Natural Solutions For Dandruff Fungal Overgrowth – Dr. J Live Podcast #162
Dr. Justin Marchegiani and Evan Brand talk about dandruff in today’s podcast. Learn what causes it and explore other possible underlying health conditions like gut infections involving bacteria, yeast, fungus or parasites.
Gain an understanding on how functional medicine practitioners approach this kind of problem including their clinical strategies and the testing involved. Get very helpful information regarding the products that they have found effective to address dandruff and the supplements they recommend to improve health conditions related to dandruff issues.
In this episode, we cover:
06:32 Antibiotics and Dandruff
07:27 Fungus and Refined Sugar
14:25 Birth Control Pills Effect and Dandruff
23:03 Hair Loss and Thrush Issues
32:16 Glutamine and Leaky Gut
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Very cool. My wife and I brought our new baby to his first wedding. That was pretty exciting. First wedding with the new one was fun and he did a great job.
Evan Brand: Oh, good. Ain’t it great when you go out on public and the baby is good, isn’t that great?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Totally. How’s your baby doing?
Evan Brand: Oh, she’s great. She’s actually— she’s got her molars coming in.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, wow!
Evan Brand: So she’s very incessantly crying this morning. Uh— but wife texted me and said the baby knocked out. So naptime is a good time. That’s great, man. Very cool. Well, we chatted kinda in our early part of the show talking about what we’re gonna talk about today, really. And we kinda discuss that dandruff is a big issue that’s been coming up in our clinical practice. We want to talk about kinda what is and just some of the clinical strategies that we utilize to approach it and to help address it from a root cause functional medicine perspective.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Something I think we should hit on first is what’s the conventional approach is? Is it dermatologist that people are getting refer to? Like what’s the rabbit hole would you say that people end up on with the dandruff problem?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So dandruff typically uses excessive shedding of kinda the skin on the scalp. And it tends to be fungal driven. Of course, there are natural diet things that help, right? Good fats, good proteins, like the digestive, the hydration component. All those things are important, but the infection component is really important because you can have the diet stuff all dialed in and that may not be enough to get rid of that infection component. And sometimes the— the fungal overgrowth that—that’s there could be there from a deeper infection. It could be there from H. pylori or blasto or deeper parasite infection. So, it’s important we keep our eye on what could be there in the scalp area, but also what other bigger infections could be promoting that overgrowth.
Evan Brand: Yup. So, if you go to conventional doc and you just happened to bring up dandruff, what are they going to do? You think they’ll just refer you out to a dermatologist in then they’ll give you some steroids for it? What would the conventional approach be? That way we have something to contrast it to our functional medicine approach.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So your conventional approach is gonna be head and shoulders or sell some blow. That’s gonna be the general conventional approach. They may give you uh—a uh—you know, systemic antifungal medication that they see other kinds of things happening there. That’s gonna be the general consensus.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So the first thing that we’re gonna look at is we would probably lean more towards a anti-fungal kind of shampoo that’s herbally-based like tea tree or lavender or uhm—neem. These are some of the really good antifungal shampoos that are out. We’ll put some of the links below couple of the ones that I like are Art Naturals and Purely Northwest. We’ll put some links below here, so people can access them. We—I use those in my clinic a lot. You can also just get some pure you know, apple cider vinegar. You can mix a little bit of coconut oil. You can even do a little bit a tea tree and put it straight and kind just gonna do a little scalp massage and get right there in the scalp. That can be helpful, too. Uhm—but some other shampoos that are out there that already to go. So that’s another good option for you. Just, if you don’t want to have to deal that.
Evan Brand: Cool. So let’s talk about testing. I mean this is always our philosophy. “You’ve got to test, don’t guess.” If you’ve got a fungal issue, we talked about parasites. So we want to look into the gut and in the organic acids testing. Wouldn’t you say that be an important one for this, too?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I like the organic acids because because you can kinda look at fungus that may be more systemic. So when we look at a gut test, we may see various species of fungus in the gut. We may see Candida. We may see geotrichum yeast. We may see other types of Candida species. These are different species of yeast. And again, yeast is like the big umbrella. Fungus is the big umbrella and then we have some species of yeast there kinda under that big umbrella of fungus. So fungus is the big umbrella, yeast is the— the smaller kind of umbrella. And again,s mold like different molds that you may see like aflatoxin mold or ochre toxin. These different compounds are also kinda under that fungus mold umbrella as well, right?
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So getting to your question—Those are some of the big ones that you may see. Now, the benefit of the organic acid test is we have some markers that are more systemic base. So we have the D-rabanose. It’s an interesting marker that looks at fungal overgrowth from a systemic perspective. So, sometimes we see people to get the stool test back and they’re maybe okay from a fungal perspective, but when we look at the organic acid urine, we may see that the D-rabanose is on the higher side which tells us there maybe some kinda fungal thing going on at a systemic level and sometimes we may see it systemically but not on the gut. So that’s a good marker, too, for treatment.
Evan Brand: Yep, cool. Yes, so, Justin and I, between us both, we run thousands and thousands and thousands of stool and organic acids testing. I would say, Justin, tell me if your assumption is different. Nine out of every 10 people have a yeast and/or a fungal problem. Whether it’s to the level which can cause extreme issues or not. Maybe it’s not nine out of 10 that have an extreme problem, but someone somewhere, nine out of 10 is gonna pop up with something that needs to be addressed in that category
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. 100%. I think there’s some –there’s always some gut component. I would say the majority is a gut component. And most people with a gut component, uh—yeast is gonna be present. I find that yeast as the primary issue isn’t more common—it’s—actually less common, I should say. Where it’s more common is there’s a deeper, infection like a parasite or bacterial infection that’s of a higher level.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And yeast is kinda there, kinda like you see these sharks and you see these underlings that kinda suck to the shark’s belly.
Evan Brand: Yup, right.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: They’re kinda like that. They’re just there as the underling and you get these bigger, stronger kind of critter that is the primary focus.
Evan Brand: Oh, by the way, I don’t know if this is true, I heard from a client of mine last week, supposedly, diagnostic solutions is coming out with a new panel that can be added to the GI-MAP where we can actually test for worms including pin worms.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s awesome! I’m really excited. Worms are definitely a concern. I know we’ve talked about, you know, we use –we add in worm wood. We added mimosa pudica, various herbs like that to help with a lot of these worms as well.
Evan Brand: Yeah. So, that’s true. We’re gonna have some really good extra clinical nuggets in our hand.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent.
Evan Brand: So—I wanted—I wanted to mention antibiotics. So, somebody does have dandruff and we could also convey that message to other issues with the hair, the skin, the nails.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.
Evan Brand: There’s probably a history of like a urinary tract infection, right? So like these yeast and fungus that you’re talking about. If that’s affecting the vaginal area for a female and they get put on some type of natural antifungal or probably a conventional anti fungal. That stuff’s gonna come back with a vengeance. They may end up doing antibiotics therapy, too. And that’s not good. That’s gonna create a lot of room for the yeast and fungus to overgrow and all of a sudden, you’ve got the clean up crew that has to come post-antibiotics.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent.
Evan Brand: We’re not big fans. Like if you can avoid antibiotics, if your life is not in danger, then you could probably go ahead and say skip them and go to the natural remedies instead.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: A hundred percent. So of course, the big thing when we deal with any type of fungus is really cutting out refined sugar. So, if we could look at our carbohydrates, we kinda draw a line down the middle. We have like real food carbohydrates on one side of the fence, and then we have refined sugar carbohydrate with extra added sugar to the carbs on the other side. So, basically, draw that line, anything that’s refined sugar, we throw out, and then the left side, I kinda break it down into starchy, non –starchy, okay? So, starchy being like sweet potatoes, squash, white potatoes. Non-starchy could be our veggies, uh—broccolis, brussel sprouts cauliflower, kale. Those are our non-starchy. And then basically, we have our high sugar fruit and our low sugar fruit. High sugar fruit are gonna be more tropical things—bananas, pineapples, mangoes, right? Those kind of things. Then we have our lower sugar fruits— berries green apple, grape fruit passion fruit. Those kind of things. So we try, number one, stay on the non-starchy carbs primarily. And the low sugar fruits. So typically, 1 to 2 servings a day even on an anti-fungal approach is gonna be okay. Some people they go to the excessive and cut everything out but there’s some clinical evidence that these fungal critters may go into the spore-like state where they’re now kinda in hibernation mode. It may make it harder to kill them. So, we’ll actually have 1 to 2 servings of fruit in there. We may even actually up the carbs even more during the killing to bate them out. We want to wake up that bear so it’s not hiding in its cave all winter, uh—so we can hunt them down, so to speak.
Evan Brand: That’s a great point. So if a ketogenic— if a ketogenic diet has been the norm for someone, we may need to bump up carbs a bit, maybe add a little bit of fruit back. And there’s been a lot of demonizing of fruit lately, which I’m just not really a fan of that. I think there’s a lot of value there.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Again, it’s all individual. If you’re super over weight, you have a lot of markers for insulin resistance, your waist size is greater than 40inches for male, you know, up 20 pounds too much weight on there, then, yeah, that may make more sense to limit it or at least focus on the lower glycemic, low sugar variety, right? Low fructose variety. Maybe keep that fructose below 15g a day. That makes sense. But if you’re pretty active and pretty healthy weight, I’m fine with it. Hand—couple of handfuls about a day, that’s not a problem.
Evan Brand: Yup, good. So you mention the diet peace, now, some talk about diet as if he could cure you of these problems. I mean, I don’t really agree there where if you just follow this Candida diet, all of a sudden your problems are going to go away.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think if someone is like, you know, they’re kinda like dipping their toe in the functional medicine field like, “Is this worth it?” Well, just start with the diet stuff and see how much you get accomplished with that. If someone is having a lot of refined sugar and a lot of refined carbohydrate, right? Remember that line I drew? Refined carbs and then whole food carbs? If they’re having a lot on this side and they cut that out, they may see a significant improvement, which is great. And they may cut the grains out as well, which is great. But uhm—that maybe that last 20 or 30%. Or if there’s a deeper infection, uhm—that will have to be removed as well. So if it’s purely a fungal overgrowth that you may see a good improvement, but there may be some stuff still lingering. If that’s the case, then we got to dig deeper. Put on our clinical hats and you wanna definitely reach out to someone like myself or you, Evan.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Well said. I guess my point—I wasn’t trying to pass the diet piece. I guess my point is that a lot of people sell these books, promoting certain diets as if you can magically eradicate all of your gut problems. For me I got maybe 80% better so I dealt with IBS for probably 10 years, maybe even 15years. I mean, I had always had irritable bowel problems. Once my diet was better, my gut problems were there, but then when you first took a look at me, you said, “Evan, you’ve got parasites. And that’s something that no matter how much kale and broccoli I ate, I wasn’t going to get rid of parasites.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Or grass-fed meats. Yeah. Exactly. I get that. So, we’re kinda biased because we see a lot of people that already come to us, they got their diet on track and we got to dig deeper on top of that. So, I get where you’re coming from, for sure.
Evan Brand: Yeah. But the low hanging fruit that is the diet. And then we—we’ve, you know, Justin and I often have people that come to us that have been doing like a Paleo template or even like uh—autoimmune Paleo and they’re still sick and that’s where you say, “Okay, good. You’ve got the diet in place. It has to be in place, perfect.” Now, let’s dig deeper and that’s where we gonna find this other stuff.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent. So we hit the uh—we hit the fungal component of dandruff. We talked about the excessive shedding of the skin on the scalp. You know, a lot of babies have it. It’s called cradle cap or seborrhea dermatitis, tends to be fungal-based. Again, with my kiddo, or just really giving just real, good-quality breastmilk, but also what the mom eats has a huge effect on the breast milk.
So my wife has kinda have a good Paleo template, really on point. We give our kid probiotics as well. He gets the infant strain probiotic. I know your daughter did the same thing as well, which helps a lot, too. And surprisingly, our baby’s had you know, zero acid reflux, zero spit up. So I think that that’s really made a big difference as well.
Evan Brand: Cool. That’s awesome. Yeah. So mom’s listening, this could apply to babies, too. Now, do you have any evidence on this? Like a mom passing a yeast or a fungus overgrowth to the baby via breastmilk? I’ve heard that was Lyme’s disease and co-infections, you know, the spirochetes can pass through the breast milk but I just wonder about you know, the yeast. Could you pass a yeast through the breastmilk?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, that may or may not be the case. I’m not really sure. There may be some data on that. Uh—my biggest concern is a lot of the infants that are gonna be fed formula, if you look at a lot of the ingredients, it’s about 50% high fructose corn syrup.
Evan Brand: Oh, God.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: If you look at the amount of sugar that’s in a lot of these uhm—formulas, it’s the same amount that’s in a Coke.
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You just gotta be careful because that’s not really the best thing for your child. And then a lot of it is gonna be GMO, too. And there’s evidence of uh— Mercury on getting into a lot of these high fructose compounds due to the extraction process. That’s not good either.
Evan Brand: Wow. So I’ve talked with a couple practitioners who do like a microscope—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.
Evan Brand: When you look at the blood and they’ve seen little—little balls of yeast basically in the serum of the blood. So I just wonder, “Huh, wonder if any of that actually gets into the system where— where mom pass it to the baby or not.” Well, I have to keep asking, keep digging. That is just my curiosity, but—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think it’s a really great question here. And I’ve I think clinically, it makes sense. I see a lot of women that have poor gut issues and their child can get it. You know, they’ll get thrush with that white coating, so to speak. And they’ll get kind of a yeast issue where they get a lot of kind of a diaper rash stuff and that can happen as well. Like with our child, we’ve had no real yeast issues not even any diaper rash. We just kinda—like a couple of times, my wife will put a little bit of coconut oil there. We have some natural stuff. Yeah, we put there. But outside of that, he’s—you know, my son Aidan has been doing great on that side of the fence.
Evan Brand: That’s great. All right, so we hit the diet piece, we talked about antibiotics as a potential problem leading up to this. I would say birth control pills could be a factor, too. I’ve have had a lot of women— I don’t know the exact correlation or causation. I don’t know if that’s doing something with progesterone and estrogen that—that’s causing the dandruff for what it is. Do you have a take on that of why birth control pills could be a factor?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Birth control pills have an effect of alkalizing. So we can alkalize the urinary track. It has effect in alkalizing the guts and fungus likes to be more in an alkaline environment. And now everyone’s like “alkalize your diet” right? Well, a lot of these bacteria and we’ll just say fungus’s and bacteria, they like more alkaline environments. If you look at what probiotics do, probiotics actually add acidic load to the intestines. Like if you look at acidophilus, it literally translates to acid loving or acid producing. If you look at a lot of the really good fermentable drinks, a lot of them are very high in various acids, whether it’s glucuronic acid or uhm—
Evan Brand: Acetic acid.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Acetic acid, which is the main acid in apple cider vinegar and it’s not a surprise that acids like apple cider vinegar are used to treat fungal issues in the hair or they’re used to treat UTI issues as well. People will then utilize the Apple cider vinegar before meal to help with digestion and also acidify the urinary tract, too. So, a lot of these things are very helpful to decrease the critters and it changes the environment in the gut. So, good probiotics actually spit out more CO2, right? They spit out more of these really good acids to help get the gut into an environment PH wise with these critters can’t thrive, so to speak.
Evan Brand: Ahh. Okay, got it. Yes. So birth control pills, the antibiotics, maybe the prescription Diflucan’s or other prescription antifungals that you could’ve been on before making these strains more resistant. We talked about the sugar in the diet we talked about the gun infections, looking into those for bacteria and yeast fungus, parasites, getting your gut check with functional testing, not conventional testing. We talked about getting the urine organic acids for looking into the yeast and measuring it that way because stool test often gives us a false negative.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: We may even look at blood, too. We may look at candida antibodies like IgA, IgG, IgM. We may see those on the higher side, which could just mean there’s more of a systemic issue. And it’s nice to know because if we don’t have any gut stuff going on or we don’t even see any organic acids stuff, you know, typically, you’ll see some organic acid. You’ll see the D-arabinose there.
Evan Brand: Yeah. So what do you say to a person when they say, “Oh, Justin, can I just go buy a bunch of herbs and just start randomly throwing stuff from the kitchen sink at this problem and see if it works?”
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, the bigger issue is most people that have these symptoms, they have a whole bunch of other things, too. It’s very rare that you’re like, “Oh, my only chief issue is dandruff.” Or some kind of fungal issue, right? It’s mood, energy, sleep. If you’re female, there’s probably some cycle imbalances, whether it’s menstruation issues or mood issues or breast tenderness, back pain. Whatever’s happening there and then you have this. So there’s a constellation of the different things happening. And body systems, they function and dysfunction together. So, imagine a beautiful orchestra going, right? And one instrument starts going off. Let’s call that one instrument our fungal overgrowth or uhm— our scalp kind of a dandruff issue, right? That’s our one symptom. That’s our one imbalance. Well, it doesn’t take long before the rest of the orchestra starts singing out of tune as well.
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And that’s what I’m referring to when we talk about the other hormonal issues that go out of balance. And then when we start having gut issues, then we can start having more leaky gut, which then can create more immune stress, then we can have more malabsorption and low stomach acid and enzymes and nutrient deficiencies, which then affect neurotransmitters and other hormone pathways. So you can see how this thing can really spiral out of control pretty fast. So, that’s why it’s good always digging deeper to really get a good body system audit of all the other things that are happening.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said. I’m so glad you—you said it so eloquently. I did a rant at the end of my podcast that I put up last week and I just told people like, “Look, please, don’t wait until you hit rock bottom. Don’t wait until every body system is falling apart and then you reach out.” Like you and I work with those complex cases all the time. But if you’ve got one thing like it’s anxiety or little bit of depression or little bitt of gut issues or little bit of skin issues, it’s so much better to start getting tested and start digging deep then, as opposed to waiting until you’re symptoms list is 20 pages long. You’ve been suffering for 20 years, then you hit rock bottom, then you decide you want to get better. I’ll tell you, it will save people a lot of money and a lot of suffering if once you see these problems a little tip the iceberg poking out, address it, then don’t wait until like you said you’ve got anxiety, depression, PMS, irritability, mood swings, rage, poor sleep and dandruff to top it all off.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent.
Evan Brand: Please. And that’s not even to benefit us. It’s to benefit you. You know, we’ve been so booked up that we aren’t necessarily begging you, “Hey, please come see us.” It’s not like that. It’s the fact that, “Hey, look, I just want to save you some suffering and save you some time.” Justin and I came from our own health journeys as well and if we could just give you one piece of advice and maybe I’m not speaking for him, so I’ll let Justin give his— his feedback, too. But If I could say one thing, it would be if you’ve got a weird symptom, there’s probably some other stuff going on that you just have to find and fix.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent.
Evan Brand: Like me, I had to wait until I’d lost about 25 pounds. I had terrible sleep. I woke up, I wasn’t feeling rested. I had a lot of stress. I had some anxiety problems even to the point of a panic attack. I called Justin up one day, “man, my heart’s beating out of my chest. I can’t stop my heart.” You’re like, “Well, how much stress do you got going on? I was like, “ a lot” And he’s like, “how are you sleeping?” I’m like, “haven’t been sleeping very well” and then he’s like, “what’s going on with your gut?” and I was like, “Oh my Lord, every body system is affected” My gut has been affected, my brain, my stress response is broken. I was like, “this ain’t even me, I’m even an anxious person. What’s going on?” And you go, “Oh, it’s parasites, Evan.” So, for me, I had to learn the hard way. I had to wait until my symptoms piled up so much that I was falling apart to then fix it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent agreed. I think we’re at that the point in our careers where we realize that there’s probably uh— more people out there that we see online with the you know, the millions of downloads we get every few months, that were not gonna be able to help anyone— everyone, so to speak. And there’s just too many people out there to help that— you know, we really want to put as much free content out there and if we can just get most of the people to just apply the free stuff, that is going to be huge. And we’re gonna make a huge difference in the world just by itself.
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think we’re really just getting really good actionable information and I think the key thing I want to push to everyone listening, if you can walk away with just one action item, “Hey, I’m gonna do this.” or “I’m gonna add this component.” or “I’m gonna add this diet shift or this lifestyle change, or this supplement change” I think that you’re gonna make yourself better and healthier after every podcast.
Evan Brand: Agreed. Cool. Do you want to hit some questions for a few minutes?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. We’ve got some questions.
Evan Brand: Okay, cool.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Everyone writing questions, if you can kinda keep the questions framed towards the conversation, I mean, you know, you can kinda do a little politician pivot where you’re like, “Hey, dandruff” and then you’re on adrenals, right? We could kinda do that, so to speak. But I’m just trying to keep it connected to what we’re talking about as possible. If it’s so disconnected, we’re just gonna have to skip over the question.
Evan Brand: Yup, yup. Well said. Okay. Yes. So a lot of those were like off-subject questions. Let’s see.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I got one here about—let me see, I’ve got Gerald’s question here. Gerald was on my G.I. Clear 2, positive for H. pylori. I feel like it’s returned. If add Masika to the G.I. Clear 2 what dose should I take per day? Typically, two caps TID, two caps, three times a day and we need to retest, Gerald. Make sure the infection is gone. Make sure there’s no residual infections. We want to look a little bit deeper to at your partner or any dogs or pets in the house. Uhm— partner for sure is the easy one because that can, you know, you can go get that reinfected back and forth. So we need you to retest and then do GI Clear2 and the pure Masika, 2 caps TID and get that retested.
Evan Brand: Well said. Yeah. I had that a few weeks ago. A lady, she said, “I feel like my—my gut’s backtracked. I got off your herb. So, what’s going on?” and I said, “Well, now it’s time to test your partner. And sure enough, there is the H. pylori.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup.
Evan Brand: That’s why she’s been getting re-infected. It took three rounds to get rid of it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.
Evan Brand: Alright, let’s go over to the next one here. There was one from Ovi. We’ll call it uh—I don’t know how to pronounce that full name. “Any tips on reducing hair loss and thrush when coming off of HRT as a female?”
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So— that would be helpful to know. I mean, imagine, I’m just coming guessing this is menopausal female, okay? So, you know 53-54 and up. So depending on kinda where the hormonal imbalance is, it’d be good to know if there is an estrogen dominance present or if we’re just having low estrogen and low progesterone and everything’s kinda in the tank. So, typically, when I think hair loss, though, I’m leaning more on the thyroid side. So, I’d want to know where the female hormones are at or if you’re cycling or not. So, if you want to comment on that, that’d be helpful. Uh— number two, really looking at the thyroid component because the thyroid has a huge effect on the hair follicles, stimulating the hair follicle to grow. And then number three is the gut component because that’s where we digest and break down a lot of the nutrients and amino acids and fatty acids that become the building blocks for our hair. So I want to look at those three places first.
Evan Brand: Well said. So I’d also add on looking at ferritin levels, too.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: See if there’s some type of anemia problem. You hit the thyroid so in—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And when I say thyroid, though, that includes all that consolation because iron is very important for making thyroid hormone, so if you have a history, if it’s menopausal female and she’s not vegetarian or vegan, doesn’t have a history of endometriosis or fibroids or excessive menses, it’s probably not an iron issue.
Evan Brand: Good. Good. And then when you talk about the thyroids, too, so this is also including the antibody. So make it sure that there’s no Hashimoto’s at play coz we see that a lot. Justin and I find that many people with autoimmune thyroid, the hair, like nine times out of 10 it’s a problem.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yup. Exactly. We’ll add in collagen peptides, too. Just this collagen is uh—it’s just great. It’s a great building block and then if it’s in peptide form, it’s already super easy to digest. So, give a little plug for my Tru Collagen on that one.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Check it out. Alright. Gerald had a follow-up question for second round of H. pylori eradication, should it be a 30 day protocol or 60 days?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Typically, a minimum 30. You can’t go wrong with just a 30. It just depends on what other infections were present along with that, but if it’s just the H. pylori, let’s say 30—30 to 45 is typically good.
Evan Brand: Yup. Nice. Alright. Mossimo had a question here, “Are sustained-release essential oils and herbs necessary as opposed to the liquid oil taken internally? It’s kind of a confusing question. I didn’t know there was such thing as a sustained-release essential oil, but what were talking about for this conversation would’ve been like a topical. So like Justin mentioned about those brands of the tea tree oil shampoos and such—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: That would just be a couple of drops on the scalp. Use some type of Jojoba or avocado or coconut oil.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: And try to dilute that so it doesn’t burn your scalp.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally. In my line, we have GI Clear5, which is an emulsified form of oregano. That is more enterically coated. So it does open up more in the small intestine than the stomach. A lot of the fungal issues tend to be more on the stomach. I’m sorry—
Evan Brand: Oh, yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It tends to be more in the small intestine. H. pylori more in the stomach. Evan Brand: Yeah. I forgot about the—the oregano oils.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.
Evan Brand: I guess when I read essential oils, I was thinking just like your standard oils that you diffuse.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s why I’d like to have some of my, you know, oils or some of my herbs taken on an empty stomach just so it can get fully out of the stomach into the small intestine where it can really help. It and really help can be little more effective.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Alright. So, Samuel had a question. “What’s your take on taking CBD with no THC for inflammation? I take it for the first time and noticed a huge difference in relaxation.” I’ll hit this one.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: I’m a huge fan. I just posted a YouTube video. If you haven’t checked it out, look it up, Samuel. I went to uh—a hemp form here in Kentucky one of the very few hemp programs that has been approved by the state government. And the guys making super high quality CBD and the guy is— so he used it on his son who is having hundreds of seizures per month and now the kid is like 12 years old and hasn’t had seizures in years just from CBD no THC. I think the THC does have benefit. I hope that there’s a couple of bills that are trying to get through for 2018. I hope we can federally just decriminalize cannabis across the board because I have talked with people, especially in the pain department, where when they add a little bit it of THC in, all the sudden their fibromyalgia or chronic pain does get better, which isn’t achieved just by the CBD by itself. So I think both would be awesome.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I’m not a huge fan of the THC side uhm— I think it can have some really good benefits if you’re going through cancer treatment and have extreme nausea and/or extreme pain and the CBD is not helping enough. I think it can be helpful like if we’re choosing you know, THC over chronic dose of the pain medication or opiate or like a lot ibuprofen, I will definitely reach for the THC component you know, over—over the rest. My biggest thing is just uhm— number one, there’s some potential memory side effects, cognitive side effects. Number two, I would say making sure that you’re not having to incinerate every time, right? Trying to do of a vaporizer or some kind of other medium that’s not involving the incineration, which exposes the poly aromatic hydrocarbons, the heterocyclic ABGs, the carcinogens that are produced. And uh—the CBD obviously is better just because it’s a less psychoactive, but if you can you know— epileptic stuff, autoimmune stuff, anxiety, mood stuff, the CBD for sure. THC more on the—if the CBD is not working and you need the pain or you have a lot of the nausea stuff that may be better.
Evan Brand: Yup. I mean with the THC, I don’t—I mean I’m sure there’s tons of people that still combust, but you really don’t even have to anymore. There are so many different drops and tinctures and potions and such that you don’t have to burn. You don’t have to burn the herbs anymore. And people don’t want to get high, too. So you could do like a 20% CBD like a 1% THC and you’d probably feel really good.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I hate the feeling of being high. I’ve only done it a few times in my life, but I’m tired and I just get the munchies. I’m fatigued and I just get really hungry. It’s like I don’t need that. I want to be energized and alert. And I think a lot of the negative studies on marijuana, too, is number one, you really have to make sure you’re not getting pesticide exposure.
Evan Brand: Exactly.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And you have to kind of faired out the burning and the incineration of the leaf.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think if you pick, take those two components out, I think you’ll see a lot of those confounding variables showing negative results in those studies in proof.
Evan Brand: For me, a vaporizer change my life. When I had IBS, the only thing before I knew about by diet changes that help me was a vaporizer. It would slow down my bowels since I was having so much loose stool. It would regulate the bowels better stomach cramps, stomach pains would go away so I had a lot of hands-on experience— super helpful.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Go ahead, I’m sorry.
Evan Brand: I just have to say, I don’t vape anymore currently. One is it’s impossible to find a good source in Kentucky. Now, if I go to Colorado and I could find some good organic, high-quality, I’m gonna take a sample, that’s for sure. But for me, I just— I can’t find a good source here. So I do stick with the—the CBD drops, which is legal, too. You know, it’s another thing. It’s— it’s legal in all 50 states, the CBD is.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally. And uhm—just kinda –I think a lot of marijuana, maybe not the CBD, because that’s more the— the non-psychoactive. I think a lot of marijuana is used you know, to cover-up emotional stress uhmm—you know to the kind of numb yourself out from whatever’s happening in your life. So we just gotta make sure that you’re not using it to avoid reality, so to speak. But there is a lot of drugs out there that are very dangerous and have a lot of side effects and kill a lot of people. So if we’re choosing marijuana over these drugs that kill a lot, I will always choose the drug that doesn’t have the profile of killing people, right?
Evan Brand: I’ll pick it over alcohol, too.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: If I had somebody say, “I wanted to drink a bottle wine every night” or “hit the vaporizer, do a couple of drops of a tincture” The alcohol for me is gonna be a bigger problem coz it’s gonna create the leaky gut situation.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I mean if you’re drinking excessively, if you’re having a glass or two and it’s organic, you know, you’re probably fine with that on the alcohol side. But if you’re going you know, four glasses a night and then it’s consistent, yeah, they’ve done studies. I think it was a Giuliani report they looked at like the highest ranked college students in the country and they say you know, what do you prefer, alcohol or marijuana as a drug of choice? And the kids that have the highest grades were choosing the marijuana and their main reason was the hangover. They could wake up the next day and studying, get their work done.
Evan Brand: Makes sense. Let’s see if we have any other on-topic questions here. Do you see any others?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: See here—see, we can find some things that we can connect to our little politician side stepped here.
Evan Brand: Gerald had one, about how do you know if you’re eating too many starchy carbs per week? I— I cycle like it depends on the week and depends on activity level how much I’m gonna do.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I mean it—I think 50 to 150 is a pretty good place for most people to be. And if you’re doing a lot of lifting or a lot of CrossFit, then you may need to go up to 250. So I think, look at your height and weight. If you’re at a really good height and weight, you’re gonna have more latitude. If you’re lifting a lot of weights, I think you can go up to 150 to 200. If you’re doing Ironmans or like you know, those, then you may have to go way higher than that. So I think you really just figure out where your activity level is at. Figure out where your height and weight is right now. 50 to 150’s pretty good. And you earn your carbs. So you exercise more, you—and you’re lifting more weights, you can up your carbs a little more and just try to keep it whole food, you’re gonna be fine.
Evan Brand: Here’s another question about glutamine. Should you take glutamine by itself to repair leaky gut or is it okay to combine with protein?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I mean glutamine is an amino acid, but if you mean like glutamine and then have real whole food protein, yeah, that’s fine. I mean in my line, we use GI Restore, which has glutamine and a bunch of their healing things and glucosamine and we’ll mix that and add in a drink, take it on an empty stomach and then patients will still have you know, a really good whole foods meal. Or we’ll add in the collagen as well which is very high in glycine. And glycine’s really good for the enterosite healing as well. So you can do either glutamine. I’ll typically only do L-glutamine by itself for patients that are very, very sensitive. We’ll typically add the healing compound in there, you know, the GI Restore, the all the other, licorice, aloe, slippery elm, glucosamine, right? Modify—We’ll all those in together and if that’s causing too much sensitivity, then we will do L-glutamine by itself. But they gotta really be sensitive if that’s the case.
Evan Brand: Yeah. And that’s— I find that pretty rare. The glutamine by itself to me, it just doesn’t move the needle as quick as the combo products like you talk about.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Only if there’s an allergy issue. And then, the collagen is great. Glycine’s a really big building block for healthy gut function, too.
Evan Brand: Nice. Bone broth, too. I think that’s another—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That is very high in glycine, too. Yup.
Evan Brand: Cool. I think that was it. There were bunch of other questions, but a lot of these were super off subjects, so I don’t want to distract from the convo too much.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So—
Evan Brand: The others—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think we kinda hit everything. I want to go off to— you know, off to uhm the kind of the __ James here talks about this just kind of the cost regarding the organic acid test and keeping it low. Typically, if— if you’re trying to keep the cost down with the organics, let’s do the test once a year. You know, do it once a year. Ideally, if you can do it uhm— twice a year, that’s ideal, but if not, you can just do it once a year. That’s kinda your—your best bet kinda just fine-tune your program once a year with the organics. That’s probably the best way to make it more cost-effective.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said. Gerald said that we guys are the best. Change his life. Hey, Gerald, thanks. We appreciate it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uhm—Gerald is actually a patient. Glad we could help, Gerald. That’s very good. And one last question, too. Diana talks about doing a podcast on estrogen dominance and progesterone therapy. Hey, you’re kinda—you’re too late. Check out the podcast’s show notes. We did a podcast on estrogence dominance and we talked about progesterone and __ augmentation programs that we do with progesterone therapy, too. So check out that podcast, Diana.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Go on either uh—Go on Justin’s YouTube. That’s probably the best if it’s posted there or to check out his site Justinhealth and just type in estrogen. You should find it either way.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And if you guys enjoy this right now, the best way you can thank us is give us a thumbs up, post, share on your twitter and/or uhm— Facebook. We love it. We just want to help more people and you notice, it’s a lot of people that are out there podcast people, they either hold information back or all they do is spend oh, you know, 90% of the time promoting their products and affiliates. I think 95% of our time is just free intel. Of course, we got a little plug here and there, but we’re 95% free information because we know there’s too many people out there that need all this info and we’re just gonna be an open book to everyone.
Evan Brand: Yup. Totally. So, we hope it helps. And if you need to reach out, schedule a consult with either of us. For Justin, check out his site. Justinhealth.com You can look up and click the book an appointment button. Myself, same thing. Evanbrand.com Check us out. Stalk us. Study us. Look under every crevice and corner. Read our reviews. We’re here for you. We’re happy to help if you got this issue going on.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Leave us comments below. Tell us what you like about the podcast and tell us about future podcast that you want to hear. We’re reading them and we get inspired by those comments below. So say, “Hey, I like this about this podcast and I want to hear something about” And tell us that topic we’ll add it to the queue.
Evan Brand: Yes, sir. Good chatting with you.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Everyone, have a great day. Take care.
Evan Brand: Take Care.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Bye.
Foundational Nutrients for Optimal Health – Dr. Justin Live Podcast # 155
Dr. Justin Marchegiani and Evan Brand dive into the topic of nutrients and their importance to our bodies. Listen to this podcast and learn how B vitamins, Magnesium, Vitamin C & D, Selenium, Zinc and Omegas contribute to achieving a healthy body. Understand how these vitamins and minerals support different bodily functions and gain an understanding on how their deficiencies affect our health and cause unfavorable symptoms.
Explore other topics related to nutrients as they answer questions about leaky gut, H.pylori and some blood pressure medications which contribute to nutritional deficiency. Know some of the best sources of supplements and product recommendations which have been proven effective based on their practice and professional experience.
In this episode, we cover:
09:00 B vitamins
11:25 Minerals + Magnesium
28:15 Vitamin C, Selenium
36:26 Vitamin D
Evan Brand: A happy Monday. If you’re watching in the future I guess the day doesn’t matter but for us it does.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I had a great weekend, man. I was doing a little waterskiing action today. It was phenomenal—actually yesterday, I’m sorry. Great, great day and back in the saddle for an awesome Monday. Got some patients coming up right after our live podcast. How about yourself man? Anything good happening for you?
Evan Brand: Uh—Actually, Yeah. I’m going to create a pretty cool piece of content as soon as you and I get off the call together, I’m gonna go eat some lunch and a I’m gonna drive about an hour away to a local hemp farm where there’s a guy who has a Kentucky hemp oil company that I’ve been seeing his products everywhere. His son was having a major seizure disorder. His son was having hundreds of seizures within a week. And he started to use cannabis extracts to help his son and now his son has not had seizures for years— several years. And so this guy he moved from Northern California where he was growing medical cannabis and now he’s just growing hemp in Kentucky and so I’m driving to the farm. I’ll probably end up doing a podcast with him coz I don’t think it’s gonna be easy to do it in the field, but I’m gonna try to take my camera and puts— maybe a 45 minute little video together, try to interview him, get a little bit his story and share his products coz I’ve been using the CBD with my clients. And as you and I talk about with inflammation and the anti-anxiety benefits, you can pretty much use it with anyone. And it’s going to help regardless of the case whether it’s like Lyme or Hashimoto’s or H. pylori. Whatever we’re dealing with our clients, I mean we can pretty much use CBD across the board and we might notice some beneficial changes and it’s definitely not gonna hurt somebody. So looking forward to going to meet that guy. And stay tuned because I have a video probably the next week that’s gonna be published on it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Love it. Yeah. I think CBD has some really good benefits. I use on handful of patients for pain issues, for sleep issues, uh—for anxiety, just from immune balance. And I do fine. It’s— it’s very good. CBD or Cannabis Diol is the non-psychoactive component of marijuana or hamper cannabis, if you will. THC Tetrahydro Cannabis that’s gonna be the part of the marijuana that gets you high and kinda gives you the munchies. So you get some of those benefits with the CBD without the, you know, the higher the munchies afterwards. And I’ve seen it work very well with seizures like you mentioned, very well with autoimmune and pain stuff. I mean it can be very therapeutic. I don’t think it fixes the root cause but I do think it’s very, very therapeutic. It can help.
Evan Brand: Right. Well said. Yeah. Definitely not gonna fix the root cause but I’ve had some people too that are in California, other states where they can even get recreational cannabis and I tell people go for it if they asked me because if they’re doing a tincture or they’re doing a spray or sublingual, they’re not having to smoke, they’re not having to use a vaporizer if they just don’t want to get the high, there’s— there’s tons of different options where you can do a high CBD. And a very tiny amount of THC where people can help fix their sleep. I had a __ in California she’s had chronic pain. She’s had Lyme forever. She said if she does CBD by itself, does pretty much nothing; but when she adds just like a milligram, so do say, 10 to 50 mg CBD, 1 mg THC, all the sudden the synergistic effect happens and the pain goes away.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. They can be very helpful. It’s a good tool in your functional medicine uh— pockets, so to speak.
Evan Brand: Yup. Hey, Robert, thanks for joining us. James, thanks for rejoining us. Our topic, well, we figure we’ll do a Q&A but our topic initially is about foundational nutrients kind of what the things that are actually worth your time and money because Justin and I were so many people come to us after they’ve been to other functional medicine practitioners. And we’ve got a kind of clean up the mess and there’s like 20 or 30 or 40 supplements that people are taking. And we like to try to whittle that down to just some of the foundations. And some things people are taking might help and can’t hurt, but if you’re spending a thousand bucks or something crazy amount on supplements, we really want to give you the stuff that just gonna move the needle coz why take something if it’s not gonna do stuff for you.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. And again, kinda foundation before we go in is a Paleo template to start. And again, that’s macronutrient agnostic. It could be high-carb, low-carb, high-fat, moderate fat, high-protein, moderate protein, right? So we’re just focusing on the anti-inflammatory, nutrient dense, low toxin foods. That’s number one. And then from there, the next step above that is making sure we have the lifestyle stressors in order: sleep, hydration, uh—not eating when we’re really stressed, that’s number two. And number three is actually making sure we can digest the foods that we eat. We eat a really good diet but we can’t break it down. That’s the equivalent of going to the grocery store and leaving that food out on the counter, not putting it in the fridge for a week or two. It’s gonna rot. So the next step above that is HCL and enzymes and digestive nutrients so we can break those really good foods down. That’s our foundation. And once we have that, that’s where I think some of the nutrients come in. So with my patients, all of them, they’re on all either the Multi Nutrients Supreme or Multi support pack which has the extra, kinda stress handling nutrients that are gonna be in there which are gonna consist of high-quality B vitamins that are methylated or activated like P5P uhm—of course, like your B1, B2, right? Thiamine, riboflavin right? These are all—niacin—These are all important nutrients. Of course, activated LMTHF folate, of course, methylated B12 or some kind other adenosine hydroxy B12.
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh—chelated minerals like calcium and magnesium and zinc and selenium, right? All chelated meaning they’re bound to specific amino acids, so that we can have better absorption. When we have an amino acid, kind of uhm—they’re next to it, it’s like an escort or a bodyguard for that nutrient to get where it needs to go in the body, if you will.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said. A lot of these nutrients people are—I’m hearing feedback. What’s going on your end? Maybe your speakers are a bit loud.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I’m good on my end. I don’t hear anything here.
Evan Brand: You don’t? Okay. Leave us a comment in the YouTube if people hear the feedback at all, if you hear my voice echoing. A lot of people are so deficient in nutrients, even with an organic diet. And that is something that you and I see and measure on the stool test and then we see and measure that on the organic acids test, too. You know we’ve got a lot of people that come to us because they’ve heard us talking about like a ketogenic diet or some other high-fat diet. But then we can measure something called the steatocrit on the stool test. And so, if people wanna quantify, “Well how am I actually digesting”, “What can you guys teach me about my nutrients?” and “My diet’s perfect, I’m one of those guys, I want to try to fix everything with diet”, well, we can take a look and see if that’s actually working for you. So if we see steatocrit that’s high, that’s a fecal fat marker. You can look at your stool, of course, but it’s better to have a number. And if we see that your fecal fat marker’s high, well, we know we’ve got to give you some good fat digesting enzymes, help out the pancreas help out the gallbladder. And then also on the organic acids panel, we’re going to look at the amino acid markers, so we can see do you have the raw breakdown materials? Coz your proteins—like your animal proteins and pastured animal products—those are all made of amino acids. That’s like the breakdown products. Stuff like those and that’s what fuels your brain chemicals, your neurotransmitters and so, if we see you’re super low on amino acids, that’s a problem. So we have to fix it.
And like you mentioned, why is it happening? Well could be infections like Robert is uh— he’s a left us a comment here. He is talking about that he’s had Blasto, he’s had Klebsiella, he’s had Citrobacter—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: He’s resolved a lot of his infections through Dr. J’s uh—antimicrobials, which is awesome. I guarantee you are getting robbed for a long time of your—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: 100%. 100% So the first thing is, right, we have that kind of diet. So think of like your health is like running a business. So every year that you’re unhealthy is like a business, right, having more expenses than its profit, right? Where then its revenue— gross revenue, right? So you’re going a little bit more into debt, a little bit more into debt. The difference is you don’t go into bankruptcy court, right, and go bankrupt. You have symptoms. And those symptoms eventually may lead into a cluster of diseases or pathology whether it’s diabetes or it’s just obesity or maybe it’s cancer or heart disease or you’re just in this in between where you kinda have chronic fatigue, you don’t feel good, you’re kind of depressed. And then you’re in this in between where you go to the doctor and they’re just like, “Oh yeah, you’re just aging.” or “Here’s an antidepressant.” or “It’s all in your head.” And then you’re stuck with these kinda in between kind of diagnoses where you’re not— you don’t have a disease, but you sure don’t feel good and you’re not getting any answers, right?
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So that’s kinda the big thing that we see. So we’re like, alright, so imagine that that’s the equivalent of business $1 million in debt. Well just because you start having good business practice and start pulling a profit, you gotta now make above and beyond that million before you start coming back in the black. So that’s where it’s really good for some of these supplements to come in because they kinda, you know, act like a mini bailout or a mini—a mini business loan to kind of bring you back in the balance. So things like B vitamins are great because you burn these up when you’re stressed. And if you have a lot of dysbiotic bacteria, these cre— the good bacteria produce healthy amounts of B vitamins. If you have a lot of bad bacteria, you’re not getting the B vitamins and you’re also getting a lot of toxins, too, which create leaky gut and create more stress and cause you to burn B vitamins and also creates a lot of lactic acid which eats a lot of your B vitamins. So B vitamins are really important first step. And we have B vitamins like B1, which is Thiamine or B2, which is Riboflavin or B3, which is Niacin and B6, which is Pyridoxine 5 Phosphate or Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, B9, which is Folate, uhm—B 12, which is amino, B12, right? Uhm—Methylcobalamin Hydroxyl Adenosyl Cobalamin, right? These are important B vitamins especially if you’re a vegetarian. B12 is gonna be one of those that you’re missing. So any comments, Evan, on the B vitamins and how important they are.
Evan Brand: Yes, sir. Absolutely. And I’m gonna address Robert’s question at the same time answering uh—or adding a comment. He said “Can these infections result in high homocysteine levels?” The answer is absolutely yes and there’s a journal that I’ll send over to Justin so we can put it in the show notes. It was American family physician was the literature but it was an article all about vitamin B12 deficiency and basically what happens is whether it’s H. pylori or like they even talk about in this article which is surprising coz most conventional medical people they kinda disregard parasites, but it’s talking about the link between parasites and B12 deficiency and then the link between B12 deficiency in elevated homocysteine levels. So, yes, we may give you some type of supplement, It’s gonna have the B12 like we always talked about. We’ve gotta get to the root cause, too. So we’ve got to fix those infections like I’ve had. We gotta fix those, too, at the same time while supplementing. So let me send it to you, Justin, so we can—we can share with the listeners.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That sounds great. I think B vitamins are really important just number one because of the stress component; number two because of the gut bacteria component; and then number three just to kind of—most people are still stressed so they need those B vitamins just to help kind of breakeven every day. So that’s the first component. Uh next let’s talk about minerals. So one of the first important minerals is gonna be magnesium because it’s a mineral that has over 100 or 1000 roles 1000 and enzymatic roles in the body, right? It has a major effect on dealing with enzymes. So with Krebs cycle, with energy, with blood pressure, with mood, with, sleep, with relaxation, with stress. Lots of different roles in the body and it’s one of those that are just incredibly deficient in our food supply. There’s lots of studies on magnesium deficiency and that’s it literally prevalent over 50% of the population. So this is important and if we’re not eating organic, then the magnesium in our food will be lower. So magnesium is one of these things that we wanna make sure is in a high quality supplement. I put it in my supplement via magnesium malate. So it’s bound to malic acid which is a Krebs cycle kinda intermediary nutrient. So it’s really important for the Krebs cycle and that way we can at least guarantee a couple hundred milligrams but because it’s chelated, we you know, it—more of it gets into where it needs to go which is really important. So magnesium is another one of those very important nutrients.
Evan Brand: Good. Well said. Yeah. And if you bought magnesium at Walgreens or CVS or Walmart or Target probably magnesium oxide, we talked about this before, but it’s about a 4% absorption rate. So if you’re taking 100 mg, you’re getting 4% of that; if you’re taking a 1000 mg, 4% of that. So take a look at your supplement bottle, flipped it around and look at the form of magnesium. If it’s oxide, you could use it for constipation that’s about the only benefit. But like Justin’s talking about the to help fuel the enzymatic processes and help Krebs cycle and promote energy and all that, it’s not going to do anything. You’ve got a look at the malate’s; you’ve got a look at the taurates; you’ve got the citrate’s; the—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Glycinate.
Evan Brand: Glycinate, the threonate. So there’s many, many good ones out there. And Mercola, I don’t know if he’s just saying this like anecdotally or if he’s got some literature on it, but Dr. Mercola’s recent talk about EMF and how he believes that the magnesium can help mitigate the EMF and he’s recommending like 2 g a day.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uhm.
Evan Brand: — of different forms of magnesium. It makes sense, but I don’t know the mechanism of how that would help.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Interesting. Well if we look at the big magnesium foods, right? Magnesium is gonna be lower in foods, but it’s gonna be highest in our green vegetables— spinach, swiss chard, uh— pumpkin seeds uhm—you know, kefirs, things like that, almonds, some legumes, avocado, figs, dark chocolate—dark chocolate’s a really good one, uh— banana. Again, you just have to be careful because if you’re kind of having autoimmune issue, more on autoimmune template to start, well, seeds are out, any dairies out, legumes out, uhm— some of these—half your foods are gone.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So you have to be careful like the big things are gonna be high quality dark chocolate, uh—lots of good greens. And if you can do one of these nuts or seeds like the pumpkin seeds I mentioned, that’s a really good place. But if not, that’s were leaning on a good supplement is gonna be helpful, but the green veggie, I think will be the key uhm—to that. So we just gotta keep in in mind, you know, there may be some foods that are really good for us made nutrient profile but they may have an inflammatory profile that’s— let’s just say, kinda contradicts or kinda—the risk outweighs the benefit of getting that nutrient coz of the inflammation.
Evan Brand: Yeah. I agree. So if you’re autoimmune protocol, if your digestion’s compromised, which it probably is if you’re on an autoimmune protocol coz you probably had an autoimmune illness and that’s what we’re recommending an AIP diet. Sounds like a magnesium supplement will be much— much, much more necessary and helpful. Uh— we had a question from Linda. She said, should she be concerned if every time she goes to the stool, so every time she poops uhm— there’s an oil slick.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I don’t know if I would say– I don’t know if I would say scared but concerned, oh, right, yeah. I mean I would be scared if there was blood in the stool.
Evan Brand: Right.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Like you know decent bit of blood and it wasn’t just from a tiny bit of a hemorrhoid issue. But if I saw blood in the stool, I would be scared, for sure. I would definitely get that—some kind of a hem—some kind of an ulcer or cancer, make sure that’s ruled out. But with just the slick in the stool, I would be concerned because you’re not digesting your fat which means vitamin A, D, E, K your fat-soluble nutrients like your long chain fatty acids like EPA or DHEA or you know, coconut, good fats like that, you’re not absorbing those which means you’re gonna have blood sugar issues and you’re gonna have malabsorption, for sure.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Absolutely. So in that case, Linda, if you listen to us before, we’ll sound like a broken record, but if not, uh— you know, if you’re working with Justin or I, what we’re gonna end up doing with you would be looking at the stool test, we’ve gotta measure that fecal fat, the steatocrit marker, we’re gonna look for infections. So we’re gonna look for parasites; we’re gonna look for yeast; we’re gonna look for fungus; we’re gonna look for anything that’s gonna be stealing your nutrients or messing up that absorption. H. pylori if that’s suppressing the parietal cells that make hydrochloric acid in the gut. Now your whole digestive cascades is falling apart, we’re gonna look at medications. So if you’ve got a history or your currently taking some type of acid blocking drug we’ve got a factor that in coz that’s such a huge factor for fat digestion, too, if you’re just suppressing that. So we gotta look for those underlying causes but eventually, yes, we could fix the situation and probably add enzymes back in. Let’s address uh—Haley’s question, too, Justin, coz uh—it kinda ties into this. She said that she’s— her digestive enzymes can make your pancreas and gallbladder quote unquote lazy. What are your thoughts? We know that’s not true. With melatonin, yes, you can turn down the production of melatonin if you supplement. But with enzymes, my understanding is we’re only feeding the fire. Justin, can you comment.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well even with melatonin I talked to Dr. Ron Rothenberg about that and he says long as the dose is relatively low that that won’t happen coz it’s a positive feedback loop with these things. But when it comes to hydrochloric acid and enzymes, one of the major feedback loops for HCl and enzymes is gastrin, right? And gastrin when you take supplemental HCl, enzyme levels are –or gastrin levels don’t drop. So it’s not like you get testosterone testicle shrink in size.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s not like that. So my bigger concern is that someone’s not making enough enzymes because they don’t have enough hydrochloric acid in the stomach and my concern is that’s— there’s not enough HCl on the stomach because of the sympathetic stress response, right? That fight or flight from food or from emotional stress or physical stress, so we, of course, we’re fixing that stuff upstream, right? Eating in a good, stress-free environment, not hydrating with food hydrating before, you know, we’re after biting after an hour or two but after, you know, 15 minutes before. And then we’re taking enough hydrochloric acid to lower the acidity so we can activate our own enzymes. But taking something is gonna be great coz I’m more concerned about that food sitting in your gut and not being digested and basically rotting and rancidifying and putrefying, creating stress by sitting in your gut.
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s my bigger concern.
Evan Brand: I agree. So we hit the minerals. You talked about those you did great. We hit our magnesium which is gonna be probably number one. There’s a whole organization dedicated to magnesium deficiencies. If you type in gotmag, it think it’s gotmag.org. There’s like stage 2, 3 and 4 symptoms. You could even have insane symptoms, big issues, heart arrhythmias, atrial fibrillation, all sorts of other like heart-related issues due to magnesium, if you’re deficient. So if you’ve got some heart flutters or some weird symptoms, the cardiologist, they’re not gonna know you’ve got a magnesium deficiency, they’re just gonna end up putting you on like a beta blocker or some type of heart rhythm drug like they’ve done to my grandmother. And they’re not addressing magnesium and these drugs they’re using are likely gonna deplete magnesium even more. So we could get into some really, really big serious health implications if we don’t address something that simple as magnesium.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, hundred percent. So again, big source of magnesium, in my line, I have one called Magnesium Supreme. That’s a magnesium malate. That malate’s are– the malic acid so that helps in the Krebs cycle, it helps with energy but also has a relaxation effect. So that’s one of the ones I formulated. I still even like a little bit of magnesium citrate at night. I think it’s great. It may not be the best absorbed, it’s cheaper but it’s still good. So I like my Magnesium Supreme and then we use the Malate— Magnesium Malate in all the multis. And the multi-nutrients Supreme, in the twice or in the Multisuper pack. So that’s kind of what we have. I like those. I use those daily. I think they’re great. And then for kids that may be uh—you know have serious gut issues, we may do like a magnesium threonate kinda gel to help or magnesium chloride kind of uhm—Epsom salt bath, too.
Evan Brand: Nice. And with the anxiety like PTSD, traumas, phobias, the supplement in my line is called Calm Clarity. And I’ve used that one with great success with people especially veterans who come back from war and they’ve just got a lot of emotional trauma or women who’ve been through some type of abuse threonate crosses the blood brain barrier. So that’s another form of magnesium and not any one form is perfect but you can use a combination of these. So like Justin mention, you wanna cycle. Maybe you’ve got some malate here, you’ve got some citrate here—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: You can add different forms.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And then we’ll put show notes and links to some of these things. So if you guys want to support the show, we always appreciate that. We’re just trying to get you the best information possible. Now, I talked about the magnesium foods. Some of the B vitamin foods, okay? Again, you’re gonna have like if you go online and look you’re gonna see the fortified ones which are gonna be cereals and orange juices which is basically crappy, crappy B vitamins.
Evan Brand: Garbage.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The worst quality. So do not count on any of the B vitamins from those foods. And number one, you shouldn’t be eating those foods, anyway coz they’re very high in sugar. With the orange juices and the grains are obviously gonna be the gluten thing which are gonna be inflammatory as well. So cut those out, nix those out. But you’re gonna do really with fish, with vegetables, with fruits, with meats, with leafy greens, egg yolks. So a lot of the Paleo versions of those are gonna have super, super high amount of B vitamins which is great.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Like Pop Tarts, like fortified with 12 vitamins and minerals. It’s like, “Oh yeah, let’s just eat pop tarts, high fructose corn syrup and genetically modified glyphosate sprayed wheat flour. We’re gonna be just fine.” Not true, not true, not true.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Remember, when you take in a lot of sugar and refined carbohydrate, all that refine carbohydrate converts to sugar and when you look at the Krebs cycle, how that Krebs cycle pumps around and it goes through all these kind of uhm—you know, reduction reactions where all these hydrogens kind of accumulate. It takes magnesium to run those cycles and if you’re basically—if it’s costing you more magnesium to run the cycle than you’re getting in, this is what we call nutrient debt, right? You’re not getting as much from it than you are— for the cost to run it, okay? So keep that in the back of your mind.
Evan Brand: Luckily the human body is resilient. I mean if that— if we we’re like a car, you and I use car analogies, if we we’re at such a nutrient debt like most people are, the car would be dead. But luckily our body will still survive. You just won’t thrive in these situations. You could have hair issues, skin issues, nail issues, like you said, autoimmune diseases, cancer, you’ve got bad skin, you’ve got acne, you’ve got poor sleep problems, you’ve got anxiety, depression, you’ve got chronic fatigue, you’ve got obesity. I mean, a lot of these diseases that have skyrocketed 10,000% over the last 20 years, there’s many, many factors that we can address in one podcast but like you mentioned, just a nutrient— the nutrient density of the soil has been reduced which is why—and I didn’t tell you this yet, but I uh—expanded my property. I bought the acre next door as well.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, cool.
Evan Brand: I’m gonna have a 1 acre farm and I’m gonna have as much of my food come from that as possible. Not the meats coz there’s a couple restrictions on having animals but my goal is to provide 50% is my goal. Uh— 50% of my own food. I’ve already grown stuff this year. I’ve had watermelons. Last year, I had bunch of sweet potatoes, I had strawberries, I had broccoli, carrots, all organic homegrown. There’s no more local—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s great.
Evan Brand: ..that you can get than your backyard.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s great. And you can even team up with some farmers and make a deal and say, “Hey, you can use my land and I’ll give you half of what’s on there.”
Evan Brand: I know.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Coz then you don’t have to worry about it at all. And you kinda make this deal, they get free land but they get half the food. Hey, there’s enough food for you and your family. The rest may go bad anyway, so you may end up giving it away, anyway. So that could be a good deal for you.
Evan Brand: Yeah. I’m gonna try to do some pecan trees and I’ve got all sorts of ideas.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Cool. Yeah. Very cool, man. I think it’s important that uhm— people have to understand that your body is like a business. When a business starts having low profits and starts— the revenue starts dropping, the business has to either get incredibly efficient or typically, more than likely, lays people off, right? It fires people, right?
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And it goes off, it fires people that are least essential to driving the profit. Well, the body does the same thing. It just starts allocating resources to other areas. Some dead skin, it’s okay, we’ll have some irritation, it will get wrinkly and creepy, it’s okay, no problem. Fingernails—weaker, more brittle; hormones will be a little bit lower that means you’ll have a lot of cycles, you know, symptoms with your cycle; you’ll have lower libido; you won’t be able to recover from strenuous work out; you won’t be able to put on muscle, that’s okay, no big deal. And uh—yeah, we won’t—we won’t put it– inflammation as much so you’ll be a little bit more achy, you know, you’ll be little bit more prone to osteopenia or osteoporosis. That’s how the body thinks. Uhm– that’s how it allocates. It’s all about survival. We are really about surviving. So those nutrients help run those systems. We really want to make sure that we have enough nutrients to run systems. There a lot of people they’re focused on calories and if you’re eating a real whole foods those calories will have nutrition, but today, it’s possible with the whole pop tart analogy or the junk food analogy, you can get a whole bunch of calories and not a lot of nutrition on the flipside. So you gotta keep that in mind.
Evan Brand: Agreed. You wanna hit a couple more questions or should we try to move the conversation into some more nutrients. I’ve had vitamin C just echoing in my brain that I have to just talk about vitamin C.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Let’s hit that. I wanna hit one last thing on magnesium and we can tie it to vitamin C. There’s a lot of the medications that are out there will actually create nutrient deficiencies. And one of the biggest ones are the blood pressure medications, the water pills, the Hydrochlorothi—Hydrochlorothiazide, the Lisinopril, the ACE inhibitors, right, the beta blockers. These will actually create magnesium deficiency which magnesium is really important for regulating blood pressure, so that actually create more blood pressure, which creates more dependency on these medications. So you can see that vicious cycle. So keep in mind the nutrient deficiency aspect with these drugs. Same thing with birth control pills and B vitamins as well and magnesium. So those are couple of common medications. And then the granddaddy of them all is gonna be the acid blockers that will affect nutrients in many directions, B vitamins, minerals etc.
Evan Brand: Yup. The Omni— is it Omni with an “n” or is it “m”? Omne—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Omneprozol. O-M-N-E and then prozol.
Evan Brand: Okay.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: That’s great.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Prilosec that’s the trade name of it. That’s the—Omneprozol is the generic. So yeah, these are the medications. These are the family of meds we got to be careful of. So, kinda tagging into your vitamin C. I’ll let you the ball with that Evan.
Evan Brand: Yeah. I just wanna—one more comment on the Prilosec.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: And the thing that’s scary is these acid blockers used to be prescription and now they’re over-the-counter. So people just go to Target and they just go buy a 48 pack of these, six month supply and they throw that giant value pack 20% more pills into their shopping cart and they just go home, “Oh, yeah, Prilosec.” It’s like, “good God”
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s really interesting because you know you get all the people that say, “Oh, you have to be such a super, super smart medical doctor to prescribe these drugs. They’re so dangerous. You need to have, you know, a medical Dr. kinda looking over you. And of course, that it—that is true with in a lot of cases, yeah, they contradict themselves coz then these drugs seven years later when the patent goes out, once they go generic and there’s no money behind them, they go over-the-counter.
Evan Brand: Oh my God.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Look at Ibuprofen, right? It kills 20,000 people a year and now it’s over-the-counter. It’s okay.
Evan Brand: Ugh. Insane isn’t it?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So I mean, you kinda talk on both sides of the mouth and you know, we pointed out. Uhm so, yeah, in general, the medications that you’re gonna see that are gonna be out there, primarily are gonna be the patented ones. Once that seven-year patents off or if they can create a mini-me version of it, then it’s over-the-counter and anyone can buy it. It’s up for grabs now.
Evan Brand: Fortunately, beta-blockers and antidepressants are still prescription only. So, that’s good. We’re saving a lot of issues with that. But yeah, let me get back on subject. Vitamin C is huge. It’s gonna be stored in the adrenal glands, typically.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: So Justin and I are gonna measure your nutritional markers when we run organic acids testing on you. We’re gonna look at a lot of nutrients. Nine times out of 10 vitamin C shows up low because people burn through it like jet fuel, just like B vitamins that Justin mention about stress, same thing with vitamin C. There is a reference range most people aren’t even on the map. I’m seeing people at like a point level, like a decimal point level when they should be hundreds of times higher. So I’m typically gonna be using about 2000 mg and I’ve had people say, “Oh Evan, I’ve taken vitamin C for years they still show up low because they were using some garbage they got at like a health food store. Even thought it’s a health food store could still have inferior quality or it’s a consumer break— consumer grade product they bought at Whole Foods or Amazon or somewhere else. And they’re not using professional grade or they’re just using ascorbic acid only, which is decent. But to really boost up the levels, you’ve got to have the antioxidants with it. The quercetin, the rutin, the bioflavonoids.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Mixed ascorbate.
Evan Brand: Yeah. You gotta have the mixed ascorbates, too. You’ve got the magnesium ascorbate, the calcium ascorbate, the sodium ascorbates. If you just do—like what is it? emergency that garbage that they sell at the check out line at Walgreens or other places where it’s not only is it just rate ascorbic acid it’s got fructose in there, too, which is gonna destroy blood sugar. That’s not gonna do anything. You could buy a year supply of that and not move the needle. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent, man. So may—uh—Vitamin C is really important. I also say selenium is one of these things that are very important as well because it’s important for thyroid conversion. Uhm— it’s important for liver detoxification, it’s important precursor for glutathione, right? And we like to give that neither like a Selenium Glycinate or Selenium Methionine kinda bound to one of these sulfur amino acids.
Evan Brand: Let me ask you this.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: What do you say to all these people, “Oh, Justin, I don’t need Selenium. I eat three Brazil nuts per day.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well I mean I think that’s a really good source of selenium; the problem is the amount of selenium in those brazil nuts can vary tenfold. So you could either be getting 50 µg or 500 µg. So the problem is you just don’t know how much you’re getting in each of them. So I think it’s good if you wanna do a Brazil nut or two a day. Just make sure that the uhm—the multi you’re taking guarantees you at least 200 µg of selenium per day. And I think you’re in a really really, good place.
Evan Brand: Yeah. And we talked about the absorption issue. So if somebody has got some gut bugs, doesn’t matter if you eat the Brazil nuts. You could probably eat a whole bag and not boost up selenium, if you’re deficient and you’ve got things stealing your nutrients or compromising your digestive quality.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. And it’s just good to have that insurance policy with selenium. Uh—it’s gonna be hard to overdose with it if you’re in that 2 to 400 µg range and you’re using a good quality like Selenium Methionine. You’re gonna be in really good shape. And again, just kinda tag teaming, we got a lot of people talking about hormone stuff. Selenium is really important for hormones especially testosterone and then we even have Zinc, right? Whether it’s zinc aspartate or zinc methionine or uhm— zinc’s really important. The zinc fingers have a lot to do with the genetics like the DNA the epigenetics. So having enough zinc is really important to activating— having good affects our epigenome. Zinc is extremely important for making HCl. It’s a really good building block for our sex hormones as well. So gotta love zinc and when you’re stressed and you have low hydrochloric acid level, zinc can go low. And you can do is a tally test. We do some Zinc Chloride or—is it Chloride or Sulfate? I was getting confused.
Evan Brand: I think Sulfate for that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes. So Zinc Sulfate. We could do a Zinc Sulfate test. The more metallic you’re tasting it is, the better— the better your Zinc is. The better or the more neutral taste, the lower your zinc is. That’s a good little kind of rule of thumb test.
Evan Brand: So people heard that, they’re like, “What the hell is he talking about?” So basically, uh—Justin and I can send a high-quality liquid Zinc Sulfate and based on the status of your zinc, that will change the flavor of the zinc. When I took this test a few years ago, I think they say, “hold it in your mouth for up to 30 seconds” So you put a little bit zinc in your mouth, you kinda gently swish it around. I swallowed it,. I tasted nothing. That was when I had all those infections. I literally tasted nothing. It tasted like water. My zinc was trashed and then as you improve infections, you get your digestion better, your supplementing with the right type of zinc, all the sudden you could put the zinc in your mouth and then it almost tastes like your licking a piece of metal like right away. That’s the goal but would you say, Justin? 95% of people they’re not going to taste the metal right away which means they’re super deficient.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I mean a lot of them are gonna be deficient if they have gut issues or stress issues or malabsorption those kind of thing for sure. So I think that’s a really important one look at. So we hit the Vitamin C, we hit Magnesium we hit Selenium and we hit Zinc.
Evan Brand: I’d say Omegas and vitamin D would be two others we have to mention.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I think Omega-3 is really important which is—the typical Omega-3 fatty acids there is ALA Alpha Linolenic Acid. That’s the omega-3 in flaxseed oil. We have EPA which is 20-chain carbon which is Eicosapentaenoic Acid, that’s EPA. And then we have the_ DHEA. These are the 20 and 22. The EPA or the DHEA are the fats found in fish oil. These are the really important ones. These have all of the anti-inflammatory action. They help block this prostaglandin E2 pathway which gets inflammation jacked up. They also are really good building blocks for the brain and the neurological system. And the ALA are the Alpha Linolenic Acid from the flax seeds and the vegetables, that actually has to get converted via this enzyme, I think it’s Delta 5 Desaturase. And that enzyme converts the 18 carbon to the 20 carbon and things like insulin resistance and inflammation and stress can affect that conversion and knock it decreased function by 80 to 90%. So you’re not getting those really biologically active omega-3 fatty acids when you’re doing a lot of the plant-based Omega-3’s because of those mechanisms I mention. So getting the really good Omega-3’s from the fish is going to the best way. Plus the fish actually bio accumulate how the plants get it which will typically is the algae, right? A lot of the good vegetable, Omega-3 supplements vegetarian ones are gonna be algae based. Well the fish concentrate the algae. It’s kinda like the grass that cows concentrate the grass. So you’re kinda getting that bioaccumulation in a more concentrated form when you’re doing some of these really good fish oils.
Evan Brand: Well said. Yeah. Pastured meats, too, you will get some— you will get some fatty acid. So your bisons, your elk, which are my two favorites.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: Your grass-fed beef, pastured pork. I would assume you’d get some from pork.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. More than likely you’re gonna get some from any of the animal products. The healthier they are, the more pastured they—the more pastured, the more biologically appropriate their diet is, uhm— the better chance that you’re gonna get more of these Omega-3 fatty acids than the more inflammatory Omega 6. But again, Arachidonic Acids are really important building block which is an Omega-6 fatty acid, but that’s gonna be a really good fat, too. So you don’t want to say, “Oh, all Omega-6 is bad. It’s just gonna really be a lot more of the Omega-6 that are gonna be driven from vegetable oils like refined vegetable oils, right? The good vegetable oils are gonna be olive oil which is a—a Oleic Acid which is really an Omega-9, your—your uhm—short chain fatty acids are gonna come from your butters and ghee which that’s gonna be more animal-based. MCT oil or your Caproic, Caprylic uhm—Lauric acids. These C6, C8, C10, C12 fatty acids, these are gonna be in the coconut. That’s great. Uh—so those are gonna be some of the really good ones to start with. All avocado oils, another really good neutral one as well.
Evan Brand: Yeah. I just wanna point out the fact that we’re hitting a lot of really good foundational nutrients but we could do entire episodes just on magnesium, just on vitamin C.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. We have that on magnesium. I know that.
Evan Brand: I think we did. Yeah. So if—if we feel like we’re glossing over some deep aspects, then that’s okay. The vitamin D that’s huge. It’s really a hormone called vitamin but vitamin D is important we like to your levels at preferably 60 or above. I say nine out of every 10 people are gonna. be deficient in magnesium As you get older, you can’t convert sunlight into usable vitamin D as much. So even if you’re getting plenty of sun exposure which I’ve talked to people who garden for six hours a day, they are still deficient in vitamin D. And so in less— you’re like Dr. Mercola, where he said he hadn’t supplemented in seven years, something like that, 5-6-7 years, he lives at a very south latitude in Florida. He’s out on the beach hours— three hours a day with so much skin exposed and he keeps his levels at about 60. So I unless you got that amount of time and lifestyle to dedicate—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.
Evan Brand: ..to sun, it’s gonna be really tough to keep it at adequate level.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I hundred percent agree. So Vitamin D is really important. We try to do it with actual sun exposure, uhm— don’t burn, kinda get your Minimal Erythemal Dose, MED, if you will. And uhm— supplement the rest. If you can— if you just do a really good 25 hydroxy vitamin or a regular vitamin D3, mine’s uh—Emulsi D Supreme and it’s got the uh—MCT oil and the vitamin D3—D3 in there which is a really good form. Again, you can also add some K2 in it. My biggest issue is you don’t get enough vitamin D with the K2 ones but just make sure getting some really good K2 in your foods which fermented foods are gonna have a lot of K2 uhm—a healthy gut bacteria makes some K2 and then also a healthy grass-fed butter or ghee are gonna be other excellent sources of vitamin K2 as well.
Evan Brand: So Designs has one that’s got 5000 IU of D+ K warning K2. I can’t remember the name. But it’s a pretty good one and I’ve used it before think. I think—I think it’s gonna be called the Su—I think it’s Supreme.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Uh-hmm.
Evan Brand: That’s what is it. D Supreme.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. The problem is the vitamin D levels in it are very, very low. That’s the only issue.
Evan Brand: I think it’s a 5000. What are you—what are you talking about using? You talking about using 8 or 10 thousand or is 5,000 good in your eyes?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It just depends. I like doing the liquid Vitamin D just because if I need to use it therapeutically like someone’s sick, right? I may do 100,000 IUs—
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And that ends up being like 20 or 30 pills. It becomes doing too hard, so it’s easier to take like 30 or 40 drops put in your smoothie and you don’t even know you had it.
Evan Brand: Well said.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I go more with the liquid, but again, your great vitamin K sources are gonna your green leafy’s, fermented foods like—like Natto, of course, Brussels sprouts, cabbage, broccoli, fermented dairy, prunes, uh—high quality uh— grass-fed butter or ghee. So you really, you know, you can get a lot of those uhm—make sure you’re getting a lot of good nutrients from those foods. Make sure their organic and that will help significantly. So if you’re doing a vitamin D, you really want to make sure that K2’s there and make sure those foods are really good in your diet and a lot of good multis and have a little bit of K2 in there, too.
Evan Brand: Good, good. Well said. Shall we look at a couple questions here?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Let’s hit them.
Evan Brand: Okay. So uh—we had a question about Mercola’s complete probiotic. It’s probably decent, Justin and I use professional grade. So if there’s a consumer grade product out there, we’re always gonna say ours is better because we’ve got healthcare manufacturers that make our products. There is very, very, very stringent restrictions in testing and manufacturing processes that we use and so were always going to push you towards our probiotics instead.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: His is probably good, though.
Evan Brand: Yeah. I’m sure their good. I mean Mercola’s, you know, he’s very detail oriented. So I’m sure his are good but we’re biased. So we’re gonna want you to buy ours.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: So you could check out uh—justinhealth.com Check out his line. He’s got several in the gut support section and I’ve got a few formulas, too, that I’ve got on my site evanbrand.com You can check out those.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Perfect.
Evan Brand: Alright. Let’s keep going. What else as we’ve got here? Uh— Robert he asked, “What foods and supplements can you take to speed up restoring low secretory IGA?” What do you think? I think a lot of the gut supports like the leaky gut formulas, your slippery elm, your marshmallow roots, chamomile flowers, anything that’s kinda fix a leaky gut situation maybe some mushrooms to support the IGA for the immune system.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I think making sure the infections are gone, number one. Making sure the diet’s good. Making sure you’re breaking down the foods that you’re eating. Uhm— number three, once the infections gone, adding in a lot of the healing nutrients. So in my line, we use one called, GI Restore, which is a lot of those same nutrients. Uhm—it’s got the glutamine, it’s got the slippery Elm, the aloe, the DGL, a lot of the healing, soothing nutrients. Getting the probiotics up is gonna be really helpful, you know, the Lactobacillus, the Bifidobacter strands, various strands there. Also very high amounts Saccharomyces Boulardiis is proven to help improve IgA levels. So those are really good things that you can add in there. And just making sure the adrenals are supported.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Because a healthy cortisol levels have a impact on your immune system which has an impact on your IgA. Coz your IgA is that mucosal that first-line defense for your immune system.
Evan Brand: Yes. So chronic stress, too, right?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: If you’re taking all the supplements in the world but you have a terrible boss and you hate your life, you’ve got to address that chronic stress component coz that’s gonna be the number one cause that’s going to drive down the secretory IgA.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent.
Evan Brand: Uh—there’s another question here. There was a supplement a person had to had a tiny bit of soy lecithin in it should they be concerned? What’s your take?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I wouldn’t worry about soy lecithin. It’s tough. Uhm—soy lecithin is more of an emulsifier. It’s more to help with the digestion and the mixing of that product is typically not gonna be soy protein in that.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The soy protein is really what causes the problems. Lecithin’s more of an emulsifier. So as long as it’s a good quality product uhm— I’m okay with there being a little bit of soy lecithin in there.
Evan Brand: Yeah. And I’ve got a couple formulas that have it in there. I’ve had people say, “Oh my God, I’m allergic to soy.” They’re fine. They have no issue. that’s not actually— it’s such a— it’s such an extracted form that it’s not like you’re eating soy. You’re not eating soybean.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Right. And then in my line, I think I may just have a few that have soy lecithin in there. But we were able to make sure that it’s guaranteed that it’s non-GMO soy. So you really want to make sure it’s at least non-GMO soy lecithin. And as long as that’s there, I’m okay with it.
Evan Brand: And it’s gonna be a tiny amount. When you look at the formula we’re talking and the other ingredients, it’s not an active ingredient. So could be 1% of the formula.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And less, you know, single digits fraction of percents for sure.
Evan Brand: Yup. Good. What else we’ve got here? If you feel like hitting this and we can, we can save it for another day—symptoms of chronic intestinal infections. I think we hit on that already with the hair, the skin, the nails, the acne, depression, anxiety, fatigue.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. All your— all your common symptoms, right? Your uhm— your intestinal symptoms: bloating, gas, diarrhea, constipation, bloating, acid reflux. And then your extra intestinal which are all the mood-based and energy-based: fatigue, mood, joint pain, depression, anxiety. Those kind of things, sleep,—
Evan Brand: Autoimmunity—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hormone stuff, autoimmunity. And we got a whole podcast on that. So just google digestion or parasites or leaky gut and you’ll get a whole bunch of podcast and videos on that topic.
Evan Brand: Cool. Robert said he loved our podcast on histamine and it hit home prior to having infections no foods were problem, uh—post infection, fermented foods read havoc on him. So thanks for the podcast. Thanks for the feedback Robert. We love to hear that the histamine podcast was a killer one.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I’m looking forward to chatting with you soon, Robert. I know uhm—you’ve been doing good work on your— on yourself there with uh— some of those good informational put in the podcast. But if you need more support, let us know. I’d get retested. Make sure we get to the root cause coz if those issues are still there with the post histamine stuff, there may be some additional critters hanging around.
Evan Brand: Yep. I agree. Another question about chronic dry eyes. “How often have you seen this with your patients? I’m working on healing the gut do you think there could be other root causes to dry eyes?” Justin, what’s your take?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Chronically low cortisol. You’ll see load—you’ll see dry eyes. Typically, get your diet stable. Once your diet’s stable, you can add a lower carbohydrate kinda diet. If those dry eyes are still there, gently taper out that carbohydrate every couple of days. You know, 10- 15 g of carbs primarily at nights. Do the safe starchy versions: squash, sweet potatoes, plantains, those kind of things. And you may see those dry eyes start to go away. You can even try a tablespoon of coconut oil and a teaspoon of honey, right, before bed as well that may help.
Evan Brand: Cool. So what else we’ve got? “Can I re-infect myself with H. pylori with makeup like lipsticks that I’ve used when I had H. pylori? I’ve no idea what the lifespan of that is on the product.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It is possible. I mean I would just look at uhm—the lipstick stuff. Maybe just get a razor blade and cut that end off there. I think you’d probably be okay with that. Uhm— typically, you know, as you knock out the infection, you know, you’d still be using it. So eventually, you’d wear off that but I think if you wanna be on the safe side, I think that’s a good thing to keep in mind. Even more important uhm—things that you can quite excise as easy like partners, right? Spouses. Ideally getting them at least treated semi- “semi” meaning maybe we only use one supplement just coz the compliance is so important. I would really be more—more imperative on the spouses and the partners.
Evan Brand: I agree. Partners are probably much bigger issue, much bigger carrier and reinfection source than your makeup and lipstick. I don’t know of any high-quality lipstick. Maybe they’re out there, but I would just throw that stuff away and maybe does discontinue using lipstick, too. I doubt you’re missing out on much in you know it’s— there’s parabens and all sorts of other stuff.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And they have some really good things on the market now that do a lot like food-based ones where they are like extracting cherries and all these different food-based ones that kinda produces the fruit-based stain and kinda gives you a similar look but it’s using nutrition and foods versus, you know, some of the synthetic things.
Evan Brand: Uhh..okay, okay. So maybe you— maybe you stick with the lipstick then. Alright. James said he had a over sympathetic—let’s see having over sympathetic with sexual activity does blood pressure med Norvasc affect ED issues? That’s kinda like—I don’t even fully understand what you’re saying coz it’s kinda like a piece together thing. Are you understanding what he’s asking?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I think what he’s saying is those medications have a potential side effect of erectile dysfunction? I would just go to RXlist.com and put that medication in there and look at that long list of side effects. I can—I can do it from right here while we continue with the conversation. What was the medication called again?
Evan Brand: It’s N-O-R-V-A-S-C. Norvasc.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, cool. I’ll pull it up here in a second. N-O-R-V-A-S-C?
Evan Brand: N-O-R-V-A-S-C. as in Charlie.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Norvasc. Got it. Okay, cool.
Evan Brand: Then he’s saying, even with Viagra, it doesn’t correct lack of sensitivity. So, yeah, I mean here’s my easy quick answer. If you didn’t have those symptoms before and now you’re on this drug and those symptoms are happening, how could that not be a factor?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. This is a an—an—Am—Amlodipine, which is a basically a calcium channel blocker, okay? Which is a calcium channel blocker, which again, magnesium kind of does the same thing, FYI. And if we look at the side effects, uh—feelings like you may pass out, swelling in your hands feet and ankles, pounding heart beat or fluttering on your chest, chest pain, heavy pain spreading arms and shoulders, nausea, general ill and there’s more uhm— side effects as well. So—
Evan Brand: It’s like a commercial all of a sudden.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I know, right? Let me see here: dizziness, drowsiness, tired, stomach pain—
Evan Brand: What is this—what is that? That’s for blood pressure? Is that right?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. This is for blood pressure medication, but I think what you said is the best advice if that wasn’t there before and then you started taking the medication and it started happening, as long as your blood pressure is not too bad and you could taper down or you could come off with your doctor’s approval, uhm— I would have no problem doing that and seeing if those symptoms improve, then you know. Coz in the end, if it’s not a side effect on RX list.com but you take the meds out and it gets better, does it really matter that they say it is? We know clinically, right?
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely.
Evan Brand: There’s so many ways. Didn’t we do a whole podcast—
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Don’t—don’t come off. If your blood pressure is 160-170 and you’re on blood pressure medications, coz it will go that high afterwards, don’t come off it. You really want to make sure that if you’re on a medication and you wanted to try and see if there’s an issue, one, fix the root causes; but two, talk to the medical doctor that prescribed it and make sure they’re in concurrence—you know, in agreement with you on the taper that you’re going to do. Make sure they are on the same page.
Evan Brand: Yes. Some people they go to the other end of the spectrum where there are so anti-pharmaceutical that “I’m getting off of this.” That’s bad. You— that’s like stroke territory. So don’t do that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You just gotta be careful. Some people if you’re like 130 or 140 over like 80 or 90, not too bad. You could probably come off as long as you’re fixing other root issues, but just have a blood pressure cuff by your bed, test it in the morning, see where you’re at. Just you— you want to do it responsibly. If you do it and you want to get to the prescribing doctor on the same page as you. You don’t want to go rogue.
Evan Brand: Yup. Well said.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent. Any other questions you wanna hit up?
Evan Brand: Uh let’s see. What else we’ve got.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I have one here. We got one on Facebook here from Michelle or from
Mitchell. “Can L- tyrosine for dopamine support be too stimulating? How much should be taken to minimize side effects?” Yeah. It can be for some people. Uhm— tyrosine can kinda provide precursor supports to dopamine which then above that can go to adrenaline, so it can be. I think starting at 500 mg and working up to maybe, potentially 3 to even 6 g a day is okay. But start low and slow and if you know that it is stimulating, use it more in that first half of the day not the last half of the day.
Evan Brand: Yup. That’s a simple fix. Good answer. Uh—Nora had a follow-up here. “Thanks for answering the question. So can I successfully eradicate H. pylori and other pathogens as if I live with people who have it. Do they have to do treatment in parallel with me?” Well, if you’re sexually active with people, you’re kissing or simple enough, even just sharing straws, sharing cups, drinking after each other, that’s enough to infect them. So even if it’s not a partner, but it’s someone, “Oh, hey, let me have a drink of that.” That’s enough to still pass H. pylori. Justin and I have seen it hundreds of times.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. The stronger your immune system is, it becomes less of an issue so like with Evan and myself, we have stronger immune systems coz we work on that. We maybe less prone because our IgA levels are up high enough where the tiny bit of that in your system, our IgA would squash it. But if your IgA is lower and you got more the stress going on and you have poor hydrochloric acid levels, then for sure. That could happen.
Evan Brand: Yeah. And I had low IgA, too. So that’s something that you’d want it measured Nora and check with the stool testing and look for your IGA figure out which your first line of defense is looking like. If it’s low and weak, you’ve just got a lot of chronic stress, then, yeah, you’re gonna be more susceptible to—to pick it up. But to answer the question, “Could you eradicate it?” If you live with other people, yeah, you could but there’s gotta be a lot of things in your favor and you’re not sharing or sharing cups or drinking for most people or kissing them etc. Uhm— Anthony—well there’s one question about—from Anthony. He said, “It’s been over five years with gut issues, irregular stools, many doctor visits.” He found out that he had a whey and casein allergy. “Where should you start to get help?” Oh, wow! That’s a hard one to answer. Uh—right here. Justin and myself. justinhealth.com evanbrand.com I mean we’ve dealt with people who’ve already been to many doctors. I mean it’s such a common story. We always asked the question, “Hey, kinda give us your history. What—what’s been your experience with other practitioners? What have you tried to help? What have you tried that hasn’t helped?” I’d say 90% of people we talked with they’ve already been to a either a Gastro doctor or some other type of doc for their gut issues and they’ve had no success and only prescription drugs like I got recommended to myself anti-spasmodic, anti-acid drugs. If you’ve got a regular Bell’s, man, you’ve got infections. I can put money on it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And I’m a huge believer— I want every patient to at least go in the conventional medical workup before they come see functional docs or functional practitioners like ourselves just to rule out big picture pathology stuff. You know, it just makes it so we at least know that the big glaring stuff is at least been looked at and addressed and assessed. And now we’re looking more functional imbalances which is really what functional medicine is treating. It’s not medicine from a conventional disease based medicine; it’s medicine from a uh— nutritional kind of support perspective working on supporting systems, not treating symptoms and disease.
Evan Brand: Yup. We’ll take one more question here. Uh from Charlotte O: “How do you feel about NOW foods brand supplements my health coach is using them on me. I think NOW foods is okay it’s once again, a consumer grade product, so it is going to be likely less high-quality. I have seen some fillers and some of their products. I have seen them do some inferior forms of certain nutrients; however, they’ve also got a lot of really good products, too, where they’re stepping up their game in they’re using the methylated bees and the higher qualities with the Omega’s, so.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And plus, people doesn’t know. NOW has another line. It’s a higher up line. It’s called “Protocols For Life” That’s their higher-grade line. So if you like NOW, look at Protocols For Life.
Evan Brand: Is protocol uh—will that have to be through practitioner or is that?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Couldn’t say it’s a practitioner one but it’s a little bit higher grade but it’s—it’s made by the same company. It’s their one step up.
Evan Brand: But overall what’s your take on NOW?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I mean I think they’re okay for certain things. You know, uhm— so as a kind of initial kinda get in your foot in the door kinda thing, I think it’s okay. But of course, you know, we—we have are our bias because were trying to get the highest quality in everything. And part of that is because we actually work with patients face to face. It’s not like they go online and buy something, we never see them again. We’re working with them face-to-face so we have to know that what we’re recommending is the best because we need to seek clinical outcome. So we have to know that. So it’s a little bit different for us because we gotta go all out and make sure that nothing is held back.
Evan Brand: Right. So when you’ve got these other companies and people out there promoting stuff, they’re not working with people one-on-one. So it comes directly back on Justin or directly back on me if we give him our product and it doesn’t work. That’s not very sustainable for us. So that’s why it’s much, much better enough for us. That’s why we have access for people that don’t work with us. We allow other people outside to access our uh—products because they’ve been tried and true and tested. And if they didn’t work with people, we wouldn’t carry them.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And if it doesn’t work, too, then it allows us to say, “Okay, there’s not some crappy filler or there’s some sub—sub nutrient in there. Let’s look a little bit deeper.” So it gives us the confidence that we just need to look deeper now. So it’s gonna be on both sides.
Evan Brand: Yeah. And just a firsthand experience with NOW foods and the secondhand, I guess, through clients. I’ve had people taking like their super enzymes, for example, and I get their digestive health markers investigated on the urine and stool test, and it looks terrible. Their digestion is not working at all even with the high dose of their enzymes. So does that mean the quality is bad? Does that mean they’re not dosing it properly? Maybe they’re not consistent as much. I don’t know. Probably a combination of factors, but I always switch over people over to my professional enzymes and then I retest and then all of a sudden, it’s fixed. Is it compliance? Is it quality? Probably both.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And you know everyone has got their bias and we kinda state our bias there. You know, we’re trying to be uhm— super transparent. Uhm—but yeah, I think there 95% of companies that are out there are bad. But I think that would be in that—I would say they’re in that 5% at least are better, for sure.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Yeah. Well, that’s it for questions. Anything else you want to hit before we wrap it up. I think we did pretty good today.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I think James uh—who is it—someone came out there—was it James—Yeah. James asked about Tom Brady. Again, love Tom Brady. Huge Patriots fan. Again Tom Brady does lots of things I would say go back and check out the podcast I did on him a year and a half ago for more specifics but he does use the green stuff. He does kinda promote like a Paleo-Alkaline diet. A lot of people have really uh—let’s just say Tom Brady like have a vegan cook. So because he had a vegan cook, Tom Brady was now on a vegan diet. No. He eats 20% meat. That’s far from vegan, okay? So just kinda keep that in the back of your mind. A lot of misnomers about Tom and he has a lot of a different training uh—modalities, too, that I’m hoping— I would love to get Tom Brady’s coach or strength coach on there.
Evan Brand: Or just get Tom Brady and the coach in a three-way podcast.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I would love that, man. I would love to hang out with Tom and get some secrets down. That’d be awesome. I think he may need to wait til he retires to truly unveil some of the stuff. But we’ll see.
Evan Brand: That’s true. That’s true. Well, reach out. I’m sure there’s a media/press person and tell him, “Look, we’ve got insanely popular health podcast. Uh— we’d like to interview Tom and his coach.” But yeah, they’d probably be like, “No way, dude. We’re not giving you the secret sauce, hold on.”
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I know. I know. Exactly, so— I know Alex Guerrero is— is his—uh coach that does a lot of the stuff. So I mean— really, really interested to get Alex on a uh— podcast. That’d be freaking awesome.
Evan Brand: Never hurts to ask.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: No, absolutely, man.
Evan Brand: Well, let’s wrap this thing up.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. We had a great call today. I’m late for my next patient here, but uhm—keep dropping knowledge bombs all day, man. Really enjoyed this call with you. Anything else you want to add or say?
Evan Brand: Well I think we mentioned it all. If people wanna work with us, we work with people around the world. So Skype and phone consultations is what we do and all the lab testing except for blood you do at your house. So if you want to get help, get to the root cause, reach out justinhealth.com or Google Dr. Justin Marchegiani or myself evanbrand.com or type in Evan Brand. Find us. Subscribe. And if you have more questions, concerns, get a hold of us. That’s what we’re here for. We love helping people. That’s what makes us thrive so we won’t help you thrive, too. So, have a great day.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And leave some comments below. If you like this podcast, tell us. Tell us what you like. If you don’t like stuff, tell us what you don’t like. And tell us what you want us to talk about next time and give us a thumbs up. Give us a share. We really appreciate it, guys. And you all have an awesome day, Take care you all.
Evan Brand: Take care.
Amino Acids for Anxiety and Sleep – Podcast #146
Dr. Justin Marchegiani and Evan Brand talk about some of the effects of amino acids, specifically how these organic compounds can help improve sleep and anxiety. Also, learn about the different ways on how to overcome issues related to sleep and anxiety.
Majority of adults whose sleep are affected by stress and anxiety are more likely to resort to violence and rage. Fortunately, such circumstances can be avoided by incorporating several healthy changes in one’s lifestyle. Listen to this podcast and learn more about this.
In this episode, we will cover:
02:50 Myofascial Release and Active Release Techniques
06:35 Causes of Anxiety
10:39 Macronutrient Gnostic
13:04 Sleep is a Priority
20:36 Different Ways to Distress
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there. It’s Dr. J. It’s wonderful Monday. Evan, how are we doing today, brother?
Evan Brand: Doing great, man. Summer’s here, and I’m hoping it doesn’t fly by. How are you doing?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Excellent, man. I got a new set of water-skis, and I was out in Lake Austin ripping it up. I had one run. Anyone who does water-skiing knows this. I had one run that probably lasted over ten minutes, and my legs are feeling like literally just jello right now. And I’m like, you know, I’m not just standing, I’m like making slalom terms, like you know, giant slalom turns. Like doing over the wake and doing jumps doing some tricks. So, I posted some of that. I got them in my iPhone right now. I’m recording on Facebook here on the other phone. So, I’ll post that up to my Facebook page and Instagram later on today so people can see me ripping it up and…
Evan Brand: Yeah. People want to see the behind the scenes. They want to see when you’re having the Polo shirt on. What are you up to?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Evan Brand: They want to stalk you.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think that’s a good idea so I’m gonna post that up there. And also, it’s great neurological exercise, right. When you’re doing things, when you got a stabilized in a– in a three-dimensional setting, right. You got to wear a bag on forwards-backwards, left-right. So, you got to really activate all of those proprioceptors and mechanoreceptors, and all of those stabilizing muscles that, typically, don’t get used if you’re doing, you know, just conventional lifting, especially machine-based lifting, right?
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: Now we’re [inaudible] …
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Look at you. [inaudible]
Evan Brand: …your abs or just your– your legs.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I mean, you know, when you first start, like your abs will be sore ‘cause you got to stabilize, right. “cause you got things rope right here. Yeah. This rope’s pulling you, the boat’s pulling the rope, right. So, if not, you’re bending over, right, ‘cause the rope’s pulling you. So, you got to keep this whole entire posture chain stabilized.
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And then you need your core in tight ‘cause you got to keep everything upright. Right? “cause sometimes if you hit a bump, you may want to fall backwards. So, you got to keep that core rock solid ‘cause you can go backwards or forwards, right?
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You got to keep that whole entire thoracolumbar chain activated. So it’s pretty cool.
Evan Brand: Sweet. Well, good job. Glad you didn’t hurt yourself. Let’s get into this podcast. We did a– last podcast on amino acids. We talked about energy and we talked about mood.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh. It’s a– by the way, I wanted to ask you. Are you okay?
Evan Brand: Am I good?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Are you okay?
Evan Brand: Is this like a trick question? What do you mean?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, I’ve seen you got attacked by the sleeve monster, so I just – I wanted to know. It seemed like you survived the attack, but you know, the sleeve monster made a way with two of your sleeves. So, I just wanted to question you about that. How are you doing?
Evan Brand: I had to rock the tank top today, man.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You’re rocking the tank top, man.
Evan Brand: I’m feeling good. Well, so, just for listeners, I won’t– I’ll make this quick. But, I had an abdominal wall injury about two years ago. I tore my abdominal wall. I thought it was a Hernia, and got the ultrasound. They said, “It’s not a Hernia but a tore abdominal wall. Be very careful ‘cause if yyou continue to lift heavy weights, you’re gonna get a Hernia.”
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: And, I tried it with you and I was like, “Dude, this scar tissue is not healing.” And you said, “Well go get a Myofascial Release therapist.” And that’s what I did. And now, for the first time, I was – In a couple of years, I was able to lift without pain. So, thank the Lord and thanks so much for the recommendation. Anybody listening, if you’ve got issues with not being able to lift, or you’re having pain in weird areas, Myofascial release is magic.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Yeah, and even better than Myofascial release is Active Release Technique. Active Release takes one step further. Active Release involves Myofascial Release but then it adds in the active range of motion by the patients. So, Myofascial Release is like – they’re kind of moving you in the direction, so they’re finding that adhesion and they’re like, let’s say it’s my bicep, right. So, this is like– so, eccentric contraction means like elongating, concentric means shortening, right? So, this is the conce– say I’d had adhesion right here in my bicep, right? I find the adhesion. I shortened the muscle, right? It’s concentric. And now, I’m lengthening it as I extend out, right? So, Myofascial is like the person is doing it for you. That’s step four, and then step five is then like, you’re actually doing it for you at the end. So, kind of gives you an idea: one’s passive, one’s active. And it’s always good to go from passive into active, because obviously, if you’re in pain, it may be harder for you to do that yourself.
Evan Brand: Makes sense. And also, my low right back, I had issues there where I hurt my back working at UPS in College, and the therapist, she goes, “Your issues not on the right side. Although the pain’s manifesting on the right side.” The issue is on the low left side of my back that was tightening the right side, so, she fixed that area too. So, I’m a huge proponent.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, when I would do like a lot Applied Kinesiology Chiropractic work, we’d like, you know, put people like at a 45-degree angle, like kind of like crawled up like to do in a sit-up, and then we’d hold them like this. We’d apply pressure. Hold them like this. Apply pressure. We can find out like was it an internal oblique, external oblique, just rectus abdominis-like weakness. And then from there, like, a lot of times, I was using the ARP Wave. So, I would use like electricity to go through there. But then, you can also take one of those stones. This gausious stone, I think they’re called. Let me put it out.
Evan Brand: Is it pretty cool?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. these little stones are called gausious stones. And then you can take it. then you can like– let’s say I had adhesion on my bicep, I could like take a little bit like coconut oil. Then I could just work out the adhesion like this, almost kind of like a– like a Graston technique.
Evan Brand: Yep, good work on it like that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But it’s not gonna be as functional as like the Myofascial because the Myofascial takes it and really works it within the contractile plains of the muscle tissue and the muscle fibers. That’s the big difference.
Evan Brand: Cool. Cool. Yeah, I mean, you need to test them. Need to do some more hands-on videos. I think people would really appreciate that.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I mean, I used to do a lot more of that earlier in my career, and then I’m just booked out three months of functional medicine.
Evan Brand: Right.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You know I just enjoy that– just more because I have so many different issues I can address.
Evan Brand: Agreed.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Functional medicine. And I see so many pain issues that normally would be a Chiropractic kind of issue but we fixed with diet and lifestyle alone. But I’d always suggest getting a holistic Chiropractor on board to work on this thing [crosstalk]… just yield so much better and the nervous system functions a lot better. And yeah, Graston’s similar to what I’m saying. Graston’s great. Again, I like uhm– techniques that also involve the range of motion too.
Evan Brand: Cool. You want to chat about amino acids.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I got a patient here coming up soon so we’ll keep this podcast a little bit shorter. So, we talked about amino acids last week. And we talked about them in regards to mood and energy. Today, we’re gonna focus on anxiety and sleep. And again, we’ve done podcasts on this topic before but, you know, it’s a new day. It’s 2017 here in July. You know, new things come our way. New clinical experience gets plugged into that open loop that we have of new information coming in so it’s always good hitting new things. So, off the bat, anxiety can be caused by a couple things, alright. Anxiety, obviously, people know anxiety a pretty self-explanatory. That uneasiness, those feelings that come in, the butterfly little tingly spider sensations to come in, and it can be subtle, right? Or it can be really extreme where it gets to a panic attack level. And a lot of times, things that can drive back can be over-adrenaline or increased adrenaline. It can be caused by increasing Cortisol. And then things that can create increase in adrenaline and increase in Cortisol are gonna be things that stimulate the sympathetic fight-or-flight nervous system so, any stressor that could have an effect on that, we really want to look at addressing. So, blood sugar’s a big thing. People skipping meals tends to drive a lot of anxiety issues. People not eating a balanced meal, within a fat and protein, can create issues because you have lack of blood sugar stability. When blood sugar goes up and down, you get surges of Insulin and you get surges of adrenaline and Cortisol on the dropping end. And all that can create mood issues and adrenaline issues. And then also just looking at the Cortisol rhythm, a lot of people, they make really drop out in the latter half of the day with their Cortisol, which may create more stress on the body to generate– to get the blood sugar up in which can create issues there too. So, that’s just kind of my little opening there.
Evan Brand: Yeah. I had a client a few weeks ago. He’s relatively new so he’s not a super large amount fat eater yet. He’s still kind of stuck on carbohydrates, and he was having panic attacks. I said, “What do you eat for breakfast?” He said, “Oh. It’s a pretty good breakfast.” “What does that mean?” “It was a banana and gluten-free cereal.” And I’m like, “Good Lord. That’s sugar and carbohydrate.” And so, for us, you know, we really want people – if you’re doing like an Intermittent Fasting protocol and you’re pushing your breakfast back, you know. Fine, if you can handle it, but if you’ve got adrenal stress, you’ve got anxiety problems, you know, Intermittent Fasting might not be a good fit for you. You may need to make your breakfast a bit sooner. You may need to do uh– within 30 minutes of waking up, you may need to eat something because if you ate dinner last night at 6 PM, and it’s now 6:00 or 7AM, and it’s 12 hours since you’ve eaten, and you’ve got anxiety, that blood sugar could be crashing and you’ve got to eat. So, whether it’s a coconut, you know, just coconut meat and might not have to be coconut oil. I’ve made some coconut chips, which are pretty cool. Just get some shredded coconut flakes and you can toast them a little bit if you want. Those are great. If you want to do a smoothie. I like smoothies over juices. Juices, typically, they’re gonna have too much sugar if it’s a store-bought juice, so smoothies, you’re gonna have the whole fruit in there. And you can add the coconut flakes or your half avocado, or some other type of fat source. If you just don’t like the coke in the morning or you just don’t have enough of an appetite. I would push someone into eating a smoothie over skipping a meal completely. And then GABA, too, is another thing that people forget about. I call it kind of the Forgotten Neurotransmitter. When you’re stressed, like Justin has talked about with Cortisol issues, you’re gonna deplete GABA, which is kind of the brakes of the brain. And so, your conventional doctors are gonna prescribe Lorazepam or Xanax, or some other sort of benzodiazephine.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: [inaudible] exactly. Some kind of benzo to help with that, for sure.
Evan Brand: Yeah, and it’s crap. And it’s not addressing the root cause and the issue with pharmaceuticals is it downregulate your own production. Just like Melatonin. Supplemental Melatonin could be helpful but you do turn down your brains productions. So, if you’re taking GABA-ergic drugs, you’re turning down GABA and that’s why people have worse anxiety and panic attacks trying to come off of Xanax and other benzos. And so, for us, we may push somebody towards like a L-Theanine…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: …or you’ve got Lemon balm, or you’ve got Chamomile extract. You’ve got Valerian, you’ve got Passionflower. There’s a lot of other cool things you can use to support anxiety without damaging yourself.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: One hundred percent. Now, low-hanging fruit, of course diet, making sure the diet’s dialed-in. Reducing inflammation’s gonna be huge, right? Anti-inflammatory, nutrient-dense, low toxin diet. And we like talking about things regarding food in a template fashion because template allows us to be macronutrient gnostic, meaning, we’re not buying store for that. If someone’s having more Insulin resistance and does better kind of Intermittent Fasting, Cyclical Ketogenic, then we go lower. People are more active, then you need a little more carbs. You make it a little bit higher. So, we’re kind of gnostic when it comes to macronutrients. Macros are protein, fat and carbohydrates. But of course, everything that we want is gonna– you know, needs to be nutrient-dense. So, in the micronutrients side, we can still have very nutrient-dense foods on the micronutrient side, but still be macronutrient gnostic, because all the foods on our palate, if you will. Like for an artist painting something, and we have all these colors to paint from, choose from. Same thing with the diet, we have all kinds of foods on our palate that may be higher carb, lower carb, higher fat, lower fat, but the one common thread– the three common threads, I should say, is nutrient-dense, high amounts of nutrition per ounce of food, anti-inflammatory, coming down inflammation, and also gonna be low in toxins: round-up, pesticides, chemicals, and even things like Lectins and phytates and oxalates and more irritating compounds in the gut too.
Evan Brand: Perfect. One other amino acid we could mention would be L-Glutamine. Even though it’s not necessarily an anti-anxiety amino acid, Glutamine can be great for stabilizing blood sugar. So, I tell women that, you know, especially women because they’re a little bit more susceptible. Keep the Glutamine in your purse. If you’ve got a sugar-craving, that blood sugar’s crashing, you pop open the Glutamine and pour it in your tongue, and within five minutes you can feel a bit better. If you’re having like a blood sugar crisis and you don’t have anything good, or you just don’t want to eat something garbage, L-Glutamine could be another good one. So, Glutamine, Theanine, we talked about Lemon balm, which isn’t an amino acid, but is a [inaudible]
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: [inaudible] same thing. Yep, Lemon balm. Absolutely. I got my Liposomal GABA here as well. Huge fan of GABA. Some people say that the molecule’s a little bit too big to cross the blood-brain barrier, that’s why I use the Liposomal form. I take a couple hits here, right now on the show.
Evan Brand: Nice. How quick does that hit you?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Ughh! I mean, it depends because I’m not really an anxious person anyways so for me, I don’t notice a huge hit but I’m feeling like a little bit more stressed. I do feel like it’s kind of helpful and soothing. So, GABA’s great with that. Also, just really simple, and some of these things, we got to have our hierarchy of treatment in line, right? If you’re doing these things but your diet sucks, your blood sugar’s everywhere, your sleep stinks uhm– and again, it’s kind of contradictory but, sleep will help anxiety the next day, right? Because you’re gonna recharge and recycle a lot of your neurotransmitters when you sleep. So, having good sleep’s definitely top priority. Now, part of your issue is you’re not getting good sleep, then we can talk about that later on the show, but GABA’s great. Also, a little bit of lavender, essential oil’s phenomenal. Do it on your wrists. You can do it right on like kind of a lymph nodes here in the jaw or back at the neck here. May have sip on the lymph nodes, that’s great. Or just even go like this on your hands and then just [does palm inhalation], then you get right into the respiratory system and it starts activating right away. So, a little bit of lavender can be very, very helpful. Then of course, Magnesium as well. These are kind of like low-hanging fruits, right? Magnesium, lavender, Lemon balm, right, or GABA, especially Liposomal GABA, right? You mentioned Melissa, you mentioned Vicky, you mentioned Valerian root. I know you mentioned L-Theanine. They’re all awesome. We may even stacked on there, some Ashwagandha.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I used my Adrenal Revive. It’s got a combo of them in there. But I also have a support that’s called Ashwagandha Supreme that has just Ashwaghanda. So, I used that a lot too. Ashwagandha’s pretty cool. It means Sanskrit. It’s a “to impart the strength of a horse.” So, a pretty cool little translation there.
Evan Brand: You want to know something else cool about Ashwagandha.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What?
Evan Brand: So, the Withania somnifera, the Latin…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep.
Evan Brand: …I was looking at the translation. It means ”to induce sleep.”
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: To induce sleep huh?
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, Withania and then yeah– Withania somnifera’s the active name. Yeah.
Evan Brand: Cool.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Also known as Indian Ginseng as well.
Evan Brand: I love it. I think that’s a great recommendation, and then, Reishi mushroom too. That’s a cool Immune Stress Support that you can take and you can stack on the Ashwagandha too. And then Motherwort, I really like Motherwort. I’ve mainly tried it in tincture. I’ve not tried it in herbal, like a capsule, but I’m sure Motherwort capsules do exist.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Absolutely. And also, just simple thing we talked about the last time, like B Vitamins, like making sure B12 and B6 are gonna be present. That’s gonna be really important. B6 is really important with neurotransmitter synthesis and communications. We don’t have enough B6 or P5P, Pyridoxal-5-Phosphate. There’s Pyridoxal hydrochloride, but Pyridoxal-5-Phosphate’s gonna be an activated B6, Vitamin B12’s gonna be really important. Especially Vegan vegetarians, there may be some nutrient density issues with some of these things. Can people don’t understand that just look at liver compared to Kale for instance. People think Kale’s a superfood in the veggie community, which I love it. I think it’s great, and it should be a part of everyone’s diet, but it doesn’t hold a candle to liver. So again, some of these animal products are incredibly bioavailable and nutrient-dense, and I like that a lot. We talked about Magnesium, that’s phenomenal. Amino acids, we talked about it last week. We talked about it– 5-HTP…
Evan Brand: Yup.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: …right? Is great for Serotonin. Serotonin can be very, very common. So, man, I take Brain Replete, which got a little 5-HTP in it as well. Sometimes, we’ll take the 5-HTP by themselves though because– just because we get a little bit of individual dose in that way, and it’s got some B6 in it. So, I like that because of the extra Serotonin. Serotonin can be calming and relaxing. A lot of doctors think you don’t need to do GABA if you have the Serotonin and Dopamine kind of dialed-in. GABA’s kind of a subsidiary of that. So, we take care of, you know, the upstream neurotransmitters. The downstream neurotransmitters kind of take care of themselves.
Evan Brand: Uh. Interesting thought. I still think the GABA’s worth having on-board. I know the significant difference. I might need it.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I think it’s helpful. I mean people that have, you know, panic attack issues or anxiety issues, you know, I give them a bottle like this and they’re doing two/three drops every couple of hours all day long. And, you know, we’re getting to the root cause, right. We’re getting the blood sugar under control. We’re also supporting the adrenal glands because the adrenal glands help that blood sugar stay unstable. So, if you’re that person and if you skipped a meal, you get anxious and you get really irritable. You got a blood sugar issue there and your adrenals probably need more help and more support to get that back on track.
Evan Brand: Yeah, so let me just say in another way. If you’re getting hangry or you’re freaking out because I’m gonna kill somebody if don’t eat, that’s the sign your blood sugar’s off. Those people could have blood sugar issues, along with anxiety issues.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And even people that do it right. Like, if you do it right, it’s better, because of course if you do more refined sugar, and not enough of those good macros like the fats and proteins, your blood sugar’s gonna drop really fast because– Well, just go camping, right? Go start a fire. Try starting a fire with twigs and paper. The fire’s gonna be up and out, up and out, up and out. That’s your blood sugar, right? Twigs and paper equal refined sugar, excess carbohydrate. Logs and the fire, logs and kindling that equal protein and fat. So, kind of keep that analogy because every time you eat you’re really trying to stog that metabolic fire. And again, of course, you know, we know maybe some gasoline, maybe a little paper may help that fire catch faster. That’s kind of where the macros kind of, you know, the constant decisions involved. So, you got to figure out what works best for you, but for default, right? You want a long-lasting fire, you actually have to show up with some wood, right?
Evan Brand: Agreed. [crosstalk] johnny said that…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: …[inaudible] you need some wood to start a fire, right?
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Makes sense? Protein, fat.
Evan Brand: Sorry to interrupt you. Johnny here left comment for– He said he tried float tanks last week, five days in a row and it was amazing for mood and stress. Yeah, I mean the lifestyle stuff’s great too. We always implement that amino acids on top of float tanks. That’s awesome too. James, he had a question, “Any amino acid for instant relief of SIBO and digestive issues, mostly bloating and gas?” What’s your take Justin about aminos and digestion?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, B6 and 5-HTP is very helpful for that migrating motor complex communication. Also, some ginger can be very helpful. But again, let’s face it. You actually have to knock out some of that bacteria, right? If SIBO’s what’s driving that issue, maybe it’s a Citrobacter or Proteus overgrowth, or maybe it’s Klebsiella, right? My old joke in Microbiology class, right, when we’d nerd out, you know. If you’re a bacteria, where is the place to party, right? You go to Klebsiella.
Evan Brand: [laughs]
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I know. It’s bad. It’s really bad, but that’s the joke. So, anyway, Klebsiella, any of those critters could be at bay there. So, you got to knock out the critters, and you may even want to starve them out on the flip side with low fat map kind of Paleo template to start. That can be a good template. You starve them on one side, right? You support the migrating motor complex here. Maybe add in some Hydrochloric acid and enzymes to work on that, and then you kill them over here. And then a slide to the left, and then you add maybe some more probiotics in afterwards. That’s kind of like our sequence for dealing with that. But of course, supporting the adrenals in the process is helpful because if it’s inflammation in the gut, inflammation does what? It’s gonna get the sympathetic nervous system going. What does the sympathetic nervous system do to digestion? Decreases digestion and decreases motility. It decreases Hydrochloric acid and enzyme secretions too.
Evan Brand: Well said. Well said. So, James, get to the root. We like having a unnatural treasure chest of things you can use, instead of, say, Pepto-bismol. But you still got to work back towards that root cause, so fix those gut issues and you won’t need anything for temporary relief. You’ll just feel amazing permanently.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. And we talked about a lot of things that are great to use but it needs to all be in the context of – okay, but also get to the root cause.
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: But also do this too. Just so we’re clear.
Evan Brand: We’re cool. I think this was a pretty rapid-fire podcast. Anything else you wanted to mention on this topic?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Ashwagandha’s gonna be great. Of course, you know, if you’re more on the anxious side, be very careful with coffee. Be very careful of alcohol because that could obviously get more of the adrenaline and the catecholamines revved up, so that component’s really important. Also, meditation’s nice. I mean, I have my little Mwave BAP here. I may go do this here in-between patients.
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Plug this in to my iPhone. Plug it on my ear and I try to get into a state of coherence with the heart and brain or in this uhm– connective state. And you can see that based on heart rate variability. So, you can do that. That’s another excellent technique as well. Uhm – couple other herbs I think we didn’t quite mention, but Chamomile’s great. Valerian’s great. Tulsi, or I think it’s Octa Noctum. Tulsi’s great. Holy Basil’s – it’s the same thing, right? They’re all the same thing.
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Same name. Uhm– those are all phenomenal. I’m getting some exercise in. It’s huge to help [crosstalk] destress, to decrease anxiety. Uhm– you’ve talked about– I forget what the [stutter] the oriental name of it is, but it’s a– you go at the forest bathings. The Japanese were…
Evan Brand: Oh, yeah. Shinrin-yoku, yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: yeah, yeah. Shinrin-yoku. Wow. Man, I thought I have a tough with it with my last name being Marchegiani.
Evan Brand: I know.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Shinrin-yoku. Okay, cool. I like that. [inaudible]
Evan Brand: Samuel left us a comment.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: What’s that?
Evan Brand: Samuel left us a comment before we get off here. He said that he’s halfway through his H. pylori protocol and his anxiety has diminished tremendously. Really happy to hear that Samuel. We see that all the time with gut infections. For me, I had two parasites. I mean I were calling Justin up one night. I’m like, “Yow. I feel like my heart’s beating out of my chest, man, what do I do?” And I had those infections at that time, so like, you know, I had some supplements to help me. But my gut issues were definitely driving my anxiety. And I’m not an anxious person by nature so it was bizarre. But once, I’ve treated the infections, and I’m infection-free now. You know, I’m back to being pretty chilled out again. So yeah. That’s a true testament. What he’s talking about. Gut infections, definitely do drive anxiety. Your doctor’s not gonna figure that out, though. They’re just gonna give you anti-anxiety meds. They’re not gonna say, “Hey. You might have something going on in the gut.” They just got no clue.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent. Let’s talk about that mechanism, right, that Samuel brought up. So, that’s the mechanism is through Lipopolysaccharide reduction. Lipopolysaccharides, another antonym or synonym for endotoxin, right? Endotoxin’s the outer second layer of these gram-negative bacteria. And these endotoxin’s, one, that can drive leaky gut. Two, when they get into your bloodstream, they can make their way to the brain and create leaky brain. But when they get into the brain, they can create a lot of mood issues and anxiety issues. There’s some studies where they talk about– and they look at what are– you know, uhm– Lipopolysaccharide antibodies and they see people to have these antibodies have like more anxiety and mood issues. And then when they would reduce the bacteria load by knocking out the bacteria, Lipopolysaccharide levels will drop and also their anxiety and mood will improve too. So that’s pretty cool. That’s another excellent mechanism there. Through leaky gut, through the gut, through infections and how that can also drive mood issues. And that has to be looked at, right? You have to actually address the infection to get that and get relief in that area.
Evan Brand: Wow. If I ever became a psychiatrist, I mean, my first place to go would be the gut.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, absolutely. I mean, Julia Ross has talked about it many times. She’s a MFT so a Marriage and Family Therapist, and she’s talked multiple times, where she has– you know, she has clients and therapy. They were just talking about their issues and [pauses] for decades, right? Just talking about their issues, talking about their problems, start fixing their diet, fixing their neurotransmitters, and then they show up the next like week or next month, and then they’re just like, “Yep. That doesn’t really bother me anymore. It’s not really an issue.” Right? It’s just kind of like they can process their emotions much better. So, things come up, they can process it and move on.
Evan Brand: Yeah. That’s the thing I’ve noticed about adults. They act more like children when they’ve got blood sugar or amino acid issues. If you’re not eating protein, for example, you know, this isn’t to throw to much shade to vegetarian Vegans but you and I see them all the time. You know, they’ve had some temper issues. I’ve talked with some Vegans, they can fly off the handle. And they’ve just got no amino acids to help regulate their mood. So, the mechanism there, if you don’t have amino acids, the raw building blocks for your neurotransmitters. You don’t have GABA, you’ve got no Serotonin, so you have no emotional flexibility. You’ve got low Dopamine, so you’ve got a lack of focus, a lack of drive, concentration. You’re easily bored. You’ve got attention deficit. You know, all these neurotransmitter deficiencies caused from a lack of quality animal proteins in a diet. It can really, really add up.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Check this out. It’s a really cool study. I’ve seen this quite frequently. Where they’ve supplemented like fish oils and like fats in jails, you know, actual criminal environments, and they found out like violence in the prisons like significantly, significantly dropped. They’ve done study where they looked at violence, and a lot of violence tends to happen in low blood sugar environments. How about that?
Evan Brand: Cool.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I’ll read this one study here for you.
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: The– Let me show you this and get to the conclusion. See if I can summarize it pretty fast. It talked about aggression, and violence often start when self-control stops. Of course, right now, what’s self-control? Self-control’s gonna be caused by the neo frontal cortex. You have about 0.25 milliseconds to take an impulse that you initially– you know, you think of, “I want to punch the wall because I’m so mad,” but then frontal cortex, right? 25 milliseconds, you override it because you’re like, “Ooh!c Broken hand, not good, right? I got to type the next day. I got to do work with it. Not a smart idea. So, then you punched a pillow instead, or you just, you know, go for a run or something, right? So, you got this frontal brain that kind of overrides a lot of that thinking. The problem is – let me just kind of hit a little bit more. “For society to function peacefully, people must control their aggressive impulses. Self-control requires a lot of brain food in the form of glucose. Thus, people who have difficulty metabolizing glucose, breaking it down into a useful form and keeping it at constant levels– I’m gonna highlight that. Breaking it down in the useful forming, keeping it at constant levels are at a greater risk for aggressive and violent behavior. The inability to metabolize glucose is not only a risk factor for health problems and those afflicted with the disorder, but it’s also a risk factor for aggression and violence in all members of society. The healthy metabolism of glucose may contribute to a more peaceful society by providing individuals with a higher level of self-control energy.” This is profound. Now, I’m gonna go highlight a couple things here. A couple missed numbers. People are gonna think here. Well, that just means I have to eat sugar constantly throughout the whole day. You got to be careful, because by doing too much sugar, you can create Reactive Hypoglycemic spikes and drops. So, it’s about having the right amount of Carbohydrate, and not all Carbohydrate’s equal. So more non-starchy vegetable-based Carbohydrates with the right amount of low-glycemic fruit and/or starchy Carbs according to what your needs is, and then you can kind of dose in some of the higher glycemic fruit as well. But this is profound, because table blood sugar have as produce better activation of the neo cortex. And, when the blood sugar drops, guess what part of your brain you’re using.
Evan Brand: Yeah, the reptilian hindbrain.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Reptilian hindbrain. So, that’s fight-or-flight, right? And a lot of spousal issues happen. Yelling and fights and issues happen with friends and family, typically, in and around food and blood sugar being low. So, very important. Let’s say, one big tip is to have your dinner and then talk about issues of stress after the fact that your food in there get your digestion going and get your blood sugar stabilized. And then you can activate that neo frontal cortex so much better.
Evan Brand: Yep. Well said, man. And I’ve seen the same thing here in the west end of Louisville. Pretty, pretty low income, definitely ghetto part of the town. It’s a food desert. There’s articles written about it all the time in the local newspapers here. There’s no high-quality food available. It’s all fast food and junk food, therefore tons of blood sugar issues. There’s the most crime in the city. I mean I [crosstalk] probably have an overlapping layer of food quality and availability, and then crime. And, I guarantee where we see higher quality food, we’re gonna see less crime because people are eating and they’re not losing their mind.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. hundred percent, and you know, we subsidize junk food in our country so it’s two to 20 billion dollars a year. So…
Evan Brand: That’s ridiculous.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Soy and corn, all this crap. It’s artificially cheap. So you know, when you look at the dollar menu, right? The reason why it’s so cheap is because it’s subsidized a ton. Now, again, we just combat that. It’s really simple, right? I don’t look for the government to do anything for me. I just vote with my wallet, and I say, “Okay. Great. Let’s try to, you know, invest in foods that are gonna make us healthier.” Now again, as a doctoral student, I was literally living on nothing, financially. I think I had like– I had just enough to pay my housing, and then maybe, I think at the end of the month, I hahd like– This is like total, I think I had 500 dollars after I paid for my housing. So I’m in the bay area, right? So, that includes groceries, car expenses, everything at 500 dollars at the end of the month. Like, you know, for the whole entire month to spend on food, you know, car, everything. So, I have to be very judicious, and I budgeted everything out, and I would buy like a lot of my meat in bulk from whole foods. I would do a lot of family pack stuff. I would do like if I needed to save money, I would do like organic vegetables frozen. That would help a ton, and then just like lots of good fats, right? Lots of good coconut oils. I’d buy it in bulk, like a gallon. You know, a gallon top of it at time. Like lots of good grass-fed butter. There’s like, I would try to make every dollar I spent just to get the highest amount of nutrient density for me.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Avocados, you can get those for a buck on sale. Five big bag of avocados you can get– I think my wife today, I think she bought five avocados for four bucks or something like that. Or four [crosstalk] avocados for five bucks. So–
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly, and Costco’s got them pretty good too, and a lot of the food options. I mean, you can get like I think berries for like four bucks. It’s like insane, like you can’t even get a job fast enough. So, lots of good options for you. Again, I lived it when basically, you know– California, I would– you know, when you’re a doctoral student. I was at the poverty level, [laughs] right?
Evan Brand: Right.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You know, I was at the poverty level for where I lived, you know, the bay area in California, and I was able to do it. It was just a matter of priority. And just – I didn’t have a smartphone back then either. I said, “You know what, I rather just take that money and put it towards food.” And then I got one after I graduated, right? So…
Evan Brand: Yeah.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: It’s just about priorities and we’re just trying to put this information, this education out there. We prioritize your stuff. Get healthier. When you’re healthier you can do more at your job. You can be better and then you can climb up that economic ladder and continue to improve yourself.
Evan Brand: Yep. Well said. I know we got to wrap this up. We both got calls to get to. Let’s hit this quick, quick last comment here by Dennis. Any idea why Diphenylalanine did not work for me as Julia Ross reports from her patients. I’ll first hit on this. I would say because there’s an underlying issue that you’ve not addressed, Dennis. [crosstalk] Amino acids are not a replacement for getting to the root cause. Amino acids are great to get you from point A to point B, but you still got to dig deeper. So, there’s probably something going on. Whether it’s H. pylori, parasites, bacterial overgrowth, something in the gut that’s throwing off your brain chemistry that you just can’t throw a pill at.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely, and again, I’m thinking Diphenylalanine. I’m thinking there’s maybe a pain issue, right? Diphenylalanine helps improve beta-Endorphin. Beta-Endorphin takes 19 amino acids to make. Go back to the gut. But if it’s pain issues, you know, go see a really good functional Chiropractor that will look at things holistically. And then also, feels like structural disc issues or ligament issues, high-dose Collagen, get the gut working better, make sure there’s not protein in your diet. So, you have structure material to heal.
Evan Brand: Yep. Cool. I’m gonna write down our links, which I think YouTube doesn’t allow me. Nope. They don’t allow me put web addresses in the comment box, but if you want to reach out to Justin and schedule a consult, just go to justinhealth.com. If you want to check out my site, you can go to evanbrand.com. Look us up. We have over 200+ episodes of other topics like this. So if we didn’t answer your question today, I’m sure we’ve answered it somewhere someplace sometime. So, reach out. Happy to help you all.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I’ll put it in right now, and I’ll put the what the reference for today’s article in there too. [crosstalk] So, I’ll just put them there now. Awesome, man. I’m gonna jump on to a patient. I know you as well. You have an awesome day, brother.
Evan Brand: Good chat with you, man. See you.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Take care. Bye. Bye.
Amino Acids to Improve Your Health – Podcast #145
Dr. Justin Marchegiani and Evan Brand talk about the importance of amino acids in promoting optimal health. Listen to them as they discuss how these amino acids actually play an essential role in our body’s neurotransmitters and hormones which in turn, affects our mood and energy profoundly.
Learn about the various forms of amino acids, as well as their benefits to one’s health. Know about the different causes of amino acid deficiency and gain an understanding on different ways to prevent such deficiency.
In this episode, we will cover:
01:40 Stress and Amino Acids
04:22 Factors Affecting Kids and Their Drive and Attention
06:58 What Causes the Deficiency of Amino Acids
30:22 Ways to Prevent Polypharmacy Cycle
40:06 Pottenger Cat Example
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Evan, it’s Dr. J. How are we doing today, man?
Evan Brand: Happy Monday. I’m doing good.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Happy Monday. It’s a great day out here in Austin, Texas. Enjoying the wonderful weekend, ready to get back to work, and get back in the grind. How are you doing?
Evan Brand: Basically, if I’m off for too long, I start to feel like I’m losing my purpose. It’s like, man, I need to get back to the hustle here.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I know. I get another hour planned after this podcast, I’m gonna need crushing out some YouTube videos. So, really excited for that. As a couple we talked about last week that I didn’t get a chance to do. We’re gonna hit those up. And today’s gonna be a great little podcast on Amino acids, which is such a great topic. And, we’re gonna keep the podcast more focused on the mood and energy component of Amino acids today. So, really excited to hit that topic up.
Evan Brand: Yes. Amino acids have changed my life for the better, without a doubt for sure. I first came across Tritryptophan, was probably the first amino acid that– that I discovered and– and got into. You know, I was dealing with depression in College in Course Conventional Medicine or Conventional Psychiatry. They’re just gonna put people on anti-depressant drugs. We could look up some statistics if we wanted to, but I guarantee everyone listening uh– has a friend or relative that’s taking some type of medication, like a Prozac. And it could work and maybe it’s necessary in some cases, but as we always discuss, it’s not getting to the root cause. And so, this antidepressant, you know, it’s not benign, definitely.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: A hundred percent. A hundred percent. I’m actually gonna be taking some amino acids here, right now, as we– as we go. Huge fan of amino acids. The more stressed you are, the more you burn through your amino acids. Right? Very important. Now, we run a lot of organic acid testing in our practice. One of the things we look at is we look at the metabolites of neurotransmitters. We’ll look at things like 5-Hydroxyindoleacetate. That gives us a window into Serotonin. We’ll look at things like Homovanillate, [pauses] right. That gives us a window into Dopamine levels. Right? So, really, really important, important uh– compounds– uhm– they give us a window in how our body’s utilizing Dopamine, utilizing adrenaline. Vanilmandelates, another one that we look at for adrenaline. Right? So, these are really important. Adrenaline’s obviously energy in regulating our fight-or-flight response. Dopamine’s gonna be our– our “I love you” neurotransmitter. Also helps with focus and ADD. Serotonin’s gonna be really important. It’s gonna help with mood. It’s gonna also help us sleep ‘cause Serotonin’s an important precursor to Melatonin, which is a sleep hormone. So, these amino acids have profound effects on our mood, on our energy, on our focus. And a lot of people actually reached to a list of drugs: Cocaine, Meth, even Marijuana, things that aren’t as bad, to actually artificially boost some of these compounds. Even sugar. Sugar’s probably one of the worst known offenders, ‘cause sugar actually increases Dopamine.
Evan Brand: How about Caffeine?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Lots of studies on this, where people that, you know, go on these MRIs and such, and they look at what parts of the brain light up when these drugs are in the body. And, they find that– you now, sugar increases the same Dopamine receptors that uh– Heroin does. They did this famous rat study where they feed these rats Oreo Cookies, and they find the– the same receptors to the brain, same parts of the brain lined up for the Oreo cookies compared to, I think, the Cocaine. I think it was even worse. The Oreo cookies caused that part of the brain to light up even more than the drugs did.
Evan Brand: It did, which is crazy. And uh – sugar, I would say, probably the number one most abused drug in the US, for sure, but probably most of the developed world. Something that’s interesting, which you kind of hit on already is most people were always modifying all neurotransmitters, so, our brain chemicals. So, this is your Dopamine, this is your GABA, this is your Serotonin, your Adrenaline, your Noradrenaline, a lot of us modify our neurotransmitters by ourselves, like we’re trying to sell treat. Even though we’re not realizing what we’re doing by eating sugar or we’re using social media.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep.
Evan Brand: Excessive Facebookers, other type of social medias, alcohol, caffeine…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep.
Evan Brand: …drugs. We’re trying to modify our brain chemistry all the time. And, we just don’t realize what we’re doing. So, some of the– the symptoms, like if you’ve got low Catechol. I mean, I’ll read these off here.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: Got depression, you’ve got apathy, you’ve got easily bored, a lack of energy of focus, a lack of drive, low motivation, uh– ADD, like you mentioned, Attention Deficit, procrastination, and indecisiveness; that’s a big one. And then craving carbs, alcohol, caffeine or drugs for energy. So, that’s all– that’s the Catecholamines, and if you have enough of those, you should be energized. You should be upbeat. You should be focused. You should have the ability to get stuff done. You know what comes to mind? I think of all the– the children that you and I have heard about with our, specially our– our female clients: our moms. We always here about their children and how they’re hooked on video games all the time. To me, sounds like video games are burning out the Catecholamines, and causing these kids to not be able to do anything else, like get a job, or not want to get a job, because they’d rather play games.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, I mean, that’s one component, right? So, if we look at the neurotransmitters, there’s two sides we’re gonna hit it on, right. There’s the – the burning-up side. What are the stressors that are causing you to burn them up? And then number two, what are things that we can do to actually replete and help support and heal, because right now, I think, some research out there, over 20 percent of fifth graders are on some kind of antidepressant. Some kind of SSRI or SSNRI, these are basically drugs that modulate the amount of neurotransmitters that are in the brain, and it does it by blocking these reuptake ports. So how that works is, here’s your presynaptic neuron, here’s your post-synaptic neuron, okay. In between is what’s called the synaptic cleft, the sewer of a lot of the neurochemicals. The Serotonin, the Dopamine, they all live right here. And basically, these chemicals get reabsorbed back into presynaptic neuron over time. And basically, the drugs block that reuptake ports so these neurotransmitters don’t go back. They hang in the space. They hang in the synaptic cleft area longer. So, then you start getting more of them in that area. Now, that can change the mood. It can change a lot of different things. The problem is, the longer those neurochemicals hang outside of that synaptic– outside of that presynaptic neuron. So, when the more these neurotransmitters stay here and don’t go back up to that presynaptic neuron, the faster they get recycled. So, that tends to be one of the reasons why if you’re on one of these medications long-term, the dose tends to have to go up, unless you’re making other changes that we’ll talk about in a bit. So, that just kind of gives you some of the mechanism how these things work. That’s one potential uh– mechanism of how these medications work.
Evan Brand: Yeah. So, let’s chat about, like you mentioned, the first section: what causes the deficiency of amino acids. So, you hit on stress. You said that we’re gonna burn up amino acids when we’re stressed. Same thing with Vitamin C too. A lot of times, you and I will see that Vitamin C is very low. We’ll see that neurotransmitters are low. We could see all the amino acid metabolites are low. Across the board, stress, eating while stressed, you know, in a fight-or-flight mode, not chewing your food, low stomach acid levels, uhm– we could hit on the infection piece. If someone’s eating a good diet, let’s say, they’re listening and they’re eating a Primal Paleo whole foods diet. But if they got parasites or bacterial bugs, or yeast, which is something you and I deal with all the time, you’re getting your nutrient stolen. And so…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah.
Evan Brand: …it’s not really what you– people say, “You are what you eat,” but really, it’s “You are what you digest.” And if you got bugs stealing your nutrients, then, you’re gonna be – you’re gonna be at a deficient state.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent. So, we kind of go back, right. One of the underlying stressors that drive a lot of these things of– when we’d say stress, people tend to associate stress as emotional stress, which is fine. So, emotional stress is gonna be family issues, finance issues, it could be relationship issues, problems with your kids, you know, that’s of the loved one. Though any of those things can be, you know, a big, I should say, uhm– a hole in that emotional pipe here, where a lot of those nutrients and a lot of those neurochemicals will flow down the more stressed you are. It’s gonna increase the burning rate. Just like driving your car faster and harder on the highway, is gonna go through more gas. You’ll also go through more neurotransmitters with those stressors. So, keep that in the back of your mind. So, some people don’t have the ability to change that. They may be in the middle of a stressful situation where that’s just it has to kind of play out. Right? So, we have to at least work on the back side of it. what’s the back side? Well, you can at least make sure your diet’s really good. Right? What does that mean? A Paleo template’s always a great place to start, healthy servings of animal protein in every meal, uh– lots of vegetables, more green vegetables than starch and fruit. And if you’re gonna do starch, try to keep it to uh– you know, dialed-in to the amount that you can handle based on exercise, and keep the fruit on the lower sugar side. And it’s all based upon your level of activity, and kind of, your body fat, and your exercise level. Is that right? More active you are, you could probably handle more carb. The more muscle you have, the more carbs. The less muscle and the less active you have, probably the less carbs. So, you can kind of keep that dialed-in. So, stress side, we may not able to change it, so we have to really make sure that the food side is dialed-in. That’s number one. Number two, we have to make sure the sleep side is dialed-in, between 2AM and 6AM’s where a lot of we– a lot of the neurotransmitters get uh– restored and recycled. So, getting to bed closer to 10:00 to 11:00 will adequate restoration of those neurotransmitters when it comes to sleep. And then number three is not excessively exercising. People will use excessive exercise, like CrossFit to really up the their– Dopamine, or Serotonin, or Adrenaline, artificially, by creating a stress response. And, nothing wrong with that. The problem is if we’re catabolic and we’re breaking down, we may not be able to recover the next day from that stress response. So, that will create more fatigue, and more adrenal, and more hormonal issues down the road.
Evan Brand: Good. So, yeah. We would say, 24-48 hours before uh– you hit the gym again. So, if you do a hard workout, you may not need to go five-six days a week. You know, we’ve seen people that they have too much of a good thing. Now, a lot of people they’re at the– the bottom end of the spectrum. They’re not getting enough exercise. They’re not getting enough movement. Stimulation, light exposure, walking; they’re not doing any of it. But then you’ve got these other uh– crazy athletes on the opposite end where they’re doing five-six days a week, and they’re starting to lose muscle mass. So, yes. You definitely can’t have too much of a good thing uh– with exercise. Give yourself 24-48 hours. Do you need protein powders? do you need amino acids? They could help. I don’t know if I would consider them, foundationally. Could that means you can still get results without them. But if you’re somebody who– you’re at uh– an underweight situation, you’re concerned you’re getting too thin, you know, that’s definitely where Justin and I are gonna look at– giving you like uh– Hydrolyzed Collagen, or a beef protein, or a grass-fed way or organic pea protein. And you can supplement with those, but you still got to focus on the food too. You know, we’ve talked with people who – they’ll do a protein shake instead of a meal, which is fine in– in– in a pinch, but if you’re skipping meals, like your after-workout meal is just a protein shake as opposed to you sitting down and having an actual post-workout meal. You know, we much prefer real food over powders when possible.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. I think combining the amino acid supplements with the real food’s the best way to go. What you get with the amino acids is you get amino acids in your bloodstream very, very fast very easily. The thermic effect of food is basically how much energy your body depletes itself of by metabolizing the protein and digesting it. So, about 30 to 40 percent of the energy you get from the protein goes into actually breaking it down and metabolizing it. That’s important. So, you know, closed to two-third – closed to over a third to half of all that energy goes into just breaking itself down. So, that’s not the best if you’re trying to get those nutrients in fast and easy and not put a lot of stress on your system. A good amino acid supplement, it does help with that. So, it gets the amino acids in there fast. It’s in the bloodstream so the body can utilize it for energy and nutrition right away. But number two, it’s gonna put a lot of stress in your digestive system. So, you don’t have to think two to three hours ahead of time what should I eat? You can kind of just, let’s say, wake up and you can have a nice little shake, and get amino acid there. And you can also use it to replete itself post-workout. Good studies I know, wheat protein– their studies 20 to 30 minutes post workout, you know, doing 20 to 30 grams of protein can increase growth hormone post workout. And that was wheat protein, and I imagine that’s gonna be similar with other amino acid profiles. You can probably find something similar with Collagen and probably even similar with pea protein as well.
Evan Brand: Yep. Well, can you chat about vegetarians and Vegans for a bit? Cause we’ve seen that some Vegans that come to us, they could have more issues with mood issues, anxiety, depression, irritability, rage, IBS issues. We see that a lot more in Vegans versus people that are eating animal proteins.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, again, a lot of Vegans and vegetarians, you can do it right, but it takes planning, alright? So number one, like, where do you get your proteins when you’re a Vegan vegetarian? Now, again, there’ll be some proteins in plants, but not a lot. I mean, if you look at the amount of proteins in plants, there’s not a lot. And plus, there aren’t a lot of calories in plants. So, there’s good micronutrients, right? No one’s saying like a bunch of Kale doesn’t have. You know, a whole bunch of macronutrient– micronutrients in that right, Vitamins, minerals, those kinds of things, Potassium, those things, but if you look at the macronutrients, right, obviously they’re gonna be non-starchy carbohydrates but there’s not a lot of calories. I mean, if you look at – we can just go to chronometer.com. We can plug in calories in – in a cup of Kale. I’ll do it right now. [crosstalk] You’re probably gonna find [inaudible]
Evan Brand: I’m gonna guess. It’s only gonna be to 40 calories.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You’re probably gonna find maybe 20 grams or 20 calories in there maybe, and then maybe one gram of protein. Yes. So, one cup of Kale, is 33 calories, alright. Now, there’s [crosstalk] 2.9…
Evan Brand: [inaudible] is what you’re saying?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and there’s 2.9 grams of protein. So, you know, what’s a good serving of Kale per meal? Let’s say, someone really goes out and does two cups. That’s a– that’s a lot of Kale per meal, would you agree?
Evan Brand: Yes.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey, you just got five grams of protein.
Evan Brand: [smiles]
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: That’s just– that’s inadequate, and you got 60 calories. Like it’s just not enough, right? So, again, vegetarians have to get their protein by combining either, you know, rice and legumes. Because a lot of vegetarian proteins are insufficient in Methionine and Lysine, so they have to work on this food combining thing, or they supplement amino acids. The ones that you see like– that are like, hey look at this guy, he’s a Vegan vegetarian, body builder. He’s this. Yeah, of course. He’s using a whole bunch of rice protein and pea protein. Like, that’s the only way you can really do it, and get the, the right amount of protein requirements, without all carbs. Uhm– there’s been studies out there. People have looked at, you know, creating a meal plan for vegetarians, Vegans. And you know, you’ve got to get three to four hundred grams of carbohydrates minimum to get that adequate amount of protein. And adequate amount, let’s say, half your gra– half your body weight and grams. So, I’m two hundred and ten pounds, for me to get a hundred and ten grams of protein, I’d have to do rice and beans or just lentils, and I’d had to really pound the lentils up. And lentils are two-thirds carbohydrate starch to one-third protein. So, do the math. I’m at a hundred grams of protein and then I’m already at three hundred plus grams of carbohydrate. So– And then you also have the digestive component where you may be using a whole bunch of bean now or enzymes because you may not have the ability to break down a lot of those uhm – beans ‘cause of the phytates and the lectins, some of the gut irritating compounds.
Evan Brand: Right. So then you run to that issue. Now, you’re running around you’re gassy ‘cause you’re trying to eat uh– beans and other types of veggies to get the protein, but it’d be much easier if you just look at some good quality. And you don’t have to go crazy. Like you said, even just a palm-sized portion of animal protein’s plenty. We’re not saying overeat protein ‘cause you’ve got the mTOR pathway, which is definitely going to shorten lifespan. You don’t really want to over activate mTOR but it’s a switch. You want to throttle it up and throttle it down, and so there’s gonna be days where– on workout days, you are gonna do some good animal proteins. Maybe you go a bit lighter on the protein on days when you’re not working out.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So, the benefit you get from animal protein– and again, we’ll put it like a little cut of qualifying thing in here. Of course, when we talk about animal proteins, we’re talking about grass-fed, pasture-fed, hormone-free, antibiotic-free, organic, right? Animals fed appropriate feed. We’re kind of encompassing all that in there. A lot of vegetarians and Vegans don’t ever put that statement regarding on their vegetables. Like, when they talk about, like, a carrot for instance, right? You know, an organic carrot isn’t the same thing as the carrot that maybe you genetically modified and sprayed pounds and pounds of herbicides or xenocides, fungicides, genetically modified uhm– pesticides in there, right? So, again, a carrot on this side that I just depicted full of all those toxins isn’t the same as an organic carrot, for instance. Same thing with the meat. So, we can qualify the plants. A lot of Vegans, vegetarians, don’t do that. Right? You see what the health that move you on that flex, we’ll have to do a review of that soon. Right? It’s kind of like, you know, here are your plants. We don’t really have to qualify plants as much, but we’ll throw all the meat over here as being in this really really bad thing full of chemicals, where there are ways you can get healthy sources of meat which we support here on the show. So, again, the benefits of the meat, why it’s so great, you don’t have to get a whole bunch of carbohydrate. That’s nice ‘cause a lot of people are Insulin-resistant. Their metabolism may not be able to handle that kind of carbohydrate. Some may, some may not. the vegans, the vegetarians that you hear that do so well. The reason that they do so well is they have good carbohydrate-handling mechanisms. They can get that three to four hundred grams and they can do okay. That’s the problem, but the issue is, you have a lot of people that are Insulin-resistant. I go as far as to say as to three quarters of the population are. And that’s why you have so many people that don’t do well with that kind of diet.
Evan Brand: Yep. Well said. So we hit the diet piece. That’s important. We had to spend time there ‘cause it’s just – it’s so under appreciated. The role of amino acid…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally.
Evan Brand: … just from your good quality proteins. Let’s talk about supplements a bit. So, you said you were gonna take some. What are you taking, amino acid-wise?
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. So, you have amino acids for performance, right, from maybe cognitive performance. These are gonna be things like Serotonin precursors and Dopamine and adrenaline precursors. So, our Serotonin precursors are gonna be 5-HTP, alright. You can also go upstream one and do Tryptophan. Tryptophan has to go through this uhm – kind of governor enzyme here that has an effect on how that gets converted down. You might think it’s uhm – 5-Hydroxylase is the enzyme, and that enzyme has a governor to it. So, it’s kind of like, someone puts a governor on your car, where you could only go 65 in the highway. You can’t go any higher. No matter how deep that gas pedal is. Same thing. So, we like to do 5-HTP ‘cause we can bypass that governor. And we’ll always want to give it with B6, ‘cause B6 and B Vitamins are, one, they get depleted with stress, and number two, they get depleted with excess carbohydrate. So, by getting extra good B Vitamins in there, that’s essential. So, B6, right, Pyridoxal-5-Phosphate, B9, which is gonna be Folate, not Folic acid but Folate or Calcium folinate. We have B12, of course. Ideally, you know, Methyl hydroxy ordynaxole cobalamin. Of course, we have B1, which is gonna be your– your Thiamine, B2, which is your Riboflavin, B3, which is your Niacin. I think B7 is uh – I think it’s Biotin, right. So, you have all these really good B Vitamins that will get depleted with stress. The big one’s for neurotransmitters though, are gonna be B6, Folate, which is technically B9, and then we have B12, which is your Methylated B12. So, those are really, really important for the neurotransmitters. We want to make sure that those are dialed-in with it. Now, what I just took was– I just took uhm– my brand, Replete. So, as a combo of 5-HTP and L-tyrosine or Dopamine precursors with the extra B Vitamins. So, I do that, and that’s specific for me ‘cause my organic acid test tends to show the 5-hydroxyindole acetate, the vanilmandelate, and the homovanillate a little off-kilter. And that’s just probably ‘cause it’s stressed. So, I just really support that, to make sure I have those building blocks, and of course, you know, my diet’s rock solid, but for me, I noticed the cognitive benefit and performance benefit, so I continue to take those. As long as my test continue to show, I need to continue to take those for me.
Evan Brand: Yep. Good. And we see that a lot, whether it’s uh– athlete’s or from a physical perspective, burning through aminos, whether it’s engineers or people like you that are just– your brain is just, “Go! Go! Go! Go!” all day. You’re burning through those. So that’s good. Let me just give a brief list here of some low Serotonin symptoms. I hit on the low Dopamine symptoms a bit, but Serotonin would be anxiety, panic attacks or phobias, worry, or being fearful, obsessive thoughts or behaviors, perfectionism, irritability, anxiety that can be worse in the winter, you’ve got winter blues, sometimes PMS with women…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yep.
Evan Brand: …uhm– depression, and then at the extreme, would be, like, suicidal thoughts, with Serotonin. So, some people, they may not have all of these. They may just have a couple, like, sometimes digestive issues, so IBS. You know, there’s a couple different uh– Irritable Bowel Syndrome formulas that Justin and I used, and the 5-HTP actually helps to regulate the intestinal motility. So, if you’ve got Diarrhea, you know, the 5-HTP itself could help replenish Serotonin, therefore, fixing your gut. So, digestive issues, you got to look at amino acids too sometimes. Sometimes, just the diet doesn’t fix it. uh– sleep issues as well, and then cravings. So, any type of alcohol, sugar cravings, that could all be – those are all symptoms I’ve read off here of Serotonin. And uhm– you hit …
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: There’s a big overlap too. Like, if you look at Serotonin, right, you’re gonna see anxiety and potentially panic attacks there, but you’ll also see that with GABA as well.
Evan Brand: That’s true. Well, what you say GABA and Serotonin. You would say, most of the time GABA and uh – Serotonin are gonna be messed up together, so you probably are gonna supplement those together.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. The big thing is I very rarely supplement amino acids by themselves, so if we do it short term, like I will maybe do that with sleep, when we’ll do 5-HTP at around dinner and before bed, to help kind of improve Melatonin synthesis, but in general, if you’re doing amino acids long-term, you want to have them together. At least some level together, because the amino acid enzyme that gets increased when you take amino acids is the aromatic decarboxylase enzyme, which metabolizes these amino acids. And these enzymes metabolize, you know, relatively speaking, the Dopamine, the Serotonin, the adrenaline enzymes together. So, if you’re taking a whole bunch of Serotonin precursors, like 5-HTP, that enzyme’s more active. If that enzyme’s more active, guess what it’s gonna do to the Dopamine and adrenaline amino acids. It’s gonna metabolize it. But if there’s less coming in, ‘cause you’re not supplementing it, you can create deficiencies longer term. And of course, it’s gonna be amino acid dependent, right. The more amino acids you give, the more that enzyme will be active. That’s why for giving a whole bunch of Thyroxine long-term it’s good to give at least a little bit of Serotonin precursors. So, I take one ___[23:32] that has mucuna in it, which is actually pure L-Dopa, based on my levels. And when you support Dopamine, you’re actually supporting adrenaline as well. And we put a little bit of Enisyl thyroxine. So, you have thyroxine in there. Thyroxine goes downstream to Dopamine, which is good. It also can go to adrenaline as well. So we support both the adrenaline pathways too, because typically, it goes like – It goes phenylalanine, thyroxine, L-Dopa, and then from L-Dopa, it can go to Dopamine, and then it can go down to Norepinephrine. So, that’s why the more stressed you are, you’ll pull from Dopamine to your Norepinephrine-Epinephrine. And, part of what happens in that metabolism, from Dopamine to Norepinephrine, you’ll actually deplete a lot of Sulphur amino acids. So, when you go on from Dopamine to your Catecholamines, you need a lot of Sulphur. So, that’s why it’s good to take Methionine, Cysteine, you know, a lot of your Glutathione precursors, Glutamine, Taurine, right. These are really important ‘cause they really helped with that Dopamine to Adrenaline pathway. So, longer term , we really want to make sure Sulphur amino acids are there to help with that conversion.
Evan Brand: Perfect. Well said. Uhm– like you mentioned, you really using them by themselves, there’s practitioners out there, that’s all they do, is amino acid therapy. They just pi– look at symptoms. They look at charts. Okay, you have these symptom, I’m gonna guess and check. Uh– you hit on organic acids testing, so that’s something we’re definitely gonna look at is figuring out what the levels are on a piece of paper. That way we can track them. Could you look at symptoms and just try to guess and check and self-treat yourself? You definitely could but I would give the disclaimer that amino acids can be as powerful if not more powerful than pharmaceutical drugs. So, just ‘cause it’s something you could go by the Health Food Store, like amino acids on Amazon, that doesn’t mean that it’s uhm– any less impactful. Doesn’t mean it cannot affect you. It certainly can change things very, very quickly, and I’ve heard of people you and I both got videos on this on YouTube as well. I’ve heard of people saying, “Hey, look. I tried this and that and that and then I had anxiety, or I tried this and that and I couldn’t sleep. So, that’s why, it’s definitely helpful to work with the practitioner who’s worked on this, and definitely someone like us, who can test you because if you just go and you look at the symptom list and you guess, “I think it’s this? But I don’t know.” And then you start taking a bunch of Thyroxine. The last thing you want to do is have an anxiety or panic attack, and then you’ve got three or four, five or six hours, where you’ve got to wait for that supplement to wear off. That’s not fun to do.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and a lot of these compounds, like uhm – Serotonin, Dopamine, that cannot, that doesn’t cross the blood-brain barrier. What will cross is the precursors. So, giving a lot of the precursor nutrients is essential, and then it will cross the blood-brain barrier and convert in the brain. So, that’s– that’s one component that’s really important. I think the most underrated supplement for dealing with mood and amino acids is gonna be your hydrochloric acid and your enzymes. ‘Cause if we can’t metabolize that healthy protein, right. Let’s start with that palm-sized of protein, three to four ounces, that’s gonna be about 25-30 grams of protein. That– that’s– you know, if you can’t break that down, right, protein is the pearl necklace, the amino acids are the individual pearls. So, think of ripping that necklace apart, that’s the digestive process that happens. So, if we can’t make that process happen, we’re not gonna be able to process those individual pearls in that necklace. So, I’d say, the digestive component’s really important in that. And I think a lot of people that have mood issues too, I know uhm – our friend there, a mind of her own – she wrote the book, “A Mind of Her Own,” uh – Dr. Kelly. She uhm– talks about the inflammation component when it comes to moods. So, she kind of doesn’t put as much on the amino acids. She does, but she puts it more on the gut and the inflammation with the brain component. So, that’s part of why the diet is so important ‘cause that’s probably one of the biggest vectors to inflammation outside of having infections in your gut tract along with leaky gut.
Evan Brand: Yep. Well said. So, we can spot treat amino acids for sure, but like how you always go back to the gut. So definitely, Epocrates and you are aligned. All disease starts in the gut. So, when we’re talking about brain issues…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: [inaudible] life and death starts in the colon.
Evan Brand: Yeah. That too. So, we got to go with the gut. Make sure you’re free and clear of infections. So, once again, we hit on this every single week probably but you got to circle back. Make sure you’re free of infections, no– no yeast, no parasites, no fungus, no bacterial overgrowth in the small intestine. That’s gonna inflame the gut. You’re gonna see Calprotectin go up on your stool test. You’re inflamed. You’re not digesting well. You’re stressed. Maybe you’re not chewing. Maybe you’re rushing. Maybe you’re scrolling on Instagram while you should be just eating your meal in peace. You know, these aare all habits that that really build up, so always go back to the gut and– yeah. You can– you can spot treat with these but we always like to go back to root cause. So, if you go to a practitioner that just does amino acids, and that’s all they do is mix and match, I think you’re results are gonna be limited.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, absolutely. And it gets a lot of side effects with these antidepressants too. Uhm– yeah, it would – Dr. Kelly Brogan. She was on the Joe Rogan Show last month too. She did a really nice thing about, you know, talking about antidepressants. And again, it’s kind of uh – you know, people use them quite frequently as a coping mechanism, and they really don’t want to get to the root cause. I mean, they just think, “Oh, there’s a chemical imbalance in my brain that’s why I need this.” But why? Why is there a chemical imbalance? Is it ‘cause your diet’s crap? Is it because you sleep five hours a night? Is it ‘cause you can’t digest protein? Is it because you’re on a low-fat diet? Why? Because the antidepressants not getting to the root cause. Now, antidepressants may be great in the short run if you’re preventing– if someone just have a travesty happen in their life, and they’re trying to get stabilized because they may kill themselves, or you know, their lives, you know, absolutely in turmoil, just to kind of get stable. And then, once they’re stable, they can then reach out and grab the right things and incorporate the right approaches to heal. Short run, it’s great. The problem is lots of research is showing that these things are not great in the long run. And they have a lot of side effects: nausea, increased appetite, loss of sexual– basically, low libido, right, low sex drive, fatigue, insomnia, dry mouth, blurred vision, constipation, weight gain. So, there’s a lot of side effects that happened from these medications, and the problem with it is, you get this Polypharmacy vicious cycle, where you start having one or two of these side effects, and then you’re on other medications to treat those side effects. And that can spiral out of control pretty fast.
Evan Brand: Oh, well said. Yeah. I mean I’ve had people where they all say, they get on an antidepressant, but then that their mood starts to fluctuate. So, then they get put on like a bipolar med on top of the antidepressant or some type of antipsychotic, or they get anxiety so then they get put on Lorazepam or Xanax ‘cause then they can’t sleep. And then, like you mentioned, three, four, five, six pharmaceuticals later, you’ve got a really, really toxic potion that you’re having to put in the body but you still don’t feel well.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So, a couple of options here. Number one– if you’re on an antidepressant and you get off, number one, don’t ever pull yourself off. Okay? Don’t ever go back to the prescribing physician and you need to have be tapered off. And it depends, right. Some people are on these medications, ‘cause they felt a little bit off. And they’re on them. But they weren’t on them for a major reason. And some people will put on them because they– they’re– they had some serious issues, and then you need to get stability back in. So, typically, the more you are on them, to really kind of stabilize your life, because your symptoms are out of control. The longer that taper has to be off. So, according to some psychiatrist, one to two years taper, for some. I’ve seen some that said, “I’m gonna just come off right away,” and I’m like, “Don’t do that. Go back to the prescribing doctor,” but some said, “Nope,” and they were fine. Right? Because they made a lot of changes. So, we always advocate the more conservative approach. Go back to the prescribing physician ‘cause they know your situation better, and tell them that, where you’re at, that you’re making a lot of these diet and lifestyle changes that you want to try start to slowly taper off those medications. That’s number one. Number two, if you’re still having issues and side effects, and you want to use some of these amino acids with us. Typically, what we’ll do is we’ll work on the amino acids first cause the amino acids will actually make the medication work better. Right? ‘Cause if the amino acids are part of the building blocks that are getting reorganized from the reuptake portals being inhibited. Then you’re gonna have uhm– basically, the– the meds work better. Right? Cause if you’re– Remember, here’s your presynaptic neuron; here’s your postsynaptic neuron. All the neurotransmitters are here, but they’re– they’re– the number of them are going down, because of the reuptake uhm– because of the recycling of those amino acids is greater, right? The longer these amino acids live outside of the presynaptic neuron, the more they get – and more of them there, the number of them goes up. So, the more they can affect neurotransmission across the synaptic cleft there. So, the – the more the meds will work better, work like they should have worked when the neurotransmitter levels were higher. So, you may start to have side effects of the antidepressant as those neurotransmitter levels go up, so be very mindful of that if you start having side effects of the medication, there’s two choices. You can decrease the neurotransmitter levels by decreasing the amino acids, or you can decrease the medication. Yeah, right. So, typically, what I always recommend is once you kind of have those side effects, you can go back to that – the physician that prescribed it. And you can start to slowly taper that down. So, I tend to get people stable first, and the I make moves by referring back to the prescribing physician. I don’t ever want to move the medication around first, because that’s creating unstable environment, especially those meds. So, we get stabilized, and then we refer back to the prescribing doctor for them to adjust and modify according to what they think is correct based on that patient’s needs.
Evan Brand: Well said. Especially if they’ve been on it 10 – 20 years, I mean…
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yes.
Evan Brand: …who knows.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. So, it creates lots of other symptoms. So, you got to be careful that– So, regarding couple other components, diet plays a big component. So, adequate protein, I’d say at least a palm’s worth of protein per meal. And again, you know, I’m 6’2’’, 210 pounds, and my palm’s bigger than, you know, someone that’s five feet a hundred pounds. So, that tends to be a pretty good rule of thumb. And to be more exact, I would say half your body weight in grams, so 200 pounds, hundred grams of protein. You’re a hundred and twenty pounds, 60 grams of proteins. A pretty good rule of thumb, regarding how much to do if you add– if you exercise more and you’re do– more active and I’d go do a full hand versus a palm. And if you’re like a Vegan vegetarian, and you’re trying to maybe add in some protein, I would just start with a quarter to half a palm to start. And, I’d make sure the – there’s adequate enzymes and HCL, because more than likely, unless you’re going to– to be a Vegan vegetarian because of environmental reasons. Then, typically, you’re– you’re there because you feel better off meat. And if you feel better off meat, it’s ‘cause your digestion’s in the tank, and you’re not able to digest it and break it down. So, you’re getting a lot of putrefaction and resinification of proteins, so it’s just rotting in your stomach. So, you’re feeling the rot and saying, “Oh. Animal protein’s bad.” No. It’s you’re not digesting it well. And if we could go all into the environmental implications of meats, it really not– isn’t what it is, if you’re eating organic and local. It’s more of the factory farm CAFO kind of feedlot models that really create uh – the environmental issues.
Evan Brand: Oh yeah. We’re fine, and the pasteurized animals actually helped with re– you know, uh– recirculation of nutrients back into the soil. I mean, the top soil’s been so degraded we’ve lost a lot of minerals over the past 50 years and vitamins in the soil, and pasteurized animals. We’ve had this cycle where the hooves are putting the poop back into the dirt, and kind of start all over. And we’ve mess that up with raising cows on concrete, feeding them corns. So, uh– yeah. Still, unfortunately, animals get lumped into the animal category, and that’s it. There really need to be more distinction, for sure.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. I mean, people talk about, you know, the excessive methane produced by these animals. That’s because they’re fake corn and grains. You cut out the corns and grains, the methane’s an on issue. Also, it’s a closed loop, if you feed them grass and what they’re supposed to be – supposed to consume because if you feed them corn and grains, you actually have to start hauling away the manure afterwards because it becomes E. coli, you know, rich. So, you have to start hauling away all of the manure afterwards first, if you have a closed system. Meaning, eat the grass, the poop goes on the ground, and the poop goes into the ground and actually creates fertilizer. But you know, the hooves and other things, feed off for that. And then, if you have a closed cycle then, the grobs come in from the manure, and then you bring the chickens out, and the chickens eat the grobs. And it’s a beautiful closed cycle. Uh – Joel Salatin talks about this uh – in his farm, The Polyface Farm. He’s got a couple of books on this idea of uhm– you know, permaculture in this kind of, you know, closed or open loop– I should– closed loop, right? Everything’s at [stuttering] complete cycle of how everything works in the uhm– in farming.
Evan Brand: Wow, I didn’t realize that about the poop of corn-fed animals. They have to haul it out. That makes total sense.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. If you watched the movie Food, Inc., they’d detailed it pretty well in that.
Evan Brand: Oh my gosh. Yeah. Jules Olsen’s got a good book called uh – “Folks, This Ain’t Normal.” I would encourage people to read that. And in for amino acid books, you could check out Julia Ross, “The Mood Cure,” “The Diet Cure.” Uh – I’ve interviewed her a couple times on the podcast. She’s got some really cool experience there, so check – check out those resources. And then, if you want a schedule with Justin or myself, visit our websites: justinhealth.com– You can schedule. And also, I think you’ve done some YouTube videos on it, and I’ve done some YouTube videos on aminos too. So, if you’re wanting like a more short, condensed version of this, if it went over your head a bit, or you just got a bit daydreamy on us, then go to the YouTube. Look up Just in Health, or look up Evan Brand. We’ve got videos that are probably less than ten minutes. That will, that will detail kind of the, symptoms. And then, we’ll do a part II – part III on this too.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely, and again, the big take-home is– we’ll have a part two, like you said, but the big take-home is diet is dialed-in, figure out the macronutrients that you need, don’t skip meals, especially if you have health issues ‘cause blood sugar fluctuations can create adrenaline stressors that cause you to burn to the adrenaline more. Also, the more sugar fluctuation you have, the more you’re gonna burn through B Vitamins, ‘cause part of B Vitamins is basically generating a fuel from glucose. So, if you’re causing your blood sugar system to fluctuate, the more you’re gonna burn the B Vitamins, especially B6, which is really, really, really important for uhm – carrying the signal from one nerve to the other. B6 is really important. It’s also important for the synthesis of these neurochemicals. Uhm – make sure you’re digesting the protein you’re eating. If you’re having– getting gassy, you’re bloaty or constipated, or diarrhea after the meals, there may be some digestive issues from an infection standpoint or food allergen standpoint, or a uhm– enzyme HCL standpoint.
Evan Brand: Yep.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: And so, B Vitamins. And also, having a really good multivitamin just there in the background’s important. Vitamin C and extra minerals, like Magnesium and B12. There’s other things that are there. It’s important to have, I’d say, just a good B-complex there, and/or good multi in the background when doing all this. Just to make sure the other nutrients are there as well.
Evan Brand: Well said.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, any other comments, Evan, you want to put out there that we didn’t quite emphasize?
Evan Brand: No, I think – if I have more, I’ll– I’ll put them on– on next episode.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Just disclaimer, if you’re on these medications and you’re like really excited, you want to make some changes, number one: work with the practitioner; number two: don’t ever go off your medications, cold turkey; three: get stabilized before you make changes, and go back to the prescribing physician. Tell them what you’re doing, what your goals are. And that – ask them to create a taper plan, specific to where they’re at. Some – I’ve seen some doctors that are just like, “Come off.” And I’m like, “Hey. If you’re gonna do that with your medical license, okay, that’s fine.” Some will say, “Hey. We need a one-year taper.” Again, they know the patient better. They know what their rationale for prescribing the medications well, so always go back to that prescribing physician. Tell them kind of where you’re at. So then, they can kind of create a plan for you.
Evan Brand: Perfect. Well said. Nice job, man.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh, and then also real quick too. You outlined it earlier about, like this issue with kids and antidepressants. We had a major epidemic with kids on these drugs. And, a lot of it just comes down to their diet, just being crap. Foodized chemicals, sugar– so if you have kids with these issues too– Again, we’re starting at the same place – the diet. And again, I know it’s hard for parents ‘cause parents project what they want, what their needs are on to the child. They see their kid and they all like, “Aww. You know what, I had fun memories eating this junkfood when I was a kid, therefore, I want to – I want my kid to have that same experience, so too speak. And uhm– again, the Pottenger Cats example, right. Each generation gets a little more nutrient-deficient as the food quality goes down. So, the type of food that we had access to, 20 to 30 years ago, isn’t even the same quality of food we have access to today. So, remember, your kids may have a weaker constitution, and also maybe even gluten-sensitive, too. So, you got to keep that in mind when your kids have health issues. You really want to dial up the food quality as much as possible. And the first place you start is: set the example and have at least one to two family meals together, is ideal.
Evan Brand: Yeah. Well said. I got to run.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Evan, great chat with you, my man. You have [crosstalk] an awesome day.
Evan Brand: Take care.
Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Alright, brother. Take care. Bye.
“A Mind of Her Own” by Dr. Kelly Brogan
“The Polyface Farms” by Joel Salatin
“Food, Inc.” by filmmaker, Robert Kenner
“Folks, This Ain’t Normal” by Jules Olsen
“The Mood Cure” and “The Diet Cure” by Julia Ross
Organic Acid Testing Review – Uncover Your Metabolic Road Blocks
By Dr. Justin Marchegiani
Organic acids are made by your metabolism. They come from amino acids or proteins essentially. They can give us a window underneath the hood what’s happening with B vitamins, with methylation, with detox, with neurotransmitters, mitochondrial function, how you’re generating energy from proteins, fats, and carbohydrates, etc. Watch this video and learn more what are the five big root cause of organic acids.
Today’s video’s going to be on organic acid testing. We’re going to dive in deep to a patient’s lab. Also, we’re going to go over organic acids- how to look at them, testing-wise and what they actually mean from the inside out.
So off the bat, organic acids are made by your metabolism. They come from amino acids or proteins, essentially. They can give us a window deeper under the hood of what’s happening with B vitamins, with methylation, with detox, with neurotransmitters, mitochondrial function, how you’re generating energy from proteins, fats and carbohydrates, neurotransmitters, oxidative stress. It even can look on fungus and bacterial overgrowth. So it gives us a good window of what’s happening underneath the hood.
Now, we will look at tests. Actually look at the summary of abnormal findings and go through what everything means.
Why organic acids go out of balance?
- Poor diet
- Genetic (MTHFR)
This can be poor macronutrients, proteins, you’re on a low-fat diet, a very high amount of carbohydrates with insulin resistant or could be just poor quality of food. Lots of toxins, chemicals, inflammatory food as well. So make sure that your diet is on point.
This could be low stomach acid or enzymes. You could have infections infections like SIBO or bacteria or parasitic infections, and could even be food allergies as well. Including sensitivity followed by leaky gut, etc.
This could be emotional stress such as relationship, financial issues, family, friends issues, work issues. It can also be too much exercise, very high amount of physical exercise or even too little. And it also could be sleep – poor sleep. Sleep really helps recharge and reinvigorate you for the next day and repair also.
Toxins whether it’s from round up or pesticides, glyphosate, heavy metals and environmental stressors like mold or mycotoxins or even EMF.
There is an MTHFR, SNP issue or just need certain higher levels of other nutrients like magnesium or B6. Everyone’s a little bit different.
So now knowing that, let’s dig in. So off the bat, you can see this patient’s lab test a lot of things are popping up. Issue with fatty acids, issues with carbohydrate, energy. The big thing off the bat is amino acids,amino acids, amino acids. Carnitine’s actually made from methionine and lysine free-form aminos, tyrosine neurotransmitter issues.
Some issues with amino acids seen on lab tests
This means that neurotransmitters are more burnt out. And the big thing I’m seeing is stress and/or malabsorption. When you see amino acids like this go crazy off the chart, that’s definitely an issue – lower brain amino acids and obviously, gut issues.
In this patient, we have other lab tests in this patient but there’s infections present as well, which is setting up for that area number two which is the malabsorption issue. We’re seeing nutrients not quite present at optimal levels and just the pattern we’re seeing really tells us a strong malabsorption going on. Persons diet’s already good, pretty good. Malabsorption is definitely present and with that, stress definitely becomes an issue. Also, sleep and all that we are working on that with the adrenals in diet and lifestyle;but malabsorption is definitely present.
So let’s go look at the nitty-gritty of the lab testing here. We like the patient to be somewhere between the top part of the first and the bottom part of the fourth. This is what I call the sweet spot that we like right in the middle. This is like the field-goal post we want to kick the ball right through for that field goal. When organic acids go high or low, there’s essentially imbalances in those intervention or companion nutrients.
Demand or Depletion Issue
You can see the Carnitine for the Ethyl Manolate. You can see that Mandelate, the companion nutrients, Tyrosine. So if these organic acids go high or low, it means either a demand or depletion issue. So when organic acids go high, there’s a massive demand issue. That means the body needs that nutrient at a higher amount than what is present.
So my analogy to the patients and that’s like you’re making $1 million a year but you’re spending $2 million a year. You’re making a lot of money but you are spending too much. Your budget needs to get rained in. That’s the big five things we talked about earlier. And then on the depletion side of now your organic acids are low. That’s typically from chronic stress of those big five issues, more chronic longer-term issue. It’s like you’re making $1000 a year, but you’re spending 10,000. One, you’re not making that much to begin with. Number two, you’re spending way more than what you’re making, anyway. So it’s going to be impossible to get ahead.
So we have to work on getting to the big five of why that is the case. When you see organic acids high or low, they mean different things, but low is more depleted; high is more demand. They both mean that those intervention nutrients need to be supported and addressed. And obviously, the underlying big five stressors need to be looked at- which in this case, is definitely going to be malabsorption and stress.
Low Amino Acids
You can see this person here, a little bit high in the Ethyl Malonate, which we talked about – means Carnitine, we saw the L – lactate. So you can see if we draw a sweet spot here, we’re very low in this area. And that’s another marker for amino acids. So the amino acids are very low and you can see some of these are two-tailed, some are one. So if you were to do like a Beta Hydroxy Butyrate, well there’s no left area that’s low. But if you go down below, under energy production, there’s definitely red on the right and left of Citrate, Cis-Aconitate and Isocitrate.
So that means we have two-tailed here and only one tail below. That matters is that we have, let’s say Malate is low, that’s important to know. But it’s more important that if Isocitrate is low because it’s actually a red area. It’s two-tailed, there’s a high and a low versus just a high.
So on that note, we can see with the above that’s amino acids, lower amino acids. You can see the mitochondria. Here’s our sweet spot. If we only have two organic acids in the sweet spot, we definitely have these two were low, but these three above are more important because there is no red area to the left down there.
Low B Vitamins
But we can see the mitochondria and how we’re generating energy is severely depleted and again this one of this patient’s chief issues is fatigue and you can see five areas in the bad left area and you can see three are very low. So definitely a depleted mitochondria, for sure. B vitamins, nothing’s flagged high but you can see we’re definitely in the low area. We’re definitely in that first quintile, and if you go back here, you can see B complex vitamins are part of what’s needed to drive the citric acid, Krebs cycle, warrior mitochondria. Essentially all the same name here for this.
So B vitamins definitely in the lower side. Methylation, a little bit in the lower side. I get more concerned when these go higher with Methylmalonate goes higher, it means we’re depleting a lot of B-12. When B12 isn’t present, Methylmalonate goes high. So it’s definitely part of this sequelae of this low B vitamin symptomatology we’re seeing. Lower energy means lower B vitamins.
Neurotransmitters, you can see this person is low in Vanilmandelate, which means lower adrenaline. Lower adrenaline so their ability to regulate stress and adapt to stress is going to be thwarted and maybe some anxiety too, pretty possible or inability to focus When you have not enough adrenaline or dopamine, you typically lose that ability to focus longer and the time there. Homovanilate, 5-Hydroxyindoleacetate, that’s serotonin and dopamine, those are okay. Kyunurenate, it’s a little bit low. It’s a marker for B6, Quinolinate and Picolinate are markers for brain inflammation. Look okay but definitely the adrenaline markers are lower. Oxidative stress look pretty good. I’m fine with these being low because, you know, less oxidative stress, stress or internal rusting.
Detox, you can see, very much on the low side and again this didn’t even get flagged on the summary page of this. It’s important because if you’re just getting this test on your own, you’re like, “fine detox look no problems”- wrong. There is a massive polar shift to the left, which tells me there’s a severe depletion, remember. Lower organic acids depletion on the left section. Sulfate, the only one in the middle. This is sitting right on the fence of being low. Right on the fence being low gets flagged at 28. That’s 29- that’s a big marker for sulfur amino acids and glutathione precursors. So definitely an issue. They’re having a harder time to bring those nutrients on board to make the glutathione and to make all the phase 2 and phase 1, literally toxifying support.
And in gut bacteria, it’s got one that’s high down here and the one that’s borderline. Indican is on the higher side that means not quite digesting protein well. Inability to digest proteins in putrefaction happening and just higher amounts of bad bacteria. And as you can see here this is what gets flagged when it’s 5% in the top 5%-1.41 It gets into the red .73, 1.41 and reach the top 5% of the reference range. Top 5% in this patient here. 1.84. So we don’t just look at it when it’s high, that’s very high. A lot of gut bacteria dysbiosis and some putrefaction are happening, meaning not quite digesting protein. And that makes sense because when we go back to the protein on the summary page, a lot of amino acids were low and then yeast and fungus looked okay.
So if we go back here to the summary page, high and low organic acids mean something. We already talked about that. Depletion on the low-end demand in the high-end. The big five tend to be the driving factors why this go out of balance. Diet, malabsorption stress, sleep, toxicity and genetics. Genetics being MTHFR, and we’ll see that with high amounts of Methylmalonate and/or formiminoglutamate but again, this is a quick video just to give you some insight of how we’re looking at how we’re interpreting this test. And we put this test together to look at body system three and we have to look at the other two body systems, and maybe even blood work. And obviously, a full diet and lifestyle review so we can get a complete picture of what’s happening under your metabolic.
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