hopefully, with this education we’re providing people can reach out and work on this before it gets to that crisis level because it’s much easier to pull you out if you’re not that deep. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Now Evan can you go to your conventional medical doctor or a gastroenterologist and typically get these infections picked up on? 

Evan Brand: No, definitely not the testing is just so outdated, you know, it’s not sensitive, like the DNA stuff we’re using. So that’s the downside is if you go to the gastro doc down the road, say, Hey, I think I’ve got Giardia, I heard these two guys on the internet talk about it. They’ll probably just laugh in your face and say, Well, you didn’t travel to any third world countries. So you don’t have it. But if you if you really want to Sally, I’ll test you on they’ll run the outdated test and then everything comes back negative and then we’ll say see, I told you it was all in your head, just, you know, take an acid blocker. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So yes, my opinion is very similar. So the more acute you are, especially with typical gastrointestinal symptoms, the greater chance they’ll pick you up, especially if you came back from like Mexico or some kind of a country like Bali where infections are probable, right? But now what do you do? If your infections aren’t really gut based symptoms, they’re the fatigue or the brain fog, well, then how does that get picked up, you’re typically never going to get picked up for that you’re more than likely to, to get a psych referral for an antidepressant, right, then to get a gut test, and Evan already alluded to some of the technology they have isn’t going to be as up to par. So we have a little bit you know, more access to the DNA technology a little bit more sensitive. And then also like H. pylori testing that they may run a breath test, right? Urea breath test and look for elevated levels of co2, it’s possible, but that may miss an infection. And if it’s more subclinical, you may need a more sensitive test to pick it up. So if you’re listening, and you’re like, Hey, I’m gonna go to my MD that may not be the solution, I may not get you the answers you want. And if you don’t have the typical gut symptoms, diarrhea, bloating, gas, a lot of stomach discomfort, and irritability, you may not even they may not even want to run a test, because those symptoms don’t match with what they think the problem could be. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, yeah. And you know, it sounds like we’re like picking on him. Right? And we sort of are and that’s fine. I love picking on them, because they’re failing people. And it makes me sad. Because I was there I was sitting in the doctor’s office trying to get help. And I was told that I just needed an acid blocking medication. I told the doc, no, I feel better when I take it. enzymes that actually increased my stomach acid, I think you’re wrong. She said, That’s not possible. You’re gonna hurt yourself, you need to stop taking supplements stop all dietary supplement, the FDA, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And and that was it. And that’s when I signed off and said, No, I’m done. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and I do recommend, and I think you’re in the same way, I do recommend patients that have chronic issues, or acute issues, at least go see your conventional medical doctor just to get checked off that there’s nothing glaring that’s going on. And that that way, if you work for someone like myself, for you, and then they’ve kind of already been looked at, and they’ve kind of already know, okay, conventional medicine is kind of done all they can do. And, you know, functional medicine is the next best option at that point. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, I’m not saying we’re the all knowing at all, if you’re bleeding out of your butt, you need to go confirm you don’t have some type of a bleeding ulcer or colon cancer or you have some type of a polyp issue or diverticulitis and you need colon surgery. I mean, there are certain things that we can’t help with. But for these more functional, non pathological issues, we’re definitely going to be able to help. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And we can help with all those issues. Once they’re stable. If they’re unstable, though, conventional medicine does a really good job on stabilizing very sensitive issues. But once they’re stable, now what because for the most part, it’s going to be just symptom drug management for the rest of your life. Right? If you look at what they talked about, it’s, hey, we’re managing your gut issue versus let’s actually get to the root underlying issue. And sometimes management’s good when things are acute and flared. But now when they’re stable now what we want to go beyond just who wants to just manage their diarrhea for the rest of their life? That’s crazy, right? 

Evan Brand: Oh, God. Well, that happens every day, doesn’t it? It’s happening today while we’re doing this call somebody is in the doctor’s office right now about to get an antispasmodic drug for their diarrhea. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and that may be fine acutely, but then what’s next? So get your health issues under control from a you know, stable standpoint, and then work on the next step with a good functional medicine doctor. Well, everyone was excellent chatting with y’all anything you want to leave us with Evan? 

Evan Brand: No, that’s it. We’re just ranting at this point. So if you need help, please reach out. JustinHealth.com, EvanBrand.com. Take great care yourself. We’ll be back. Have a good one, y’all. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Take care. Bye now. 

Evan Brand: Bye.


References:

https://www.evanbrand.com/

https://justinhealth.com/

Audio Podcast:

https://justinhealth.libsyn.com/fatigue-tiredness-and-link-to-gut-infections-podcast-311

Essential Blood Tests to Analyze Your Health | Podcast #305

Regular blood testing is one of the most important ways to keep track of your overall physical well-being. Getting tested at routine intervals can allow you to see how your body changes over time and empower you to make informed decisions about your health. Here’s Dr. J and Evan talking about the areas to check aside from the usual blood tests we know. 

A conventional medical doctor will typically recommend that you get routine blood work, but this is the bare minimum. There are several significant reasons you may want to get blood tests more often than that. Either you want to optimize your health or to reduce the risk of disease and health complications. 

What are some routine tests and others that you should ask or know? Aside from CBCs (Complete Blood Count), Dr. J and Dr. Even pointed out enzyme markers, cholesterol tests, blood sugar tests, liver markers, thyroid panel, and so on. It will help your doctors make a differential diagnosis and dive into the root cause of your present health status. To know more, check out this podcast.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

Dr. Justin Marchegiani

In this episode, we cover:

3:12       Conventional Side of Blood Works

12:14     Thyroid Panels

17:56     Blood Glucose

23:50     Adrenal Issues

29:33     Lipid Panels

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Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We are live. It’s Dr. J here in the house with Evan brand. Today, we’re gonna be chatting about blood tests that we use to help assess our health and help us get better. So we’re gonna be chatting a little bit about kind of intro blood tests, what the best tests are kind of what our perspective on that is, Evan, how are we doing today, man? 

Evan Brand: Doing really well excited to dive into this topic, I went, got my blood work. And I got my wife’s blood work done on Friday. And I just want to give a brief little note on how you and I run blood work as clinicians because it’s very easy. And it’s so convenient, because we don’t have to go and beg a GP or an MD and say, Hey, please, please, doctor. I mean, you and I’ve heard countless stories. Yeah, I asked my doctor to run this, they wouldn’t run it, I asked my endocrinologist to run this, they wouldn’t run it. With us, the accounts that we have with our credentials, were able to order and create customized lab panels. So you and I both have created customized blood panels that with a click of a button, we can go boom, order it for anyone, whether it’s ourselves, or our clients or patients, and then we get an instant requisition form. We go straight into labcorp request, you check in, you sit down, they call your name, you hand them the paper, you get the blood draw, you go home, it is so amazing. Every time I get my bloodwork done, I’m like, wow. And I didn’t have to get anyone’s permission to do that. But my own. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Isn’t that nice? Yeah, it totally is nice. Also, there’s the big insurance scam, right. So because we have accounts directly with the lab companies, we can order tests, and typically we get, you know, an 80 to 90%. You know, discount in price compared to what the insurance would bill. So like my typical thyroid panel, full thyroid panel that I charge my patients probably around $120. And the insurance would typically charge a patient for that well over $1,000. So then patients, most patients don’t get 100% coverage, right, especially if you’re not in network, and then the doctors can’t ever retest, but once every six months, so then you’re you’re stuck not being able to ever retest. But they think, Oh, I’m gonna get coverage for this. And then they get 90% coverage, and they end up paying more money. For the for the 90% coverage, even though they paid 100% cash, it had been cheaper. So that’s kind of the insurance scam. And then the problem with that is they can’t retest but once every six months, so they’re kind of stuck. So yeah, it’s really nice to be able to order what the patient needs and to be able to reorder and reassess. Based on a time that is good for us. Not good for the insurance companies. That’s kind of nice, right? 

Yeah. And you’re kind of we’re kind of circumnavigating that conventional system where you’re waiting two, three months, and then you get a bill in the mail and you’re like, oh, medical bill, What’s this about? And then it’s like, oh, you owe 700. with us. It’s all transparent. It’s up front, you pay, boom, boom, boom, you’re done. I’ve already paid for it. I know that I’m not spending another penny. And the turnaround time is insanely quick to like one or two days, typically on some of these panels are running. So let’s go into some of the details. Now, let’s quickly compare and contrast. I think you and I have a lot of fun. Like where we did our conventional functional medicine vers conventional medicine, gut workup. Let’s talk about the same with bloodwork. So if you go to your doctor, and you have them say, hey, Johnny, we’re going to run your blood. What is that going to look like?

So conventional medical doctor, they’re typically going to do a CBC, they’re going to do a metabolic panel, they’ll probably do a lipid panel that’s usually going to be at maybe a year analysis, that’s kind of it. So like on the CMP they’re kind of looking at liver enzymes. They will look at some electrolytes on the liver on the CMP as well. Those liver enzymes electrolytes, maybe some protein markers there, they’ll probably look at glomerular filtration kind of some baseline kidney function with creatine and and bond. The kit the liver markers are going to be a lt and as to the liver enzyme markers, the gallbladder is ggt but probably look at some bilirubin your electrolytes are going to be sodium chloride, potassium magnesium, all serum not not intercellular which is a difference Okay. And then on the red blood cells are going to look at red blood cells RBC some adequate hemoglobin that’s part of the CBC right complete blood count which is going to help be helpful for anemic patterns right low iron right, although also run indices which are MC VMC, HMCHC right me corpuscular volume me corpuscular hemoglobin me corpuscular hemoglobin concentration. When those markers go high, that tends to mean that we’re dealing with B vitamin issues like b 12, full eight issues, and we call that megaloblastic anemia. So we have two kinds of anemia. As we look at big cell anemia is right we tend to be more B vitamins stuff. And then small anemias. We tend to be more on the red blood cell hemoglobin hematocrit, low iron side, and then we have immune markers, whether it’s neutrophils, lymphocytes, eosinophils, monocytes, and basophils, which could be from bacterial issues, parasite issues, gut inflammation issues, viral issues. And then I would say on top of the CBC, that’s pretty much it and then your limits. So total cholesterol, triglycerides and then of course, your LD vldl pattern, and then there’s some add ons that we may talk about whether it’s c reactive protein for inflammation, fibrinogen, for inflammation, homocysteine for inflammation, methylation, vitamin D. and we can kind of go into each one of those in regards to what we think is important on the functional side. But you know, the whole lipid thing is, it’s kind of overplayed, right people think that lipids are a really important issue now once you start going over 200 or so on the total cholesterol, and that may not be. And we’ll talk about the ratios and the perspective that we add to when we look at it.

Evan Brand: Yeah, so the way you talk, it sounds pretty good. It’s like, oh, wow, that’s a lot of stuff. But truthfully, there are rarely issues that show up on just standard bloodwork. Now, if you have more of the functional training that you and I’ve had regarding blood chemistry, you can kind of, I guess you would just say pick through the CBC with a fine tooth comb, and you can really look and maybe find some functional issues, like for me, I know that I you know, for a very long time, my hematic crit, you know, I’ve always had the hematocrit be a little bit high, which, based on some of the training you and I’ve had, it would indicate that there’s probably a dehydration issue. And that’s tough. You know, it’s, it’s, it’s tough to stay hydrated. And so even if I mean, I’m sipping on water all day, but you know, I’ve heard there’s a big influence on anti diuretic hormone, and all of that when you’re exposed to mold toxin, that’s a conversation for another day. But anyway, unless you’re really looking with a with a fine tooth comb, conventional bloodwork doesn’t reveal much. And you may see a little bit of this a little bit of that, but it’s not, I’m not making too many protocol decisions based on a CBC I would say. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So when I look at blood, it can give me a good area of where to where to look next, or where to dive in deeper, which is helpful. And then if we look at it, using the optimal reference range, or a functional reference range, we can definitely glean better information. So the problem with most conventional medical doctors, they’re looking at blood through a pathological range, they’re trying to pick up like major disease patterns or pathological patterns. And so how it works is you have to show you have all people kind of fit in what’s called the bell curve. And the typical range is going to be two standard deviations to the left and right, this is represents about 95% of the population fit into the so called normal. So you have two and a half on the high two and a half on the low that are on the high or low side, pathologically, right. And so the problem with that range is it as people get more unhealthy and sicker. And as those sick people tend to test more, what happens to the lab reference range over time, it gets wider. And so it becomes more encompassing, it’s like having a bad field goal kicker and you make the field goal every year wider and wider and wider and closer and closer to compensate for the lack of, you know, good kickers out there. So it’s kind of like that. And so what we do is we kind of narrow up that range a little bit, and that narrower range helps us pick things out before it becomes a problem. So let’s kind of go over a couple of things. So with women or people that are vegan vegetarians, women, because they bleed more when they’re when they’re at menstrual age, right, typically 50 or below 48 or below, they can be more anemic. So we may look at things like lower red blood cells, right, red blood cells, you know, below 4.2 or so we may look at hemoglobin below 12, we may look at him at a crit, you know, in the mid to low 30s as a sign that there could be some low iron issues brewing, we may also run an iron panel, it’s not typically run, but we may run things like ferritin, or iron binding capacity. Or we may look at things like iron saturation to get a window of low iron, for instance. And that’s commonly missed, because what most conventional Doc’s do is, their threshold for low iron is really low. And there’s a lot of women I see in vegetarians in general that could be on that lower side could be a little bit anemic, and then they’re not going to be able to carry oxygen throughout their body adequately, which makes a huge difference in energy and stress and and mitochondrial function and thyroid function because you need to be able to carry oxygen to have good energy. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, let’s go into some of the more let’s let’s, let’s break some of the stuff down. But before we break it down more, let’s hit on what are the things that that we’re going to run and so I’ve got my panel pulled up that I ran. And so I’ll kind of run through some of these things. But as you mentioned, ferritin that’s typically not going to get run I’ve rarely rarely seen fair to run by anyone. The iron saturation as you mentioned the iron binding capacity. That’s really wrong. That’s right to be ti BC. Often on your bloodwork, the vitamin D. I mean, my God, it’s so important, but yet vitamin D to this day is still not commonly run. Nope. And if they run it, they may run the wrong one. I’ve seen people where they don’t run the 25 o hydroxy. tryptophan, they’re going to run like the even the beat the D two. They’re going to run the What is it? Ergo? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, the vitamin D too. Yep, Ergocalciferol.

Evan Brand: Yep, yeah. Ergocalciferol? Yeah. So you have a vitamin D, they may run the D two and you’re like crap I needed to d3.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, the [inaudible]. The animal base kind of the d3 is the more active form. The D two is the more plant synthetic form, typically made from lanolin. A lot of times, that’s the D two, that’s the ergocalciferol. Ah, so vitamin D is really important. And then the range on that is pathological as well. They want above 20. Why? Because they’re looking for rickets, right, the bone bending disease, right, because d3 helps absorb calcium and helps a calcium get into the bone. So we want 50 to 70 or maybe 70 to 100 if we’re autoimmune or cancer risk. So vitamin D is a big one, I would say also on the CBC, we may be looking at immune cells, if I see low white blood cells, you know, below four and a half. There could be some you know, deficiency issues if there’s high white blood cells, you know, greater than seven and a half there could be some immune stress. Now we look at the, the immune cells, how do we look at those never let monkeys eat bananas, that’s the mnemonic device and doctor at school we learned so neutrophils we want to see, you know, below 60 lymphocytes, we want to see mid reference range when we see high neutrophils or low neutrophils and elevated lymphocytes. That’s a common h pylori or bacterial infection pattern. If we see elevations in eosinophils, greater than four, we’re thinking potential parasites or chronic environmental allergies by sea monocytes, greater than 10. I’m thinking some kind of intestinal inflammation. So we there’s different, you know, patterns you may look at, when we look at some of these immune cells. That’s very important. But unless it’s very high, they’re typically not going to say much. And if it’s very low, they typically don’t say much either there. 

Evan Brand: Yep, so also more advanced thyroid markers. It’s very, very sad how many people go to even an endocrinologist and they may only end up with a free T for possibly a free t three, but even that’s not guaranteed. Maybe a total T for you may get Of course, TSH is going to be on there. But you and I are definitely going to be running like thyroid globulin, I mean obat antibodies, we’re going to be running t TPO, thyroid paradoxus antibodies, maybe TSI, sometimes if we think there could be something else going on next. And then you’ve got the uptake of T three, what else you got? You got reverse t three that we’re going to be looking at. That’s an awesome marker. And that’s never run. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So when it comes to a thyroid panel, you already mentioned it, most conventional endocrinologist and primary care are going to run TSH because that’s the major screening brain hormone, not a thyroid hormone majrooh. It’s not a thyroid hormone, but it’s a major brain hormone that talks to the thyroid and you’d be lucky to get a T for total after that. But we know downstream is a lot of conversion issues and even patients that have normal TSH, guess what, especially if they’re on Synthroid, which is a synthetic thyroid medication that’s just T for many of them can’t make that conversion. And that’s a problem too. And so you can have adequate T for good TSH and low t three. And you may have a lot of thyroid symptoms. So it’s really important that we look at things complete. And don’t even get me started on thyroid antibodies, because that’s almost never run and thyroid antibodies are the major mechanism why most people sideway glands aren’t functioning properly because their immune systems have beaten the crap out of their thyroid for a very long time. 

Evan Brand: And we’re talking what I mean, you’d say probably over half of cases of hypothyroid are probably autoimmune based on what I’ve seen, what would your guess be? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I would say that and some may not even come back on the lab test, but it’s very helpful to be able to look at those we run TPO antibodies and thyroid globulin antibodies. And so my full thyroid panel nevitt, some kind of a TSH, T for free and total t three free and total TPO antibody, federal globulin antibody, and we may run a reverse d3 or an uptake. Those are all okay markers to add to. So that’s kind of your complete thyroid panel. Let me just piggyback to the CVC. Is there anything else on the CDC? I think we hit it all there. We can go to the metabolic profile now if you want. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, well, you mentioned like earlier, like CBR active protein c reactive protein, I guess it kinda depends. I mean, sometimes that standard, but a lot of times that’s not an hscrp is, you know, going to be the same same section of the inflammation panel on your blood. So hopefully you get those two run together. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, usually CRP and cardio CRP is basically the same thing CRP, they’re just, they’re breaking the number down typically below two, I think the cardio CRP, they typically don’t do it less than two or so. So when they you do a highly sensitive CRP, they’re just breaking it down into a smaller number. Let’s go we want to see that below one that’s great as a good marker of systemic inflammation. And fibrinogen is great. We have for highly inflamed, we may see a lot of clotting happen. And fibrinogen looks at clotting factors, which is helpful. So if we don’t have good fatty acids, good omega three omega six ratio or a lot of inflammation, a lot of trans fat, high blood sugar cells tend to agglutinate they get very sticky. And so it’s nice to see where that stickiness that stickiness level is. And homocysteine is also another measure of blood inflammation because it’s homocysteine is an inflammatory metabolite. That typically happens when there’s not enough B vitamins B six and four And B 12. In their active form, that can be a big inflammatory issue there too.

Evan Brand: Yeah, that was a problem for me. Actually, I did have elevated homocysteine couple years ago and started hitting some more Foley and it fixed it. So it was fun to see how the blood correlated to that. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, you know, we’re going to try to get as much of that which we can do leafy greens and high quality, you know, essential fats and meats, right, but that’s good. And so metabolic profile, we may look at liver enzymes that could be helpful patients that have a lot of insulin resistance and inflammation, you may see an elevation in liver enzymes. What does that mean? That could be a non alcoholic, fatty liver, non alcoholic steatohepatitis, that’s Nash or non alcoholic fatty liver, meaning your liver has stressed not from alcohol, but from typically too much fructose and junky carbs. So the liver is a people think the liver is just a big filter for toxins. No, it also has a major effect at regulating blood sugar, and is also a storage site for sugar, especially fructose. So when you over consume fructose from high fructose corn syrup, or, you know, just too much carbohydrate, in general, the liver really gets stored up. And then when that liver fully gets saturated, overly saturated with fructose, for instance, you start having all these up regulations of inflammatory enzymes called the the junk enzymes, the J, the J and K one enzymes, and you see a lot of inflammation and a fatty liver there, and you see it an ultrasound. And so that’s a common marker seen those elevated liver enzymes, and it’s good to be able to look at that. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, I don’t know if you’ve tested bloodwork much with people like in the middle of a protocol. But I’ve had a couple interesting cases where, while using binders, we’ve seen liver enzymes go up. And it could have been also parasite protocols and things like that, that were kind of interwoven with detox protocols. But I’ve seen liver enzymes temporarily go up during that. So I don’t know if you pay much attention to that. But I’ve seen it and they always go down as soon as it protocols over so.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Even with some killing herbs, like worm woods, a common one that we may see a little bit of elevation and liver enzymes, people that are sensitive, some of the killing herbs, it could be a little bit of stress, is it just the herbs? Or is it the dead debris that is now mobilized from the killing of those microbes, it could be both. That’s where adding things like binders can be very helpful just to kind of put handcuffs on those critters and escorted out of the body versus kind of having it go back into general circulation. also adding an extra glutathione support can be helpful too. Just to really support and tone if I deliver those are very important too. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, well. And it’s common for you and I to use some sort of a liver gallbladder support too. So we may be throwing in like some extra taurine or Mathionine or beet powder artichoke. And there’s many, many things that I say milk thistle already NAC. So there’s a lot of stuff we can do. But yeah, I just figured I mentioned it. Because if someone’s listening and you happen to do blood work in the middle of a protocol, it’s possible that the levels may you may look at him and go, Oh, my God, my liver enzymes, but it will go back to normal relatively quick after killing protocols over. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Also, we may look at glucose, blood glucose is going to be on a metabolic profile as well. CMP panel, I don’t love it as much, because most people that are going to get a blood test and they’re getting pricked in the arm of the big needle, or they kind of stressed. Yeah, and so that the cortisol from that can really increase their blood glucose. So I like getting a really good blood sugar kit like this. And then you can measure your blood glucose during the day. So here’s my little kit here. And so I have I use the keto Mojo now because it measures ketones, so I’m a little meter, I have my little pricker here from my finger, and then I have the blood glucose and the ketones. So this one right here is the blood sugar. And this one here in the lighter blue, this is my ketones. So it’s kind of nice to have those. So I can test my blood sugar before I eat. And then I can do a one two hour three hour and play around with my blood sugar. The whole goal is the more you keep your blood sugar down after a meal and bring it back to baseline within two or three hours, the less insulin you’re making, the higher it goes up and the longer it takes to come back down, the more insulin you’re making. So it gives you kind of a good window how you’re responding to food. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, what I wanted to point out is that you’re doing more functional analysis of glucose versus if you just go into your doctor once every six months, you get a morning fasted glucose, that’s just not enough information.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s not because the whole goal while you’re just checking morning glucose is because you’re thinking your food, so out of whack, that your glucose is now elevated as a result. Now the problem is most people haven’t eaten in 12 hours. So for your glucose is still be out of whack. 12 hours later, the problem has to be pretty severe number one, and then number two, a lot of times it can be elevated not because of food, but because of stress hormones in the morning. And so the stress hormones, people say oh, I’m at 105. Yeah, but it just could be a good cortisol response in the morning called the dawn phenomenon that’s raising that glucose. That’s why you want to check it against your foods during the day. If you have a blood glucose issue. You’re going to see one and two hours later, it’s chronically elevated, and it’s taken a bit of time to come down. So that’s a better marker. Make sure you’re handling glucose okay.

Evan Brand: Yep. How about hemoglobin A1C, this is something that for diabetics, obviously, this is hopefully going to be regularly checked. But for your average person that maybe has some issues, A1C is probably not going to be on your standard blood panel. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I don’t love A1C, I used to like it. I don’t love it as much, I find that when people’s blood cells live longer, because they’re more healthier, they have more time to accumulate blood glucose. So the A1C it’s a part of the hemoglobin and they’re looking at the coding, the coding of glucose on the outside of the hemoglobin, right? So imagine, like, you know, when you, you know, you go up into your car during allergy season, you can see like a big fixed swath of like pollen on the car, they’re kind of looking at the swath of glucose on the outer part of the human lobe. And now the problem is, the longer your red blood cells are hanging around, the more time they have to accumulate that blood sugar. So it can be helpful to look at something. But if you’re, if you’re a little bit on the higher side, or like, let’s say 5.5 or so, let’s say under six, but 5.5. And up, it may just because your red blood cells are a little bit more healthier. So like, for instance, with my anemic women who may have a ton of blood sugar, right, a lot of carbs, because maybe they’re vegetarian or vegan. Guess what? When you’re anemic, your red blood cells die faster. So all my anemic women have A1C super low, like in the forest. And so it’s not going to be a great marker when your red blood cells don’t live that long, and we see it with our anemic patients.

Evan Brand: That’s a good point. Good point.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: If I see someone six or higher, yeah, it’s helpful, you know, but when you’re kind of in that subclinical zone, you’re going to typically have to go back to one, a meter like this, to really look at it. And then also look at your fasting insulin, which is a better marker, because that’s going to give you a better window, how much insulin you’re making frequently. 

Evan Brand: Yep, good point, that analogy is perfect. The pollen on the car. So good job there.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. And if you leave your car out there a lot longer, you’re gonna get a lot more pollen. It’s kind of like that, right? 

Evan Brand: I’m always under five though, no matter what with a one C, I’m always right. 4.9. Somewhere in there. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I’m pretty low, too. I’m always like, right in the low fives. 5’1 5’2. But I’ve seen a lot of patients in my career that have that have really good diets that have tested their blood sugar, have good insulin, and they’ll still have a little bit higher on the a one C and I’m just like, yeah, it’s just it’s missing some people. That’s all. It makes sense. The question is, what’s the mechanism? And that’s what it is. 

Evan Brand: Yep. Makes sense. You hit the you hit the dawn phenomenon. So you know, cortisol that may be run via blood, although we don’t really like blood cortisol too much. We really like more functional analysis of cortisol, like with urine or possibly saliva? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, yeah. And part of the reason why we don’t we don’t like it, is it because when you’re measuring a stress hormone, while creating a stress response, ie putting a needle in my arm, you may influence that a little bit, right? And so that’s kind of the reason why we don’t love that. And even if you’re like, Well, you know, do the adrenals make cortisol fast enough after the needle happens to show in the blood? Well, it’s not just that it’s the fact that you’re anticipating it happening. Therefore, you’re replaying that stress in your mind all the way up to the doctor’s office to go and then the elevator getting into the you’re already making that stress hormone while you’re anticipating what’s going to happen. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, you go in the friggin lab with the scientific fluorescent lights above your head. It’s all awkward the quiet they got some like drug commercials on in the waiting room, Justin, and they call your name come on back. Yeah. So and, you know, also Not to mention, too, that that’s just a snapshot, right? I mean, that doesn’t tell us anything about what’s happening at two or 3pm when you’re complaining of that midday crash. So I really am not too interested about what happened at 8am. I’m really want to know what what’s going on at 2pm when you’re saying you need that third cup of coffee. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly, yep. 100%. So it’s, it’s really important that you’re kind of on top of that. So I think we hit some good blood glucose stuff, we hit some liver enzymes we hit. I’m thinking here, we hit some of the electrolytes. electrolytes are good, too. So sodium and chloride are really good ones. Now when I see patients that have adrenal issues, you could easily have low sodium and high potassium, or you can just kind of have lower minerals all together. Now the serum is not going to be the best marker for testing minerals. So when you see your minerals out of balance, you know, it’s a big issue, but you could still have mineral issues. And the serum be okay, because it really matters what’s in the cell. Not necessarily what’s floating around in the blood. So think of interesting Imagine you’re in a pool, okay? The pool is serum. Okay, you’re in the little floaty. You’re in the little inner tube, right? So it’s you in the inner tube, right? You and the inner tube and the water in the inner tube that’s intercellular. The water outside of the inner tube is extracellular serum. So that’s kind of how you think of it. So when we test some of these nutrients, it’s better to get a sample of the water in the inner tube with you that’s intercellular versus the water outside of the inner tube. That’s serum.

Evan Brand: Yeah, and how do people get that? What is look like?

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, you can like we can add like a red blood cell serum or a potassium serum on some of these panels, we may run like a spectracell, or a Nutri eval or an ion panel that looks at more intercellular nutrients, we may look at different tests that allow us to do that. But there’s not too many add ons for conventional testing like quest or labcorp. Outside of I seen a blood cell magnesium is good. You can do a potassium if you wanted. So there are a couple that you can do to get a window into that. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, I was gonna say I looked through all the options for the conventional labs, RBC magnesium, I think that was about it. I think that’s all I could find. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So yeah, not too much. But it’s something you know, because magnesium is a big one, right? And with magnesium RBC, we want to see a greater than five on that one, red blood cell magnesium greater than five. So that’s helpful. And then, of course, we mentioned magnesium surround, we want that greater than two. And then your minerals, you want them somewhat mid reference range, once we start going under 100 or so I think like sodium, it’s like 104 is kind of mid range. If you’re under 104, it could be a problem, potassium, I forget the exact ranges in it, but I want them all about mid range. In regards to the reference range. 

Evan Brand: What do you feel about using conventional bloodwork to do like omega three omega six fatty acid panels, I know, there’s some Doc’s that are just so obsessed with all these ratios. But, you know, truthfully, if you’re doing the things that we’re discussing with our clients and patients for nutrition, you’re going to pretty much be optimized anyway. I don’t know what that would tell you. Besides, hey, maybe you need to do a little more this or that? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, it’s a great question, I think, look at the person’s food. Like someone could have really good diet, but let’s say the meat and the eggs aren’t pasture fed. Well, that could easily be the reason why your omega six to three is off a little bit. Or it could be that you know, you’re just doing too much plant fats, and those plants or from coming from, you know, omega six bass plants soy or canola or safflower. So if you’re doing good fats, like coconut oil, and olive oil and avocado stuff, which are monosaccharides are Yeah, so those are, yeah, those are MonEl fatty acids versus like, vs. poly, which is like a fish oil, right. And then so the fish oils, you have omega threes, right, which are going to be like, the ones that are we talking about that are going to be more on the anti inflammatory side, right? These are the Polly’s. And then of course, the Omega sixes are going to be more on the vegetable side. These are going to be also Polly’s but they’re going to have six bonds, these are going to be your safflower canola, these are going to be your soybean oil, all of your plant based fats, most in the most of your plant bait fast, to extract the fats from them with the olive oil or maybe an avocado, you tend to have to damage the fats, they tend to be more damaged, they tend to be more on the Omega six side. And when you get when you eat plants by themselves, you’re not getting that concentration of fats. And so you tend to not have that high omega six to omega three, when you’re doing just vegetables by themselves. Okay. And so we can just look at how much fish you haven’t per week, how much pasture fed eggs you have in a week, how much steak or meat that is grass fed, you haven’t per week, and then you can kind of look at it relative to what’s high on the Omega sixes like the knots and the seas and the refined vegetable oils. And you can kind of get a pretty good assessment of where you’re at, which is like kind of for one or less. So four times omega six to one is pretty, it’s pretty. Okay. And you can always run that omega three to six tests on the blood too. Does that make sense? 

Evan Brand: It does. Yeah, I just find that it’s not a huge needle mover. So I don’t run it too often. I mean, I think it’s cool to check in you could call it kind of a lie detector test as somebody says they’re doing everything that’s dialed in, but then you find out that Oh, they’ve been coconut grass fed steak, but it’s been in this healthy heart oil blend that they found on the shelf and it was a safflower canola combo. You’re like, Oh crap, then we missed it. And you got to get off of that stuff. So yeah, I mean, I was just gonna say so it’s not really a standard thing. For me at least you know, I’m not running into often with people but- 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But it’s there it’s an option and then it’s something if someone wants to run we’ll run it and so we have the polyunsaturated which is the fish oil or on the omega three side, right. And then we also have things like flaxseed oil, but it has to get converted to the to the higher up fatty acid so you know, omega three fish, and then you get to get some mega three from cows that are grass fed as well. 

Evan Brand: What about particle size on a lipid panel? So we talked about that briefly. It’s just a good add on that most people don’t do and our friend jack Wolfson, he discusses particle size and I think it’s something that more people are asking questions to their doctor about but it’s still very uncommon to run. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: People that have a cardiovascular history. Just want to run it to begin with. I think it’s okay. I can almost always tell you what your particle sizes if you’re eating good health saturated fatty acids like coconut oil and grass fed butter. And you’re getting meats that are like good quality fish, good quality grass fed beef, egg yolks, you’re keeping a lot of your junky fats down a lot of the refined sugar down and a lot of the trans fats down, you’re going to have a large, you’re going to have a particle size A, which means large and buoyant and fluffy, right? Think of a like you want an ad on your test. And then you have the small dense atherosclerotic particle size B, think B for bad, and the B for bad, more trans fats, more inflammatory, processed vegetable oils, more refined sugar. And so with patients, I almost always can look at their diet. And guess what that will be to begin with. So if I do a dietary check and do a diet recall, what’s what’s the average day look like? And I look at that and I get a window, it’s pretty easy to predict that. And so we’ll run it for patients that have a cardiovascular history, and they just want to know, but for the most part, it’s not hard to predict it. 

Evan Brand: Yeah. And when you see it, are you just tweaking dial? Like, if you see a bunch of small dense particles, or are you coming in? Are you using any kind of like plant sterols or anything like that, to help with it are you just tweaking diet, and then it fixes itself? 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It depends how acute the patient is. But if it’s if it’s not acute, meaning the patient’s not dealing with a heart issue right away, then we’re going to just tweak the diet, and that’s going to take care of it, we’re going to add an extra omega three fatty acids from fish oil, we’re tweaking the diet, we’re getting the carbs down, we may be adding extra nutrients to manage blood sugar and manage inflammation. And then usually within a month or so you’re gonna see a big change. After we retest. Awesome, yeah, usually once you get about 100 good meals, then you’re going to see a big shift. A good average person is doing about 21 meals a week, right? So three a day times 721. So four to five weeks, once you get 100 meals in, if you can get them close to in a row. Your body has a huge shift in physiology. 

Evan Brand: It’s amazing how quick you can change stuff I knew. I mean, sometimes we get impatient because like what the detox piece like that takes longer. I mean, I’m here I am a couple years in detox and mycotoxins. I’ve still got some going on. So, you know, with that, it’s like, oh, man, you get impatient. But luckily, with the blood, it’s a quicker turnaround time sounds like. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, totally, man. It’s really important. So I think we hit some of the big markers today. I would say one other one for lipids. You know, I don’t really care if cholesterol is a little bit on the higher side, just I try to make sure the cholesterol to HDL ratio is ideally you know, four. So if the if your Triggs are sorry if your total cholesterol is 200, and your HDL is 60, or what’s that ratio to the math, put my calculator 200 divided by 60, that’s 3.3. That’s pretty darn good. Usually, when you’re under three and a half, that’s half the average risk factor. Okay? When you let’s say you’re at 242 40 divided by 60. On the HDL, now you’re at four. And so I like to look at the total cholesterol to HDL because HDL is what recycles cholesterol. Okay? So if you have good recycling lipoproteins, ie HDL, that’s a good sign. And then I’m also going to look at my trigger to HDL ratio, we want that under two. But if we can have a closer to one, that’s wonderful, what does that mean? Take your trig number, let’s say your trig numbers at 60. Let’s say your HDL is at 50. Well, what’s that? What’s that number? Well, we do 60 divided by 50. We’re at like, 1.2. That’s good. So we want to under two but closer to one’s ideal. That’s a really good marker. That’s my insulin resistance inflammation marker for my limits. So I’ll look at trade over HDL. That’s a really good marker. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, you know, I talked to jack one time about the, the blood and I said, When do you start getting freaked out regarding total cholesterol, because if you talk to a conventional cardiologist, they’re they’re brainwashed on that 200 number. And he says that he’s got people up in the 450s, that he’s not worried about 1%, like total cholesterol being 450. And it’s not an issue. So he just talks about, like he said, ratios, inflammation associated with it, you know, then you get into more trouble. But I mean, the total number, I mean, he acts like it’s just minimally important.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, on its own, I would be a little bit concerned once you start getting in the mid 300. Just because that’s that could be more hypercholesterolemia. And that’s not necessarily a diet thing, that’s more of a genetic thing where you’re making a lot more cholesterol. So I personally would get a little bit more concerned with that and I’d be monitoring that. But it’s hard to really jack up your cholesterol when you’re keeping inflammation down. Like I just did a blood test for my lipids last month, and my cholesterol my total cholesterol and you know what I eat man? I good fats, good proteins, good eggs, good fatty acids. And my total cholesterol was at 165.

Evan Brand: Whoa, yeah, I was like a 202.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, 165 my my trades were at 60. And my HDL is we’re at 50. So I had like a 1.1 1.2 ratio for trigger over HDL, which is great. And so most of the cholesterol, you’re gonna Ahead is gonna be made by your body. So when it starts getting too jacked up and your diets good, you know, we want to look at thyroid hormone, maybe that could be a big thing. And there could be a hypercholesterolemia genetic issue, and we can always run a genetic test for that to see what’s going on. And if that’s the case, what are natural things you can do to get your cholesterol down, you can do higher dose berberine to make sure your thyroids check, you can also do some potential plant sterols as well. But get that check. So my philosophy if it goes a little too high, I’m curious, I’m worried about the hypercholesterolemia piece. 

Evan Brand: Yeah, and I don’t mention that 400 number just to get people off the hook. I just thought it was interesting that that’s what he was saying. And he’s probably talking like, you’re in big trouble if you get to that point. But But anyway, so that’s rare, though. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s super like these are very, very rare situations, you know, sub 1% of the population are going to be there. My never seen it ever. I have two patients with that. But most people already know about it, because someone in their family already had been picked up previously. Yes. So most people already know what especially today, you know, maybe 3040 years ago, not as much, but people that have had those issues have already been picked up. They already know genetically, if it’s in their family, and then once you know genetically, if it’s in their family attend to get tested for it. 

Evan Brand: Yep. Right? Well, let’s wrap this thing up. So as we mentioned, bloodwork is a piece of the puzzle. If you go to a practitioner, and they’re like I’m going to analyze your blood and tell you everything you need, they’re wrong, because you mentioned some of the clues into the immune section about parasite infections and all that. However, I will speak for you and say that you’re not going to depend on that bloodwork solely to identify parasites, you’re still going to be running comprehensive genetic DNA based school panels, you’re going to be running organic acid panels to look and deeper. So yes, you may look at those things. And I think it’s awesome that you gave us some insight into that, however, I’m not going to go to a guy who’s going to look at the blood and say, Yep, you’ve got parasites, let’s put this protocol together, I’m going to want more data. So blood is just part of that data. And it can be helpful, especially when you’re working with autoimmune people, because you and I like to look at these antibodies, and it’s very fun and satisfying. And it makes you look better when you could have a a woman come in with a TPO of 1000. And all you do is fix her gut and our TPO antibodies go down to sub 200. That’s exciting. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally, that’s huge. So I think today is very great, great podcast, because we’re talking about actual things. We want people to kind of like say, Hey, you know, what’s it like to be inside Dr. J, and Evans head, and this is kind of it. And everything that we look at, we’re kind of like a detective, we’re putting like checkmarks in the column over here that support us going in this direction, or going in that direction. So we add up all of our checkmarks, right, and we’re kind of create what that differential diagnosis is, and what tests we’re going to do to dive in deeper in in whatever those avenues where those check marks are adding up. So that’s kind of inside of our head, we’re walking through you through our thinking. And if you want to dive in and reach deeper, you know, into work with a practitioner, like Evan or myself, you can head over to EvanBrand.com, you can schedule a consult with Evan or myself at JustinHealth.com. And you can schedule we are available worldwide to help y’all with your functional medicine and natural health care needs. And if you want to get to the root cause we’re going to be the best person to to look at anything else you want to highlight here today. 

Evan Brand: Maybe just one frequently asked question, Well, I’m not where you live. Does that matter? Well, in the US, it doesn’t matter at all. We can run like a blood comprehensive blood panel, we can run that anywhere now. We’ll try to help people internationally in regards to providing maybe some codes or things like that to help people. But at least for the us know, you location does not matter. We haven’t had any issue with that. I think New Jersey for a while was getting a little more strict. But beyond that, no. I mean, nationwide, it’s a piece of cake. So as we talked about the beginning, create a panel, send a requisition form to your email, print it go get your labs drawn, you’re done. It’s awesome. percent was in New York, or was in New York or New Jersey was one of them. 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, both. 

Evan Brand: They’re both difficult. But was it for blood? Or was it for some of the functional or was it- 

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: For blood, but there are some still some Malin fingerprick tests that we have accessible to deal with patients like that. So we still have options for them. Maybe not quite as much. And then if they’re near the Connecticut border or the Pennsylvania border, we have also options there too, but we still have some mail and stuff. That’s helpful. 

Evan Brand: Cool, cool. All right. Well check out the sites JustinHealth.com. EvanBrand.com. We’ll be back next week. Take care.

Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. Have a good one, y’all. Take care. Bye.


References:

https://justinhealth.com/

https://www.evanbrand.com/

Audio Podcast:

https://justinhealth.libsyn.com/essential-blood-tests-to-analyze-your-health-podcast-305

The Top 5 Causes of Chronic Headaches

Today we are going to be talking about the top underlying reasons why you may be having a chronic headache. I had a patient come in today who had headaches for 25 years, monthly and chronically, and we were able to get to the root cause and there are many different root causes for every person. Let me lay out the common ones that I find to be a major vector of my patients.

Click here for a consultation with a functional medicine doctor if you are experiencing chronic headaches!

So we have headaches and head pain or migraines where you kind of have that aura and sound sensitivity. There are a couple of different major reasons why headaches may happen.

1. Food Allergens

Most common food allergy is gluten and dairy. There are some studies on gluten affecting blood flow up to the brain. We have these garden hoses on the side of our neck called our carotid arteries. When we have inflammation especially caused by gluten that can decrease blood flow and blood profusion to the frontal cortex, and when you have less blood, you’re going to have decreased performance of the brain. You can see that manifesting in a headache. People don’t know but headaches are actually an issue with vasodilation in the brain.  Caffeine can help as caffeine actually causes constriction and brain’s typical headache signal is caused by vasodilation.

2. Food Additives.

These could be things like MSG, aspartame, Splenda or various artificial colors and dyes.

3. Blood Sugar Fluctuation.

We want to have healthy proteins and healthy fats with every meal. If we skip meals or we eat foods that are too high in carbohydrates and refined “crapohydrates” and sugar, and not enough fats and proteins, our blood sugar can go up and then drop. This is called reactive hypoglycemia. We react by putting a whole bunch of sugar in our bloodstream because all of these carbohydrate sources break down into sugar — processed sugar, grains, flours and acellular carbohydrates. These type of flours and refined processed carbs get converted to glucose in our bloodstream. When glucose goes up, our pancreas goes, “Holy smokes! We got a lot of glucose there. We got to pull it into the cell.” It spits out a whole bunch of insulin and pulls that glucose right down, and we have his blood sugar going up with a lot of insulin driving that blood sugar back down. When that blood sugar goes back down, this is where we have cravings.  This is where we have addictions, mood issues, energy issues, jitteriness, and cognitive issues. Our body makes adrenaline and cortisol to bring that blood sugar back up. Most people literally live on this high insulin where they are making fat, storing fat and engaging in lipogenesis which makes us tired. Then blood sugar crashes which makes people jittery, anxious, and moody. Most people live on this reactive hypoglycemia rollercoaster and that can drive headaches.

4. Gut Infections.

Patients with a lot of gut inflammation, gut permeability, and infections whether it’s H. pylori, SIBO (small intestinal, bacterial overgrowth) or fungal overgrowth have gut stressors can create inflammation in the gut. When we have inflammation in the gut, we have gut permeability. So our tight junctions in our intestines start to open up and undigested bacteria, lipopolysaccharides, food particles can slip through and create an immune response. You can see histamine along with that immune response and histamine can create headache issues.

5. Hormonal Issue.

A woman’s cycle is about 28 days and in the middle is ovulation. Some women have it during ovulation and most have it right at the end just before they menstruate. This is called premenstrual syndrome that is right before menstruation. A lot of women may also have it during menstruation, too. What happens is progesterone can drop out early and that drop in progesterone can actually cause headache manifestations and also the aberrations in estrogen can also cause headaches as well. We may also see it with excessive bleeding too. So if you’re bleeding a lot or too much, what may happen is you may lose iron and that low iron may cause oxygenation issues.  That low level of oxygen may also cause some headache issues as well.  Because if you can’t carry oxygen, that is going to be a stressed-out situation for your mitochondria and your metabolism. For menopausal women who have chronically low hormones and they’re not in an optimal place, that can create issues. Progesterone and estrogen can be very anti-inflammatory. So if there is inflammation in the brain, progesterone is a powerful anti-inflammatory and that can really help a lot of inflammation in the brain.

If you have any questions about headaches, please reach out to a functional medicine doctor to find a way to fix your issue.


The entire contents of this website are based upon the opinions of Dr. Justin Marchegiani unless otherwise noted. Individual articles are based upon the opinions of the respective author, who retains copyright as marked. The information on this website is not intended to replace a one-on-one relationship with a qualified health care professional and is not intended as medical advice. It is intended as a sharing of knowledge and information from the research and experience of Dr. Justin and his community. Dr. Justin encourages you to make your own health care decisions based upon your research and in partnership with a qualified healthcare professional. These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Dr. Marchegiani’s products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. If you are pregnant, nursing, taking medication, or have a medical condition, consult your physician before using any products.